PDA

View Full Version : C9 - Back to the Future!


Rabbit
05-13-2008, 05:32 PM
I played with one of my newly acquired C9's tonight. The first thing I noticed was that it felt just like a C10, maybe not as flexy and maybe lighter. The second thing I noticed was that I was getting a ton of racket head speed and consequently a ton of action on the ball.

I began to swing harder on a vertical plane as my confidence increased. The balls began to break in a more pronounced fashion in the air. It was a Catch-22, but a good one. The guy I was hitting with said my balls had more bite and more pace.

The C9 is about 20 grams lighter than the C10. I guess it's 20 grams lighter in the right spots, this one hit like a dream.

I'm going to play a few more times with it, but if the trend continues, I may be setting the dials back to the C9.

couch
05-13-2008, 08:02 PM
It's amazing what additional racquet head speed can do for you. It's always about trade-offs with racquet head speed and the weight/balance of a racquet. Finding the perfect balance between the two is the key.

So what's the weight of the C9's? Are they about 11.5 oz. strung?

Chauvalito
05-13-2008, 08:22 PM
I played with one of my newly acquired C9's tonight. The first thing I noticed was that it felt just like a C10, maybe not as flexy and maybe lighter. The second thing I noticed was that I was getting a ton of racket head speed and consequently a ton of action on the ball.

I began to swing harder on a vertical plane as my confidence increased. The balls began to break in a more pronounced fashion in the air. It was a Catch-22, but a good one. The guy I was hitting with said my balls had more bite and more pace.

The C9 is about 20 grams lighter than the C10. I guess it's 20 grams lighter in the right spots, this one hit like a dream.

I'm going to play a few more times with it, but if the trend continues, I may be setting the dials back to the C9.

After months of waiting I got my brand new C7's from Japan...and I have not gone back to anything else since.

I will post a review at some point, but the racket is hitting very well, and quite solid.

I made the mistake of stringing it with WC Scorpion at 57 pounds. with the dense pattern it was initially very boardy, the strings are settling in now and it feels like an old friend again.

I now have 3 in total, 2 new, and one from my high school playing days.

Chauvalito
05-13-2008, 08:28 PM
It's amazing what additional racquet head speed can do for you. It's always about trade-offs with racquet head speed and the weight/balance of a racquet. Finding the perfect balance between the two is the key.

So what's the weight of the C9's? Are they about 11.5 oz. strung?

I think 11.5 is about right. I remember hitting with the C9 a long long time ago. I would like to give it another play one of these days.

I have said it many times and I will say it again. The Volkl Classic series was golden. You had everything you ever wanted in a players racket available.

C10 Pro tour - 93 inch 16x19 (heavy and flexy)

C10 Pro - 98, 16x19 (Heavy and Flexy)

C10 Pro extended - 98, 16x19, 27.6, lighter than the c10

C9 Pro - 98, 16x19 - as mentioned by rabbit, basically a lighter C10

C9 Pro extended - same as above with another .6 inches

C8 Pro - 98, 18x20 - around 11 oz (I think), with big grommets for more power

C7 Pro (personal favorite) - 98, 12 oz, 18x20 - Very much a sleeper racket

C7 Comp - 93, 12 oz, 18x20...I have not had the pleasure of hitting with this racket but I hope to someday.

There were various iterations in between including extended length versions.

sargeinaz
05-13-2008, 11:56 PM
I think 11.5 is about right. I remember hitting with the C9 a long long time ago. I would like to give it another play one of these days.

I have said it many times and I will say it again. The Volkl Classic series was golden. You had everything you ever wanted in a players racket available.

C10 Pro tour - 93 inch 16x19 (heavy and flexy)

C10 Pro - 98, 16x19 (Heavy and Flexy)

C10 Pro extended - 98, 16x19, 27.6, lighter than the c10

C9 Pro - 98, 16x19 - as mentioned by rabbit, basically a lighter C10

C9 Pro extended - same as above with another .6 inches

C8 Pro - 98, 18x20 - around 11 oz (I think), with big grommets for more power

C7 Pro (personal favorite) - 98, 12 oz, 18x20 - Very much a sleeper racket

C7 Comp - 93, 12 oz, 18x20...I have not had the pleasure of hitting with this racket but I hope to someday.

