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CEvertFan
04-19-2007, 12:56 PM
Does anyone besides myself appreciate just how well Lindsey hit the ball? Her contact was always so clean and very technically sound that you could even hear the difference as compared to other players when her racket made contact with the ball. To be able to hit that well is a tribute to how good of a player she was even though her movement was always a major weakness. I always watched her in awe when she was in full command of a rally.

Condoleezza
04-19-2007, 01:00 PM
Does anyone besides myself appreciate just how well Lindsey hit the ball? Her contact was always so clean and very technically sound that you could even hear the difference as compared to other players when her racket made contact with the ball. To be able to hit that well is a tribute to how good of a player she was even though her movement was always a major weakness. I always watched her in awe when she was in full command of a rally.


But she was SOOOO slow.
The 2005 Wimbledon final was embarrassing ...

Condi

CEvertFan
04-19-2007, 01:04 PM
But she was SOOOO slow.
The 2005 Wimbledon final was embarrassing ...

Condi

I did say her movement was a major weakness did I not???

Condoleezza
04-19-2007, 01:06 PM
I did say her movement was a major weakness did I not???

It is easy to hit a clean stroke when you wait until the ball comes into your comfort zone.

Condi

CEvertFan
04-19-2007, 01:07 PM
It is easy to hit a clean stroke when you wait until the ball comes into your comfort zone.

Condi


Even the pros and commentators acknowledge that she hit the ball more cleanly than almost anyone else.

Condoleezza
04-19-2007, 01:13 PM
Even the pros and commentators acknowledge that she hit the ball more cleanly than almost anyone else.

American pros and commentators?

Condi

federerfanatic
04-19-2007, 03:15 PM
Does anyone besides myself appreciate just how well Lindsey hit the ball? Her contact was always so clean and very technically sound that you could even hear the difference as compared to other players when her racket made contact with the ball. To be able to hit that well is a tribute to how good of a player she was even though her movement was always a major weakness. I always watched her in awe when she was in full command of a rally.


You are right. Her strokes are pretty close to textbook. So clean, such control, with so much power created with such ease and little effort.

To be able to achieve what she has with very limited(to put it kindly)athletic skills speaks to the extreme excellence of her strokes.

Alexandros
04-19-2007, 03:58 PM
But she was SOOOO slow.
The 2005 Wimbledon final was embarrassing ...

Condi

Embarassing? She matched Venus point for point and held was one away from the championship despite being 'slow'.

tricky
04-19-2007, 04:28 PM
Davenport's movement wasn't great, but she had a great reverse FH on the run. If you couldn't the ball past her FH side, you were in deep trouble. This changes the makeup, because you then had to think twice about blasting shots past her.

She also had a more classic stroke than her peers, and didn't swing across the body as much as her peers. As a result, her swing arcs were linear, which coupled with very deep shoulder turn and her height gave her both natural power and control.

Mad iX
04-19-2007, 04:45 PM
She was noticeably slower than the rest of the Top 10 at her peak but she still hit #1 and no small number of slams.
Imagine if she was as quick as everyone else ...

LarougeNY
04-19-2007, 04:52 PM
It is easy to hit a clean stroke when you wait until the ball comes into your comfort zone.

Condi

Can you hold your own and hit clean strokes when Top WTA pros whack the ball into your comfort zone?

tricky
04-19-2007, 05:21 PM
In regards to comfort zone -- remember her biggest weapon was the DTL running forehand. She wasn't fast, but if she was moving and you couldn't hit the ball past her, you were in big trouble.

Imagine if she was as quick as everyone else ...

The real limiting factor for her, really like so many top female tennis players, was her mental strength. Her game could break down when she was put in a bind. Fought nerves through the end of her career.

backhander
04-19-2007, 06:39 PM
Embarassing? She matched Venus point for point and held was one away from the championship despite being 'slow'.

Condi is just bitter because Davenport beat Graf at the Wimby finals and into retirement.

rommil
04-19-2007, 10:10 PM
But she was SOOOO slow.
The 2005 Wimbledon final was embarrassing ...

Condi

Slow enough to shock Graf in the '99 Wimbledon finals?

rommil
04-19-2007, 10:12 PM
Condi is just bitter because Davenport beat Graf at the Wimby finals and into retirement.

My thoughts exactly. I think that match was one of the factors made Graf decide it was time to exit.

Condoleezza
04-19-2007, 10:18 PM
Condi is just bitter because Davenport beat Graf at the Wimby finals and into retirement.

Graf was injured (thigh). She even had to retire from mixed doubles with McEnroe the day before.

The singles final against Davenport was very close.
Both had only 2 break points. Davenport converted them, Graf not.
In the end Davenport had made 70 points, Graf 67.

No comparison to the easy win Graf had in the FO quarters that year.


Condi

Condoleezza
04-19-2007, 10:20 PM
Slow enough to shock Graf in the '99 Wimbledon finals?

Davenport of 2005 was over-the-hill.
Don't forget that she won her last slam in January 2000.

Condi

rommil
04-19-2007, 10:38 PM
Davenport of 2005 was over-the-hill.
Don't forget that she won her last slam in January 2000.

Condi

Funny how you just type some facts just to say you have an arguement or a rebuttal(the very competent "lawyer" that you are). Seriously a lot of people expected, maybe, including me, that Graf would win the 1999 Wimbledon. After all, she has won it numerous times and that her game is suited to grass and Davenport is so the opposite. But what happened was that Graf ran into a red hot Davenport. And don't give me that bull that it was close. The score maybe but Davenport just went ahead without looking back.
Morale of the match-when somebody is capable of serving well and hitting with consistent power off both sides then it exploits Graf's game. It got to the point where Graf couldn't afford to keep running around her forehand because Davenport can hit the ball with equal ferocity off both sides.

freelancer
04-20-2007, 07:23 AM
Umm... are we all going to neglect that Davenport had the 2005 Wimbledon match in the bag when she hurt her back?

And when she stunned Hingis in the 2000 Aussie final. A grand slam that Hingis had won the previous 3 years in a row. Davenport even took the first set 6-1.

