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kctennis1005
06-30-2008, 05:52 PM
im a rising senior and going to be playing college tennis. the schools im considering right now are georgetown, boston college, villanova, yale, harvard, and princeton. does anyone have any experience with the coaches from these teams or the players? i have been in contact with the coaches and they all seems like great guys. any other experiences with them or the team or the schools?

duso
06-30-2008, 06:22 PM
If Ivy take a look at Cornell. If not, it isn't a D1, but look at Denison in Ohio. Many CEO's have attended Denison. I recall the Wall Street Journal was very high on it as a school that educates many of our business leaders.

kctennis1005
06-30-2008, 06:56 PM
already looked at cornell.....too cold for me and too isolated from a big city. i want d1 too bc i wanna go to a school people have heard of. no offense but i have never heard of denison and i dont really think many people have.

duso
06-30-2008, 07:01 PM
Michael Eisner, former head of ,(CEO) of Disney. Do some research!

kctennis1005
06-30-2008, 07:18 PM
im not debating that its a good school im just saying i want to go to a school that is widely known and recognized, not a small liberal arts college in ohio.

chrisplchs
06-30-2008, 07:24 PM
I know most of the Ivy coaches and the staff at BC. BC is harder to get in to now since it joined the ACC. Those three Ivies you mentioned probably need to be the same level as BC.

goober
06-30-2008, 07:39 PM
A couple years ago our state champion went to Harvard. He had a national ranking (top 75 I think) and was also recruited by 4-5 other D1 schools including one Pac 10 school. He is in the starting line up but is like #5 I think.

kctennis1005
06-30-2008, 07:52 PM
I know most of the Ivy coaches and the staff at BC. BC is harder to get in to now since it joined the ACC. Those three Ivies you mentioned probably need to be the same level as BC.

ya the ivies might be a little bit harder to get onto the team than bc. the bc coach watched me play in the national opens this last weekend and i think i liked me but u can never tell. im 286 in the class of 09 right now so i think i might be able to play at bc but for the ivies it might be a little tougher. i am #1 in my high school class and have a 4.9 gpa so that might help. what do u know about the ivy coaches and bc staffs reputations/training regiments/recruiting/etc.?

TBanh12
07-01-2008, 11:55 AM
ya the ivies might be a little bit harder to get onto the team than bc. the bc coach watched me play in the national opens this last weekend and i think i liked me but u can never tell. im 286 in the class of 09 right now so i think i might be able to play at bc but for the ivies it might be a little tougher. i am #1 in my high school class and have a 4.9 gpa so that might help. what do u know about the ivy coaches and bc staffs reputations/training regiments/recruiting/etc.?

How do you have a 4.9? Does that mean you take all weighted classes? My gpa is 4.3 and I've only gotten 1 B+. (f'in Foods and Nutrition for crying out loud!!! I thought it was a blowoff class, but it wasn't. :shock:) Anyways, I think some of the top colleges look at you schedule rather than your gpa. I think you have a great shot at an Ivy school with your number 1 status.

I've taken 7 weighted classes so far and next year (SENIOR 09:twisted:) I'll take another 4.

kctennis1005
07-01-2008, 02:23 PM
ya ive taken all honors classes and then 4 aps last yr as a junior and then 5 more as a senior. everything else is honors. i had one regular class for pe and health. hopefully with my academics the coaches will help me get in.

duso
07-01-2008, 06:40 PM
This is reality, unless you are in the top 50, the coaches won't lift a finger for you. They can pick and choose. You compete against the world. Everyone and their brother that applies to an Ivy League school will match in about where you say you are. Location is important, especially if you live in an under represented area. If you are from the Northern Plains area, you'll get in. If you are from New England, Chicago area, or California. Good Luck! Of course you already know that. You aren't interested in Cornell, so scratch Dartmouth, (that is really isolated-I went there). You tell me?

chrisplchs
07-01-2008, 07:28 PM
ya the ivies might be a little bit harder to get onto the team than bc. the bc coach watched me play in the national opens this last weekend and i think i liked me but u can never tell. im 286 in the class of 09 right now so i think i might be able to play at bc but for the ivies it might be a little tougher. i am #1 in my high school class and have a 4.9 gpa so that might help. what do u know about the ivy coaches and bc staffs reputations/training regiments/recruiting/etc.?

college coaches don't really do much player development but rather just recruit and make sure you are in shape and such. at 286, BC might been even out of your reach for a recruited walk on spot. One of my friends was top 140 and he got almost nothing from D1 so he went D2 with some money thrown in. and some the posters are right: if you aren't top 50, all top programs won't do much for you. one

cncretecwbo
07-01-2008, 07:46 PM
im not debating that its a good school im just saying i want to go to a school that is widely known and recognized, not a small liberal arts college in ohio.

what makes you think a liberal arts college is below you?

kctennis1005
07-01-2008, 10:29 PM
what makes you think a liberal arts college is below you?

im not saying that a lac is below me...im just saying that it doesnt fit my personality. i am a big sports fan and small lacs dont have that scene. ive visited some and i dont really like the feel

duso
07-02-2008, 03:41 AM
im not saying that a lac is below me...im just saying that it doesnt fit my personality. i am a big sports fan and small lacs dont have that scene. ive visited some and i dont really like the feel

Why then not just go to Ohio State. Improve your game, and take your chances on making the team. They have everything you want.

kctennis1005
07-02-2008, 08:19 AM
Why then not just go to Ohio State. Improve your game, and take your chances on making the team. They have everything you want.

umm ohio state isnt exactly a highly respected academic institution. if u read before i have a 4.9 gpa and #1 in my class. thats why im looking for a blend of academics and athletics. so ohio state definitely does not have what i want.

dork2tennisstud
07-02-2008, 08:37 AM
If you're looking for good academic schools that also have D-1 athletics (and you seem to like the Northeast, based on the schools you listed), check out Bucknell, Lehigh, St. Joe's, Seton Hall, etc. If you're a girl, Syracuse (no men's team).

They don't get quite the name recognition as the Ivy's or Georgetown, but you don't have to be as insane a player to play there, the academics are very good, and you still get D-1 sports, including some damn good basketball.

kctennis1005
07-02-2008, 08:46 AM
ya i checked those out but i also want the name recognition. u dont really hear about those schools.

duso
07-02-2008, 09:19 AM
umm ohio state isnt exactly a highly respected academic institution. if u read before i have a 4.9 gpa and #1 in my class. thats why im looking for a blend of academics and athletics. so ohio state definitely does not have what i want.

Boy you are one gifted person. All the people in med. school at oSU will be glad to know that they are wasting their academic lives away. It seems tome that you have a a healthy (unhealthy) opinion of yourself. The United States has distinguished itself with grade inflation, and AP scholarship. Try the University of Michigan, an A is 4.00, no recognition of the increased 5.00 scale. Perhaps Northwestern is for you. Too bad that OSU only gets those who try academically. I guess that 62,000 students are doomed to work for people like you.

kctennis1005
07-02-2008, 09:44 AM
i wasnt unsulting the med school. the undergrad has a bit of a sports and party reputation rather than academic. its just not the atmosphere im looking for. i didnt mean to insult osu and if i did i apologize sincerely.

duso
07-02-2008, 10:38 AM
Let me see if I can help you out here. If you haven't been seriously recruited, we can pretty much drop that part of the equation. You probably won't get a return letter from any of the Big 10 schools, academic or non-academic ones. Northwestern isn't bad. Now a lesson in life, the school you attend doesn't matter. It doesn't get you a job or into a professional school. If you have a personality that makes a rat vomit, it won't matter. You'll have your degree from Columbia, and be working for someone from Palomar Junior College. Why? People like that person like that person. GPA isn't that big a deal anylonger. They are manipulated, and inflated. Good luck, but I think you need to see reality in more areas than just tennis.

cncretecwbo
07-02-2008, 03:31 PM
you get out of a college what you put into it. that being said schools like UVA have great academics, but unless they are coming to get you for tennis, it would be hard to get on the team.

BullDogTennis
07-02-2008, 04:44 PM
a school really is what you make it...if you go to harvard and want to party, i bet there are plenty of parties. if you go to OSU and dont want to party you wont. if you get into a big academic college you'd be the one to think your better than a senior or someoe and say you had a 4.9 GPA and you'll get knocked out. honestly GPA hardly even matters, if you get a high enough ACT/SAT score then you're gonna be well off...(with the exception of a select few)

kctennis1005
07-02-2008, 06:07 PM
ya i get what u guys are all saying at. i have high sat/act score too and good extra curriculars so academically wont be too much of a problem.

duso: u said i wont get looked at by any big 10 schools? the illinois head coach watched my match two weeks ago and was very interested bc i play aggresively and serve and volley.

duso
07-02-2008, 06:37 PM
Thats great. Go there then. I doubt it meets your standard for academics, so let the Northwestern and Michigan coaches know that you would be available to them. You are one gifted person.

kctennis1005
07-02-2008, 06:41 PM
illinois is a great school...my mom went there....but im not really interested in ******* big 10 schools...theyre too big for my taste. i like northwestern but they have a full roster. thanks for your help though

chrisplchs
07-02-2008, 07:55 PM
you need to prepare a tennis resume and possible video. i'm guessing you are a rising senior? usually coaches of the top programs are working on rising sophomores and some juniors. you are pretty behind in that if you haven't done so already. there are still places but unless you are a Klahn or Thacher, the top programs won't listen

kctennis1005
07-02-2008, 08:36 PM
ive already contatced them all since end of freshman year. no worries. already got the resume and have been sending them updates on my rankings and results and theyre very receptive. working on the video right now.

chrisplchs
07-02-2008, 10:10 PM
good, keep it up. btw.. why did you put 'nova and g'town in your list? those two stick out like sore thumbs

kctennis1005
07-02-2008, 10:21 PM
why do those two stick out like sore thumbs? georgetown is a really good school. practically an ivy level academics. villanova is a little lower academically but has a good business school and i really like the sense of community there. the coach there is really nice guy too.

chrisplchs
07-03-2008, 06:46 AM
why do those two stick out like sore thumbs? georgetown is a really good school. practically an ivy level academics. villanova is a little lower academically but has a good business school and i really like the sense of community there. the coach there is really nice guy too.

is georgetown in the top 20 even? i thought you were going to a school for name recognition and academic prestige

kctennis1005
07-03-2008, 07:00 AM
georgetown is actually more academically prestigious than boston college. and i want to major in international health and its program is top in the nation.

CaveMan
07-03-2008, 08:55 AM
i wasnt unsulting the med school. the undergrad has a bit of a sports and party reputation rather than academic. its just not the atmosphere im looking for. i didnt mean to insult osu and if i did i apologize sincerely.

socal community college.......its perfect for you.

Julieta
07-03-2008, 09:52 AM
Sheesh, the kid is being respectful, people need to chill. He just wants to find a school with good academics, name recognition but not too big. Hopefully he can find it.

I dont have any connections at the schools you've mentioned. I used to have a good Harvard connection but I lost touch with them. I do remember that the player loved Harvard - his dad played there too so it was a family tradition - and the coach is the same. The coach is pretty important too..but more so if you plan to play pros after college. If you want to play college tennis and then go on to graduate school the coach is not as important. I mean you don't want a jerk or anything but it doesn't matter as much if they are the kind of coach that can really help you with your tennis. Good luck and I hope you can find a school.

MIGHTY MANFRED THE WONDER
07-03-2008, 09:53 AM
^ K.C.
This is tough, and turning down one school or another, one suggestion or another is getting you in a unintended jam....

Lets just look at facts, based on your rough requirements-
Maybe 150 scholarships on the table (in tennis) per year- per class at schools that meet your "Ideal" academics- 10,000 prospects. The coaches go 50 and "out" top 50 then reach for foreign players, period.

