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View Full Version : This Just In: USTA Not To Penalize Norcal 4.0/Backesto Park Team!!


Joeyg
12-20-2006, 08:58 AM
Well, I spoke to a member of the 4.0 Backesto Park team and apparently the USTA decided there wasn't enough evidence to warrant any penalties for the incident at Nationals. I find this to be totally in character for the dunces at the USTA. As long as they are getting their $18.00 for every team you join, and they want you to play on as many as you can, all is good in the world of league tennis!

Just my two cents.

robkat
12-20-2006, 09:10 AM
It is all about the mightly $$$.... same stuff happens here on the east coast in the USTA's Mid Atlantic section. This year and in the future, I decided to keep my $35 membership fee in my pocket due to siimlar issues, like you described above. The only thing I was getting get out of the USTA was lousy tennis and a free Tennis mag. I can get the the magazine for $12 a year and save $23.

Richard Pur
12-20-2006, 10:09 AM
This is ridiculous!! How about a boycott? I wouldn't mind saving the $23.

And you wonder why tennis is in a downward spiral.

tennismike33
12-20-2006, 03:42 PM
As I have no idea what happened, is there a link we can log onto and look at the details.

Of course without the details I think the USTA screwed something up, lol!!!

10sguy
12-20-2006, 08:50 PM
Well, I spoke to a member of the 4.0 Backesto Park team and apparently the USTA decided there wasn't enough evidence to warrant any penalties for the incident at Nationals. I find this to be totally in character for the dunces at the USTA. As long as they are getting their $18.00 for every team you join, and they want you to play on as many as you can, all is good in the world of league tennis!

Just my two cents.

*And you're gonna believe THOSE GUYS??!! Sure, it's possible that's the case - but before everyone here gets all riled up, why not get the facts? (or did you just hafta be first with the news?) *

BigGriff
12-21-2006, 02:15 AM
Well, I spoke to a member of the 4.0 Backesto Park team and apparently the USTA decided there wasn't enough evidence to warrant any penalties for the incident at Nationals. I find this to be totally in character for the dunces at the USTA. As long as they are getting their $18.00 for every team you join, and they want you to play on as many as you can, all is good in the world of league tennis!

Just my two cents.

This is not a shock to me at all. I occasionally play with a few members from the Beckesto Park team and when I spoke to them about the incident they either acted like it was no big deal or played dumb.

Dr. Van Nostrand
12-21-2006, 08:49 AM
*And you're gonna believe THOSE GUYS??!! Sure, it's possible that's the case - but before everyone here gets all riled up, why not get the facts? (or did you just hafta be first with the news?) *

The USTA Norcal 2006 Sanction webpage does not indicate any action was taken against any of the members of that team.
http://www.norcal.usta.com/generic/custom.sps?iType=2058&icustompageid=17316

Joeyg
12-21-2006, 09:57 AM
10SGuy,

I could care less about being first. I am telling you that this is the case. Whether you choose to believe it or not is your business. I have been on the USTA's case in NorCal for years. I have complained about many things and nothing seems to change. The board of directors all have very specific agendas that they are pushing on the members.

I firmly believe that as long as the board is elected by proxy that NOTHING will change. Until it is one person, one vote, we will be stuck with whomever the club owners and the insiders deem acceptable.

Until that time, I will grudingly be playing only age group tourneys. No more of the corrupt BS shenannigans that happen in league play for me!

Joe Grech

gokou703
12-21-2006, 11:24 AM
*And you're gonna believe THOSE GUYS??!! Sure, it's possible that's the case - but before everyone here gets all riled up, why not get the facts? (or did you just hafta be first with the news?) *

By the way 10sguy word gets around so fast in norcal, especially since Backesto Park is a local team (south bay). I talked to my own teammates and Joeyg is right just to let you know. Backesto park wasn't penalized. SO before embarrassing yourself on these threads you should actually find out the facts before denying anyone's word is false.

Raiden.Kaminari
02-10-2007, 03:44 PM
Well, it took time, but they were finally penalized ...

12 Backesto players suspended (http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/NorCalTennisTalk/message/1038)

10sguy
02-10-2007, 04:49 PM
By the way 10sguy word gets around so fast in norcal, especially since Backesto Park is a local team (south bay). I talked to my own teammates and Joeyg is right just to let you know. Backesto park wasn't penalized. SO before embarrassing yourself on these threads you should actually find out the facts before denying anyone's word is false.

