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View Full Version : Roddick vs. Haas Predictions/"SPOILER"


court_zone
02-12-2005, 06:54 AM
Predictions and "Spoiler"

Roddick has not really brought his A-game lately but somehow he's pulled out with a win in tough matches because of his serve. If Roddick is flat again today, his serve will help him get out of a tough spot. Roddick in 3 sets.

alienhamster
02-12-2005, 06:58 AM
This one is a really tough call. Normally I'd pick Roddick on a hard court, but his game does seem off lately. I think Roddick may edge this out, and honestly he needs to do so to keep his confidence from taking a huge nosedive.

Wish I had TV coverage . . . :(

Pushmaster
02-12-2005, 07:09 AM
Is the match on TV?

verdasco67
02-12-2005, 07:13 AM
im going to go for haas on this one....Roddick isnt in good form....

court_zone
02-12-2005, 07:14 AM
Is the match on TV?

Tennis Channel, I believe... Too bad I don't get that coveragehttp://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/images/smilies/icon_sad.gif

Andy Hewitt
02-12-2005, 07:39 AM
Tennis Channel, I believe... Too bad I don't get that coveragehttp://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/images/smilies/icon_sad.gif
:( I cant wait until MArch 4th for Davis Cup!!! I wanna see tennis NOW!! Stupid COmcast!!!

court_zone
02-12-2005, 07:43 AM
SAP OPEN TV SCHEDULE:http://www.sapopentennis.com/tennis/tv_schedule/tv_schedule_national.htm

Andy Hewitt
02-12-2005, 07:47 AM
SAP OPEN TV SCHEDULE:http://www.sapopentennis.com/tennis/tv_schedule/tv_schedule_national.htm
Awesome! I get to see TAPED Semifinals on Monday and TAPED Final on Teusday! Go FSN CHICAGO! Wow i never even knew they showed Tennis. I wish COmcast Sports Net got some games.

rhubarb
02-12-2005, 07:59 AM
Bummer. That means Roddick must have beaten Enqvist.

dAgEnIuS
02-12-2005, 09:20 AM
Roddick has not really brought his A-game lately but somehow he's pulled out with a win in tough matches because of his serve. If Roddick is flat again today, his serve will help him get out of a tough spot. Roddick in 3 sets.
your right, roddick and agassi were playing terribly this week,,
and you all know what happend to Agassi...
i say Haas in 3 sets....

Matt H.
02-12-2005, 09:36 AM
Haas in straights.

splink779
02-12-2005, 11:12 AM
GO HAAS! Hopefully it will be as exciting as the olympic match between these two... Too bad I can't watch it.

Fee
02-12-2005, 12:31 PM
Fox Sports has the rights to the Singles semifinals and finals, but each of their affiliates will show them at different times so check your local listings or do a search at Yahoo TV.

Tommy Haas called the trainer during his match yesterday for a back injury. Those are always kind of scary.

Vlad
02-12-2005, 12:43 PM
Haas said that his back is bothering him and he can not serve at 100%. If this is the case, then I don't see him winning the match against Roddick. He needs his big serve to get easy points as Roddick will get them in bunches.....

court_zone
02-12-2005, 06:23 PM
The match has begun; Haas leading 2-1 so far, it looks like it started a bit late, but I'm not sure because I am only following it through www.sapopentennis.com

david aames
02-12-2005, 06:33 PM
The Tennis Channel will show both semis tape delayed on monday, 4PM EST

court_zone
02-12-2005, 06:37 PM
Too bad that I don't have The Tennis Channel or FSN so I won't be able to see any of the matches.

Haka Boy
02-12-2005, 07:07 PM
roddick has won the first set 7-6

nkhera1
02-12-2005, 07:09 PM
haas broke roddick and then roddick broke right back

verdasco67
02-12-2005, 07:25 PM
currently 7-6 5-2 RODDICK!

Haka Boy
02-12-2005, 07:31 PM
Roddick won, final score 7-6 6-3

nkhera1
02-12-2005, 07:33 PM
Did anyone here watch the match? If so could you please post some impressions of Haas and Roddick.

