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Golden Retriever
05-13-2007, 01:03 PM
When Nadal and Gonzales were delivering their speeches in Spanish, the Italian spectators seem to understand immediate without translation. I know Italian and Spanish are close but not that close.

dirk85
05-13-2007, 02:03 PM
Spanish and italian are quite similar language.
I'm italian: it's clear I cannot understand every word of spanish, but the general meaning, yes, even if I have never studied it in my life...
Unfortunately I cannot say the same about german, french or swahili.

Andres
05-13-2007, 02:06 PM
Italian and spanish share the exact same grammar modes, and tenses. And even the words are pretty similar. And of course, the open vowels, and the overall accents.

diegaa
05-13-2007, 02:11 PM
its obvious that any spanish speaker can understand a portuguese and an italian speaker if the latter wants to be understood. the same goes in the other way round.

edmondsm
05-13-2007, 02:16 PM
its obvious that any spanish speaker can understand a portuguese and an italian speaker if the latter wants to be understood. the same goes in the other way round.


What about the dialects of Spanish? I am curious as to whether say the Spanish and Argentine dialects are the same as American English is to Scottish or something like that.

rommil
05-13-2007, 02:24 PM
When Nadal and Gonzales were delivering their speeches in Spanish, the Italian spectators seem to understand immediate without translation. I know Italian and Spanish are close but not that close.

They are close. Plus there might have been Spanish speaking people in the crowd too.

Phil
05-13-2007, 06:50 PM
In my experience, Spanish speakers in Latin America who do not speak Portuguese have a difficult time understanding Brazilians, but Brazilians don't have much problem understanding their neighbors. Maybe it's the Brazilian accent that throws them off. I was able to get through a dinner, jokes and all, with two Brazilians who didn't speak a word of English, by speaking my (then) decent-but-not-great Spanish.

diegaa
05-13-2007, 06:56 PM
In my experience, Spanish speakers in Latin America who do not speak Portuguese have a difficult time understanding Brazilians, but Brazilians don't have much problem understanding their neighbors. Maybe it's the Brazilian accent that throws them off. I was able to get through a dinner, jokes and all, with two Brazilians who didn't speak a word of English, by speaking my (then) decent-but-not-great Spanish.

most argies i know can understand brazilian portugues at a decent level. that is not two brazilian guys speaking to each other or a brazilian movie, but a brazilian talking to a spanish speaker guy.

LarougeNY
05-13-2007, 06:58 PM
Well I take spanish and I admit I can't understand anything Nadal says except for a few things here and there. Catalano is very hard for someone thats espanol-challenged to understand. and castellian is where they purposely speak with a lisp right?

simi
05-13-2007, 07:06 PM
Just returned last month from a two-week 'big bus' tour of Italy. It has been stressed upon me that to experience the real Italy, one needs to get away from the tourist haunts and get into the back streets to see Italians and their culture as they really are.

Even though I tired to learn Italian for about six months before leaving, I found more times than not reverting to Spanish for anything other than basic pleasantries, and was understood completely. I was able to understand their Italian also, that is if they didn't speak too rapidly. My Spanish isn't all that good either, (married to a nice Uruguayan lady and two years of 'high school' Spanish classes.). It is uncanny how similar the two languages are to each other.

Phil
05-13-2007, 07:07 PM
most argies i know can understand brazilian portugues at a decent level. that is not two brazilian guys speaking to each other or a brazilian movie, but a brazilian talking to a spanish speaker guy.

The ones I met (i.e. "my experience" which is, admittedly, limited) could not really understand Brazilian Portuguese-at least as it was spoken. But this also includes Mexicans, Colombians and Chileans.

Ripper
05-13-2007, 07:08 PM
Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin_languages

Musashi
05-13-2007, 07:09 PM
Isn't Mallorca/Majorca a Spanish only speaking city? I think Nadal speaks Castellano, no? Castellano is the original Spanish. The lisp thing is delicious!

Ripper
05-13-2007, 07:13 PM
Isn't Mallorca/Majorca a Spanish only speaking city? I think Nadal speaks Castellano, no? Castellano is the original Spanish. The lisp thing is delicious!

Every single Spanish speaking country has a different accent and that's what you're refering to. Castellano is the same as Spanish. Actually, Castellano is correct, Español isn't. Well, that's what my teacher used to say, back in school :)

diegaa
05-13-2007, 07:20 PM
Isn't Mallorca/Majorca a Spanish only speaking city? I think Nadal speaks Castellano, no? Castellano is the original Spanish. The lisp thing is delicious!

no, they speak a dialect very similar to catalan. Baleares Is. is "almost" Catalauña

pmata814
05-14-2007, 07:48 AM
When Nadal and Gonzales were delivering their speeches in Spanish, the Italian spectators seem to understand immediate without translation. I know Italian and Spanish are close but not that close.


