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View Full Version : The "incredible" Spahetti racquet used by Nastase is a Myth


The Pusher Terminator
02-27-2005, 07:34 AM
Nastase used the spaghetti racquet to snap Vilas' world record winning streak. Vilas cried like a baby and simply quit in the second set. His coach Tiriac then used his political clout to make this racquet the first illegal racquet in the history of tennis.

I am here to say that the effeciveness of the Spaghetti string is a myth! I personally just bought an adidas racquet (the Lendl one) which is spaghetti strung on ****.....and its really not that big of a deal. It is silent when you hit it and you can get some wicked spin....but the power sucks!! This racquet does not give players an unfair advantage. You are not able to hit kickers over the fence as the "legend" says you can.

It is a real shame that this racquet was made illegal simply for political reasons. It would have added a new dimension to the game. You would see power players vs. Spin doctors. Personally, I lost my match using the spaghetti...the power is terrible.

Frankc
02-27-2005, 09:06 AM
First of all, the technology at the time was different as was the game. There was little power then - it was mostly foot speed and a hand and eye match of wits. To the best athlete went the spoils. The power available to all of us now changes the equation of successs in tennis and our own frame of reference as to waht is effective- does the power "sucK" (not my usual word choice)as opposed to wood and metal and first generation graphite? Additionally, do a lttle reserach... very few players were gifted enough to really time and use the sphaghetti effectively. Most pros could not use it a few did. Only one of my friends could effectively wield it well - and he was a top regional competitor. By the way, it was not the power, it was the wicked spin and angles. A top spin forehand would bounce into and sometimes over the side fence. A second serve may do likewise - it was dizzy, geometry defying junk WHEN IN THE RIGHT HANDS> That was admittedly few of us. Something tells me that with a new edge, Nastase could still give Vilas a real hard time - that was his edge.

Rabbit
02-27-2005, 10:19 AM
Stan Smith would also probably disagree as he fell victim to Michael Fishbach at the U.S. Open. Fishbach was playing with a spaghetti strung racket at the time. Their match was on clay as I recall. Smith said he couldn't hear the ball and that spin was unbelievable off Fishbach's racket. Fishbach was, at best, a journeyman with no significant results prior to that.

NoBadMojo
02-27-2005, 10:37 AM
like Rabbit sez...Martin Fischbach was really the first to use this to my knowldege..he wasnt beating anyone of consequence until he switched to the sphag..he was unskilled compared to the likes of Smith and Nastase and Vilas..nobody had control with this thing....you would just load it up w. totally unpredicatble spin and aim for pretty much the center of the court because there was no control w. these things....i dont consider that talent...it was actually embarrassing for better players who found themselves lunging for balls because the bounces where so unpredictable and inconsistently erratic..even the racquet operator had no clue where the ball was going or how the spin would take the court....it was determined that spaghetti stringing should be disallowed for the joke that it is.

BERDI4
02-27-2005, 05:33 PM
The decision to forbid the spaghetti strings was before Vilas match against Nastase. The problem was that the rule was going to be active from Monday on, one day after that match. So if the match was rain delayed, Nastase wouldn't be able to use the sapg strings and maybe it would be another story.
I think you didn't like the strings Pusher because you were using an old racquet which has'nt the technology of the new ones.

The Pusher Terminator
02-27-2005, 06:28 PM
I read what some of you guys said. I agree that the spaghetti only worked well in the right hands....so then why make it illegal? I mean the babolat only works well in the right hands as well....can you say Roddick!

Secondly, I heard that Fishbach would have beaten Smith anyway since Smith was in the twighlight of his career. Furthermore, Fishbach was not a scrub. he was a pretty good player.

Thirdly, I did like the racquet but I just liked modern day racqets better. I really don't think the spaghetti should have been made illegal. Tennis has become a power game....the Spaghetti would have been a nice counter to the power in todays game.

Finally, The strings were not made illegal prior to the Nastase match....there was a suspension on them at the time...read Vic Braden's Tennis encyclopedia. It was Tiriacs crying and politics that made the racquet illegal.

