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View Full Version : I never really thought about this, but what exactly is "power"?


Alafter
10-19-2007, 09:22 PM
When a racquet is more "powerful" than another, what does that exactly mean?

Alafter
10-19-2007, 09:24 PM
I am thinking about getting PDR for the "power" and control, but then again i have an Nblade 106 OS, and OS is supposed to be powerful. So then again maybe there's nothing in the PDR I wont miss with my NBlade

paulfreda
10-19-2007, 10:07 PM
I am surprised you ask this question Alafter.
But I will bite.

Power usually means that the frame does the work rather than the player.
Granny sticks [OS and stiff] need very little of a swing to send it to the back fence. While players frames like AG100, K/N90, Prestige, etc need a pretty big cut to send it long.

Power in a frame comes from; stiffness, weight and lower tension [and indirectly head size].

=======================
I hit with a local pro's Dunlop 900 this morning for fun and other than the little ping heard at contact it played fine as long as I hit with good topspin and only hit flat on sitters. Tons of power in the frame. Stiffness = 72, wow !

Alafter
10-19-2007, 10:31 PM
So a powerful racquet probably automatically means the balls you hit will be be faster then? I have tried granny sticks--the balls seem to sail longer, but dont travel any faster.

psp2
10-19-2007, 10:42 PM
So a powerful racquet probably automatically means the balls you hit will be be faster then? I have tried granny sticks--the balls seem to sail longer, but dont travel any faster.

If one object landed farther than another object of the same mass and the angle of the trajectory didn't change, the ONLY variable that has changed is the initial velocity of the object. Thus, the velocity of the object that sailed longer must be greater.

It's simple physics.

Speedygonzalez
10-20-2007, 01:43 AM
If you want to know what a powerful racquet is...Try a Prince CTS Thunderstick! During high school a friend of mine had one. When he just got it he hit all the balls in the fence! But after while he had the hardest serve of the club...

kalic
10-20-2007, 01:58 AM
PDR is more powerful than nBlade OS becouse high stiffnes of PDR. Stiffnes is more important for power than head size.

three eights
10-20-2007, 05:50 AM
PDR is more powerful than nBlade OS becouse high stiffnes of PDR. Stiffnes is more important for power than head size.

What's more important for power: frame stiffness, string tention or string selection (nylon/poly)?

jace112
10-20-2007, 08:01 AM
Power in a frame comes from; stiffness, weight and lower tension [and indirectly head size].
don't forget the SW ;)

paulfreda
10-20-2007, 03:06 PM
What's more important for power: frame stiffness, string tention or string selection (nylon/poly)?

I would think stiffness is the most important.
To maximize power for your ability and strength/fitness level you want the stiffest frame you can hit well.
If you choose a frame that is too stiff you will lose power.
If you pick a frame that is too flexible you will lose power too.
Tension you can easily change and fool around with.
But frame stiffness is fixed, so you need to get it right when choosing the frame.
Demoing many frames is the key to finding this out for yourself.

J011yroger
10-20-2007, 04:56 PM
Please read my guide to racquet selection, ESPECIALLY the section on power vs. control. I think it should clarify a lot of things for a lot of people. I put a good deal of effort into it, and it explains many of these things in detail.

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=160692

J

tennismaster888
10-20-2007, 05:54 PM
If one object landed farther than another object of the same mass and the angle of the trajectory didn't change, the ONLY variable that has changed is the initial velocity of the object. Thus, the velocity of the object that sailed longer must be greater.

It's simple physics.

yep, no matter how dreadful that class is i agree

Please read my guide to racquet selection, ESPECIALLY the section on power vs. control. I think it should clarify a lot of things for a lot of people. I put a good deal of effort into it, and it explains many of these things in detail.

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=160692

J

you should really just put that link in your signature cuz your hand must be tired from advertising it so much ;)

shwetty[tennis]balls
10-20-2007, 06:05 PM
I agree w/ the posts that say the racquet does the work. In other words, as Prince breaks it down, a control racquet usually requires a fuller swing, whereas a more power oriented racquet would take a lesser swing to project the ball just as far. The power/control factor can usually be determined by the thickness of the frame (the thicker the more power) and also by the stiffness of the frame, which will tie into the composition of the raquet.

J011yroger
10-20-2007, 06:12 PM
yep, no matter how dreadful that class is i agree



you should really just put that link in your signature cuz your hand must be tired from advertising it so much ;)

Yea, I have been shamelessly promoting it all over the boards, but the reason I wrote it was so that I could save time in the end. Instead of typing out the same reccomendation and explanation everytime someone asked the same question, now I can just refer them to my super duper handy dandy guide.

Kind of like the TTW Version of RTFM!

J

tennismaster888
10-20-2007, 06:20 PM
Yea, I have been shamelessly promoting it all over the boards, but the reason I wrote it was so that I could save time in the end. Instead of typing out the same reccomendation and explanation everytime someone asked the same question, now I can just refer them to my super duper handy dandy guide.

Kind of like the TTW Version of RTFM!

J

haha well good luck with your promotions ;) and i know the guide definitaly helped me :D

cukoo
10-20-2007, 08:21 PM
PDR is more powerful than nBlade OS becouse high stiffnes of PDR. Stiffnes is more important for power than head size.