SonicSpeed
02-12-2005, 07:43 PM
I watched the match, Andy has REALLY picked up his game tonight. Tommy gave away a break through some forced errors but Andy's forehand was penetrating and he ran down a couple great drop shot and ended up winning the point. Much more pumped up Andy instead of the dejected Andy all week.

ibemadskillzz
02-12-2005, 07:48 PM
good thing that we have coverage here. the tennis channel is great- I got to watch SAP and buenos aires- LIVE.

norcal
02-12-2005, 09:06 PM
Bummer. That means Roddick must have beaten Enqvist. Rhubarb, I was sitting ********* for Enqvist/Ginepri and Enqvist was feeling it. When his forehand is on it is still one of the best out there. He was hitting winners like crazy on the run off of good shots by Ginepri. Ginepri even resorted to semi-moonballing at one point, trying to mix it up. That idea lasted all of three shots. I am not suprised Enqvist gave Roddick a heck of a match.

nkhera1
02-12-2005, 09:15 PM
lets not forget that Haas had an injured back which forced him to take somthing off of his serve

norcal
02-12-2005, 09:24 PM
lets not forget that Haas had an injured back which forced him to take somthing off of his serve
Let's not forget Haas choked in the first set tiebreak, then got his hass kicked by A-rod in the second.

Memo to Haas fans: Roddick is a better tennis player.

Pushmaster
02-12-2005, 10:31 PM
Memo to Haas fans: Roddick is a better tennis player.
Well, he was today anyway. But I still think Haas is a better all-around player (when he's 100% healthy).

andfor
02-13-2005, 01:31 AM
lets not forget that Haas had an injured back which forced him to take somthing off of his serve

Let's not forget these guys are professional tennis player. 90% of these guys are dealing with an ailment of one sort or another. Get over the excuses.

andfor
02-13-2005, 01:35 AM
Well, he was today anyway. But I still think Haas is a better all-around player (when he's 100% healthy).

Excuses, excuses. Be careful of what you said. Given Haas's physical past then he may never be better than Roddick. That's good news for you, if he never beats Roddick again at least you can use that as an excuse.

Pushmaster
02-13-2005, 06:49 AM
If it wasn't for Roddick's serve, I doubt if he would even be in the top 50. Because of Haas shoulder he can only serve at 75% of his normal pace, and he still had a very good chance of beating Roddick if he could have pulled out that 1st set. Haas' lack of cheap points of his serve was the difference. BTW, I'm not a Roddick hater by any means (terrific player), but I admit Haas is one of my favorite players to watch along with Moya and Federer. In contrast to Roddick those guys games are so beautiful to watch compared to Roddick's "herky-jerky" style.

splink779
02-13-2005, 07:06 AM
If it wasn't for Roddick's serve, I doubt if he would even be in the top 50.

I really don't like it when people say this, especially Roddick haters. It's no suprise if you take away a players greatest strength they'll become worse. If it wasn't for Fed's forehand, or Coria's speed, or Hewitt's foocus... These strengths make the players what they are. No matter how crappy he plays, he's ended the last two years at #1 or #2, and probably will end in the top 3 again this year.

goober
02-13-2005, 07:11 AM
If it wasn't for Roddick's serve, I doubt if he would even be in the top 50.

Statements like that are pretty silly.

If Pete Sampras had an average serve he would be probably not in the top 50 either.

If Stefi Graf had average forehand where would she be? Let's see slice backhand and average forehand, probably not even top 100.

If Michael Chang didn't have his speed he would not be in the top 100.

If Shaq were 6'1" instead of 7'1" he would not be in the NBA.

andfor
02-13-2005, 07:13 AM
.........and the hating continures................or is it something else?

VictorS.
02-13-2005, 07:28 AM
Has Haas' serve really dropped off since the surgery? It seems like a pretty solid serve IMO. It's been so long since he last played before surgery, that it's really difficult to remember how he served. But really...I don't remember him having a huge serve.

Pushmaster
02-13-2005, 07:35 AM
Maybe it is a silly statement in a way, but you guys are missing my point. What I'm saying is that if Haas' serve is 100%, he has a better all-around game than Roddick, and probably would have won. But them are the breaks.

Pushmaster
02-13-2005, 07:41 AM
Has Haas' serve really dropped off since the surgery? It seems like a pretty solid serve IMO. It's been so long since he last played before surgery, that it's really difficult to remember how he served. But really...I don't remember him having a huge serve.
Before Haas' surgery he could consistently hit serves in the 120-125 mph range (pretty big IMO), compared to 100-110 now, believe me it makes a big difference when your looking to get some cheap points, and can be the difference between winning and losing matches.

BreakPoint
02-13-2005, 07:45 AM
I saw the match live. Haas was the better player off the ground and at the net. I agree that the serve was the difference. Roddick did volley well, though. If Haas' serve had been 100%, I think he would have won.

BreakPoint
02-13-2005, 07:46 AM
Memo to Haas fans: Roddick is a better tennis player.