Hey GOUKOU703 . . . you wanna talk about it now???

BiGGieStuFF
02-10-2007, 11:01 PM
Hey GOUKOU703 . . . you wanna talk about it now???

Very Nice ;)

gokou703
02-16-2007, 01:43 AM
Hey GOUKOU703 . . . you wanna talk about it now???

Yeah man i'm right here ready and willing to talk...btw its spelled GOKOU703 as of 12/21/06 there wasn't any action taken and i'm extremely happy that recently there was a decision that was made. If you look at the most RECENT Inside Tennis Magazine (Norcal's) Backesto Park is still recognized for their success. So with all this recognition for Backesto Park's success it wasn't so far fetched to believe that little action was taken...i.e. no record of action taken place...http://www.norcal.usta.com/generic/custom.sps?iType=2058&icustompageid=17316

Eventually I was proven wrong but the way you responded to JoeyG's post:
Originally Posted by 10sguy
*And you're gonna believe THOSE GUYS??!! Sure, it's possible that's the case - but before everyone here gets all riled up, why not get the facts? (or did you just hafta be first with the news?) *

..was quite immature and rude...

amarone
02-16-2007, 03:24 AM
Well, it took time, but they were finally penalized ...

12 Backesto players suspended (http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/NorCalTennisTalk/message/1038)
Interesting grievance result write-up. I have served on a grievance committee and we always stated what our finding was. This write-up states what the committee did, then dished out the suspensions, but does not say why. One can obviously draw conclusions, but you cannot tell whether the suspensions were because people did play under a false name or because the players refused to answer the questions.

raiden031
02-16-2007, 06:53 AM
Where did they get the imposters from? Did they get them because they didn't have players available or because they wanted to make sure they won and found players not on the team that were better?

andfor
02-16-2007, 04:33 PM
Where did they get the imposters from? Did they get them because they didn't have players available or because they wanted to make sure they won and found players not on the team that were better?

They must have got them from some losing local 5.0 team. Just kidding. Now that you mention it who are the imposters and are they included in the sanction?

Raiden.Kaminari
02-17-2007, 12:06 AM
Interesting grievance result write-up. I have served on a grievance committee and we always stated what our finding was. This write-up states what the committee did, then dished out the suspensions, but does not say why. One can obviously draw conclusions, but you cannot tell whether the suspensions were because people did play under a false name or because the players refused to answer the questions.

Yeah, it's one of the problems of the national grievance decision. Besides apparently suspending the registered captain and not the acting captain for 10 years.

If you read the other threads, they apparently got the other players from the Backesto 4.5 (former 5.0 players that tanked their matches one season to get down to 4.5).

Joeyg
02-18-2007, 09:22 AM
And now the Backesto Park 4.5 team is back in business! Check out their roster this season. I am sure they are planning a return trip to Nationals after tanking their matches at 5.0! I know a bunch of these guys and to think they lost legitimately to some of these 5.0's is a joke.

tennis_nerd22
02-18-2007, 10:48 AM
This is ridiculous!! How about a boycott? I wouldn't mind saving the $23.

And you wonder why tennis is in a downward spiral.

i agree, however, its not tennis in the world, just tennis in North America in my opinion

kylebarendrick
02-22-2007, 07:26 AM
Looks like Norcal has made it public:
http://www.norcal.usta.com/generic/custom.sps?iType=2058&icustompageid=17316

Joeyg
02-22-2007, 12:17 PM
I see that Tuan Lam got 10 years as the captain. However, he wasn't even there. He could not make the trip. I would imagine that an appeal is imminent. As for the others, I see that anyone that played a match was suspended for 5 years. Is this fair? Some of these guys didn't do anything wrong, but just didn't rat out the imposters. I would imagine that the Texas coach who knowingly played a ranked junior and the junior himself deserve at least 5 years if this is the criteria used by USTA National to suspend people. Your thoughts?

Cindysphinx
02-22-2007, 12:37 PM
I think everyone on the team who failed to rat out imposters should be suspended. Come on, if you *know* your captain is fielding players who are flat out not on your team, how can you stand by and say nothing?

