PDA

View Full Version : Venus vs Justine?


pirateofthecarribean
07-10-2007, 06:07 PM
Both are tied at 6 "slams". However, Venus has 4 Wimbledons and Justine has 4 French Opens.

Since Wimbledon is THE most prestigious tournament, I think Venus still has the upper edge at the moment, even more so compared to Serena's 8 "slams".

I think Wimbledon title = 2 times US Open/French Open/Australian Open. So, that should put Venus in the lead at the moment.

Agree? :D

babySuri
07-10-2007, 06:10 PM
hmmm justine wouldn't have won as many slams as she has if the williams sisters were around and/or healthy.

iamke55
07-10-2007, 06:14 PM
Wimbledon is the easiest GS to win, since it has seen so many repeat-winners. The French Open requires superb fitness and concentration, as well as the shots. It takes more than just a serve, which is why Pete Sampras only made the semi once in his career.

dave333
07-10-2007, 06:14 PM
I think 2x all those tournaments is complete BS. Wimbledon is not 2x as prestigious as the others....

anointedone
07-10-2007, 06:17 PM
I dont know. I think they are about the same right now. Both are now superior to Hingis.

pirateofthecarribean
07-10-2007, 06:22 PM
Nevertheless, Wimbledon is the most prestigious, more so than any other slam. Venus has the edge compared to Justine.

FEDEXP
07-10-2007, 06:27 PM
Wimbledon is more "prestigious". Give me a break.....

tennishead93
07-10-2007, 06:34 PM
yea its total bs that wimby gets all the credit for being the most prestigious. it should be most likely to have a rain delay does that qualify for most "prestigious"
plus when u win a slam u get the same amount of pts, no matter what slam

pirateofthecarribean
07-10-2007, 06:36 PM
yea its total bs that wimby gets all the credit for being the most prestigious. it should be most likely to have a rain delay does that qualify for most "prestigious"
plus when u win a slam u get the same amount of pts, no matter what slam

Internationally, e.g. in China, we only recognize Wimbledon.

crazylevity
07-10-2007, 10:00 PM
There's no need to debate their respective careers at this point. Both ladies are well poised to be competing for the majors in the near future. Whoever can add to their tally will be deemed to have the better career.

pirateofthecarribean
07-11-2007, 05:51 AM
There's no need to debate their respective careers at this point. Both ladies are well poised to be competing for the majors in the near future. Whoever can add to their tally will be deemed to have the better career.

Winning multiple Wimbledon singles titles is a must for tennis greats. Until Justine and Martina both have multiple Wimbledon singles titles, they cannot be compared to Venus.

drakulie
07-11-2007, 08:22 AM
Winning multiple Wimbledon singles titles is a must for tennis greats. Until Justine and Martina both have multiple Wimbledon singles titles, they cannot be compared to Venus.


Then why did you start a thread doing exactly that??

BTW, they both have 6 slams, and although Wimbledon may be prestigious, it is possibly also the easiest to win for someone with a big serve, while the French is hands down the toughest to win. So, looking at it that way, Justine has the upper hand.

anointedone
07-11-2007, 08:37 AM
Wimbledon is not twice as prestigious as all the other slams. That is way over the top. This does not relate to Henin or Hingis so much, since Henin won most of her slams at the French, Hingis in Australia, but the U.S Open is probably on par with Wimbledon in prestige these days.

pirateofthecarribean
07-11-2007, 08:50 AM
Wimbledon is not twice as prestigious as all the other slams. That is way over the top. This does not relate to Henin or Hingis so much, since Henin won most of her slams at the French, Hingis in Australia, but the U.S Open is probably on par with Wimbledon in prestige these days.

If Wimbledon isn't the most prestigious tournament, there wouldn't be a movie on it, Wimbledon (2004) starring Kirsten Dunst. :D

ufgatorkid
07-11-2007, 08:54 AM
If Wimbledon isn't the most prestigious tournament, there wouldn't be a movie on it, Wimbledon (2004) starring Kirsten Dunst. :D
Why did you make this thread if you had no intention on actually discussing it? If you're set in your opinions, don't try to force them on everyone else.

Bertie B
07-11-2007, 08:54 AM
What's the question?

IMO, Justine is still a lightweight, and still a choker. Like Myskina, & transitional Hingis, she's great at capitalizing on opportunities when the big guns are away.

I'd go so far as to say, she's the one player Mauresmo could defeat at Roland Garros.

crazylevity
07-11-2007, 08:55 AM
What's the question?

IMO, Justine is still a lightweight, and still a choker. Like Myskina, & transitional Hingis, she's great at capitalizing on opportunities when the big guns are away.

I'd go so far as to say, she's the one player Mauresmo could defeat at Roland Garros.

When Mauresmo can't even get past the quarters consistently, you think she can take down a 4 time RG champ?? :confused:

pirateofthecarribean
07-11-2007, 08:56 AM
Why did you make this thread if you had no intention on actually discussing it? If you're set in your opinions, don't try to force them on everyone else.