My signature below says it all.

andfor
02-13-2005, 07:46 AM
Main Entry: 1conĚjecĚture
Pronunciation: k&n-'jek-ch&r
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Middle French or Latin; Middle French, from Latin conjectura, from conjectus, past participle of conicere, literally, to throw together, from com- + jacere to throw -- more at JET
1 obsolete a : interpretation of omens b : SUPPOSITION
2 a : inference from defective or presumptive evidence b : a conclusion deduced by surmise or guesswork c : a proposition (as in mathematics) before it has been proved or disproved

goober
02-13-2005, 08:03 AM
I saw the match live. Haas was the better player off the ground and at the net. I agree that the serve was the difference. Roddick did volley well, though. If Haas' serve had been 100%, I think he would have won.

Well Roddick beat has beaten Haas 3 straight times now. What was his excuse in the other 2 matches? Was he not 100% those times either?

splink779
02-13-2005, 08:14 AM
Before Haas' surgery he could consistently hit serves in the 120-125 mph range (pretty big IMO), compared to 100-110 now, believe me it makes a big difference when your looking to get some cheap points, and can be the difference between winning and losing matches.

I think it was more like 120-130 first serve, sometimes just over 130. I don't know how he served yesterday, but after the shoulder surgery it took probably 15 mph off his first serve. His placement has always been good, even now with a slower serve. The match against Sampras in toronto in 2002, he served so well, I beleive he had more aces than Sampras by a wide margin.

nkhera1
02-13-2005, 11:48 AM
lol you guys misunderstand me. Roddick is probably my favorite player, but we can't say he has suddenly improved back to his normal self just because he beat an oppnent with a bum shoulder.

Also saying roddick wouldn't be in top 3 without his serve is like saying coria wouldn't be in the top 10 with this speed or that federer wouldn't be number 1 without his forehand

devila
02-13-2005, 11:50 AM
Credit to him, he still has a hobby despite being the most evil, undedicated, ugliest, unfit, worst-coached player ever.

Cfidave
02-13-2005, 11:53 AM
Roddick will continue to win as long as he does not have to play anyone in the top 10. Although Haas is around 17 or so, he has beaten Roddick 4 out of the last 7 times they played. If he had been 100%, for their match, my money would have been on Haas. I don't think Andy would have broken him, even once. Would have been a different outcome in the tie breaker, as well. Only reason it was as close as it was, with Haas just spinning serves in, is because Roddick has a terrible return of serve, probably one of his biggest weaknesses.

Vlad
02-13-2005, 12:00 PM
In last year's Thai Open final, Roddick could not serve 100% in the second set against Roger Federer. It is just a good indication of what Haas was feeling yesterday not being able to go full out on hid serve.
BTW Roddick lost that set 0-6 to Roger.

Fee
02-13-2005, 12:45 PM
There is nothing wrong with Tommy's shoulder. He played that match with back soreness that he had been fighting all week (and it was pretty bad after his match on Friday). That's why he was taking speed off of his serve, keeping it right around 100 mph. He was okay moving side to side and forward, it was just the twisting and reaching that was giving him the most trouble apparently. He's going to try to play Memphis and Scottsdale before Davis Cup, but personally I hope he takes a week off.

Fee
02-13-2005, 12:45 PM
oops, duplicate

goober
02-13-2005, 01:24 PM
Roddick will continue to win as long as he does not have to play anyone in the top 10.

Roddick vs top 10

Fed 1-8
Hewitt 1-5
Safin 3-2
Coria 4-0
Moya 3-1
Henman 2-3
Gaudio 0-0
Nalbandian 3-1
Agassi 1-5

Whatever dude. He only has a losing record against 4 top 10 players and his matches have been very close with Henman so I would say that it is a toss up with him.

andfor
02-13-2005, 02:48 PM
Roddick vs top 10

Fed 1-8
Hewitt 1-5
Safin 3-2
Coria 4-0
Moya 3-1
Henman 2-3
Gaudio 0-0
Nalbandian 3-1
Agassi 1-5

Whatever dude. He only has a losing record against 4 top 10 players and his matches have been very close with Henman so I would say that it is a toss up with him.

Thanks for setting the record straight. It won't stop the next wise-guy/know-it-all from popping off without any truth behind their words. While I enjoy coming here to the board I have found many like to come and run their mouth and say whatever they want. No facts, just diarrhea of the mouth.

