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OvertheFence
02-06-2009, 08:42 AM
Can someone explain how this works, and pros/cons. thnx

Kevo
02-06-2009, 09:10 AM
Well, I don't think you can think of a 1HBH as a windshield wiper in the same way you can a forehand. On a WW forehand the racquet will drop low before the forward swing and then *wipe* up and back down again.

On a 1HBH, you can start low, but you pretty much need to finish high. The only time I can think of a 1HBH being wiper-ish is when you are trying to hit a shot with very little forward swing. Maybe a short ball you need to hit cross-court. In that case you probably want mostly spin and very little forward speed, so you could end up "wristing" the ball over the net.

Djokovicfan4life
02-06-2009, 09:11 AM
Step 1: step onto court

Step 2: take racquet and "wipe" the ball for awhile.

Step 3: learn to hit the OHBH like a man.

*Sarcasm detectors on stun*

Sentinel
02-06-2009, 09:16 AM
omg , it took me a while - lol. I didn't know you switched off "coach mode" !!!

I don't know whether OP is referring to the wrist flick which you elaborated on elsewhere ?

LeeD
02-06-2009, 09:25 AM
I used to WW on the two handed backhand topspin.
But one handers, nah....

Racer41c
02-06-2009, 09:27 AM
http://www.fuzzyyellowballs.com/

Djokovicfan4life
02-06-2009, 09:29 AM
omg , it took me a while - lol. I didn't know you switched off "coach mode" !!!

I don't know whether OP is referring to the wrist flick which you elaborated on elsewhere ?

I did? Where? I thought my intentions were clear with this post. I'm strictly opposed to this concept of "wiping" the ball when it comes to generating topspin. I won't be switching off of coach mode in the near future either, believe me.

Matt

LeeD
02-06-2009, 11:33 AM
I'm wrong quite often.....
For me, the idea of WW is to insure a full follow tru, similar in hitting a baseball or a golfstroke. The full followthru forces a longer hitting zone, and a correct hitting form.
As far as actual impact, I don't consider hitting while trying to WW. The WW, to me, is the end of the followthru.

Djokovicfan4life
02-06-2009, 12:03 PM
I'm wrong quite often.....
For me, the idea of WW is to insure a full follow tru, similar in hitting a baseball or a golfstroke. The full followthru forces a longer hitting zone, and a correct hitting form.
As far as actual impact, I don't consider hitting while trying to WW. The WW, to me, is the end of the followthru.
Good stuff.

Sublime
02-06-2009, 12:24 PM
* Get low on your back foot
* Big shoulder turn on your takeback
* Swing out while remaining in your laid back position.

If your racket face is open enough and you've put enough juice on it, you'll send the ball over the fence, into the parking lot, and maybe, just maybe, hit a windshield wiper with your backhand.

Djokovicfan4life
02-06-2009, 12:27 PM
* Get low on your back foot
* Big shoulder turn on your takeback
* Swing out while remaining in your laid back position.

If your racket face is open enough and you've put enough juice on it, you'll send the ball over the fence, into the parking lot, and maybe, just maybe, hit a windshield wiper with your backhand.

Ahahahahahaha! Seriously, this is backhand technique were defining here, not that of a forehand. Why should they have to be the same?

oneguy21
02-06-2009, 12:57 PM
I don't think such shots are possible.

For the one-handed backhand, your racquet would have to swing across and parallel to your face and at some point you should be able to see through the strings.

If you employ, the technique I just described, it can lead to injury.

Just use the classic ohb to generate the topspin.

They key is getting under the ball. (which means getting low) Don't try what a lot of people do and just scrape the top of the ball.

LeeD
02-06-2009, 02:04 PM
Post #5 ??

Djokovicfan4life
02-06-2009, 09:34 PM
Post #5 ??

Are you starting to see my personal beef with the WW terminology, LD? :wink:

NamRanger
02-06-2009, 10:30 PM
Actually, Gasquet, Kuerten, and alot of other clay players, or those who use semi-western / western backhand grips use a pseudo windshield wiper 1HBH. I'm sure Yandell could provide better feedback on this.



It's very prominent in players who have some hip rotation on their backhand (more than usual). Wawrinka is one player who I have seen that has this type of backhand. It's absolutely deadly when executed properly.




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4t-l7KX1RM



Where the traditional backhand keeps the racquet in front of the body, watch how Wawrinka rotates his hips and shoulders in sync with his racquet, and watch where the racquet ends. It's actually behind him. This allows Wawrinka to put tremendous amounts of topspin and pace on the ball. It's one of the reasons why when Nadal and Wawrinka meet, Nadal tends to try and outmaneuver Wawrinka, rather than attack his backhand relentlessly.

