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View Full Version : Henman -- #3 with a bullet


bcaz
11-16-2004, 09:19 PM
This guy is a magnificent tennis player and thoroughly underappreciated. Is there anyone else who can stand toe to toe with Federer and Roddick like this guy? It takes tremendous guts to play his style against the world's best, the most powerful strokes of our time. Tim is just a point or two away once again. Maybe a victim of his commitment to the net; maybe he would have won tonight by staying back a few more times. But playing his way says a lot about commitment, courage, and faith. He can only be the best Tim Henman that he can be.

Vlad
11-16-2004, 09:36 PM
Tim played a great match. As you said it, 2 or 3 points decided the outcome. He feeld comfortable playing with Roddick for some reason. He blocks his serves very well and gives him no rythm with cheap and charge.

Max G.
11-16-2004, 09:36 PM
" Maybe a victim of his commitment to the net; maybe he would have won tonight by staying back a few more times"

I doubt it. His netrushing is what gives Roddick/Federer problems, that's why he can stay toe-to-toe with them. If he stays back more, he plays into their hands.

The problem wasn't holding serve. In the first set, Roddick hit three ridiculously good shots to get the break, nothing Henman could have done there. Henman was only broken that one time.

He lost because
a) Roddick served and volleyed some himself, and Henman couldn't break him.
b) Henman missed two makeable shots in the 2nd set tiebreak, a volley and an easy putaway.

I don't think that staying back more would have done him well.

bobby
11-16-2004, 09:56 PM
Yeah, Henman's attacking game proves very hard for the best players like Federer and Roddick to beat. He is the only player to have beaten both Roddick and Federer this year and was 3-1 against Roddick before this match. Now, he is 3-2, still a winning record.

On another note, I thought that tonight's match was great. Both Roddick and Henman played superbly. Also, Henman is one of my favorite players, so the last few games of the second set and then the tie-breaker were really nerve racking for me. Too bad Henman couldn't have won a few extra key points here and there.

skuludo
11-16-2004, 10:06 PM
Isn't Federer undefeated against a top ten player this year?
If thats the case when was Fed beaten by Tim?

Vlad
11-16-2004, 10:10 PM
TIme wasn't in the top 10 at that time I think..

JohnThomas1
11-16-2004, 10:19 PM
Fed is 19 - 0 or summin against the top 10ers.

Type40
11-16-2004, 10:19 PM
Can someone make a bit torrent of this match ?

bobby
11-16-2004, 10:24 PM
Correct. Henman was ranked 11th at the time, and the tournament was the ABN Amro World Tennis Tournament at Rotterdam, an indoor tournament back in February. Henman beat Federer 6-3, 7-6 (11-9) in the quarterfinals and then lost in the semis to his arch-nemesis Lleyton Hewitt.

rafael
11-16-2004, 11:20 PM
Definately my favorite Henman match. I have a far greater appreciation for his game after watching him today.

ShooterMcMarco
11-16-2004, 11:53 PM
Isn't Federer undefeated against a top ten player this year?
If thats the case when was Fed beaten by Tim?

that happened in 2003.

i appreciate tim henman as a tennis player, andy was excellent today though

rhubarb
11-17-2004, 12:52 AM
Correct. Henman was ranked 11th at the time, and the tournament was the ABN Amro World Tennis Tournament at Rotterdam, an indoor tournament back in February. Henman beat Federer 6-3, 7-6 (11-9) in the quarterfinals and then lost in the semis to his arch-nemesis Lleyton Hewitt.

Yep, spot on. Roger hasn't lost to anyone else in the top 20 in the past 12 months (Hrbaty was 21 when he beat him in Cincy).

