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EtePras
03-26-2009, 11:03 AM
I wonder how someone can be a threat for #1 if he does everything worse than the current #1, lol.

Serve - people always talk about Federer's serve, but I would rather have Nadal's. Federer has the speed but Nadal's serve has the accuracy and spin to find the other guy's backhand every time. Look at break point conversions in all of their matches and what percentage of their games they hold serve, and it is incredibly obvious that Nadal serves better.
Forehand - Nadal has so much better placement and controls his forehand so much better on the run
Backhand - Not even up for debate
Volleys - people say that Federer is better volleys, but what about the last game of Wimbledon? You see Nadal hit amazing passing shots against Federer all the time, but rarely the other way around.
Movement - Nadal is faster and gets into position much more easily, that is why he is able to put so much on every shot
Mental - Once again, not even up for debate
Hard courts - see most recent GS final and most recent Master Series 1000 tournament
Grass courts - see most recent Wimbledon final, plus Nadal faced a much tougher field in his grass warm-up the week before Wimbledon
Clay courts - this one is just total domination, Nadal goes down 1-5 or 4-0 on purpose just to practise his mental toughness. It worked so well, not only did he win the matches where he was down 1-5, the mental toughness practice let him win Wimbledon and the Australian Open too
Other surfaces - neither player has done anything important on other surfaces in the past year

Any takers? Federer might've had a better forehand and serve and volleys in his prime, but that time is long gone.

tahiti
03-26-2009, 11:12 AM
I prefer RAfa's forehand. I think it's a killer shot and his volleying of late has improved. He sometimes has great touch in drop shots though it has worsened in the last year.

I think Federer's first serve is better though.

MajinX
03-26-2009, 11:13 AM
wow... this is a time bomb set to go off. I cantt wait until all the nadal and fed fans see this one.

Dilettante
03-26-2009, 11:13 AM
Serve - people always talk about Federer's serve, but I would rather have Nadal's.

You must be kidding.

SFrazeur
03-26-2009, 11:15 AM
Dress .

-SF

woodrow1029
03-26-2009, 11:15 AM
wow... this is a time bomb set to go off. I cantt wait until all the nadal and fed fans see this one.
LOL.. They will be happy that they have another Nadal fan boy. Unless, this is another clone of Nadal Freak.

deltox
03-26-2009, 11:17 AM
nadal in all areas cept volleying, serve and grass

fednad
03-26-2009, 11:18 AM
I wonder how someone can be a threat for #1 if he does everything worse than the current #1, lol.

Serve - people always talk about Federer's serve, but I would rather have Nadal's.

These two statements alone define the credibility of your post.
And you will perhaps be the only guy to want to have Nadals serve over Federer. Even die hard Nadal fans would any time take Fed's serve over Nadals.

thejoe
03-26-2009, 11:19 AM
I wonder how someone can be a threat for #1 if he does everything worse than the current #1, lol.

Serve - people always talk about Federer's serve, but I would rather have Nadal's. Federer has the speed but Nadal's serve has the accuracy and spin to find the other guy's backhand every time. Look at break point conversions in all of their matches and what percentage of their games they hold serve, and it is incredibly obvious that Nadal serves better.
Forehand - Nadal has so much better placement and controls his forehand so much better on the run
Backhand - Not even up for debate
Volleys - people say that Federer is better volleys, but what about the last game of Wimbledon? You see Nadal hit amazing passing shots against Federer all the time, but rarely the other way around.
Movement - Nadal is faster and gets into position much more easily, that is why he is able to put so much on every shot
Mental - Once again, not even up for debate
Hard courts - see most recent GS final and most recent Master Series 1000 tournament
Grass courts - see most recent Wimbledon final, plus Nadal faced a much tougher field in his grass warm-up the week before Wimbledon
Clay courts - this one is just total domination, Nadal goes down 1-5 or 4-0 on purpose just to practise his mental toughness. It worked so well, not only did he win the matches where he was down 1-5, the mental toughness practice let him win Wimbledon and the Australian Open too
Other surfaces - neither player has done anything important on other surfaces in the past year

Any takers? Federer might've had a better forehand and serve and volleys in his prime, but that time is long gone.