Not to mention the fact that Davenport has a winning record against; Venus, Capriati, Seles, Hingis, Mauresmo... in fact, she has a winning record against 7 of the current top ten players on the WTA tour.

I think Lindsay could have won more singles titles than she did, but often times her mental game could come into question, as well has her weak movemnet around the court. But all things considered, she has proven to be an amazing player, worthy of respect.

Condoleezza
04-20-2007, 08:57 AM
Funny how you just type some facts just to say you have an arguement or a rebuttal(the very competent "lawyer" that you are). Seriously a lot of people expected, maybe, including me, that Graf would win the 1999 Wimbledon. After all, she has won it numerous times and that her game is suited to grass and Davenport is so the opposite. But what happened was that Graf ran into a red hot Davenport. ...

What happened is that Graf was injured.
She made only 3 points less than Davenport (67-70).
She hit more winners (2).
She didn't convert her 2 break points.
Davenport converted her 2 break points.

End of story.

"Red hot Davenport", my *** ....


Condi

suwanee4712
04-20-2007, 09:17 AM
What happened is that Graf was injured.
She made only 3 points less than Davenport (67-70).
She hit more winners (2).
She didn't convert her 2 break points.
Davenport converted her 2 break points.

End of story.

"Red hot Davenport", my *** ....


Condi

Funny how injuries, sickness, etc. only count when it hurts Steffi with you. I was rooting for Steffi that day, but Lindsey won it fair and square. Steffi herself would tell you that.

Condoleezza
04-20-2007, 09:40 AM
Funny how injuries, sickness, etc. only count when it hurts Steffi with you. I was rooting for Steffi that day, but Lindsey won it fair and square. Steffi herself would tell you that.

I never heard that Steffi called Davenport "red hot".
Davenport was the better player that day.
3 points better. Which is enough. Same in, say, basketball.

Condi

suwanee4712
04-20-2007, 10:04 AM
I never heard that Steffi called Davenport "red hot".
Davenport was the better player that day.
3 points better. Which is enough. Same in, say, basketball.

Condi


I never said anything about Steffi saying that Lindsey was "red hot." She might have. But I don't have that quote and didn't assert that. It was a close match and could have gone either way. Steffi was a champion even in defeat, not offering excuses for her loss.

rommil
04-20-2007, 12:17 PM
What happened is that Graf was injured.
She made only 3 points less than Davenport (67-70).
She hit more winners (2).
She didn't convert her 2 break points.
Davenport converted her 2 break points.

End of story.

"Red hot Davenport", my *** ....


Condi

Lol Condi I am pretty sure you were turning in your grave when Graf got spanked in supposedly her living room that day. Yeah I said it. Davenport was red hot. Your ***, on the other hand, I'm pretty sure is a totally different matter.

tennissavy
04-28-2007, 08:23 AM
American pros and commentators?

Condi

NO, all commentators said that not just Americans.

tennissavy
04-28-2007, 08:24 AM
Lol Condi I am pretty sure you were turning in your grave when Graf got spanked in supposedly her living room that day. Yeah I said it. Davenport was red hot. Your ***, on the other hand, I'm pretty sure is a totally different matter.

good one:)

CEvertFan
04-28-2007, 01:54 PM
good one:)



LOL I agree.

federerfanatic
04-28-2007, 04:00 PM
I disagree with Rommil that the 1999 Wimbledon final was not a close match, or that Davenport dominated the match. The first set started with a long service game on Graf's serve where she squandered many game points, then a long service game on Davenport's serve where Graf missed a chance to break. The rest of the set was very equal. Then the second set was very equal until 4-5 Davenport serving, when Graf missed an easy forehand(for her)at 15-30 which would have given her double set point. Then on Graf's next service game she played her worst service game of the set with 4 unforced errors in 5 points lost, and still missed a game point and only got broken from deuce. Then Davenport served it out.

I am not saying Davenport did not play extremely well or deserve to win, but to say it wasnt a close match or Davenport just dominated the whole match is ridiculous.

rommil
04-28-2007, 07:44 PM
^OPINION duly noted. If you want to equate "spanked" to "dominated"(your word BTW) then go ahead. The fact remains that majority of us, including me, expected Graf to win that Finals. Now, you mentioned that Graf made a lot of errors in this match, you and Condi might argue that this was due to her injury, I can say it might be due to Davenport's play or both. The fact remains that Davenport executed her game well and she served well. Final score 6-4,7-5....not so close considering Linday was the underdog. 7-5,5-7,7-5 now that would have been close. And I did say that Lindsay never looked back. You said it yourself, Lindsay was serving for the match. So she did, finishing Graf and shocking everybody and even Davenport sounded shocked on the final point.

rommil
04-28-2007, 09:56 PM
Ok I just watched the Davenport-Graf final again and yeah Consdipation, Davenport played RED HOT. Davenport was unquestionably the much better player in that match considering her handicap and history on grass. She kept herself low on shots, had the better composure,played very calmly and chose her shots very well and oh did I mention she was never broken on her serve? Graf on the other hand played with a foul mood about 3/4 of the total match, kept running side to side, talked to herself, was never able to capitalize on any break points and was THE PLAYER WAITING FOR THAT SMALL WINDOW TO OPEN but nothing came. And oh 3-2 on the first set, Graf saw the ball was in and didn't have a play on it and she didn't say anything. All in all, Graf didn't have any reasons to deserve to win that match because you know why? Davenport just exemplified how it is to be a better player that day.

ubel
04-29-2007, 07:28 AM
When I first saw her, not only did her ability to hit with such consistently clean contact surprise me, but the power with which every shot had. She controlled the ball so very well, was in awe at first sight :o

federerfanatic
04-29-2007, 09:58 AM
^OPINION duly noted. If you want to equate "spanked" to "dominated"(your word BTW) then go ahead. The fact remains that majority of us, including me, expected Graf to win that Finals. Now, you mentioned that Graf made a lot of errors in this match, you and Condi might argue that this was due to her injury, I can say it might be due to Davenport's play or both. The fact remains that Davenport executed her game well and she served well. Final score 6-4,7-5....not so close considering Linday was the underdog. 7-5,5-7,7-5 now that would have been close. And I did say that Lindsay never looked back. You said it yourself, Lindsay was serving for the match. So she did, finishing Graf and shocking everybody and even Davenport sounded shocked on the final point.