Metzler
02-27-2005, 07:30 PM
Pg. 270 and 271 of Bud Collins' Total Tennis, the definitive tennis encyclopedia (Braden has not written an encyclopedia of tennis) points out that that the spaghetti racquet was invented in West Germany by Werner Fisher in 1977. "...it gained further notoriety at the US Open when an obscure American player named Mike Fishbach tounced ...ex-champ and 16th seed Stan Smith... a couple of weeks later, Ilie Nastase was beaten by a French player Georges Goven who used a spaghetti racquet. Nastase vowed he would never play against it again, but the following week used it himself to end Vilas' long winning streak. Vilas quit down two sets in the best 3 of 5, claiming the exaggerated spin hurt his elbow. The ITF had already acted by that time, however, instituting a temporary ban effective the day (Oct. 2) the tournament ended. The following June the ban was made permanent, based on a report by the University of Brunswick in West Germany, claiming every hit was in fact a double hit, a violation of tennis rules."
Berd 14, Rabbit and Mojo have the facts on their side - the racquet would have been like making tennis a game of only knuckleball pitchers - like Nastase, everyone would have had to used one in an escalating arms race of wild spins without knowing where they were hitting them

Rabbit
02-28-2005, 11:19 AM
Fishbach's only claim to fame was the match in which he defeated Smith using the spaghetti strung racket. No one ever heard of him before that match, or after. While he may have been a pretty good player, he certainly was not a world class player and to my knowlege never ranked in the top 100 even. He was also never considered a threat to beat Smith and this is what caused the furor. The fact that a lesser player could beat a world class pro was what got them (the strings) thrown out. Finally, this match was played on clay at Forest Hills, I say this only because this means that the match occurred prior to 1978. I believe the match was played in 1975, which means that Smith was only 4 years out from winning the Open.

Even the proponents of spaghetti stringing admit that its users were/are able to generate nearly twice the amount of spin that is normally possible. I feel that the ITF finally did something right. This, like so many gadgets in golf, substantially altered the game. IMO, the ITF should do more, not less to protect the game. There are other ways they can curtail the rise in power other than allowing something like spaghetti stringing.

NoBadMojo
02-28-2005, 11:37 AM
I think the ITF or whoever the more dominating governing body in tennis might be SHOULD change a rule in tennis to allow for the best players with the most skills to rise to the top and to skew the game away from boring baseline bashing no risk play and into more exciting all court play..all allowing spaghetti stringing would do would allow lesser players to win more. The prob w. tennis IMO is there are too many organizations and governing bodies..the ITF, the ATP, the WTA et al and they arent helping tennis and they seem to not be coordination their efforts in any way...i dont think the issue is one of power it's more about racquet headsize..make the largest allowable headsize on tour like an 85 and watch the game change to more all court and watch the truly best players (ball strilkers) rise to the top rather than the most trained in many cases..says even more for Fed that he can be a level above everyone else in this day of ****genous cloned baseline play. Todd martin when recently interviewed said <and i roughly quote>..'with the new technology pros can just pretty much flail away and slap at the ball anyway they like and good technique really isnt rewarded any more.' to me. thats a function of headsize more than power. my .o2

SC in MA
02-28-2005, 07:23 PM
Pusher Terminator: If I recall, that Lendl racket sold on **** was a very conservative type of spaghetti stringing. Testing what's left of my memory even more, I recall a friend of mine who experimented extensively with spaghetti stringing techniques. I was surprised anyone could even hit with some of his concoctions, some of which consisted of short pieces of loosely weaved plastic tubing and fishing line and maybe even tin foil and other odds and ends that I can't recall. The ball he could hit with some of these setups was virtually unreturnable because of hellaciously unpredictable and often giant spin. The ball did not have to be hit hard to make it unreturnable. It made a mockery of the game. It was no myth.

TommyGun
02-28-2005, 07:35 PM
Bring back grass as the universal surface. Then it don't matter what the racquets are like, you just can't flail away at balls that don't bounce evenly.

I think that if you have a good pro and teach children at a young age an all court game and approach then technique will still get rewarded. One dimensional players don't win Wimbledon. One dimensional players don't win as much overall on tour either. Martina Hingis was proof that talent can still win over brute strength.

andfor
02-28-2005, 08:32 PM
I heard that Fishbach would have beaten Smith anyway since Smith was in the twighlight of his career. Furthermore, Fishbach was not a scrub. he was a pretty good player.