People who stand by while such things are going on are co-conspirators -- just as guilty as their fellow conspirators.

Gugafan_Redux
02-22-2007, 01:28 PM
http://picsrv.usta.com/?fif=/usta/norcal/img_56_1463.jpg&obj=iip,1.0&wid=348&hei=261&bgc=255,255,255&rgn=0.0,0.0,1.0,1.0&cvt=jpeg

party in question. Public info. That's all.

cak
02-22-2007, 01:55 PM
I see that Tuan Lam got 10 years as the captain. However, he wasn't even there. He could not make the trip. I would imagine that an appeal is imminent.

Appeals had to be in by Feb 12th. I suspect they waited this long to put these on the NorCal page until all appeals ran their course.

Raiden.Kaminari
02-22-2007, 03:23 PM
I think everyone on the team who failed to rat out imposters should be suspended. Come on, if you *know* your captain is fielding players who are flat out not on your team, how can you stand by and say nothing?

People who stand by while such things are going on are co-conspirators -- just as guilty as their fellow conspirators.

I have to agree with you there ... however, as I posted before, they suspended the captain who wasn't even there, rather than the acting captain, for 10 years. The players should have reported the improper behavior of the acting captain if they wanted not to be suspended, but they thought they could get away with the "innocent, until proven guilty."

I guess they didn't read on the boards that they had information against them collected by USTA.

Cindysphinx
02-22-2007, 05:31 PM
Hey, the captain signed the scorecards (or so I read). When I'm not at a match, I don't sign the scorecard; the sub captain does.

andfor
02-23-2007, 06:19 AM
Hey, the captain signed the scorecards (or so I read). When I'm not at a match, I don't sign the scorecard; the sub captain does.

I am sure that forging the captains signature was not beneath anyone on that team.

BigJEFF
02-23-2007, 08:25 PM
I see that Tuan Lam got 10 years as the captain. However, he wasn't even there. He could not make the trip. I would imagine that an appeal is imminent. As for the others, I see that anyone that played a match was suspended for 5 years. Is this fair? Some of these guys didn't do anything wrong, but just didn't rat out the imposters. I would imagine that the Texas coach who knowingly played a ranked junior and the junior himself deserve at least 5 years if this is the criteria used by USTA National to suspend people. Your thoughts?

I agree they both knew the rules and broke them

ferocious4hand
04-17-2007, 02:26 PM
Apparently this was big enough of a story to make it in Tennis Magazine's May issue. How sad...

andfor
04-17-2007, 02:39 PM
Apparently this was big enough of a story to make it in Tennis Magazine's May issue. How sad..........and I am sure the story was not one of the USTA's press releases. The story was big outside the USTA especially on message boards like this one. The USTA had no where to hide on this one!

the_playa
04-17-2007, 03:56 PM
Apparently this was big enough of a story to make it in Tennis Magazine's May issue. How sad...

i couldn't find it in the may issue. where is it?

ferocious4hand
04-17-2007, 04:32 PM
i couldn't find it in the may issue. where is it?

don't recall the page # but it was a side column not very noticable

edit: pg 24

Cruzer
04-17-2007, 04:57 PM
Some or maybe all of the suspended guys appear to have appealed the initial suspensions handed out. The captain's suspension is now only three years. I guess since he wasn't present his penalty should not have been more severe than those who were there. The longest suspension is five years for a few guys.

OzNQc
04-18-2007, 09:28 PM
This thread sounds kinda funny, but maybe not to the losing side(s) in your USTA tourney or whatever it was!

Sorry for asking but what actually happened??

quite an intriguing thread...lotsa suspended players!

I remember 2 state graders in oz having a nice push and shove on the tennis court which got them suspended a long time ago hehehe And i also heard that 2 aspiring pros at a grasscourt tourney in oz went at it in the carpark after 1 had enough of the other hooking him on line calls. The guy who was not cheating finally responded with an out call on a ball that was clearly a metre in the court hahaha And then the fistycuffs were on!
By the way, the cheater was not allower to play in our state for 1 yr or more
hahahaha

BreakPoint
04-18-2007, 10:07 PM
Well, it took time, but they were finally penalized ...