Venus has 4 Wimbledons, THE most prestigious title. However, Justine has more variety: FO, USO, AO. Their slam # is the same at 6. So, I would put Venus = Justine, for NOW.

JamesBlaze
07-13-2007, 11:46 AM
justine has more solid technique, which is why she wins the french open where the clay sucks up raw power. venus is good when she's on fire, but in my opinion she is just not as consistent as henin.

ktownva
07-13-2007, 12:29 PM
Venus is the more complete player - better serve, better volley, less variety off the ground, but more efficient. Justine is a little more explosive, but Venus is better at grinding the opponent into powder. Winning the French is over-rated. The ball just sits there waiting to get smacked. On grass you have to have better hand-eye coordination and reflexes. JH will need to improve a bit to win Wimby, maybe tighten up her big swings.

sondraj
07-13-2007, 12:47 PM
Nevertheless, Wimbledon is the most prestigious, more so than any other slam. Venus has the edge compared to Justine.

Do people know what the word prestigious means, you all used it to denote some sort or greater achievement in the name of sports because it is the most respected. It doesn't mean it is the toughest to win, or that you are a greater athlete because you won it. It means that it holds are great deal of respect, due to it's tradition etc.

I think you should all take a cue from your fav tennis players and hear them talk about the French as opposed to winning other slams and they all pretty much agree that it is much tougher to win the French than wimby. Wimby is in fact quite easy to win because you don't have to work as hard for the points

In an interview where the interviewer made a joke about Rafa being able to win RG but not other slams he asks does that make him a lesser man and Roddick says well it's quite hard to win the French so maybe he's the lesser man for not being able to get passed the first round of the French

Free_Martha
07-13-2007, 12:49 PM
Henin VS williams is good for tennis.

pirateofthecarribean
07-13-2007, 02:25 PM
Do people know what the word prestigious means, you all used it to denote some sort or greater achievement in the name of sports because it is the most respected. It doesn't mean it is the toughest to win, or that you are a greater athlete because you won it. It means that it holds are great deal of respect, due to it's tradition etc.

I think you should all take a cue from your fav tennis players and hear them talk about the French as opposed to winning other slams and they all pretty much agree that it is much tougher to win the French than wimby. Wimby is in fact quite easy to win because you don't have to work as hard for the points

In an interview where the interviewer made a joke about Rafa being able to win RG but not other slams he asks does that make him a lesser man and Roddick says well it's quite hard to win the French so maybe he's the lesser man for not being able to get passed the first round of the French

It's true that, in general, at least to the layman (people who don't watch tennis on a regular basis), Wimbledon is the most prestigious.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Championships,_Wimbledon

xshilinx
07-14-2007, 12:39 AM
Internationally, e.g. in China, we only recognize Wimbledon.

Are you saying China makes up the International?

Wimbledon only? Myopic enough.

tennisjunkiela
07-14-2007, 05:34 AM
IMO, Justine is still a lightweight, and still a choker. Like Myskina, & transitional Hingis, she's great at capitalizing on opportunities when the big guns are away.

justine and venus are both great!

justine is amazing and a freak of nature for the power she generates from her small frame - pound for pound the best tennis player in the world, male or female!

venus is less consistent but truly an amazing sight to see when in full flight! her serve, her speed, her athleticism, the way she moves, all arms and legs everywhere, just amazing! i know that serena always says that when she's 100%, she is the best female tennis player in the world; however, i think that venus is actually the best female player in the world when everything is clicking; however, we don't see it much because venus just isn't as tough mentally as serena, who is tough as nails!

and imagine if venus finally listened to billie jean king and became a serve and volleyer, it would be over for the competition!

my only knock on henin's wins are that she won a bunch of them when the williams sisters were out with injuries so like the poster above said, she won them when the big guns were away. not her fault but a fact none the less.

plus henin's very one-sided head to head against venus 1 win - 7 losses clearly gives venus the edge over henin.

JohnS
07-14-2007, 05:59 AM
justine and venus are both great!

justine is amazing and a freak of nature for the power she generates from her small frame - pound for pound the best tennis player in the world, male or female!

venus is less consistent but truly an amazing sight to see when in full flight! her serve, her speed, her athleticism, the way she moves, all arms and legs everywhere, just amazing! i know that serena always says that when she's 100%, she is the best female tennis player in the world; however, i think that venus is actually the best female player in the world when everything is clicking; however, we don't see it much because venus just isn't as tough mentally as serena, who is tough as nails!

and imagine if venus finally listened to billie jean king and became a serve and volleyer, it would be over for the competition!

my only knock on henin's wins are that she won a bunch of them when the williams sisters were out with injuries so like the poster above said, she won them when the big guns were away. not her fault but a fact none the less.

plus henin's very one-sided head to head against venus 1 win - 7 losses clearly gives venus the edge over henin.

One on one, I'd pick Henin over Venus. Henin is much more of a consistent performer and remains healthy. Despite their head-to-head match ups. It also depends on surface. Henin has the edge on slower surfaces such as clay and aussie hardcourts but she has improved on faster hardcourts too. But Venus has the advantage on fast surfaces.