I can only attribute that behavior to one of three possibilities.
1. Stupidity.
2. Trolling.
3. Immaturity. There are a bunch of children here.

fan_of_reds
02-13-2005, 05:13 PM
Roddick vs top 10

Fed 1-8
Hewitt 1-5
Safin 3-2
Coria 4-0
Moya 3-1
Henman 2-3
Gaudio 0-0
Nalbandian 3-1
Agassi 1-5

Whatever dude. He only has a losing record against 4 top 10 players and his matches have been very close with Henman so I would say that it is a toss up with him.

Yeah, Roddick "only" has losing records against four of the top 10 players...but let's add up the TOTAL wins and losses against the top 10 players above.. 18 W - 25 L (for a winning percentage of only 41.86%)... I'd say if you had to bet, you'd go against Roddick if he is playing a top 10 player...

andfor
02-13-2005, 05:18 PM
Yeah, Roddick "only" has losing records against four of the top 10 players...but let's add up the TOTAL wins and losses against the top 10 players above.. 18 W - 25 L (for a winning percentage of only 41.86%)... I'd say if you had to bet, you'd go against Roddick if he is playing a top 10 player...

That's very informative. Why don't you do the same for the rest of the top 10? I bet Gaudio has a killer record againt the other top 10 guys.

VictorS.
02-13-2005, 05:32 PM
Those numbers are a little deceiving. For example, most of his losses against Agassi and Hewitt were earlier in his career, before he won the '03 US Open. Take away his record against Federer, and his record against top 10 players is much much better.

Matt H.
02-13-2005, 05:36 PM
Haas's fastest serve before shoulder surgery was 136. I'd say he's lost a consistant 8-10 mph on his first serve. Last year on good days he was occaisonally touching the mid 120's or so. In '02, he would touch the low 130's.

No excuses, but i hope Haas takes a week off or so because i'm driving down to attend the Nasdaq 100 and he better be there!!!

VictorS.
02-13-2005, 05:40 PM
I'm not sure how shoulder injuries such as Haas' affect play, etc. I know though in other sports such as football and basketball, it often takes a year or so to really get back from a major injury, such as an ACL. Hopefully Haas can get the power back in his serve. I wouldn't be surprised if it is largely mental. In his mind, Haas might be taking a little bit off his serves in fear of reinjuring the shoulder again.

goober
02-13-2005, 05:44 PM
Yeah, Roddick "only" has losing records against four of the top 10 players...but let's add up the TOTAL wins and losses against the top 10 players above.. 18 W - 25 L (for a winning percentage of only 41.86%)... I'd say if you had to bet, you'd go against Roddick if he is playing a top 10 player...

Obviously you don't do much betting because I would not draw the same conclusions based on his results. I would only bet against him when he was playing Federer, Hewitt and Agassi. Well who would bet against Fed in any matchup with any player unless it was a clay court match? Hewitt and Agassi own him but I doubt I would lay a bet down on Agassi these days because his game in currently in a state of decline. Everybody else in the top 10, I would pick Roddick over on hardcourts and grass, but obviously not clay. 72% of his losses in the top 10 come from 3 players. Obviously you would pick based on who he matched up with. Making a blanket statement that you bet against Roddick when he playing any top 10 player would lose you a lot of money.

BTW Gaudio is 11-19 against top 10 players for a winning % of 37.7%. Why aren't you raggin on him? Coria who is ranked 5th is 15 -20 against top 10 players for a winning % of 42.8% basically the same as Roddicks. Keep the hating up but at least base it on some facts.

fan_of_reds
02-13-2005, 06:04 PM
Thanks for setting the record straight. It won't stop the next wise-guy/know-it-all from popping off without any truth behind their words. While I enjoy coming here to the board I have found many like to come and run their mouth and say whatever they want. No facts, just diarrhea of the mouth.

I can only attribute that behavior to one of three possibilities.
1. Stupidity.
2. Trolling.
3. Immaturity. There are a bunch of children here.

I'm not hating anyone, just simply pointing out that someone saying Roddick doesn't fare well against top 10 players is not "diarrhea of the mouth." Nor is it immature or stupid... It is just a comment based on the numbers.

As for...
Obviously you don't do much betting because I would not draw the same conclusions based on his results. I would only bet against him when he was playing Federer, Hewitt and Agassi. Well who would bet against Fed in any matchup with any player unless it was a clay court match? Hewitt and Agassi own him but I doubt I would lay a bet down on Agassi these days because his game in currently in a state of decline. Everybody else in the top 10, I would pick Roddick over on hardcourts and grass, but obviously not clay. 72% of his losses in the top 10 come from 3 players. Obviously you would pick based on who he matched up with. Making a blanket statement that you bet against Roddick when he playing any top 10 player would lose you a lot of money.