12 Backesto players suspended (http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/NorCalTennisTalk/message/1038)
Looks like Norcal has made it public:
http://www.norcal.usta.com/generic/custom.sps?iType=2058&icustompageid=17316

Why were the sentences reduced so significantly? I mean, for example, the captain's sentence was reduced from a 10 year suspension to only a 2 year suspension? That's barely a slap on the wrists!

http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/NorCalTennisTalk/message/1038

http://www.norcal.usta.com/generic/custom.sps?iType=2058&icustompageid=17316

JLyon
04-19-2007, 04:10 AM
is anyone truly surprised that the USTA only gave these guys a slap on the wrist. they won't even follow their own guidelines set in place to protect the integrity of League Tennis.
If they followed their own rules you would see a huge increase in 4.5, 5.0, and 5.5 divisions as more players would be placed in their true divisions.

goober
04-19-2007, 05:14 AM
Why were the sentences reduced so significantly? I mean, for example, the captain's sentence was reduced from a 10 year suspension to only a 2 year suspension? That's barely a slap on the wrists!

http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/NorCalTennisTalk/message/1038

http://www.norcal.usta.com/generic/custom.sps?iType=2058&icustompageid=17316

I don't understand how they could reduce the suspension so significantly from 10 to 2 years. I don't care if he was actually there or not. He knew what was going on and condoned it. He was the captain, not some guy peripherally associated with the team. It makes the comments that the USTA made in Tennis magazine look like a joke.

HoustonHacker
04-19-2007, 06:29 AM
The suspension is ridiculously light given the fact that he has a history of breaking the rules. A long history.

DavaiMarat
04-19-2007, 11:51 AM
I think everyone on the team who failed to rat out imposters should be suspended. Come on, if you *know* your captain is fielding players who are flat out not on your team, how can you stand by and say nothing?

People who stand by while such things are going on are co-conspirators -- just as guilty as their fellow conspirators.

Lol, Sorry Cindy but that's a very idealistic if not somewhat naive POV. You would rat on your captain for using an illegal player on a league night. You wouldn't last very long in many teams I tell you that much.

I'm not saying what they did was wrong but would you rat on your friends and jeopardize your spot on the team? I don't think so.

max8176
04-19-2007, 01:40 PM
The suspension is ridiculously light given the fact that he has a history of breaking the rules. A long history.

Long history??

Raiden.Kaminari
04-19-2007, 04:28 PM
The suspension is ridiculously light given the fact that he has a history of breaking the rules. A long history.

Who are you speaking about?

Raiden.Kaminari
04-19-2007, 04:28 PM
Lol, Sorry Cindy but that's a very idealistic if not somewhat naive POV. You would rat on your captain for using an illegal player on a league night. You wouldn't last very long in many teams I tell you that much.

I'm not saying what they did was wrong but would you rat on your friends and jeopardize your spot on the team? I don't think so.

Hmmm ... Do the right thing, or just stay teammates with people who are cheaters? Some of the teams are formed to be competitive, and don't necessarily have guys who are friends. Also, players can submit information directly to USTA and request anonymity. So the right thing would have been the players present in Hawaii present information. Then again, if you are willing to stay friends with people willing to cheat, I'm sure you would be willing to be "friends" with proven murderers, con artists, ID thieves, child molesters, spouse abusers, etc. To cheat at something so small in life is pitiful, and reflects poorly on their character.

So if it had been me on that team and I had information, I would have told the other players my name was my honor and that I wouldn't stand for what they did.

Raiden.Kaminari
04-19-2007, 04:30 PM
is anyone truly surprised that the USTA only gave these guys a slap on the wrist. they won't even follow their own guidelines set in place to protect the integrity of League Tennis.
If they followed their own rules you would see a huge increase in 4.5, 5.0, and 5.5 divisions as more players would be placed in their true divisions.

More like very disappointed :(

Raiden.Kaminari
04-19-2007, 04:32 PM
Why were the sentences reduced so significantly? I mean, for example, the captain's sentence was reduced from a 10 year suspension to only a 2 year suspension? That's barely a slap on the wrists!

http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/NorCalTennisTalk/message/1038

http://www.norcal.usta.com/generic/custom.sps?iType=2058&icustompageid=17316

It was probably because the captain wasn't actually physically in Hawaii when the player replacement occurred.

