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View Full Version : It's winter, my second serve sucks...


TsongaEatingAPineappleLol
01-09-2009, 03:14 PM
The title says it all. I totally lost my twist serve, man! I haven't practiced it since 2 weeks from today because I live in an extremely cold area, although today I did practice it today, and boy, it doesn't look that consistent.

Here is the problem: I have matches in my home club tomorrow, and my ranking will be risked if I screw up because of my serve. I might get booted out of the top 10, and yes, I will definitely have to defend it.

The question is, my second serve is alright, but not like it would go right all the time. I get it in about 5/10 times, maybe more. Should I go on with using this for tomorrow, or should I do a simple knock-in? ( 10/10 times. Not a tap-in, a knock-in)

LeeD
01-09-2009, 03:17 PM
If you can't practice at a court, practice your swings at home. Living room, garage, bedroom, whatever, you swing till you get smooth consistency.
As for strategy, you can hit them slower in and once in a while, when you want to take the chance, zing one in.
Better to have a 100% second serve that you hit oval, to the backhand, to the forehand, or into the body with an alternative kicker twist for variety.

Bungalo Bill
01-09-2009, 03:30 PM
The title says it all. I totally lost my twist serve, man! I haven't practiced it since 2 weeks from today because I live in an extremely cold area, although today I did practice it today, and boy, it doesn't look that consistent.

Here is the problem: I have matches in my home club tomorrow, and my ranking will be risked if I screw up because of my serve. I might get booted out of the top 10, and yes, I will definitely have to defend it.

The question is, my second serve is alright, but not like it would go right all the time. I get it in about 5/10 times, maybe more. Should I go on with using this for tomorrow, or should I do a simple knock-in? ( 10/10 times. Not a tap-in, a knock-in)

The living room is not going to solve a consistency problem. You need to practice on court.

If your twist serve has gone array, you might simply need to settle for being more consistent and taking some pace off the ball. Placement will be more of the important issue because you want to be able to move the ball around or your opponent will get used to the reduction in pace and pound it.

If you can hit a twist, you should be able to hit topspin as well. Might want to think about mixing that in as well.

When you are practicing it, check your toss and timing to the ball. None times out of ten, the toss has gone array and your timing is a bit off causing consistency issue with the serve.

Another thing is to ensure you are using your legs as the spring to go up to the ball.

The other strategy you can take is not thinking to "win" the point with your twist serve. Look to win the point with your strokes and volleys instead. Use the serve and place it well to start the point. If you win the point from your serve, that is icing on the cake.

LeeD
01-09-2009, 03:57 PM
I still maintain that swing practice is better than NO practice at all.
Sorry, Bungalow. I didn't say swing practice is better than court practice.
And "taking pace" off the kick/twist to better consistency. Do you mean your rackethead swing speed or do you mean the ball speed thru the air? Two very different things, and you are unclear.
And original poster needs an instant fix, not a longtern cure.... he needed it today !!!
So you're going to introduce a completely new serve (topspin) to his repetoire NOW?
And I don't understand fundamentals?
Maybe we both should get into the cab right away.:oops::oops::oops:

Noaler
01-09-2009, 04:37 PM
I'm sorry but practicing in your living room doesn't help one bit. Especially if you have a lot of furniture.

Or you could just use your second serve as your first if its still pretty bad.

LeeD
01-09-2009, 05:14 PM
Then I guess you don't believe in visualization.
But swinging a racket is even better, you get to excercise the muscles, tendons, and ligaments while trying to replicate the stroke over and over again.
Possibly for you, it's worthless.
For me, it allows me to take 7 months off tennis and still swing the racket about the same as when I left the game.
Now of course, if you strokes are erratic, incorrect, or just plain wrong, then swing reinforces exactly that.:shock::shock:
Replication is the goal.

TsongaEatingAPineappleLol
01-10-2009, 09:55 AM
The living room is not going to solve a consistency problem. You need to practice on court.

If your twist serve has gone array, you might simply need to settle for being more consistent and taking some pace off the ball. Placement will be more of the important issue because you want to be able to move the ball around or your opponent will get used to the reduction in pace and pound it.

If you can hit a twist, you should be able to hit topspin as well. Might want to think about mixing that in as well.

When you are practicing it, check your toss and timing to the ball. None times out of ten, the toss has gone array and your timing is a bit off causing consistency issue with the serve.

Another thing is to ensure you are using your legs as the spring to go up to the ball.

The other strategy you can take is not thinking to "win" the point with your twist serve. Look to win the point with your strokes and volleys instead. Use the serve and place it well to start the point. If you win the point from your serve, that is icing on the cake.

Thank you man. A slight cut at the ball with smooth motion will do the trick. You saved me man ;-)

Mada
01-10-2009, 09:59 AM
I'm sorry but practicing in your living room doesn't help one bit. Especially if you have a lot of furniture.

Or you could just use your second serve as your first if its still pretty bad.

Air-swinging does help. It helps you get the feel for the stroke. It's not a lot, but it's better than nothing.

