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View Full Version : Coach would prefer me not to use full poly set-ups anymore


Ripper
12-20-2006, 12:39 PM
I was using a Yonex 880/Lux BB Original hybrid at 54/52 and was doing well with it. But, recently, out of curiosity, I tried a full string-job of SPPP 18 at 48/46 and am so happy with the results that I want to stick with it, for the time being, at least. However, this coach says my shots have lost their sting. He caught me by surprise when he said that to me today, because, with this set-up, I was feeling more secure about hitting out. So, I've been thinking about it all day and, maybe, he's right. I mean, I'm no James Blake; I need the strings to help me a bit in the power department. Plus, it's true I had to be more carefull with my top-spin groundstrokes with the previous set-up, but I was controlling it pretty well. Having said that, it would be hard to leave the new found feeling of security that the full poly job has given me. What should I do?

Valjean
12-20-2006, 01:05 PM
Tradeoffs, tradeoffs on the wall--just find another hybrid, why don't you?

Ripper
12-20-2006, 01:15 PM
--just find another hybrid, why don't you?

Because he says there was no reason for the change. Don't fix what is not broken, etc.

NoBadMojo
12-20-2006, 04:16 PM
question...are you a junior? lots of people get enamored with the spin that poly makes and the ball sure does look pretty in the air, but i bet your coach is advising you to change because your ball doesnt have enough stick on it after the bounce..also, if you get away from full poly now, your arm will likely thank you later. having security but losing penetration on your shots isnt a good thing. good luck

eunjam
12-20-2006, 05:22 PM
talk about messing with your head.......

sureshs
12-20-2006, 05:35 PM
Polys don't help with power - they help you better control the power you have thru topspin.

alu16L
12-20-2006, 07:58 PM
Because he says there was no reason for the change. Don't fix what is not broken, etc.

I'd recommend to stick with the full poly string job because of the added control. The power will come as your technique improves.

Ripper
12-21-2006, 08:20 AM
question...are you a junior? lots of people get enamored with the spin that poly makes and the ball sure does look pretty in the air, but i bet your coach is advising you to change because your ball doesnt have enough stick on it after the bounce..also, if you get away from full poly now, your arm will likely thank you later. having security but losing penetration on your shots isnt a good thing. good luck

The days in which I could be refered to as a junior are long gone in the past, lol.

Edit: Today I proved to this guy that my shots could have the same zip in them with the full poly. He admited to this. However, I had to hit quite a bit harder to accomplish this (was reminded of Roddick's "wooly mamooth swings" comment). So, he asked me if I could hit like that for a complete match. I'm not sure about that. Anyway, NoBadMojo, thanks for reminding me about the possible future arm issues. At this point, I'm not sure of what to do. I could just carry raquets with both types of string jobs and decide on which one to use depending on how I feel that given day. Nevertheless, I'm not sure that would be a good idea... Bah, I'll figure it out. Thanks for your responses.

travlerajm
12-21-2006, 09:53 AM
The days in which I could be refered to as a junior are long gone in the past, lol.

Edit: Today I proved to this guy that my shots could have the same zip in them with the full poly. He admited to this. However, I had to hit quite a bit harder to accomplish this (was reminded of Roddick's "wooly mamooth swings" comment). So, he asked me if I could hit like that for a complete match. I'm not sure about that. Anyway, NoBadMojo, thanks for reminding me about the possible future arm issues. At this point, I'm not sure of what to do. I could just carry raquets with both types of string jobs and decide on which one to use depending on how I feel that given day. Nevertheless, I'm not sure that would be a good idea... Bah, I'll figure it out. Thanks for your responses.

What happens when you add a dab of lead?

maverick66
12-21-2006, 10:00 AM
wow i would fire that coach. you need to decide on what feels best to you. also telling a student that there shots are getting worse only messes with your head. use what feels comfortable to you if you want the security of full poly then use it. i use full poly and if use anything else i cant stand it. it feels like a trampoline to me when i use other strings. and i tried a hybrid and still it felt like crap and mentally i kept questining it.

NoBadMojo
12-21-2006, 10:12 AM
The days in which I could be refered to as a junior are long gone in the past, lol.

Edit: Today I proved to this guy that my shots could have the same zip in them with the full poly. He admited to this. However, I had to hit quite a bit harder to accomplish this (was reminded of Roddick's "wooly mamooth swings" comment). So, he asked me if I could hit like that for a complete match. I'm not sure about that. Anyway, NoBadMojo, thanks for reminding me about the possible future arm issues. At this point, I'm not sure of what to do. I could just carry raquets with both types of string jobs and decide on which one to use depending on how I feel that given day. Nevertheless, I'm not sure that would be a good idea... Bah, I'll figure it out. Thanks for your responses.

i think your coach makes some good points. i suggest you prove this to yourself. i dont know your level, but go play someone a little better than you w. the poly using your poly swings and see if you can do it for the duration or if you get sloppy and start making lots of ue's near the end of your session.

