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rasajadad
02-04-2009, 12:00 PM
I'd like to throw out a situation that occurred this past Friday evening. I was playing doubles at a team "practice". I was at the net in the deuce court and my partner was at the baseline in the ad court. The opposing team lobbed over my head into the deuce corner. My partner and I switched, so I was in the front court in the ad side. My partner threw up a short lob right to their net man. I started to turn my back to the netman (who was on the ad side)to concede the point and WHAM! he slams it into my right eye. I was wearing glasses which shattered into at least six pieces. (The lenses didn't shatter, but the frames did.) It is important to note that the guy has a history of "head hunting" and that he is a big hooker. Also, I am a 4.5 so it's not like I'm a danger to myself at the net.

(By the way, I am okay.)

spot
02-04-2009, 12:02 PM
yell at your partner for setting you up at the net like that and not warning you about the short lob. I seriously doubt your teammate was trying to hit you- you were just in the way of the crosscourt shot which is the right one to take. If he is looking up at the ball i don't really get why you think he would know that you were trying to concede the point.

LuckyR
02-04-2009, 12:07 PM
I'd like to throw out a situation that occurred this past Friday evening. I was playing doubles at a team "practice". I was at the net in the deuce court and my partner was at the baseline in the ad court. The opposing team lobbed over my head into the deuce corner. My partner and I switched, so I was in the front court in the ad side. My partner threw up a short lob right to their net man. I started to turn my back to the netman (who was on the ad side)to concede the point and WHAM! he slams it into my right eye. I was wearing glasses which shattered into at least six pieces. (The lenses didn't shatter, but the frames did.) It is important to note that the guy has a history of "head hunting" and that he is a big hooker. Also, I am a 4.5 so it's not like I'm a danger to myself at the net.

(By the way, I am okay.)


Glad to hear you are OK. My guess is this thread will degenerate into a litany of tire slashing, car keying and a55 kicking references.

Basically as you have set up your question the guy is a known headhunting cheater. I guess you are making us therefore assume that he intentionally hit the ball into your right eye (or at least into your face).

Given this setup: why do you play with this guy, why did you not wear a helmet, and why didn't you run screaming to the baseline once your partner (the real bad guy here) threw up his pathetic lob?

blakesq
02-04-2009, 12:07 PM
How is it he still hit you in the eye, if you turned your back. Something is not adding up here.

Moz
02-04-2009, 12:17 PM
Why on earth were you turning your back on the net man?

blakesq
02-04-2009, 12:20 PM
I presume so you do don't get hit in the eyeball with a ball going 100 mph, and maybe breaking an orbit, or worse.

Why on earth were you turning your back on the net man?

Moz
02-04-2009, 12:27 PM
You get a far better chance of protecting yourself if you back up as quickly as possible while facing the netman.

Plus you stand a chance of returning the ball.

Tarboro
02-04-2009, 12:29 PM
Most satisfying response: jump the net and assault him and/or drill him a new @$$h01e with the next overhead you see.

2nd Most satisfying response: a verbal altercation calling into question his paternity, followed by passive-aggressively shunning him forever.

Likely best response (IMHO): ask him where to send the bill for the glasses and tell him that it's unacceptable to behave like that, particularly in practice.

Unfortunately, I think the best response is to be the bigger man in situations like this. If possible, never lose to him again so that your success gets into his head and he begins to question his masculinity in losing to someone he should thoroughly physically dominate.

spot
02-04-2009, 12:45 PM
Judging by the question you just don't like your teammate and thats what the real problem is. "hooking" doesn't have anything to do with the question other than the fact that you don't like the guy. SO really the question is what to do when you have a guy on your team that you can't stand. Cause I seriously doubt he was trying to hit you in PRACTICE. Seriously- get over yourself.

raiden031
02-04-2009, 01:43 PM
yell at your partner for setting you up at the net like that and not warning you about the short lob. I seriously doubt your teammate was trying to hit you- you were just in the way of the crosscourt shot which is the right one to take. If he is looking up at the ball i don't really get why you think he would know that you were trying to concede the point.

Does a partner really deserve to be yelled at for hitting a weak shot? Have you never hit a weak lob before? And they shouldn't need a warning, they should be able to read their opponents' preparation for an overhead smash.

spot
02-04-2009, 02:00 PM
what exactly is the downside to warning your partner if you put up a short lob?

Jim A
02-04-2009, 03:01 PM
is turning your back on a point in doubles common knowledge of conceding a point? New to me if so

Geezer Guy
02-04-2009, 03:20 PM
When you and your partner "switched", you should have gone to the baseline instead of staying at the net.
From the net, you have no play if your partner throws up a short lob - or basicily hits ANY ball to your opponents net man.
From the baseline, however, you and your partner can take the net together if he throws up a GOOD lob, or you'll be in a position to make a play on a ball that goes to the opposing net man.
That's what I would have done.

goober
02-04-2009, 04:23 PM
When you and your partner "switched", you should have gone to the baseline instead of staying at the net.
From the net, you have no play if your partner throws up a short lob - or basicily hits ANY ball to your opponents net man.
From the baseline, however, you and your partner can take the net together if he throws up a GOOD lob, or you'll be in a position to make a play on a ball that goes to the opposing net man.
That's what I would have done.

Actually this one of the times I would turn my head and see what my partner is doing. I know they teach you not to look at your partner, but I think you have enough time with a deep lob. If it looks like he is going to barely get to it and hit a defensive shot, I would retrieve to the baseline. If he looks like he is going to get to it easily and have time to set up, I would stay at the net because I would assume he could place the ball away from the netman or do a deep lob.

I guess the real question is if you concede a point by turning your head, it is unsportsmanlike conduct to hit an overhead right at you? I would say in practice session- yes especially since it is your teammate.

In a tourney I am not so sure. Many variations of this question have been asked before and I think most people say it is a fair shot in a competitive situation as long as the intent was not there to hurt or harm you.

marcb
02-04-2009, 04:49 PM
is turning your back on a point in doubles common knowledge of conceding a point? New to me if so

It's called "The Move" according to the book Operation Doubles (a great book BTW) and is supposedly practiced by the pros. It's designed to avoid injury if there is no chance to win the point. I think I've observed in it one high ranking pro match on TV but I'll guess it happens more at the lower levels.

