PDA

View Full Version : Dont believe in Yonex Isometric headshape


PackardDell
08-13-2007, 12:16 PM
Yonex claimes that their isometric headshape gives you a bigger sweetspot but I don't really believe that. Given a racket of 98 sq inch. Isometric shape or an oval shape. It is still 98 sq inch. So how gonna gives the isometric shape me more sweetspot? Isomtric shape means the the max horz distance of the frame is smaller than with an oval shape. So you lose some sweetspot.

Images like this are not convincing

http://www.tagsports.co.uk/tennis-images/tech-sq-isometric2.jpg

SFrazeur
08-13-2007, 12:23 PM
See picture:


http://rs.tennis-warehouse.com/tw/vtech/YONEXTECH/ISO_IMG.JPG
ISO (Isometric Square Head Shape)
This exclusive Yonex innovation results in a sweet spot up to 48% larger than a traditional oval head shape.
According to Yonex, it ensures more power and control with fewer off-center shots.


It does work. But the sweet spot is not as "sweet" as regular ones, Yonex sweet spots are more . . . "Mellow"

-SF

sharp*shooter
08-13-2007, 12:24 PM
The proof is in the testing.

Ambivalent
08-13-2007, 12:25 PM
Doesn't that mean it's less stable since circles and round things are supposedly the strongest shapes?

PackardDell
08-13-2007, 12:26 PM
See picture:


http://rs.tennis-warehouse.com/tw/vtech/YONEXTECH/ISO_IMG.JPG
ISO (Isometric Square Head Shape)
This exclusive Yonex innovation results in a sweet spot up to 48% larger than a traditional oval head shape.
According to Yonex, it ensures more power and control with fewer off-center shots.


It does work. But the sweet spot is not as "sweet" as regular ones, Yonex sweet spots are more . . . "Mellow"

-SF




but why putting a coloured rectangle in the picture of the oval racket and not a diamond shape or an oval shape. That gives you bigger sweatspot for the oval which may result in a sweetspot equal compared to the yonex one.

aidenous
08-13-2007, 12:31 PM
I never felt a larger sweetspot with the Yonex.

SFrazeur
08-13-2007, 12:33 PM
"Unlike a conventional racquet with main and cross strings of varying length, the Isometric Square Head Shape equalizes the length of main cross strings in the stringbed-enlarging the sweetspot all-around for more consistent shot accuracy even on off-centre hits."

" Where the longest main and longest cross strings meet in the string-bed is known as the sweet spot. In conventional racquets, the sweet spot is the area where 8 main and 11 cross strings meet. However, with the YONEX ISOMETRIC square head shape, 10 main strings meet 13 cross to produce a larger sweet spot. This equates to a 10% larger sweet spot than conventional round head shape racquets. "

-SF

pow
08-13-2007, 12:33 PM
but why putting a coloured rectangle in the picture of the oval racket and not a diamond shape or an oval shape. That gives you bigger sweatspot for the oval which may result in a sweetspot equal compared to the yonex one.

I think it's because there are more consistently longer mains and cross strings intersecting at the middle, resulting in a bigger area but also, less "active" sweetspot since the middle two mains aren't as dramatically long as normal oval racquets.

TennezSport
08-13-2007, 01:13 PM
"Unlike a conventional racquet with main and cross strings of varying length, the Isometric Square Head Shape equalizes the length of main cross strings in the stringbed-enlarging the sweetspot all-around for more consistent shot accuracy even on off-centre hits."

" Where the longest main and longest cross strings meet in the string-bed is known as the sweet spot. In conventional racquets, the sweet spot is the area where 8 main and 11 cross strings meet. However, with the YONEX ISOMETRIC square head shape, 10 main strings meet 13 cross to produce a larger sweet spot. This equates to a 10% larger sweet spot than conventional round head shape racquets. "

-SF

What he said! We playtest racquets all the time and there is a difference in the Yonex SS area.

TennezSport :cool:

LafayetteHitter
08-13-2007, 01:17 PM
I think it's because there are more consistently longer mains and cross strings intersecting at the middle, resulting in a bigger area but also, less "active" sweetspot since the middle two mains aren't as dramatically long as normal oval racquets.

Ditto, people assume all sorts of things about racquet shape and don't consider what the racquet design does to he string pattern. The string setup on a Yonex headshape does help provide a nice sized sweetspot.