However, what I'm really surprised about is that the people responsible (the replacement player and acting captain) were not been identified and suspended.

My suggestion would be to suspend NorCal from participating in any National event for two years.

Raiden.Kaminari
04-19-2007, 04:34 PM
I don't understand how they could reduce the suspension so significantly from 10 to 2 years. I don't care if he was actually there or not. He knew what was going on and condoned it. He was the captain, not some guy peripherally associated with the team. It makes the comments that the USTA made in Tennis magazine look like a joke.

I got an e-mail from USTA with the grievance appeal results, but since I didn't review any of the "appeal" information presented, I have no idea what made the National appeal committee reduce the suspensions. Needless to say, I'm sure many members of USTA are very disappointed.

We should all contact USTA about the decision to say it's simple B.S. and to suspend NorCal from participating in Nationals until they clean up their act.

kylebarendrick
04-19-2007, 06:45 PM
Why is suspending NorCal from Nationals a reasonable response? The event occurred at a national tournament, not a NorCal one - it was national USTA that should have caught this when it happened and taken the appropriate steps.

If someone from your section uses a ringer impersonating a team member at a national event, should your whole section be banned also? NorCal is now requiring photo IDs at all matches. At least that's a start.

Now if we can just get rid of the ratings appeals and add some verifiers at the District levels...

DavaiMarat
04-19-2007, 09:17 PM
Hmmm ... Do the right thing, or just stay teammates with people who are cheaters? Some of the teams are formed to be competitive, and don't necessarily have guys who are friends. Also, players can submit information directly to USTA and request anonymity. So the right thing would have been the players present in Hawaii present information. Then again, if you are willing to stay friends with people willing to cheat, I'm sure you would be willing to be "friends" with proven murderers, con artists, ID thieves, child molesters, spouse abusers, etc. To cheat at something so small in life is pitiful, and reflects poorly on their character.

So if it had been me on that team and I had information, I would have told the other players my name was my honor and that I wouldn't stand for what they did.

Ummmm dude,

Cheating by fielding illegal players is one thing...being friends with thieves and child molesters are another...lets not get too dramatic here.

I've played on alot of teams. I've captained a few and played on many. I hated captaining. I've never fielded illegal players because I was organized but I've been on teams where my captain has brought a outside player, got the club to give him a 'team' membership just to field the 5 teams we needed. Did it matter he/she was a former national ranked junior? Honestly, you'd be hard pressed to find a captain out there who hasn't had to pull some strings to field a competitive team.

Not saying what he did was right but it's not realistic for someone to say sanctimoniously say it's easy to 'BLOW THE WHISTLE' on your captain, that's all I'm saying. For example, you friend smokes weed, it's illegal, would you call the police on him. That's all I'm saying.

It's easy to be sanctimonious from a outsiders point of view, they got punished that's the important thing. However, to judge them beyond that and to say u'd rat out your entire team, your friends, because u were on some moral high horse is unrealistic. Quit the team maybe, but to call foul? U'd probably wouldn't want to play at that club anymore.

penpal
04-20-2007, 05:23 AM
Lol, Sorry Cindy but that's a very idealistic if not somewhat naive POV. You would rat on your captain for using an illegal player on a league night. You wouldn't last very long in many teams I tell you that much.

I'm not saying what they did was wrong but would you rat on your friends and jeopardize your spot on the team? I don't think so.

I do think so.

It's a pretty easy decision actually. Your captain plays someone who you know to be an illegal entry, you say something to an official -- case closed. And if you are friends with the captain, you tell him/her not to play this person before the incident even takes place, in no uncertain terms.

Davai - your line of reasoning, taken to its logical conclusion, is exactly the type of reasoning that results in the formation of criminal organizations. You might say, "hey, I'm just being realistic," and that's not untrue, but that doesn't mean you should criticize someone else for acting in a way that is morally superior.

DavaiMarat
04-20-2007, 07:29 AM
I do think so.

It's a pretty easy decision actually. Your captain plays someone who you know to be an illegal entry, you say something to an official -- case closed. And if you are friends with the captain, you tell him/her not to play this person before the incident even takes place, in no uncertain terms.