BreakPoint
11-17-2004, 01:36 AM
At 5-5 in the first set, 15-40, double break point for Henman on Roddick's serve, he chipped and charged on Roddick's 2nd serve and had a makable volley into the open court. Instead he let it go and the ball landed just inside the baseline near the corner. I'd bet he wished he could have that point back. I guess what I learned there is if you have a makable volley, go for it. Don't let the close ones go. I didn't see any more of the match after that. Too bad that Tim lost. I would've liked to see him win that one. :(

BiGGieStuFF
11-17-2004, 06:27 AM
At 5-5 in the first set, 15-40, double break point for Henman on Roddick's serve, he chipped and charged on Roddick's 2nd serve and had a makable volley into the open court. Instead he let it go and the ball landed just inside the baseline near the corner. I'd bet he wished he could have that point back. I guess what I learned there is if you have a makable volley, go for it. Don't let the close ones go. I didn't see any more of the match after that. Too bad that Tim lost. I would've liked to see him win that one. :(

That shot definitely looked like it was going out. I thought it was out for sure but dipped in and caught the line. I was like "whoa" Definitely some good tennis out there that night. Started off a bit slow but after the 8th game, things really got into gear. Roddick was pulling out some great shots to beat Tim though.

splink779
11-17-2004, 06:35 AM
Could anyone tell me if that match was rain delyed? I set up my vcr back home to start recording at 11 and stop at 1 on ESPN2 here in Michigan, and I really wanted to see this match. If there was a rain delay I probably missed it.

BiGGieStuFF
11-17-2004, 06:50 AM
There was a rain delay but the match on TV was still shown during the regular time since the match finished before it aired on TV.

@wright
11-17-2004, 07:11 AM
I couldn't believe the groundies Tim was hitting, haven't seen him hit the ball like that before. What a great match, Andy just hit some incredible shots to win the 1st set with that break. I was very glad I stayed up to watch that one.

NoBadMojo
11-17-2004, 08:13 AM
ya man..that was a terrific exciting match. i wish there were more epic battles involving all courters/serve-volleyers vs baseliners..they are often more exciting and you see a bigger array of shotmaking. a couple points turned the match as is often the case w. players who have the cajones to flee the safety of the baseline.

@wright
11-17-2004, 09:03 AM
I was also impressed by Roddick's volleying. Is it just me, or has someone taught him how to stick a volley? He seemed much harder to break now that he actually had some net skills to back up his forays to the net...He didn't seem like he was getting lucky with his best volleys either.

AJP
11-17-2004, 09:14 AM
One factor that turned out to be very significant in this match was when Tim was up 30-15 to hold serve (at 5-6) & got a bad call. Andy hit a crosscourt fh that landed wide but was called good. If Tim had 40-15, most likely he would have held and it would have gone on to a tie-break.

I'm not sure it would have changed the outcome because Andy was playing so well. To me it looked like Andy had much more to his game than I saw at the open. He actually looked competent at the net. His bh and agility look better as well.


It's a strange point in tennis right now because everyone knows that the shot spot type line calls are better than the human eye, but the ATP is dragging their feet in implementing it. The Serina/Jen Cap. match at the open was the most blatant, but even in this match I believe it was a factor. In the 12th game of the 1st set Tim was serving to bring it to a tie break. Because of a bad call it was 30-30 instead of 40-15. Tim did get to 40-30 before Andy hit 3 ridiculous winners/passes on the run in order to break Tim and take the set 7-5.

But here is my question. If the 1st set went to a tie break, would Andy have tightened up? Andy had lost to Tim 3 out of the 4 times they had played and that surely would have been in the back of his mind when in the pressure of a breaker.

Feņa14
11-17-2004, 09:19 AM
At last, some people appreciating Henman. To of achieved what he has is exceptional, he may not have won Wimbledon YET and thats what people over here judge him on but his results are scary good.

He can still qualify but I doubt he can beat Safin, he should beat Coria though.

I'm glad I stayed up until until 4.30 in the morning for it now, great match.

NoBadMojo
11-17-2004, 09:26 AM
i think his bh got better, and i think that his bh is fundamentally far better than his fh altho he is obviously more dominating w. the fh. henman went after his bh almost exclusively and it held up really well. as far as his volleying goes, i thought it was a little better, although he is still really out of control at the net IMO..volleying is about being compact and precise and having great feel, and that isnt what roddick is all about IMO <but he does seem to be improving>.thought henman was bringing roddick in on purpose last night by chipping short to his bh because he knows roddick still really cant volley. thought henman played a really tactically tight match along w. striking the ball great..some of those passes by roddick on his BH were just crazy...3 stellar ones in a row i seem to recall. my .o2

BiGGieStuFF
11-17-2004, 09:30 AM
Henman will be glad to see Coria. It should be a free 120K for him :)

coria=free money :) OH and if he pulls out he only gets pro-rated amount of the 90K.