The two languages are very similiar. I'm Mexican and though I didn't understand every word she said I had a very good idea at the end of every sentence.

When I was in college I was asked by my voice instructor to translate every song so I knew what I was singing and I loved it when I had to sing in Italian because I hardly ever needed a dictionary. I could pretty much translate it as I went along.

SalvadorVeiga
05-14-2007, 09:06 AM
The ones I met (i.e. "my experience" which is, admittedly, limited) could not really understand Brazilian Portuguese-at least as it was spoken. But this also includes Mexicans, Colombians and Chileans.

Phil that's because mostly, brazilians use slang too much... when talking to each other usually most brazilians don't even care for grammar rules etc... They start making up rules, that are becoming standard... sometimes is hard for portuguese people (not brazialian) to understand the semantics, probably that's why other romantic language countries don't quite follow since they derivate from rules too much... But if is a higher level of brazilian portuguese ( TV's, Shows, or some kind of formal event) it's easier... For a portuguese, for example, even if it had never learned the language in his life, but has a good learning foundation of his own language (phonetics etc) its pretty easy to even read in other languages...I never had spanish or italian but I can read easily with good pronounciation from a text and understand what I'm saying, as well as speaking spanish...the same for french but this one I had in highschool... the same goes the other way although I believe it's tougher for others to speak portuguese (i know several spanish, italian etc living in portugal for decades that never got the language right...although portuguese people can easily with practice achieve perfect pronounciation etc...I think it has to do something with our phonetics)...there was a study from a while back that stated the most difficult languages to learn were russian, mandarin, and portuguese and romanian because they were too complex and had so many derivatives...while the speakers of romanian and portuguese had easier times learning other languages...

Luca
05-14-2007, 09:25 AM
Isn't Mallorca/Majorca a Spanish only speaking city? I think Nadal speaks Castellano, no? Castellano is the original Spanish. The lisp thing is delicious!

In Spain there are 4 official languages, Spanish (or Castellano, the main one), and also in some regions people also speaks Basq, Gallego and Catalán.
Catalán is spoken in Catalonia, Balearic Islands (Mallorca, Menorca, Ibiza) and Region of Valencia and Nadal always speaks in Catalán with his family and friends, not in Spanish.

about Italian, Spanish and portuguese, the 3 languages are very simmilar, but in my experience, understanding an italian or a Portuguese depends too much of the accent of the person who is talking.

What´s the "lisp thing"?

Morrissey
05-14-2007, 11:33 AM
Every single Spanish speaking country has a different accent and that's what you're refering to. Castellano is the same as Spanish. Actually, Castellano is correct, Español isn't. Well, that's what my teacher used to say, back in school :)

Your teacher was right. The way Spanish is spoken in Spain is the original and correct way to speak Spanish, Castillian. But in the Balearic Islands they speak Castillian and Catalan. Nadal gave his acceptance speech in Barcelona in Catalan which delighted the people there for sure since they're so hard up for their own dialect. In the Catalan speaking regions of Spain they call him Rafel Nadal.

Morrissey
05-14-2007, 11:35 AM
In Spain there are 4 official languages, Spanish (or Castellano, the main one), and also in some regions people also speaks Basq, Gallego and Catalán.
Catalán is spoken in Catalonia, Balearic Islands (Mallorca, Menorca, Ibiza) and Region of Valencia and Nadal always speaks in Catalán with his family and friends, not in Spanish.

about Italian, Spanish and portuguese, the 3 languages are very simmilar, but in my experience, understanding an italian or a Portuguese depends too much of the accent of the person who is talking.

What´s the "lisp thing"?

I guess he means when they pronounce the Z and C like a TH. For example, Barthelona, Tharagotha, Valenthia.

patrick922
05-14-2007, 12:14 PM
I guess he means when they pronounce the Z and C like a TH. For example, Barthelona, Tharagotha, Valenthia.

dont forget the famous grathiath for gracias

diegaa
05-14-2007, 12:34 PM
lisp = ceceo.

croatian sensation
05-14-2007, 12:44 PM
Spanish and italian are quite similar language.
I'm italian: it's clear I cannot understand every word of spanish, but the general meaning, yes, even if I have never studied it in my life...
Unfortunately I cannot say the same about german, french or swahili.

