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superslam
02-04-2009, 02:22 PM
Should your ball toss be used with your index and thumb or by clinching it with all your fingers gently?

I always have trouble with my ball toss. It either goes too far to the right or too low that I end up hitting it into the net.

Also when is a good time to bend your knees when serving?

LeeD
02-04-2009, 02:26 PM
Try holding the ball with your thumb, forefinger, and use your middle finger to support the other two fingers, at the bottom. Don't use any wrist. If you have ball toss control problems, try to reach upwards directly from prep position, and NOT ALLOW the ball tossing hand to drop. Longer toss stroke makes for more mistakes.
Now KNOW which serve you are attempting, and know where the toss should be.
As for knee bend, if you do, it's bent most at the trophy position, ready to explode both up AND forewards into the court.

kimbahpnam
02-04-2009, 02:30 PM
really, whatever gets the ball to where you want it to go.

LeeD
02-04-2009, 02:33 PM
Funny ding, dat....
Used to hit with a ranked B player who had one strong arm, one tyranosauras midget arm. He'd scoop the ball up onto the racket, flip it over and bounce it to the serve position, then hit a normal pretty good serve, both first and second. Not huge by any means, but maybe 100 first and 70 mph topspin seconds.
Basically, he played one handed and was ranked maybe 30th or so in the NorCal B's.

tennisdad65
02-04-2009, 02:34 PM
Try holding the ball with your thumb, forefinger, and use your middle finger to support the other two fingers, at the bottom. .

Hi lee..
you really have me confused with this statement :)
how do I support my thumb and forefinger with my middle finger :confused:

do you mean.. hold the ball in the tips of the first 3 fingers?

LeeD
02-04-2009, 02:36 PM
I'm confused too....
OK, hold the ball wid dumb and pointer finger.
At the bottom of the ball, use your middle finger, but don't point it upwards all by itself. :confused::confused:
Trying to take the wrist out of the equation.

tennisdad65
02-04-2009, 02:40 PM
I'm confused too....
OK, hold the ball wid dumb and pointer finger.
At the bottom of the ball, use your middle finger, but don't point it upwards all by itself. :confused::confused:
Trying to take the wrist out of the equation.

yes.. :) that clarified it..
I just tried with the 3 fingers and it seems pretty good. I normally hold it in the tips of the first 4 fingers

pabletion
02-04-2009, 03:01 PM
ball toss is key........ I struggled for about a year with it and came to the conclusion that it needs to be as simple as possible. Keep the body quiet, as well as the arm. Keep the arm straight, and donw lower it too much when arming up for toss. Dont go down with your body nor bend knees while tossing; wait until you have already tossed to bend. Reach as further up with your tossing arm as possible, do not release ball until it is wayy up there! thats a very common mistake, releasing ball early, and that makes you lower tossing arm too fast. Reach for the ball, as in the trophy position.
hope it helps

anchorage
02-05-2009, 02:55 AM
Also, when you toss, the palm of your hand should be facing straight up.

LeeD
02-05-2009, 08:53 AM
Anchorage...
What you say is true if the player DOESN'T have problems with the wandering ball toss.
For players who toss all over the map, keep the palm 90 degrees to the ground! Dat way, you eliminate the wrist flip, which is 60% of the problems with wandering toss's.
I have a perfect toss :twisted::twisted: really. I NEVER catch the ball after tossing, and it mostly is within a half a foot from where I want it. I can hold it upside down for all that matters.
Nothing bothers me more than watching another server toss and catch over and over again, say SORRY over and over again, and still toss to far out left, right, back, and forwards.

Djokovicfan4life
02-05-2009, 09:57 AM
really, whatever gets the ball to where you want it to go.

100% disagree with this.

Here are the steps to developing a great toss:

1. Shoulder turn.

http://virtualtennisacademy.com/cms/serve.php/234/sampras_serve_shoulder_turn.gif

2. Tossing arm parallel to the baseline and moving forward to around 45 degrees as you begin your upward motion.

http://virtualtennisacademy.com/cms/serve.php/234/sampras_toss_ball_drop.gif

3. Release point should be at the 2 o'clock point on an imaginary clock.

http://virtualtennisacademy.com/cms/serve.php/234/agassi_serve_toss_release_point.gif

Hope this helps,

Matt

Sentinel
02-05-2009, 10:06 AM
Just want some clarifs:

I have askedt this question many times and never got a clear answer. You say toss arm parallel to baseline. Yet some folks like Soderling keep the toss arm perpendicular to the baseline.

The reason I adopted the parallel to baseline, was that when I rotate away from the court my arm should not get carreid away. That happens if the toss arm is pointing forward.

Yes, after watching Fed I too see that the arm rises forward at an angle.

2) Should you not stress where the ball should be falling (either where it should be at contact, or where it should land if you did not hit it).

I need the ball to be ahead of me if I want to get any real speed in the serve.
However, a lot of coaches say throw ahead only if you intend to S&V.

Thanks.

Djokovicfan4life
02-05-2009, 10:10 AM
Just want some clarifs:

I have askedt this question many times and never got a clear answer. You say toss arm parallel to baseline. Yet some folks like Soderling keep the toss arm perpendicular to the baseline.

The reason I adopted the parallel to baseline, was that when I rotate away from the court my arm should not get carreid away. That happens if the toss arm is pointing forward.

Yes, after watching Fed I too see that the arm rises forward at an angle.

2) Should you not stress where the ball should be falling (either where it should be at contact, or where it should land if you did not hit it).

I need the ball to be ahead of me if I want to get any real speed in the serve.
However, a lot of coaches say throw ahead only if you intend to S&V.

Thanks.

Not 100% sure on the Soderling thing, to be honest. But take a look at the 2nd step I provided and note how Sampras' arm moves back parallel to the baseline as a result of his shoulder rotation away for the net, then into the court as well at around a 45 degree angle to the net as he begins to use the back leg to transfer his weight forward into the ball, leading with the hip.

Drop me an email as well if necessary.

Matt

tennisdad65
02-05-2009, 04:59 PM
For players who toss all over the map, keep the palm 90 degrees to the ground! Dat way, you eliminate the wrist flip, which is 60% of the problems with wandering toss's....

Thanks for the tip :). I tried it out today and it was great. I normally have a big wrist flip problem and this completely eliminated that.

Do any pro's use this? is it common? First time I ever heard of tossing the ball this way, so I am guessing that it is uncommon and no pro's use it.

Djokovicfan4life
02-05-2009, 05:00 PM
Thanks for the tip :). I tried it out today and it was great. I normally have a big wrist flip problem and this completely eliminated that.

Do any pro's use this? is it common? First time I ever heard of tossing the ball this way, so I am guessing that it is uncommon and no pro's use it.

He's an "innovator", TD, mark my words.

LeeD
02-05-2009, 05:17 PM
Actually....
One old fart, GeorgePonticoff, a drunk, homeless, and never working man showed me this in 1976.
Now George was a decent C player, even drunk with a cigarette in his hands. He was really old, like 50 or so at the time.
His buds were ArtLarsen and JohnMurio. You might have heard of one or the other. Another of the regular old farts doubles group would include some ex A players (I don't recall all the names, it was a while ago, and drugs, ectasy, and alcohol....)
See, you are not the only person on these forums with some old experience.:):)