- NOW -
Understand when you are talking scholarship, at best 50%
For that you work 30 hours a week for the tennis team, not the school- and your coach sure as heck doesn't care how you do academically, at this "high" academic school, PERIOD. He is here to win or lose his job. How are you going to keep up these high academic ideals you want in your schooling at that rate?
Lets say you pull it off- school and tennis, many posters have said there is no time for anything else, should you be able to conquer these two priorities-
If you are really stuck to make that high price tag- you will be WORKING for the athletic department with ANY spare hours, so you will be going to football games- but taking tickets, or supervising the off-hours tennis courts and handing out loaner rackets.

"It takes a lot of green to go to Brown" the late Peter Boyle (RIP)

duso
07-03-2008, 12:02 PM
ya i get what u guys are all saying at. i have high sat/act score too and good extra curriculars so academically wont be too much of a problem.

duso: u said i wont get looked at by any big 10 schools? the illinois head coach watched my match two weeks ago and was very interested bc i play aggresively and serve and volley.

anyone can watch. Its a public world. Hs he called you in the last two weeks? That is probably your answer. You are a senior. He's not considering you. How about Rice?

Gus
07-03-2008, 12:51 PM
KC, are you hoping for a scholarship or is that secondary to getting into a good school? Is walking on to a team an option if you get admitted into the school that you want? I suggest keeping all options on the table. Scholarships are limited in number and are usually just partial. Pick the school that's best for you and your family (they will be paying for it). If tennis works out then great- if not, then "oh well." At this point you probably realize that you're not going to be a professional tennis player, so the only pro career you should be thinking about is the one you'll major in in college.

Playing on a college team will certainly enhance the college experience but you don't necessarily need a scholarship to do that. PS- why the allure of the east? Save your parents some coin and go for UCLA or Berkely.

Julieta
07-03-2008, 01:06 PM
Save your parents some coin and go for UCLA or Berkely.

Those were my two dream schools but I wasn't good enough to play for them. Sniff.

duso
07-03-2008, 05:54 PM
KC, are you hoping for a scholarship or is that secondary to getting into a good school? Is walking on to a team an option if you get admitted into the school that you want? I suggest keeping all options on the table. Scholarships are limited in number and are usually just partial. Pick the school that's best for you and your family (they will be paying for it). If tennis works out then great- if not, then "oh well." At this point you probably realize that you're not going to be a professional tennis player, so the only pro career you should be thinking about is the one you'll major in in college.

Playing on a college team will certainly enhance the college experience but you don't necessarily need a scholarship to do that. PS- why the allure of the east? Save your parents some coin and go for UCLA or Berkely.
KC, I think this is what many of us have tried to tell you. The world of "Big Time" college tennis isn't what you think it is. Obviously some of us have been there. If you aren't in the top six, you really are on the outside. That is the truth. The coaches have a job, and that is to win. Every year they look for one or two players to come in and make an impact. Great players get ground up. We all had dreams, and we all have memories. Your education is most important. I said it once, the school really doesn't matter. Look at Cal-Berkley, UCLA, if $ isn't a problem USC. Enjoy tennis, its a game for a lifetime. But don't get hung up on the name of the school. Its really meaningless!

kctennis1005
07-03-2008, 06:03 PM
im not really looking for a scholarship. im actually in the running for an academic scholarship at villanova or boston college. at harvard/princeton/yale i just want to be able to be guaranteed a roster spot....no grants at all. hopefully they will be able to write a letter of recommendation and that will help me through the admissions process. my doubles skills might help for that(i'm 6'5"). does anyone have experience with ivy recruiting?

as manfred mentioned about the intensity of scholarship tennis i dont really want to play on scholarship. academics is the 1st priority and tennis is secondary but i definitely want to play on the team. my family doesnt really have any financial concerns, but i dont want them to have to pay if possible so an academic at villanova or bc would be nice but going to harvard/yale/princeton would be hard to pass up.

chrisplchs
07-03-2008, 07:55 PM
I have friends on the teams at about half of the Ivies. All of them were phenomenal students to begin with and were top 200 B18s and top 100 G18s. Most of them got in on their own merit as the coaches really don't have much pull unless you're James Blake who helped fulfill a lot of quotas except for one guy who was top 25 B18s who probably could have gotten in on his own merit but wanted to get the process done with early.

Also if you want to play tennis, make sure that the coach says you have a roster spot. All coaches want their teams to have even numbers as it makes practicing easier.

kctennis1005
07-03-2008, 08:05 PM
thanks chris. ya im hoping to get in on my own but getting into ivies is kind of luck of the draw. that coaches recommendation letter really puts the applicant over the top so hopefully i can get that. do u know anything about the ivy coaches?

tguru
07-03-2008, 08:39 PM
You do know that the Ivies do not have Scholarships, right?

kctennis1005
07-03-2008, 08:49 PM
ya i dont want a scholarship. just want to get in and be on the roster.

verdasco67
07-03-2008, 10:12 PM
are you really ready for college tennis? i am a college tennis player myself and i have a friend in columbia playing on the team. its quite stressful. you have to deal with fitness training, traveling, missing classes. Then comes schoolwork. its quite a big responsibility. if you decide not to play at the college level you can always train outside of school and work with your own schedule.

best of luck!

kctennis1005
07-03-2008, 11:31 PM
ya i really want to play college. im pretty good at time management so i dont think schoolwork will be a problem. i love training and i love competing, but i especially love the team atmosphere. theres a great sense of community and i really want to be part of that in college.

Coach Carter
07-04-2008, 08:44 PM
As a college tennis coach...I gotta say you need to do some research. You need to go watch matches for schools of all sizes...even D3. The reason why...you may realize you have work to do still to make a team at any level. I am not saying it to be ugly, but I coach at a D3 and we play D1's every year and beat them badly. It's more about finding a school where you can get a great education and where the team is "like you". When I say that, I mean if you're aggressive then that's the kind of team you need to find. Would you want to play at a D1 where you get no scholarship and play 12 matches a year (losing 11 of them)...while not even traveling out of the state...where the players and coach don't even take it serious? Would you want to play at D3 where you get a nice academic or merit scholarship and play 28 matches a year...while traveling all over (including an 8 day spring break trip)...where all the players were highly ranked and are pushing to win a title? The tough decision is there to make. Are you more interested in your friends "thinking" you play somewhere big...when you may get a t-shirt and string some racquets for the "real players"...or do you really want to be a "difference maker" on a team? Look at rosters on the internet...research the players (jrs rankings)...see where you would probably be. If you haven't got some attention from a big school coach by the end of jr year, then it's all up hill. The other thing most kids or parents don't realize...a "fully funded" D1 men's team has 4.5 scholarships and a women's has 8...in D2 it's 4.5 and 6 respectively. That's not 4.5 new each year! Look at rosters and see how many foreign players are there. It's all about educating yourself and asking yourself how much you truly want to play college tennis. It can be a great experience...don't be a sheep...be a leader and do something amazing!!!

Coach Carter
07-04-2008, 08:47 PM
Oh yes and the biggest point to the scholarship numbers talk...very few schools are fully funded. I'd guess about 60% at the D1 level and less than 50% easily at the D2. Just FYI.

kctennis1005
07-04-2008, 08:52 PM
coach carter, where do u coach?

MLoutch
07-07-2008, 10:59 AM
He is at LeTourneau University in Longview, Texas - between Dallas and Shreveport, La (East Texas)
Very nice school that my daughter was looking at before she decided she wanted to play collage Lacrosse - his advise is dead on- I played D1 (wayyy back 1979 - 1983) at a top 15 program and trust me the work load at that level was huge - if anything the demands are even more now.

And to be honest looking at the schools on your list unless they are already looking at you and calling you (July 1 was the day coaches could start calling you once per week at the D1 level). your best shot would be heavy selling on your part and MAYBE a shot to walk on - At this stage coaches are already looking at 2010 on even 2011 grads and they pretty much now which 2009's they want from the US high school and Junior ranks..
factor in the International students and you should start getting the picture -
good luck

Gemini
07-07-2008, 01:19 PM
From my personal experience playing D1 tennis back in the 90's, Coach Carter's giving a lot of good advice. I was recruited by several schools in my senior year for tennis and did a lot of school visits in my junior/senior years but at the last minute decided to go to college on a swimming scholarship.

Once I got to college (I started in the Summer instead Fall like most 1st years), I had daily swim practices. By the time Fall came around, I was burned out on swimming and quit the team giving up my scholarship as well.

A family friend convinced me to talk to the men's tennis coach about joining the team. I spoke with him, played in a walk-on tournament and earned a spot on the team but because I was the low-man-on-the-totem pole I didn't see much match time and no scholarship money my first year. I moved up to the five spot my 2nd year and three spot by my third year which earned me a little money and a lot more playing time but it was pretty stressful in terms of juggling classes/labs, practices, mandatory study halls, physical training/therapy sessions, matches, travel, etc...

Most of the student-athletes at my university were Management majors because for lack of a better word the curriculum was "easy". I, on the other hand, had a double-major in Engineering. The key to survival for me was that I "gel-ed" really well with the other guys on the team so it made easier to stomach the fact that I was seeing so little playing time my first year and busting my butt in the classroom and on court without much to show for the latter initially.

meowmix
07-07-2008, 03:11 PM
Hey, this question doesn't have too much to do with this thread... but...

My friend is ranked 14th in the nation for doubles. He's a member of the class of 2010. He says that a friend of HIS got into Yale on a tennis scholarship and he was ranked something like 18th. He says that he really wants to follow in the footsteps of his friend. Do you think it's feasible?

BTW, he has a mixture of B's and A's, played 1st singles this year and last (as sophmore and freshman) for a schools that's about 4th in PA.

MLoutch
07-07-2008, 06:26 PM
One problem is that the Ivy league schools don't give athletic scholarships - now maybe he received academic help, But if he is ranked Top 20 Nationally in doubles and top 100 in singles he should be able to play at Yale - all you need to do is look over the current Yale roster and review the current player bio's.
That gives you an excellent idea of what kind of players the current coach is recruiting (and signing).

meowmix
07-07-2008, 06:48 PM
^^^ No athletic scholarship huh? Huh, don't know what he was talking about then...

I don't know his singles ranking, last I heard, I think it was 114 or something... I think he said he was 3 in the middle states (PA, DE, NJ)...

MLoutch
07-07-2008, 07:13 PM
Yale just signed two players - a kid from Western Florida and one from Norcal - last year they had a kid from New York, Utah and again Norcal.

As Tennis is a Non Revenue sport, coaches have very little pull with admissions (vs. football or basketball as example) in most programs. So the first goal is to be able to get into to the school first. Harsh reality is 3.7 GPA and good SAT / ACT scores most likely are not going to get you into Ivy league schools - or any Very Selective school for that matter (i.e. Rice, Stanford, Vandy, Northwestern, Emory...etc).

duso
07-08-2008, 06:17 AM
Yale just signed two players - a kid from Western Florida and one from Norcal - last year they had a kid from New York, Utah and again Norcal.

As Tennis is a Non Revenue sport, coaches have very little pull with admissions (vs. football or basketball as example) in most programs. So the first goal is to be able to get into to the school first. Harsh reality is 3.7 GPA and good SAT / ACT scores most likely are not going to get you into Ivy league schools - or any Very Selective school for that matter (i.e. Rice, Stanford, Vandy, Northwestern, Emory...etc).
This is very accurate. I think KC is like any kid, he's getting advice, but isn't hearing it. He has ideas, and sees himself in a place that he wants. Reality is always a good teacher. As a former Ivy player, Dartmouth early 70s. Ivy tennis is tough. Academics are what you make of them. This was my point with Ohio State. KC seemed to view himself as above OSU. Comments have been made that you can party you life away at an Ivy, Dartmouth certainly can hold its own there. Or you can study your life away. Life's map is a strange one. The "Illinois coach liked my aggressive style." How aggressively has he contacted to you to come to Illinois? The name of the college will never guarantee success, so many people are confused by this. Look at an entering class to Harvard law school, you'll see names of schools you didn't know exist. Look at admission to the lowest level law schools you'll see students that went to Harvard. Its the arrogance of how he sees things beneath him, and his inflated sense that his racket will take him far that entertains me. But as I said , he's a kid and needs to find out on his own. All things considered, I think he'd do well at a Drake, Boise State, and enjoy college.

kctennis1005
07-08-2008, 07:01 AM
1. why would i go to ohio state or boise state whose teams are better than the ivy teams? if u think im not good enough obviously i couldnt play at those schools

2. why would i have worked as hard as i have academically in high school to go to a state school that is not even in my state? normally people want some sort of reward for their hard work and going to ohio st or boise st would not be a reward for my work in the classroom.

i guess u just done understand. if all the valedictorians of the world went to state schools, who would be going to the top academic institutions? theres a reason the top schools are at the top. they get the highest caliber of students.

duso
07-08-2008, 07:05 AM
Drake is private. And so far as tennis Ohio State is beyond your reach.

