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View Full Version : how important is your racquet in determining the outcome of a close match?


Pro_Tour_630
01-11-2008, 09:25 PM
1. It is important

2. It is not important at all, I can play with just about anything

Just about anything meaning a very wide spectrum

Guys think extreme 9oz stick vs 14oz, SW 280 VS 380, 28inch length VS 27 85sq vs 110sq 30cm Head light vs 36cm Head heavy

Think BIG BUBBA vs PS8.5

IN A TIGHT MATCH

IF IT DOES NOT MATTER THEN SO BE IT

But please vote here as well regarding your string setup

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=174882

bluetrain4
01-11-2008, 09:28 PM
I can play with a pretty wide variety of frames as long as I have a little time to adjust.

That said, I do have preferences and some frames (ultra light, for example) would be out of the question.

I can adjust very easily to flexibility and string pattern changes

More diffcult to adjust to weight, but fairly easy if it's within a .4 oz.

Swingweight is probably the most difficult, but even then, as with all of these things, strokes can adjusted.

Chauvalito
01-11-2008, 09:36 PM
If it is a close match, I would want to be playing with a racket I am completely comfortable with.

Otherwise I adjust fairly quickly to different rackets...I switch often between similar but different rackets and have no problems.

That said, in a match situation I would prefer a racket which i know well.

retrowagen
01-11-2008, 09:41 PM
For me (ex. Div III college, ITF juniors and circuit player), #2. Except on bad "mental toughness" days when any number of factors would get under my skin - wind or a guy with a loud Hawaiian shirt in the stands could mess me up on such a fragile day as much as the wrong size racket grip or string tension off by 5 pounds.

Generally, better players need a racket they're comfortable with, weight, balance and feel within a certain range, and it needs to be tailored to the player's overall style of play (an all S/V person might not be too happy with a Rossignol F200, for instance, but it can be done in the hands of the right athlete).

In my competitive career (mid 80's-early 90's), I had success with such varied frames as the Kneissl White Star Pro Master, Dunlop Max 200G, Head Elite Pro, and Fischer Vacuum Elliptic. I did try the Rossi F200, but it was more useful on clay than hard courts, as was the Kneissl. I found the Voelkl Worldcup MS24 to be such a dismally-performing frame, that I refused to play more than one tournament with it - I switched over to Dunlop and then found the Head Elite Pro to be a very friendly racket for my play and kept on with it for quite a while.

Pro_Tour_630
01-11-2008, 09:46 PM
Just about anything meaning a very wide spectrum

Guys think extreme 9oz stick vs 14oz, SW 280 VS 380, 28inch length VS 27 85sq vs 110sq 30cm Head light vs 36cm Head heavy

Think BIG BUBBA vs PS8.5

IN A TIGHT MATCH

IF IT DOES NOT MATTER THEN SO BE IT

dantespark33
01-11-2008, 09:52 PM
i would have to say it is really important, because if you don't use a racket what else will you use? a frying pan? ^_^

retrowagen
01-11-2008, 10:09 PM
Well, OK then, if you consider the "It's a Close Match, Big Bubba Or PS85 It Doesn't Matter" extremes of equipment selection, then the match probably wouldn't be a close one to begin with, were the player playing with an absolutely unsuitable piece of equipment. I'd suggest this is more true with advanced players than beginners.

It'd be as ludicrous as suggesting that it wouldn't matter if one would climb Mt. Everest in either proper insulated Mountaineering Boots with crampons, or cowboy boots.

CAM178
01-11-2008, 10:13 PM
Yes, it matters. I've broken a string close to the end of a match, and had to switch to another frame. Me not happy. Me win, but me not happy.

iradical18
01-11-2008, 10:19 PM
It is important to me. Not as important as my first serve percentage, but still pretty important.

roller~
01-11-2008, 10:22 PM
In most cases, it is important.
And it has a special effect on ur mental.

JohnP
01-11-2008, 10:23 PM
Anybody who voted "it doesnt matter" needs to stop huffing paint thinner.

Pro_Tour_630
01-11-2008, 10:31 PM
retrowagen you are thinking too hard......... Hawaiian shirts etc:confused: WTF does that have anything to do with tennis racquets:confused:

Pro_Tour_630
01-11-2008, 10:35 PM
this is the best answer I have found so far, thanks


For those of you who thinks otherwise, you will use the racquet of my choice next time.

meowmix
01-12-2008, 10:47 AM
If I'm 7-6, 6-7, 6-5 in a match and I break my strings on my primary racket and I have to switch rackets, I'm screwed. Pure and simple. I can adjust to the other racket, but it'll take me 15-20 minutes. I wouldn't have that kind of time in a close match.

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 07:25 AM
This is a Wilson ULTRA with metal PWS head size is 65sq not sure if there is smaller, and it weighs over 13oz flexs at 80, with 3/4 grip and 1.40mm 15g strings at 40lbs . This is the frame I will bring with me for all you Macho folks who can win with anything in a close match. ONLY person I know on this board who can play effective with this frame is Deuce

http://i8.tinypic.com/721cc2e.jpg

drakulie
01-13-2008, 07:37 AM
I don't even want to think about my frame when playing. That said, if I am comfortable with my selection, then it is important. If it does not feel comfortable, I will be too conscious of it, and will probably tighten up during points.

WBF
01-13-2008, 07:40 AM
Anybody who voted "it doesnt matter" needs to stop huffing paint thinner.

If you have time to practice with the racquet (as in, multiple days, completely habituate to it in the same sense that you did your previous racquet), then it does not matter.

If you are asking whether these specs can make a difference when you just randomly switch with no practice on the new racquet whatsoever, I don't see the point in the question.