I'm interested in knowing how string tension factors in this.
Can a low powered frame like a PS85 be made more "powerful" by stringing it very loose?

tennismaster888
10-20-2007, 08:41 PM
I'm interested in knowing how string tension factors in this.
Can a low powered frame like a PS85 be made more "powerful" by stringing it very loose?

yes but it still prob wont be too powerful

sdslyout
10-20-2007, 08:42 PM
It's called kinetic energy

Duzza
10-20-2007, 08:45 PM
Power is that feeling you get in your tummy when you really need to fart.

gerikoh
10-20-2007, 08:55 PM
When a racquet is more "powerful" than another, what does that exactly mean?

the depth of the ball when being hit.

a simple explanation is having the same force exerted on the racquet wehn you hit the ball, the longer the ball goes, the more power it has. so power racquets need less force to exert compared to a non-powered racquet w/c requires more charged backswing to produce more power. ;)

nousername
10-20-2007, 09:58 PM
When a racquet is more "powerful" than another, what does that exactly mean?
technically (and actually rather simplistically too) it just means that the *more* powerful racquet absorbs *less* energy from the ball than the less powerful racquet... meaning the ball itself will retain a greater amount of energy.

shwetty[tennis]balls
10-21-2007, 07:51 PM
Power is that feeling you get in your tummy when you really need to fart.
Heh-heh- you sick *******!!!

Alafter
10-21-2007, 08:01 PM
Thanks all for discussing.

Well I guess I now can relate to some of the posts here. Yeah, balls do sail longer. Perhaps I am not as perceptive about ball speeds as many others--but i STILL swear that with power racquets, balls really just simply fly longer, not faster.

I was personally hoping that more means same balls paths, just MUCH faster (like using a pure drive would increase all my groundstrokes ballspeed noticably).

At any rate, I have spent the money alloted to leisure for the month (I work btw) to Nintendo DS instead. I really think I have made a wise choice here ;)

Lastly, some 3.0 (fischer no.1 pro) and 4.5 dude (fischer something) who are not racquet freaks picked up my nblades OS. They all loved the racquet. Power without losing control. I was happy and also at the same time ashamed--to be able to pick GREAT racquets but lack the ability to use them...I feel like a monkey with an excalibur, which those guys are samurais wielding wooden sticks. Sigh....

LPShanet
10-22-2007, 01:49 AM
technically (and actually rather simplistically too) it just means that the *more* powerful racquet absorbs *less* energy from the ball than the less powerful racquet... meaning the ball itself will retain a greater amount of energy.

This is the closest to correct in physics terms so far. A "powerful" racquet is the one that most efficiently transfers a given amount of swing energy to the ball. In a sense, it's really the one that loses the least energy in the transaction, rather than adding the most.

As for people's statements about strings (lower tension equalling greater power): this turns out not to be true, based on lab testing. Surprisingly, tension has almost no effect on power at all. Lower tension APPEARS to cause more power because it changes the angle that the ball comes off the racquet, causing the ball to land farther away, but the ball speed does not increase with lower tensions.

Also, in terms of racquet power, there is another factor that hasn't been factored in yet: the player. Because the racquet isn't just being projected forward on an even plane, the stiffness equation isn't quite so simple. Which racquet is most powerful for a given player turns out to be based on their swing pattern, which is different for each player. Many pros can actually hit harder with racquets that on paper would seem less powerful, because of the physics of their entire swing. In effect, their arm and the racquet as a unit create a whiplike effect, and the racquet that allows the best timed whip to produce maximum head speed at impact is the one that will allow the player to be the most powerful. Sometimes it's a relatively stiff racquet, other times a more flexible one. However, for beginners, whose strokes are much more linear, the stiffer racquet is almost always more powerful.

Lastly, the heaviest racquet that doesn't slow down the swing will impart the most power.

paulfreda
10-22-2007, 04:02 AM
Yes I think there is a missing element in this question of power regarding the racuqet. Specifically, density.

A frame can have high stiffness from the physics of a widebody. Think of trying to bend a 2 x 4 over your knee but with the 2 inch side on your knee. Almost impossible due to the thickness in the bending direction.

A frame can also have stiffness due to the strength of the material [mostly attributable to density]. Think of a 1 inch steel rod. Not very thick but not very easy to bend.

The widebody may be rated stiff and thus seem very powerful, but because it is so light, it loses 'power' due to its light weight. A frame like an nCode6195, or MGExtremePro may have a lower stiffness rating but be quite a bit more powerful due to density and thus additional weight.

One almost has to be an engineer to enjoy these complexities.
Much easier to just go to Swetka's and demo frames.

Cheers

keithchircop
10-22-2007, 02:03 PM
Alafter,

The nBlade OS is about as powerful as the Babolat midplus. If you're not finding enough power in your 11oz OS, either you're using some poly or kevlar string or you have soft/short strokes. I suggest some multi string and more lessons with your coach.

wally
10-22-2007, 03:22 PM
Power is that feeling you get in your tummy when you really need to fart.


Actaully its that full feeling in the diaphram after a really gooood beer and just prior to the belch:-D A proper beer belch is alwasy from the diaphram