Ok fair enough. I just believed it was a much more tight match then your initial depiction, but I understand what you are saying all the same. BTW, I do not imply any of Graf's errors were due to her injury.

CEvertFan
04-29-2007, 01:13 PM
One other thing that always amazed me about her strokes is that she hit with so much power without seeming to throw her whole body into the shot ala Venus or Serena or even Seles. Her shots were effortlessly powerful which just means stroke production of the highest caliber.

rommil
04-29-2007, 03:48 PM
One other thing that always amazed me about her strokes is that she hit with so much power without seeming to throw her whole body into the shot ala Venus or Serena or even Seles. Her shots were effortlessly powerful which just means stroke production of the highest caliber.

I think what it is that Davenport LEANED into her shots well instead of throwing her body into it.

jkonecne
04-29-2007, 04:14 PM
Her size was a big part of it. She could control points so well so she has so much time to get ready for her shots.

Condoleezza
04-30-2007, 01:06 PM
I disagree with Rommil that the 1999 Wimbledon final was not a close match, or that Davenport dominated the match. The first set started with a long service game on Graf's serve where she squandered many game points, then a long service game on Davenport's serve where Graf missed a chance to break. The rest of the set was very equal. Then the second set was very equal until 4-5 Davenport serving, when Graf missed an easy forehand(for her)at 15-30 which would have given her double set point. Then on Graf's next service game she played her worst service game of the set with 4 unforced errors in 5 points lost, and still missed a game point and only got broken from deuce. Then Davenport served it out.

I am not saying Davenport did not play extremely well or deserve to win, but to say it wasnt a close match or Davenport just dominated the whole match is ridiculous.


Of course it is ridiculous. You have to be a rah-rah-rah redneck US "patriot" to say so.
Davenport won 70 points and Graf 67 during the whole match.
Both player had exactly TWO break points. Davenport converted hers, Graf not. Graf hit more winners, BTW.

Condi

Condoleezza
04-30-2007, 01:09 PM
Ok I just watched the Davenport-Graf final again and yeah Consdipation, Davenport played RED HOT. Davenport was unquestionably the much better player in that match ...

She won with 70-67 on points played, hit less winners than Graf.

I'd call that "Selesian style domination" .... :D :D :D :D

Condi

Condoleezza
04-30-2007, 01:10 PM
I think what it is that Davenport LEANED into her shots well instead of throwing her body into it.

:D :D :D :D
Dude, have you ever played tennis yourself ... ?



Condi

rommil
04-30-2007, 08:32 PM
:D :D :D :D
Dude, have you ever played tennis yourself ... ?



Condi
4.0 rating here. You?

Condoleezza
04-30-2007, 08:35 PM
4.0 rating here. You?


What is a "4.0 rating"?
Something from you national tennis federation?

How exciting .... :D :D :D


Condi

rommil
04-30-2007, 08:38 PM
She won with 70-67 on points played, hit less winners than Graf.

I'd call that "Selesian style domination" .... :D :D :D :D

Condi

You can spit out any number you want yet Graf failed to consolidate any chances she had to break. Davenport showed more control and composure to her game while Graf played in a very foul and sometimes angry mood. Now, what more do I need to point out to you that Davenport exemplified how to be the better player that day? Graf lost because SHE WAS THE PLAYER LOOKING FOR THAT WINDOW OF OPPORTUNITY TO GET AHEAD and SHE FAILED.

rommil
04-30-2007, 08:41 PM
What is a "4.0 rating"?
Something from you national tennis federation?

How exciting .... :D :D :D


Condi
Google it yourself you pee drinking, insecure Nigerian.I didn't state my rating to excite you. Don't bother answering my question about your level of play because it is not a matter of interest to me.

Condoleezza
04-30-2007, 08:46 PM
Google it yourself you pee drinking, insecure Nigerian. ...


Ah, our little racist shows his true colours now and then ...

Condi

rommil
04-30-2007, 08:48 PM
Ah, our little racist shows his true colours now and then ...

Condi
Nice try Condi.....but I am sorry to tell you it's your insecurity, your low self esteem and your poor intelligence level that's playing tricks on you that's why you feel that way. I do not have control over that. I said Nigerian and there is nothing wrong with that. It is like saying American or Japanese or Russian. Like I said, it's your low perception of yourself that's making you feel that way. And that Condi, is your problem, not mine.

CEvertFan
04-30-2007, 09:14 PM
Keep in mind that Davenport won that Wimbledon title without losing a set throughout the tournament. In fact she did that with all 3 of her Grand Slam titles.

federerfanatic
04-30-2007, 09:52 PM
Keep in mind that Davenport won that Wimbledon title without losing a set throughout the tournament. In fact she did that with all 3 of her Grand Slam titles.

I find it amazing she went the last almost 7 years of her career without winning a single slam title. To me 3 slams seems too low for her, with all the tournaments she won, all the success she had vs other top end players of her time. Capriati is the golden girl in the U.S media's eyes, but I actually find it unbelievable she does not have more slams then Capriati.

CEvertFan
04-30-2007, 10:19 PM
I find it amazing she went the last almost 7 years of her career without winning a single slam title. To me 3 slams seems too low for her, with all the tournaments she won, all the success she had vs other top end players of her time. Capriati is the golden girl in the U.S media's eyes, but I actually find it unbelievable she does not have more slams then Capriati.



The two greatest obstacles were that she was a bit mentally fragile, even more so after she started getting lots of injuries, and her not so great movement. If winning matches was just a case of clean power hitting then Davenport would have 20 slams because she just loved to get into a hitting contest against opponents because she knew she could almost always outhit them, but they knew that the primary way to beat her was to make her run instead. Her opponents also knew she could/would get down on herself when she was under pressure and took full advantage, as they should have.

Even so I agree with you that it is astounding that she only has 3 Slams but she did finish as the year end #1 four times in her career. She is also 9th on the all time list of winningest players in history with regard to singles titles won.

