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View Full Version : wimbledon is now the same speed as rome


The Gorilla
07-08-2007, 09:33 AM
in the last two days the court has been playing like a clay court, the ball hits the ground and it just stops.I think they've gone too far.

dima
07-08-2007, 09:36 AM
Agreed, this is getting ridiculous.

ACE of Hearts
07-08-2007, 09:38 AM
No doubt, Nadal will win wimbledon soon.Its ridiculous.The bounces where insane.

Dolphina
07-08-2007, 10:11 AM
Yeah, Im glad this is over now, and the quick hardcourt comes. I was so disappointed not to see more powerful rallyes in Wimbly:mad:

pow
07-08-2007, 10:17 AM
What year did this grass change come about?
Feels like it's getting progressively slower every year.

goforgold99
07-08-2007, 10:30 AM
Yes, it was ridiculously slow this year, not only the grass, I think the balls are heavier too.

It's obvious they want to create more close matches through that, but that Wimbledon used to have the fastest conditions is also a TRADITION. So they are so with their traditions, they shouldn't break this one either.

If it stays so slow I can image Nadal to be the champ next time. Also the hardsourts are getting slower and slower. It's just more and more difficult for Fed and these power-players like Nadal are favoured.

Dolphina
07-08-2007, 10:32 AM
I think Wimbly had been criticised couple of years ago, to be boring, because of the dominance of the serve of the men, so they wanted to make it slower to make it more attractive like the other slams, but this is going toonfar.

ACE of Hearts
07-08-2007, 10:36 AM
There is no doubt in my mind that it was faster last year and the bounces where lower.Get a tape of this match and the finals from last year and compare.

Big Fed
07-08-2007, 10:39 AM
To true. Im glad its hardcourt season now.

Spencer
07-08-2007, 10:45 AM
Well, Federer never won Wimbledon until after they changed the grass so he has actually benefited from the slower conditions too. He has won all 5 Wimbledon's on slow grass and all from the baseline except this first win which he served and volleyed. Pete won 7 on the fast grass.

So all this talk of slow grass hurting him is a joke. He has destroyed the field the past 5 years at Wimbledon. If the grass was getting slower each year he would be having more problems winning it each year. He has not. He has no problems beating anyone else on any surface. He has trouble with Rafa on all surfaces.

Still great win for Federer today. There should be no more doubt about his heart and ability to rise over adversity. A truly great & fearless champion. It was Nadal who tightened up and blinked first in the 5th.

ACE of Hearts
07-08-2007, 10:46 AM
Hey spencer, give me a break.Go back to 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, its not slower and the bounces werent high.It was faster then it is now.U didnt see alot of rallies like u see now.I also noticed that the bounces are high then they where during 2003-2006

Spencer
07-08-2007, 10:54 AM
If you guys want to diminish Federer's achievements of 11 grandslams by saying that all the tournaments play at similar speeds now a days then go ahead. If you are saying that the grandslams were much more varied in the past then it means that Sampras' achievement looks more impressive.

Federer won because he served lights out and showed the heart of a champion when it counted, why can't we leave it at that without all this talk about slow grass to try to diminish Rafa's accomplishment?

Kim
07-08-2007, 10:54 AM
...But how come Federer never complains that its slower??

Kim
07-08-2007, 10:56 AM
...it might be good practice for him for the French if he can continue to win on these "slow" grass, eh??

I think the French is his number 1 goal, although he always says its Wimby.

Kim
07-08-2007, 10:57 AM
I fully agree with Spencer. If Fed does not complain, neither should we. Just enjoy the show people..!!!!

ACE of Hearts
07-08-2007, 10:57 AM
Hey kim, maybe he doesnt wanna see it as an excuse, i am sure u would agree with me that the bounces are high and the balls look heavy.

Mikael
07-08-2007, 11:01 AM
I've been going to Wimbledon every year since 1997, spending a few days at the championships, and the only real change I noticed came about 2002-2003. Thats when I noticed a few "key players" stopped serving and volleying systematically. I'm not convinced the surface was considerably slower this year than in 2006, 2005, 2004 or 2003. Maybe you have this impression because you see Rafael Nadal playing and the guy has incredible speed, covering the court so well he makes the bounces seem slower than they are.

Red Velvet
07-08-2007, 11:03 AM
Oh well, and what about red clay at the French getting faster ? Grass is still grass and even if you slow it down, it remains faster than a "fast" clay !

