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View Full Version : softest playing multi even if strung at 60lbs and up on a 90sq-in thin-beam racket?


protege
09-17-2008, 11:53 AM
Need a little help guys.

Some multis lose power and play dead at higher tensions. What multis can you recommend that retain their softness and avoid feeling like traditional synthetic guts at higher tensions?

tennisfreak15347
09-17-2008, 12:14 PM
Maybe Xcel 2008 and NXT, but I'm not sure about them. However, for Tecnifibre Multifeel at 62 on my racquet, it felt quite comfortable, plenty of power, very soft, and very lively. Anything but a dead-feeling.

Valjean
09-17-2008, 12:35 PM
Today? Xcel 2008, hands down!

wao
09-17-2008, 12:42 PM
Need a little help guys.

Some multis lose power and play dead at higher tensions. What multis can you recommend that retain their softness and avoid feeling like traditional synthetic guts at higher tensions?
I would say NRG 515.

Valjean
09-17-2008, 12:48 PM
Tecnifibre's venerable 515--which can still be found for now--nonetheless has recently been discontinued, to be replaced by its TGV, which isn't as soft.

wao
09-17-2008, 02:54 PM
Tecnifibre's venerable 515--which can still be found for now--nonetheless has recently been discontinued, to be replaced by its TGV, which isn't as soft.wasn't aware it was discontinued, though have not played with in in years. Just knew it was soft and gummy.

North
09-17-2008, 03:06 PM
The softest I've found is NXT. I use the 17g at 60 lbs on a Slaz X1.

Octavianus
09-17-2008, 04:56 PM
Today? Xcel 2008, hands down!


I fully agree. Xcel 2008 and IsoSpeed Control are by far the softest multis that I have ever used.

tennisfreak15347
09-17-2008, 05:03 PM
a quick question. does a soft multi automatically mean it is high powered? I might put this as a separate thread.

protege
09-17-2008, 06:17 PM
a quick question. does a soft multi automatically mean it is high powered? I might put this as a separate thread.

Yes, I believe so. It's hard for me to imagine a soft string that won't trampoline (or bounce back if some people don't like that term too much :oops:).

Which racket did you string Multifeel @ 62lbs?

protege
09-17-2008, 06:20 PM
I fully agree. Xcel 2008 and IsoSpeed Control are by far the softest multis that I have ever used.

Ocavianus, Valjean, wao

What rackets and tensions did you use?

North,

Have you tried Xcel 2008, IsoSpeed Control, or Tecnifibre 515?

tennisfreak15347
09-17-2008, 06:22 PM
currently using a tweener racquet that I bought a few months back, the Wilson k-six-two, but I plan on demoing ( and hopefully liking) the Microgel Prestige Mid +, installed with a nice helping of babolat VS @ 64 lbs.

protege
09-17-2008, 06:25 PM
Another multi worth mentioning might be WeissCANNON's Explosiv! - the manufacturer actually recommends stringing at 10% higher than normal. :)

tennisfreak15347, somehow I think Babolat's product line disagrees with me:

Xcel is lower in power but more comfortable than Xcel Power which is higher in power but less comfortable then plain vanilla Xcel.

Kenny022593
09-17-2008, 06:38 PM
http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/descpageACYONEX-Y85016.html

this one

2nd_Serve
09-17-2008, 06:44 PM
I think the softest is Xcel or NRG.

tennisfreak15347
09-17-2008, 07:53 PM
Another multi worth mentioning might be WeissCANNON's Explosiv! - the manufacturer actually recommends stringing at 10% higher than normal. :)

tennisfreak15347, somehow I think Babolat's product line disagrees with me:

Xcel is lower in power but more comfortable than Xcel Power which is higher in power but less comfortable then plain vanilla Xcel.

judging by the softness rating of 187, which is pretty soft for a multi, it should still be very high powered. We'll see once it arrives from TW

Keifers
09-17-2008, 08:44 PM
I agree that the Yonex 850 would be worth considering here. I've used it several times and always found the stringbed nice and comfortable -- and yet offering excellent touch and feel for the ball. It holds tension very well and stays playable over time. It's also a excellent value at its price point, imo.

Booyah
09-17-2008, 08:59 PM
I fully agree. Xcel 2008 and IsoSpeed Control are by far the softest multis that I have ever used.

Isospeed Control for sure, also NXT

Octavianus
09-17-2008, 11:34 PM
Ocavianus, Valjean, wao

What rackets and tensions did you use?

