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Mansewerz
01-20-2009, 01:50 PM
I'm gonna hybrid it with the M2 I got!

Max Winther
01-20-2009, 01:53 PM
I've had my hollowcore for a good month, its the M2 I'm waiting for!

TonyB
01-20-2009, 01:59 PM
Why would you bother hybriding two strings that you've never tried before as full sets? What could you possibly learn?

Maybe the M2 is perfect for you, but you're ruining it with the HC. Or vice versa. It just makes sense to play with a full set before you hybrid so you know what characteristics you're looking for from each string. The two strings in a hybrid are supposed to complement each other, offering specific benefits of each string to fill in the gaps of the other string. But it's all personal preference.

Making a hybrid out of two random strings is a recipe for disappointment.

nadalfan!
01-20-2009, 02:27 PM
Why would you bother hybriding two strings that you've never tried before as full sets? What could you possibly learn?

Maybe the M2 is perfect for you, but you're ruining it with the HC. Or vice versa. It just makes sense to play with a full set before you hybrid so you know what characteristics you're looking for from each string. The two strings in a hybrid are supposed to complement each other, offering specific benefits of each string to fill in the gaps of the other string. But it's all personal preference.

Making a hybrid out of two random strings is a recipe for disappointment.

That first option would never happen! ;) Hollow core sucks arse and the luxilon m2 is actually pretty good. Especially since it was free! Nothing beats that!:D

Mansewerz
01-20-2009, 02:37 PM
Why would you bother hybriding two strings that you've never tried before as full sets? What could you possibly learn?

Maybe the M2 is perfect for you, but you're ruining it with the HC. Or vice versa. It just makes sense to play with a full set before you hybrid so you know what characteristics you're looking for from each string. The two strings in a hybrid are supposed to complement each other, offering specific benefits of each string to fill in the gaps of the other string. But it's all personal preference.

Making a hybrid out of two random strings is a recipe for disappointment.

Meh, i'm not really into poly. Just trying it out. Maybe i'll just give the M2 to my bro and take all of the hollow core :D

TonyB
01-20-2009, 04:24 PM
Meh, i'm not really into poly. Just trying it out. Maybe i'll just give the M2 to my bro and take all of the hollow core :D


Good idea. Hollow Core is awesome. At this point, I don't see myself using any other string. I still have 4 sets of Tonic+ gut that used to be my regular string that I'm not planning on using anymore because of the switch to Hollow Core.

And I'm not joking, either. The string is very, very good and suits my game perfectly. Don't listen to the naysayers that call it Hollow Krap or other such cleverisms. Those people are typically 3.5 level 13 year old poly-loving Nadal wannabes who wouldn't know what a good string felt like if... well... they just wouldn't know what a good string feels like at all :)

ag200boy
01-20-2009, 04:44 PM
Good idea. Hollow Core is awesome. At this point, I don't see myself using any other string. I still have 4 sets of Tonic+ gut that used to be my regular string that I'm not planning on using anymore because of the switch to Hollow Core.

And I'm not joking, either. The string is very, very good and suits my game perfectly. Don't listen to the naysayers that call it Hollow Krap or other such cleverisms. Those people are typically 3.5 level 13 year old poly-loving Nadal wannabes who wouldn't know what a good string felt like if... well... they just wouldn't know what a good string feels like at all :)

while i may be your "poly-loving teenagers", and we've had this discussion before i believe, just because you like a string doesn't mean that everyone who dislikes it doesn't know what a good string feels like. I don't bother calling out all the multi/gut users that say poly is crap, I don't think their ideas of what a good string is is any worse then mine. Also, just because people use poly doesn't mean they are trying to imitate pros, contrary to popular belief, some people actually swing fast that aren't 7.0 pro's and some people, like myself, much prefer the feel of a co-poly to the feel of gut.

[/RANT]

Jsa2u
01-20-2009, 04:56 PM
[/quote]Those people are typically 3.5 level 13 year old poly-loving Nadal wannabes[/quote]


What is wrong with being one of these people? Nadal is the #1 player, who better to look up to. Atleast they arent sitting on their butts playing video games all day. Lots of people love poly strings. Don't take the shortcut!

purple-n-gold
01-20-2009, 05:06 PM
I'm gonna hybrid it with the M2 I got!