Ripper
12-21-2006, 01:46 PM
What happens when you add a dab of lead?

Haven't tried that, to tell you the truth. Probably should. Thanks.

sypl
12-21-2006, 05:44 PM
I think your coach may be onto something. If the reduction in power is making you land balls a bit short then maybe you've got the wrong string. A full poly job needs a player who can really belt it. Be honest with yourself - are you that player yet?

nopiforyou
12-21-2006, 06:58 PM
Ripper, I wanted to know for a while. How old are you?

Ripper
12-22-2006, 06:33 AM
Ripper, I wanted to know for a while. How old are you?

39, believe it or not.

diredesire
12-22-2006, 07:03 AM
39, believe it or not.

I thought you were way younger :P

As far as the setup goes, You don't necessarily have to live or die by his advice, although it really depends on the coach. Some coaches are wise beyond their years, others don't think what they teach/say very thoroughly. Like an above poster said, there are a lot of trade offs in the world of strings. I think polys have their place and suit a certain type of player better than another. If the benefits really are helping, maybe you can adjust the tension or your game to capitalize on the benefits, but this is kind of backwards.

I think either route you choose, you'll realize down the road which decision is right. That's one of the joys of experimentation, i guess. Just give yourself a thorough evaluation on what you're trying to achieve. Although you may be losing something you had, if this decision moves you towards your current goals, I feel that you're not really making a bad choice. Arm problems aside, if you are learning new things, this is a good thing.

Ripper
12-22-2006, 08:22 AM
I thought you were way younger

I know. Sometimes, I act that way here, for some reason. Plus, the avatar, lol.

Anyway, regarding my dilema, I think it should all come down to what gives me better results. In other words, with which set-up do I feel I can win more points with. The full poly set-up is, definitively, better for extreme angles and, with certain players, you really need to be able to execute those shots very well. So, I've decided to not hurry up to make a decision.

knasty131
12-22-2006, 08:33 AM
Ripper, I second that thought about just a little more lead. Also, how deep in the court did you hit with your previous setup compared to now?

Ripper
12-22-2006, 10:27 AM
Ripper, I second that thought about just a little more lead. Also, how deep in the court did you hit with your previous setup compared to now?

With the full poly, the ball may land a bit shorter, depending on what I put into the swing.

Edit: And about adding a bit more weight, I don't think that would be a solution for me, because my swingweight is already close to my personal 'too much' borderline and I wouldn't like it to be higher.

PurePrestige
12-22-2006, 02:34 PM
Ripper, what racquet are ya using?

Full poly can really give a sharp drop in power for lower powered more flexy frames. I mean if you like the SPPP, try a hybrid with that in the mains?

Try SPPP 18 mains with Yonex 880 crosses? The multi in the crosses will help you maintain that pop, while the poly mains will give you that bite and control you wanted?

SPPP 18 will definitely give you more bite, that thin of gauge? So stick with the thin gauge poly mains for more bite and spin for control, but add a multi cross to keep it from being too dampened.

kaissoz
12-22-2006, 05:38 PM
It's almost the same dilemma I had to face myself recently, should I stick to feel, or or go for results. I'd been away from the game for a couple of years, but had a few PS Tour 95s in my closet. when leaded up (in the low 12 ounce), i really enjoy the feel the of sweetspot, and I thought I would stick with that racquet/setup for many years, cuz it "felt" so great to me (assuming i'm within the vincinity of the sweetspot).

I'm about a weak 5.0 right now, but i've been trying to shake out the rust and take my game to new levels in recent months by playing more regularly with players slightly better than me, and my previously beloved prostaff still feels great, but i found it difficult to generate the necessary power/pace in less than ideal situations. So i decided to switch to a lighter, more forgiving racquet, which didn't feel as good when hit in the sweetspot, but provides with so much more forgiveness and power (head instinct tour xl).

The fact that now my opponents had a tougher time returning my balls complely made up for what I had lost in "feel". when not playing competitively, i was more focused on enjoying the "feel" of my equipment, but i quickly changed my mind after a few bad losses (as a side note, i do agree with NBMJ and many others as far as the trend toward lighter, larger headed frames in advanced players. in my area, i see more 3.5/4.0s holding traditional midize frames than 5.0s).

So, assuming he doesn't have any vested, I would trust your coach when he says your ball does not have as much "sting".

Ripper
12-24-2006, 07:40 AM
Ripper, what racquet are ya using?

Full poly can really give a sharp drop in power for lower powered more flexy frames.