Ultra2HolyGrail
01-13-2008, 07:46 AM
When i was playing a light hyper carbon i felt one match i lost becuase of my racquet.. And alot of approach shots i felt the control was not my fault. The one match i remember against a player using a prestige was that i was getting tight and not swinging out like i should have.. Could of just been me at the time choking but that was a pretty powerfull and stiff racquet and for some reason i felt i could not hit out like i should have. And the guy swinging the prestige was swinging it like a mad man ;) I really should have beat him lol..

Rabbit
01-13-2008, 07:58 AM
This is a Wilson ULTRA with metal PWS head size is 65sq not sure if there is smaller, and it weighs over 13oz flexs at 80, with 3/4 grip and 1.40mm 15g strings at 40lbs . This is the frame I will bring with me for all you Macho folks who can win with anything in a close match. ONLY person I know on this board who can play effective with this frame is Deuce

http://i8.tinypic.com/721cc2e.jpg

Hmmmm.....

Ultra2HolyGrail
01-13-2008, 08:16 AM
I voted yes it makes a difference but disclaimer is only if you are comfortable with your racquet and been playing it for atleast a year than it should make zero difference. That's why anybody who takes tennis pretty serious stays with the same racquet.. The last thing you want to worry about is if you "like" your racquet when your playing. So yes it makes a difference but if you tend to lose alot of close matches than i say thats your fault.. Flat out "Choking"-playing tight and losing focus and intensity is usally the real reason why you lose in a close match.. Or the other person just played better than you.. To me nothing is worse than losing a close match, if it's close, i feel i should win it..

herosol
01-13-2008, 08:20 AM
This is a Wilson ULTRA with metal PWS head size is 65sq not sure if there is smaller, and it weighs over 13oz flexs at 80, with 3/4 grip and 1.40mm 15g strings at 40lbs . This is the frame I will bring with me for all you Macho folks who can win with anything in a close match. ONLY person I know on this board who can play effective with this frame is Deuce

http://i8.tinypic.com/721cc2e.jpg


lawl. Ai pwnz u wit dat racketz kkz?

I would probably attempt to just lob every shot, and just hit every ball really high like a pusher with that thing. :[

The racket does matter, especially since I use Yonex. For me the Isometric head-shape has always been a very unique feeling for me atleast. I takes me awhile to get back to using regular oval/circular shaped racket heads. The Isometric vs Regular Shape really affects my serve in particular.

Zhou
01-13-2008, 08:27 AM
Wow, for the 10 people that voted no, there are 2 possibilities. 1) You are just beast and are gonna be pro someday or 2) you are trying to be cool and say your awesome on these boards so people would portray you to be a good tennis player but in real life you are just a lousy 3.5...

RoddickAce
01-13-2008, 08:31 AM
Imagine using an oversize racquet, with modern technology, and then switching to an 80 sq inch or less frame size wooden racquet. I need to adapt, and in a really close match, I would perform the best if I'm used to using my equipment.

Ultra2HolyGrail
01-13-2008, 08:32 AM
Wow, for the 10 people that voted no, there are 2 possibilities. 1) You are just beast and are gonna be pro someday or 2) you are trying to be cool and say your awesome on these boards so people would portray you to be a good tennis player but in real life you are just a lousy 3.5...

Everybody is 4.5+ on these boards :)

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 02:19 PM
Wow, for the 10 people that voted no, there are 2 possibilities. 1) You are just beast and are gonna be pro someday or 2) you are trying to be cool and say your awesome on these boards so people would portray you to be a good tennis player but in real life you are just a lousy 3.5...
it is funny how the people who say racquets are not important are rarely seen in the equipment section, they are faithful posters everywhere else though

But I would like to know how many from these people also think setup is no important as well. show of hands? I know there are few of you, maybe even all of yous think the same regarding string string setup as well.

anbu4ever11
01-13-2008, 02:36 PM
i would say it matters in the fact of the enviroment.lets say its a long match and your tired then i think which racket your using does matter.ill have my choice sticks but if im tired or not getting and depth or power then i will switch to a back up more powerful easier to swing racket.if ur performing at ur best physical and mental then id say then what racket your using doesnt matter.

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 02:41 PM
Anybody who voted "it doesnt matter" needs to stop huffing paint thinner.

behold the glue sniffers, me thinks they should be banned from the equipment section

chiapants226 (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=23406), Jack & Coke (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=16791), johlhausen (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=19925), JW10S (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=13484), Leelord337 (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=12905), retrowagen (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=15034), robmachado23 (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=25027), tennis_nerd22 (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=6835), WBF (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=21892), YULitle (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=5187)

1/2 these people are under 4.0 and are teens who do not know the difference between a tennis racquet and a hockey stick and it is not surprising, but I am rather disappointed from the older and much more experienced crowd. I think this macho bunch are on a mission. I hope they reach their goal.

quest01
01-13-2008, 02:54 PM
If I'm playing a guy thats pretty good then I want to use a racket I feel I'm best with. If I'm playing for fun or against a guy that reeks then I'll use a racket which is more demanding like the PS85 or K90.

Mick
01-13-2008, 03:38 PM
when I lose a close match, it's not because of my equipment. It's because my opponent out played me.

WBF
01-13-2008, 03:50 PM
behold the glue sniffers, me thinks they should be banned from the equipment section

chiapants226 (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=23406), Jack & Coke (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=16791), johlhausen (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=19925), JW10S (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=13484), Leelord337 (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=12905), retrowagen (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=15034), robmachado23 (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=25027), tennis_nerd22 (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=6835), WBF (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=21892), YULitle (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/member.php?u=5187)

1/2 these people are under 4.0 and are teens who do not know the difference between a tennis racquet and a hockey stick and it is not surprising, but I am rather disappointed from the older and much more experienced crowd. I think this macho bunch are on a mission. I hope they reach their goal.