Noaler
01-10-2009, 03:59 PM
Air-swinging does help. It helps you get the feel for the stroke. It's not a lot, but it's better than nothing.

Yes for the stroke, but I don't think the serve motion really helps honestly...

oneguy21
01-10-2009, 05:03 PM
A question I've always had was if a twist serve is a topspin-slice serve that causes the ball to curve to the left and kick to the right (for a righty), then what is really a normal topspin-slice serve that causes the ball to curve to the left and kick in the same direction? According to Wikipedia, three kick serves exist: topspin, topspin-slice, and twist. Having a difficult time differentiating between twist and topspin-slice.

[osu]ilovecows
01-11-2009, 04:25 AM
A twist serve and a topspin-slice serve are not the same. From a righty server's point of view, a topspin-slice serve will curve to the left and continue to kick to the left. A twist serve will curve to the left, but kick to the right.

Bungalo Bill
01-12-2009, 08:05 AM
I still maintain that swing practice is better than NO practice at all.

That isnt the practice he needs. He needs to practice improving his consistency. Timing with his toss and his swing is not going to be practiced in a living room. He will not be able to get feedback from the ball whether it landed in, out, or in the net by swinging in his living room.

Please you are beginning to embarrass yourself and I will be obliged to help you do so.

Sorry, Bungalow. I didn't say swing practice is better than court practice.

No, but practing the mechanics of the serve and timing with the toss is the right solution.

And "taking pace" off the kick/twist to better consistency. Do you mean your rackethead swing speed or do you mean the ball speed thru the air? Two very different things, and you are unclear.

LOL!!!!! ARE YOU KIDDING ME? LOL!!!!!!!!

And original poster needs an instant fix, not a longtern cure.... he needed it today !!!

Does he? Practicing on the court is what is going to be needed to help improve an inconsistent serve. The living room won't.

So you're going to introduce a completely new serve (topspin) to his repetoire NOW?
And I don't understand fundamentals?

No, you do not understand fundamentals. Your advice has been weak and I can tell your stuff is for a 65 year old man that lives in no-man's land with tumble weeds blowing around. In other words, you dont know what you are talking about.

If you read my post it said USUALLY a person that can hit a twist serve can hit a topspin serve. There is nothing being changed. If he is having trouble with a certain serve in a match, he should use his other serve more (if it is reasonably consistent) instead.

Is this real hard to understand?

Maybe we both should get into the cab right away.:oops::oops::oops:

What I think is you should stop trying to challenge me. You will not win this game. I know far more than you about playing and coaching tennis than your little high school varisty stint could ever possibly give you.

Take it as a missle fired across the bow of your ship. This is a warning shot.

Bungalo Bill
01-12-2009, 08:12 AM
Now of course, if you strokes are erratic, incorrect, or just plain wrong, then swing reinforces exactly that.:shock::shock:
Replication is the goal.

IT IS REPETITION THAT IS IMPORTANT!!!

That means the ball is in the hand and he is swinging to hit the darn ball!!!!!

Timing is not going to be learned in a living room!

And further, this contradicts your other post when we advised the person to not short-arm or straigten his legs. You were the one that clamored about us trying to make his stroke perfect. You went on mumbling about how people who have these "pretty strokes" cant hit the ball.

Now, you are saying technique is important? LOL!!!!!

Consider this another shot across the bow.

Djokovicfan4life
01-12-2009, 08:21 AM
Bungalo Bill = The Spanish Armada

LeeD = A couple of tugboats

Djokovicfan4life = The cowardly Frenchman watching from the beaches.

LeeD
01-12-2009, 08:51 AM
I'll take that similie..:):)
The tugboat just chugs along, looking ugly but moving in the right direction.
The Armada looks almighty, blowing steam and most everyone out of the water, only to look foolish when it really matters.
Sorry Bill, I'm just funnin up above. I respect your ideas as a tennis coach.
But consider this.... When someone says they CANNOT practice with a ball at a court, you tell him to practice with a ball at a tennis court. I recommend the shortest route....swing practice.
If I was snowed in, no court availible, I'd work on my swing, to get it long and smooth, consistent and repetitive. You wouldn't, because you have access to a tennis court at all times !!
Bungalow.... like most 13 year olds, you can read, but cannot understand what you read. I never said all pretty strokes don't work. What I said was sometimes ugly strokes work, most but not all pretty strokes work.
You can't tell the difference because you are BillAlmighty and can never be crossed, challenged, or disputed.
There are MANY paths to tennis skills. You way definetely works. But still, there are many other ways that also works.