Let's allow the the record of how good of a playing career Fishbach had speak for itself:

Mike Fishbach (USA)

Birthdate: 12/1/1954

Birthplace: Bronx, NY

Residence: N/A

Height: 5'11'' (180 cm)

Weight: 155 lbs (70 kg)

Plays: Right-handed

Career High INDESIT ATP Entry Ranking - Singles: 47 (1/16/1978 )

Career High ATP Entry Ranking - Doubles: 300 (1/3/1983)

Singles Record: 16 - 41

Singles Titles: 0

Double Titles: 1

Career Doubles 42 - 57

Stan Smith = Tennis Hall of Fame
Mike Fishbach = Scrub

NoBadMojo
02-28-2005, 08:47 PM
lol..that 16-41 singles record is most impressive..and i wonder how many of those W's were spaghetti strung wins?

andfor
02-28-2005, 08:57 PM
lol..that 16-41 singles record is most impressive..and i wonder how many of those W's were spaghetti strung wins?

My thoughts exatctly! Here's a journeyman who was "pretty good" with a 16 - 41 career singles record? Stan Smith's career recor was 615 - 257.
At the same time on other threads here we have some posters bagging on players with Grand Slam titles, former world number 1's and slamming a guy who won 14 majors. What a wild swing of opinons.

NoBadMojo
02-28-2005, 09:16 PM
Andfor this is a nutty place at times..sometimes ya just gotta scratch your head and laugh.....and move on...thats what i'm learning to do.

andfor
02-28-2005, 09:29 PM
Andfor this is a nutty place at times..sometimes ya just gotta scratch your head and laugh.....and move on...thats what i'm learning to do.

I'm getting there Ed, slowly, I'm getting there..........Push will be on the attack tomorrow to support his cause because I debunked another of his claims with hard evidence. :D Having said that he'll now try to bait me into some drawn out debate. I am going to head it off now. As I told him before he needs to go the the ITF and apply to legalize his Spaghetti racket.

It's all in fun Push. lol

bc-05
03-01-2005, 03:50 AM
hmm gives me an idea.. seriously i never tried this type of stringing... does it really work though? coz if it does.. i still have a score to settle with this girl friend of mine (not gf) that plays in the state team that beat my arse last time... if i used this would i be able to beat her? and make her lunge for her shots?

Rabbit
03-01-2005, 06:01 AM
Let's allow the the record of how good of a playing career Fishbach had speak for itself:

Mike Fishbach (USA)

Birthdate: 12/1/1954

Birthplace: Bronx, NY

Residence: N/A

Height: 5'11'' (180 cm)

Weight: 155 lbs (70 kg)

Plays: Right-handed

Career High INDESIT ATP Entry Ranking - Singles: 47 (1/16/1978 )

Career High ATP Entry Ranking - Doubles: 300 (1/3/1983)

Singles Record: 16 - 41

Singles Titles: 0

Double Titles: 1

Career Doubles 42 - 57

Stan Smith = Tennis Hall of Fame
Mike Fishbach = Scrub

DUDE! - that is awesome! LMAO...

- Bring back grass as the universal surface. Then it don't matter what the racquets are like, you just can't flail away at balls that don't bounce evenly.


I agree with a friendly amendment. Tennis, especially in the Grand Slams, should be played on a natural surface. Since the rest of the tour basically exists to support the Grand Slams, this means that they would change and tennis would return to what it once was.

Those of you too young to remember the American clay court season really missed some nice tennis. The green clay that is used in America is fast enough to serve/volley on, but slow enough to give backcourters a sporting chance. If it's maintained properly, and with the new watering systems that are underground, it can play as true as a hardcourt.

andfor
03-01-2005, 06:44 AM
[QUOTE=Rabbit]DUDE! - that is awesome! LMAO...

Right off the ATP and ITF websites..........