VS_Power
08-13-2007, 01:24 PM
i didn't believe until my eyes were opened a week ago. now im trying to get my hands on a yonex =P

they're still ugly though

Keifers
08-13-2007, 01:32 PM
I can report that the RDX 500 Mid has the biggest sweetspot of any 90" racquet I've ever hit with -- easily the equivalent of, say, a 95 or 98" oval-shaped racquet. Very stable too.

drpepper4590
08-13-2007, 01:50 PM
it's also because, in part, hte different shape eliminates some of the unnessesary (spelling sorry) area in the far corner of the racquet making the string placement more efficient

and triangles are theh strongest geometric shape i think

NoBadMojo
08-13-2007, 01:54 PM
I think Yonex got the pancake flipper headshape a bit backwards. They had some popularity with that headshape, and were known for it, so they stuck with it

I think Rossignol had a much better idea with their headshape...they inverted the lower bridge which raised the sweetspot higher where many players <including the best players> often hit. The Yonex design makes for a feeble hit up high and a structurally unsound frame. That is why they say to string the crosses lower than the mains <at least on some of their frames>

Keifers
08-13-2007, 02:10 PM
I'm afraid that NoBadMojo has something of a bias against Yonexes -- or maybe he just gets a chuckle out of referring to their "pancake flipper" headshape. He's entitled to either, of course.

The notion that the frames are structurally unsound and that is why the crosses are to be strung lower on some Y racquets is erroneous, however. Yonex recommends that the crosses be strung lower because the cross strings are shorter than the mains by a wider margin than in oval-shaped frames. This is purely a recommendation, btw, and Yonex will stand by its manufacturer's warranty with racquets which have been strung with mains and crosses at the same tension.

NoBadMojo
08-13-2007, 02:18 PM
I'm afraid that NoBadMojo has something of a bias against Yonexes -- or maybe he just gets a chuckle out of referring to their "pancake flipper" headshape. He's entitled to either, of course.

The notion that the frames are structurally unsound and that is why the crosses are to be strung lower on some Y racquets is erroneous, however. Yonex recommends that the crosses be strung lower because the cross strings are shorter than the mains by a wider margin than in oval-shaped frames. This is purely a recommendation, btw, and Yonex will stand by its manufacturer's warranty with racquets which have been strung with mains and crosses at the same tension.

Exactly..I have a bias against racquets I feel are illdesigned. Yonex suggests that their racquets be string lower in the crosses because it cuts down on warranty claims.

blubber
08-13-2007, 02:37 PM
I've tried 3 Yonex frames: RDS 001 MP, RDS 003, RDX 500.

All felt pretty good on ground strokes.

But I don't think I'm a fan of the head shape. They all feel a little funny when swung through the air. They feel slower than their swing weights suggest. Plus it's hard to scoop up shots, especially hard flat slices. Not to mention serving seems to be a weak point.

nickb
08-13-2007, 02:42 PM
Exactly..I have a bias against racquets I feel are illdesigned. Yonex suggests that their racquets be string lower in the crosses because it cuts down on warranty claims.

You seem to get angry when someone comments on a volkl being "ill designed"...yet you can go around calling yonex's pancake flippers and its fine...

sharp*shooter
08-13-2007, 02:43 PM
Well they worked for Rios, Hewitt etc...

NoBadMojo
08-13-2007, 02:54 PM
You seem to get angry when someone comments on a volkl being "ill designed"...yet you can go around calling yonex's pancake flippers and its fine...

i am way past tired of your snide comments and personal assaults and inaccurate portrayals of me. it's way past old and just doesnt look good on you. you're very annoying and a waste of time

i dont ever recall anyone even once saying that Volkl racquets are ill designed so you are way off base here as usual. plus this thread is about Yonex and not Volkl. calling a frame a pancake flipper is very inoocuous..a racquet is an inanimate object...why some people get bent up about that and make things personal is really queerly dysfunctional

Flyingpanda
08-13-2007, 03:45 PM
Personally I def think the yonex has a bigger sweet spot. However I agree with what has been said. The sweet spot doesn't feel as "sweet" as a normal racquet. I don't know if this is even true, but to me there feels like there is a sweetspot within the sweetspot.

nickb
08-13-2007, 04:10 PM
i am way past tired of your snide comments and personal assaults and inaccurate portrayals of me. it's way past old and just doesnt look good on you. you're very annoying and a waste of time

i dont ever recall anyone even once saying that Volkl racquets are ill designed so you are way off base here as usual. plus this thread is about Yonex and not Volkl. calling a frame a pancake flipper is very inoocuous..a racquet is an inanimate object...why some people get bent up about that and make things personal is really queerly dysfunctional

There was nothing personal about my post.