ACE of Hearts
07-08-2007, 11:06 AM
No, just look at the matches and i think u would agree with me.There was no pace out there.The grass is slower, plain and simple and the bounces are absurd.

Kim
07-08-2007, 11:07 AM
Well, Ace of Hearts....I must admit that yeah, it seems that the court is slower and that many supposedly unretrievable balls can still be retrieved. When I watch past matches like that of Fed-Sampras 2001, rallies were much shorter and the balls seem faster...Well, yeah maybe Fed just don't want to say it out loud because it might indeed be taken against him.

But still.... we can't do anything about it. And Fed still won, so happy me :)

Kim
07-08-2007, 11:12 AM
Come to think of it, Tomas Berdych in his interview also said that he feels the grass at Wimby is slower now that's why he thinks Nadal is just playing his claycourt game, while having a chance to win.

Maybe the grass at Queens is the normal grass---faster. There Nadal lost to Mahut who served and volleyed like crazy, and Nadal couldn't pick up and run down balls as much as he was in Wimby....Hmmm.....Maybe this is also why Fed has refused to play at Queens because its not good practice for Wimby?

Is the grass at Halle slower too (I ask coz Fed joins this tourney rather than Queens as a tuneup)..?

Kim
07-08-2007, 11:16 AM
Please read this 2002 link:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/tennis/wimbledon/2088800.stm


Hmm...the courts aren't supposed to slow down noticeably EACH YEAR....but its implicitly indicated that its slowing down gradually...Hmmm!

NamRanger
07-08-2007, 11:16 AM
Nadal's lefty top spin should not be a factor on grass at all. Anyone who hits heavy top spin should not be a factor on grass to be honest. No one should be able to stay behind the baseline and do that well on grass. That is why Wimbledon is now absurd.

Dolphina
07-08-2007, 11:21 AM
Even Venus Williams hit like Martina Hingis in the final, lol. Something was wrong this year.

Spencer
07-08-2007, 11:23 AM
People say that the grandslams have been slowed down to increase rallies making it harder to end points quickly. But the same people say that Sampras would not do well in today's game because the current pros hit the ball harder and faster. They say current pros are stronger and have more advanced racquets and can hit winners from way behind the baseline.

So which is it? Is it harder to hit a straight out winner now with the slow courts and powerful racquest or back then with the faster courts and old racquets?

Spencer
07-08-2007, 11:28 AM
Grass is still grass. If Federer had hit 20+ aces against Rafa in Paris he may very well have beaten Nadal and got the career grandslam. The ball bounces higher because Federer is hitting his shots off of Nadal's heavy topspin groundstrokes. Nadal puts more spin than anyone else on tour so even the grass looks different when he is on the court. Plus Federer refuses to slice his backhand and hits topspin most of the match.

superstition
07-08-2007, 11:28 AM
Powerful larger-headed racquets make it easier to play from the baseline. Slow balls and courts also make it easier to play from the baseline.

ACE of Hearts
07-08-2007, 11:29 AM
Hey Kim, Roger has ties with Halle.He has thought about playing in Queens.I think Roger prefers the grass fast and the balls low, its better for his backhand and his serve to function more.

Red Velvet
07-08-2007, 11:29 AM
Well, two weeks ago I'd never have bet a cent on Nadal reaching the final. But the result is here and instead of saying the surface being slower, why don't we give credit to him intstead ? In fact, I didn't think he 'd be able to take the ball so early and to dictate the pace from the baseline like he did against Federer. But then again, Fed didn't use his sliced backhand that often... It's certainly true that the grass is slower but tricky rebounds are still there and like I said before, it remains grass !

ACE of Hearts
07-08-2007, 11:31 AM
Hey velvet, no one is taking his play away.He played the match of his life but the conditions clearly favored him today.The bounces where high and right in his zone.To be honest, i am quite surprise that Roger won this match.His serve saved his butt.

ACE of Hearts
07-08-2007, 11:32 AM
Hahahahaha, the crazy thing is that i think the conditions in Halle are quicker then what i saw today.

vince916
07-08-2007, 11:38 AM
Are any of you guys emailing wimbledon to voice your concern or are you just whining on these forums?