Tuck in your ego.

kctennis1005
07-08-2008, 07:17 AM
i think i just said ohio state is beyond my reach. thats one of many reasons i wouldnt want to go there. u have no idea of any of my academic achievements so i would stop judging me and saying i should go to these second-rate schools where YOU think i would be "happy". thats not your place since you dont even know me.

Julieta
07-08-2008, 07:52 AM
Drake is private. And so far as tennis Ohio State is beyond your reach.

Tuck in your ego.

Does Drake even consider Americans anymore?! One of their seniors was born in 1983.

Okay I just looked and they do have two...

goober
07-08-2008, 08:04 AM
i think i just said ohio state is beyond my reach. thats one of many reasons i wouldnt want to go there. u have no idea of any of my academic achievements so i would stop judging me and saying i should go to these second-rate schools where YOU think i would be "happy". thats not your place since you dont even know me.

Dude- you already know where you want to apply. There is no point in arguing about it over the internet. You don't come off very well doing so. There are only a handful of elite academic schools that also have D1 tennis. Schools like Duke and Stanford you are not good enough to play at. Ivy league schools your main concern is getting in first, then worry about making the team. Your ranking is not high enough for the coaches to make a big push to get you in.

Since you are hung up on brand name schools- villanova, BC and georgetown are good schools but they are not elite in the academic sense.

andfor
07-08-2008, 08:09 AM
i think i just said ohio state is beyond my reach. thats one of many reasons i wouldnt want to go there. u have no idea of any of my academic achievements so i would stop judging me and saying i should go to these second-rate schools where YOU think i would be "happy". thats not your place since you dont even know me.

The way I see it and I've read the entire thread is you have 3 choices.

1. Use your academic achievements to your best advantage and go to the best school ever. Whatever that school is in your mind, only you know what it is (probably IVY). Then maybe try to walk on that team. You may not make the team at all.

2. Play college tennis at the best academic school that allows you to best leverage your HS resume and junior tennis resume. Where that is I am not sure. You're a little picky. You could then go to grad school afterwards at the BIG U of your choice.

3. Settle on a lower D1 school academically or excellent D3 school that needs you on their tennis roster. You could still get a big academic scholarship to pay for school. Could talking with D1 coaches about leveraging your grades for academic scholarship purposes allow him to free up scholarship money for another player? Being viewed as a team player in this regard may bring more attention to you as a tennis prospect. You could then go to grad school afterwards at the BIG U of your choice.

I've talked about this very problem a lot here. You're predicament regarding playing college tennis and going to the BIG U at the same time is not unique to you alone. Many juniors get very good at tennis, they also happen to be good students. They want to play in college but have some overriding mentality that if they don't go to the BIG U they will never get a job after college. This is patently false. Problem is only a small percentage of tennis junior U.S. and worldwide play at the best (top 50) D1 schools anyway.

Good luck. If your heart says play college tennis, do it. You only have a small window of opportunity to do so. What a person makes of college and ultimately life is up to the individual, not the school they attended.

JLyon
07-08-2008, 08:51 AM
Andfor:
Actually makes a good point as to why there are so few American players on "lower" D1 schools. The coaches have the scholarships but to many American Juniors have a spoiled mentality that they do have to go to State U.
Easy examples: Univ. of Texas or UT-Arlington?
University of TN or TN-Martin, TN Tech, East TN State, Murray State, Memphis, etc...
So many schools go foreign because good American players have an elitist spoiled brat attitude, while the foreign players are just as smart and talented and want to go to college to play and get a degree, regardless of the namesake.

andfor
07-08-2008, 09:17 AM
Andfor:
Actually makes a good point as to why there are so few American players on "lower" D1 schools. The coaches have the scholarships but to many American Juniors have a spoiled mentality that they do have to go to State U.
Easy examples: Univ. of Texas or UT-Arlington?
University of TN or TN-Martin, TN Tech, East TN State, Murray State, Memphis, etc...
So many schools go foreign because good American players have an elitist spoiled brat attitude, while the foreign players are just as smart and talented and want to go to college to play and get a degree, regardless of the namesake.

Not to get into a tennis college with good academic naming contest but there are many to consider. Samford has excellent academics, D1 tennis and is located very close to a large city, Birmingham, AL. Good weather and academics what more could a smart tennis kid ask for? Tulane, very good academics, is restarting their program in New Orleans after shutting it down for a few years after Katrina. Seattle U., D1 just started a program, not sure about academics but it can't be bad. Heck they both probably need players at this point. Belmont U. and Lipscomb U. have a OK rep for academics and are both in Nashville and yes they are D1. Good D3 tennis schools in big cities include, Rhodes, Memphis, TN (only 1 kid from Memphis on their team, no forigners), Washington U., St. Louis, Emory, ATL. There's so many more for the open minded.

alb1
07-08-2008, 09:46 AM
im not really looking for a scholarship. im actually in the running for an academic scholarship at villanova or boston college. at harvard/princeton/yale i just want to be able to be guaranteed a roster spot....no grants at all. hopefully they will be able to write a letter of recommendation and that will help me through the admissions process. my doubles skills might help for that(i'm 6'5"). does anyone have experience with ivy recruiting?

as manfred mentioned about the intensity of scholarship tennis i dont really want to play on scholarship. academics is the 1st priority and tennis is secondary but i definitely want to play on the team. my family doesnt really have any financial concerns, but i dont want them to have to pay if possible so an academic at villanova or bc would be nice but going to harvard/yale/princeton would be hard to pass up.

I don't beleive a coach can "guarantee" you a top 6 roster spot at the large schools you're interested in. Even if you walk on and are on the bottom, the next years freshmen class may bump you down.

Coach Carter
07-08-2008, 10:33 AM
The way I see it and I've read the entire thread is you have 3 choices.

1. Use your academic achievements to your best advantage and go to the best school ever. Whatever that school is in your mind, only you know what it is (probably IVY). Then maybe try to walk on that team. You may not make the team at all.

2. Play college tennis at the best academic school that allows you to best leverage your HS resume and junior tennis resume. Where that is I am not sure. You're a little picky. You could then go to grad school afterwards at the BIG U of your choice.

3. Settle on a lower D1 school academically or excellent D3 school that needs you on their tennis roster. You could still get a big academic scholarship to pay for school. Could talking with D1 coaches about leveraging your grades for academic scholarship purposes allow him to free up scholarship money for another player? Being viewed as a team player in this regard may bring more attention to you as a tennis prospect. You could then go to grad school afterwards at the BIG U of your choice.

I've talked about this very problem a lot here. You're predicament regarding playing college tennis and going to the BIG U at the same time is not unique to you alone. Many juniors get very good at tennis, they also happen to be good students. They want to play in college but have some overriding mentality that if they don't go to the BIG U they will never get a job after college. This is patently false. Problem is only a small percentage of tennis junior U.S. and worldwide play at the best (top 50) D1 schools anyway.

Good luck. If your heart says play college tennis, do it. You only have a small window of opportunity to do so. What a person makes of college and ultimately life is up to the individual, not the school they attended.

Very well said...you have a great opportunity BECAUSE you have set yourself up wisely academically. Let me make sure I capitalize, so I don't get my degree taken away on a forum. :) Because you have made great grades, you can go nearly anywhere and get a terrific academic scholarship...forget the worries about a tennis scholarship. If you want to go to an Ivy League school then work to get in...that's the key. Many of those schools do have very good tennis teams. You may not make that team...if I knew your name I could do some research and possibly give you more feedback (and honesty). Another poster was dead on that a state school doesn't necessarily mean poor academics. LeTourneau University is a top engineering school in the US...I am also led to believe that Texas A&M (a state school) has a very well respected engineering program. As you are getting ready to graduate from either...I believe that you will be sought out by top engineering firms for jobs.

What I want to say is that I wish more players looked for their "place to shine", both athletically, spiritually, and/or academically. If you have taken care of your business in the classroom then you hold the cards to your life and athletic career...99% of coaches want good students...ones they don't have to worry so much about. Find a great school that meets your needs and go there...don't worry what others say or think...it's you that has to live the life and live with choices. I know I have regrets...I'd love to save many of you from the same.

Again, college tennis (athletics) is an amazing experience...give yourself a real chance.

Coach Carter
07-08-2008, 10:42 AM
I don't beleive a coach can "guarantee" you a top 6 roster spot at the large schools you're interested in. Even if you walk on and are on the bottom, the next years freshmen class may bump you down.

Absolutely not...I have a young man right now that's dad wants guarantees from me (at a D3). As a coach, unless the #1 superchamp in Texas commits to us and deposits (which I'd feel real good about saying he'd make it) :) then my standard statement is, "It's all in your hands. If you take off the rest of the summer and get fat and happy while the rest of my kids are busting it. Then you are taking a real chance. I will keep you because I recruited you, but it may be a sadder, tougher year, not actually being as big a part of the team as you would have liked. You need to play as often as you can against the toughest players you can. You need to play the ITA's in July...so you know what to expect competition wise, and so you have an early chance to meet your teammates. And last but not least, you need to do my offseason workout plan or do something hard to push yourself to be ready physically for what's coming this fall. This is competition, there are no promises aside from that you'll be given every opportunity to succeed and get what you desire." That's about it...simple in Coach Carter terms (in other words a book). :)

Coach Carter
07-08-2008, 10:50 AM
Yale just signed two players - a kid from Western Florida and one from Norcal - last year they had a kid from New York, Utah and again Norcal.

As Tennis is a Non Revenue sport, coaches have very little pull with admissions (vs. football or basketball as example) in most programs. So the first goal is to be able to get into to the school first. Harsh reality is 3.7 GPA and good SAT / ACT scores most likely are not going to get you into Ivy league schools - or any Very Selective school for that matter (i.e. Rice, Stanford, Vandy, Northwestern, Emory...etc).

MLoutch, thank you for the kind words and the great advise you are sharing from a former players point of view. I'd love to have some Zina kids, or any Houston kids. We have done well in the past couple years down there. This will be Britney Cleveland's second year with us...from Zina Garrison. Her uncle is Otis Sadler (from Longhorn player and a great friend of mine from juniors). She played real well for us as a freshmen last year! Team AJ has provided some help too, but like has been said there are many expectations with some...and decisions get made to go bigger places...some for great reasons, but many times for the incorrect. I'd love to talk to you guys again.

rockbox
07-08-2008, 10:55 AM
There is definitely no guarantees of a roster spot of you're not top 50. You have to remember that not only do you have to compete with all the other kids in the country, you have to compete against foreign players for a spot also. One of my friends was top 10 in Texas and couldn't get any looks at any D1 school. He went to Texas and could have walked on but decided not to. I would recommend just focusing on getting into a school you want to go to and try to walk on. If your game is up to it, you may get a scholarship afterward.

D1 sports is very difficult to excel at while still focusing on academics. We're talking 4 hours of practice everyday plus travel for matches. Its very difficult to maintain your grades and have any resemblance of a normal life. My nephew, who only missed one question on his SAT's and AP'ed out almost 45 hours of classes, couldn't handle marching band while maintaining good grades in engineering school at Texas.