North,

Have you tried Xcel 2008, IsoSpeed Control, or Tecnifibre 515?


I use the following racquets
Wilson K6.1 - 95, 18x16 - String: Babolat XCel 16g @ 58 lbs (for singles) and
Prince Speedport Black - String: IsoSpeed Control 16g @ 62 lbs(for doubles)
I like both strings equally well. I have a bothersome wrist and I can use these strings and not worry at all. As a matter of fact I like these strings as well as gut. The only strings that I would presently use and not worry about aggravating my sore wrist are: Babolat XCel, IsoSpeed Control, Babolat VS gut 16g and Klip Legend 16g.

jazar
09-17-2008, 11:49 PM
pacific spacepower tx 1.24 plays great at higher tensions

protege
09-18-2008, 12:23 AM
Kenny022593, Keifers,

Thanks for the suggestion.

I did read that the Yonex 850 is nice. The reviews are mixed but one that stood out mentioned it being "somewhat crisp or firm" at 60lbs on the RDX-500 mid (a racket which I also have, but I find too light).

Isospeed Control & Professional seem promising and priced above the Yonex 850. Since they're in similar price points, which would you pick over the other based on this thread's criteria?

Is the premium on Xcel 2008 really worth it? NXT 17 is almost the same price too. How do these two compare?

I can't find 515 anymore :(

Keifers
09-18-2008, 12:28 AM
^^^

Which 90" racquet are you using, protege?

And can you tell us what other strings you've used in it?

protege
09-18-2008, 01:02 AM
I just read a playtest review of WeissCANNON and it basically said that it was still comfortable even when initially strung at 67lbs. That's tight!

Very interesting indeed and intro priced only at about $1 more, I will definitely put this in the shortlist as well.

protege
09-18-2008, 01:32 AM
^^^

Which 90" racquet are you using, protege?

And can you tell us what other strings you've used in it?

Keifers, I primarily use the K-SixOne Tour 90.

And I've only used Babolat Superfine Play 17 on it.

It's a softer, less lively string compared to POSG 17, and PSGD 17 and 18
which I used to use on different rackets a long way back. But it sure
plays better than the also soft and muted Toalson Synthetic 63 that I used
to use. :shock:

When freshly strung at 58 or 60lbs, it's feels stiff and boardy like the Prince
strings I mentioned and remains that way for up to 3 hours of use within 1-2
days after stringing. It softens up and plays well for up to 4-6 hours of use
afterwards until it breaks not long after.

I can't imagine using stiff/crisp strings like the POSG 17 and PSGD 17 on the
K90, hence my search for a multi that I can string tight. Up until a few days ago, I used to think that I needed a stiff stringbed along with my
low-powered racket. I always looked for that metallic ping sound when I strike
the palm of my hand against the string bed. If I didn't hear that ping at the
right pitch, I'd cut the strings out.

As an aside, I used to use the RDX-500 mid but I found that too light. Before
that I used the Wilson Graphite Matrix (85) - now that was a heavy racket. I
need to get strong again before I try to hit with that.

Valjean
09-18-2008, 04:37 AM
a quick question. does a soft multi automatically mean it is high powered? I might put this as a separate thread.
No. Compare Babolat's ratings for Xcel 2008 and Xcel Power imprinted on the front of their string boxes on this site. Xcel 2008 shows higher comfort and yet lower power. Experience here bears this out.

wao
09-18-2008, 07:46 AM
Ocavianus, Valjean, wao

What rackets and tensions did you use?

North,

Have you tried Xcel 2008, IsoSpeed Control, or Tecnifibre 515?
I use a Head MG Extreme that has been extended to 27.75 and 6g lead at 12. My current string is Blue Gear M at 54 and Max Touch at 56. Though there are a couple of polys I want to try again.

protege
09-18-2008, 08:12 AM
a quick question. does a soft multi automatically mean it is high powered? I might put this as a separate thread.
Yes, I believe so. It's hard for me to imagine a soft string that won't trampoline (or bounce back if some people don't like that term too much :oops:)....
tennisfreak15347, somehow I think Babolat's product line disagrees with me:

Xcel is lower in power but more comfortable than Xcel Power which is higher in power but less comfortable then plain vanilla Xcel.
judging by the softness rating of 187, which is pretty soft for a multi, it should still be very high powered. We'll see once it arrives from TWNo. Compare Babolat's ratings for Xcel 2008 and Xcel Power imprinted on the front of their string boxes on this site. Xcel 2008 shows higher comfort and yet lower power. Experience here bears this out.