Red Velvet
07-08-2007, 11:38 AM
Don't worry, I 'm not a Nadal fan at all ;) But even if the conditions favored him, I guess it's only a minor factor. It' s as if saying a hot and warm day at the French would favor Federer. Certainly a bit but it would still not allow him to play like he was on grass. And so the reverse is true for Nadal !

vince916
07-08-2007, 11:38 AM
Are any of you guys emailing wimbledon to voice your concern or are you just whining on these forums?

ACE of Hearts
07-08-2007, 11:40 AM
Is there such a thing as emailing them?I would, give me where to do it?

Polaris
07-08-2007, 11:43 AM
Man, if they slow down the USO, Roddick stands to get hosed.

Spencer
07-08-2007, 11:43 AM
The story everyone should focus on is the fact that Roger finally faced real adversity in the finals of a Major for the first time and he passed. In the past his talent allowed him to secure safer victories but today he faced his toughest opponent in the 5th set of his favorite major. He had everything to lose and if it was anyone else they would have choked and lost.

Federer slowed his champion's heart today. I'm more impressed he pulled this one out than if he had beaten Nadal in 3 easy sets. Wilander will have to eat his words.

Kim
07-08-2007, 11:52 AM
I have to agree with Spencer. This was an acid test for Roger, and he passed!!!

Many complainers out there say that Roger cannot be the greatest yet because he hasn't had that "DRAMA" of a match yet. Those people would have to revise their point of views RIGHT ABOUT NOW.

Kim
07-08-2007, 11:53 AM
...maybe he will carry this "scrapper's" mentality to the French Open and wrest it from Nadal in 2008?? I hope so :)

NamRanger
07-08-2007, 11:53 AM
Grass is still grass. If Federer had hit 20+ aces against Rafa in Paris he may very well have beaten Nadal and got the career grandslam. The ball bounces higher because Federer is hitting his shots off of Nadal's heavy topspin groundstrokes. Nadal puts more spin than anyone else on tour so even the grass looks different when he is on the court. Plus Federer refuses to slice his backhand and hits topspin most of the match.


Rafa isn't the only one. Alot of players who are considered "clay court" or "slow hardcourt" players are making in roads at Wimbledon, such as Gasquet (primarily a clay court / slow hardcourt player, hits with heavy topspin off both sides), JCF (what the heck, a counter puncher making this deep of a run, and taking a set off Federer?), and Hewitt in that marathon match (rallies that lasted ages against Djoko). It's rediculous. If you wanted to be fair, why don't you just speed up the clay at the French Open to give American players a better chance?

ACE of Hearts
07-08-2007, 12:00 PM
Exactly, speed the clay up for players that dont like the slow stuff.

Nadal_Freak
07-08-2007, 12:04 PM
Everytime Rafa does well, someone complains about the speed of grass. Federer still had 25 aces on this slowed down grass. Maybe not as good as it used to be but still a good amount of aces.

CyBorg
07-08-2007, 12:07 PM
haha - admittedly, that was very slow. The bounces near Federer's ears raised my eyebrows.

Doesn't change the fact that Nadal's effort is astounding and that he probably should have won, but I am hoping for a continuation of fast, fast tennis on the US Open courts.

Anything else would be cringeworthy.

BigServer1
07-08-2007, 12:14 PM
Everytime Rafa does well, someone complains about the speed of grass. Federer still had 25 aces on this slowed down grass. Maybe not as good as it used to be but still a good amount of aces.

Hold on there partner. While I agree with your post completely, it was YOU who after Federer's win in Hamburg said: "It played like an Orange hard court with some dirt on top." None of us are totally innocent for excuse making.

Nadal_Freak
07-08-2007, 12:16 PM
Hold on there partner. While I agree with your post completely, it was YOU who after Federer's win in Hamburg said: "It played like an Orange hard court with some dirt on top." None of us are totally innocent for excuse making.
Yeah I was wrong. Hamburg was slow but low bouncing. The conditions seem to make a huge difference between these 2 players. Hot and dry favors Nadal and cold and humid favor Federer.

War, Safin!
07-08-2007, 12:18 PM
in the last two days the court has been playing like a clay court, the ball hits the ground and it just stops.I think they've gone too far.
I don't often agree with your posts, Gorilla...but this one I'm with you 100%.
It's just not Wimbledon anymore and has made me like this Slam
less and less with each passing year.