Coach Carter
07-08-2008, 11:05 AM
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/12/sports/12lifestyles.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/10/sports/10scholarships.html?_r=1&ref=sports&oref=slogin

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/11/sports/11coaches.html?ref=sports

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/12/sports/12envy.html

http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2008/03/11/sports/20080311_COACHES_GRAPHIC.html

These can open eyes if you read and understand these things totally.

Coach Carter
07-08-2008, 11:07 AM
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/12/sports/12lifestyles.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/10/sports/10scholarships.html?_r=1&ref=sports&oref=slogin

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/11/sports/11coaches.html?ref=sports

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/12/sports/12envy.html

http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2008/03/11/sports/20080311_COACHES_GRAPHIC.html

These can open eyes if you read and understand these things totally.

Sign up for the free membership so you can read these...it's worth it. I could copy and paste if you need me to. You can open the last link without.

Coach Carter
07-08-2008, 11:13 AM
The Scholarship Divide
It’s Not an Adventure, It’s a Job
By BILL PENNINGTON
A few months into her first year at Villanova, Stephanie Campbell was despondent.

As a high school senior in New Jersey, she had been thrilled to receive a $19,000 athletic scholarship to play field hockey at Villanova University, a select, private institution outside Philadelphia. But she had not counted on the 7 a.m. start of every class day, something required so she could be in the locker room by noon to prepare for a four-hour shift of afternoon practices and weight-lifting sessions. Travel to games forced her to miss exams and classes. There were also mandatory team meetings, study halls and weekend practices.

She was overwhelmed.

“Plus, her roommate had a typical college student’s social life, while Stephanie was in her room on weekend nights trying to sleep because she had a game the next day,” her mother, Kathleen Campbell, said last month. “She came home crying.”

So Kathleen Campbell sat her daughter down, waited for a break in the sobs and said: “Villanova costs more than $40,000 a year to attend. They’re paying you $19,000 to play field hockey. At your age, there is no one out there anywhere who is going to pay you that kind of money to do anything. And that’s how you have to look at this: It’s a job, but it’s a great job.”

Campbell, 22, kept at it all four years, serving as a team captain last fall while majoring in marketing. She is expected to graduate this spring.

“I’m missing the sport terribly already,” she said last month. “But it was a ton of work. Receiving an athletic scholarship is a wonderful thing, but most of us only know what we’re getting, not what we’re getting into.”

Dozens of scholarship athletes at N.C.A.A. Division I institutions said in interviews that they had underestimated how taxing and hectic their lives would be playing college sports. They also said others share a common misperception that athletes lead a privileged existence.

“You know, maybe if you’re a scholarship football player at Oklahoma, everything is taken care of for you,” Tim Poydenis, a scholarship baseball player at Villanova, said. “But most of us are nonrevenue-sport athletes who have to do our own fund-raising just to pay for basics like sweat pants and batting gloves. We miss all these classes, which obviously doesn’t help us or make our professors happy. We give up almost all our free time. Our social life is stripped bare.

“Friday happy hour or spring break? Forget it. I haven’t had a spring break since I was a sophomore in high school.”

The athletes were interviewed over several weeks from a cross section of sports at two representative Division I institutions, Villanova, a charter member of the Big East Conference, and the University of Delaware, a state-run institution that is a member of the Colonial Athletic Association. None of the athletes asked for or expected sympathy. They know there are many overscheduled college students who devote extra hours to academic and extracurricular activities or part-time jobs and internships.

“We love what we do, and it is worth it,” Poydenis said. “But everybody thinks every college athlete is on a pampered full ride. The truth is a lot of us are getting $4,000 and working our butts off for it.”

The life of the scholarship athlete is so arduous that coaches and athletes said it was not unusual for as many as 15 percent of those receiving athletic aid to quit sports and turn down the scholarship money after a year or two.

“I came in with 10 recruited girls,” Stephanie Campbell said. “There are four of us left as seniors. Not everyone was on scholarship, but maybe half who left were getting money.”

Campbell said she had a teammate who wanted to be an engineer but that the classes and off-campus projects in that major clashed with field hockey practices and trips.

Katie Lee, a senior softball player at Delaware, said at least one scholarship player had quit the team in each of her seasons. Of her former teammates, she said, “I see them around campus, and they look happy.”

Emily Schaknowski, a sophomore lacrosse player on athletic scholarship at Delaware, said 5 of the 12 women she entered with were no longer on the team. Most had relinquished their scholarships.

Joe Taylor, a junior soccer player at Villanova, said he was one of four left from a freshman recruiting class of 10.

“You wonder if you should try to talk them out of it,” Taylor said. “But for most of those guys, it probably is the best decision to walk away.”

At Villanova, Poydenis said he thought the defections resulted from the shock that set in after a youth sports culture ethos collided with the realities of college athletics.

“Kids who have worked their whole life trying to get a scholarship think the hard part is over when they get the college money,” he said. “They don’t know that it’s a whole new monster when you get here.”

His coach, Joe Godri, says he tries to warn ******** before they accept athletic aid. He tells them that being a Division I student-athlete is a full-time job. “It’s not even close to being a normal college student,” Godri said.

The Division I athletes interviewed indicated they devoted at least four hours a day to their sport, not counting the time it takes to play or to travel to games. Classes must be scheduled in the early morning to free the afternoon for practices and games. Practices often last from 4 to 6:30 p.m., although several athletes talked about how they had to arrive early for treatment of injuries or to have old injuries taped or harnessed. Highly competitive, demanding practices come next.

There is often a team dinner, perhaps a short meeting and a mandatory study hall in some cases. Weekday away games, which are common, can mean a bus ride that begins at 1 p.m. and a return trip that reaches campus at 10 p.m.

“You come back to your dorm room ready to crash,” Taylor said. “But you’ve got homework or maybe a test the next morning. The rest of the dorm is starting to get a little rowdy because those guys have all finished their homework. They might be getting ready to go out. A lot of them took a nap in the afternoon.”

College athletes routinely said there was one accouterment not often mentioned in recruiting trips but essential to the athlete’s equipment bag: ear plugs.

“They help you sleep on those nights when you have a game the next day,” Jamie Flynn, a junior soccer player at Delaware, said.

Many athletes tend to gather together in off-campus housing, so at least their apartment is quieter on the nights before games. Most teams have a rule prohibiting alcohol 48 hours before a game. The Villanova field hockey team, for example, pledges to not to drink alcohol for the entire season.

And the players police other teammates who might not be abiding by the rules about partying before games or practices. Jillian Loyden, a senior All-Big East goalie on Villanova’s soccer team, said it was usually first-year players who slipped up.

“They get to college and want to be normal college students on a Friday night,” said Loyden, who has raided parties to usher first-year teammates out of a building so they would head home to bed. “You have to make them understand that our team is not a social club.”

Athletes from the nonrevenue sports also customarily have to do extra work on campus to raise money to pay for equipment or apparel not normally financed by the athletic department, like warm-up jackets. Cortney Barry, a scholarship swimmer at Delaware, cut short her Thanksgiving Day break at home last year because the swim team had agreed to clean the garbage from the football stadium bleachers to pay for some expenses.

For this and other reasons, college athletes often refer to students who are nonathletes as “normals” or “regulars.” When asked why, Stephanie Campbell answered, “Because we’re not normal.”

“Look, we are fortunate to be athletes and to get tuition money to do it,” Campbell added. “I have loved my time here. I’m going to get a prestigious degree, and I know there are a lot of people who would have wanted to trade places with me. But I’d still say Division I athletics is not meant for everybody. Nobody tells you that.”

Campbell, who was an All-Big East selection in her final season, has gone back to her hometown, Gibbsboro in South Jersey, to help coach the club team she played for as a youngster.

“I worry about the kids I see now, because they’re under so much stress to get something out of field hockey,” she said. “You can never lose sight of why you play. Yes, I got a scholarship, but in the end, I put up with the sore muscles, lost sleep and everything else because I loved playing that much.”

These days, she is trying to make up for lost time on the business networking front, attending vocational seminars and fairs aimed at easing college graduates into the workplace. It is a new game for Campbell.

“Well, I’m graduating in May,” she said. “I need a job.”

MIGHTY MANFRED THE WONDER
07-08-2008, 11:41 AM
Coach Carter
I want to be the first to thank you for pulling these articles together for everyone on the board. I am hoping that FINALLY folks will pull their heads out (of the sand). These should be mandatory reading for EVERY tennis parent on this board.

These articles may help some (not too far already gone) to try and use some reasoning and some restraint with their children and tennis. Every article has supported your bottom line-
Find a school first, tennis second

Be a BIGGER fish in a (freindly, more agreeable) smaller pond- make an impact

A smaller school MAY even be able to get you more ($ help) with your grades, tennis and attitude- As these small schools know how to scramble

NOW the BIG issue, and it may never get tackled- The INDUSTRY of blowing smoke up people's skirts about helping chase an tennis scholarship. I can only wish that this series of highly informative and STRAIGHT OFF THE CUFF information could get to everyone on the JUNIORS section where it deserves it's own THREAD perminate reference, it's just that important.

andfor
07-08-2008, 12:37 PM
Coach Carter,

I want to be second to thank you for being here and contributing. Your first hand insight is a welcome relief to the second hand stories propogated about college tennis. I myself may be accused of some of that. I would like to see more U.S. tennis playing kids join the ranks of college tennis, at all the levels. To many pass it by never knowing what they missed.

More coaches should spend time here as you are. My guess and hope is you will find a great kid or two and many more giving youself this free exposure.

Go LeTourneau University Tennis! If you just happen to be in Memphis this coming week for the Girls 18 Clay Courts e-mail me from my profile.

Thanks again,

Andy

Coach Carter
07-08-2008, 01:26 PM
Coach Carter,

I want to be second to thank you for being here and contributing. Your first hand insight is a welcome relief to the second hand stories propogated about college tennis. I myself may be accused of some of that. I would like to see more U.S. tennis playing kids join the ranks of college tennis, at all the levels. To many pass it by never knowing what they missed.

More coaches should spend time here as you are. My guess and hope is you will find a great kid or two and many more giving youself this free exposure.

Go LeTourneau University Tennis! If you just happen to be in Memphis this coming week for the Girls 18 Clay Courts e-mail me from my profile.

Thanks again,

Andy

I wish I was going to be there. I have camps going (trying to grow the game around here) until Friday afternoon. I will be running up to the ITA in the Dallas area this weekend. Checking on my kids and doing a little recruiting. Feel free to shoot me an email anytime: dougcarter@letu.edu - I'm glad to help any kids (and parents) I can. I would love for it to help me snag a couple great kids, but if I help college tennis get better and help some kid increase his enjoyment in life with tennis, then I'm a happier person. If you hear of any players (guys or girls) looking for a great school and a fun, fiery, winning team and coach...then give them my email or office number (903)233-3729. They won't regret it!

Coach Carter
07-08-2008, 01:27 PM
I really do hope I am helping...and thank you for the kind words.

Pancho G
07-08-2008, 05:05 PM
Hey, KC Tennis, you are still a teenager, and you sound like you need some schooling in life. Here’s my view of things. You really come off like a braggart, talking about your GPA and SAT scores, and the financial means to go to any Ivy League School.

Academic achievement means little in life if you’re social IQ is weak. Yours is.

Additionally, if you’re so good at math and English, why the original question? Your odds of playing big time college tennis are slim and none at the schools you mentioned.

Your likability aside, you should pick the best academic school for you, without any regard for tennis, and go there. It doesn't mean you have to stop playing tennis, but you'll see in the future that the school you got your degree from is much more important than the school you played tennis at.