Just saying what I think.

Nick

Ripper
08-13-2007, 04:16 PM
"Dont believe in Yonex Isometric headshape"

I do, but I don't believe in Head Flexpoint... So, who cares...

bertrevert
08-13-2007, 05:09 PM
Agree with what's said so far. The SS is bigger but not sweeter (think pumped up strawberries).

But I'd agree they don't excel at serves. Adequate, but not stellar. I'd adjudge that it is that upper hoop area not having the same zing as the normal oval shape.

In fact having always used the distinctive Dunlop elongated oval, I found the Yonex a complete opposite.

BTW what is a pancake flipper? i just a normal egg slice flipper thing on pancakes ;)

krz
08-13-2007, 05:40 PM
I used to play with a Htour 95in then moved to a yonex ti-250 98in and I now play with a K95 but I can honestly say without a doubt the yonex had the biggest sweet spot and was the most forgiving of the rackets.

martin8768
08-13-2007, 06:48 PM
ok im not gonna say that yonex gives a bigger sweet spot, but i will say that their a definitely more forgiving and it's not a bad thing, you guys that are trying to diss is make it sound like it sucks when actually makes barely any difference and it's all about preference.

galain
08-13-2007, 07:50 PM
The thing that gets me is that Yonex are quite capable of making near perfect conventional shaped frames. The RX32 is the probably one of two racquets i would describe as perfect - and it wasn't isometric. I've always wondered - if they were able to make such a fantastic "conventional" stick, why they didn't continue to do so.

i also agree with Ed. I've used Yonex's before (R10 -R22- RD7 - RD70) - and i think Rossignol's inverted bridge did a better job of increasing sweetspot size and response than the isometric head shape does.

Keifers
08-13-2007, 10:02 PM
Exactly..I have a bias against racquets I feel are illdesigned. Yonex suggests that their racquets be string lower in the crosses because it cuts down on warranty claims.
Huh? What's the basis for this statement? In years of frequenting the Talk Tennis message board, I've never heard even a whiff of this. You're saying that Yonex's designs are so close to the edge of structural unsoundness that stringing the crosses three lbs tighter (5% in a 60 lb string job) will increase their warranty claims? I'm finding that very hard to believe.

It's one thing to have an opinion about a particular design feature, but it's quite different, imo, to make a negative statement like this. Please clarify.

retrowagen
08-13-2007, 10:13 PM
I think the whole idea behind the 'Isometric' head shape was, as was already said, to try to make the mains of almost even length, and make the crosses of almost even length. This would, in theory, create a more even playing (hence the prefix, "iso") stringbed.

Yonex were not alone in this concept. Snauwaert, with their Dyno series of mids, and Rossignol, with their inverted bridge F-series rackets (all circa 1982 +-1 year) were attempts to equalize all mains' length in hopes of making better playing rackets. I liked the original Yonex R-10 and the Graphite Dyno best of the bunch, although ti was really fun to hit mega topspin with the Rossie F200 (although it was not too useful at the net).

NoBadMojo
08-13-2007, 10:22 PM
Agree with what's said so far. The SS is bigger but not sweeter (think pumped up strawberries).

But I'd agree they don't excel at serves. Adequate, but not stellar. I'd adjudge that it is that upper hoop area not having the same zing as the normal oval shape.

In fact having always used the distinctive Dunlop elongated oval, I found the Yonex a complete opposite.

BTW what is a pancake flipper? i just a normal egg slice flipper thing on pancakes ;)


there shall be no one playfully comparing the Yonex hoop shape to a kitchen utensil....a couple of TW posters have so decried ;)

lots of good servers shun the yonex pancake flipper headshape because it is lame up high and many better players hit a little north of center especially on serves....ditto for volleys.

AJK1
08-13-2007, 10:42 PM
I've owned all the major brands over the years including Yonex, and head shape means nothing, it's head size, racquet weight, balance and string/ tension that determines how the ball feels when you hit it.
It just proves how marketing can fool people into believing all this garbage, because in actual fact, good players want a smaller sweetspot, not a bigger one.
By the way, I like a small sweetspot.;)

mitchell_ota
08-13-2007, 10:56 PM
I didn't find the sweetspot to be any larger on my RDS 001 mid than compared to my Wilson Tour 90, but the stringbed area on my Yonex definitely feels more even than on my Wilson. The Yonex is more forgiving on the off-center hits than my Wilson, and doesn't have an overly hot spot on the stringbed.