Bungalo Bill
01-12-2009, 11:18 AM
I'll take that similie..:):)
The tugboat just chugs along, looking ugly but moving in the right direction.
The Armada looks almighty, blowing steam and most everyone out of the water, only to look foolish when it really matters.
Sorry Bill, I'm just funnin up above. I respect your ideas as a tennis coach.
But consider this.... When someone says they CANNOT practice with a ball at a court, you tell him to practice with a ball at a tennis court. I recommend the shortest route....swing practice.
If I was snowed in, no court availible, I'd work on my swing, to get it long and smooth, consistent and repetitive. You wouldn't, because you have access to a tennis court at all times !!
Bungalow.... like most 13 year olds, you can read, but cannot understand what you read. I never said all pretty strokes don't work. What I said was sometimes ugly strokes work, most but not all pretty strokes work.
You can't tell the difference because you are BillAlmighty and can never be crossed, challenged, or disputed.
There are MANY paths to tennis skills. You way definetely works. But still, there are many other ways that also works.

I am not "funnin" at all anymore.

I have no problem being challenged. I have no problem arguing. But please, this isnt even fair. I would at least like to be challenged by someone who actually knows something about tennis.

You constantly speak from only your limited "experience" and downplay things you have no business downplaying.

Here it is in a nutshell.

1. You have no coaching experience in tennis.

2. You offer pat answers and call it "advice" or "instruction."

3. You dont have a clue what you are talking about except on what you have learned in your little isolated 2.0 world. And even what you learned is questionable.

4. You have never studied technique.

5. You have never coached players nor understand the issues people face concerning various issues.

6. You can not offer anyone long-term advice because you have no basis and no foundation.

7. You offer advice that potentially can cause more harm than good in a players game. In other words, your advice is limiting players and you are actually creating mediocre tennis players because of your little "quick fixes."

Warning shots are done.

LeeD
01-12-2009, 11:25 AM
Yes, I now see why you are a "former" teaching pro.
Your people skills are outstanding, you have patience and present your points in a simple and logical manner.
And you are always positive, so the GAME of tennis can represent a positive experience, rather than a negative "I know everything, you know nothing, even thos you're a 2.0 beginner" .
I am everything, because I used to be a PRO teacher!
NObody else can know anything, because they are not me!

Spokewench
01-12-2009, 11:39 AM
Ok, I feel like a mother now! Get over yourselves boys. Being derogatory and combative does not get anyone anywhere.

It's time to live and let live. All people have different opinions. Let it go.

spoke

Bungalo Bill
01-12-2009, 11:48 AM
Yes, I now see why you are a "former" teaching pro.

Guess what, you are wrong again.

Your people skills are outstanding, you have patience and present your points in a simple and logical manner.
And you are always positive, so the GAME of tennis can represent a positive experience, rather than a negative "I know everything, you know nothing, even thos you're a 2.0 beginner" .
I am everything, because I used to be a PRO teacher!
NObody else can know anything, because they are not me!

You are nothing. And guess what? I am great with people and with those who genuinely want to learn and grow. People like you who think they know, come in and degrade good instruction from various people, and then provide weak advice is who I am not very civil with.

Get a clue.

LeeD
01-12-2009, 12:03 PM
Ah, but the sandbox allows for all creeds, sizes, races, intelligence levels, to all play together......

oneguy21
01-12-2009, 01:20 PM
Ah, but the sandbox allows for all creeds, sizes, races, intelligence levels, to all play together......

Yes, but that does not mean your advice should be taken seriously. No one is stoppping you from babbling on about your tips, but no one will probably care what you say.

LeeD
01-12-2009, 03:10 PM
I never said everyone should adopt my advice.
If you choose to disregard, good for you!
I must be totally wrong everytime I come onto this BB, and you know everything of course.
As BungBob said, I don't know anything at all, so just disregard my advice.
Advice is free.... you can disregard it anytime you want!

Bungalo Bill
01-12-2009, 03:20 PM
I never said everyone should adopt my advice.
If you choose to disregard, good for you!

I disregarded it.

anachronism
01-19-2009, 02:42 AM
hmm... so, I should practice tennis on a tennis court? lol

Couldn't have been that hard to say

LeeD
01-19-2009, 09:44 AM
Lets beat the dead horse some more!
OP #1 said he hasn't hit on a court for two weeks. Whether by choice or weather we don't know.
But he's concerned with consistency. He doesn't have weeks to practice. He said "thanks" to Bill already.
Still, practicing a swing is more than 50% of the second serve mechanics. I assume most of you can throw the ball up and hit center. Most of you cannot replicate the swing and body mechanics over and over again.

Petekbladetour1
01-19-2009, 09:45 AM
The title says it all. I totally lost my twist serve, man! I haven't practiced it since 2 weeks from today because I live in an extremely cold area, although today I did practice it today, and boy, it doesn't look that consistent.

Here is the problem: I have matches in my home club tomorrow, and my ranking will be risked if I screw up because of my serve. I might get booted out of the top 10, and yes, I will definitely have to defend it.

The question is, my second serve is alright, but not like it would go right all the time. I get it in about 5/10 times, maybe more. Should I go on with using this for tomorrow, or should I do a simple knock-in? ( 10/10 times. Not a tap-in, a knock-in)

hm. i had 4 weeks off and after 30 min my 2nd erve was back to normal