Prize Money: US$ 3,700,000
Kids Fund: US$50,000

Total Player Purse: US$ 3,650,000
Alternate: US$ 50,000
Participation Fee: US$ 90,000*
Round Robin Win: US$ 120,000
Semifinal Win: US$ 370,000
Final Win: US$ 700,000
Undefeated Winner: US$ 1,520,000
*Pro-rated on
per match basis: US$45,000=1 match; US$70,000=2 matches; US$ 90,000=3 matches

INDESIT ATP Race Points:

RR Win: 20 points
Semifinal Win: 40 points
Final Win: 50 points
Undef. Winner: 150 points

splink779
11-17-2004, 11:45 AM
Just saw the match, great stuff, very crazy shot were made. Roddick volleyed very well. Both played awesome. Too bad they dont show the speed of serve, because I'm pretty sure Roddick wasn't doing a lot of hard serving. That could have just been me. Imagine if Roddick had Henman's volley skills and became a serve&volley player. He would be unstopable.

BiGGieStuFF
11-17-2004, 12:37 PM
Just saw the match, great stuff, very crazy shot were made. Roddick volleyed very well. Both played awesome. Too bad they dont show the speed of serve, because I'm pretty sure Roddick wasn't doing a lot of hard serving. That could have just been me. Imagine if Roddick had Henman's volley skills and became a serve&volley player. He would be unstopable.

You're pretty much right. He was only serving from 110-mid 120's but making a lot of 1st serves in. His strategy was to probably get the 1st serves in with the weather and hopefully henman would be tentative to move laterally. He did let one huge angry serve loose when he questioned a call in the 1st set at 15-30 but henman got it back and won the point to give him 2 break points which he didn't convert.

BreakPoint
11-17-2004, 01:42 PM
Roddick got a really lucky break in the 2nd set tiebreak. At 2-5 in the tiebreak, Roddick came to net and totally framed a volley, the ball somehow stayed in with no pace on it. Henman then hit a great DTL passing shot which Roddick somehow stuck his racquet out and stabbed at and plopped it into the open court which Henman couldn't get to because he was so shocked that the ball came back. It was all downhill for Tim after that. If Roddick's arms weren't so long and he wasn't using an extra length racquet, I don't think he could've reached that stab volley. Once again confriming that it's a game of inches. :lol:

AndyC
11-17-2004, 02:10 PM
Actually I've always appreciated Tim. However it's more accurate to say that Tim is the player WITHOUT a bullet. If he had one truly outstanding shot he would have definitely won a Slam event by now. The thing about Tim's game is he's a guy whose taken his natural talent and pushed it right to the limit.

It's hard to imagine it now but when Tim started out the LTA had much higher hopes for almost every junior who were Tim's peers. How ironic then that the one they wrote off is the one that has come good.

tennis*bill
11-17-2004, 02:16 PM
Both Tim and Andy played a great match. A couple of points here and there decided the match. Tim's chip and charge didn't hold up under pressure when it counted most, but it wasn't like Roddick was just hitting the ball back, he was making great shots. I was there, we waited thru about a 2 hour rain delay to see it. Tim should have won the 2nd set tie break for sure. It was by far the most competitive singles match of the tourney so far.

james_R
11-18-2004, 06:16 AM
I really appreciate the way Henman plays. I am a Hewitt fan but after watching Henman changed to playing more at the net and, as someone not as strong as a couple of other players at my club, have been punished at the baseline on occasions. Now, after much practise I 'brave' it out to the net and manage to get some good points and games, perplexing the 'big' hitter on the other end of the court and choking them by coming in. His a great example of how to play clever tennis, as well as Federer, who is just outstanding all round (though cant quite cut it at the net as well as Henman, but his getting close.)