The rules of the game actually say that the person being hit is causing a hindrance. I'm paraphrasing because I don't have the exact text handy but the gist is that you can't take over a portion of the court just by being there and expect it to be a no hit zone.

That being said, it was a practice and a headshot to boot?! Yikes. In three and a half years I've accidentally hit someone once and I play aggressively. So he's either got bad ball control or is a complete jerk. Both are about as bad especially in a team environment. Your captain should talk to him. One bad apple, etc.

BTW, the book also says that running backwards is a really bad idea because your natural reflexes won't allow you to do anything well while moving backwards. Better to take a big step back and plant. This is designed to give you a fighting chance should you choose to take it.

onehandbh
02-04-2009, 05:17 PM
super glue the glasses back together and continue play. If you're eye
hurts, then cut a dead ball in half w/ a knife (or metal tennis can top)
and make a protective patch to cover your eye. The convex shape will
protect your eye from future attacks.

spot
02-04-2009, 06:40 PM
Who the hell looks at their opponent to see what direction they are facing when they are hitting an overhead? Me? I sort of prefer to look up at the ball.

ChipNCharge
02-04-2009, 06:51 PM
what exactly is the downside to warning your partner if you put up a short lob?

Section 33 of The Code: "Talking During the Point"

"A player shall not talk while the ball is moving toward the opponent's side of the court. If the player's talking interferes with an opponent's ability to play the ball, the player loses the point. Consider the situation where a player hits a weak lob and loudly yells at his or his partner to get back. If the shout is loud enough to distract an opponent, then the opponent may claim the point based on a deliberate hindrance. If the opponent chooses to hit the lob and misses it, the opponent loses the point because the opponent did not make a timely claim of hindrance"

Slicendicer
02-04-2009, 07:09 PM
That went down at a team practice?? No way... we would have had words after the match. Game on... you got plenty of time for revenge... just wait patiently, do not force a "bad" shot out of emotion... when the time is right... nail that SOB with an overhead or a high volley.

Mans game.

spot
02-04-2009, 07:21 PM
Who said anything about yelling at your partner so loud as to distract the opponent?

You do realize this was practice right?

And have you ever seen a hindrance call on one partner telling another to get back?

Seriously- get a grip and start communicating out there on the court.

Crusher10s
02-04-2009, 07:37 PM
As soon as I realized the lob was over my head and my partner was going to have to cover it, I'd have switched back to the baseline like Geezer said and then waited to see what my partner did with the lob. If I didn't have time to switch all the way back then I would've watched the reaction of the opposing net player to see whether he was going to hit an overhead and then if it was too late to get back then I'd either turn and do the "move" to the alley or I'd hold my ground (would depend on how hard my opponent could hit an overhead at me) and attempt to block the shot back. All those decisions can be made in the blink of an eye so frankly I don't see why you got hit if you're really a 4.5 rated player who should at that level know exactly how to handle that situation.

Tennisman912
02-04-2009, 07:49 PM
TM

I would have to agree with goober and Geezer Guy. If a lob goes over your head and you don’t get it yourself, you should not be rushing the net on the other side of the court. You should be retreating and if you partner does hit a good lob over your opponent’s heads, you can both go toward the net. You have plenty of time to watch the ball and defend against your partner’s probable less than perfect lob. You should be back near the baseline because a real 4.5 is going to be hitting a pretty good over head out of the air against any shot that doesn't hit their baseline.

I have never seen a 4.5 player rush the net when they are in such a disadvantageous situation. Assuming your opponents are also 4.5, I would think they see you out of the corner of their eye and should have the skills to not hit you. Having said that, even though it may be poor sportsmanship to hit someone turning, hitting in their direction and yes even hitting them on purpose is still a legitimate play irregardless of it being in poor taste (not that I would ever do so, especially in practice). Protecting yourself is the first rule of tennis. Glad to hear you are ok.

TM

10sguy
02-04-2009, 09:02 PM
Who said anything about yelling at your partner so loud as to distract the opponent?

You do realize this was practice right?

And have you ever seen a hindrance call on one partner telling another to get back?

Seriously- get a grip and start communicating out there on the court.

ChipnCharge was 100% correct; Read/understand the hindrance rule and play by it. FYI, "loud enough to distract the opponent" is determined by the opponent; the player/team talking/causing the hindrance has absolutely no say in the matter. It's REAL SIMPLE . . . button your lip after striking the ball/before the opponent(s) hits it. AFTER the opponent strikes the ball, you may communicate with your partner.

moonbat
02-04-2009, 11:00 PM
Judging by the question you just don't like your teammate and thats what the real problem is. "hooking" doesn't have anything to do with the question other than the fact that you don't like the guy. SO really the question is what to do when you have a guy on your team that you can't stand. Cause I seriously doubt he was trying to hit you in PRACTICE. Seriously- get over yourself.

Heh...are you the guy who hit him? ;)

spot
02-05-2009, 03:44 AM
Personally I'll keep communicating with my partner. If the other team wants to be jerks and complain about legitimate communication that is not intended to distract them at all then I'll adjust from there. But I have played enough other sports and it woudl be tough to not communicate with my partner at this point. To me calling hindrance if they other team warns their partner about a short lob is right up there with footfaults where you are entitled to call it but its a pathetic move in the vast majority of situations.

raiden031
02-05-2009, 05:12 AM
what exactly is the downside to warning your partner if you put up a short lob?

No downside to it. But if my partner yelled at me for hitting a weak shot or not warning them when they should be able to read the situation, then I'd tell them to go F themselves.

Who the hell looks at their opponent to see what direction they are facing when they are hitting an overhead? Me? I sort of prefer to look up at the ball.

A good player can read their opponents' movements to know what they are going to do next. There is no benefit to focusing strictly on the ball as it goes to your opponents' side and not read what the opponents are going to do with the ball.

raiden031
02-05-2009, 05:16 AM
It's called "The Move" according to the book Operation Doubles (a great book BTW) and is supposedly practiced by the pros. It's designed to avoid injury if there is no chance to win the point. I think I've observed in it one high ranking pro match on TV but I'll guess it happens more at the lower levels.