Winningest players on the WTA Tour

Player Country Titles Majors

Martina Navratilova USA 167 18
Chris Evert USA 157 18
Steffi Graf GER 107 22
Margaret Smith-Court AUS 92 24
Evonne Goolagong AUS 68 7
Billie Jean King USA 67 12
Virginia Wade GBR 55 3
Monica Seles USA 53 9
Lindsay Davenport USA 51 3
Martina Hingis SUI 44 5
Venus Williams USA 34 5
Conchita Martinez ESP 33 1
Kim Clijsters BEL 33 1
Justine Henin BEL 31 5
Tracy Austin USA 30 2

CEvertFan
04-30-2007, 10:27 PM
If she hadn't injured her back during the Wimbledon final of '05, she would have won it. She was playing her very best tennis that day (until the injury during the 2nd set) and although she did lose, I don't think she showed signs of mentally crumbling but the injury did affect her serve and movement just enough. She did go down fighting for all she was worth that day though. I felt so bad for her when the match was over.

basil J
05-01-2007, 12:52 PM
I thought this thread was in appreciation of her groundstrokes, not how many slams she won? I got the chance to see her play live back in 01 and she hit the ball VERY solid. She is a lousy mover, which in my mind even makes her strokes that much more impressive. She also had a big first serve...

Condoleezza
05-01-2007, 12:55 PM
Nice try Condi.....but I am sorry to tell you it's your insecurity, your low self esteem and your poor intelligence level that's playing tricks on you that's why you feel that way. I do not have control over that. I said Nigerian and there is nothing wrong with that. It is like saying American or Japanese or Russian. Like I said, it's your low perception of yourself that's making you feel that way. And that Condi, is your problem, not mine.

No, it's rednecks like you who think "nig.gers" from Nigeria might drink pee now and then. The word association in your post was extremely revealing. The sub-conscious: Pee-drinking - Nigerian.

Condi

Condoleezza
05-01-2007, 01:00 PM
....
Winningest players on the WTA Tour

Player Country Titles Majors

Martina Navratilova USA 167 18
Chris Evert USA 157 18
Steffi Graf GER 107 22
Margaret Smith-Court AUS 92 24
Evonne Goolagong AUS 68 7
Billie Jean King USA 67 12
Virginia Wade GBR 55 3
Monica Seles USA 53 9
Lindsay Davenport USA 51 3
Martina Hingis SUI 44 5
Venus Williams USA 34 5
Conchita Martinez ESP 33 1
Kim Clijsters BEL 33 1
Justine Henin BEL 31 5
Tracy Austin USA 30 2

Quite interesting - you take Court's pre-open-era SLAMS so she is ahead of Graf.
But you don't take her non-slam pre-open titles because then she would be ahead of Navratilova.

Let me guess - you are American?

Condi

CEvertFan
05-01-2007, 01:09 PM
Quite interesting - you take Court's pre-open-era SLAMS so she is ahead of Graf.
But you don't take her non-slam pre-open titles because then she would be ahead of Navratilova.

Let me guess - you are American?

Condi


This only takes into account SINGLES titles whether they be Slam titles or not, it doesn't include doubles titles of any kind. There is no way that Court is ahead of Navratilova or Evert with total # of singles titles won. Navratilova and Evert are both FAR above anyone else in that regard.

Condoleezza
05-01-2007, 01:15 PM
This only takes into account SINGLES titles whether they be Slam titles or not, it doesn't include doubles titles of any kind. There is no way that Court is ahead of Navratilova or Evert with total # of singles titles won. Navratilova and Evert are both FAR above anyone else in that regard.

You really think Court has only 92 singles titles ..... ? :D :D :D :D

Condi

CEvertFan
05-01-2007, 01:25 PM
You really think Court has only 92 singles titles ..... ? :D :D :D :D

Condi


The numbers speak for themselves. You should try doing some valid research instead of making up stuff.

rommil
05-01-2007, 08:33 PM
No, it's rednecks like you who think "nig.gers" from Nigeria might drink pee now and then. The word association in your post was extremely revealing. The sub-conscious: Pee-drinking - Nigerian.

Condi

Rednecks? Lol you don't have any remote idea who I am. I am not talking about any other people from any other race Condi, I am talking about you. You and your take on everything. The fact of the matter is that you try to hide yourself, make people believe who and what you are and you bask under a protection you think you are under but the sad fact is that anything you say gives away the sense that you don't like yourself .I am not talking about Nigeria or any other Nigerian for that matter. Just you Condi, you and your miserable, low self esteem, insecure, stuck up self.

Condoleezza
05-01-2007, 08:37 PM
Rednecks? Lol you don't have any remote idea who I am. I am not talking about any other people from any other race Condi, I am talking about you. You and your take on everything. The fact of the matter is that you try to hide yourself, make people believe who and what you are and you bask under a protection you think you are under but the sad fact is that anything you say gives away the sense that you don't like yourself .I am not talking about Nigeria or any other Nigerian for that matter. Just you Condi, you and your miserable, low self esteem, insecure, stuck up self.


My self esteem is sky-high, rumnil ...

Condi

rommil
05-01-2007, 08:40 PM
My self esteem is sky-high, rumnil ...

Condi

On the contrary Consdipation, on the contrary. Whatever you do and say betrays your statement otherwise. You might think what you are saying impresses other people but I tell you not. You have been told by numerous people here in one form or another what they think about you and you know it.

Condoleezza
05-02-2007, 12:12 AM
On the contrary Consdipation, on the contrary. Whatever you do and say betrays your statement otherwise. You might think what you are saying impresses other people but I tell you not. You have been told by numerous people here in one form or another what they think about you and you know it.

Well, I have beaten numerous simple-minded people here with stats and facts again and again.
No wonder they refrained to insulting me.

And what was your point?


Condi

rommil
05-02-2007, 06:13 AM
Well, I have beaten numerous simple-minded people here with stats and facts again and again.
No wonder they refrained to insulting me.

And what was your point?