There were various iterations in between including extended length versions.

Wow that honestly sounds like the perfect line up of rackets. It's a shame they are discontinued and so hard to find now.
________
Iolite Vs Volcano (http://vaporizers.net)

!Tym
05-14-2008, 12:36 AM
Wow that honestly sounds like the perfect line up of rackets. It's a shame they are discontinued and so hard to find now.

Well, not for everyone. To me, the C7 Pro stunk. It's like it tries to be PT280, but fails miserably. Well, I wouldn't say miserably, but it just lacks the solid, beefy, THUNK of a PT280.

The C9 Pro SEEMS like it's the greatest thing since sliced Wonder Bread...until you use it side-by-side with a Yonex RD-7 and realize the difference. Suddenly, you feel like you're playing with an orange toothpick, an orange creamsicle, I don't know, anything but heavy.

The C10 Pro is more solid feeling, but doesn't have the same touch-sensitive, orange creamiscle feel of the C9...not quite. The C10 Pro is twang-sensitive, but dull to me. Everything just has the kind more rounded off feel to it, I can't quite put my finger on it, while the C9 is soft yet gives you a crisper, sharper, sensation without losing any of the smoothness.

The C10 Pro Tour is the REAL gem of this bunch. But beforewarned, ONLY in normal grip sizes. With the L1 grip pallet, it plays like an entirely different racket. Just not enough handle material, and it suddenly loses its solid feeling response. I wish I could get the four C10 Pro Tour I used to use back, because now that I custom mold my own handles with a much denser material, I can still use a small grip size for whippiness but WITHOUT losing all the feeling that handle material gives you.

Same goes for my old RD-8s. They played brilliantly until I got new New Tech handles molded onto them in a tiny L2 that barely covered the handle. Without enough handle material, the racket played like crip by comparison. Just lost all its feel, FELT like a different racket entirely, not necessarily played different.

nickb
05-14-2008, 01:34 AM
I used to have a C9 Pro...really great classic feeling racket but in a lighter package. I know what you mean about the racket head speed...I think ive just found my perfect SW / Weight with the K Blade.

Nick

baek57
05-14-2008, 01:36 AM
c8 98 is a 16x19 pattern and 2pts HL. feels like its low 11oz range. have one sitting right next to me.

Rabbit
05-14-2008, 02:40 AM
It's amazing what additional racquet head speed can do for you. It's always about trade-offs with racquet head speed and the weight/balance of a racquet. Finding the perfect balance between the two is the key.

So what's the weight of the C9's? Are they about 11.5 oz. strung?

Strung with leather & overgrip my C9 weighs 345 grams (12.2 ounces)

By comparison my C10 weighs 357 grams

couch
05-14-2008, 06:12 AM
Strung with leather & overgrip my C9 weighs 345 grams (12.2 ounces)

By comparison my C10 weighs 357 grams

Wow, didn't think they would be that heavy but like you said being able to generate some additional racquet head speed can make a big difference and looks like about .4 oz. might just be the ticket for you. :)

By the looks of your signature it appears you've already switched to the C9?

anirut
05-14-2008, 06:26 AM
Ummm ... C9 ... Should I sell mine? Or should I keep it?

I've sold off most of my rackets (including the 10VE mid & MW200G). The C9 didn't go (yet) as there was no offer for it.

I think I should hold on to it. At least it's not a very "common" stick ...

007
05-14-2008, 06:35 AM
I must disagree with TYM: IMO the C7 is a much more solid stick than the PT280 due its firmer overall flex and better 'plow thru' factor.

Rabbit
05-14-2008, 08:42 AM
Wow, didn't think they would be that heavy but like you said being able to generate some additional racquet head speed can make a big difference and looks like about .4 oz. might just be the ticket for you. :)

By the looks of your signature it appears you've already switched to the C9?

Yeah, I was surprised that around 15 grams would make that much difference. It's almost got me thinking it's all mental. But, I am going to check the balance as well. Maybe there's a significant difference there.