String it middle to high tension for you raq, i strung this hybrid on the low end and should've gone at least a few lbs. higher.

Tonyb is probably correct on trying one at a time though since they're new,
M2 seems to be getting better reviews than HC, but tonyb really seems to like HC.

TonyB
01-20-2009, 05:18 PM
M2 seems to be getting better reviews than HC, but tonyb really seems to like HC.



That's because M2 is a poly and the majority of this forum is pro-poly.

I'm in the distinct minority in that I prefer classic 100% graphite, 50-flex racquets with tons of feel and strings that go with them. HC is a unique string with incredible feel and response. I wish it had a bit more spin, but the controlled power and feedback are awesome.

I've never strung it in a stiff frame, so I'm not sure if it "sucks" in that case. As with everything else, personal preference is the ultimate factor, so maybe those who like stiff frames just hate the feel of HC. But then again, you'd think that a stiff frame with a stiff string would be much worse.

Bottom line is that you probably shouldn't listen to generic criticisms of the string like "HC sucks" or similar literary gems. Figure out if the frame, tension, playing style, etc. matches your game and then decide if it's worth a shot. As I (and others) have said, HC has a very unique feel to it that no other string on the market seems to offer. That alone puts it in a different category.

Mansewerz
01-20-2009, 05:19 PM
Good idea. Hollow Core is awesome. At this point, I don't see myself using any other string. I still have 4 sets of Tonic+ gut that used to be my regular string that I'm not planning on using anymore because of the switch to Hollow Core.

And I'm not joking, either. The string is very, very good and suits my game perfectly. Don't listen to the naysayers that call it Hollow Krap or other such cleverisms. Those people are typically 3.5 level 13 year old poly-loving Nadal wannabes who wouldn't know what a good string felt like if... well... they just wouldn't know what a good string feels like at all :)

Never used poly. How would it compare to PSGD? More feel? is it soft?

Mansewerz
01-20-2009, 05:20 PM
That's because M2 is a poly and the majority of this forum is pro-poly.

I'm in the distinct minority in that I prefer classic 100% graphite, 50-flex racquets with tons of feel and strings that go with them. HC is a unique string with incredible feel and response. I wish it had a bit more spin, but the controlled power and feedback are awesome.

I've never strung it in a stiff frame, so I'm not sure if it "sucks" in that case. As with everything else, personal preference is the ultimate factor, so maybe those who like stiff frames just hate the feel of HC. But then again, you'd think that a stiff frame with a stiff string would be much worse.

Bottom line is that you probably shouldn't listen to generic criticisms of the string like "HC sucks" or similar literary gems. Figure out if the frame, tension, playing style, etc. matches your game and then decide if it's worth a shot. As I (and others) have said, HC has a very unique feel to it that no other string on the market seems to offer. That alone puts it in a different category.

My frame is 60 flex or lower (it's a pretty well used frame) :D

TonyB
01-20-2009, 05:44 PM
Never used poly. How would it compare to PSGD? More feel? is it soft?


Much more feel. It's not even close. PSGD is a decent syn gut, but it is still muted like most syn guts. HC is responsive, but not as lively as a multi, for example. It's got extremely controlled power, and its characteristics are very balanced. Maybe that's why people don't like it... it doesn't "Wow" them in any category. It's just a great string that does everything equally well, but in a toned-down way. Good spin, good control (I might say great control), good power, great feedback and feel. Not exceptional spin like poly. Not incredible power like gut or a multi. It's "responsive" and "lively" without being overly powerful, if that makes any sense. It's easy to feel where your shots are going, no matter how hard or soft you hit them. That's what "great feel" means to me.


My frame is 60 flex or lower (it's a pretty well used frame) :D


60 flex is respectable. I see you're using a Fischer, which is not a classic "graphite feel", but it's still soft, but in more of a ProKennex way. But I would guess the HC still would be suitable for that frame. My guess is that your Fischer would respond better with a full set of HC than it would a full set of M2. I used to use Fischer for about 6 months to 1 year, so I know how they feel. They're unique, but I think they would do well with the HC.