Condi

The point is people don't like you, I don't mean just here but at home, at work and everywhere. You don't have to respond to that and give us a fake impression that it is otherwise. You know it. Anyways, did I tell you that Davenport played RED HOT on that '99 finals that Graf couldn't figure out a way to win?

rommil
05-02-2007, 06:21 AM
Well, I have beaten numerous simple-minded people here with stats and facts again and again.
No wonder they refrained to insulting me.

And what was your point?


Condi
Funny how you complain when you feel insulted when you do it yourself. You got to learn how to take it if you dish it.

Condoleezza
05-02-2007, 06:31 AM
The point is people don't like you, I don't mean just here but at home, at work and everywhere. You don't have to respond to that and give us a fake impression that it is otherwise. You know it. Anyways, did I tell you that Davenport played RED HOT on that '99 finals that Graf couldn't figure out a way to win?

People like you don't like me, yes. Actually most dumb people even hate me.

Yes, Davenport most probably played her best match ever against over-the-hill Graf in the Wimbledon 1999 final. So she was able to squeak by Graf with a 70-67 win on points played. But we must not forget that Graf beat Davenport in the FO quarters like a drum (won 20 points more than Lindz).

That was Graf in summer of 1999:
Beat Davenport (taken both matches together), beat Seles, beat Hingis, beat Venus in slams.
Sadly she fell in love with Agassi. Could have won a lot of slams in the next 3 of 4 years otherwise ....

Condi

rommil
05-02-2007, 06:39 AM
People like you don't like me, yes. Actually most dumb people even hate me.

Yes, Davenport most probably played her best match ever against over-the-hill Graf in the Wimbledon 1999 final. So she was able to squeak by Graf with a 70-67 win on points played. But we must not forget that Graf beat Davenport in the FO quarters like a drum (won 20 points more than Lindz).

That was Graf in summer of 1999:
Beat Davenport (taken both matches together), beat Seles, beat Hingis, beat Venus in slams.
Sadly she fell in love with Agassi. Could have won a lot of slams in the next 3 of 4 years otherwise ....

Condi
Sadly she fell in love? I think the only person sad about it is you. You are one selfish creature/thing.And no people just don't like you,period. Yet anyway, that's a universal truth. Funny how you start to introduce other scenarios to sway the subject. Graf beat Davenport on clay at the FO? So what? But Davenport beat Graf in Wimbledon, on a surface and a venue that's suit Graf,and yet Davenport showed up a much better and composed player and Graf FAILED to find a winning game.Absurd Condi, absurd. Wasn't it?

bluegrasser
05-02-2007, 06:42 AM
It is easy to hit a clean stroke when you wait until the ball comes into your comfort zone.

Condi

Come on Condi, if you had a small torso with spider legs - how do you think you'd move. She was one of the best/cleanest ball strikers along with AA IMO.

rommil
05-02-2007, 06:43 AM
People like you don't like me, yes. Actually most dumb people even hate me.

Yes, Davenport most probably played her best match ever against over-the-hill Graf in the Wimbledon 1999 final. So she was able to squeak by Graf with a 70-67 win on points played. But we must not forget that Graf beat Davenport in the FO quarters like a drum (won 20 points more than Lindz).

That was Graf in summer of 1999:
Beat Davenport (taken both matches together), beat Seles, beat Hingis, beat Venus in slams.
Sadly she fell in love with Agassi. Could have won a lot of slams in the next 3 of 4 years otherwise ....

Condi

Does that explain the utter look of disdain on your face everytime you see yourself on the mirror?

suwanee4712
05-02-2007, 06:53 AM
Well, I have beaten numerous simple-minded people here with stats and facts again and again.
No wonder they refrained to insulting me.

And what was your point?


Condi


In your short time at wtaworld.com (before you were banned) and in my short time here, I'm waiting for you to actually prove someone wrong with facts. The next time that happens, will be a first for you.

And I find it funny that you bring up insulting people. Because you're always the first to resort to name calling or stereotyping people because of their nationality when you don't get your way. People who don't either have facts or misuse facts have to resort to that sort of thing.

Condoleezza
05-02-2007, 07:12 AM
In your short time at wtaworld.com (before you were banned) and in my short time here, I'm waiting for you to actually prove someone wrong with facts. The next time that happens, will be a first for you. ....

I never was in "wtaworld", at least I never posted there.

I have proven many people wrong with facts. Why do you think so many people hate me?

I have debunked the following theories with facts:

a) Seles was still on the rise when she was stabbed.
b) Graf was not slumping in the early 90ies.
c) #1 Seles dominated Graf.
d) Navratilova was over-the-hill in 1988/89.
e) Sabatini peaked in 1990-92 and not in 1988/89.
f) The Williams sisters raised the bar in 2000-03.

Condi

lambielspins
05-02-2007, 07:35 AM
a) Seles was still on the rise when she was stabbed.

I think she was on the rise when she was stabbed. She won the U.S Open and year end Championships in easier fashion to end 1992 then she had in 1991. She did not win the 1993 Australian Open more easily in 1993 then 1992, but Graf did not play in 1992 there. She won it more easily over Graf in the final then she had the French Open final over Graf.

b) Graf was not slumping in the early 90ies.

I agree on this, Graf was in a slump in the early 90s, and was starting to come out of it right around when Seles was stabbed which made the timing even more unfortunate. We may have missed the best part of the rivalry. A no longer slumping Graf that Seles had while she dominated vs an even more maturing Seles.

c) #1 Seles dominated Graf.

She did not dominate her head to head, but did in terms of big events won. It depends what your basis is I guess.

d) Navratilova was over-the-hill in 1988/89.

I think she was still a great player but probably not in her prime by that point.

e) Sabatini peaked in 1990-92 and not in 1988/89.

I dont know either way. I thought that whole period was her prime, so I dont really distinguish between those two spans.

f) The Williams sisters raised the bar in 2000-03.

I think they definitely did. Venus's dominance in the second half of 2000 and 2001, and Serena's dominance over all while Venus dominated the rest in 2002 and 2003 was incredible and taking the game to a higher level. So powerful and athletic as players, such great competitors too.

rommil
05-02-2007, 08:39 AM
I never was in "wtaworld", at least I never posted there.