Well, I changed my signature after I strung one up. After hitting with it once, I am leaning very heavily toward switching. I'm probably going to hit again today and Friday, so I'll be more sure then. The up side is that there is absolutely no change in my swing for this frame. It feels like a trimmed down C10. I looked up the specs and it is a little stiffer, but not enough to say grace over.

Ummm ... C9 ... Should I sell mine? Or should I keep it?

I've sold off most of my rackets (including the 10VE mid & MW200G). The C9 didn't go (yet) as there was no offer for it.

I think I should hold on to it. At least it's not a very "common" stick ...

Where are you trying to sell it? That famous auction site?

I have said it many times and I will say it again. The Volkl Classic series was golden.

You go that right, I couldn't agree more. This is one of those special cases where they just shouldn't have messed with perfection. The whole line from top to bottom had quite a cadre of devotees.

Kevin T
05-14-2008, 09:37 AM
I played with one of my newly acquired C9's tonight. The first thing I noticed was that it felt just like a C10, maybe not as flexy and maybe lighter. The second thing I noticed was that I was getting a ton of racket head speed and consequently a ton of action on the ball.

I began to swing harder on a vertical plane as my confidence increased. The balls began to break in a more pronounced fashion in the air. It was a Catch-22, but a good one. The guy I was hitting with said my balls had more bite and more pace.

The C9 is about 20 grams lighter than the C10. I guess it's 20 grams lighter in the right spots, this one hit like a dream.

I'm going to play a few more times with it, but if the trend continues, I may be setting the dials back to the C9.


Rabbit, I keep telling you, it's all about the "batspeed"!! Get with the program! :)

Rabbit
05-14-2008, 09:42 AM
LMAO...thanks...my monitor has spots on it now.

NoBadMojo
05-14-2008, 01:23 PM
c8 98 is a 16x19 pattern and 2pts HL. feels like its low 11oz range. have one sitting right next to me.

c8 Pro has 18 mains. sounds like you have a c8 (comp 8). think folks are talking about the pro series

i agree..the c pro series was a great series back in the day.

wouldnt touch a used one pre Pure Fibre...those fatigued quickly and all of these frames are low powered to begin with

NoBadMojo
05-14-2008, 01:39 PM
It's amazing what additional racquet head speed can do for you. It's always about trade-offs with racquet head speed and the weight/balance of a racquet. Finding the perfect balance between the two is the key.

So what's the weight of the C9's? Are they about 11.5 oz. strung?

really good point couch. batspeed is your friend, and i think people should know the swingweight range that works best for them...sure makes racquet selection a lot easier if they do.

danix
05-14-2008, 04:37 PM
The C9 was a great frame, but NBMJ has a point about the age of the frames. Also, like the Tour 9 that followed it, I felt the C9 got pushed around a bit during heavy hitting, which is why I upgraded to the C10 at the time.

Rabbit
05-14-2008, 05:37 PM
The C9 was a great frame, but NBMJ has a point about the age of the frames. Also, like the Tour 9 that followed it, I felt the C9 got pushed around a bit during heavy hitting, which is why I upgraded to the C10 at the time.

I don't know that I agree with either point. I was as of very recently playing with a fish scale C10 from 1998, an intermediate model from 2000, and a brand new one I had ordered (I ordered 4 bumblebees). There wasn't a dime's difference between the 3 I had in rotation. When I bought my black ones, I sold the 4 brand new ones I had to a board member leaving me the '98 and '00 models.

I never had a problem with stability with the C9. The C10 is more stable, no question, but the C9 is plenty stable. And, the ones I'm swinging are only 20 grams off the C10s I played. I find that I'm a little further out in front with the C9, have faster racket head speed, and am able to maneuver the head more. IMO, this more than makes up for the extra 20 grams in the C10.

The downside to this is, of course, that my arm is working a little harder. But so far, no problem at all. The results I'm seeing pretty much outweigh any extra work my arm is doing. I like the C9s and am pretty surprised that I've gone full circle in 10 years. I hope the honeymoon never ends...

danix
05-14-2008, 05:56 PM
Graphite fibers do degrade. A new old-stock frame is probably fine, but a frame that has been strung 100 times will feel different than one which has been strung once.