Mansewerz
01-20-2009, 05:46 PM
Much more feel. It's not even close. PSGD is a decent syn gut, but it is still muted like most syn guts. HC is responsive, but not as lively as a multi, for example. It's got extremely controlled power, and its characteristics are very balanced. Maybe that's why people don't like it... it doesn't "Wow" them in any category. It's just a great string that does everything equally well, but in a toned-down way. Good spin, good control (I might say great control), good power, great feedback and feel. Not exceptional spin like poly. Not incredible power like gut or a multi. It's "responsive" and "lively" without being overly powerful, if that makes any sense. It's easy to feel where your shots are going, no matter how hard or soft you hit them. That's what "great feel" means to me.



60 flex is respectable. I see you're using a Fischer, which is not a classic "graphite feel", but it's still soft, but in more of a ProKennex way. But I would guess the HC still would be suitable for that frame. My guess is that your Fischer would respond better with a full set of HC than it would a full set of M2. I used to use Fischer for about 6 months to 1 year, so I know how they feel. They're unique, but I think they would do well with the HC.

Nice, my grommets broke a last week. i clipped the broken piece off and am waiting for the replacement I ordered to be delivered. Hopefully once my SP syn gut breaks, i'll replace the grommets and put in a fresh set of HC. What tension would you recommend?

Max Winther
01-20-2009, 05:55 PM
Yeah, my set is just waiting in my string drawer for when I feel like stringing it up. I don't think I'm gonna like it though. It will have too much power, but I'll give it a shot.

TonyB
01-20-2009, 06:00 PM
Yeah, my set is just waiting in my string drawer for when I feel like stringing it up. I don't think I'm gonna like it though. It will have too much power, but I'll give it a shot.


I'm pretty sure that "Hollow Core" and "too much power" will never appear together in the same sentence.

You'll be fine. Don't prejudice your opinion of the string before you even try it. Go into it with an open mind and try to give it a fair evaluation.

TonyB
01-20-2009, 06:04 PM
Nice, my grommets broke a last week. i clipped the broken piece off and am waiting for the replacement I ordered to be delivered. Hopefully once my SP syn gut breaks, i'll replace the grommets and put in a fresh set of HC. What tension would you recommend?


From your sig, you're stringing regular syn gut at 60 lb. I would keep the same tension. My guess is that you'll notice more ball pocketing right away, and probably THINK that you're getting more power in a trampoline-like way as a result. But you're not. You're just getting more feedback on the ball speed than you're used to. It will feel like you're hitting rockets, but the speed will probably be slightly LESS than you're getting with your current setup. (I'm just guessing here).

Anyways, stick with the same tension. I doubt it will feel any stiffer than your current setup, and you won't see any increase in power, so you should be okay. It might take a little while to adjust to the increase in feel and feedback, along with the slight reduction in power, but otherwise you should be fine.

Mansewerz
01-20-2009, 06:06 PM
From your sig, you're stringing regular syn gut at 60 lb. I would keep the same tension. My guess is that you'll notice more ball pocketing right away, and probably THINK that you're getting more power in a trampoline-like way as a result. But you're not. You're just getting more feedback on the ball speed than you're used to. It will feel like you're hitting rockets, but the speed will probably be slightly LESS than you're getting with your current setup. (I'm just guessing here).

Anyways, stick with the same tension. I doubt it will feel any stiffer than your current setup, and you won't see any increase in power, so you should be okay. It might take a little while to adjust to the increase in feel and feedback, along with the slight reduction in power, but otherwise you should be fine.

Sweet, i can't wait until my strings break :D

ag200boy
01-20-2009, 06:34 PM
Yeah, my set is just waiting in my string drawer for when I feel like stringing it up. I don't think I'm gonna like it though. It will have too much power, but I'll give it a shot.

go into it with an open mind, but we have similar tastes in strings, and this string did nothing for me. but who knows?

TonyB
01-20-2009, 07:17 PM
go into it with an open mind, but we have similar tastes in strings, and this string did nothing for me. but who knows?


Notice that it's not just STRINGS, but the string-frame combination that matters.

Don't just judge a string by itself. It has to be paired up with a frame to be able to evaluate it. So, don't dismiss a string just because it doesn't work with your specific frame at your specific tension. It's amazing how many GOOD combinations of frames and strings there are out there.

ag200boy
01-21-2009, 05:12 AM
Notice that it's not just STRINGS, but the string-frame combination that matters.