The phrasing of the op was such that we were asked whether individually, we think we could play against close opponents with various racquets. I pointed out that given practice and time to adapt to a new racquet (and a reasonable racquet, junior sticks and crap like that excluded), I think it wouldn't be the deciding factor. I would simply habituate to the racquet. Does it not generate enough spin? I would modify my game (I have had success using my first serve twice in a row, slightly slower vs. the kicker). Too powerful? I would adjust my strokes. etc.

Does this mean that I won't play with my racquet of choice given the opportunity? Of course not. You asked the question, I just answered it.

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 03:55 PM
when I lose a close match, it's not because of my equipment. It's because my opponent out played me.

The phrasing of the op was such that we were asked whether individually, we think we could play against close opponents with various racquets. I pointed out that given practice and time to adapt to a new racquet (and a reasonable racquet, junior sticks and crap like that excluded), I think it wouldn't be the deciding factor. I would simply habituate to the racquet. Does it not generate enough spin? I would modify my game (I have had success using my first serve twice in a row, slightly slower vs. the kicker). Too powerful? I would adjust my strokes. etc.

Does this mean that I won't play with my racquet of choice given the opportunity? Of course not. You asked the question, I just answered it.

you two don't even think strings setup are important in a match so racquets should not even be a question, not surprising

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 03:59 PM
Does it not generate enough spin? I would modify my game (I have had success using my first serve twice in a row, slightly slower vs. the kicker).


WBF I have seen your first serve, if you slow down your first serve with less kick against me, I will crush it and the chances are you will get broken and oh yeah bring your LM prestige the one you hate the most

WBF
01-13-2008, 04:00 PM
I think I clarified in my post that the string would need to be within the tension recommendations on the racquet. Other than that, just edit my above post so it discusses stringing vs. racquets.

It is not that these aren't important. It's that these won't be deciding factors during a match with a close competitor, if you have time to habituate to them.

The reason they are important to *me* is that they let me play my favorite style of game with less discomfort, room for injury, and so forth. Factors that ultimately wouldn't affect the outcome of a match imho.

WBF
01-13-2008, 04:03 PM
WBF I have seen your first serve, if you slow down your first serve against me, I will crush it and the chances are you will get broken

Hehe, I would strongly disagree with you here.... Regardless of what level tennis you play.

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 04:43 PM
WBF You just bought a new stringer few weeks ago, you are new to stringing, people here have been stringing for 30 years and they will disagree with you, I have been stringing for more than 25 years since I was 13

You just joined this site six months ago with over 700 post in less than six months read below:

you never started a thread in the equipment section

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/search.php?searchid=1509772

you have posted a dozen times in the racquet section

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/search.php?searchid=1509783

and a few times in the stringing section

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/search.php?searchid=1509781

Given your history I am not surprised by your position.

Gimmick
01-13-2008, 04:43 PM
I think the gap in specs between the two racquets is going to determine how much it affects your outcome.

(I kept it brief because my posts keep disappearing???)

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 04:51 PM
I think I clarified in my post that the string would need to be within the tension recommendations on the racquet.
We are talking about gauge and type which IMO are even more important than tension. I agree tension does not matter as much I can play well between 40-60

If I give you a very dense frame with all 15g Kevlar or 15g POLY at 70lbs you will habituate in a few days to it and beat your closest competitor:confused:

If you can then all the power to you mate, either you are clueless to gear or we are going to have a NEW US hopeful, but you are 24

WBF
01-13-2008, 04:56 PM
Michael, I've been stringing my own racquets for around 10 years. I've been stringing other players racquets for the same amount of time. I strung for my Dad's club team (good players), I strung for my highschool team, and I strung a little during college, although they had very poorly maintained stringer, so I avoided it as often as possible. And I had... other things to do! I've used a dropweight for a few years, but mostly a crank (ektelon model H). While I am not nearly as experienced as all of you, I am far from new to stringing.

I enjoy using the equipment I like but... Sometimes the vehement positions taken here remind me of this study ( http://scienceblogs.com/cortex/2007/11/the_subjectivity_of_wine.php )

Serve n' Volley
01-13-2008, 04:59 PM
If I give you a very dense frame with all 15g Kevlar or 15g POLY at 70lbs you will habituate in a few days to it and beat your closest competitor:confused:



I don't think 70's in the recommended tension range on that many racquets. :-|

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 05:01 PM
Michael, I've been stringing my own racquets for around 10 years. I've been stringing other players racquets for the same amount of time. I strung for my Dad's club team (good players), I strung for my highschool team, and I strung a little during college, although they had very poorly maintained stringer, so I avoided it as often as possible. And I had... other things to do! I've used a dropweight for a few years, but mostly a crank (ektelon model H). While I am not nearly as experienced as all of you, I am far from new to stringing.

I enjoy using the equipment I like but... Sometimes the vehement positions taken here remind me of this study ( http://scienceblogs.com/cortex/2007/11/the_subjectivity_of_wine.php )


this thread tells me otherwise

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=173657

now you want to go out and buy a scale, it is getting addicting

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 05:02 PM
I don't think 70's in the recommended tension range on that many racquets. :-|

65.................

WBF
01-13-2008, 05:07 PM
this thread tells me otherwise

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=173657

now you want to go out and buy a scale, it is getting addicting

I have never said that I would *prefer* to play with equipment that I am not used to. I simply stated that I *could* play with equipment that I am not used to, and given practice, could attain the same results.

Obviously, I would prefer to play with what I am used to, vs. having to adjust my game.

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 05:26 PM
^^^^^^ why don't you play with the LM prestige? seriously what don't you like about it? It should do everything your N6.1 can.

Oh and I do like your serve BTW only you should invest in a ball hopper rather than a baggy :)

You know why your position is the way it is, it is because you are a young 24 year old, healthy and very fit, wait till your 40,

WBF
01-13-2008, 05:30 PM
Haha, yes, this may be a factor :p The reason I do not use the LM is because I prefer the n6.1. I think I could compete with close competitors using both, but one of them would require far more work (getting used to it, changing aspects of my game, not enjoying the feel, etc).