I'm not saying the C9 is bad, don't get me wrong. I still keep a C9 (well, CX9) in Europe for when I'm visiting family :)

couch
05-14-2008, 06:38 PM
really good point couch. batspeed is your friend, and i think people should know the swingweight range that works best for them...sure makes racquet selection a lot easier if they do.

On a side note I think I just switched back to my Tour 8's. LOL Those things are just an extension of my arm and my results and execution can't be questioned when using them. I need to just quit trying to find something different because I don't think anything is going to suit me as well as the 8's and I have plenty of them so that really doesn't matter. I just get bored and want to try other racquets about this time every year.

I played great with the Pure Storms inside but was having some difficulty with them on the dirt. I'm sure I could've gotten used to them but dang those 8's just feel too good. :) It's funny how you mentioned the different surfaces in an earlier post. LOL

louis netman
05-14-2008, 11:28 PM
I've been coming back full circle to those orange meanies since they were introduced after my shoulder rehab. Comfort, great feel, and plenty of margin for modding. I have mine weighted to C10 w/leather specs, but slightly more HL...All graphite composition with a bit sharper feel than the C10 Pro makes for a pretty sweet frame...

Rabbit
05-15-2008, 05:43 AM
Graphite fibers do degrade. A new old-stock frame is probably fine, but a frame that has been strung 100 times will feel different than one which has been strung once.

No worries, I agree that rackets do 'limber' up with enough restringings. The fish scale that I have has been strung I know over 100 times in 10 years. That said, on court in a match, its performance was on par with newer frames that I also have. I'm a 4.5 and probably not good enough to feel a racket going dead or hit hard enough to cause a racket to go dead though. Also, the frames I have are brand new and have never been strung.

But, then again, there are those who prefer a used feeling. Ivan Lendl used to give his frames to friends to play with prior to him using on the tour. Bruguera reportedly used rackets only after they had been strung 50+ times.


I'm not saying the C9 is bad, don't get me wrong. I still keep a C9 (well, CX9) in Europe for when I'm visiting family :)

If I could quote Doc Hollidae from Tombstone

"Now I really hate him"

:)


I've been coming back full circle to those orange meanies since they were introduced after my shoulder rehab. Comfort, great feel, and plenty of margin for modding. I have mine weighted to C10 w/leather specs, but slightly more HL...All graphite composition with a bit sharper feel than the C10 Pro makes for a pretty sweet frame...

It would appear that I've made the same circle for a different reason. With the C9, I find that I am more able to really go out after my returns. It is truly amazing the difference 20 grams makes even to my level, but playing the other night, I found that I was able to really go out after service returns and hit them with a lot more topspin. The balls were dropping inside the service box which was right where they needed to be as my opponent was coming in. Off the ground, the extra racket head speed also gave me more confidence to swing out and as many have said, spin is control.


Update
I strung up two more yesterday as we have a big deal coming up this weekend. I had to grip the other two, so I regripped the first one. I regripped the first one because the Fairway, which came off a C10, I was using came up a bit short.

Unpaid promotion
I purchased some of the TW leather grips (6) for this express purpose. They are as good as any grips I've ever seen, really better than most because they include an adhesive strip on the back which precludes you from having to fool with double sided tape.

The grips I bought were the wide/thin version 25mmx1300mmx1.3mm. The reason I bought these was the pallets on the C10 felt bigger than those of old. And I figured they'd reduce the size of the feel a bit. But, they wound up on 3 C9's instead. They are $7.95 and worth every dime. They are good looking and have a good tack to them. I highly recommend them to anyone purchasing leather grips. They make good sense and are as good as, dare I say it, a Fairway costing 5X as much.

Return to regularly scheduled program
After regripping all 3 C9s, I weighed them again. I found them to be 1 gram off, at 337, 338, and 339 grams. Now, this weight is without an overgrip which explains the difference from my previous listing. I don't know if there's anything to be read into the weight difference and the age of the frames, but there it is.

NoBadMojo
05-15-2008, 05:57 AM
On a side note I think I just switched back to my Tour 8's. LOL Those things are just an extension of my arm and my results and execution can't be questioned when using them. I need to just quit trying to find something different because I don't think anything is going to suit me as well as the 8's and I have plenty of them so that really doesn't matter. I just get bored and want to try other racquets about this time every year.