And about the harshness, you really need to step away from yourself and see how you sound. The size of your brain -- as well as your pecker, should be private. Humility equals likability. Bragging doesn't really get you any friends in life.

duso
07-08-2008, 07:06 PM
KC, if you want it all, then look at these schools, Army, Navy, Air Force Academy, or Coast Guard Academy. Great academics, good tennis. Future that recognizes, and rewards your achievement. They also look closely at leadership. Contact your Congressman, this may be the place!

marc
07-08-2008, 08:23 PM
When making a decision about college tennis, you really need to take a long look at the mirror and decide what sort of experience you want in college, both athletically and academically.
Do you want tennis to be a major part of your experience? Do you want to be pushed and really work hard on your game (I mean REALLY work) and become a better player? Do you want to compete in a major conference? Or do you want to continue playing tennis because its fun and you like it and you want to keep competing but its not a priority and you really want to get a great degree and focus on school? There are no "right" answers but everyone has the answer that is the best fit for them.
Once you figure this out, try to get an idea from coaches and players at the schools you are interested in as to what sorts of programs the schools that interest you have. I assure you that your experience at each of the schools you mention will be very different. Find out what a typical practice schedule for the week is like. Ask the coach if he does a lot of individuals. Ask the coach if there is a certain number of extras that he/she requires. Whats the conditioning schedule like? What are the facilities like? Are there indoor courts on campus? Is it a tennis-only facility? Does the administration support the program? Look at the team's schedule from the past few years. Is there a lot of travel? Do they play a tough schedule? Or an easy schedule? Is it appealing to you? Talk to the players. Do they respect the coach? Do they like the coach? HAS HE HELPED THEM GET BETTER? Does he respect their academics? Do they like the way practices are run?
College tennis is an incredible experience. Choosing a school is a very exciting time. KC if you would like detailed and specific information regarding the programs that you mentioned, find a way to get in touch with me... I think you need to be very careful who you listen to in a forum like this, it seems that there are only a couple of us who actually know first-hand what we are talking about...

Alex978
07-08-2008, 09:00 PM
hey kc, i can see you have the academic part down but with your ranking you might have some trouble getting onto a d1 team.
One school I think you should look at is Emory University. It's a really good school if you haven't heard about it and they are always one of the top D3 teams in the country. If you look at their recruiting class, they have a lot of players around your level.

tlimster
07-08-2008, 09:18 PM
I was regionally ranked (couldn't afford travel to nationals), went to Columbia for undergrad, and was invited to try out for the tennis team after the coach saw me hitting at the courts (Har Tru!), questioned my background, and sparred with me for a few minutes. The traveling varsity was determined by a round robin tournament, with the top guys getting byes. I ended up playing on the JV team freshman year. The other notable people on the JV team were: a walk-on SoCal ranked junior, a nationally ranked junior from Texas, a top regionally ranked player from Louisiana, a nationally ranked player from North Carolina, and a top player from the NY tri-state area. The tri-state and North Carolina player were recruited along with a third internationally ranked player from India who played in the U.S. Open 18s right before we started school. He was the only recruited freshman to make the team. The guy from Texas was recruited two years before then demoted. The player from Louisiana was recruited the year before then demoted. Actually, i'm not sure if either of those guys ever made the traveling team -- was afraid to ask since that was a sensitive question.

So, the only freshman to make the traveling team that year was the guy from India. We won ivies that year and the JV team went undefeated. The guy from NC took a whole year off, went to Bollettieri, came back and got cut again, then finally made the team as the final doubles guy two years later. Everyone else, including myself, just kind of dropped off and we played socially throughout our time.

Another kid I played with had your specs physically, he was top 150 nationally and top 1 regionally, and walked on playing all four years at Princeton.

My doubles partner went to Pomona and decided to play tennis as an afterthought (after he got in, our coach contacted Pomona's coach, who was psyched to hear that a top 5 sectional player was coming; our number 3 ranked player was 86 nationally; our number 1 at the time, Gambill, was near the top nationally), was a top player there, and I hear went to med school.

What is my point? If you want to go to an Ivy (or any other D1), whether you make the team or not will likely depend on who else is recruited and who else decides to go. There is no way you will be guaranteed a spot at a D1 with a top 300 ranking, IMO. You might be able play your way into a doubles spot since you're tall, though I think that's 40/60 (I would think that it would be just as hard if not harder to make the Ohio State team, btw).

If you want a guaranteed spot, go to a great academic D3 school -- which a lot of people have already said. I don't think you will sacrifice academics at all -- the experience is totally different, though at a smaller school.

Good luck, and happy hunting!

LPShanet
07-09-2008, 02:46 AM
im a rising senior and going to be playing college tennis. the schools im considering right now are georgetown, boston college, villanova, yale, harvard, and princeton. does anyone have any experience with the coaches from these teams or the players? i have been in contact with the coaches and they all seems like great guys. any other experiences with them or the team or the schools?

I know a few of the coaches in question, but before mentioning them, I think the first thing you need to ask yourself is what you're hoping to get out of your college choice and what your tennis plans are. Also, your list is a bit strange in that the schools don't really go together. For example, most people who can get into Harvard, Yale, Princeton, etc. wouldn't really consider Boston College, except as a "safe school". Similarly, someone who could start on Harvard's tennis team probably wouldn't bother with playing at Georgetown. Do you have an accurate idea of where you really stand academically and in terms of tennis? (Not just in your area/school, but with respect to your national competition.) A few things to consider:

1. If academics are more important, then obviously that will affect your choice. Villanova and Boston College aren't in the same league as the others in terms of academics. So if that's your priority, you will want to keep that in mind.

2. Also, you have to consider whether you'd rather be on a better tennis team, but not play much if at all (or risk not making the team), or whether you'd prefer to be an actual contributor to a lesser team. Again, the schools here are of vastly different levels. The top Ivy League teams will very likely not afford you much playing time (at best). Meanwhile, Georgetown, BC, etc. may give you a better shot at playing.

3. Whether or not you want a scholarship of some kind. The Ivys don't give athletic scholarships as a policy. However, if you're overqualified at some of the other schools, there might be some money in it, as you've noted. Also, if you're an academic standout, you might get some academic scholarship money from a place like Villanova or BC, as you've also dicsussed.

In the end, you should weigh the above factors and determine which are the priorities.

Now, on to the coaches:

Harvard: Dave Fish is one of the top coaches in all of college tennis. He knows a lot about the game and has coached several players who later became successful tour players. He's been there over 30 years! A class act.

Princeton: Glenn Michibata is a former ATP player, and a very nice guy. He knows the game very well, and can give good insight as he's played the game at the top level. I think he played his college tennis at Pepperdine, which had a long history of being a top NCAA team.

Yale: Alex Dorato isn't as experienced as someone like Fish, but he's been Yale's coach for 16 years, which is still a long time. He's well respected, and knowledgeable, though Yale's team is usually not quite of the level of the above two.

Others: Georgetown is a much less serious program than the Ivys. The coaching is fairly strong, but the level of play is more comparable to a top level Division 3 program. As a result, you'll spend less time practicing and tennis will take second place to studies. The academics are far more elite than at BC or Villanova. At those places, while the tennis teams aren't top level, they're more likely to afford you practice time. The coaching is decent at both, but not standout.

Hope this helps.

P.S. As others have mentioned, going to a Division 3 school with strong tennis and very strong academics is something you should definitely consider. Places like Johns Hopkins are light years ahead of BC, 'Nova, etc. in terms of academic prestige/fame, and have nationally ranked tennis teams that have both D1 and D3 opponents on their schedules.

kctennis1005
07-09-2008, 05:32 PM
I know a few of the coaches in question, but before mentioning them, I think the first thing you need to ask yourself is what you're hoping to get out of your college choice and what your tennis plans are. Also, your list is a bit strange in that the schools don't really go together. For example, most people who can get into Harvard, Yale, Princeton, etc. wouldn't really consider Boston College, except as a "safe school". Similarly, someone who could start on Harvard's tennis team probably wouldn't bother with playing at Georgetown. Do you have an accurate idea of where you really stand academically and in terms of tennis? (Not just in your area/school, but with respect to your national competition.) A few things to consider:

1. If academics are more important, then obviously that will affect your choice. Villanova and Boston College aren't in the same league as the others in terms of academics. So if that's your priority, you will want to keep that in mind.

2. Also, you have to consider whether you'd rather be on a better tennis team, but not play much if at all (or risk not making the team), or whether you'd prefer to be an actual contributor to a lesser team. Again, the schools here are of vastly different levels. The top Ivy League teams will very likely not afford you much playing time (at best). Meanwhile, Georgetown, BC, etc. may give you a better shot at playing.

3. Whether or not you want a scholarship of some kind. The Ivys don't give athletic scholarships as a policy. However, if you're overqualified at some of the other schools, there might be some money in it, as you've noted. Also, if you're an academic standout, you might get some academic scholarship money from a place like Villanova or BC, as you've also dicsussed.

In the end, you should weigh the above factors and determine which are the priorities.

Now, on to the coaches:

Harvard: Dave Fish is one of the top coaches in all of college tennis. He knows a lot about the game and has coached several players who later became successful tour players. He's been there over 30 years! A class act.

Princeton: Glenn Michibata is a former ATP player, and a very nice guy. He knows the game very well, and can give good insight as he's played the game at the top level. I think he played his college tennis at Pepperdine, which had a long history of being a top NCAA team.

Yale: Alex Dorato isn't as experienced as someone like Fish, but he's been Yale's coach for 16 years, which is still a long time. He's well respected, and knowledgeable, though Yale's team is usually not quite of the level of the above two.

Others: Georgetown is a much less serious program than the Ivys. The coaching is fairly strong, but the level of play is more comparable to a top level Division 3 program. As a result, you'll spend less time practicing and tennis will take second place to studies. The academics are far more elite than at BC or Villanova. At those places, while the tennis teams aren't top level, they're more likely to afford you practice time. The coaching is decent at both, but not standout.

Hope this helps.

P.S. As others have mentioned, going to a Division 3 school with strong tennis and very strong academics is something you should definitely consider. Places like Johns Hopkins are light years ahead of BC, 'Nova, etc. in terms of academic prestige/fame, and have nationally ranked tennis teams that have both D1 and D3 opponents on their schedules.

thanks for your help. this is really what i wanted out of this forum. i really appreciate your post

andfor
07-10-2008, 05:25 AM
thanks for your help. this is really what i wanted out of this forum. i really appreciate your post

What was it you liked about the post that had not already been said? Most of it was already covered 2 or 3 times. The only differnence other than the nice coaching bios was a mention to John Hopkins U.

kctennis1005
07-10-2008, 07:10 AM
nobody else went into the detail about the coaches and what they can offer

duso
07-10-2008, 09:51 AM
KC, I think everyone on the thread did their best to point out all of the same things. I think we also became frustrated, as you had a reluctance in seeing reality. I don't think anyone could have been more realistic about you tennis possibilities than 3/4 of those who responded. Then you would retreat into your academic gifts and hard work. We then tried to inform you that name, and rank of the school is meaningless, so if you would take the time to read the entire thread, you'd note that we chased you to the four corners of the globe. You have ordinary tennis credentials. You enter the world of D1 tennis, and you are below average. Academically, you have a profile that getting into most Ivy League schools will be a push. MIT, and the University of Chicago, would process your rejection within 10 days.

I'm glad you are now growing up. Look at Colgate, Williams both good choices.

kctennis1005
07-10-2008, 01:35 PM
KC, I think everyone on the thread did their best to point out all of the same things. I think we also became frustrated, as you had a reluctance in seeing reality. I don't think anyone could have been more realistic about you tennis possibilities than 3/4 of those who responded. Then you would retreat into your academic gifts and hard work. We then tried to inform you that name, and rank of the school is meaningless, so if you would take the time to read the entire thread, you'd note that we chased you to the four corners of the globe. You have ordinary tennis credentials. You enter the world of D1 tennis, and you are below average. Academically, you have a profile that getting into most Ivy League schools will be a push. MIT, and the University of Chicago, would process your rejection within 10 days.

