Drop volley bounces back over

[kevhen]

Last night I hit my first ever drop volley to go over the net and then bounce back over to my side for a winner in a doubles match. I have hit dropshots and wind aided lobs that have bounced back over but never a drop volley and it was indoors so not wind aided. It cleared the net by about 6 inches and came as a surprise to me when it hopped back over.

Have you ever hit a drop volley that went to the other side and bounced back to yours?

[Bagumbawalla]

There are some old guys that play doubles all day, around here, that use that as there normal shot.

It's an impressive shot, when it works, however, when the ball just dies on the opponent's side, close to the net, it is really more effective in the long run.

[maverick1]

That takes impressive touch.

But I am having a hard time imagining it as a unseful shot to use intentionally.
That drop volley must have lobbed up over 7 feet at some point in order to bounce over the net(3.5 to 4 feet high). Tennis balls are spec'd to bounce only 55% of the maximum height they reach, unless you hit down on them.

If someone is in such a good position and has enough skill to play this shot, why would he choose to play a high bouncing volley rather than putting it away thru a hole or playing a volley that just dies after the bounce?

[DRtenniS1112]

That takes impressive touch.

But I am having a hard time imagining it as a unseful shot to use intentionally.
That drop volley must have lobbed up over 7 feet at some point in order to bounce over the net(3.5 to 4 feet high). Tennis balls are spec'd to bounce only 55% of the maximum height they reach, unless you hit down on them.

If someone is in such a good position and has enough skill to play this shot, why would he choose to play a high bouncing volley rather than putting it away thru a hole or playing a volley that just dies after the bounce?

This was exactly my thought, You could do it from the baseline but as a volley it would be so difficult.

[Andres]

This was exactly my thought, You could do it from the baseline but as a volley it would be so difficult.
No, IMO, it's easier in a volley than from the baseline.
Sampras hit a diving volley, with a VERY exaggerated vertical swing, so the volley went back because of the heavy backspin in the exhibition against Ginepri.

It's so much easier to do it when you're at the net, the distance is much smaller, so the ball doesn't lose the backspin because of air resistance and inertia ;)

[SFrazeur]

This was exactly my thought, You could do it from the baseline but as a volley it would be so difficult.

That would be true if you are a base-liner. But, more volley orientated players would have an easier time closer to net. Makes sense doesn't it.

[kevhen]

It seems easier to do at the net than from the baseline in my opinion since I was in good position pretty close to the net. I think that my drop volley popped up maybe about 5-6 feet above the ground and then bounced back over the net. I was surprised that it bounced back up that high myself. I was working on drop vollies last night against guys who didn't hit hard passing shots.

I usually test a ball's bounce by dropping it from shoulder height (5') and seeing if it will bounce back to my waist height which would be about 3'6. That would mean a new ball bouncing about 70% of it's original height on a hard surface. Is this correct? We played with Wilson Championship balls. Penns don't usually bounce as high.

[kevhen]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennis_ball
A tennis ball should bounce between 53 and 58 inches when dropped from 100 inches.

But how far does it need to fall to clear a 36 inch net?

[Midlife crisis]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennis_ball
A tennis ball should bounce between 53 and 58 inches when dropped from 100 inches.

But how far does it need to fall to clear a 36 inch net?

That's hard to say because there are different sources of energy loss in a bouncing tennis ball, and these vary in their magnitude depending on how hard the ball bounces. You could probably get close by estimating that the ball would bounce about 55% of its drop height, so maybe about 70 inches or so?

I've done this a few times (having a short volley bounce back over to my side) but never deliberately. It is easier from the net because the forward velocity is much lower than trying to do so from the baseline, and consequently you need a lot less backspin to get the ball to reverse direction. The only times it's ever happened for me are when I have to stab it a dipping topspin shot and I mis-hit it off the top of the stringbed, and amazingly I've done this three or four times.

A couple of days ago, my son was practicing volleying and had me scrambling wide to my forehand. I swiped at the ball using a chopping motion. The ball went up about 30 feet hit with a lot of backspin, but was coming down almost directly on top of the net so my son was standing there ready to hit the ball if it actually cleared the net.

It did, but just barely, and then the ball bounced back towards my side. He had to reach over the net to my side to hit it, and could only manage to hit the ball directly into the net on my side. The ball dribbled down the net and rolled, and there would have been no way I could have returned that shot even if I was standing there. That's the first time I've ever seen that happen.

[kevhen]

Here is an article I found. It says the balls loses more energy, the more it is compressed.

The Ball
The rules of tennis specify that the ball must bounce to a height between 53 and 58 inches when dropped from a height of 100 inches onto a concrete slab. What happens in actual play is hard to predict, but a good test is to drop a ball onto the strings when the head is clamped (eg by placing the racquet on the floor and stepping on the handle near the head). When dropped from a height of say 1 meter, the ball will bounce to a height of about 0.70 meter. The ball loses about 45% of its energy when dropped on concrete, but it loses only 30% of its energy when dropped on the strings. That's because the strings absorb some of the impact energy and then give almost all of that back to the ball. The amount of energy lost by the ball depends on its compression. When dropped from 100 inches on concrete, it compresses by about 6 mm. When dropped on the strings, it compresses by about 3 mm. The bigger the compression, the more energy is lost when the ball expands back to its original shape. That means that at high impact speeds, where the ball compresses more, the energy loss is even greater. Furthermore, the fraction of the ball's energy that is lost also increases as the the ball's energy is increased or as the compression is increased.