Don't just judge a string by itself. It has to be paired up with a frame to be able to evaluate it. So, don't dismiss a string just because it doesn't work with your specific frame at your specific tension. It's amazing how many GOOD combinations of frames and strings there are out there.

we also both use leaded up aerogel 200's

javierjavier
01-21-2009, 08:40 AM
Why would you bother hybriding two strings that you've never tried before as full sets? What could you possibly learn?

Maybe the M2 is perfect for you, but you're ruining it with the HC. Or vice versa. It just makes sense to play with a full set before you hybrid so you know what characteristics you're looking for from each string. The two strings in a hybrid are supposed to complement each other, offering specific benefits of each string to fill in the gaps of the other string. But it's all personal preference.

Making a hybrid out of two random strings is a recipe for disappointment.
i strung it up as a hybrid in my old liquidmetal radical. my regular set up is usually poly mains and synthetic gut crosses. i figured if i liked it i'd string up my current racket with the same setup.

i suppose it makes sense to try the full set to get a feel for the characteristics of each individually, but actually if your regular setup is a poly/ synthetic gut hybrid the ideal test would be matching the M2 with your regular syn gut crosses, and the hollow core with your regular poly mains.

now that i think about it, this is what i should have done.

i haven't had a chance to hit with it yet, but i'll report back when i do.

Teamtomo
01-21-2009, 08:44 AM
Is Hollowcore any good??

Mansewerz
01-21-2009, 09:26 AM
Hollow core is a multi, right?

Blade0324
01-21-2009, 09:39 AM
TonyB, I have tried both the M2 in a full set as well as the Hollowcore in a full set and hybrid. I use a 63 flex frame with 16x19 pattern and am by no means a teenager. I went into the Hollowcore not having read any reviews on it here as when I try a new string I want to form my own opinion without being poisoned by others thoughts. I can tell you that IMO Hollowcore is a VERY powerfull string that showed little control in a full set or a hybrid. I strung it up at 62 in a full set and at 63 as crosses with a Poly main. I found that it moves around a lot and had very little spin capability. It is indeed very soft and responsive but I found it nearly unplayable due to the amount of power and lack of control. It even moved around a good deal in the hybrid with a poly which very few strings do. IMO there are many other Multi's, or Syn. guts out there that far exceed that quality of Hollowcore. As for the M2 I find it to be a nice string. I have not tried it in a hybrid yet as I am still happy with how it's playing as a full set. Good control, decent spin for poly, softer than many poly's and I find good feel as well. Obviously everyone likes something a little different and that is why there are so many strings out there for us to choose from. Just offering my thoughts on the strings.

TonyB
01-21-2009, 01:57 PM
TonyB, I have tried both the M2 in a full set as well as the Hollowcore in a full set and hybrid. I use a 63 flex frame with 16x19 pattern and am by no means a teenager. I went into the Hollowcore not having read any reviews on it here as when I try a new string I want to form my own opinion without being poisoned by others thoughts. I can tell you that IMO Hollowcore is a VERY powerfull string that showed little control in a full set or a hybrid. I strung it up at 62 in a full set and at 63 as crosses with a Poly main. I found that it moves around a lot and had very little spin capability. It is indeed very soft and responsive but I found it nearly unplayable due to the amount of power and lack of control. It even moved around a good deal in the hybrid with a poly which very few strings do. IMO there are many other Multi's, or Syn. guts out there that far exceed that quality of Hollowcore. As for the M2 I find it to be a nice string. I have not tried it in a hybrid yet as I am still happy with how it's playing as a full set. Good control, decent spin for poly, softer than many poly's and I find good feel as well. Obviously everyone likes something a little different and that is why there are so many strings out there for us to choose from. Just offering my thoughts on the strings.


Quite honestly, this does not match my experience (and a few others) at all. Too powerful? Lack of control? Strung at 62 lb.?