If I had a racquet that simply *sounded* crisp when hitting, but was literally the same in all other ways to a racquet which sounded muted, I would prefer the crisp sounding one. Would it change my game? No, I just wouldn't enjoy playing with it as much.

I live less than a 5 minute walk away from the courts; the canvas bag I use (was it a baggy in the video? or the canvas bag?) is more comfortable vs. thin metal over my shoulder!

Mick
01-13-2008, 05:46 PM
you two don't even think strings setup are important in a match so racquets should not even be a question, not surprising

1/ all my racquets have the same strings/tension.
2/ when I play opponents at my level, I would bring the racquets that I play my best with to the courts.
3/ when he beats me, I would congratulate him for playing a good match. I don't tell him: if i used a bigger headsize racquet or if I use a certain strings setup I could have won.

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 05:54 PM
Haha, yes, this may be a factor :p The reason I do not use the LM is because I prefer the n6.1. I think I could compete with close competitors using both, but one of them would require far more work (getting used to it, changing aspects of my game, not enjoying the feel, etc).

If I had a racquet that simply *sounded* crisp when hitting, but was literally the same in all other ways to a racquet which sounded muted, I would prefer the crisp sounding one. Would it change my game? No, I just wouldn't enjoy playing with it as much.

You think you can compete with close competitors but can you win, have you tried it? picture you went to a tourny and all three of your n6.1 broke, your buddy gave you an LM prestige a frame you know so no need to have few weeks with it, would you win a very close match?

As for sound, now you are making sense to me. Sound is one of the most important element in my game. How a frame sounds and how a string sounds builds up my confidence, especially the "thumping" sounds of PC600 and PT630. If a frame or string sounds metallic with a high pitch or a frame the sound very HOLLOW, it will affect my game to some degree, many here will agree to that.

Try hitting with your ears plugged, and you will know the importance of sound is a game. I ounce lost to a 4.5 that I usually kill, why because we played near a highway were all you hear were cars driving by, I could not even hear a single any shot. It was not only distracting but annoying.

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 05:57 PM
1/ all my racquets have the same strings/tension.


stop, all your racquets have the same string and tension, and you voted string/tension should not matter, please who do you think we are? why do you even have the same string and tension in all your frames?

Mick
01-13-2008, 05:59 PM
I don't even want to think about my frame when playing. That said, if I am comfortable with my selection, then it is important. If it does not feel comfortable, I will be too conscious of it, and will probably tighten up during points.

I am with you. I never think about my racquet when I play. I would only think about where I would place the ball and how much pace I should use.

WBF
01-13-2008, 05:59 PM
You think you can compete with close competitors but can you win, have you tried it? picture you went to a tourny and all three of your n6.1 broke, your buddy gave you an LM prestige a frame you know so no need to have few weeks with it, would you win a very close match?


I might lose. I might win. The racquet could certainly be to blame in this case; as I pointed out before, I would need time, and a good amount of it, to get used to the racquet.

Mick
01-13-2008, 06:05 PM
stop, all your racquets have the same string and tension, and you voted string/tension should not matter, please who do you think we are? why do you even have the same string and tension in all your frames?

when I get my racquets strung, I would ask them to string the racquets at the mid point of recommended tensions. But the string tensions would loosen the more you play, so I have played with 60 lbs tension and a bit less and the change doesn't affect my level of play.

I know it would affect the level of play for professionals because they are playing against world class players but I don't play against world class players.

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 06:11 PM
when I get my racquets strung, I would ask them to string the racquets at the mid point of recommended tensions. But the string tensions would loosen the more you play, so I have played with 60 lbs tension and a bit less and the change doesn't affect my level of play.

I know it would affect the level of play for professionals because they are playing against world class players but I don't play against world class players.
I agree with you on the tension, not sure your level of play but if you are below lets say 4.5 all this should not matter that much, but if you are competing like WBF at a high level, string selection would matter more than tension, but If I were to play indoors vs outdoors or on clay or other surfaces, or even many different types of players, string tension will become just as important

Mick
01-13-2008, 06:20 PM
I agree with you on the tension, not sure your level of play but if you are below lets say 4.5 all this should not matter that much, but if you are competing like WBF at a high level, string selection would matter more than tension, but If I were to play indoors vs outdoors or on clay or other surfaces, or even many different types of players, string tension will become just as important

we are in agreement :)

I visited roger federer website and a forum member was asking about the string tension on his racquets. He answered the same. Federer said he would pick which racquet to use depending on the surface, balls, and temperature.

______________
Q. Which string(s) you are using and which string tension are you playing with?
Federer: I play with half synthetic strings and the other half Wilson gut strings. The tension depends on the surface, the balls as well as the temperature and thus varies between 24 and 28 kg.

source: http://www.rogerfederer.com/en/fanzone/askroger/index.cfm?uCategoryID=3

Pro_Tour_630
01-13-2008, 06:32 PM
we are in agreement :)

Federer said he would pick which racquet to use depending on the surface, balls, and temperature.

______________
Q. Which string(s) you are using and which string tension are you playing with?
Federer: I play with half synthetic strings and the other half Wilson gut strings. The tension depends on the surface, the balls as well as the temperature and thus varies between 24 and 28 kg.

source: http://www.rogerfederer.com/en/fanzone/askroger/index.cfm?uCategoryID=3

Believe me not only Fed does this, there are more players that do this, some post here on this site. They know who they are. I am sensitive, some people are not that sensitive.