BTW, the book also says that running backwards is a really bad idea because your natural reflexes won't allow you to do anything well while moving backwards. Better to take a big step back and plant. This is designed to give you a fighting chance should you choose to take it.

From my observations of pro doubles, if a player is too close to the net and their opponent gets a weak shot they can overhead smash, it is common practice to turn around because it is safer to get hit in the back then hit in the front with the ball.

Also for someone to be in this "sitting duck" position, there is no time to backpedal far enough back that you can 1) protect yourself from injury or 2) reliably get your racquet on the ball. That is why they turn around because its the only reasonable option available.

nickynu
02-05-2009, 05:32 AM
Im not sure what the problem is here? There are idiots in life whatever sport you play. Sounds like this guy is one of them , its unfortunate but hey-ho,

but hey here's the thing - he did not do anything wrong technically- so just go out there and repeatedly make the guy look a fool by beating him, as I am sure that will hurt him far more than you trying to get him back with a smash.

I also think the guy probably knows if you have been bad-mouthing him, could you have brought it on yourself. ? just a thought.

JRstriker12
02-05-2009, 06:11 AM
Just wondering - how did the guy act after he hit you? Was he a jerk? Did he apologize?

TheGreatestAudia
02-05-2009, 07:47 AM
This is lame. I highly doubt this guy was trying to hit you, let alone, in the face. I don't care how good you are, that is an almost impossible shot to make. He mis-hit the ball! Don't be a girl when it comes to accidents like this. Your teammate and partner do not owe you anything. I'm sure the guy apologized to you and felt bad.

Also, if you really were going to cede the point, why wouldn't you turn completely around? Why continue to watch? If he had mis-hit the ball and it barely trickled over the net, you would have gone after it. There is no reason for that guy to let up.

beernutz
02-05-2009, 08:20 AM
I'd like to throw out a situation that occurred this past Friday evening. I was playing doubles at a team "practice". I was at the net in the deuce court and my partner was at the baseline in the ad court. The opposing team lobbed over my head into the deuce corner. My partner and I switched, so I was in the front court in the ad side. My partner threw up a short lob right to their net man. I started to turn my back to the netman (who was on the ad side)to concede the point and WHAM! he slams it into my right eye. I was wearing glasses which shattered into at least six pieces. (The lenses didn't shatter, but the frames did.) It is important to note that the guy has a history of "head hunting" and that he is a big hooker. Also, I am a 4.5 so it's not like I'm a danger to myself at the net.

(By the way, I am okay.)

I am curious about this statement. How many people has he hit in the head before? I've been playing over 30 years and I can't remember ever hitting someone in the face or head with a ball.

Fay
02-05-2009, 08:37 AM
I have been hit in the face *hard* twice by the same person playing across the net from me in doubles ... most men will hit at the feet or away with a winner. He likes to hit women in the face. I had to to get ice for my nose after the match.

It resulted from my partner having a weak serve. This was back before I knew about such things. Since then my coach has told me to move back with a partner with a weaker serve which allows the net person to get a big return.

What I did back then was practice having my racquet up so when he was at the net diagonally from me I was ready ... the next time he hit the ball at my face I blocked the ball up the middle for a winner and just smirked at him.

Of course this maneuver requires turning the racquet in my hand to a frying pan grip in front of my face which is not the way I would normally play the net. I cannot protect my face with a continental grip, have tried before. So I went with this method when I am playing a jerk. This is not something I would normally be thinking, but some people get a reputation.

The other men give him a bad time about it, he has reputation, but he doesn't seem to care, so I practiced to defend against people like that. I have only seen one woman (claimed she is a 4.0) who would intentionally hit to the face. But it does happen.

bobbynorwich
02-05-2009, 08:48 AM
I'd like to throw out a situation that occurred this past Friday evening. I was playing doubles at a team "practice". I was at the net in the deuce court and my partner was at the baseline in the ad court. The opposing team lobbed over my head into the deuce corner. My partner and I switched, so I was in the front court in the ad side. My partner threw up a short lob right to their net man. I started to turn my back to the netman (who was on the ad side)to concede the point and WHAM! he slams it into my right eye. I was wearing glasses which shattered into at least six pieces. (The lenses didn't shatter, but the frames did.) It is important to note that the guy has a history of "head hunting" and that he is a big hooker. Also, I am a 4.5 so it's not like I'm a danger to myself at the net.

(By the way, I am okay.)

Just don't play with that dude again.

raiden031
02-05-2009, 08:54 AM
I have been hit in the face *hard* twice by the same person playing across the net from me in doubles ... most men will hit at the feet or away with a winner. He likes to hit women in the face. I had to to get ice for my nose after the match.

It resulted from my partner having a weak serve. This was back before I knew about such things. Since then my coach has told me to move back with a partner with a weaker serve which allows the net person to get a big return.

What I did back then was practice having my racquet up so when he was at the net diagonally from me I was ready ... the next time he hit the ball at my face I blocked the ball up the middle for a winner and just smirked at him.

Of course this maneuver requires turning the racquet in my hand to a frying pan grip in front of my face which is not the way I would normally play the net. I cannot protect my face with a continental grip, have tried before. So I went with this method when I am playing a jerk. This is not something I would normally be thinking, but some people get a reputation.

The other men give him a bad time about it, he has reputation, but he doesn't seem to care, so I practiced to defend against people like that. I have only seen one woman (claimed she is a 4.0) who would intentionally hit to the face. But it does happen.

This is why I'm an advocate of women being higher rated than men in mixed competition. It boggles my mind why women often want to play at a mixed level higher than what their rating is rather than a level lower where they are more competitive, when they are just going to be target practice.