Davai - your line of reasoning, taken to its logical conclusion, is exactly the type of reasoning that results in the formation of criminal organizations. You might say, "hey, I'm just being realistic," and that's not untrue, but that doesn't mean you should criticize someone else for acting in a way that is morally superior.

Before this becomes a mud slinging fest. If those guys truly tanked an entire season just to drop a division to win, screw 'em they got what they deserve and probably deserve more. I totally agree with that.

However, you'd be hard pressed to find a captain who hasn't fielded someone who shouldn't be in a division. We had one team in our A league that like never had the same team twice literally. It was ringer central (like former futures/satellite players). Lol some of them didn't even speak english. In our minds they weren't even a team but what could we really do or say?
They were too good to play in that division?

Oh well. I just find it odd you'd condemn me to be immoral and injust. If you've played as long as I have, played on as many teams I have, you'd be hard pressed to have not been on a team who hasn't fielded a player who was over qualified for the division. I may have even been that player at some point (ie Like a friend needed a player for his B2 team.)

Can you truly say you've never seen any of this or been on a team where anything like this has happen. Then I must be the most vile morally corrupt human being along with everyone I've played with.

Maybe I'm wrong thinking the way I do. I tend not to judge to harshly because simply we've all been on the side of doing something 'selfish or morally questionable' at some point. Also, it tend to keep my hair brown instead of white.

Cheers,

Mike

skiracer55
04-20-2007, 07:44 AM
...so this is what NTRP leagues are all about? I rest my case. I'm going to play age group only. I'm not going anywhere near this kind of nonsense...

kreative
04-20-2007, 08:27 AM
Some of the teams are formed to be competitive, and don't necessarily have guys who are friends.

I'll agree with that. Sometimes you don't know who's on your team or not...you don't really pay attention to the other players and just focus in on your own match. So if you captain told you, "Hey, this guy's name is XXX and he's playing for us," you'd be like "OK, nice to meet you." So yes, it's obvious that it's the captain's fault, but the other players are not necessarily co-conspirators.

Raiden.Kaminari
04-20-2007, 01:00 PM
Before this becomes a mud slinging fest. If those guys truly tanked an entire season just to drop a division to win, screw 'em they got what they deserve and probably deserve more. I totally agree with that.

However, you'd be hard pressed to find a captain who hasn't fielded someone who shouldn't be in a division. We had one team in our A league that like never had the same team twice literally. It was ringer central (like former futures/satellite players). Lol some of them didn't even speak english. In our minds they weren't even a team but what could we really do or say?
They were too good to play in that division?

Oh well. I just find it odd you'd condemn me to be immoral and injust. If you've played as long as I have, played on as many teams I have, you'd be hard pressed to have not been on a team who hasn't fielded a player who was over qualified for the division. I may have even been that player at some point (ie Like a friend needed a player for his B2 team.)

Can you truly say you've never seen any of this or been on a team where anything like this has happen. Then I must be the most vile morally corrupt human being along with everyone I've played with.

Maybe I'm wrong thinking the way I do. I tend not to judge to harshly because simply we've all been on the side of doing something 'selfish or morally questionable' at some point. Also, it tend to keep my hair brown instead of white.

Cheers,

Mike

Life is more than just tennis. But tennis is a reflection on life.

So essentially, you condone cheating because you feel everyone is doing it?

Let's get realistic. Only a small percentage of the population cheats. However, this population is usually the one that represents the section at Nationals.

Your attitude is what made USTA league tennis no more than an arms race lately. I would quit from a team if the captain put in ringers, or even replaced a team. The captain's unethical behavior usually means he/she will attempt to cheat me in real life at something else in the future.

The only teams that do the "right" thing realize they won't go far in the post season, if it all. But I would say that these teams are the ones that realize trophy hunting is worthless. Who cares if some team goes to Nationals? Maybe they should get rid of Nationals completely, since adult players don't have a chance of going pro anyways?

Raiden.Kaminari
04-20-2007, 01:13 PM
Why is suspending NorCal from Nationals a reasonable response? The event occurred at a national tournament, not a NorCal one - it was national USTA that should have caught this when it happened and taken the appropriate steps.

IDs are being implemented across the board because USTA never expected people to cheat so badly.

The Section let them go through, right? There's been several accusations leveled against NorCal in the past. Are they being lax in their responsibility?