I played great with the Pure Storms inside but was having some difficulty with them on the dirt. I'm sure I could've gotten used to them but dang those 8's just feel too good. :) It's funny how you mentioned the different surfaces in an earlier post. LOL

we knew you would go back couch ;) it's fun to try a new racquet...you may even get a surprise by hitting something you normally wouldnt hit.

what was the deal on the dirt w. the Storms? ball was fast but not piercing enough? sweetzone too small?

as for me, i think i am past the honeymoon stage w. the 11Mids. i've got everything dialed in to the best of my ability now after 3 months

max
05-15-2008, 09:42 AM
I'm in the Louis Netman/Rabbit camp with the weighting and adjusting of my C-9s.

They have leather grips, Fairways, and with the various doo-dads (tournagrip, grip band, vibration absorber, leather string pad bits, string), they weigh in at 349 grams. But nicely headlight, which greatly helps my service accuracy.

This is, all told, a nice setup for me. I have two C-9s in good condition; one that's on its way, slowly, out. The good news I tell myself here is that there are now lots of interesting companions in this racquet category.

b mathis
05-15-2008, 02:53 PM
yea ,my wife swings a c9 ,plays soft and friendly ,but my c10 93 ,98 frames
with leather grips ,vs 17 strings , weight in at 370 grams ,10 points headlite,
will hit such a heavy ball its scary ,the 93 sqin comp frames are even more
nasty , bulk up boys there may be a c10 pro across the net from you some day!!

Rabbit
05-16-2008, 04:57 AM
yea ,my wife swings a c9 ,plays soft and friendly ,but my c10 93 ,98 frames
with leather grips ,vs 17 strings , weight in at 370 grams ,10 points headlite,
will hit such a heavy ball its scary ,the 93 sqin comp frames are even more
nasty , bulk up boys there may be a c10 pro across the net from you some day!!

:shock:

Wooooooooooooo........I'm scart!

I played with the C10 for about ten years and have just gone back to the C9. I think if I played me the me with the C9 would probably win easily.

I put the C9s on the balance board this morning. They are way more evenly balanced than the C10 coming in at 4 points head light. I wonder if the reduced weight and shifted balance have something to do with all of this...

ericsson
05-16-2008, 05:05 AM
Rabbit, i'm sure you will go back to your beloved C 10's, it's just a matter of time...;-)

b mathis
05-16-2008, 07:10 AM
you guys are the volkl masters , thanks for all you imput on these frames ,who
am I kidding thinking I can swing these heavy frames forever ,may take a c10
and shave down the bumper and put on a thin grip to test a lighter frame ??
anybody try this mod yet .

couch
05-16-2008, 07:32 AM
we knew you would go back couch ;) it's fun to try a new racquet...you may even get a surprise by hitting something you normally wouldnt hit.

what was the deal on the dirt w. the Storms? ball was fast but not piercing enough? sweetzone too small?


I had to work harder on the dirt and was having a little trouble finding the range on my shots. I was missing a lot of forehands for some reason and that's normally my best, most offensive shot. I know I could get used to them (and may even be better for me in the long-run) but going from fast indoor hard to slower outdoor clay is always a bit of a transition in the first few weeks even with racquets you're accustomed to.

I just didn't feel like wasting time with tensions, strings, etc. to find the right setup for the dirt when I had it all the time in the 8's. Oh well, makes me appreciate my 8's that much more. ;):)

NoBadMojo
05-16-2008, 07:51 AM
you guys are the volkl masters , thanks for all you imput on these frames ,who
am I kidding thinking I can swing these heavy frames forever ,may take a c10
and shave down the bumper and put on a thin grip to test a lighter frame ??
anybody try this mod yet .

i wouldnt recommend bumper surgery on this racquet. you would be taking an already seriously headlight racquet and making it gruesomely headlight and i think the racquet would play really poorly

NoBadMojo
05-16-2008, 07:55 AM
I had to work harder on the dirt and was having a little trouble finding the range on my shots. I was missing a lot of forehands for some reason and that's normally my best, most offensive shot. I know I could get used to them (and may even be better for me in the long-run) but going from fast indoor hard to slower outdoor clay is always a bit of a transition in the first few weeks even with racquets you're accustomed to.