Valjean, you've confirmed my suspicion. I'm interested to learn how this can be. Would I be correct if I said that:

power is derived from the string's resiliency? The more resilient the string, the more powerful it is?
softness is the perceived amount of stringbed deflection?
comfort is the apparent lack of vibration being transmitted to the arm?

I framed the topic based on my perception that "soft = powerful" so I guess I should qualify it to read "softest, most powerful multi..."?

jackson vile
09-18-2008, 08:18 AM
Hands down Uniqe Irradiated 17g, nothing will be softer but at the same time not mushy

samster
09-18-2008, 08:18 AM
Alpha Gut 2000, mushiest multi known to man.

ced
09-18-2008, 11:02 AM
Another multi worth mentioning might be WeissCANNON's Explosiv! - the manufacturer actually recommends stringing at 10% higher than normal. :)

I strung one of my racquets with Explosiv yesterday @56m/60x. Pretty 'stretchy', very, very easy to string.

Hit this morning and was impressed with the string .... nice feel, good control, good 'pop'. Doesn't move much, which surprised me.

Keifers
09-18-2008, 07:28 PM
Keifers, I primarily use the K-SixOne Tour 90.

And I've only used Babolat Superfine Play 17 on it.

It's a softer, less lively string compared to POSG 17, and PSGD 17 and 18
which I used to use on different rackets a long way back. But it sure
plays better than the also soft and muted Toalson Synthetic 63 that I used
to use. :shock:

When freshly strung at 58 or 60lbs, it's feels stiff and boardy like the Prince
strings I mentioned and remains that way for up to 3 hours of use within 1-2
days after stringing. It softens up and plays well for up to 4-6 hours of use
afterwards until it breaks not long after.

I can't imagine using stiff/crisp strings like the POSG 17 and PSGD 17 on the
K90, hence my search for a multi that I can string tight. Up until a few days ago, I used to think that I needed a stiff stringbed along with my
low-powered racket. I always looked for that metallic ping sound when I strike
the palm of my hand against the string bed. If I didn't hear that ping at the
right pitch, I'd cut the strings out.

As an aside, I used to use the RDX-500 mid but I found that too light. Before
that I used the Wilson Graphite Matrix (85) - now that was a heavy racket. I
need to get strong again before I try to hit with that.
protege,
I've used Superfine Play 16 over the years and liked it a lot (except for its relatively short playability life). Like you, I probably wouldn't like SFP 17 in a K90 -- it wouldn't have the "give" / feel I would like in that frame.

Similarly, POSG and PSGD 17 wouldn't have the feel I'd want.

One multi that comes to mind is Gamma Revelation 17. It provides a noticeable pocketing -- without being soft and mushy -- that could be very satisfying in a K90. I put it in a PS Tour 90 (yellow and black) a while back and quite liked the combo.

Of course, nat gut or a nat gut hybrid would be very nice in a K90 based on what you've said in this thread. Closest to nat gut would be Gamma Professional (which I'm told many gut users go to when the weather gets too wet here). K-Gut or K-Gut Pro might be a good choice after Professional.

What do you think?

(Unfortunately, I have no experience with the Isospeeds.)

Keifers
09-18-2008, 07:43 PM
Valjean, you've confirmed my suspicion. I'm interested to learn how this can be. Would I be correct if I said that:

power is derived from the string's resiliency? The more resilient the string, the more powerful it is?
softness is the perceived amount of stringbed deflection?
comfort is the apparent lack of vibration being transmitted to the arm?

I framed the topic based on my perception that "soft = powerful" so I guess I should qualify it to read "softest, most powerful multi..."?
When I spoke with a Gamma rep a few years ago, he talked about "elasticity" and "resiliency" as two of the key measurable properties of a string. The first is the amount the string stretches under load (the rate at which the stretch happens would also be a factor, I would think) and the second is the speed with which the string goes back to its unstretched state.