I think part of the reason is age, your body breaks down in time, ( my arm for that matter) and I tend to be very sensitive regarding frames and setups. I wish I were 25 and healthy maybe I would have voted differently :cry:

rabidcow
01-13-2008, 06:36 PM
ok, i voted without reading the thread but it is ridiculous to say that racquet selection doesn't have some effect. But I think in a close match as long as the racquet is say, a tweener/player's racquet I would care about a lot of stuff more than the racquet

Mick
01-13-2008, 06:43 PM
ok, i voted without reading the thread but it is ridiculous to say that racquet selection doesn't have some effect. But I think in a close match as long as the racquet is say, a tweener/player's racquet I would care about a lot of stuff more than the racquet

Yeah, but if you lost the match because you brought to the courts the racquets that you know you could not play your best with, you deserve to lose. Don't you agree ?

Alafter
01-13-2008, 06:59 PM
Gotta have the racquet you are used to in a match. Specifically, your racquet of choice. I can bet it wouldnt be uncommon for any player to be nervous not having his or her regular racquet and then having to play an opponent of the same skill level.

Of course, as a side note, if your choice of racquet sucked already to begin with, then that's another matter:lol:

McLovin
01-14-2008, 03:02 AM
I don't have a "favorite" racket. I have 4 sticks, all the same frame, all strung the same. I use one until the string breaks, then go to the bag & grab the next one.
If I break a string in the middle of a match, I have no worries about whether I grabbed the correct racket or not. They are all the same.

Pro_Tour_630
01-15-2008, 05:34 PM
IF I combine the two threads, the racquet and the string set up thread, there are 150 votes and it is safe to assume that the %80 of us feel that the combination of racquet and string is very important in the out come of a close match verses only %20 that think it is not important at all.

CAM178
01-15-2008, 05:47 PM
There have been pros (teaching) that I've run into who feel that you should be able to win with anything. That in and of itself is BS, to me. I always ask them 'Then why do you play with that racquet?' They always say the same thing: 'I play best with this racquet.' I rest my case.

drakulie
01-15-2008, 05:53 PM
^^Yup.

Simply said>> they feel safe and comfortable with their frame of choice/string of choice.

emerckx53
01-15-2008, 07:10 PM
you two don't even think strings setup are important in a match so racquets should not even be a question, not surprising

Easily the most ridiculous thread I have seen since I joined this forum......

Pro_Tour_630
01-15-2008, 08:01 PM
really? you did not even vote, care to tell us why?

BTW: Volkl sucks,

CAM178
01-15-2008, 08:08 PM
Easily the most ridiculous thread I have seen since I joined this forum......
Then you need to spread your wings a bit, and see some of the completely chromosome-lacking threads on this board. They are abundant. Things like 'spin-friendly frames', etc.

hopeless
01-15-2008, 08:32 PM
really? you did not even vote, care to tell us why?

BTW: Volkl sucks,

This poll seems to have only 2 extremes to vote on

If we vote on the second choice, it seems to imply that one can play just as well with just about anything, be it a super granny stick or a heavy wooden stick, which i think is impossible. Surely using such extremes, or even changing between such extremes, will affect the outcome of a close match

If we vote on the first choice, it seems to imply that the racket that one is currently using is important in determining the outcome of a close match. Whereas in reality, racket choice is the often the last thing on one's mind in a close game. As long as a racket is fairly suitable for a player, it is probably not the key factor in deciding a close game

If you have something in between the 2 extremes to vote on, this poll would make more sense. As it currently is, I cant vote on this thread as neither choice represents my view.

Mick
01-15-2008, 08:43 PM
I vote for the 2nd choice because my feeling is if I lose the match with the racquet that I am playing, I doubt that changing to another racquet would help me win the match. Therefore racquets don't matter. It's the guy across the net that matters.

hopeless
01-15-2008, 09:39 PM
IF I combine the two threads, the racquet and the string set up thread, there are 150 votes and it is safe to assume that the %80 of us feel that the combination of racquet and string is very important in the out come of a close match verses only %20 that think it is not important at all.

sorry but the poll was biased towards option 1 in the first place

so the percentages are skewed and/or the conclusions are not representative of what the poll was actually about.. it would be more accurate to say that 20% think that they can play equally well with just about any racket and any string setup

ChuDat
01-15-2008, 09:55 PM
Using my racquet is very important because it takes me time to get use to a new racquet.

0d1n
01-15-2008, 11:56 PM
sorry but the poll was biased towards option 1 in the first place

so the percentages are skewed and/or the conclusions are not representative of what the poll was actually about.. it would be more accurate to say that 20% think that they can play equally well with just about any racket and any string setup

Not only that, but the OP is quoting and attacking the posters who voted for the option that he doesn't believe is true, and is starting to dig up older posts from those guys in order to belittle whatever opinion they have because they may have been wrong in the past or may have posted some nonsense in the past.
I respect the OP and his reviews and I also believe that the racket is sufficiently important to determine the outcome of a match if the 2 players are EXTREMELY close to each other in their level of tennis and physical shape, but he seems to have a problem with people who disagree with his opinions, and anybody that thinks he holds the "absolute truth" should not really be posting on a forum, because the whole point of a forum is to have discussions (sometimes contradictory discussions) with regards to different subjects.
Just my two pence worth...

hopeless
01-16-2008, 05:34 AM
sorry but the poll was biased towards option 1 in the first place

so the percentages are skewed and/or the conclusions are not representative of what the poll was actually about.. it would be more accurate to say that 20% think that they can play equally well with just about any racket and any string setup

yup Od1n .. i also missed out commenting that it would be more accurate to say that %80 of us feel that the combination of racket and string is at least vaguely important in the outcome of a close match
as compared to saying that 80% feel that the combination of racquet and string is very important in the out come of a close match

Alafter
01-16-2008, 06:05 AM
Pffff those ppl arguing, just admit you got baited. He's pulling an obvious poll like this plus the way he words things--he can't be proven wrong, or biased, or anything. Suckers.

atomicx
01-16-2008, 06:31 AM
Ask me after the match. If I won then it wasn't important at all, but if I lost then it was definitely all because of the strange racquet. :)

Alafter
01-16-2008, 07:30 AM
Ask me after the match. If I won then it wasn't important at all, but if I lost then it was definitely all because of the strange racquet. :)

Gasp you fiend! You hypercritical bastage!