Oh dear.

Serve, forehand and volleys are still Federer. I will give you mental, backhand, and Nadal is certainly quicker than Federer, but Fed's footwork is probably better.

Right, so by this logic, after Hamburg 2007, Federer was the better claycourter? Did Nadal play any real grass-courters at Queens? The one player with an attacking game caused Nadal real problems, and this is a guy who doesn't even possess great volleys or groundstrokes. He was nearly beaten by a serve.

I think you should perhaps watch some tennis before commenting...

thejoe
03-26-2009, 11:20 AM
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TheTruth
03-26-2009, 11:24 AM
I do think Fed has an uncanny ability to hit aces when he's in trouble. He's been struggling recently, but that's still a great trick to have in your arsenal.

I also think he's willing to be aggressive more and end the points quicker.

And he is quicker to serve and get ready for the next point.

Amazing shots? I like Nadal's better.

GasquetGOAT
03-26-2009, 11:26 AM
No. Nadal is the best EVER! END OF THREAD!
http://www.im-net.hu/images/wallpaper_images/rafael_nadal1024.jpg

tahiti
03-26-2009, 11:28 AM
Oh dear.

Serve, forehand and volleys are still Federer. I will give you mental, backhand, and Nadal is certainly quicker than Federer, but Fed's footwork is probably better.

Right, so by this logic, after Hamburg 2007, Federer was the better claycourter? Did Nadal play any real grass-courters at Queens? The one player with an attacking game caused Nadal real problems, and this is a guy who doesn't even possess great volleys or groundstrokes. He was nearly beaten by a serve.

I think you should perhaps watch some tennis before commenting...

Compare the field in the draw at Queen's to Roger's tournament in Switzerland or the Den Bosch Holland. The better grass courters were at Queens. He's also reached the Wimbledon finals three years in row. So Rafa is definitely on his way to become a grass court specialist too.

Dilettante
03-26-2009, 11:29 AM
Serve, forehand and volleys are still Federer.

...not so sure about forehand, mate.

rubberduckies
03-26-2009, 11:31 AM
Serve??? Are you kidding me?
Roger has one of the best serves in the game.
Nadal has a clown serve. His ground game is at a point where if he actually had a non-clown serve he would be pretty much unbeatable on all surfaces.

I remember when they surveyed players in early 2008 on tennis.com or something and asked them would had the best serve, forehand, backhand, etc. For forehand, lots of players picked Nadal and nobody picked

deltox
03-26-2009, 11:32 AM
No. Nadal is the best EVER! END OF THREAD!
http://www.im-net.hu/images/wallpaper_images/rafael_nadal1024.jpg

i feel so violated.. ewww.. yuk

henryshli
03-26-2009, 11:35 AM
I wonder how someone can be a threat for #1 if he does everything worse than the current #1, lol.

Serve - people always talk about Federer's serve, but I would rather have Nadal's. Federer has the speed but Nadal's serve has the accuracy and spin to find the other guy's backhand every time. Look at break point conversions in all of their matches and what percentage of their games they hold serve, and it is incredibly obvious that Nadal serves better.
Forehand - Nadal has so much better placement and controls his forehand so much better on the run
Backhand - Not even up for debate
Volleys - people say that Federer is better volleys, but what about the last game of Wimbledon? You see Nadal hit amazing passing shots against Federer all the time, but rarely the other way around.
Movement - Nadal is faster and gets into position much more easily, that is why he is able to put so much on every shot
Mental - Once again, not even up for debate
Hard courts - see most recent GS final and most recent Master Series 1000 tournament
Grass courts - see most recent Wimbledon final, plus Nadal faced a much tougher field in his grass warm-up the week before Wimbledon
Clay courts - this one is just total domination, Nadal goes down 1-5 or 4-0 on purpose just to practise his mental toughness. It worked so well, not only did he win the matches where he was down 1-5, the mental toughness practice let him win Wimbledon and the Australian Open too
Other surfaces - neither player has done anything important on other surfaces in the past year

Any takers? Federer might've had a better forehand and serve and volleys in his prime, but that time is long gone.