I have proven many people wrong with facts. Why do you think so many people hate me?

I have debunked the following theories with facts:

a) Seles was still on the rise when she was stabbed.
b) Graf was not slumping in the early 90ies.
c) #1 Seles dominated Graf.
d) Navratilova was over-the-hill in 1988/89.
e) Sabatini peaked in 1990-92 and not in 1988/89.
f) The Williams sisters raised the bar in 2000-03.

Condi

So you are aware so many people hate you.

suwanee4712
05-02-2007, 09:03 AM
I never was in "wtaworld", at least I never posted there.

I have proven many people wrong with facts. Why do you think so many people hate me?

I have debunked the following theories with facts:

a) Seles was still on the rise when she was stabbed.
b) Graf was not slumping in the early 90ies.
c) #1 Seles dominated Graf.
d) Navratilova was over-the-hill in 1988/89.
e) Sabatini peaked in 1990-92 and not in 1988/89.
f) The Williams sisters raised the bar in 2000-03.

Condi

The only thing you've proven is that you live in alternate world where you think everyone that doesn't agree with Steffi as being the all time greatest, sport carrying player is somehow biased, unfair, or otherwise a liar.

You constantly criticize players that achieved great things in the sport as well. And you even go so far as to speak authoritatively about players that you never even saw play.

You know how to use the internet to dig up stats. Congratulations on that. But you have no perspective of tennis whatsoever outside of your small window of interest.

Condoleezza
05-02-2007, 09:08 AM
I think she was on the rise when she was stabbed. She won the U.S Open and year end Championships in easier fashion to end 1992 then she had in 1991. She did not win the 1993 Australian Open more easily in 1993 then 1992, but Graf did not play in 1992 there. She won it more easily over Graf in the final then she had the French Open final over Graf.
....


Seles had a winning percentage of 92.06 % in the 12 months before the stabbing (Graf was at 91.95 %).
But in the 12 months before these 12 months (May 1991 - April 1992) Seles had a winning percentage of 93.83 %.
A decline of almost 2 % ....


....
I think they definitely did. Venus's dominance in the second half of 2000 and 2001, and Serena's dominance over all while Venus dominated the rest in 2002 and 2003 was incredible and taking the game to a higher level. So powerful and athletic as players, such great competitors too.

:D
1) You can't take dominance in two "second halves" of a year as "raising the bar"! But yes, 2000/01 were Venus's two best years.

In the first half of 2000 she lost to Coetzer (3-6 4-6),Dokic (1-6 2-6), Sanchez. In the second half only to Davenport. 41 wins and 4 losses.
Her slam final wins were a 7-6 6-3 and a 6-4 7-5 against Davenport.
Raising the bar?

In the first half of 2001 Venus lost to Hingis (1-6 1-6), Mg. Maleeva, Henin (4-6 1-6), Schett. In the second half only to Shaughnessy. 46 wins and 5 losses. Her slam final wins were a 6-1 3-6 6-0 against Henin and a 6-2 6-4 against her sister (both still maturing).
Raising the bar??

2) Serena lost to Shaughnessy, Schnyder, Henin (3), Rubin, Clijsters, Mauresmo in 2002/03. 12 titles and 8 losses. 4 slam final wins against sister in 4 mediocre slam finals.
Raising the bar???

You have to be an extremely patriotic American to believe that ...
(Sorry!)

Condi

rommil
05-02-2007, 09:10 AM
The only thing you've proven is that you live in alternate world where you think everyone that doesn't agree with Steffi as being the all time greatest, sport carrying player is somehow biased, unfair, or otherwise a liar.

You constantly criticize players that achieved great things in the sport as well. And you even go so far as to speak authoritatively about players that you never even saw play.

You know how to use the internet to dig up stats. Congratulations on that. But you have no perspective of tennis whatsoever outside of your small window of interest.

I really hope this Condi thing won't go as far as thinking of having kids. It will be such an utter disgrace for Condi to multiply.

Condoleezza
05-02-2007, 09:32 AM
I really hope this Condi thing won't go as far as thinking of having kids. It will be such an utter disgrace for Condi to multiply.

And I hope you get ******* ***** very soon ...

Condi

suwanee4712
05-02-2007, 09:42 AM
And I hope you get ******* ***** very soon ...

Condi


My, my, my.........wishing harm upon a fellow poster is low indeed, even for you. Shame on you!

rommil
05-02-2007, 10:02 AM
And I hope you get ******* ***** very soon ...

Condi
Oh what do we have here? Am I getting under you thick skin Condi? Is this true that the self confessed person who said he/she/it is here to annoy people is GETTING ANNOYED?C'mon do not give me that satisfaction. Oh btw, please don't multiply. Ask you parents, they can tell you more about it.

rommil
05-02-2007, 10:10 AM
And I hope you get ******* ***** very soon ...

Condi

Typical psychotic Graf fans(Gunther Parche et al).....a lowlife psycho that retaliates with violence when beaten to the ground. Word of advice, stay on the ground. That's where you belong so you can watch the rest of the world move forward.You stuck up low life.

Condoleezza
05-02-2007, 10:23 AM
My, my, my.........wishing harm upon a fellow poster is low indeed, even for you. Shame on you!


Which *harm*?

Condi

suwanee4712
05-02-2007, 11:42 AM
Which *harm*?

Condi

You should be banned. Just as you were from www.wtaworld.com.

FiveO
05-03-2007, 06:56 AM
In the same thread one making this statement...

It is easy to hit a clean stroke when you wait until the ball comes into your comfort zone.

Condi

...should be more introspective before asking this question of another poster...

:D :D :D :D
Dude, have you ever played tennis yourself ... ?



Condi

The irony is wonderful. You've outdone yourself, which must be hard to do.

Condoleezza
05-03-2007, 07:21 AM
In the same thread one making this statement...



...should be more introspective before asking this question of another poster...



The irony is wonderful. You've outdone yourself, which must be hard to do.


I didn't imply that hitting a clean stroke would be easy for YOU even if it were from your comfort zone, son ....

Condi

FiveO
05-03-2007, 09:01 AM
I didn't imply that hitting a clean stroke would be easy for YOU even if it were from your comfort zone, son ....