Pro_Tour_630
01-16-2008, 08:46 AM
Pffff those ppl arguing, just admit you got baited. He's pulling an obvious poll like this plus the way he words things--he can't be proven wrong, or biased, or anything. Suckers.

nice:twisted:

WBF
01-16-2008, 08:51 AM
... EXTREMELY close ...

Perhaps this is why I don't feel it is important. I don't know anyone who I'm extremely close to, in scores or ability. I either get beat soundly, or win soundly (occasionally with close looking scores, but the matches themselves aren't close). In the matches I have played, I doubt using an inoptimal racquet which I had become accustomed to would have made a difference.

In the end, you can't really prove it either way. I agree that racquets can be important, but I think you (Michael) might be underestimating the ability of the body and mind to adapt to changes. Given an athletic person with good fundamental knowledge of the game and fitness, any racquet can be a powerful weapon, they would simply change their game to fit the racquet... Much in the same way that a skilled player changes their game based on opponents.

Pro_Tour_630
01-16-2008, 08:53 AM
sorry but the poll was biased towards option 1 in the first place

so the percentages are skewed and/or the conclusions are not representative of what the poll was actually about.. it would be more accurate to say that 20% think that they can play equally well with just about any racket and any string setup

next time you start a poll, or any thread for that matter:-|

Pro_Tour_630
01-16-2008, 09:04 AM
I don't know anyone who I'm extremely close to, in scores or ability. I either get beat soundly, or win soundly (occasionally with close looking scores, but the matches themselves aren't close). In the matches I have played, I doubt using an inoptimal racquet which I had become accustomed to would have made a difference.

In the end, you can't really prove it either way. I agree that racquets can be important, but I think you (Michael) might be underestimating the ability of the body and mind to adapt to changes. Given an athletic person with good fundamental knowledge of the game and fitness, any racquet can be a powerful weapon, they would simply change their game to fit the racquet... Much in the same way that a skilled player changes their game based on opponents.

I am sorry if none of us are as physically and mentally tough as you and can adapt to anything, where you whould either lose 6-0 or win 6-0

Like I said if I ever play you I am busting out your LM prestige .

NoBadMojo
01-16-2008, 09:09 AM
I think this poll would possibly indicate something if it were actually 2 polls.

Same question

First poll directed at beginners up to <but not including> 4.5;s

Second poll directed at 4.5's and up

you see a lot of 3.5's and such seriously searching for racquets to do things like hit heavy balls when they are hitting 1/2 the balls into the middle of the net or 5' long

i think it obvious the importance of the gear should be very dependent upon level of play. also there are many really good players who care less about their gear than many 3.5's

Pro_Tour_630
01-16-2008, 09:23 AM
I think this poll would possibly indicate something if it were actually 2 polls.

Same question

First poll directed at beginners up to <but not including> 4.5;s

Second poll directed at 4.5's and up

you see a lot of 3.5's and such seriously searching for racquets to do things like hit heavy balls when they are hitting 1/2 the balls into the middle of the net or 5' long

i think it obvious the importance of the gear should be very dependent upon level of play

I agree, start a poll and break it up the way you see fit

IMO polls with yes or no are simple. you are either pro abortion or against abortion, you are either pregnant or not.

when you get to a b c d e f all of the above none of the above, a and b c and d, it gets unnecessarily complicated

hopeless
01-16-2008, 04:19 PM
next time you start a poll, or any thread for that matter:-|

Im not interested in setting a poll for this matter, in fact I would have voted had the poll been less biased towards the 1st option (as i feel the 2nd option is quite impossible, as explained earlier in a previous post)

"IF I combine the two threads, the racquet and the string set up thread, there are 150 votes and it is safe to assume that the %80 of us feel that the combination of racquet and string is very important in the out come of a close match verses only %20 that think it is not important at all."

But I was commenting cuz you seemed to want to use this poll to draw conclusions which were pretty obviously false, if not inaccurate at least

It almost seems like you manipulated this poll to support something you had in mind beforehand... as opposed to being genuinely curious to find out what pple thought

As I had mentioned earlier.. despite the shortcomings of the poll... you also could have at least made the conclusion fit the question asked. ie. 80% think that racket and string are important in determining the outcome of a close match, and 20% think that racket and strings are not important at all in determining the outcome of a close match, that they can play with just about anything, be it big bubba or PS 85

Pro_Tour_630
01-16-2008, 09:49 PM
The conclusion of the poll is what it is, they are accurate, deal with it, racquets and strings matter in a close match, why I did this poll and how I did this poll is none of your business. The outcome speaks volume,

hopeless
01-16-2008, 10:57 PM
The conclusion of the poll is what it is, they are accurate, deal with it, racquets and strings matter in a close match, why I did this poll and how I did this poll is none of your business. The outcome speaks volume,

of course how you did the poll affects the outcome.. if you think how the poll is conducted does not affect the outcome then that speaks volumes about you

"Pffff those ppl arguing, just admit you got baited. He's pulling an obvious poll like this plus the way he words things--he can't be proven wrong, or biased, or anything. Suckers."

Alafter is right though, about the point where I got baited into arguing about this.. even though I didnt vote..

whatever, you win.. continue believing in whatever you want and making any conclusions you want if it makes you happy

thewallylama
01-18-2008, 06:01 AM
There's a saying: "A poor carpenter blames his tools. A good carpenter has good tools." Once I get my racquet/string setup to my liking, it becomes kind of extension of me. If that's off, it is kind of like trying to play with a sore wrist or a stiff back--it makes a difference. So the right racquet is a given, just like taking reasonable care of my body is a given.