The Pusher Terminator
03-01-2005, 10:14 AM
Pg. 270 and 271 of Bud Collins' Total Tennis, the definitive tennis encyclopedia (Braden has not written an encyclopedia of tennis) points out that that the spaghetti racquet was invented in West Germany by Werner Fisher in 1977. "...it gained further notoriety at the US Open when an obscure American player named Mike Fishbach tounced ...ex-champ and 16th seed Stan Smith... a couple of weeks later, Ilie Nastase was beaten by a French player Georges Goven who used a spaghetti racquet. Nastase vowed he would never play against it again, but the following week used it himself to end Vilas' long winning streak. Vilas quit down two sets in the best 3 of 5, claiming the exaggerated spin hurt his elbow. The ITF had already acted by that time, however, instituting a temporary ban effective the day (Oct. 2) the tournament ended. The following June the ban was made permanent, based on a report by the University of Brunswick in West Germany, claiming every hit was in fact a double hit, a violation of tennis rules."
Berd 14, Rabbit and Mojo have the facts on their side - the racquet would have been like making tennis a game of only knuckleball pitchers - like Nastase, everyone would have had to used one in an escalating arms race of wild spins without knowing where they were hitting them


Yup thats exactly what I read! I meant Bud collins...thanks....I was reading on the court with a friend and I couldn't remeber who wrote it. Anyway....we were reading it with the Spaghetti racquet in our hand. We both agreed that the double hit thing was a load of crap...it was just a way to make a political situation go away. They had decided to find a way to make the thing illegal. I am telling you....there is no way Nastase could have beaten Roddick with this thing.

The high powered racquets of today give just as much of an unfair advantage as anything else. In baseball they limit bats to wood....why? Same thing in tennis. If there are going to be limits on racquets then they need to be fair. The increase in head size and the improvement in racquet materials gives way more of an advantage than Spaghetti ever did. I am telling you it was purely a political matter and that is why it was made illegal. I bet if Wilson pushed for it to be legal then they would get their way.

It is very hard for a small timer to break into this business. A guy like Werner Fischer did not stand a chance against the huge political powers that stood in their way. In fact , I spoke with gunter harz's attorney (Harz imported the racquets) and he says that Harz ran out of money and could not continue tha lawsuit against the USTA...in fact the attorney is still ****ed off because he is owed a huge chunk of money. This is simply another case of corporate America beating up on the small guy. In the end we as tennis fans lose.


Finally...dear mr. "and for",

I have truly missed our debates. Good to see you back . In response to yours please consider this:
#47 in the world is not that terrible my friend. It is not unheard of for the number 47 in the world to beat an aging ex champion...I mean lets face it ....Mcenroe lost to Krishnan and I believe monfil an unranked Junior just beat a top ten player. It does happen. Smith was in the twighlight of his career...I don't think it was so unbelievable that Fishbach won. In any event making it to the top 50 in the world is a huge acheivemnet and it means that he was not soooooo unheard of as the myth says. he was actually a pretty decent player who played with two hands on both the forehand and backhand. The guy could play...he was no scrub and would have beaten Smith on that particular day under those particular conditions with any racquet.

ClemsonTennis9
03-01-2005, 12:46 PM
does anyone have a picture of a racquet that is spaghetti strung...i cant tell what it is

Rabbit
03-01-2005, 02:26 PM
#47 in the world is not that terrible my friend. It is not unheard of for the number 47 in the world to beat an aging ex champion...I mean lets face it ....Mcenroe lost to Krishnan and I believe monfil an unranked Junior just beat a top ten player. It does happen. Smith was in the twighlight of his career...I don't think it was so unbelievable that Fishbach won. In any event making it to the top 50 in the world is a huge acheivemnet and it means that he was not soooooo unheard of as the myth says. he was actually a pretty decent player who played with two hands on both the forehand and backhand. The guy could play...he was no scrub and would have beaten Smith on that particular day under those particular conditions with any racquet.

#47 in the world is not terrible, but Fishbach wasn't anywhere near there when he played Smith. Smith was not in the twilight of his career as several years later, he and Bob Lutz displaced McEnroe and Fleming in a Davis Cup tie as the doubles team. The match was played against Lendl, Smid, and company from Czechoslavakia. Fishbach was not a scrub, he was more like a journeyman pro. The player of today that comes to mind is Vince Spadea although Spadea has had more consistent results than even Fishbach dreamed of.

IMO, the only reason he beat Smith on any day was the string job. Why, after the match was he never heard from again? If he was such a force, where were his results after that match. I remember when it happened, and I had been a fan of tennis for several years even then. I'd never heard of him and I never heard of him again. It was very much like Peter Doohan (who I have heard of since) beating Becker at Wimbledon the year after he won it. Even a blind squirrel finds an acorn every now and then.