LeeD
02-07-2009, 07:55 AM
Seems to me the red shirter is exposing the backside of his racket to the opponent, rather than the hitting side.

oneguy21
02-07-2009, 08:46 AM
Does anyone know what backhand grip Wawrinka uses?

Dreamer
02-07-2009, 09:56 AM
One handed backhands are not windshield wiper motions, you'll miss a lot of balls with this mindset. It may resemble it, but the motion you're looking for is low to high. The flourish makes it look like a WW, but you'll find difficulties with a OHBH trying to emulate a ww motion

NamRanger
02-07-2009, 10:22 AM
Does anyone know what backhand grip Wawrinka uses?


Same as Gasquet or something very similar.

NamRanger
02-07-2009, 10:24 AM
One handed backhands are not windshield wiper motions, you'll miss a lot of balls with this mindset. It may resemble it, but the motion you're looking for is low to high. The flourish makes it look like a WW, but you'll find difficulties with a OHBH trying to emulate a ww motion



I have to respectfully disagree. Some one handed backhands do resemble something like a WW motion. It is not perfectly a WW motion, but Wawrinka's backhand has a significant amount of supernation in it; more so than Federer. This is why he can get tremendous pace and spin.

Dreamer
02-07-2009, 10:55 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4t-l7KX1RM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewDuDmoWMFk&feature=related

I agreed that it may resemble it, but I just believe it's misleading to call it windshield wiper. The mechanics are very different. I think a lot of people would go out there trying to hit a ww forehand on their backhand side. Wawrinka's foundation is still a classic one handed backhand, low to high despite his supination. It also ends short of the full WW motion because of the range of motion on backhand side. Where WW forehand the racquet could very well finish at the waist.

WW takes away from how different a onehand backhand is from both forehand and the 2hbh. There really should be more emphasis on how different these strokes are especially the use of shoulder and legs.

BeHappy
02-07-2009, 11:13 AM
Same as Gasquet or something very similar.

no, eastern.

NamRanger
02-07-2009, 11:14 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4t-l7KX1RM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewDuDmoWMFk&feature=related

I agreed that it may resemble it, but I just believe it's misleading to call it windshield wiper. The mechanics are very different. I think a lot of people would go out there trying to hit a ww forehand on their backhand side. Wawrinka's foundation is still a classic one handed backhand, low to high despite his supination. It also ends short of the full WW motion because of the range of motion on backhand side. Where WW forehand the racquet could very well finish at the waist.

WW takes away from how different a onehand backhand is from both forehand and the 2hbh. There really should be more emphasis on how different these strokes are especially the use of shoulder and legs.


True, however I do think that Wawrinka's backhand should be classified separately from Federer's one hand backhand. Though they both have the same basic principals behind them, Wawrinka does a few things significantly different, which is why he can drive through and create more topspin.

BeHappy
02-07-2009, 11:15 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4t-l7KX1RM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewDuDmoWMFk&feature=related

I agreed that it may resemble it, but I just believe it's misleading to call it windshield wiper. The mechanics are very different. I think a lot of people would go out there trying to hit a ww forehand on their backhand side. Wawrinka's foundation is still a classic one handed backhand, low to high despite his supination. It also ends short of the full WW motion because of the range of motion on backhand side. Where WW forehand the racquet could very well finish at the waist.

WW takes away from how different a onehand backhand is from both forehand and the 2hbh. There really should be more emphasis on how different these strokes are especially the use of shoulder and legs.

I agree, the downward finish is due to rotation of the shoulder, not the hand.

BeHappy
02-07-2009, 11:16 AM
True, however I do think that Wawrinka's backhand should be classified separately from Federer's one hand backhand. Though they both have the same basic principals behind them, Wawrinka does a few things significantly different, which is why he can drive through and create more topspin.

no .

BeHappy
02-07-2009, 11:18 AM
Good stuff.

I find it very creepy (a la Hitchcock's Pycho) the way you copy Bungalo Bill's posting style.

NamRanger
02-07-2009, 03:02 PM
no, eastern.


Wawrinka does not use an Eastern Backhand grip. I seriously don't know what you are looking at.

Djokovicfan4life
02-07-2009, 05:39 PM
I find it very creepy (a la Hitchcock's Pycho) the way you copy Bungalo Bill's posting style.

Who ****ed in your Cheerio's this morning?

NamRanger
02-07-2009, 06:00 PM
Who ****ed in your Cheerio's this morning?