I think this guy you mention has some pretty disgusting behavior though. I'm used to every shot being directed at the woman, but its not to injure, just to defeat the opposing team.

blakesq
02-05-2009, 09:09 AM
I have hit at least two people in the face with a tennis ball in the last 1.5 years. Once in a mens 4.0 doubles match, i hit an overhead, that hit the ground, bounced up and hit my opponent in the face. I apologized, but he was angry. The second time I was serving in a 3.5 mixed doubles league, i hit a 2nd serve with lots of spin, the ball bounced, and the lady, probably in her early 60's, didnt know which way it was going, and got hit in the eye. I apologized, and we took a break for about 5 minutes.

I often hit people, i dont aim for the face, but if they crowd me at net when I am hitting an overhead, i will aim the ball in their general direction.


I am curious about this statement. How many people has he hit in the head before? I've been playing over 30 years and I can't remember ever hitting someone in the face or head with a ball.

bleach
02-05-2009, 09:10 AM
Suck it up....

If you don't want the risk of being hit, then don't play the net.

TheGreatestAudia
02-05-2009, 09:33 AM
I have hit at least two people in the face with a tennis in the last 1.5 years. Once in a mens 4.0 doubles match, i hit an overhead, that hit the ground, bounced up and hit my opponent in the face. I apologized, but he was angry. The second time I was serving in a 3.5 mixed doubles league, i hit a 2nd serve with lots of spin, the ball bounced, and the lady, probably in her early 60's, didnt know which way it was going, and got hit in the eye. I apologized, and we took a break for about 5 minutes.

I often hit people, i dont aim for the face, but if they crowd me at net when I am hitting an overhead, i will aim the ball in their general direction.

That guy got ticked because the ball bounced and hit him in the face?! "Sorry sir! Next time, I will make sure it does not bounce first!" I am so glad I have not run into this crap before. Probably because I do not play ALTA...

Joe Average
02-05-2009, 09:34 AM
My immediate reaction is same as that of Geezer Guy, Moz, and Crusher. Why didn't you go back? When someone lobs over your head, yes, you switch, but you move back diagonally. You should not have been any closer to the net than behind the service line. And you should have been watching your opponents for their reaction, not your teammate. If he puts up a weak lob, you still have time to move to the baseline (where you should have been standing). If he puts up a lob that forces them back, then you have plenty of time to rush the net. One does not get hit in the face with an overhead while standing near the baseline. But I'm sorry you were hit. And if it were me, my first impulse would have been to get angry (mixed with embarrassment). But if I were standing where you were, I'd have to assume much of the blame. I'm sure your opponent/teammate felt pretty bad about it. But would you want him to play less aggressively against another team?

skiracer55
02-05-2009, 09:54 AM
...is did the guy say "Sorry" or something to that effect? That's pretty much de rigeur in this situation...and if this happens, you're kind of honor bound to shake it off. If on the other hand the guy didn't say anything, IMHO the gloves are off and you can hit him right in the cojones the next chance you get...

Geezer Guy
02-05-2009, 10:01 AM
Since we're confessing... I don't think I've ever hit an opponent in the face, but I've hit my partner in the head several times when serving, and once I hit my partner (different guy this time) square in the face when I was trying to squeeze a groundstroke cross-court when he was at the net. He turned to watch me hit, and took a ball square between the eyes, breaking his glasses, cutting he face, etc. (That's another good reason NOT to watch your partner hit the ball.)
Personally, I was hit smack in the forehead when I tried to poach against a 5.0 player one time. I felt pretty stupid. He hit a big groundie of a soft serve, and I just couldn't get my racquet up in time.

JRstriker12
02-05-2009, 10:44 AM
This is why I'm an advocate of women being higher rated than men in mixed competition. It boggles my mind why women often want to play at a mixed level higher than what their rating is rather than a level lower where they are more competitive, when they are just going to be target practice.

I think this guy you mention has some pretty disgusting behavior though. I'm used to every shot being directed at the woman, but its not to injure, just to defeat the opposing team.

I'm with you on this Raiden. Or how about making women's rankings equal to male rankings? IMHO - they don't match up sometimes.

On occasion, I have been the target in target practice in mixed off my partner's serve. I had to suck it up and just

One thing I think is kind of funny, is if I get hit, it's usually my fault for not reacting quick enough or being out of position. I mean, if the ball is coming at me from a ground stroke and I have time to try to duck it, I should have enough time to put a racket up. Almost got nailed in the head in a recent match. One, time had a net cord ball that smacked me in the forehead. I had to laugh.

Topaz
02-05-2009, 10:54 AM
I'm with you on this Raiden. Or how about making women's rankings equal to male rankings? IMHO - they don't match up sometimes.

On occasion, I have been the target in target practice in mixed off my partner's serve. I had to suck it up and just

One thing I think is kind of funny, is if I get hit, it's usually my fault for not reacting quick enough or being out of position. I mean, if the ball is coming at me from a ground stroke and I have time to try to duck it, I should have enough time to put a racket up. Almost got nailed in the head in a recent match. One, time had a net cord ball that smacked me in the forehead. I had to laugh.

I think you mean ratings, not rankings....just wanted to clarify.

JR, in our league, though, I would also argue that more guys are sandbagging than women, so that only exacerbates the perceived difference.

You know JJ has a soft serve...you should be ready!!!!!

And, did I not get nailed with the guy's overhead partnering with you once? ;) Why are you setting me up for target practice?!?! :)

cknobman
02-05-2009, 11:02 AM
1 foot up opponents @55 for hitting me intentionally

1 foot up partners @55 for pathetic lob giving opponent opportunity

Fay
02-05-2009, 11:10 AM
This is why I'm an advocate of women being higher rated than men in mixed competition.

Would you say that to a man who is trying to get better ?

I did the right thing and trained to be prepared the next time and I was. :-) My net reflexes were slow when I started out and they have gotten much better as I was motivated to get quicker.

It boggles my mind why women often want to play at a mixed level higher than what their rating is rather than a level lower where they are more competitive, when they are just going to be target practice.

I think this guy you mention has some pretty disgusting behavior though. I'm used to every shot being directed at the woman, but its not to injure, just to defeat the opposing team.

He didn't apologize and he has a reputation .... just made me learn to evaluate my partner's serve and be on the alert for behavior like that.
A beginner has no clue that their partner's serve sets up a situation like that. I know better now.