McEnroe always had trouble with Ramesh Krishnan, even when he was #1 in the world. Why? It was a bad match up for McEnroe. McEnroe himself played off the other guy's pace and Krishnan gave absolutely no pace. He played touch tennis and did so better than McEnroe on occasion. This, in my opinion, is an invalid comparison. Plus, Krishnan was ranked consistently higher than Fishbach ever thought about being.


The spaghetti string job that Fishbach used had a myriad of extra string, rubber bands, and paper clips that were attached to the regular string bed. They required constant maintenance during play (done on change overs). The ITF banned them because they significantly altered the game.

andfor
03-01-2005, 04:16 PM
Push, I have spoken my peace here and we have already discussed this in another post ad nauseum(sp?). My brain is going to run out of hard drive space if I don't stop.

As I have said to you before, talking about it here is like talking about it with Oprah or Dr. Phil, nobody here is going to grant your wish. Go the the ITF and apply to legalize the Spaghetti racket. Let us know what the say, heck publish their response here. I know many here would find that facinating if you did.

Good luck in you quest to legalize the Spaghetti racket. And since you like challenges like this one try to legalize another easy one, CRACK COCAINE.

Serve and Volley
03-02-2005, 07:03 AM
what the hell?

Serve and Volley
03-02-2005, 07:19 AM
what the hell?

Rabbit
03-02-2005, 07:19 AM
Who exactly is he attacking, The Pusher Terminator or Serve and Volley.

I'm not sure, but I think this ploy has been used before with disastrous results to the poster's credibility. In the immortal words of the Who, "Who are you?". Given the facts that we have a dual personality thing going on, my participation in this thread is at an end and any credibility given to the other side of the argument at an end as well.

TommyGun
03-02-2005, 07:30 AM
Spaghetti strining was just a fad, and had the ITF not banned it it would probably have died on its own:

1. About one person in the world really knew how to do fettucini stringing, and I guarantee after about a year of stringers being asked to to it they would be charging too much for it to bee economically feasible.

2. having hit with a version of "pasta", it wasn't the easiest to hit with. I remember having to alter my swing some just to keep balls in play..

3. Eventually enough people would complain, as the bounces were ridiculous, and then start to refuse to play people with them.

Either way, its moot now, isn't it?

The Pusher Terminator
03-02-2005, 07:38 AM
Who exactly is he attacking, The Pusher Terminator or Serve and Volley.

I'm not sure, but I think this ploy has been used before with disastrous results to the poster's credibility. In the immortal words of the Who, "Who are you?". Given the facts that we have a dual personality thing going on, my participation in this thread is at an end and any credibility given to the other side of the argument at an end as well.

Incorrect. Its just a mistake. I created the nic serve and volley but unfortunately there is someone else with another nic Serve-and-volley( the differences is the dashes). Which was almost exactly the same as my nic and created too much confusion. Therefore I made a new nic and the "pusher terminator was born". Unfortunately, this computer automatically logged me in as serve and volley accidentally. Therefore to avoid any confusion I have erased my response. I assure you that there is a real Serve-and-volley out ther and he is a different person than I am. Sorry for any confusion.

andfor
03-02-2005, 09:27 AM
You guys do know I was just joking?

NoBadMojo
03-02-2005, 09:42 AM
Andfor you are not permitted to joke around here......:) that's a TW board code violation...should your bahviour continue, you will only be permitted to post in the Vacation/Travel folder of the board ;)

The Pusher Terminator
03-02-2005, 09:53 AM
You guys do know I was just joking?

Damn...I was already just about to begin my quest to have crack cocaine be made legal. Now that I know you were only joking I must quit. Damn you and for...lol,.

andfor
03-02-2005, 12:33 PM
Andfor you are not permitted to joke around here......:) that's a TW board code violation...should your bahviour continue, you will only be permitted to post in the Vacation/Travel folder of the board ;)

Ed, Yours is an unprovaked direct assult on me. Our honor can only be salvage by a dual.
Not that kind of dual, a tennis match! Now if only we could have a TW Board Tennis Tournament.