It's nice how you convinced only yourself in the above thread.

Serve: Federer's it better. Count the aces. Finding opponent's BH every time requires no accuracy, a 5yo can do that. This simply reflects Nadal's lack of tactics.

Forehand: About the same. Nadal's FH is safer because of the spin and he has a bigger margin for error. I prefer Federer's FH because I can pick up any racket and pretty much hit the same forehand all day long. Nadal's FH needs the modern technology.

Backhand: Federer. Simply because 2BHs are ugly.

Volleys: Federer. i don't even know why I have to justify this. Nadal doesn't come to the net as often as Federer. Nadal only comes to the net when he knows he doesn't have to hit a good volley - again a volley that a 5 yo can put away. Federer on the other hand volleys much more difficult shots.

Movement: Yes Nadal can get to the ball faster. That is his greatest strength, his game is based on his athleticism.

Hardcourts: Federer. Not sure why you are just referring to the last result. Perhaps you should count their H2Hs in HC.

Grass: Sigh. Federer any day. If they played 10 matches on grass my money would be on Federer winning more of those matches.

Clay: Nadal for sure. This surface is a big contributor to Nadal's H2H record against Federer......but why have they played so many matches on clay???? That's only because Federer could make the finals of a clay tournament and Nadal is often knocked out before the final until now.

Physical condition: Federer. He gets injured less often than Nadal and Federer is older. Nadal will fall to pieces. This also answers the main question of this thread.

SoCal10s
03-26-2009, 11:37 AM
as of now.. win U.S. Opens..

veroniquem
03-26-2009, 11:42 AM
I agree that Nadal's serve is greatly underrated. Look at his most recent matches, he gets a lot of free points because opponents do a bad job of returning his serve (and that includes Fed also). He may not serve lots of aces but a- he does have the capability to pull the aces when in trouble, b- his serve placement is excellent and troubles other players a lot.
If you're comparing Nadal to current Fed, there's no contest, that's why Nadal is ahead by more than 4000 points. Federer used to have a lethal serve but not anymore. I would say prime Fed's forehand is very close in quality to Nadal' s forehand, I've always preferred Nadal's backhand and for movement prime Fed's advantage was smoothness and rarely getting off balance while Nadal's assets are speed and reflexes.

GasquetGOAT
03-26-2009, 11:45 AM
i feel so violated.. ewww.. yuk

Don't be. Nadal is the best! Not to mention better skin than Federer! ;)

deltox
03-26-2009, 11:47 AM
I agree that Nadal's serve is greatly underrated. Look at his most recent matches, he gets a lot of free points because opponents do a bad job of returning his serve (and that includes Fed also). He may not serve lots of aces but a- he does have the capability to pull the aces when in trouble, b- his serve placement is excellent and troubles other players a lot.
If you're comparing Nadal to current Fed, there's no contest, that's why Nadal is ahead by more than 4000 points. Federer used to have a lethal serve but not anymore. I would say prime Fed's forehand is very close in quality to Nadal' s forehand, I've always preferred Nadal's backhand and for movement prime Fed's advantage was smoothness and rarely getting off balance while Nadal's assets are speed and reflexes.

do you also think nadals 1st serve is better than roddicks non flat first serve? just curious because both cause the opponents to receive at head height alot.

veroniquem
03-26-2009, 11:51 AM
It's nice how you convinced only yourself in the above thread.

Serve: Federer's it better. Count the aces. Finding opponent's BH every time requires no accuracy, a 5yo can do that. This simply reflects Nadal's lack of tactics.

