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View Full Version : the 1972 US Open had a 148 draw?


Moose Malloy
03-26-2007, 01:27 PM
Was going through some old draws at the itf site, & came across this, which was surprising:

http://www.itftennis.com/mens/tournaments/drawsheetbyround.asp?tournament=1010004556&event=1010010361&round=1

Apparently the 1972 US Open, for some players, involved an extra match. According to the link 108 players had a bye & another 40 played an extra match to get into the next round, which was the round of 128. The weird thing was that they all ended up playing each other in the next round, they weren't spread out in different parts of the draw(like you would see in other events that involve byes)

And these don't look like qualifying results, seeing that 2 of the players involved were seeds. Many of the names are well-known (including players like Ramirez, Riessen, Teacher, McMillan, Pasarell, Amritraj, Drysdale, Stolle)

Was surprised to see Borg in this draw, the atp site says that his 1st US Open was in '73, looks like he played it in '72 as well(losing his 1st Round match to Emerson 7-5 6-7 6-4 6-4, at the age of 16!)

anyone know what the deal was in '72? some competing tours thing?

so theoretically, there could have been someone having to win 8 main draw matches in order to win a major.

Stolle & McMillan made it the farthest of these 'extra match' players, both winning 5 matches just to get to the quarters.

vive le beau jeu !
03-26-2007, 07:07 PM
great discovery ! :D
this draw is really weird... some of the 16 seeds seemed to have to play this extra round, while some other unseeded players didn't have to ! http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/emoticons7/39.gif

and borg vs emerson as a "R256" match... what an amazing catch that you made !
this match doesn't appear in the atptennis.com database, but it gives 23 (past and upcoming) slams on the court !
(they also played in 1973 : final at san francisco, also won by emerson)
for the moment, this is the (male) encounter with the highest "amount" of slam......
... after the federer-sampras at wimbledon in 2001, with 24 ! ;)

Rosebud
03-27-2007, 02:44 AM
ITF db is correct, in World of tennis it's mentioned that the draw was so loaded with players that they decided to add a preliminary round and expand the draw to 148. It was the best field of the year, after the ban which prohibited WCT players to appear in Rome, Paris and Wimbledon was lifted. But although WoT mentions it, it hasn't actually included this preliminary round in their overview of the draw. So, nice find.

Moose Malloy
03-30-2007, 11:25 AM
Rosebud are you referring to World of Tennis by Richard Schickel? is that a good book? I've seen an excerpt of it in another book, I thought it was about the 1974 US Open?

Do you(or urban) know how they decided on where to place those additional players in the draw in '72? it doesn't seem that fair.

urban
03-30-2007, 12:09 PM
Moose, i think Rosebud - who will know it of course better - is referring to the World of tennis yearbooks by John Barrett and Lance Tingay. The Schickel book of 1975 is quite good, by a film director, who focusses a bit on the charisma and drawing ability of players. The book has rare and interesting pictures of older players and the old pro tours, including Tilden (i think some pictures show him in short pants, had beautiful legs, which made Gussy Moran blink). It ends with a report of the 1974 Forest Hills, which Connors won. On the part of the historical pictures, i know not many better books, maybe the Clerici Book '500 year of Tennis' is even better. Don't know, how they made the draw in 1972. As Rosebud said, it was the only real big event with all the best pros in 72. A big win for Nastase, although i give Smith the nod for the year because of Wim and especially his Davis Cup win at Bukarest. That must have been Nastase's nightmare.

Rosebud
03-31-2007, 03:32 AM
Oh, sorry. Yes urban is right. I meant the World of Tennis Annual for that year. It's a pity but it doesn't give any explanation for that section of the draw either. It looks rather random, or even like last minute decision making, but the accord between ITF and WCT was made in April already, wasn't it?
It is neat to see Borg - who had won the Wimbledon junior title that year - there.

I believe I saw that Schickel book at a local bookseller for a very nice price. Think I'll go and get it before it's gone! Thanks for the recomendation.

Hops
04-01-2007, 07:13 PM
Was going through some old draws at the itf site, & came across this, which was surprising:

http://www.itftennis.com/mens/tournaments/drawsheetbyround.asp?tournament=1010004556&event=1010010361&round=1

Apparently the 1972 US Open, for some players, involved an extra match. According to the link 108 players had a bye & another 40 played an extra match to get into the next round, which was the round of 128. The weird thing was that they all ended up playing each other in the next round, they weren't spread out in different parts of the draw(like you would see in other events that involve byes)



yeah, dunno what the story was back then. the fact that seeded players didn't recieve byes ...

Open Era draws, not 128:

1968 RG 135
1968 US 96
1969 AO 48
1970 AO 48
1970 US 108
1971 AO 48
1972 AO 50
1972 RG 64
1972 US 148
1973 AO 56
1974-81 AO 64
1982-87 AO 96


if anyone has differing figures, let me know, thanks

vive le beau jeu !
04-02-2007, 01:15 AM
yeah, dunno what the story was back then. the fact that seeded players didn't recieve byes ...

Open Era draws, not 128:

1968 RG 135
1968 US 96
1969 AO 48
1970 AO 48
1970 US 108
1971 AO 48
1972 AO 50
1972 RG 64
1972 US 148
1973 AO 56
1974-81 AO 64
1982-87 AO 96


if anyone has differing figures, let me know, thanks
wow, good research ! very interesting... and surprising !
i knew the AO had a smaller draw in the past, but for the others...

135 for the 1968 FO ?! really strange ! :rolleyes:

Moose Malloy
01-23-2008, 09:51 AM
Ok, just came across another strange bit of trivia about the 1972 USO-they had a 3rd place match between the 2 losing semifinalists that year!

Cliff Richey d Tom Gorman 6-4 to win an extra $1,000(siginificant if you consider the purse for winning the Open that year was $25,000)

urban, do you remember anything about this? was it just a one year thing?

hoodjem
01-23-2008, 11:44 AM
Was surprised to see Borg in this draw, the atp site says that his 1st US Open was in '73, looks like he played it in '72 as well(losing his 1st Round match to Emerson 7-5 6-7 6-4 6-4, at the age of 16!)



Wow! Emmo and Borg at the USO: two greats from two different eras. If Borg was 16, how old was Emmo--35 or 36?

CyBorg
01-23-2008, 12:16 PM
I assumed that Borg lost to Emerson in some kind of qualifying component.

CyBorg
01-23-2008, 12:18 PM
ITF db is correct, in World of tennis it's mentioned that the draw was so loaded with players that they decided to add a preliminary round and expand the draw to 148. It was the best field of the year, after the ban which prohibited WCT players to appear in Rome, Paris and Wimbledon was lifted. But although WoT mentions it, it hasn't actually included this preliminary round in their overview of the draw. So, nice find.

Man, try telling this to some people who think that tennis wasn't deep in those years.

hoodjem
02-04-2008, 11:42 AM
So true.

All one hears these days is "today's players are SO MUCH better than players have ever been before."

TennisandMusic
02-04-2008, 01:12 PM
So true.

All one hears these days is "today's players are SO MUCH better than players have ever been before."

I think most people who take this stance are kids who have the belief that just because it didn't happen during their brief lifetime, it must not have been any good.