I never dreamed that someone would hit at another person's face, after all we are not wearing safety glasses or full face helmuts .... so I learned the hard way.

When I played racquet ball no one would consider coming onto the court without glasses, but then men would hit people in the back with the ball as hard as they could to intimidate them.
There are all kinds of players out there and some of them not so nice.

I look at it sort of like a tournament where I don't get to chose my opponents.

That way when I go to a tournament I will be mentally and physically prepared for whatever happens.

Of course I would not choose to socialize with people like this, LOL

blakesq
02-05-2009, 11:21 AM
What the hell does this mean? Try it again, but this time using proper English.

1 foot up opponents @55 for hitting me intentionally

1 foot up partners @55 for pathetic lob giving opponent opportunity

Fay
02-05-2009, 11:22 AM
1 foot up opponents @55 for hitting me intentionally

1 foot up partners @55 for pathetic lob giving opponent opportunity



Great avatar of Roger and Rafa !

Topaz
02-05-2009, 11:23 AM
I never dreamed that someone would hit at another person's face, after all we are not wearing safety glasses or full face helmuts .... so I learned the hard way.



Personally, I don't care what level you are or if you are a man or woman...aiming at someone's face is not cool. If it is an accident...fine. If not...then the person doing the aiming has some serious issues and should probably look into some kind of full body impact sport rather than tennis.

You can hit me anywhere else (well, the neck wasn't fun either), and I'll take it like a *woman*, because I know I'm there to play. And again, accidents happen.

But for the life of me, I can NOT understand, particularly in a league match, why someone would think it is okay to intentionally aim at an opponent's face.

Fay
02-05-2009, 11:25 AM
What the hell does this mean? Try it again, but this time using proper English.

I think that was to get past the censors, LOL

* s s

JRstriker12
02-05-2009, 11:26 AM
I think you mean ratings, not rankings....just wanted to clarify.

JR, in our league, though, I would also argue that more guys are sandbagging than women, so that only exacerbates the perceived difference.

You know JJ has a soft serve...you should be ready!!!!!

And, did I not get nailed with the guy's overhead partnering with you once? ;) Why are you setting me up for target practice?!?! :)

But you're a ball magnet Topaz. IIRC - I think it happens almost every TWMAC meet-up ;)

Yes, everyone will push up a soft lob every once in a while. I'm not complaining about that. I've been hit and hit people (accidentally) in that manner. But being a target off a serve for 4+ points, where it's pretty much accepted to hit at the net guy is not fun. You don't have to serve hard, but a little practice on placement and spin can go a long way.

I also said I sucked it up and stood at the net and that most of the time if I get hit, it's my fault. The last time I got hit, I should have thrown my racket up instead of ducking. For the record pt. 1- I also stood in there for my male Capt. when his serve gets crushed in combo... even less fun when that guy is a 4.0.

For the record pt. 2 - I did not name anyone in particular.

Yes, I meant ratings. I don't know. I don't think most of the guys I ran up against in our league were sandbagging. Only that 7ft guy was clearly on a much better level and his female partner was too. She'd give most 4.0 guys a run. So far, most of the guys I have played were about my level - and I don't think I'm sandbagging. All I know is that I run into the target practice off of serve problem more often in mixed than in non-mixed.

Topaz
02-05-2009, 11:27 AM
But you're a ball magnet Topaz. IIRC - I think it happens almost every TWMAC meet-up ;)

.

Oh yeah...I keep forgetting that!

Is this a bad time to mention that I got hit last night in clinic...in the warm-up?!?

Six of my opponents last season got the bump. Six. And I didn't play that many matches.

I've never seen so many people playing out of level before than I did during commonwealth.

Fay
02-05-2009, 11:30 AM
Personally, I don't care what level you are or if you are a man or woman...aiming at someone's face is not cool.
But for the life of me, I can NOT understand, particularly in a league match, why someone would think it is okay to intentionally aim at an opponent's face.

I don't believe anyone thinks it is okay except for the person doing it.

He obviously has issue with women as I have not seen him do it to men ...which would not be okay either.

Worse he is very tall and can play quite well. No excuse for it.

Topaz
02-05-2009, 11:31 AM
^^^Yikes! I know I definitely would not want to play against him. With his reputation, I'm surprised the other guys let him get away with it!

JRstriker12
02-05-2009, 11:35 AM
Oh yeah...I keep forgetting that!

Is this a bad time to mention that I got hit last night in clinic...in the warm-up?!?

Six of my opponents last season got the bump. Six. And I didn't play that many matches.

I've never seen so many people playing out of level before than I did during commonwealth.


Topaz Ball Magnet (copyrighted)
;)

raiden031
02-05-2009, 11:38 AM
Would you say that to a man who is trying to get better ?


I didn't quite follow your question. I was implying that mixed is more fun if the women are higher rated because it is a more level playing field and there is no abusive targeting. You can't target someone who is as good as you otherwise you will lose.

For instance I was partnered with a weak 3.0 female in 7.0 mixed and don't understand why a weak 3.0 would want to play 7.0 when they aren't competitive with anybody else on the court.

Topaz
02-05-2009, 11:39 AM
I didn't quite follow your question. I was implying that mixed is more fun if the women are higher rated because it is a more level playing field and there is no abusive targeting. You can't target someone who is as good as you otherwise you will lose.

For instance I was partnered with a weak 3.0 female in 7.0 mixed and don't understand why a weak 3.0 would want to play 7.0 when they aren't competitive with anybody else on the court.

There are plenty of 3.0 women who do quite well at 7.0...you just didn't happen to get paired up with one that time.

kylebarendrick
02-05-2009, 11:47 AM
I don't believe anyone thinks it is okay except for the person doing it.

He obviously has issue with women as I have not seen him do it to men ...which would not be okay either.

Worse he is very tall and can play quite well. No excuse for it.

Yeah, but you are talking about a return of serve. If he hits a hard return in the direction of the netplayer (a fair tactic BTW), then it can look like a shot at the face - and it may be headed for your face. But as far as I'm concerned, any return of serve is fair game. It's not like he's hitting an overhead from inside the service line at you. You have time to react and, if your partner is weak, to simply play two back.