Condi


Sweetheart, your analysis is exceeded only by your lack of knowledge.

rommil
05-03-2007, 09:28 AM
Sweetheart, your analysis is exceeded only by your lack of knowledge.

...and the utter misuse of it tops it off. Five O, that's too much compliment for Condi since you are implying that he/she/it is capable of knowledge.

Condoleezza
05-03-2007, 09:36 AM
Five O, that's too much of a compliment. I think absence is the word.

Keep on believing that hitting a "clean stroke" is sooo difficult when someone gives you a ball to your "comfort zone".
What made Davenport's strokes impressive is that she hit her "clean strokes" with a lot of power. Well, no wonder, look at her muscles.
But do you really think a Graf, a Henin, a Hingis, a Serena hit "unclean strokes"?
Please don't be so ********!

(But why not, it's more fun for me then ...... :D :D )


Condi

rommil
05-03-2007, 09:37 AM
Keep on believing that hitting a "clean stroke" is sooo difficult when someone gives you a ball to your "comfort zone".
What made Davenport's strokes impressive is that she hit her "clean strokes" with a lot of power. Well, no wonder, look at her muscles.
But do you really think a Graf, a Henin, a Hingis, a Serena hit "unclean strokes"?
Please don't be so ********!

(But why not, it's more fun for me then ...... :D :D )


Condi

Nah I think your own ******ation is what's amusing you.

Condoleezza
05-03-2007, 09:41 AM
Nah I think your own ******ation is what's amusing you.

Whatever ...

Condi

rommil
05-03-2007, 09:43 AM
Whatever ...

Condi

Lol you know that's the best arguement you have come up with so far hahaha.....As much as I think I am wasting my time posting here it gives me pleasure each time you say things like that....Just priceless..

Condoleezza
05-03-2007, 10:11 AM
Lol you know that's the best arguement you have come up with so far hahaha.....As much as I think I am wasting my time posting here it gives me pleasure each time you say things like that....Just priceless..

Since you have stopped arguing: Whatever again ....

Condi

rommil
05-03-2007, 10:13 AM
Since you have stopped arguing: Whatever again ....

Condi

Haha I am not giving you the satisfaction by arguing with you, I don't take pleasure in that lol.

Condoleezza
05-03-2007, 10:24 AM
Haha I am not giving you the satisfaction by arguing with you, I don't take pleasure in that lol.

I know that types like you don't take pleasure in arguing with me.
After all who likes being rag-dolled all the time?

Condi

EZRA
05-03-2007, 04:40 PM
I know that types like you don't take pleasure in arguing with me.
After all who likes being rag-dolled all the time?

Condi

Actually.. "WHATEVER" is the universal response of those who have been rag-dolled and left dumbfounded.

CEvertFan
05-03-2007, 05:38 PM
Back to topic: Davenport's wonderful, clean, effortless, powerful groundstrokes, surely in the top 5 of best groundstrokes ever.

rommil
05-03-2007, 08:18 PM
I know that types like you don't take pleasure in arguing with me.
After all who likes being rag-dolled all the time?

Condi

There you are again, amusing yourself with your own ******ation. Arguing is for people that struggle to be heard which defines your life. And btw, nobody is interested in what you say judging from your reception here. Now go to the urinal and get drunk.

Condoleezza
05-03-2007, 08:50 PM
Actually.. "WHATEVER" is the universal response of those who have been rag-dolled and left dumbfounded.

If you say so - you must know ... :D :D :D :D

Condi

Condoleezza
05-03-2007, 08:51 PM
There you are again, amusing yourself with your own ******ation. Arguing is for people that struggle to be heard which defines your life. And btw, nobody is interested in what you say judging from your reception here. Now go to the urinal and get drunk.


Whatever, son ...

Condi

rommil
05-03-2007, 09:01 PM
Whatever, son ...

Condi

Haha 3 whatevers and you're officially owned lol. Now go and be a good cat......You Condi, are being dismissed for today.

Condoleezza
05-03-2007, 09:02 PM
Haha 3 whatevers and you're officially owned lol.


If you say so, boy ...

Condi

rommil
05-03-2007, 09:04 PM
If you say so, boy ...

Condi

Now if you keep up with that calling people "son" or "boy", I am starting to suspect you maybe a resident at Neverland ranch.

Condoleezza
05-03-2007, 09:11 PM
Now if you keep up with that calling people "son" or "boy", I am starting to suspect you maybe a resident at Neverland ranch.

If you say so, son.
What is "Neverland", boy?

Condi

rommil
05-03-2007, 09:14 PM
If you say so, son.
What is "Neverland", boy?

Condi

Oh the "great Condi" doesn't know? Why don't you scamper away and find out....

rommil
05-03-2007, 09:32 PM
Where are your fabricated stats?Maybe they can save you?You slowing down Grandmaleeza? Ok I will give you a number. How's 48?

EZRA
05-04-2007, 03:35 AM
If you say so - you must know ... :D :D :D :D

Condi


Condoleezza ... that didn't call for a retaliation. And with a response like ..."you must know" (which doesn't actually apply to me), one may question your maturity level or you're simply that insecure?

Condoleezza
05-04-2007, 03:44 AM
Condoleezza ... that didn't call for a retaliation. ...


It did.
You attacked me first.
And now you whine because I retaliated.
Coward.

Condi

35ft6
05-04-2007, 04:25 AM
It is easy to hit a clean stroke when you wait until the ball comes into your comfort zone.

Condi What does this even mean?

Lindsay hit a very very clean ball. Trying to think of a woman player who hits a cleaner ball and right now can't think of one.

EZRA
05-04-2007, 05:20 AM
It did.
You attacked me first.
And now you whine because I retaliated.
Coward.

Condi


I whine? attacked? LOL .. I just pointed out the contradiction on your post. And you call that an attack? And look at your feeble attempt at retaliation ("You should know") .. :D
Where was I whining? Coward? - You have such a high regard on yourself yet your actions shows how insecure you really are.

(LOL .. calling someone a coward in this medium.. again, such maturity) .. You got nothing on me Condoleezza.