LOL, AF

andfor
03-02-2005, 12:37 PM
Damn...I was already just about to begin my quest to have crack cocaine be made legal. Now that I know you were only joking I must quit. Damn you and for...lol,.

The Crack Cocaine blast was a joke. Now as for you going to the ITF. That's another story. Even though I know their answer in advance (they would laugh) I am willing to help you if you'll write up your petition to legalize Spaghetti racket. LOL

Push you got busted with your 2 names. Now that's funny. :mrgreen:

Rabbit
03-02-2005, 12:47 PM
Wouldn't that be a duel?

The Pusher Terminator
03-02-2005, 02:25 PM
The Crack Cocaine blast was a joke. Now as for you going to the ITF. That's another story. Even though I know their answer in advance (they would laugh) I am willing to help you if you'll write up your petition to legalize Spaghetti racket. LOL

Push you got busted with your 2 names. Now that's funny. :mrgreen:


secondly , Maybe I will change my name to and-for and then see what you would do? Sheesh! and therefore I now challenge you to a duel once again...XBOX baby! go out and splurge and buy the damn thing so I can kick your ***. "That was a joke ".

andfor
03-02-2005, 03:08 PM
Wouldn't that be a duel?

I was sick the day they taught that.

NoBadMojo
03-02-2005, 03:12 PM
funny Andfor..somewhile ago i suggested a TW sponsored demo days event and tourney on the board and was even willing to do some organization.it would be fun to see who really has game and who just makes alot of noise around here..not too many people responded.....i wonder what that might mean???????

andfor
03-02-2005, 04:08 PM
funny Andfor..somewhile ago i suggested a TW sponsored demo days event and tourney on the board and was even willing to do some organization.it would be fun to see who really has game and who just makes alot of noise around here..not too many people responded.....i wonder what that might mean???????

I remember your suggestion and am pretty sure I responded. It turned south and ended up as a funny. I am for the tournament and even if it's in California. If things are right at the ranch here I would try to make that event.

Back to the subject. Spaghetti racket legalization, fun to talk about but realistically not happening in our lifetime.

The Pusher Terminator
03-02-2005, 07:00 PM
"andfor" you are a yellow belly ,,,,,

In any event does anyone know how to start a league on xbox topspin online?

andfor
03-02-2005, 07:07 PM
"andfor" you are a yellow belly ,,,,,

In any event does anyone know how to start a league on xbox topspin online?

Push, I told you before, I don't have an XBOX. My kids have a PS2. I only participate (you don't like the word play) in real tennis. :D

Now get to writing that appeal to the ITF.

The Pusher Terminator
03-03-2005, 04:35 AM
Push, I told you before, I don't have an XBOX. My kids have a PS2. I only participate (you don't like the word play) in real tennis. :D

Now get to writing that appeal to the ITF.


Ok old man (chicken). But before I write to the ITF I will take you up on your suggestion fighting to make crack cocaine legal! Can I sign your kids up?...lol.

Dedans Penthouse
03-03-2005, 05:52 AM
.......and would have beaten Smith on that particular day under those particular conditions with any racquet.

With any racquet (i.e. a "normal" racquet)? Nope. It wasn't that THAT particular day had Fishback playing well and Smith playing poorly. It was Fishback's "cheat" stick that did the trick. 1975 was only 3 years removed from Stan Smith leading probably the most impressive Davis Cup win; 1972 U.S.A. vs. Romania (in Romania) and in an atmosphere so hostile that it would've made playing in Central and/or South America look like a walk in the park, against flagrantly cheating linesmen, a brow-beaten chair umpire and two cheating pieces of garbage Ilie Nastase and Ion Tiriac, especially Tiriac. (sorry for using the term "garbage" .... in retrospect, the term "garbage" doesn't really do those 2 clowns justice -- esp. to describe Tiriac and his OUTRAGEOUS cheating. I bring that up to illustrate Stan Smith's quiet tenacity and unflappable demeanor. That was one of the qualities that made him the number one player in the world. Stan Smith was not one to "shrink from the fight" or freakout when faced with some screwy obstacle such as a ham-and-egger playing with a gimmick stick. Fishback was a good player, but he was not, by any stretch of the immagination, a Stan Smith, even a 1975 Smith. Smith, though not in the G.O.A.T. fraternity was nevertheless a clear #1 in the world (just before Connors took over) and an all-time great. And although Smith is probably a relative unknown to younger tennis fans of today, he was also one of the true class acts in sports let alone tennis.