I string my frames at around 50 lb. (50 mains, 48 crosses) with the HC and it STILL doesn't have too much power. I play what I would consider a "power game" with above-average topspin on both sides, but still rely heavily on touchy-feely finesse shots in doubles. If I crank my forehand up, it's unreturnable, so I know what "too much power" feels like in a string. HC is just about at the opposite end of the scale... it actually might have too LITTLE power for a syn gut. Just about every other syn gut I've ever used (Klip, Gosen, Prince, you name it) is noticebly more powerful than HC at the same tension. But since I get more control with the HC, I can live without the extra power and I have adjusted my game accordingly.

Because of the lower power, and great feel and feedback of the string, I find it to have tremendous control. Again, I'm really surprised at your experience with HC, because they do not match mine at all.

am22fcw
01-21-2009, 02:04 PM
Hollow core is a multi, right?

hollow core is a synthetic gut

ag200boy
01-21-2009, 02:27 PM
Quite honestly, this does not match my experience (and a few others) at all. Too powerful? Lack of control? Strung at 62 lb.?

I string my frames at around 50 lb. (50 mains, 48 crosses) with the HC and it STILL doesn't have too much power. I play what I would consider a "power game" with above-average topspin on both sides, but still rely heavily on touchy-feely finesse shots in doubles. If I crank my forehand up, it's unreturnable, so I know what "too much power" feels like in a string. HC is just about at the opposite end of the scale... it actually might have too LITTLE power for a syn gut. Just about every other syn gut I've ever used (Klip, Gosen, Prince, you name it) is noticebly more powerful than HC at the same tension. But since I get more control with the HC, I can live without the extra power and I have adjusted my game accordingly.

Because of the lower power, and great feel and feedback of the string, I find it to have tremendous control. Again, I'm really surprised at your experience with HC, because they do not match mine at all.

i found too much power strung at 65, i wouldn't say it was "uncontrollable" but i just couldn't hit out with the confidence that i enjoy with full poly

TonyB
01-21-2009, 02:58 PM
i found too much power strung at 65, i wouldn't say it was "uncontrollable" but i just couldn't hit out with the confidence that i enjoy with full poly


What about natural gut? I guarantee you 100% that any natural gut will blow HC away in terms of power. Does that mean natural gut is crap?

All I'm saying is that coming from high-tensioned poly (60+ lb. per your sig), everything will feel more powerful initially. Multis, syn guts, natural guts, whatever. Try switching to X-1 Biphase or something similar.

I just think it's funny. Finally, a string comes along that isn't just a retread of the other thousands of strings on the market, and everyone calls it crap because it doesn't play like poly (not you specifically, but others).

am22fcw
01-21-2009, 03:14 PM
i agree 100% with tonyB

"I just think it's funny. Finally, a string comes along that isn't just a retread of the other thousands of strings on the market, and everyone calls it crap because it doesn't play like poly (not you specifically, but others)."

couldn't have said it any better myself

TonyB
01-21-2009, 04:08 PM
Here's the other reviewer whose experience with HC matches mine.

http://www.essentialtennis.com/gearReviewBlog/


Scroll down the page to the Hollow Core Playtest blog entry. Here's a snip:

"... in comparison to other strings at the same tension, I did not notice any added power. I would rate the power level as average."


Here's another opinion from the original HC thread:

"I usually use multis (Yonex 850 or FiberTour) or PSG DF. By comparison, the new Wilson string has the least power, its almost anemic. Found myself taking huge cuts at the ball to generate any pace."

ag200boy
01-21-2009, 04:41 PM
What about natural gut? I guarantee you 100% that any natural gut will blow HC away in terms of power. Does that mean natural gut is crap?

All I'm saying is that coming from high-tensioned poly (60+ lb. per your sig), everything will feel more powerful initially. Multis, syn guts, natural guts, whatever. Try switching to X-1 Biphase or something similar.