Condoleezza
05-04-2007, 05:25 AM
What does this even mean?

Lindsay hit a very very clean ball. Trying to think of a woman player who hits a cleaner ball and right now can't think of one.

What is a "clean ball" anyway?
With no spin or what? With a "text-book" arm movement?
:confused:

Condi

Condoleezza
05-04-2007, 05:27 AM
I whine? attacked? LOL .. I just pointed out the contradiction on your post. ...

You commented on my using the word "whatever" in a derogatory way.
Fine with me.
But then stop whining like a little boy when you get flak from me ...


Condi

EZRA
05-04-2007, 05:30 AM
Where was that FLAK? when you said "You Should Know"? LOL ...

That's not FLAK, that's a pre-pubescent comeback... same thing as "WHATEVER" (so much for calling me little boy, right?) LOL

Condoleezza... If you really want to offend me, you gotta do better than throwing childish insults my way.

Condoleezza
05-04-2007, 06:59 AM
Where was that FLAK? when you said "You Should Know"? LOL ...

That's not FLAK, that's a pre-pubescent comeback... same thing as "WHATEVER" (so much for calling me little boy, right?) LOL

Condoleezza... If you really want to offend me, you gotta do better than throwing childish insults my way.

I don't want to offend little flag-waving boys. I just wipe the floor with them.

Condi

rommil
05-04-2007, 07:14 AM
Condi construes everything as an attack. Yet again another proof of insecurity and being very defensive.Everything Condi says is never tainted with anything positive. Must be tough living your life Condi FEELING like you are pushed against the wall all the time. The saddest part about it? You are doing it to yourself.

Condoleezza
05-04-2007, 07:15 AM
Condi construes everything as an attack. Yet again another proof of insecurity and being very defensive.Everything Condi says is never tainted with anything positive. Must be tough living your life Condi FEELING like you are pushed against the wall all the time. The saddest part about it? You are doing it to yourself.

Whatever ...


Condi

EZRA
05-04-2007, 07:19 AM
I don't want to offend little flag-waving boys. I just wipe the floor with them.

Condi


Flag waving boys.... ? You assume I'm american, right? Shows how little you know. Wipe the floor .. LOL

rommil
05-04-2007, 07:23 AM
Whatever ...


Condi

In all the time you spent here endlessly spewing any non sense possible with every word imaginable and all you can muster is "whatever". Usually it is a word used by pimpled faced hormonal teens and alas, it is suddenly the mantra of this 48 year old poser who fakes that he/she/it is 28 in a tennis forum, a self proclaimed lawyer who has the arguing wits of a babboon's red body part, who has a self esteem as low as a 99year old woman's b00bs, a person whose time machine buttons got stuck in the year 1998 and every single negative word that's not even deserving to you.Oh Grandmaleeza, satisfaction couldn't be this easy.

rommil
05-04-2007, 07:25 AM
I don't want to offend little flag-waving boys. I just wipe the floor with them.

Condi

Yeah wipe the floor....and please stay away from my Bentley. I don't want it to stink.

Condoleezza
05-04-2007, 07:30 AM
In all the time you spent here endlessly spewing any non sense possible with every word imaginable and all you can muster is "whatever". Usually it is a word used by pimpled faced hormonal teens and alas, it is suddenly the mantra of this 48 year old poser who fakes that he/she/it is 28 in a tennis forum, a self proclaimed lawyer who has the arguing wits of a babboon's red body part, who has a self esteem as low as a 99year old woman's b00bs, a person whose time machine buttons got stuck in the year 1998 and every single negative word that's not even deserving to you.Oh Grandmaleeza, satisfaction couldn't be this easy.

Whatever ...

Condi

Condoleezza
05-04-2007, 07:31 AM
Yeah wipe the floor....and please stay away from my Bentley. I don't want it to stink.

I never said I would wipe cars with you.
Just the floor.

Condi

rommil
05-04-2007, 07:40 AM
I never said I would wipe cars with you.
Just the floor.

Condi

By any means don't ever think that there is anything in you that remotely is deserving to share an activity with me or anybody else in this board. Yeah good idea, stay on the floor.

rommil
05-04-2007, 07:41 AM
Whatever ...

Condi

Good. The first step in solving a problem is admission. This is a healthy step for you Grandmaleezza.....

Condoleezza
05-04-2007, 07:45 AM
Good. The first step in solving a problem is admission. This is a healthy step for you Grandmaleezza.....

Whatever, son ...

Condi

rommil
05-04-2007, 07:53 AM
I don't want to offend little flag-waving boys. I just wipe the floor with them.

Condi
And btw, some little puppy peed on the floor earlier, I trust it you will deal with that the best way you know how. Enjoy Condi.....

Condoleezza
05-04-2007, 07:55 AM
And btw, some little puppy peed on the floor earlier, I trust it you will deal with that the best way you know how. Enjoy Condi.....

Whatever, boy ...

Condi

rommil
05-04-2007, 07:57 AM
Whatever, boy ...

Condi

You're actually slightly amusing when you type the least amount of words. Less bullcr@p. How you doing with the floor?

35ft6
05-04-2007, 03:45 PM
What is a "clean ball" anyway?
With no spin or what? With a "text-book" arm movement?
:confused:

Condi You're being disingenuous.

TheNatural
05-05-2007, 09:06 PM
I agree she had excellent groundstrokes. When she played some okay players her groundstrokes made them look silly at times. The first tiem i ever noticed her was because of hard and LOUD her shots sounded on a practice court a few courts away.

Wingshellphelp
05-06-2007, 05:27 AM
My god has this drifted far from the topic...

bluegrasser
05-06-2007, 11:16 AM
You're being disingenuous.

I'd give up on Condi, as she's brought the word *argumentative* to a new level...

CEvertFan
05-06-2007, 12:16 PM
I'd give up on Condi, as she's brought the word *argumentative* to a new level...


Condi has been banned.

Wingshellphelp
05-06-2007, 02:38 PM
Condi has been banned.

all of the smart people saw it coming:-D

Serve 'em hard
05-06-2007, 05:37 PM
Condi has been banned.

Do you know why exactly?