That's how he always is. He's a well known troll, just ignore him. He tried to accuse a world class coach of not knowing what he was talking about.

Djokovicfan4life
02-07-2009, 06:03 PM
That's how he always is. He's a well known troll, just ignore him. He tried to accuse a world class coach of not knowing what he was talking about.

Today's lesson plan: :)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mentor
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friend

BeHappy
02-08-2009, 04:43 AM
That's how he always is. He's a well known troll, just ignore him. He tried to accuse a world class coach of not knowing what he was talking about.

Ok? personal attack much? I was right about that guy btw, he said you should hit the serve facing the court, no knee bend etc, insane. I don't know anyone else apart from yourself who calls me a troll btw.






And Yes, Wawrinka does have an Eastern Grip on his backhand, and I have no reason to be biased as I am a big fan of the semi western backhand. I've witnessed his backhand crumble against Nadal as well.

Now back in your cave.

BeHappy
02-08-2009, 04:44 AM
Who ****ed in your Cheerio's this morning?

This is good stuff.

lol it's pretty transparent Djokovicfan4life

BeHappy
02-08-2009, 04:54 AM
http://s5.tinypic.com/2uh1h07.jpg

Eastern grip, the ball is only between chest and waist and you can see he's approaching the very limit of his grip in terms of the height it can handle before having to actually bend his wrist downward. A player using a semi western grip on the other hand would have his hand nearly fully laid back at this point.

Djokovicfan4life
02-08-2009, 07:18 AM
This is good stuff.

lol it's pretty transparent Djokovicfan4life

http://l.yimg.com/img.tv.yahoo.com/tv/us/img/site/78/67/0000037867_20070216115823.jpg

Take your blah blah to the blah blaholigist.

Jonny S&V
02-08-2009, 07:25 AM
Same as Gasquet or something very similar.

Wawrinka does not use an Eastern Backhand grip. I seriously don't know what you are looking at.

http://s5.tinypic.com/2uh1h07.jpg

Eastern grip, the ball is only between chest and waist and you can see he's approaching the very limit of his grip in terms of the height it can handle before having to actually bend his wrist downward. A player using a semi western grip on the other hand would have his hand nearly fully laid back at this point.

Not to mention he turns his wrist so it looks like a semi-western backhand.

NamRanger
02-08-2009, 11:20 AM
Ok? personal attack much? I was right about that guy btw, he said you should hit the serve facing the court, no knee bend etc, insane. I don't know anyone else apart from yourself who calls me a troll btw.






And Yes, Wawrinka does have an Eastern Grip on his backhand, and I have no reason to be biased as I am a big fan of the semi western backhand. I've witnessed his backhand crumble against Nadal as well.

Now back in your cave.



Ok Gorilla. Ok. We get it. You're a world class coach. You > The Serve Doctor.




Wait......... why are you on these forums again? Didn't you get banned? Oh that's right. You can't live without these forums.




His backhand is a semi-western grip. I sure didn't see his backhand crumble at Stuttgart when he played Nadal on clay.

BeHappy
02-08-2009, 12:16 PM
Ok Gorilla.
???????????????????????????
Ok. We get it. You're a world class coach. You > The Serve Doctor.
That was the consensus yes.




Wait......... why are you on these forums again? Didn't you get banned? Oh that's right. You can't live without these forums.
I hardly ever post on these forums, what are you talking about?




His backhand is a semi-western grip.[/quote

No it isn't, look at the still.

[quote] I sure didn't see his backhand crumble at Stuttgart when he played Nadal on clay.
When he lost in straight sets? Nadal has a 3 - 0 record against Stan.

junbumkim
02-08-2009, 12:43 PM
His backhand is a semi-western grip. I sure didn't see his backhand crumble at Stuttgart when he played Nadal on clay.

His backhand grip is NOT semi-western grip. It seems like it's between SW and Eastern backhand grip..

http://tennis.topbuzz.com/tennis-pics/v/one-handed-backhand/stanislas+wawrinka+backhand+at+contact.jpg.html

Compare the following two pictures and you can see the difference.

http://www.advantage-tennis.com/wawrinka/index.php?ind=6

Gasquet
http://tennis.about.com/od/playersmale/ss/gasquetbackhand_3.htm

Alafter
02-08-2009, 08:18 PM
Well, I dunno about windshield on backhand. But remember the reason for windshielding: topspin. Just happens to be the most effective way to go for forehand, right?

That said, i think your foremost concern should be achieving topspin, not the motion, right?

I think this is what we should all be looking to do. Huge cut on the ball, probably killer topspin:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oX7CcDIkMhE