Spencer
07-08-2007, 12:28 PM
Well if everyone thinks Wimbledon played like clay this year how do you explain Roddick getting to the quaterfinals in dominant fashion instead of getting bounced first round? :D

War, Safin!
07-08-2007, 12:32 PM
Well if everyone thinks Wimbledon played like clay this year how do you explain Roddick getting to the quaterfinals in dominant fashion instead of getting bounced first round? :D
It doesn't play exactly like clay - but I'm pretty sure from what everyone is saying (pros) - the surface is slower than either Rebound Ace or Deco-Turf now....

BounceHitBounceHit
07-08-2007, 01:28 PM
I've been going to Wimbledon every year since 1997, spending a few days at the championships, and the only real change I noticed came about 2002-2003. Thats when I noticed a few "key players" stopped serving and volleying systematically. I'm not convinced the surface was considerably slower this year than in 2006, 2005, 2004 or 2003. Maybe you have this impression because you see Rafael Nadal playing and the guy has incredible speed, covering the court so well he makes the bounces seem slower than they are.

Thanks for the insight. It DOES seem the grass is getting slower and slower.......perhaps not. ;)

As for the Fed or Rafa bashing, NONE here! I think they are both great players and we are lucky to have them around right now to push one another to greater and greater heights.

I DO prefer Fed's game, but certainly respect Rafa.

CC

The Gorilla
07-08-2007, 01:29 PM
it wasn't playing like clay until a day or two ago because the weather was so cold, it was more like USO speed, yesterday and today it was like clay.

Mikael
07-08-2007, 01:33 PM
Rafa isn't the only one. Alot of players who are considered "clay court" or "slow hardcourt" players are making in roads at Wimbledon, such as Gasquet (primarily a clay court / slow hardcourt player, hits with heavy topspin off both sides), JCF (what the heck, a counter puncher making this deep of a run, and taking a set off Federer?), and Hewitt in that marathon match (rallies that lasted ages against Djoko). It's rediculous. If you wanted to be fair, why don't you just speed up the clay at the French Open to give American players a better chance?

Your point would have more credibility if you had left Gasquet and Hewitt out of your argument.

Gasquet has never made it beyond the 3rd round at the French Open, has won the Nottingham tournament two years in a row, and has won carpet tournaments. He's not a clay court or slow hard court specialist, despite beating Federer on clay in Monte Carlo a couple years ago. He's a shotmaker and does well on all surfaces.

As for Hewitt, he loves very fast surfaces, because they allow him to use his opponent's pace better. He's never done well at the French Open, and for an Aussie, his AO results are crap. His thrives on fast hard and indoor courts (notice his excellent results at the US Open) and grass (results at Queens + of course Wimbledon).

Even JCF is a very versatile player, he made the finals of the US Open in 2003, he's by no means a standard clay court specialist.

The Gorilla
07-08-2007, 09:31 PM
the surface is a joke

superman1
07-08-2007, 10:14 PM
A lot of people in the tennis world are saying that it is now slower than the US Open. Apparently the Australian Open is going to be the same as the US Open, so that means that Wimbledon is the 2nd slowest surface.

I don't like how it extinguishes the serve and volleyers, but I do think that today's final was one of the best I've seen. I'd like them to speed it up a bit, but not too much.

tennis_hand
07-08-2007, 10:16 PM
It gets slower and slower as the play goes on. So the final on a sunny day is like on clay in the green color.

Hot Sauce
07-08-2007, 10:22 PM
How do they make it slower?

holera
07-08-2007, 10:34 PM
How do they make it slower?

i think it's the soil beneath the grass, more compacted. the balls are heavier too i think.

original poster is right. wimbledon is now basically roma with some grass on top.

Ultra2HolyGrail
07-09-2007, 12:02 AM
This whole crying about the grass being slow is ridiculous. I'm sure everyone crying about it is a nadal hater, get over it, the guy is great and deserved to be there. Going from watching french to watching the first match on grass it's still the fastest surface there is.

Russell Finch
07-09-2007, 12:08 AM
i think it's the soil beneath the grass, more compacted. the balls are heavier too i think.

original poster is right. wimbledon is now basically roma with some grass on top.


They changed the type of grass 5 or 6 years ago.

British public especially complained for years about the lack of rallies and outright S+V domination during the Becker- Edberg - Sampras - Ivanisevic era. It does seem to have gone too far though.

tennis_hand
07-09-2007, 12:11 AM
This whole crying about the grass being slow is ridiculous. I'm sure everyone crying about it is a nadal hater, get over it, the guy is great and deserved to be there. Going from watching french to watching the first match on grass it's still the fastest surface there is.