I'm glad you are now growing up. Look at Colgate, Williams both good choices.

wow, u act like you know everything about me. why would i be an automatic rejection from mit and chicago? williams is the top(#1 ranked) liberal arts college in the nation. why would that be any easier to get into than the others? also, im pretty sure name and rank of school are not meaningless. u go to a job and say your from harvard vs. cal st long beach i think the harvard is going to get the job.

duso
07-10-2008, 03:43 PM
No Harvard won't get the job. The person will get the job. As I said look at the colleges represented in the entering Harvard Law class. Many get there w/o having gone to Harvard. I believe many of us have tried to tell you this.

kctennis1005
07-10-2008, 04:13 PM
1. u act like a degree from a state school is the same as one from an ivy. theyre not. ur right that the person gets the job, but a person who graduates from harvard is going to be much more prepared than the person from cal st long beach. just look at the past graduates from each and what they have done with their lives and its easy to see.

2. u didnt answer my question: why would i be an auto reject from mit or chicago? what do u actually know about my academics?

duso
07-10-2008, 05:29 PM
Life has taught me many lessons, and I have the wisdom of time. I am a graduate of Dartmouth. Under no circumstances is your school the one that gets you the job, or gets you ahead. The world is filled with people who thought that. Read How Starbucks Saved my Life. I played 3 on the varsity for three years. School is just a moment in your life. But you are way messed up in your thinking.

kctennis1005
07-10-2008, 08:44 PM
ok u went to dartmouth. why did u pick dartmouth over a state school? if not for the academics, it was because u felt that u "fit in" there. thats why i would go to the schools on my list. because when i visited they felt right.

onehandbh
07-11-2008, 03:21 AM
Just trying to think outside the court... One thing nobody
has mentioned yet is trying to get into Mensa.
To get a rough idea of whether or not you have a chance
(before going through with the testing), you can time yourself
for 30 minutes and take the practice test they have on their
website at mensa.org. If you get like 27-30 out of 30 then
you might consider taking the test b/c you might pass it.

To get an accurate assessment for yourself, don't take the
practice test multiple times. Just take it once and see how
you do. Many of the questions are SAT-ish like questions
and others involve logic and simple problem solving and does
not require any math beyond algebra so you really don't
need to prep or review anything before taking it.
Does it really measure IQ? That's debatable, but it is an internationally recognized organization.

andfor
07-11-2008, 08:22 AM
wow, u act like you know everything about me. why would i be an automatic rejection from mit and chicago? williams is the top(#1 ranked) liberal arts college in the nation. why would that be any easier to get into than the others? also, im pretty sure name and rank of school are not meaningless. u go to a job and say your from harvard vs. cal st long beach i think the harvard is going to get the job.

If your competition went Long Beach and so did the boss I'd bet the guy from Long Beach.

Come on KC, people now avg. about 3 years at a job. You're first job although important is not going to be the final determiner where you'll end up when you're 30, 40 50 and so on. Think bigger picture than that. There's plenty of losers from Harvard as there are from all sorts of schools. Get over the school snobbery. If you want to play tennis and academics are important find a school that does both we'll. There is a happy medium where you’re a fit for the school and the tennis team. It's out there, you have to look and make your own decisions, none of us can guess where that is for you.

kctennis1005
07-11-2008, 08:39 AM
If your competition went Long Beach and so did the boss I'd bet the guy from Long Beach.

Come on KC, people now avg. about 3 years at a job. You're first job although important is not going to be the final determiner where you'll end up when you're 30, 40 50 and so on. Think bigger picture than that. There's plenty of losers from Harvard as there are from all sorts of schools. Get over the school snobbery. If you want to play tennis and academics are important find a school that does both we'll. There is a happy medium where you’re a fit for the school and the tennis team. It's out there, you have to look and make your own decisions, none of us can guess where that is for you.

exactly my point. i found the schools where im a fit for the school when i visited. those are the ones on my list at the beginning of this thread. thats why i was asking about the coaches from the schools and the types of programs. only one or two posters actually replied with the info i wanted. every1 else started bashing

MIGHTY MANFRED THE WONDER
07-11-2008, 08:39 AM
Yeah, besides Business school at Long Beach ain't nothing to sneeze at.... The basketball stadium is pretty funny though-
The coeds along Alamitos Bay right now, Yeah, the Dirtbags are nothing to pass over quite so lightly.

andfor
07-11-2008, 04:35 PM
exactly my point. i found the schools where im a fit for the school when i visited. those are the ones on my list at the beginning of this thread. thats why i was asking about the coaches from the schools and the types of programs. only one or two posters actually replied with the info i wanted. every1 else started bashing

You should just reach out to the coaches yourself, ASAP before it's to late. In the meantime if you want any of their attention you need to play as many high level sectional and any national tournaments you can get into as possible.

Let us know where you land. Good luck to you and find a place where you can get your undergrad and play tennis at a program that wants you to play. That is, if you really want to play college tennis. If you don't like the school where you start you can transfer.

kctennis1005
07-11-2008, 04:47 PM
im at clay court supers this weekend and have already contacted the coaches since before sophomore year.

Coach Carter
07-11-2008, 09:07 PM
it's rarely the degree that gets the job...it's the personality selling yourself that along with the degree gets the job.

Coach Carter
07-11-2008, 09:30 PM
#296 Nationally...again, though good...that's not successful D1 range. That's a nice D3 range...for Johns Hopkins, Emory, etc...maybe...there's work to be done to be a difference maker on any of those top squads.

kctennis1005
07-11-2008, 10:00 PM
coach carter, im not necesarrily trying to be a starter at those d1 schools on my list freshman year. its more that i want to be on the roster because i definitely want to play college tennis. im even ok with redshirting freshman year, as long as i get to practice with the team. im most likely going to go to grad school so i can use my 4th yr of eligibility my first year of grad school. also, as a coach i have a question for you: do u go solely based on rank or do u judge a lot on potential? i'm 6'5" and the yale coach said i have a lot of potential. most coaches i talk to say once i get in the weightroom in college i will be a big force, especially in doubles. how does this play into recruiting?

LPShanet
07-11-2008, 11:24 PM
Just trying to think outside the court... One thing nobody
has mentioned yet is trying to get into Mensa.
To get a rough idea of whether or not you have a chance
(before going through with the testing), you can time yourself
for 30 minutes and take the practice test they have on their
website at mensa.org. If you get like 27-30 out of 30 then
you might consider taking the test b/c you might pass it.

To get an accurate assessment for yourself, don't take the
practice test multiple times. Just take it once and see how
you do. Many of the questions are SAT-ish like questions
and others involve logic and simple problem solving and does
not require any math beyond algebra so you really don't
need to prep or review anything before taking it.
Does it really measure IQ? That's debatable, but it is an internationally recognized organization.

I'm not sure why Mensa is relevant here, but there's a shorter route than taking the practice tests to determine if he could get in. Mensa offers immediate acceptance based on a wide variety of standardized test scores (from many of the best known tests...SAT, GRE, etc.). So all he has to do is see if his SAT's qualify. But again, I don't know why that matters to this discussion.

KC, glad I could help. I'd say there's no need to argue further whether he has assessed himself correctly...that's his job to take care of. He just asked for info on specific coaches and programs. I'll just offer wishes of good luck, regardless of which college, team or first job he decides on.

ihearit1st
07-12-2008, 12:41 PM
1. why would i go to ohio state or boise state whose teams are better than the ivy teams? if u think im not good enough obviously i couldnt play at those schools

2. why would i have worked as hard as i have academically in high school to go to a state school that is not even in my state? normally people want some sort of reward for their hard work and going to ohio st or boise st would not be a reward for my work in the classroom.

i guess u just done understand. if all the valedictorians of the world went to state schools, who would be going to the top academic institutions? theres a reason the top schools are at the top. they get the highest caliber of students.

I think your perception of state school's academic load is skewed. Look at a Newsweek report on the best colleges in the field you want to go to. I would guess 30-50% of the Top 20 are STATE schools. Yes, Ivys are always going to be very demanding and rewarding academically. But there are some state schools in different programs that BEAT Ivys in terms of academics. Some of your best academics in Division 1 come out of the Big 10, Big 12, Pac 10, Big East, ACC and SEC. Those also mirror some of your best athletics. If you're looking for a very tough academic school, with great athletics, recognizable name, you're probably not ranked high enough. Those schools are going after the absolute upper echelon of players. You might want to broaden your scope and lower the bar you've set in your head.

amaj
07-12-2008, 01:08 PM
are you guys kidding me who would choose a state school over an ivy. no matter what.

andfor
07-12-2008, 02:10 PM
are you guys kidding me who would choose a state school over an ivy. no matter what.

Uhhhh? The guy who can't afford the Ivy?

ihearit1st
07-12-2008, 03:45 PM
Who wants to go there? How about 83% of the best players that play college tennis. Because 83% of the top 25 schools are public.

And I did some research and came up with some sad news. I searched the 8 schools in the Ivy Conference. With no exceptions, those that got to see playing time were either TennisRecruiting 4 Star, 5 Star or Blue Chips.

You need to look at the broad scope of things in considering a school. Yes, Ivy league schools are great. Are they worth paying 40K a year for tuition instead of getting a full or partial scholarship to another school?

I got 11 Division 1 full scholarship offers. I also got into 2 Ivy League schools and had a really good shot at making the lineups right away. I ended up going to a great state school and got a stellar education. I didn't pay a cent for 4 years and had a pretty nice playing career. I think if I had gone to one of the Ivys, I would have gotten a great education, played on a great team, and started my adult life 150k in the hole.

ihearit1st
07-12-2008, 03:49 PM
And we're talking with Kevin Cox, look him up.

jaggy
07-12-2008, 04:03 PM
Undergraduate degrees are about money, go where you will have less loans when you end.

kctennis1005
07-12-2008, 04:03 PM
andfor: ivy leagues actually have really good financial aid programs now and meet 100% of your demonstrated need.

ihearit1st: i respect your decision, but remember not every1 is yourself. other ppl would be willing to go 150K in the hole to go to an ivy rather than a state school. many of those top 83% of players were more concerned with tennis and getting a scholarship than receiving a top notch education. i respect that decision, but again....not for every1. also, i dont really care if i start freshman year. i actually just want to roster and maybe start doubles(my strength).

ihearit1st
07-12-2008, 04:59 PM
KC what do you want to major in? I would look up some Newsweek reports on schools with top programs in your field and go from there. Harvard or Yale might have great business programs for example, but maybe subpar advertising or English programs. When in the job market, top companies will not just say, "Oh it Harvard or Princeton, he must know his stuff." They will see that maybe a college like Williams or Wheaton has the best advertising or English program and that a degree from there is worth more than an Ivy. Does that make sense? There are plenty of schools that are educationally on par with Ivys in specific programs. Look up on wikipedia Ivy leagues and you will get links to schools compared to Ivys that you might not have heard of on the west coast but are great on the east or vice versa.

With a list of 10-15 schools that fit your educational criteria, you can weed out the ones that don't fit your athletic criteria. You obviously want a shot at playing at a better school and it seems the educational part is the most important to you. So make a list of those you could get a degree from and find out which ones you can play for and who is in need of players when you are graduating.

amaj
07-12-2008, 08:05 PM
And we're talking with Kevin Cox, look him up.

if your talking to me, you should be looking him up i know him a little better then you.

On Tilt EX
07-12-2008, 08:27 PM
Not to get into a tennis college with good academic naming contest but there are many to consider. Samford has excellent academics, D1 tennis and is located very close to a large city, Birmingham, AL. Good weather and academics what more could a smart tennis kid ask for? Tulane, very good academics, is restarting their program in New Orleans after shutting it down for a few years after Katrina. Seattle U., D1 just started a program, not sure about academics but it can't be bad. Heck they both probably need players at this point. Belmont U. and Lipscomb U. have a OK rep for academics and are both in Nashville and yes they are D1. Good D3 tennis schools in big cities include, Rhodes, Memphis, TN (only 1 kid from Memphis on their team, no forigners), Washington U., St. Louis, Emory, ATL. There's so many more for the open minded.