Well, if he wins roughly 42% of his matches against top 10 players, I dont see how a blanket bet against him would be a poor choice. Sure, you don't bet against Federer, or perhaps maybe you always take Roddick on hardcourts, or whatever, the point is: ON AVERAGE, if you bet against Roddick, you win (and you win 58% of the time). The numbers don't lie, nor are they tilted (although, to be fair, I didn't actually look up the wins and losses Andy had, I took YOUR numbers).

goober
02-13-2005, 06:27 PM
Well, if he wins roughly 42% of his matches against top 10 players, I dont see how a blanket bet against him would be a poor choice. Sure, you don't bet against Federer, or perhaps maybe you always take Roddick on hardcourts, or whatever, the point is: ON AVERAGE, if you bet against Roddick, you win (and you win 58% of the time). The numbers don't lie, nor are they tilted (although, to be fair, I didn't actually look up the wins and losses Andy had, I took YOUR numbers).

Well what is your point? I doubt that all the players ranked 5-10 significantly better winning % against top 10 players. I checked two-gaudios is 37.7 and Coria is 42.8. Guess what Sherlock it is hard to beat top 10 players! Maybe that is why they are ranked in the top 10? So basically you are saying you wouldn't bet against any player in the top 10 playing another player in the top 10 unless it is Federer or Hewitt. Well geez I guess that why they are ranked #1 and #2 in the world. BTW all the numbers are on the ATP site and you are free to look them up an confirm them.

alan-n
02-13-2005, 07:06 PM
I don't read too much into the percentages, as a player early in their career is nowhere near the player they are now. Roddick in the last 1 1/2 years has taken some tough slam AND master series losses to Hewitt, Federer, Pim Pim. Tough Davis cup losses to Nadal, everyone else he has fared much better. Good to see have some confidence back, I'm not a fan of Roddick but would like to see him give guys like Hewitt and Federer a tough fight rather than fold like he has in the last few matches.

andfor
02-13-2005, 08:47 PM
Well what is your point? I doubt that all the players ranked 5-10 significantly better winning % against top 10 players. I checked two-gaudios is 37.7 and Coria is 42.8. Guess what Sherlock it is hard to beat top 10 players! Maybe that is why they are ranked in the top 10? So basically you are saying you wouldn't bet against any player in the top 10 playing another player in the top 10 unless it is Federer or Hewitt. Well geez I guess that why they are ranked #1 and #2 in the world. BTW all the numbers are on the ATP site and you are free to look them up an confirm them.

Goober, Thanks for looking up some of the numbers for Red and me. I wanted Red to do it so he could see what you pointed out. I am usually pretty good looking up info as you did but was short on time and had to run.

I purposely made the comment about Gaudio blind. I knew with out looking up his record against the top 10 he was maybe the worst of all of them. Goober your right, even the top 10 guys have difficulty playing each other. Unless a top ten guy (except Fed or Hewitt) gets to play other top ten guys on their favorite surface every time, records may scew decievingly one way or another. Also, records of top 10 guys against other top 10's for players who have not been in the top 10 very long may not be the best measure of a players big match ability or ability to win period.

Vlad
02-13-2005, 09:55 PM
The fact is and I agree with some of you that if Roddick is healthy then I would not bet against him on hard courts except when he plays Fed, Hewitt, Agassi, Safin, and maybe Johannson. The rest of the field either does not posses the serve to match Roddick or return of serve to get his his balls in play on a consistent basis. There are few others who are capable of beating Roddick on hard only if they play very very decent match : Moya, Nalbandian, Haas, Canas.

On clay it is totally different scenario. I can think of maybe 20-25 players who are easily better than Roddick. Once his serve is in play on a consistent basis, then a lot of guys out there who can compete with him from the baseline.
His top 10 results are skewed somewhat becuase most of the wins he had against likes of Coria, Moya, Nalbandian, are on hard courts and if he could make later rounds in clay events and face those guys, his results would be somewhat different.

BTW, I just checked Safin - Gaudio head to head and all of their meeting were on clay (5 meetings, Safin leads 3-2) once again because Gaudio is a clay courter and he does not reach later rounds of hard court events often.

andfor
02-13-2005, 10:06 PM
Interesting stuff Vlad.

Vlad
02-13-2005, 11:47 PM
I forgot Henman.... sorry Tiger Tim
he is definately right up there with those guys.