I just didn't feel like wasting time with tensions, strings, etc. to find the right setup for the dirt when I had it all the time in the 8's. Oh well, makes me appreciate my 8's that much more. ;):)

understand..takes me as much as 3 months to fully adjust to a new racquet. some things come quickly, and the serve <for me> is the last to come....hitting my spots and such. i'm only a 5.0....wouldnt make much difference to a 3.5 as long as they are using something reasonable as their improvement can still be fairly rapid from a learning point of view...but a good player like you is a diff story....why spend all the time only to perhaps not get back to where you were before?

Rabbit
05-16-2008, 07:58 AM
you guys are the volkl masters , thanks for all you imput on these frames ,who
am I kidding thinking I can swing these heavy frames forever ,may take a c10
and shave down the bumper and put on a thin grip to test a lighter frame ??
anybody try this mod yet .

Yep, I pretty much am arriving at the same conclusion. Everybody, espeically on the boards, longs for a 'pro' spec frame, but I don't know that anyone can play effectively with one. For me, it was really amazing what a little tweaking of static weight and balance can do.

I had to work harder on the dirt and was having a little trouble finding the range on my shots. I was missing a lot of forehands for some reason and that's normally my best, most offensive shot. I know I could get used to them (and may even be better for me in the long-run) but going from fast indoor hard to slower outdoor clay is always a bit of a transition in the first few weeks even with racquets you're accustomed to.

I just didn't feel like wasting time with tensions, strings, etc. to find the right setup for the dirt when I had it all the time in the 8's. Oh well, makes me appreciate my 8's that much more. ;):)

The 8 you're talking about is the red/silver one? I reviewed that one for TW and really liked it, but the stiffness scared me off a little. I found that you could absolutely clobber the ball with it and put as much spin on it as you wanted.

couch
05-16-2008, 10:03 AM
The 8 you're talking about is the red/silver one? I reviewed that one for TW and really liked it, but the stiffness scared me off a little. I found that you could absolutely clobber the ball with it and put as much spin on it as you wanted.

You may be talking about the Tour 8 V-Engine. I believe that one was mostly red with a little silver at the V part of the throat. My Tour 8 is mostly black with some red at the top of the frame. They both have similar specs but I believe mine was slightly thinner beamed and maybe a little less powerful if I remember correctly.

I think the Tour 8's have a little more solid feel than the V-Engine 8's. The 8 series is somewhat stiff but I think it's a comfy hit though for the stiffness.

You can absolutely get some awesome spin with the Tour 8 and really work some serious angles. It's one of the best groundstroking racquets I've ever hit. It's funny how other guys who are used to heavier racquets will pick it up and comment on how much they like it. lol

Rabbit
05-16-2008, 10:07 AM
OK, I gotcha...that was the series after the C-series,right?

couch
05-16-2008, 10:24 AM
understand..takes me as much as 3 months to fully adjust to a new racquet. some things come quickly, and the serve <for me> is the last to come....hitting my spots and such. i'm only a 5.0....wouldnt make much difference to a 3.5 as long as they are using something reasonable as their improvement can still be fairly rapid from a learning point of view...but a good player like you is a diff story....why spend all the time only to perhaps not get back to where you were before?

Yep, you're exactly right; why spend all that time getting used to a new racquet that may or may not even get me to where I was before. Not like I was playing bad with the 8's, just always looking for something that might be better. At this stage though a racquet probably isn't going to help as much as other things since I'm pretty much in-tune with the 8's.

couch
05-16-2008, 10:28 AM
OK, I gotcha...that was the series after the C-series,right?

I believe so Rabbit. I think after the C-Series the Tour Series might have been one of the best offerings from Volkl. I used to see tons of people using those racquets about 5-6 years ago. Still see quite a few using the Tour 8's around my neck of the woods today.

danix
05-22-2008, 06:54 AM
Rabbit, my 2008 C10 demo from TW weighs in at 334.7g, less than any of your C9s. I wonder why?

Rabbit
05-22-2008, 07:09 AM
Really? That is a poser...

danix
05-22-2008, 11:33 AM
Poser? I don't quite follow. I know the scale is accurate.

I sent you an email about the C10 a few days ago but didn't hear back.