WBF
01-18-2008, 08:01 AM
No, the only conclusion you can draw is that a racquet is important in determining the outcome of a close match for 75 of 96 members who are registered with tennis warehouse, vote in polls, and read your particular post in this particular subforum. Oh, and you have to note that this is their opinion, not fact. You cannot extrapolate this data either, given this specific, possibly biased subset, and the limited sample size. This ignores the fact that you introduced bias both with the phrasing of the question, and with phrasing the answers.
Do you see that there is a difference here?

It is important
It is not important at all, I can play with just about anything.

Note the italics. They introduce bias.

Please take a rudimentary course in statistics before attempting to create a poll or drawing conclusions from one.

Pro_Tour_630
01-18-2008, 08:15 AM
anyone see the nadal and simon first set match?

If gear in this case correct string tension is not important then I don't know what is.

simon was up 5/2 first set and had four set points,

Rafa goes over between points and changes racquets, looks to his coach and points to his strings shacks his head and says something.

after he changed frames, his shots were very different, they had more spin and were going deep, he was not missing, shots wre wicked and on fire. He came back and crushed simon 5/7 and the next two sets were history,


Not sure about the outcome of the match but i guarantee had Rafa did not change frames he would have lost without a doubt the first set. and I don't care what all of you think even if I am the only one in the world.

Pro_Tour_630
01-18-2008, 08:19 AM
of course how you did the poll affects the outcome.. if you think how the poll is conducted does not affect the outcome then that speaks volumes about you

"Pffff those ppl arguing, just admit you got baited. He's pulling an obvious poll like this plus the way he words things--he can't be proven wrong, or biased, or anything. Suckers."

Alafter is right though, about the point where I got baited into arguing about this.. even though I didnt vote..

whatever, you win.. continue believing in whatever you want and making any conclusions you want if it makes you happy

No, the only conclusion you can draw is that a racquet is important in determining the outcome of a close match for 75 of 96 members who are registered with tennis warehouse, vote in polls, and read your particular post in this particular subforum. Oh, and you have to note that this is their opinion, not fact. You cannot extrapolate this data either, given this specific, possibly biased subset, and the limited sample size. This ignores the fact that you introduced bias both with the phrasing of the question, and with phrasing the answers.
Do you see that there is a difference here?

It is important
It is not important at all, I can play with just about anything.

Note the italics. They introduce bias.

Please take a rudimentary course in statistics before attempting to create a poll or drawing conclusions from one.

polls are biased in nature, most polls are meant to sway people one way or another, show me a poll that is not. So to the both of yous, please give me the correct unbiased wording to the poll and I will resubmit it, until then...........go cry me a river

WBF
01-18-2008, 08:26 AM
Michael, you seem intent on drawing conclusions based on little if any valid data (remember the questions I asked in John C.'s thread? People who do those things have this tendency, that's why I asked them!).

Could it have been the frame? Maybe.

Could it have been Nadal in a rut tennis-wise, and changing his racquet for obsessive compulsive reasons (see: water bottle issues)?

Could it have been that Nadal *thought* his racquet was making the difference, switched, then started playing a different game to win, with the racquet playing no part?

You can't draw any conclusions from that instance.

I was losing 3-0 in my second round match at my last tournament. Instead of blaming the racquet, I buckled down, stopped playing the ineffective style (against him) I had been using, and switched tactics to attack his various weaknesses. I won the next 6 games. Had I been a superstitious person, perhaps I might have switched racquets, as well as changing the gameplan.

WBF
01-18-2008, 08:32 AM
polls are biased in nature, most polls are meant to sway people one way or another, show me a poll that is not. So to the both of yous, please give me the correct unbiased wording to the poll and I will resubmit it, until then...........go cry me a river

I think you watch a little too much mainstream news. Polls are *not* biased in nature, nor are they meant to sway people one way or another. Does this happen? Yes. Sometimes by accident, sometimes on purpose. By introducing bias, you invalidate the data. You cannot use it.

vB uses the term poll, for a function that is synonymous with a survey. Please read this ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statistical_survey ) for more information. Take a course in basic statistics for a better explanation.

Pro_Tour_630
01-18-2008, 08:38 AM
Michael, you seem intent on drawing conclusions based on little if any valid data (remember the questions I asked in John C.'s thread? People who do those things have this tendency, that's why I asked them!).

Could it have been the frame? Maybe.

Could it have been Nadal in a rut tennis-wise, and changing his racquet for obsessive compulsive reasons (see: water bottle issues)?

Could it have been that Nadal *thought* his racquet was making the difference, switched, then started playing a different game to win, with the racquet playing no part?

You can't draw any conclusions from that instance.

I was losing 3-0 in my second round match at my last tournament. Instead of blaming the racquet, I buckled down, stopped playing the ineffective style (against him) I had been using, and switched tactics to attack his various weaknesses. I won the next 6 games. Had I been a superstitious person, perhaps I might have switched racquets, as well as changing the gameplan.

obviously you have not seen the match, it was like night and day, like a light switch, he went over to his bag right in the middle of a game between points, pointed to his strings and shook his head in disgust and said something to his corner. And it was all over after that. Seriously it was that obvious, the strings mattered because the ball that was coming off his frame was absolutely different. I have a 50 inch liquid flat screen which I was glued too and was watching the match on high definition. The balls had tons of kick he was hitting deep, and was not missing, period. Poor simon he did not know what hit him, it was like getting hit by a freight train,

BTW your one experience is lame

Pro_Tour_630
01-18-2008, 08:43 AM
I think you watch a little too much mainstream news. Polls are *not* biased in nature, nor are they meant to sway people one way or another. Does this happen? Yes. Sometimes by accident, sometimes on purpose. By introducing bias, you invalidate the data. You cannot use it.

vB uses the term poll, for a function that is synonymous with a survey. Please read this ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statistical_survey ) for more information. Take a course in basic statistics for a better explanation.

polls/surveys are biased 70% of them are, do you see some that are not sure but many are, still waiting for your unbiased wording ?