No French? Ok, not when they speak (that's virtually impossible, unless you are fluent in French) but written. I'm fluent in Italian but my Italian is far from perfect, and when I was studying French I could understand a lot.

dirk85
05-14-2007, 01:01 PM
No French? Ok, not when they speak (that's virtually impossible, unless you are fluent in French) but written. I'm fluent in Italian but my Italian is far from perfect, and when I was studying French I could understand a lot.

Well, you are right.
But I was referring to spoken language.
Grammar rules and some words are similar in french and in italian: I can read a newspaper and understand what it is about, without studying french in my life.
I can even understand something (a little) of spoken french, but I think it's only because the dialect used where I live have some words in common with it...
Don't think someone from Rome or Naples could say the same.

croatian sensation
05-14-2007, 01:12 PM
Ah, Rome and southern Italian dialects...I've always wondered how come they can even understand themselves. :-) Boy, that has nothing to do with Italian we learned at school :-)

Andres
05-14-2007, 02:13 PM
I met a Sicilian gal there in Siena. Made me feel embarrassed about my italian (purely tuscan). After that, I felt better when a guy from Roma told me he had the hardest time picking up her accent. That made me feel better :D

He was a native italian, and he couldn't understand her sicilian dialect :p

Golden Retriever
05-14-2007, 04:53 PM
So you guys think they really understood what Nadal was saying without any translation and not just applauding out of being polite?

Ripper
05-14-2007, 07:20 PM
The way Spanish is spoken in Spain is the original and correct way to speak Spanish...

Yes, just like the way English is spoken in England in the original and correct way to speak English ;)

Morrissey
05-16-2007, 08:17 AM
dont forget the famous grathiath for gracias

Only in Andalucia they pronounce the S as a TH. Everywhere else it's only Z and C.

Morrissey
05-16-2007, 08:18 AM
Yes, just like the way English is spoken in England in the original and correct way to speak English ;)

Absolutely spot on.

hectornorton
05-16-2007, 11:34 AM
The main difference between Spanish from Spain, Mexico, Argentina, Uruguay, Colombia etc is the accent..Of course there are a few different words but it's the same language..

You can compare it with English... English from South Africa, England, Scotland, Ireland, US etc.. It's the same thing.

In Spain we have different dialects too BUT 100% of the people can speak Spanish...

Obviously people coming from different regions also speak their local dialects...

simi
05-16-2007, 12:28 PM
The main difference between Spanish from Spain, Mexico, Argentina, Uruguay, Colombia etc is the accent..Of course there are a few different words but it's the same language..

I always found it 'funny' for my wife and her family (Uruguayan) to always say "ciao" all the time, instead of Spanish words.

Andres
05-16-2007, 12:30 PM
I always found it 'funny' for my wife and her family (Uruguayan) to always say "ciao" all the time, instead of Spanish words.
Chau, not ciao :D

simi
05-16-2007, 07:14 PM
Chau, not ciao :D

Shows you how little I know, Andres. Asked the wife when I got home to spell it. She spelled it chao. Looked it up in the dictionary and chau refers back to chao. Not slang either. Looks like both spellings are acceptable. Thanks for the language lesson.

Ripper
05-16-2007, 07:46 PM
Shows you how little I know, Andres. Asked the wife when I got home to spell it. She spelled it chao. Looked it up in the dictionary and chau refers back to chao. Not slang either. Looks like both spellings are acceptable. Thanks for the language lesson.

Chiao (Chao or Chau) is Italian, but is used a lot in Latin American speaking countries, for some reason. I think the Argentinians, who have a lot of Italian in them, must have introduced it in to the region.

Hot Sauce
05-16-2007, 07:48 PM
I wish you could understand other languages with English.

nalk7
07-09-2008, 08:05 PM
I am half Catalan and half Itialian (Genoa). I can honestly tell you that the three languages are extremely similar. It's funny, in both countries people from the north like me have a hard time understanding southerners. For example I have a real hard time understanding what Massimo Troisi says on his movies. They guy mumbles instead of talking. Same in Spain, people from the north jokingly say that the south (andalucia, murcia etc.) is part of Afriha lol. But someone with a neutral spanish can understand a neutral italian and vise versa.

Andres
07-09-2008, 08:13 PM
Chiao (Chao or Chau) is Italian, but is used a lot in Latin American speaking countries, for some reason. I think the Argentinians, who have a lot of Italian in them, must have introduced it in to the region.
It's actually Ciao, but the point still stands. Chiao is pronounced Kiao :)