Spokewench
02-05-2009, 11:47 AM
I don't believe anyone thinks it is okay except for the person doing it.

He obviously has issue with women as I have not seen him do it to men ...which would not be okay either.

Worse he is very tall and can play quite well. No excuse for it.


Fay? Do I know this guy? Give me a hint so I don't get caught out by this guy.

I've been playing with the senior group in town lately (and every time I play with them, I seem to get hit) The problem is, it is all from behind! One week, it was a big server (male) on my team who hit his serve which commenced to bounce right at my feet and hit me in the side of the knee (Ouch); and then one older lady (on my team again) hit her flat serve right smack dab into the back of my head! I wonder where I'm going to get hit next week???

Fay
02-05-2009, 11:55 AM
Yeah, but you are talking about a return of serve. If he hits a hard return in the direction of the netplayer (a fair tactic BTW), then it can look like a shot at the face - and it may be headed for your face. But as far as I'm concerned, any return of serve is fair game. It's not like he's hitting an overhead from inside the service line at you. You have time to react and, if your partner is weak, to simply play two back.

No I was talking about the next shot

1. Weak serve
2. good return
3. return off the return of serve
4. then his shot / the poach hit hard

this is a recreational group with most men about 3.5 and 4.0

not what one is used to seeing at the 4.5 - 5.5 men that I have seen ...

but he has to go to a lot of trouble to hit it DIAGONALLY to my face, plenty of other places to hit

and some of the men chid him about it ... but there are not enough men with pride that will form a group and get on him

another group I played with had a 4.0 woman who would hit at anyone's face, particularly the men.

most really fine players will hit at the feet, just behind the feet, or in a hole somewhere. It is an intentional ploy to try to cause a relatively low level player to miss hit so that they can get the point ... that would never work with someone 5.0 or above.

Fay
02-05-2009, 11:56 AM
Fay? Do I know this guy? Give me a hint so I don't get caught out by this guy.

I've been playing with the senior group in town lately (and every time I play with them, I seem to get hit) The problem is, it is all from behind! One week, it was a big server (male) on my team who hit his serve which commenced to bounce right at my feet and hit me in the side of the knee (Ouch); and then one older lady (on my team again) hit her flat serve right smack dab into the back of my head! I wonder where I'm going to get hit next week???

no worries, not in our town ... out of town person. :-)

I'll tell ya next time I see ya or call me :-)

kylebarendrick
02-05-2009, 12:12 PM
No I was talking about the next shot

1. Weak serve
2. good return
3. return off the return of serve
4. then his shot / the poach hit hard


Gotcha - I misread. Sorry about that.

raiden031
02-05-2009, 01:49 PM
There are plenty of 3.0 women who do quite well at 7.0...you just didn't happen to get paired up with one that time.

Well it would be like me playing on a 4.5 team. I have no business playing there because even the 2nd weakest player on the court is 0.5+ better than me. If I was a solid 4.0 ready for a greater challenge, that is something different.

So my point is that its not a good idea to have such a huge discrepancy between partnerships that you see in mixed, because it just makes it less fun for the better player because they can't touch the ball or have any offensive opportunities and the weaker player might face one of these dirtbags who targets them.

cknobman
02-05-2009, 02:14 PM
What the hell does this mean? Try it again, but this time using proper English.

your a little slow arent you?

beernutz
02-05-2009, 02:14 PM
What the hell does this mean? Try it again, but this time using proper English.

Its pretty clear to me.

JHBKLYN
02-05-2009, 07:14 PM
There are plenty of 3.0 women who do quite well at 7.0...you just didn't happen to get paired up with one that time.

The only 3.0 women that I found that do well at 7.0s are those who are really 3.5's. Either that or the guy goes after every ball and tries to win the match by himself.

Topaz
02-05-2009, 07:17 PM
The only 3.0 women that I found that do well at 7.0s are those who are really 3.5's. Either that or the guy goes after every ball and tries to win the match by himself.

Exactly! But, if the computer still says they are a 3.0, then that's that.

Those 3.0 rated (but really 3.5) women are *very* popular around here...they get snatched up for mixed so fast it makes your head spin. I lost a spot on a team once because they wanted a 3.0 woman instead of me (3.5). Though, honestly, I play like such a dork in mixed that I think I should get a special 3.0 rating just for that!

JHBKLYN
02-05-2009, 07:35 PM
yell at your partner for setting you up at the net like that and not warning you about the short lob.

Due to short lobs, I got nailed 2x in a match yesterday, one volley and one overhead. I was 2 or 3 feet from the net when I could've gotten nailed on another overhead but I gave the universal sign of conceding the point by turning my back. I did stick out my racquet in case I got lucky. But I will never yell or blame my partner because it's really the opponent's fault. When I got hit, I should've screamed: Why did you have to read the lob so well and make a textbook smash??? WHY????? Couldn't you see that I read the short lob (not sure how people can play doubles if they don't look at the ball or know where the ball is going, must have eyes in back of their heads) and decided you weren't fast enough to come up and smash it so I stood my ground???? Why did you have to kill it and win the point???? I think next time when I see a short lob, I'm going to move back ....

JHBKLYN
02-05-2009, 07:51 PM
Exactly! But, if the computer still says they are a 3.0, then that's that.

Those 3.0 rated (but really 3.5) women are *very* popular around here...they get snatched up for mixed so fast it makes your head spin. I lost a spot on a team once because they wanted a 3.0 woman instead of me (3.5). Though, honestly, I play like such a dork in mixed that I think I should get a special 3.0 rating just for that!

Those gals get snatched faster than Harry Potter novels! The 3.0 women on winning teams have serves and groundstrokes more powerful than some of the 3.5 guys in the league! :lol: If you don't feel comfortable playing mixed, every chance you get, run to the net and stay there, less of a chance to expose the dorkiness. But if you can volley well, you will be feared and 'tis better to be feared than loved .. at least that's what Sonny said in A Bronx Tale. :)

Topaz
02-05-2009, 08:04 PM
Those gals get snatched faster than Harry Potter novels! The 3.0 women on winning teams have serves and groundstrokes more powerful than some of the 3.5 guys in the league! :lol: If you don't feel comfortable playing mixed, every chance you get, run to the net and stay there, less of a chance to expose the dorkiness. But if you can volley well, you will be feared and 'tis better to be feared than loved .. at least that's what Sonny said in A Bronx Tale. :)

Ha, ha...well put!