Not exactly Nadal haters. but surely his presence in the finals say something about the surface.

Ultra2HolyGrail
07-09-2007, 12:14 AM
but surely his presence in the finals say something about the surface.

Or maybe his greatness, get over it. He's number2, and everyone knew he would be in the finals...And he's only 20yrs old.

brolycjw
07-09-2007, 12:21 AM
These guys should get a life instead of complaining about the surface, we all witnessed a great match and that's all it matters. Federer played very well, and he certainly deserves to be in the hall of fame. Nadal managed to keep up with Federer and he undoubtedly deserved to be in the finals. If Federer didn't complain despite having such a tight match, it just shows that he was a great champion with a big heart. But some of his fans are a different story.

Wimbledon can do whatever they want to the surface and you can't do a pretty damn thing about it, since you're just a nobody. So get off your couch and computer and start working out those fats, instead of making kazillion posts a day trying to vent your frustration and complain on the forum.

The Gorilla
07-09-2007, 12:25 AM
^^
muster never got anywhere near the wimby final

Dilettante
07-09-2007, 01:59 AM
These guys should get a life instead of complaining about the surface, we all witnessed a great match and that's all it matters. Federer played very well, and he certainly deserves to be in the hall of fame. Nadal managed to keep up with Federer and he undoubtedly deserved to be in the finals. If Federer didn't complain despite having such a tight match, it just shows that he was a great champion with a big heart. But some of his fans are a different story.

Wimbledon can do whatever they want to the surface and you can't do a pretty damn thing about it

Agreed here.

prosealster
07-09-2007, 04:42 AM
when 3 out of the 4 semifinalist are in both FO and Wim... it MAY mean that the pace of the courts are similar...

Virginia
07-09-2007, 09:06 PM
Apparently the Australian Open is going to be the same as the US Open, so that means that Wimbledon is the 2nd slowest surface.
The surface for the Aussie Open is going to be changed by 2008, if this report is anything to go by:

http://sportal.co.nz/default.aspx/tennis-news-display/new-surface-for-australian-open

It won't be the same as the US Open though - it will be very similar to the current Rebound Ace, to preserve the unique surface characteristics of the Australian Open.

Nadal_Freak
07-10-2007, 01:08 AM
when 3 out of the 4 semifinalist are in both FO and Wim... it MAY mean that the pace of the courts are similar...
The top 3 players in the world happen to be the 3 players in the semifinals. They are able to able to adapt to all surfaces. It wouldn't surprise me if it is the same for the US Open with Nadal, Federer, and Djokovic in the semifinals.

betterer
07-10-2007, 04:29 PM
Tim Henman actually asked the tournament director why everything felt slower. The director told him that the balls are taken out of the can a couple weeks before the tournament starts. All of us who play tennis know what kind of effect that would have on the balls...This is just ridiculous. Something needs to be done. Look at the queens tournament. I wonder why nadal was bounced out early then. Maybe because he played on real grass.... No knock against nadal, but there's something fishy about the surface.

sondraj
07-10-2007, 05:08 PM
No, just look at the matches and i think u would agree with me.There was no pace out there.The grass is slower, plain and simple and the bounces are absurd.

And like people have stated Red clay is faster. So it all evens out in the end

Eviscerator
07-10-2007, 06:30 PM
What year did this grass change come about?
Feels like it's getting progressively slower every year.

The first major change occured after the 2001 match between Goran and Rafter. As a result Hewitt won in 2002.

Kaptain Karl
07-10-2007, 08:05 PM
And like people have stated Red clay is faster.Faster than what???

- KK

Lion King
07-10-2007, 08:43 PM
Is there such a thing as emailing them?I would, give me where to do it?

Go to the wibledon website and look up the Feedback on the bottom of the page.

TheNatural
07-10-2007, 10:40 PM
A couple of weeks? Surely the balls have to be fresh straight out of the can. Balls are totally flat if they're taken out of the can for a few weeks.

Tim Henman actually asked the tournament director why everything felt slower. The director told him that the balls are taken out of the can a couple weeks before the tournament starts. All of us who play tennis know what kind of effect that would have on the balls...This is just ridiculous. Something needs to be done. Look at the queens tournament. I wonder why nadal was bounced out early then. Maybe because he played on real grass.... No knock against nadal, but there's something fishy about the surface.