I just think it's funny. Finally, a string comes along that isn't just a retread of the other thousands of strings on the market, and everyone calls it crap because it doesn't play like poly (not you specifically, but others).

first off, let me apologize, as i know it sounds like i am bashing you in all of my posts, but im not! :)

second, Correct, I absolutely hate natural gut, too soft and too much power

third of all, i know everything else will have too much power, thats why i pretty much don't like anything but poly

and last but not least, you said earlier that it doesn't stand out in any category, it simply performs in every category. While i understand that this is important, there ARE certain qualities that, without them, I do not like the string, 3 of these are:

1. Spin: Come on, compared to an 18g poly at 60 lbs, NO 16g multi/syn gut will even compare!
2. Control: control was actually decent with hollowcore, but once again, doesn't stick out at me.
3. This is one of the most important things i look for in a string, and its rather hard to explain actually. I enjoy a string that i can feel the ball hitting the strings, thats where high tension poly wins the race for me. I don't like soft strings primarily because i just seem to rip right through the ball, and it just feels mushy to me, which i hate.

i hope this cleared up why i think how i do about hollowcore

Max Winther
01-21-2009, 04:49 PM
Yeah, I can't really hit with anything else other than poly. I've altered my game to my specific setup, and everything else flies long. It's not a bad thing that I think hollowcore (or any other Syn gut) is too powerful, its just the type of game I play. It may work for you, it may not.

TonyB
01-21-2009, 05:01 PM
first off, let me apologize, as i know it sounds like i am bashing you in all of my posts, but im not! :)

second, Correct, I absolutely hate natural gut, too soft and too much power

third of all, i know everything else will have too much power, thats why i pretty much don't like anything but poly

and last but not least, you said earlier that it doesn't stand out in any category, it simply performs in every category. While i understand that this is important, there ARE certain qualities that, without them, I do not like the string, 3 of these are:

1. Spin: Come on, compared to an 18g poly at 60 lbs, NO 16g multi/syn gut will even compare!
2. Control: control was actually decent with hollowcore, but once again, doesn't stick out at me.
3. This is one of the most important things i look for in a string, and its rather hard to explain actually. I enjoy a string that i can feel the ball hitting the strings, thats where high tension poly wins the race for me. I don't like soft strings primarily because i just seem to rip right through the ball, and it just feels mushy to me, which i hate.

i hope this cleared up why i think how i do about hollowcore



First off, no apologies are necessary. You didn't say anything offensive at all in your posts. Frankly, mine were harsher than yours.

Second, if you don't like HC, then you don't like it. You don't really need to explain it, other than to maybe elaborate on the fact that you're comparing it against your usual high-tension poly setup, which gives us a point of reference.

Most people just call it "crap" and that's it. If you don't like strings that are softer than poly and hate HC because of it, then that's fine, but at least be able to describe WHY you hate it.

And sure, if you need 18 gauge poly strung at high tensions to get the spin you need to play your style of tennis, then yeah, pretty much nothing else will compare. Fortunately for me, I'm perfectly fine with softer 16 gauge strings. I get all the spin I need from my technique.

Max Winther
01-21-2009, 05:30 PM
And sure, if you need 18 gauge poly strung at high tensions to get the spin you need to play your style of tennis, then yeah, pretty much nothing else will compare. Fortunately for me, I'm perfectly fine with softer 16 gauge strings. I get all the spin I need from my technique.

Well, what racquet do you use? I chose an 18x20 racquet for the added control and lower power, and the 18g poly helps us with spin potential because an 18x20 naturally has less of it than a more open pattern.

ag200boy
01-22-2009, 04:10 AM
Well, what racquet do you use? I chose an 18x20 racquet for the added control and lower power, and the 18g poly helps us with spin potential because an 18x20 naturally has less of it than a more open pattern.

also, i dont like to do a windshield wiper type stroke, i mainly hit through the ball, and thin poly gives the ball some extra weight

skierpaul
01-27-2009, 08:26 PM
I've really enjoyed the Wilson Hollow Core. I feel that it gives a good amount of feel, its not underpowered, and has decent bite for a 16g. I'll mirror the sentiments of this being a very well balanced string.

One thing that I really liked about the Hollow Core was its longevity compared to the other synthetic guts and multifillaments which I like. (PSDG, TF Multifeel, Yonex Tour 850). Hollow Core doesn't go dead nearly as quickly as these others, doesn't have a "break in period" like the Multifeel, and doesn't fray nearly as easily. The TF Mulifeel was my favorite string before, but I didn't like how often I had to restring, and it went dead way too quickly. After trying it the Wilson Hollow Core, I ordered 4 sets off of Ebahy since it seems TW doesn't carry it. Its my new favorite string.

I hit with a 70RA Vantage btw, for those wondering how the string feels in a stiff racket.