I have another mixed match Sunday...will try my best to camp out at the net (my volleys are decent I think), and see if the dork can be defeated!!!

JHBKLYN
02-05-2009, 08:16 PM
Ha, ha...well put!

I have another mixed match Sunday...will try my best to camp out at the net (my volleys are decent I think), and see if the dork can be defeated!!!

Don't forget when the ball is not within your reach, do what Lisa Raymond does (I think it was her that I saw who do this constantly) and yell YOU! When your partner misses, say good try and give encouragement so he'll play harder!

raiden031
02-06-2009, 03:25 AM
Exactly! But, if the computer still says they are a 3.0, then that's that.

Those 3.0 rated (but really 3.5) women are *very* popular around here...they get snatched up for mixed so fast it makes your head spin. I lost a spot on a team once because they wanted a 3.0 woman instead of me (3.5). Though, honestly, I play like such a dork in mixed that I think I should get a special 3.0 rating just for that!

Yes you're right. But I was talking about someone who is a weak 3.0. So someone who would lose most of their 6.0 matches.

TsongaEatingAPineappleLol
02-06-2009, 04:50 AM
I'm sorry but I laughed so freaking hard it was unbelievable. :twisted:

TheGreatestAudia
02-06-2009, 05:56 AM
your a little slow arent you?

So is "you're" grammar.

ChipNCharge
02-06-2009, 07:09 AM
...but I've hit my partner in the head several times when serving, and once I hit my partner (different guy this time) square in the face when I was trying to squeeze a groundstroke cross-court when he was at the net.

Note to self: if Geezer Guy asks you to be his partner, politely decline.

Geezer Guy
02-06-2009, 07:46 AM
Watch out Green Country. I may be coming to a location near you - if my freakin house will ever sell.

r2473
02-06-2009, 02:35 PM
My guess is this thread will degenerate into a litany of tire slashing, car keying and a55 kicking references.

How on earth did you guess :)

Slicendicer
02-06-2009, 04:43 PM
Due to short lobs, I got nailed 2x in a match yesterday, one volley and one overhead.

We call short lobs... slobs. :mrgreen:

LuckyR
02-06-2009, 07:16 PM
How on earth did you guess :)


I'm lucky, I guess...

rasajadad
02-07-2009, 09:18 AM
Just wondering - how did the guy act after he hit you? Was he a jerk? Did he apologize?

He wasn't a jerk, but he did not come over to see if I was all right, nor did he apologize except for "If I thought he did it intentionally."

rasajadad
02-07-2009, 09:22 AM
TM

I would have to agree with goober and Geezer Guy. If a lob goes over your head and you donít get it yourself, you should not be rushing the net on the other side of the court. You should be retreating and if you partner does hit a good lob over your opponentís heads, you can both go toward the net. You have plenty of time to watch the ball and defend against your partnerís probable less than perfect lob. You should be back near the baseline because a real 4.5 is going to be hitting a pretty good over head out of the air against any shot that doesn't hit their baseline.

I have never seen a 4.5 player rush the net when they are in such a disadvantageous situation. Assuming your opponents are also 4.5, I would think they see you out of the corner of their eye and should have the skills to not hit you. Having said that, even though it may be poor sportsmanship to hit someone turning, hitting in their direction and yes even hitting them on purpose is still a legitimate play irregardless of it being in poor taste (not that I would ever do so, especially in practice). Protecting yourself is the first rule of tennis. Glad to hear you are ok.

TM

I didn't rush the net. I was already at the net with my partner at the baseline. I only crossed over on a soft lob (which would have been a forehand for my partner.) Frankly I expected him to protect my position by cracking a forehand groundstroke.

rasajadad
02-07-2009, 09:26 AM
I am curious about this statement. How many people has he hit in the head before? I've been playing over 30 years and I can't remember ever hitting someone in the face or head with a ball.

Good question. I've been playing over 40 years myself and this is the first time I've been struck by a ball in the head. However, this guy has hit three (including me) in the 2 1/2 years I've known him. Quite a record!

blakesq
02-07-2009, 10:01 AM
I have hit way more than 3 people in 2.5 years. I hit at least 1 person a month.


Good question. I've been playing over 40 years myself and this is the first time I've been struck by a ball in the head. However, this guy has hit three (including me) in the 2 1/2 years I've known him. Quite a record!

jefferson
02-07-2009, 10:20 AM
I dont think that hitting someone is the question here. There is a place for putting the ball on someone, especially in doubles. The problem here is hitting someone in the face! I am all for hitting an opponent with the ball, just make sure its below the neck! And if you do hit people, dont ever complain when you get hit.
I have hit many people, might I say never in the face. I have in return been hit many times also, might I say never in the face.
As for getting hit, it is your partners fault. Whether he intentionally hit a soft lob or not. It is his responsibility to not put you in a bad position. But it happens. THATS DOUBLES!! and that is why I love doubs.

jefferson
02-07-2009, 10:27 AM
I can remember a time in college when a player hit another in the nose on an overhead. The worst part was the celebrating and the giggling after it happened. The kid had to go to the hospital for a broken nose!!

As for the Bully who hit him, he had to play me and my partner next. I must of hit him at least 8 times (all below the neck). Followed by a high five from my parnter. Maybe I was wrong but I felt that he had to learn that somethings just arent cool.
This guy that you are talking about will get his eventually, even if you arent the one to do it.

blakesq
02-07-2009, 11:20 AM
What was not cool? Hitting someone in the nose, or hitting someone 8 times followed by high fives?


I can remember a time in college when a player hit another in the nose on an overhead. The worst part was the celebrating and the giggling after it happened. The kid had to go to the hospital for a broken nose!!