Having played college tennis for a couple of years, and having a couple of friends that played on better teams, I feel like I can lend a hand to this conversation. Being on a college team is very different than playing on one. Being on a team seems like the greatest thing in the world when you are a senior in high school, but after two years of practicing for a few hours a day, lifting weights, and never knowing if you are going to play begins to suck.

Go where you want to go for actual school, if tennis works out great, if not, you will have an education. I went to the above mentioned Samford University. Great school and good tennis program, generally comprised of guys from the south and a few guys from outside the states. Birmingham, although smaller, is a fun city. Don't completely rule out the smallers schools. Someone said it earlier, and its very true. College is what you make it. It can be as hard or easy as you would like, no matter where you go.
Good luck in your search

amaj
07-12-2008, 09:29 PM
why are you guys making it out that kevin is horrible anyways. He should be a 3 star next update, hes playing clay court supers and has some good wins.

ihearit1st
07-13-2008, 07:09 AM
if your talking to me, you should be looking him up i know him a little better then you.

I wasn't talking to you.

And I'm not trying to make him out to be a bad player. He's just not realistic enough in his choices. A 3 Star(just for arguments sake) isn't going to have much recruiting success if they decide they're only going to one of these handful of schools. If you limit yourself to just Ivys, you run the risk of:

1- They not offering the degree program you're looking for.

2- Them having more than enough players on their roster for that year that pursuing you isn't a top priority.

3- Not getting one second of playing time. If you'll read my previous posts, I stated that currently in the Ivys, there are Blue Chips, 5 and 4 Stars receiving playing time.

So take is as a personal blow to him if you want, but its not directed that way. He came on these boards asking for help, I think he's just not hearing what he wanted to hear.

ihearit1st
07-13-2008, 07:27 AM
I see you're interested in Washington and Lee. That would be a good choice. Look at these as well: St. Josephs, Temple, Liberty, Drexel, George Mason, Old Dominion, Rider, Siena, Bradley, Creighton, College of Charleston, Gonzaga. I think everyone will tell you those schools rank pretty high academically and are fairly recognizable names. A couple BBball Final Four teams in there. If you think you'll be a 3 Star soon, check out schools with 3 and 4 Stars on the current roster. That will give you a good idea that you'll get some playing time possibly in the first year but not necessarily at the top spot, which it doesn't seem like you're interested in.

kctennis1005
07-13-2008, 04:17 PM
well i will choose villanova over any of those schools on the list and theyre recruiting me quite a bit right now.

ihearit1st
07-13-2008, 05:11 PM
Great school. That's one of those that competes with the Ivys in terms of academics and athletics.

ihearit1st
07-13-2008, 05:16 PM
FYI- Old Dominion beat Villanova 7-0 this last year.

kctennis1005
07-13-2008, 06:32 PM
FYI- Old Dominion beat Villanova 7-0 this last year.

well old dominion was ranked was ranked as high at 37 nationally this season. i dont care how good villanova's team is. i like the school and i like the tennis. hopefully i get some good academic money there.

Coach Carter
07-16-2008, 05:12 PM
well old dominion was ranked was ranked as high at 37 nationally this season. i dont care how good villanova's team is. i like the school and i like the tennis. hopefully i get some good academic money there.

nice that you appear to be narrowing down on a school. okay, here's the next question. how will you like to live in/near Philadelphia...big difference from the wesy coast.

About VU

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SoCal10s
07-16-2008, 11:09 PM
[QUOTE=ihearit1st;2517326]Who wants to go there? How about 83% of the best players that play college tennis. Because 83% of the top 25 schools are public.

83% of of the best players.. that's absolutely what they are ,,players and not students...a bunch of those kids are home schooled and academy schooled so they have no chance to qualify to get in the better ivy leagues schools that KC want to go to.. this guy wants it all and he can do tennis and academics and balance it out.. when I went to college,I met a guy who was on the Notre Dame tennis team,he played #1 and he was a Rhodes scholor and the second string quarter back and pre-med student... some guys can have it all if so why not???

tnkGod4tns
07-19-2008, 08:44 AM
a school really is what you make it...if you go to harvard and want to party, i bet there are plenty of parties. if you go to OSU and dont want to party you wont. if you get into a big academic college you'd be the one to think your better than a senior or someoe and say you had a 4.9 GPA and you'll get knocked out. honestly GPA hardly even matters, if you get a high enough ACT/SAT score then you're gonna be well off...(with the exception of a select few)

i agree for me a great school can only help you up to a certain point, school is what you make it, like what other people said if you go to a great school but just want to party and barely pass your classes then you won't learn a lot compare to a person who goes to a not so known school but is motivated to learn and make the most of the collegerlearning experience everyday who do you think would come out as a better person/student, not to say that you want to party but i believe school is what you make it, but if you can go to a known school and really want to learn that's the best combination because you have all the resources in front of you.

cmutennis10
07-19-2008, 09:14 AM
KC,

I'm currently going to be a rising junior at Carnegie Mellon and I also happen to be a sem-expert college counselor. I help out most of the kids at my club with their college situation and I looked at all of the schools you are considering druing my recruiting process 2-3 years ago. If you are interested in talking or hearing my advice, shoot me an e-mail at jspero@andrew.cmu.edu and I'll advise you on my opinion.

Couple questions quickly...

A preference between ED and Regular?
You just want a spot on the team or you want to start?

SirBlend12
07-19-2008, 10:46 AM
Anyone from Northeast Ohio? I'm going to Lake Erie and they're just now integrating a Varsity team and I'm hoping to maybe help it get going. Anyone here from any other area DII and DIII schools?

fedclone69
07-21-2008, 10:01 AM
andfor: ivy leagues actually have really good financial aid programs now and meet 100% of your demonstrated need.

ihearit1st: i respect your decision, but remember not every1 is yourself. other ppl would be willing to go 150K in the hole to go to an ivy rather than a state school. many of those top 83% of players were more concerned with tennis and getting a scholarship than receiving a top notch education. i respect that decision, but again....not for every1. also, i dont really care if i start freshman year. i actually just want to roster and maybe start doubles(my strength).

yo man obviously you have little to no friends because you are on this site trying to have people kiss your *** so you can feel better about yourself. It is clear to me that you have some kind of self-esteem issue. Why do you feel the need to talk yourself up and give out every little detail of your recruitment. I doubt coaches appreciate that. Be happy with yourself, but don't feel the need to brag on the internet about your accomplishments(which by the way are not all that impressive).

Gemini
07-21-2008, 11:04 AM
are you guys kidding me who would choose a state school over an ivy. no matter what.

I did. Got into Harvard and Yale. Choose to go to a state school (not my own state) because the curriculum was as competitive. Travel time between school and home was much more reasonable. The weather was better year-round and I had access to some of the best hitting partners in the country outside of my college teammates.

Choosing a the college/university is/should be about more than just the name and rep of the school. It's about finding a school that offers the best balance of what you want as a complete person. A buddy of mine played one year tennis for University of Florida years ago and transferred after that year to University of the South - Sewanne because the school offered a better balance of what he wanted as a student and an athlete. He was #7 at U of F. At Sewanee, he was #2. Better fit for him overall.

cmb
07-25-2008, 04:38 AM
Georgia Tech....pretty good school. Good tennis, good football team, lots of parties. Downtown atlanta.

MTChong
07-25-2008, 08:46 AM
Haven't read all the posts, but you seem to have the run of the mill schools on your list. Harvard, Yale, Princeton? Are you looking for a name? They're quite different, each of those schools. You should prioritize fit over recognition. Sure, you may not know the names of the small liberal arts colleges, but when it comes down to it, employers -- the people who matter -- do.

kctennis1005
07-25-2008, 10:39 AM
ya for fit i think its coming down to yale, villanova, boston college, and georgetown.

ClarkC
07-29-2008, 03:54 PM
illinois is a great school...my mom went there....but im not really interested in ******* big 10 schools...theyre too big for my taste. i like northwestern but they have a full roster. thanks for your help though

Your definition of "schools no one has heard of" seems to be "schools with no Division I-A football team." But you don't like the big state schools, either. Those two dislikes really seem to narrow things down a lot.

I recall going to a private school and wanted to transfer to a big state school because I had a girlfriend and lots of high school friends there. I talked to a professor I was close to. He said that he had been to three totally different sized schools for his bachelor's, master's, and doctorate degrees in Computer Science. Some private, some public. His opinion was that if I applied myself, I was going to get a good education and do fine in life.

Your mileage may vary. Perhaps narrowing things down so much will cause you to go somewhere that really fits you perfectly. Perhaps it will close a lot of doors that could have been good ones to open. I don't know you, so I cannot say. But it is something to think about.

ClarkC
07-29-2008, 04:09 PM
1. why would i go to ohio state or boise state whose teams are better than the ivy teams? if u think im not good enough obviously i couldnt play at those schools

2. why would i have worked as hard as i have academically in high school to go to a state school that is not even in my state? normally people want some sort of reward for their hard work and going to ohio st or boise st would not be a reward for my work in the classroom.

i guess u just done understand. if all the valedictorians of the world went to state schools, who would be going to the top academic institutions? theres a reason the top schools are at the top. they get the highest caliber of students.

One word of advice: When you contact some Ivy League school to tell them about your academic prowess, discover the Shift key on your keyboard.

verdasco
08-01-2008, 07:23 PM
You should look at the little ivies. Williams, amherst, etc. Also consider UC Santa Cruz. Those teams are at the top of D3 and are very prestigious academically.

Face it, you're not going to play professionally, so you might as well go somewhere where you can get a great education and stand out athletically. If you played D3 you would get a lot more match time and that makes being on a team all the better.

verdasco
08-01-2008, 07:29 PM
Oh, and playing D3 does not rule out playing professionally. It can be done.

http://gustavus.edu/athletics/news/2729

Ignorant Genius
08-16-2008, 11:05 PM
1. why would i go to ohio state or boise state whose teams are better than the ivy teams? if u think im not good enough obviously i couldnt play at those schools

2. why would i have worked as hard as i have academically in high school to go to a state school that is not even in my state? normally people want some sort of reward for their hard work and going to ohio st or boise st would not be a reward for my work in the classroom.

i guess u just done understand. if all the valedictorians of the world went to state schools, who would be going to the top academic institutions? theres a reason the top schools are at the top. they get the highest caliber of students.

If you are so smart, then why are you asking strangers for advice on an internet message board? Seriously?

If you are a top level student, getting into one of the top 3 schools on your list should not be a problem.

And if you're a good enough tennis player, you should be able to make the team.

And regarding a school like Ohio State -- there are lots of people at that school that are much smarter than you. You're in for a big surprise when you get out of your cozy little world and step into the real world.

Let us know how it goes for you.

tenniscrazed
08-19-2008, 12:16 PM
If you are so smart, then why are you asking strangers for advice on an internet message board? Seriously?

If you are a top level student, getting into one of the top 3 schools on your list should not be a problem.

And if you're a good enough tennis player, you should be able to make the team.

And regarding a school like Ohio State -- there are lots of people at that school that are much smarter than you. You're in for a big surprise when you get out of your cozy little world and step into the real world.

Let us know how it goes for you.

^^^^He's right you know. First, you are going to need to decide between athletics and academics. Based on your posts a big, well known school for your undergrad work is very important to you. However, do understand in the real world your post grad school is more important. Nevertheless, Brown, Cornell, Harvard, Stanford, Cal, Georgetown, Villanova. However, consider this University of Colorado at Boulder was ranked the 34th best academic university globally by the The Institute of Higher Education in Shanghai, China. U.C. Boulder was also considered the "best buy" in university education, mainly because of its academic excellence and value.