I'm thinking power, softness and comfort have to do with combinations of elasticity and resiliency -- and probably stiffness (which the USRSA measures and tabulates).

baek57
09-18-2008, 07:50 PM
When freshly strung at 58 or 60lbs, it's feels stiff and boardy like the Prince
strings I mentioned and remains that way for up to 3 hours of use within 1-2
days after stringing. It softens up and plays well for up to 4-6 hours of use
afterwards until it breaks not long after.


to me that sounds like you are stringing it too tight. i never want my racquets to feel stiff and boardy, even if it softens up later. i like my racquets to be good right off the stringer. maybe thats just me.

tennisfreak15347
09-18-2008, 07:53 PM
Valjean, you've confirmed my suspicion. I'm interested to learn how this can be. Would I be correct if I said that:

power is derived from the string's resiliency? The more resilient the string, the more powerful it is?
softness is the perceived amount of stringbed deflection?
comfort is the apparent lack of vibration being transmitted to the arm?

I framed the topic based on my perception that "soft = powerful" so I guess I should qualify it to read "softest, most powerful multi..."?

I'm still a little skeptical of this myself.

protege
09-19-2008, 02:03 AM
to me that sounds like you are stringing it too tight.
i never want my racquets to feel stiff and boardy, even if it softens up later. i
like my racquets to be good right off the stringer. maybe thats just
me.

Yes, I agree that it is stiff and it would be nice if the rackets are good to go
right after stringing. I used to string it at 60lbs then I took it down a notch to
58lbs. Last Sunday, I had it strung at 56lbs. My stringer was very accurate
since I was able to verify that the tension right after stringing was 56lbs.

I've been tracking the relative tension loss since then and I've measured that
it has lost about 6lbs over 4 days with the racket just sitting around.

I've embarked on an experiment that will allow me to answer the ff questions:

1. What tension range do I feel the string to be playing it's best for my game
and my racket? This allows me know when it's time for a fresh set. I'll also be
measuring and tracking the tension loss after every match.

2. How fast does the string lose tension on my racket? Does it stabilize up to
a certain point?

3. What tension should I use for the next string job and when should I
restring? This can be dictated by when I will be playing next and when I
can have my racket restrung.

It's a little over-the-top, I know. What I'm trying to get is a set-up that's
repeatable and predictable once I find the string that I like.

It's a long process and that's why I need several sets of the multis I'll be
trying out. This will keep me busy for quite some time, I reckon. :twisted:

protege
09-19-2008, 06:41 AM
protege,
I've used Superfine Play 16 over the years and liked it a lot (except for its relatively short playability life). Like you, I probably wouldn't like SFP 17 in a K90 -- it wouldn't have the "give" / feel I would like in that frame.

Similarly, POSG and PSGD 17 wouldn't have the feel I'd want.

One multi that comes to mind is Gamma Revelation 17. It provides a noticeable pocketing -- without being soft and mushy -- that could be very satisfying in a K90. I put it in a PS Tour 90 (yellow and black) a while back and quite liked the combo.

Of course, nat gut or a nat gut hybrid would be very nice in a K90 based on what you've said in this thread. Closest to nat gut would be Gamma Professional (which I'm told many gut users go to when the weather gets too wet here). K-Gut or K-Gut Pro might be a good choice after Professional.

What do you think?

(Unfortunately, I have no experience with the Isospeeds.)

Thanks for the suggestions. Yes, the SFP doesn't last long. For now, I'll have to live with it until I find the right strings. Mini-reels of K-Gut seems to be on sale @ TW at the moment.

Gamma Revelation might be more realistic for me since Professional is priced way too high for my humble budget. :)

When I spoke with a Gamma rep a few years ago, he talked about "elasticity" and "resiliency" as two of the key measurable properties of a string. The first is the amount the string stretches under load (the rate at which the stretch happens would also be a factor, I would think) and the second is the speed with which the string goes back to its unstretched state.

I'm thinking power, softness and comfort have to do with combinations of elasticity and resiliency -- and probably stiffness (which the USRSA measures and tabulates).

This is great. It follows that a strings elasticity determines it softness and comfort while resiliency determines the string's power.

So if a string were elastic but not very resilient, it would play soft and comfortable but not very powerful. Right?

Keifers
09-19-2008, 04:32 PM
^^^

One other possibility to consider is Maxim Touch. It's a lower-power multi that has excellent comfort, feel and control. So you could potentially string it lower tension in your K90 and still not have too much power.

Based on positive comments on these boards (esp. from drakulie), I just put some MT (17 ga) in my AG100 and I liked it a lot. Excellent against hard-hitting opponents because it absorbed incoming pace well and was lively enough to send the ball back with pace and control. Very good touch for half-volleys, spinny lobs, etc.

In fact the more I think about it, the more I'm inclined to suggest you try it.