[kevhen]

Yeah, usually the ball bounces back over off a mishit off the frame where it has a ton of backspin and may have gone up high and barely cleared the net in the first place.

This was my first drop volley off the strings that came back over and I didn't try to do that but it was cool to see it happen anyway. I was laughing as my opponents both attempted to chase it down but they had to slow down as the net got closer so they couldn't quite reach it.

[emo5]

would this be your best shot ever?
At higher grades people will just put those shots away.

[SteveI]

Here is an article I found. It says the balls loses more energy, the more it is compressed.

The Ball
The rules of tennis specify that the ball must bounce to a height between 53 and 58 inches when dropped from a height of 100 inches onto a concrete slab. What happens in actual play is hard to predict, but a good test is to drop a ball onto the strings when the head is clamped (eg by placing the racquet on the floor and stepping on the handle near the head). When dropped from a height of say 1 meter, the ball will bounce to a height of about 0.70 meter. The ball loses about 45% of its energy when dropped on concrete, but it loses only 30% of its energy when dropped on the strings. That's because the strings absorb some of the impact energy and then give almost all of that back to the ball. The amount of energy lost by the ball depends on its compression. When dropped from 100 inches on concrete, it compresses by about 6 mm. When dropped on the strings, it compresses by about 3 mm. The bigger the compression, the more energy is lost when the ball expands back to its original shape. That means that at high impact speeds, where the ball compresses more, the energy loss is even greater. Furthermore, the fraction of the ball's energy that is lost also increases as the the ball's energy is increased or as the compression is increased.


Hi,

Here ya go.. this determines tennis ball bounce..


The "perfect gas law" describes the relation between pressure, density and temperature:


p= r RT

where p is the pressure, r is the density, R is a gas constant (there is an individual gas constant for each gas) and T is the temperature of the gas. So if the temperature of the gas inside the ball increases and R and r stay the same, that means the pressure will increase.

Enjoy... :-)

Steve

[JRstriker12]

I was watching a series of tennis instruction shows by Joe Dinoffer on the tennis channel. Joe does this clown character that does tricks on the tennis court.

He managed to hit this sort of slice drop shot over the net so that it came back to him, then he would hit it again and it would bounce back. He did this about 10 times in a row. It's wasn't in a game, but it was impressive. I've never been able to do that on purpose.

I see where people are saying that a ball should be only able to bounce so far, but that test it probably on a ball dropped from a certain distance from a dead stop with out any additonal force. Even though most of this shot is slice, you are adding additional both forward and down, plus the energy imparted by the spin.

[kevhen]

Yeah, Sampras must not be playing at his best anymore since he made a similar shot in an exhibition match earlier this year.

My opponent hits a passing shot DTL from the baseline to my forehand side with his partner at the service line diagonal to me. Most any volley I hit would go back to one of them. Instead I hit a drop volley that clears the net by 6 inches that neither of them can touch and both of them have good speed. This is a low level shot????

[tarheels2323]

I hit one during Districts my senior year against the #2 seeded team (we won by the way). I'm pretty sure it was the only one I've ever hit.

[slice bh compliment]

...this clown character that does tricks on the tennis court....

Hhahaha, yeah, I saw that too. I think his name is Bijou the Clown. That clown is actually a teaching pro in Georgia somewhere. A friend of a friend, his real name is Henri something. Talented dude.

[VadeRetro]

Rules question concerning this!

Today I played a drop volley that bounced back.
The opponent didn't hit it, but I was so surprised that I continued play.
When they finished the point, I remembered that they didn't touch my drop volley and claimed the point, which was reluctantly granted.

Question:
Did I forfeit my claim to the point by continuing play until they finished the ralley?

My point? Their point? A let?

[kevhen]

I think by continuing the point you may have lost your claim to it, although technically it should be yours as soon as the ball landed on your side.

Had you hit the ball while still in the air on it's way back to your side, you would have lost the point but otherwise the point is yours.

[The Gorilla]

it's easier at the net because you are using your opponents topspin with your backspin,from the baseline you have to generate all your own spin.

[skuludo]

I've seen the net cord version of that.

A teaching pro named Jeremy hits a slice backhand off a forehand drive. The ball hits the net cord and then it travels a couple of centimeters forward in the air then comes back and hits the net again. <-- Point is over. It looked like someone just dumped the ball in the net if some one was actualy there volleying the shot.

The slice was fast so it is impossible to move at all to retrive the shot because the inital foreand drive was fast.

[ChipNCharge]

Rules question concerning this!

Today I played a drop volley that bounced back.
The opponent didn't hit it, but I was so surprised that I continued play.
When they finished the point, I remembered that they didn't touch my drop volley and claimed the point, which was reluctantly granted.

Question:
Did I forfeit my claim to the point by continuing play until they finished the ralley?

My point? Their point? A let?

I think you still won the point because the point was over the moment the ball bounced back onto your side of the court.

[OrangeOne]

I've seen the net cord version of that.

A teaching pro named Jeremy hits a slice backhand off a forehand drive. The ball hits the net cord and then it travels a couple of centimeters forward in the air then comes back and hits the net again. <-- Point is over. It looked like someone just dumped the ball in the net if some one was actualy there volleying the shot.

The slice was fast so it is impossible to move at all to retrive the shot because the inital foreand drive was fast.

Without looking up the rules, I'm pretty sure the point isn't over in the above case, the ball hasn't even landed in or out yet imho....