As to the spaghetti racquet: I saw it one time at Forest Hills. There was (for a short while) a tournament played at Forest Hills in the spring (Forest Hills stadium had removed the grass and installed Har-Tru), and this pro (whose name escapes me) was on a side court with 2 other pro players who were clowing around with a spaghetti racquet. It was like watching a dog performing tricks the way they could absolutely turn the ball into a whirring egg -- it wasn't cricket. And, it certainly wasn't tennis.

andfor
03-03-2005, 06:53 AM
Ok old man (chicken). But before I write to the ITF I will take you up on your suggestion fighting to make crack cocaine legal! Can I sign your kids up?...lol.

Very tacky Push. No, you can't and that does not let you out of writing the ITF. Now get started on your homework or I'll come take away your XBOX kid.

Rabbit
03-03-2005, 08:21 AM
Dedans - I recently saw a recap of the 71 final which was the first between the US and Romania. It was played in the States on hard courts. Again, against Tiriac, Smith was down two sets to love and came back to win the match in something over 5 hours. He played both singles and teamed with Erik Van Dillen to play the dubs. It was as great a performance as his 72 final.

gmlasam
03-03-2005, 08:29 AM
Pusher Terminator,

Would you post a pic of that racquet with spaghetti stringing you purchased from ****?

Dedans Penthouse
03-03-2005, 10:48 AM
Ok old man (chicken). But before I write to the ITF I will take you up on your suggestion fighting to make crack cocaine legal! Can I sign your kids up?...lol.

rotflmao.......and I thought I was warped......

Rabbit: I don't really recall that "earlier" (1971) final vs. Romania that was played in the U.S., because I didn't follow tennis at that time (outside of going to the U.S. Open at Forest Hills as a sports event "happening" if you will). I mean, I didn't know didly-squat about who was whom (aside from the "big names"), but Forest Hills was fun in that you could wander around the grounds and look at side court matches, practices, etc..

I only recall the '72 finals (the one played in Romania) because of the press it received in the papers; there was a mysterious vibe to the event because it was blacked out from being televised (talk about a kangaroo court!) and the press made very pointed commentary about the outrageousness of the "gracious hosts" behind the "blackout curtain" as well as Smith (and Van Dillen) showing major "sack" in the face of such hostility and blatant cheating. As recently as maybe a year ago, there was a great article in Sports Illustrated about that 1972 U.S.A.- Romania Davis Cup final played in Bucharest, Romania and in the article Stan Smith laughingly was quoted as saying that to this day people still come up to him and (while congratulating him) mention how VIVIDLY they recall watching that final -- when Smith himself knew that it was purposely being blacked out. I'll try and find the article....really worth a read. I was not really a Stan Smith fan (being a young punk at the time, I was into the "modern" styles of Connors and Borg), but to this day (when I think about it), THAT 1972 Davis Cup final was one that ranks up there on the "major clutch" list in anyone's book. Talk about Daniel in the lion's den!

Tennissee
10-30-2005, 01:20 PM
http://www.itftennis.com/shared/medialibrary/image/staticarticle/IO_2784_staticarticle.JPG

joe sch
10-30-2005, 03:49 PM
Nastase used the spaghetti racquet to snap Vilas' world record winning streak. Vilas cried like a baby and simply quit in the second set. His coach Tiriac then used his political clout to make this racquet the first illegal racquet in the history of tennis.

I am here to say that the effeciveness of the Spaghetti string is a myth! I personally just bought an adidas racquet (the Lendl one) which is spaghetti strung on ****.....and its really not that big of a deal. It is silent when you hit it and you can get some wicked spin....but the power sucks!! This racquet does not give players an unfair advantage. You are not able to hit kickers over the fence as the "legend" says you can.

It is a real shame that this racquet was made illegal simply for political reasons. It would have added a new dimension to the game. You would see power players vs. Spin doctors. Personally, I lost my match using the spaghetti...the power is terrible.