Pro_Tour_630
01-18-2008, 08:59 AM
also another observation, there are more than a few who voted no, the racquet does not matter and I respect that since they voted that the string/tension mattered in the second poll. These people know more about gear than the people who voted no in both polls. IMO

10nisDude~
01-18-2008, 09:09 AM
well...i say it is important cuz its the racket that u feel comfortable with and can play with...just ask the pros...

Pro_Tour_630
01-18-2008, 09:26 AM
boy did I find the perfect unbiased poll, BTW I voted for the string

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=29771&highlight=important+racquet

this thread talks about the importance of string

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=126218&highlight=important+racquet

BTW do you think it will be biased if I call up Roman from RPNY and asked him the question?

ps60
01-18-2008, 09:33 AM
I don't know why, the best rackets are always in others' hands :)

i always bought the wrong or a poor rackets, esp. Prince. i borrow other's rackets and often find some easy ride.

Examples. are Volkl QV1, Prince Shark MP & OS (for double), PS60 95", Yonex MP2i..., even a Chinese brandname strung racket worth US$15 (if only it was tighter strung) .... Even a very old AK90 became an immediate Serve Monster. It's always that case, just like other's dish is always more delicious :evil:

tbini87
01-18-2008, 12:12 PM
if both people are using racquets they prefer, then the racquet has very little to do with determining the outcome. if someone gets handed a racquet they are not used to and have to play a match, then it COULD have an impact on the outcome of the match...

Mick
01-18-2008, 12:18 PM
if both people are using racquets they prefer, then the racquet has very little to do with determining the outcome. if someone gets handed a racquet they are not used to and have to play a match, then it COULD have an impact on the outcome of the match...

exactly !

and my thought is if you did not care to bring enough racquets to the court (in case your string breaks), you deserve to lose.

McGee
01-18-2008, 01:40 PM
if both people are using racquets they prefer, then the racquet has very little to do with determining the outcome. if someone gets handed a racquet they are not used to and have to play a match, then it COULD have an impact on the outcome of the match...

I agree.

However, It seems kind of lame to post a poll and then when people actually vote in the poll the OP lists the people that do not agree with him and insults their intelligence. Why bother?

retrowagen
01-18-2008, 03:39 PM
It seems kind of lame to post a poll and then when people actually vote in the poll the OP lists the people that do not agree with him and insults their intelligence. Why bother?

That's what I'm asking myself now. The OP listed me among those not agreeing with him, and publicly called me a "glue sniffer" and suggested I be banned from the forum (if only because my point of view on this issue differs from his). Nice, eh?

If he made a mistake in insulting me thus, I'd hope he'd make it right by publicly apologizing and try in the future to be careful about what he writes.

And FWIW (I know, probably not much), here is a recent and very true story from my experience:

Last month, I was playing a practice match against a local 5.0-rated player. I won the first set in a close tiebreaker, and we drew even on serve, 4-4 in the second. Up to the match for a few months I had been playing primarily with the Fischer Pro Classic 98 (a few of them identically matched in weight, balance, grip, string type and tension, etc.), and was through this match. However, some of my friends on the sidelines dared me to bring out an old racket I had brought to the courts to show them that day, and actually play with it. So at 4-4 in the second, I did: an old Wilson T-2000, with a crumbly old leather grip two sizes larger than what I prefer, and ancient, loose, cheap-o nylon strings. I began by receiving serve with it, and immediately thumped the first two balls into the net - compared to the Fischer, it felt awful, AWFUL!! but on the next serve, I returned decently and got into a rally, giving me more of a feel for the racket on groundies. The game went on to deuce, and then break point, and then I broke serve. Then on to serve it out with the T-2k, which felt as though I was hitting the ball with a heavy piece of plastic planking. I held serve and won the set.

Pro_Tour_630
01-19-2008, 06:05 AM
behold the glue sniffers, me thinks they should be banned from the equipment section

That's what I'm asking myself now. The OP listed me among those not agreeing with him, and publicly called me a "glue sniffer" and suggested I be banned from the forum (if only because my point of view on this issue differs from his). Nice, eh?

If he made a mistake in insulting me thus, I'd hope he'd make it right by publicly apologizing and try in the future to be careful about what he writes.

I can't believe what I am reading, in reference to glue sniffer, it is a joke and you all know it. If it bothered you THAT much then I apologize. You are taking this out of content, banned from the forum??!?!?!I suggested why post in the equipment section since it does not matter? few of the people that have voted NO, have rarely posted in the equipment section and I understand why, equipment/gear means nothing to them, they are mainly involved with fitness, teaching etc.......

Pro_Tour_630
01-19-2008, 06:20 AM
I agree.

However, It seems kind of lame to post a poll and then when people actually vote in the poll the OP lists the people that do not agree with him and insults their intelligence. Why bother?
it seems you have issues with transparency.

Behtareen
03-05-2008, 07:27 PM
a good player can play his game with any racket. most rackets make very minor differences

jasonchu
03-05-2008, 10:09 PM
a good player can play his game with any racket. most rackets make very minor differences

i disagree. just like a race car driver has to make modifications due to track conditions and tire wear, a player and many pros must have different racquets that can help them address court conditions, string tension loss, and the competition's style.

in the end a racquet that suits the situation (e.g. different tension, or different string) can make the difference...

nascar cars are supposed to be stock, but any driver will tell you every car really is different. i feel my racquets despite customization/rebalancing each play just a little different.