IMO, if they played their best on all surfaces against one another today, I'd make it a tie: Henin with Oz and FO, Venus with Wimby and USO. We saw what happened to Henin last year against sharapova at the uso. Venus may have done the same thing because of similar playing styles.

But, Venus having the edge over Henin, not any more...

FYI, but pound-for-pound, Olivier Rochus is the best tennis player if you are looking solely at the little people of tennis. If you think Henin is more likely to beat guys like Safin, Berdych, Davydenko, Hewitt, and have match point against federer on grass, than .... **nods head** Rochus is so underrated.

krz
07-15-2007, 02:16 PM
Venus is the more complete player - better serve, better volley, less variety off the ground, but more efficient. Justine is a little more explosive, but Venus is better at grinding the opponent into powder. Winning the French is over-rated. The ball just sits there waiting to get smacked. On grass you have to have better hand-eye coordination and reflexes. JH will need to improve a bit to win Wimby, maybe tighten up her big swings.

Henin is by far the most complete tennis player right now on either mens side or womens side. (Minus Fed)

pirateofthecarribean
07-15-2007, 02:57 PM
Henin is by far the most complete tennis player right now on either mens side or womens side. (Minus Fed)

Yet she needs to look up at her coach after every point. :D

Borat72
07-16-2007, 08:55 AM
hmmm justine wouldn't have won as many slams as she has if the williams sisters were around and/or healthy.

Henin would have won several slams more if she hadn't had all these injury and illness problems.

anointedone
07-16-2007, 09:00 AM
Henin would have won several slams more if she hadn't had all these injury and illness problems.

Venus has had alot of injury problems since 2003 as well.

Borat72
07-16-2007, 09:03 AM
Venus has had alot of injury problems since 2003 as well.

Yes, so these Russians could win a lot (Myskina, Sharapova, Kuznetsova).
With healthy Henin, Serena and Venus that would not have been possible.

robin7
07-16-2007, 09:11 AM
venus is less consistent but truly an amazing sight to see when in full flight! her serve, her speed, her athleticism, the way she moves, all arms and legs everywhere, just amazing! i know that serena always says that when she's 100%, she is the best female tennis player in the world; however, i think that venus is actually the best female player in the world when everything is clicking; however, we don't see it much because venus just isn't as tough mentally as serena, who is tough as nails!

Venus has almost everything, except consistency, to be the best female tennis player!

Justine is consistent and has all the technical skills despite her physical limitation.

Venus has the edge when playing 100%.

Sub-topic: Will Venus win AO/FO before Justine winning Wimbly?

babolat15
07-16-2007, 09:12 AM
Everyine will remember Venus

anointedone
07-16-2007, 09:33 AM
Venus has almost everything, except consistency, to be the best female tennis player!

Justine is consistent and has all the technical skills despite her physical limitation.

Venus has the edge when playing 100%.

Sub-topic: Will Venus win AO/FO before Justine winning Wimbly?

Venus will never win the Australian Open or French Open at this point. I am 150% sure she never wins the French Open, and if she ever gets beyond the quarters there again I will be amazed. The Australian Open, I guess there is an outside shot, but she never seems ready that early in the season to go all the way in an event like that. Wimbledon and the U.S Open seem the be the future slam possibilites for Venus at this point, but last time she won Wimbledon she was a quiet presence for quite awhile so we will see what happens.

I am not sure about Justine ever winning Wimbledon either though. I am doubting it more and more.

mentalcase
07-16-2007, 05:15 PM
Henin would have won several slams more if she hadn't had all these injury and illness problems.

pfft, Henin made 5 straight slam finals and could only win 2!
Graf, Seles, Hingis, S. Williams at their peak would not go to 5 straight slam final and only win 2.

She had the opportunity to pass Serena in slam total and claim the title of best player of her generation and she choked and blamed a tummyache!

She will not win another slam till the French Open where she has no competition.

anointedone
07-16-2007, 05:29 PM
pfft, Henin made 5 straight slam finals and could only win 2!
Graf, Seles, Hingis, S. Williams at their peak would not go to 5 straight slam final and only win 2.

She had the opportunity to pass Serena in slam total and claim the title of best player of her generation and she choked and blamed a tummyache!

She will not win another slam till the French Open where she has no competition.

You are right that Justine reaching 5 straight slam finals, being favored in all and not even having to oppose a Williams which are her biggest opposition, and still coming out with only the 2 French Opens on her best surface and losing the other 3, is a major blotch her greatness. None of the players you mentioned would have ever had that happen to them.

anointedone
07-16-2007, 05:31 PM
Yes, so these Russians could win a lot (Myskina, Sharapova, Kuznetsova).
With healthy Henin, Serena and Venus that would not have been possible.

This is true I think. Kuznetsova did atleast reach another slam final, and has stayed in the top 10, so although I am not sure she ever wins another slam, atleast she has done enough to show she wasnt a fluke I think.

Myskina though is looking like a pretty big fluke. She never got past the quarters of another slam, and her stay in the top 10 which started before her French Open title was brief.