Im not taking your assessment of that situation serious because :

1) Your skills are no way comparable to Vilas
2) Your opponents are not using standard head wood rackets

The speghetti rackets were outlawed before the graphite revolution ?
The Lendl speghetti racket is not a realistic remake.

IMO, speghetti stringing or any kind of unusual stringing would not be a factor in todays game, even with the space age rackets. Power and consistency are what win tennis matches. It would be entertaining to see more spin masters attempting to win upsets.
I would like to see the stringing rules relaxed

jura
10-30-2005, 11:59 PM
I didn't read the whole thread, so sorry if I post something which was written before.
The "spaghetti racket" was "constructed" by a German guy of the small town Vilsbiburg. The whole team of his club used these strings. Top player was Michael Fischbach (has NOTHING to do with US Mike Fishbach!!!). Due to the advantage of this kind of string the team of Vilsbiburg came up to the Bundesliga, the highest German League. But before the next season the "spaghetti string" were banned. The team of Viilsbiburg lost all matches in the Bundesliga nearly without winning a single match. As far as I know only Fischbach could win one of his singles.

AndrewD
11-02-2005, 06:44 AM
An interesting side note on the spaghetti-strung racquet is that one of its proponents was Barry Phillips-Moore who would later be instrumental in the design of the Snauwert Hi-Ten50, another racquet that allowed you to gain ungodly amounts of spin although, in that case, perfectly legal. Phillips-Moore was later the early coach of Mark Woodforde who, not surprisingly, used the Hi-Ten50 or some variant of it throughout his career.

jura
11-02-2005, 08:55 PM
An interesting side note on the spaghetti-strung racquet is that one of its proponents was Barry Phillips-Moore who would later be instrumental in the design of the Snauwert Hi-Ten50, another racquet that allowed you to gain ungodly amounts of spin although, in that case, perfectly legal. Phillips-Moore was later the early coach of Mark Woodforde who, not surprisingly, used the Hi-Ten50 or some variant of it throughout his career.
Yeah, that was a funny racket: Oversize with only 10(!) main strings. Woodforde used the Hi-Ten 50 a long time with strings up to 1,8 mm thick, as I heard. After the Hi-Ten 50 I think he used a Wimbledon stick for a while before switching ti Wilson. They made him a kind of 6.1 with a special string pattern with 12 main strings I think.
BTW: Völkl made some various rackets for Mantilla with only 14 main strings. (According to the Graphite II LB he used before switching to Völkl.)

AndrewD
11-02-2005, 11:28 PM
Yeah, that was a funny racket: Oversize with only 10(!) main strings. Woodforde used the Hi-Ten 50 a long time with strings up to 1,8 mm thick, as I heard. After the Hi-Ten 50 I think he used a Wimbledon stick for a while before switching ti Wilson. They made him a kind of 6.1 with a special string pattern with 12 main strings I think.
BTW: Völkl made some various rackets for Mantilla with only 14 main strings. (According to the Graphite II LB he used before switching to Völkl.)


My brother used it for a good 10 years before his last frame died. It was one of the most unique racquets because the feel just wasn't comparable to any other racquet. Not that the frame was so unusual, although it was very stiff and a 100sq headsize at a time when that wasn't so common. The unique ingredient was the string, string pattern and tension range. Hugely thick string similar in thickness to the nylon line you get in whipper snippers (not sure what they call them in the States), an exceptionally open string pattern and tensions around 90lbs. End result was huge potential for spin, excellent control but a rather jarring effect when you weren't imparting spin (flat serves were tough).

Once you'd played with the Hi-Ten50 for a while and got used to the feel it was a nightmare trying to play with anything else. I know people talk about the unique feel of the PS85 and the POG OS but those things are twins compared to the Hi-Ten50 and everything else. A normal racquet just produces a 'shrill' (can't think of a better word) and flimsy response compared to it and Im pretty sure that's the reason why Woodforde couldn't make a break from the stringing pattern, during his pro career. When my brother had to change it took him almost two years to adjust to a normal racquet LOL.

One other thing. If anyone ever doubted how good Woodforde was and what an excellent pair of hands he had they should try to volley with the Hi-Ten50.

The Pusher Terminator
11-13-2005, 04:30 AM
any idea of where to buy the hi-ten50?