As for the Bully who hit him, he had to play me and my partner next. I must of hit him at least 8 times (all below the neck). Followed by a high five from my parnter. Maybe I was wrong but I felt that he had to learn that somethings just arent cool.
This guy that you are talking about will get his eventually, even if you arent the one to do it.

peter
02-07-2009, 01:27 PM
Note to self: if Geezer Guy asks you to be his partner, politely decline.

Me and my doubles partner have given each other green cards for hitting *anywhere* when we are playing. If one of us is at the net then yes, a foot from the netmans head is OK (if we deem that it was necessary to hit there).

It's the net guys responsibilty to stay low and look *forward* (to be prepared to what the opponents are doing and to avoid being hit in the face).

So far I've only hit him once in his back head - A first serve forehand return in the AD court where I was slightly late in starting my swing so the ball didn't quite go down the middle... He has managed to miss me so far, but I've got some new hair designs a couple of times... :-)

jefferson
02-07-2009, 03:19 PM
I already admitted to being wrong! Breaking someones nose and celebrating about it while the kid is bleeding on the court is uncool! Showing no remorse to hurting someone is bad karma. Getting hit doesnt hurt for too long, a broken nose is serious!
By the way players from both teams thanked me afterwards.

blakesq
02-07-2009, 03:25 PM
Uh, saying "Maybe I was wrong but I felt that he had to learn that somethings just arent cool" is NOT admitting your wrong. Putting down a guy for hitting someone, then you doing it yourself 8 times and giving high 5's to your team mate...is the height of hypocrisy.



I already admitted to being wrong! Breaking someones nose and celebrating about it while the kid is bleeding on the court is uncool! Showing no remorse to hurting someone is bad karma. Getting hit doesnt hurt for too long, a broken nose is serious!
By the way players from both teams thanked me afterwards.

jefferson
02-07-2009, 03:37 PM
I answered the question that the poll asked, that is what i would do.
i have reread all of your posts and you still have yet to answer the question.

you have admitted to hitting people in the face, and you apologized. Great but what would you do if someone hit you in the face and didnt apologize?

blakesq
02-08-2009, 07:04 AM
What poll are you referring to? To answer your question, If someone hit me in the face and did not apologize, I would be headhunting for that person.


I answered the question that the poll asked, that is what i would do.
i have reread all of your posts and you still have yet to answer the question.

you have admitted to hitting people in the face, and you apologized. Great but what would you do if someone hit you in the face and didnt apologize?

jefferson
02-08-2009, 08:08 AM
Okay that is what this post was about. You would take it into your own hands and try to take his head off. Perfect.

I dont understand why you are so bothered by me hitting someone back. Even though it wasnt me getting hit. I thought that it was a teachable moment and thought that i would teach him the proper way to hit someone. Which to me is below the neck.
I'm not sure you read my first post on this issue. I am okay with getting hit and hitting people. Just keep it below the neck...

blakesq
02-08-2009, 11:36 AM
I am bothered by your hypocrisy. Getting hit in tennis is a risk we all take. If you purposefully aim at someone, then the chances of hitting them in the face is even greater. So, you are no better than the guy who broke someone's nose. You hit a guy 8 times on purpose. You could have easily misjudged, and hit the guy in the nose, or eye. Mistakes happen. Don't tell me you can guarantee that you wouldn't hit a person in the eye . Even Federer and Nadal hit the frame of their raquets on accident and the ball goes flying off in some crazy unpredictable direction.


Okay that is what this post was about. You would take it into your own hands and try to take his head off. Perfect.

I dont understand why you are so bothered by me hitting someone back. Even though it wasnt me getting hit. I thought that it was a teachable moment and thought that i would teach him the proper way to hit someone. Which to me is below the neck.
I'm not sure you read my first post on this issue. I am okay with getting hit and hitting people. Just keep it below the neck...

jefferson
02-08-2009, 03:25 PM
I would never compare my game to Rog or Rafa. Maybe I'm just lucky but I have NEVER hit anyone in the face. Unlike you who hits a kicker to a 60 yr old lady and it hits her in the face. Seriously a 60 yr old lady? Maybe she was a retired pro... or maybe you had something to prove to her...

Honestly I'm done with this, you can get the last word. Thanks for playing. I'm sure we'll run into each other again.

JZImmer123
02-08-2009, 03:53 PM
Wow! Not that it would have made things any better, but I hope that A-hole at least had the courtesy to apologize, whether or not it is a genuine apology.

Either way I definately would've had words with that guy, especially knowing that person is notorius for headhunting. I'd hate to have a teammate like that. If I was the captain of that team I wouldn't play that guy for pulling a stunt like that during a practice.

randomname
02-09-2009, 07:19 AM
I would never compare my game to Rog or Rafa. Maybe I'm just lucky but I have NEVER hit anyone in the face. Unlike you who hits a kicker to a 60 yr old lady and it hits her in the face. Seriously a 60 yr old lady? Maybe she was a retired pro... or maybe you had something to prove to her...

Honestly I'm done with this, you can get the last word. Thanks for playing. I'm sure we'll run into each other again.

don't bother trying to argue with them, the vast majority of TW posters sit on a high horse on top of a giant pedestal, any minor transgression deserves capitol punishment and lord knows everyone here is up for sainthood if they could just complete that pesky third miracle.

autumn_leaf
02-09-2009, 07:30 AM
i have no idea why you turned your back in the first place. if you really didn't want to get hit you would've ducked right up next to the net with the racquet over your head.

better option for the game would be to back up and play defensively. this allows some breathing room and time for a reflex shot or at least enabled you to cover your face with your racquet.

and 3 people in 1 year wouldn't be that many.

i just got hit in the leg from a smash this past week. accidents tend to happen on any shot especially smashes because people tend to want to let-er-rip which causes not only devasting shots but mishits and lack or direction also.

blakesq
02-09-2009, 08:33 AM
I hit a guy yesterday right in the chest in a mixed doubles match. I said "sorry", and he was cool with it. Probably because he was hitting heaters right at my female partner most of the match. I almost hit him in the head, by accident, he basically almost ran into the ball. I apologized again, and again he was cool.