Yonex RD-7s, which are flexy and lower powered.

I mean if you like the SPPP, try a hybrid with that in the mains?

Try SPPP 18 mains with Yonex 880 crosses? The multi in the crosses will help you maintain that pop, while the poly mains will give you that bite and control you wanted?

SPPP 18 will definitely give you more bite, that thin of gauge? So stick with the thin gauge poly mains for more bite and spin for control, but add a multi cross to keep it from being too dampened.

I tried a Lux BB Original/Yonex 850 Non-Spin set-up (in other words, replaced 880 with 850) and it was interesting. 850 has less feel, but, also, less power, than 880, which provides me with a little bit more confidence when hitting out. So, I understand what some of you are saying about trying other hybrids. From what I've read, I think something like TF X-One Biphase could be what I need.

Edit: Here's an update on my findings. I've been playing side by side with both set-ups and hitting heavy balls doesn't seem to be an issue with the full poly set-up when playing against hard hitters. It can, sometimes, be a problem, for me, when facing people who hit without pace. With them, I seem to be better with a hybrid.

Ripper
12-24-2006, 07:59 AM
I'm about a weak 5.0 right now, but i've been trying to shake out the rust and take my game to new levels in recent months by playing more regularly with players slightly better than me...

A word of advise. Be careful with this approach. Playing against opponents you're supposed to lose with is great, because the pressure is on the other guy. However, if you get too used to this, you may have problems when you have to face someone you're supposed to beat, believe it or not. I'm talking from personal experience. Personally, I believe that, playing with all kinds of opponents (to a certain point, of course), is a wise thing to do. Sorry for the detour.

Paul Goldstein
12-26-2006, 08:45 AM
I know your base tension is low, but I suggest you lower it 2 lbs and see if you get more pop/depth

gl

Wondertoy
01-26-2007, 08:06 AM
Ripper if you want to stay all poly and get more stick on the ball you have to switch to Polystar Energy or ALU Power. SPPP and Big Banger Original are lower powered.

Ripper
01-26-2007, 08:32 AM
Ripper if you want to stay all poly and get more stick on the ball you have to switch to Polystar Energy or ALU Power. SPPP and Big Banger Original are lower powered.

What about Lux BB Ace? Since I like SPPP's thin gauge...

Wondertoy
01-26-2007, 09:58 AM
What about Lux BB Ace? Since I like SPPP's thin gauge...

BB Ace is also low powered. Polystar Energy comes in 1.20mm which is close to SPPP 1.18mm. Touch Turbo is also springy.

Noisy Ninja
01-26-2007, 10:05 AM
What about Lux BB Ace? Since I like SPPP's thin gauge...

Have you considered trying Topspin Cyberflash in lieu of the SPPP? It would give you a bit more power than SPPP and string tension dropoff wouldn't be as drastic as Lux BB Ace from what I recall.

Ripper
01-26-2007, 10:10 AM
Have you considered trying Topspin Cyberflash in lieu of the SPPP? It would give you a bit more power than SPPP and string tension dropoff wouldn't be as drastic as Lux BB Ace from what I recall.

Actually, I'm about to try Topspin Poly Polar 17. Not as thin, but I've been curious about the springyness of this string.

Noisy Ninja
01-26-2007, 10:51 AM
Actually, I'm about to try Topspin Poly Polar 17. Not as thin, but I've been curious about the springyness of this string.
I don't have any personal experience with Poly Polar 17 but one of my hitting partners tried it previously as a full string job and thought it lacked feel for his taste. It's all subjective though and what one person considers mushy in feel is comfortable to another (more so if that person had arm problems). Best of luck with your search for the right string.

Ripper
01-26-2007, 11:16 AM
I don't have any personal experience with Poly Polar 17 but one of my hitting partners tried it previously as a full string job and thought it lacked feel for his taste. It's all subjective though and what one person considers mushy in feel is comfortable to another (more so if that person had arm problems). Best of luck with your search for the right string.

Apparently, everyone's definition of feel is different. Thanks.

Midlife crisis
01-26-2007, 01:32 PM
Apparently, everyone's definition of feel is different. Thanks.

Not only that, but there's also the value of feel. What you feel can have no affect at all on the ball that was just hit, because the ball leaves the strings at around the time the ball impact is traveling along your nerves at about the level of your shoulder. By the time the first impulse of the impact reaches our brain, the ball is long gone, with no possible way to influence where it is going and how it is going there.

Pragmatically, the only real use of feel is to determine how well the shot was hit, because your vision tells you the rest. If you hit it flush and the you see the ball not going where it was supposed to, then you adjust. If you did hit it well and see the ball go where you wanted, you don't adjust. Neither one of these happens without your vision, but the only practical information from the feel is how well the ball was hit.