With respect to tennis, look for the school and walk on forget getting on the team right now. If you do, great if you don't then play Mens opens and practice with a local coach or academy until you can walk on. With a 4.95 gpa, and a 290 ranking I'd give tennis a seat on the back of the bus.

andfor
08-19-2008, 01:23 PM
^^^^He's right you know. First, you are going to need to decide between athletics and academics. Based on your posts a big, well known school for your undergrad work is very important to you. However, do understand in the real world your post grad school is more important. Nevertheless, Brown, Cornell, Harvard, Stanford, Cal, Georgetown, Villanova. However, consider this University of Colorado at Boulder was ranked the 34th best academic university globally by the The Institute of Higher Education in Shanghai, China. U.C. Boulder was also considered the "best buy" in university education, mainly because of its academic excellence and value.

With respect to tennis, look for the school and walk on forget getting on the team right now. If you do, great if you don't then play Mens opens and practice with a local coach or academy until you can walk on. With a 4.95 gpa, and a 290 ranking I'd give tennis a seat on the back of the bus.

You are right as well and provide good advice. Much of what you said has been said in one form or another throughout the course of the thread.

My experience with H.S. seniors and tennis is that once they are set on a big name school and are convinced they will fail in life without a degree there they will not change. Certainly prioritizing academics over tennis should always take precedence.

BTW. CU Boulder dropped their mens tennis program a couple of years ago. The premier NCAA D1 tennis schools in Colorodo for men are now Denver University and Air Force Acadamy.

If for an individual whose academics and tennis can be a 55/45 type priority split then there could be a compromise on where one goes to school and plays tennis, etc. KC does not want that and that's his choice and I respect that. Maybe he'll make the tennis team at Villanova or Georgetown, win the NCAA's, be an academic all-American, graduate with honors, become a top 25touring pro, serve at President for the Players on the ATP Players Council, retire from tennis, go to grad school at Harvard, and with that kind of experience in today's world then run for president of the United States.

I wish him luck and hope to hear how things go for him.

tenniscrazed
08-19-2008, 02:12 PM
Boulder losing tennis, another title IX victim I'm sure.

If for an individual whose academics and tennis can be a 55/45 type priority split then there could be a compromise on where one goes to school and plays tennis, etc. KC does not want that and that's his choice and I respect that. Maybe he'll make the tennis team at Villanova or Georgetown, win the NCAA's, be an academic all-American, graduate with honors, become a top 25touring pro, serve at President for the Players on the ATP Players Council, retire from tennis, go to grad school at Harvard, and with that kind of experience in today's world then run for president of the United States.

I wish him luck and hope to hear how things go for him.

With a 4.95 gpa he should be able to go any school he wants. With all due respect if NCAA tennis is in the picture a 290 ranking for a senior just doesn't match up to the 4.95 gpa.

That's not to say he couldn't stay home, go to a great local university, save money, travel and work on his Open ranking. Hopefully get a few W/C's and make good use of them and go from there is a viable option on the tennis end.

OleNole
08-19-2008, 02:27 PM
Its probably too late for new suggestions anyways, but here's my two cents. It seems to me you are academically qualified to attend a top notch school, but at only aroung 300 in the country you will not get a roster spot at an ivy league school, or another top D1 program, such as the aforementioned PAC 10 and Big 10 schools.
My solution: Play at a top D3 school. Any NESCAC school, Johns Hopkins, U of Chicago, NYU, etc. should at least be possibilities academically. And the tennis at these schools is top notch. Actually, you might not even get a roster spot at someplace like CMS (Claremont-Mudd-Scripps) or Emory, those teams are sensational.
If money is not an issue and academics really do come first for you, these schools are worth a visit.

tenniscrazed
08-19-2008, 03:14 PM
Its probably too late for new suggestions anyways, but here's my two cents. It seems to me you are academically qualified to attend a top notch school, but at only aroung 300 in the country you will not get a roster spot at an ivy league school, or another top D1 program, such as the aforementioned PAC 10 and Big 10 schools.
My solution: Play at a top D3 school. Any NESCAC school, Johns Hopkins, U of Chicago, NYU, etc. should at least be possibilities academically. And the tennis at these schools is top notch. Actually, you might not even get a roster spot at someplace like CMS (Claremont-Mudd-Scripps) or Emory, those teams are sensational.
If money is not an issue and academics really do come first for you, these schools are worth a visit.

^^^ He's right too. If you want a balance between school, and you really want to play. Then Johns Hopkins, Chicago or NYU will be academically challenging along with possibly giving you the opportunity to play tennis. Again, with 4.95 gpa academically the worlds at your feet. Tenniswise it just isn't there unless you are willing to go to D2 (maybe) D3 (likely). Even better, go to U of Chicago or NYU, play tennis, get a great education and intern at a downtown Chicago or NY hospital or urgent care facility, and use the 4.95 to better the world.

andfor
08-20-2008, 09:54 AM
^^^ He's right too. If you want a balance between school, and you really want to play. Then Johns Hopkins, Chicago or NYU will be academically challenging along with possibly giving you the opportunity to play tennis. Again, with 4.95 gpa academically the worlds at your feet. Tenniswise it just isn't there unless you are willing to go to D2 (maybe) D3 (likely). Even better, go to U of Chicago or NYU, play tennis, get a great education and intern at a downtown Chicago or NY hospital or urgent care facility, and use the 4.95 to better the world.

As a review all DII schools have been POOPOOED by the OP. Fellas, I don't mean to come across as a jerk to you (some may say I am anyways), but although your ideas are good ones, they have already been suggested, maybe not in the exact context. The OP has his mind made up on G-Town, Villanova and one other I can't remember, Princeton or Dartmoth, whatever. IMO his mind was made up before he posted his question. I know you guys are trying to be helpful though. This whole thing started with the OP's question, helpful suggestions then given, then the wheels fell off when the OP started shooting down many helpful posters.

Don't waste your time. No disrespect intended to you or the OP. I wish him well with his dreams and goals. I'll take my own advise and now leave this thread. Thanks for listening.

tenniscrazed
08-20-2008, 10:15 AM
As a review all DII schools have been POOPOOED by the OP. Fellas, I don't mean to come across as a jerk to you (some may say I am anyways), but although your ideas are good ones, they have already been suggested, maybe not in the exact context. The OP has his mind made up on G-Town, Villanova and one other I can't remember, Princeton or Dartmoth, whatever. IMO his mind was made up before he posted his question. I know you guys are trying to be helpful though. This whole thing started with the OP's question, helpful suggestions then given, then the wheels fell off when the OP started shooting down many helpful posters.

Don't waste your time. No disrespect intended to you or the OP. I wish him well with his dreams and goals. I'll take my own advise and now leave this thread. Thanks for listening.

No offense taken. You're right, as I reviewed all of the OP's suggestions I see now that they were all "poopooed". I guess that is why they have "campus leagues".

Kbtoyz26
08-21-2008, 01:38 PM
I know this thread is somewhat exhaused, but here are my 2 cents...

1. Take Nova off your list. They are not a tennis school. They lost to D3 Middlebury 7-0 last year, who finished like #3 or 4 in D3. A good program, but still...

2. Go to an Ivy if you can pull it off academically, definietly worth it in the long run... what about Brown? I know their tennis is better, but you should be able to make it in academically then work your way on the team... your call.

3. Consider Williams, Amherst, Middlebury... all excellent schools with great programs... yea I know theyre not big etc.. but consider them at least

4. a few others to consider-- William & Mary, U Penn, Northwestern

Pancho G
08-23-2008, 04:09 PM
What does ya mean anyway? I bet KC Tennis is bs'ing all of us. I'm starting to think he's a made up character. Ya Ya Ya.

Wondertoy
09-05-2008, 09:36 AM
Kctennis, the facts are that if you are a rising senior and you do not already have a dialogue with the coaches of the schools you have listed, then it's not going to happen tennis wise. Fish at Harvard wants to win and if he sees something in your game that he likes, then you have a shot. Michibata at Princeton is only interested in the highly ranked recruits. Dorato at Yale is interested in the smartest applicants that can play tennis. I knew a smart kid who got in and played doubles as a walk on. You don't have much time, you better get a move on.

csr_88
09-30-2008, 10:06 AM
1. why would i go to ohio state or boise state whose teams are better than the ivy teams? if u think im not good enough obviously i couldnt play at those schools

2. why would i have worked as hard as i have academically in high school to go to a state school that is not even in my state? normally people want some sort of reward for their hard work and going to ohio st or boise st would not be a reward for my work in the classroom.

i guess u just done understand. if all the valedictorians of the world went to state schools, who would be going to the top academic institutions? theres a reason the top schools are at the top. they get the highest caliber of students.


valedictorian doesn't mean anything nowadays...

like people have said before you can be more successful at state/city schools than big/ivy school in the world. it all depends on the person. To be honest, high school really doesn't matter(just as long as you're not an idiot and do your work). if you haven't been written back or they aren't visiting you at home, then i would seriously consider looking elsewhere.

there's plenty of schools that can take you just as far if not farther then ivy's. you can find just as many genius' at state schools as you can find at ivy's. BUT you will find MANY more kids in ivy's that are there because of their parents/money than you will find anywhere else.

dmtree
09-30-2008, 10:47 AM
you really ought to choose the school you like best, outside of the name/prestige/etc. you'll be spending 4 years there, make sure you will have a good time and will make a lot of friends.

The school's prestige does play a role when you are getting your first jobs after graduating. But after a couple of years people will be looking at what you accomplished outside of school, and where you actually go to school will be less and less important as you go except for the friends you will have made there.

If you move out West, you'll notice that many employers here don't really care quite as much about the precious east coast schools, they respect schools like Michigan, Notre Dame, USC, Berkeley, or Texas as much as the Ivies. It's hard to believe when you're caught up in the admission process, but it's the truth.

You will most likely have other priorities when you get to college besides tennis. I would be that you will probably not play serious tennis for all 4 years, I wouldn't make that commitment if I were you. If you get into a Ivy, you will have tons of schoolwork, if you major in the sciences, you'll have even more. I knew several people who were recruited for various sports but ended up quitting their teams to spend more time studying. Plus there will be girls, parties, all sorts of things that you probably didn't do a lot of in high school... that won't leave a whole lot of room for tennis.

ClarkC
09-30-2008, 01:26 PM
valedictorian doesn't mean anything nowadays...



I thought it meant the same thing it has always meant, that you graduated #1 in your class. If the meaning has changed, please explain.

Joeyg
09-30-2008, 05:20 PM
At Mission San Jose High School in Fremont, they had 22 valedictorians. The competition is so tough to get into a UC (especially Berkeley) that parents will do anything to have their kids graduate at the top of their class. This includes tutors, sleep deprivation to do more homework and good, old fashioned beatings when the kids don't perform up to snuff.

kctennis1005
09-30-2008, 06:54 PM
at my school there is only 1 valedictorian and 1 salutatorian. they go to the 2 kids with the highest academic gpa.

atatu
09-30-2008, 11:59 PM
I second the CMS suggestions, especially if you're from socal. Go get a great education, play college tennis, then go to an Ivy or Berkley for grad school...

Cameron
10-12-2008, 05:26 PM
congrats kc on your great GPA! Can I have some of your smarts? :) Good luck finding a school!

tennisnoob2
08-01-2009, 03:59 PM
At Mission San Jose High School in Fremont, they had 22 valedictorians. The competition is so tough to get into a UC (especially Berkeley) that parents will do anything to have their kids graduate at the top of their class. This includes tutors, sleep deprivation to do more homework and good, old fashioned beatings when the kids don't perform up to snuff.

thats more an ethnicity thing.

quick q- i thought if you were an athlete, you really didnt get a decent degree at school cuz sports took up so much time. Like if you ever watch a college sport game..they always list players with hometown, facts, etc and MAJOR. the major ALWAYS seems to beem communication for d1.

maybe its just a misconception?

edit: pancho is probably right..a 4.9 gpa is IMPOSSIBLE unless its on a 6.0/or some other odd scale