According to some friends in NorCal, USTA NorCal knew about the team. They knew some of the player's history (ie. they were on another Backesto team a prior year that had not paid league fees). Sadly enough, you can no longer pull the information up on the NorCal website about grievances (that were upheld).

Unfortunately, NorCal isn't the only section with issues. Some other sections also need to be removed from Nationals until they clean house. You review which states do consistently well at Nationals, and you will find the Sections that really need to clean up their act. Removing a Section from Nationals would hopefully convince some of the players of that Section to reflect on their values, and whether winning at all costs is really winning. Then we would hopefully see players willing to play at the appropriate level, not just at the level they can win at.

Perhaps USTA should not have Nationals until the majority sections clean up their NTRP issues.

Raiden.Kaminari
04-20-2007, 01:14 PM
...so this is what NTRP leagues are all about? I rest my case. I'm going to play age group only. I'm not going anywhere near this kind of nonsense...

Yeah, after 30+ years of playing tennis, a few years playing USTA league, I'm leaning towards going back to only being an Open player.

Sakkijarvi
04-21-2007, 02:41 AM
Looks like they hung pham. It's just to bad they didn't give him a ming ta explain his bad self!

Seems Steve tried to quach news of this getting out but Vincent said, 'ha, I'll see about that' and word leaked out all over the place.

And the end of the say Susan, acting as forman, was unable to get them to tuan from their bad ways and they'll all have to go on the lam. All of them except for John, he says, 'I'll bui back' and it'd be best to take him at his word as he plans to re-register as 'Rambo' and self-rate down to 2.0. Another approach is planned by Walter Jefferson, who says 'I'm moving on up', and apparently plans to also re-register as 'Billy Carter' and self-rate to 7.0.

Good luck and godspeed to these fine folks, may the strings be with them. The violin strings...

Sakki

Rabbit
04-21-2007, 04:24 AM
You know what the really sad thing is? They'll probably take their two year suspension, and come back and self-rate 3.5.

The USTA's stance on league tennis is ridiculous. I think ALTA should go national.

drop shot
05-18-2007, 10:45 PM
Was that team from Cambodia or the US?

the_playa
05-19-2007, 03:49 AM
that sounds like a racist question to me.

they were mainly vietnamese i believe, not cambodian.

armand
05-19-2007, 04:19 AM
I'll agree with that. Sometimes you don't know who's on your team or not...you don't really pay attention to the other players and just focus in on your own match. So if you captain told you, "Hey, this guy's name is XXX and he's playing for us," you'd be like "OK, nice to meet you." So yes, it's obvious that it's the captain's fault, but the other players are not necessarily co-conspirators.Hahaha Exactly. I'm the captain of my team and most players they don't know what's going on(not saying anything is going), they just play and chat. Are they supposed to ask me the tennis credentials of all our players now?

Having said all that, I think punishing everyone is good because it's just another way to punish this capt. and discourage future cheating by other captains: A captain will be less willing to cheat knowing that he's not only putting himself at risk, but his players too.

grothman
07-29-2007, 07:14 PM
An interesting tidbit on this thread is that I just got done playing in the USTA Southern Sectionals and found out that they are going to let that Alabama team from last year go to Nationals automatically now this year. There will be 2 states from Southern represented in 4.0 Men. Its kind of wierd because that team is mostly 4.5 now :) I guess this was USTA's way for making up for NorCals deal.

Sean Dugan
08-07-2007, 08:08 AM
Not that vietnamese culture has a monopoly on cheating/corruption but corruption seems to be a cultural norm in vietnam and that norm has apparently carried over to USTA league tennis.

The captains, the replacement players and the replaced players in this case should have all received a lifetime ban. The players attending the nationals who didn't report the ringers should have received at least a five year ban. The rest of the team at least a one year ban.

These guys probably lawyered up and threathened to sue so USTA compromised and lessened the terms of the suspensions to avoid litigation.

People who cheat on this level for USTA League tennis are total idiots.

harleywilson
08-07-2007, 09:33 AM
You know what the really sad thing is? They'll probably take their two year suspension, and come back and self-rate 3.5.

The USTA's stance on league tennis is ridiculous. I think ALTA should go national.

I personally don't like ALTA. There are no singles lines and the sandbagging is horrific. Every league has its problems with dishonesty.