It may be me, but I felt that my serves have more pace and spin than with a conventional oval shape racquet. I know that my opponents have had a harder time returning serves coming off my Yonex, but that may come from the added spin giving extra action off the bounce. I can definitely say that I miss less serves with my Yonex than with my Wilson, though.

Also, I understand that this is a public forum where we're all entitled to our own opinions, but is there really a reason to engage in attacks and bickering? I personally believe in the Yonex racquet design, and I'm glad that it works for me. If someone else doesn't like it, then that's fine. They should play with the racquet that makes their game the best. I've personally never found a Prince racquet that didn't feel like a wet sponge, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't recommend those racquets to others. We each are unique and have different tastes. I'm sure there are enough racquets and lead tape out there to satisfy all of us.

NoBadMojo
08-13-2007, 11:33 PM
The thing that gets me is that Yonex are quite capable of making near perfect conventional shaped frames. The RX32 is the probably one of two racquets i would describe as perfect - and it wasn't isometric. I've always wondered - if they were able to make such a fantastic "conventional" stick, why they didn't continue to do so.

i also agree with Ed. I've used Yonex's before (R10 -R22- RD7 - RD70) - and i think Rossignol's inverted bridge did a better job of increasing sweetspot size and response than the isometric head shape does.

The only reason I can think of is because they have a following of people who like the pancake flipper shape..it is what Yonex is known for. lose that <even if it isnt a good design> and you lose the following and the uniqueness

Deuce
08-14-2007, 12:55 AM
i also agree with Ed. I've used Yonex's before (R10 -R22- RD7 - RD70) - and i think Rossignol's inverted bridge did a better job of increasing sweetspot size and response than the isometric head shape does.
Yeah - but neither design can hold a candle to the Ergonom...

VikingSamurai
08-14-2007, 01:10 AM
Its funny how times change in the 15 years that I played seriously.. Back then the wide body was just born, and Yonex had the RQ 180 or something.. In those days it was rare to see a playing professional (man) or for that matter any guys play with a Yonex.. And escpecially in the area I played it was considered a girls racquet.. A guy would never ever pick one up in the store in the fear of ridicule.. But now days, they are like little dogs to celebrities. A must have.. Boy how things change!

aznspongehead
08-14-2007, 01:26 AM
With all sweetspots, I think the larger they get, the less "sweet" they get.

With small headed rackets it is usually SWEET when you hit the sweet spot and HARSH when you don't. All Yonex did is make it both less sweet and less harsh. The technology does work like yonex claims it does: expand the "sweet" spot.

alm
08-14-2007, 02:13 AM
In my opinion, the Yonex head shape does increase the size of the sweetspot. Compared to my Prostaff MP and the LM Prestige, my Yonex is far more forgiving a frame.

It is not without downsides though. It doesn't swing as freely as the Prostaff did and, as mentioned by others, the sweetspot doesn't feel as sweet as other frames.

Kevo
08-14-2007, 03:49 PM
I think the Yonex head shape does make the sweet area larger. The best feel of any racquet I've tried is the RDX 500 with a nice multi in it. As for the Yonex doesn't serve well stuff, it's silliness. I've gotten lots of compliments on my serve when I was using my RDX 500. I didn't really notice any change when I started using the Pure Storm. Same kind of response. If you serve well you will still serve well with a Yonex. There may be an adjustment period, but it's mostly just timing and feel. It took me about a month before I felt as comfortable with my Storm as I did with my RDX.

racquetjunkie
08-14-2007, 04:10 PM
chris-in-japan,
it was funny hearing you say that. my Japanese colleague told me the exact same thing (he is a Babolat man), that Yonex is considered a girl's racquet. I love the RDX500 mid myself.

jmverdugo
08-14-2007, 06:02 PM
Eventhoug it makes sense for me (the isometric head shape technology) i do not think the difference is that much (about sweet spot), i do not even like the head shape and do not like the color of mine RDS's, nevertheless they are the only stick I play with and i do not even think about change them- I just like the feel which is really different to others racket i have used. I do not think the others tecnologies make that much of a difference but it is always about taste and finding your own. I do think that analizing the tecnologies is not the best way to find your more suitable stick.

So, in few words, it may not increase the sweet spot but it is definitely a different feeling which, in this case, works for me. Playtesting is the key!!

runningmann
04-08-2009, 06:07 AM
my rds001 mid def. has a huge sweetspot. It feels more like a midplus from another company.