Forehand: About the same. Nadal's FH is safer because of the spin and he has a bigger margin for error. I prefer Federer's FH because I can pick up any racket and pretty much hit the same forehand all day long. Nadal's FH needs the modern technology.

Backhand: Federer. Simply because 2BHs are ugly.

Volleys: Federer. i don't even know why I have to justify this. Nadal doesn't come to the net as often as Federer. Nadal only comes to the net when he knows he doesn't have to hit a good volley - again a volley that a 5 yo can put away. Federer on the other hand volleys much more difficult shots.

Movement: Yes Nadal can get to the ball faster. That is his greatest strength, his game is based on his athleticism.

Hardcourts: Federer. Not sure why you are just referring to the last result. Perhaps you should count their H2Hs in HC.

Grass: Sigh. Federer any day. If they played 10 matches on grass my money would be on Federer winning more of those matches.

Clay: Nadal for sure. This surface is a big contributor to Nadal's H2H record against Federer......but why have they played so many matches on clay???? That's only because Federer could make the finals of a clay tournament and Nadal is often knocked out before the final until now.

Physical condition: Federer. He gets injured less often than Nadal and Federer is older. Nadal will fall to pieces. This also answers the main question of this thread.
I disagree about the backhand: the onehanded backhand is too vulnerable, 2 handed more efficient (that's why 1 handed is slowly disappearing).
I disagree about grass, if they played 10 matches on grass NOW, Nadal would win practically all of them, Nadal almost won W 2008 in straights even though Fed was playing the best grass court tennis of his life (according to his fans themselves, first time he won Halle without dropping a set, didn't lose a set either in W before the final). For physical condition Nadal is a beast, sure he's had problems with his feet and knees but they haven't stopped him from playing much so far and in 5 setters noone has better conditioning than Nadal. His 5 set record (only 3 lost careerwise, only one after the age of 18, 0 on clay) is mindboggling. Federer (who has lost a lot of 5 set matches in his career) doesn't even come close.

clayman2000
03-26-2009, 11:54 AM
It's nice how you convinced only yourself in the above thread.

Serve: Federer's it better. Count the aces. Finding opponent's BH every time requires no accuracy, a 5yo can do that. This simply reflects Nadal's lack of tactics.

Forehand: About the same. Nadal's FH is safer because of the spin and he has a bigger margin for error. I prefer Federer's FH because I can pick up any racket and pretty much hit the same forehand all day long. Nadal's FH needs the modern technology.

Backhand: Federer. Simply because 2BHs are ugly.

Volleys: Federer. i don't even know why I have to justify this. Nadal doesn't come to the net as often as Federer. Nadal only comes to the net when he knows he doesn't have to hit a good volley - again a volley that a 5 yo can put away. Federer on the other hand volleys much more difficult shots.

Movement: Yes Nadal can get to the ball faster. That is his greatest strength, his game is based on his athleticism.

Hardcourts: Federer. Not sure why you are just referring to the last result. Perhaps you should count their H2Hs in HC.

Grass: Sigh. Federer any day. If they played 10 matches on grass my money would be on Federer winning more of those matches.

Clay: Nadal for sure. This surface is a big contributor to Nadal's H2H record against Federer......but why have they played so many matches on clay???? That's only because Federer could make the finals of a clay tournament and Nadal is often knocked out before the final until now.

Physical condition: Federer. He gets injured less often than Nadal and Federer is older. Nadal will fall to pieces. This also answers the main question of this thread.


You just lost all credibility when you said Federer has better physical condition. Physical condition doesn't mean whose less injury prone, but more if the game goes long, who will be in better condition at the end

Serve - Federer no question. For me the best serve in the game after Karlovic, tied with roddick. Look at Wimby 07 and you will see why FedAce won.

Forhand - right now i would take Nadal. He is absolutely amazing at hitting lines and putting people away when they are on the run. Federer's is good no doubt, especially when he takes it on the rise, but right now it is too inconsistent

Backhand - Nadal. He can really take controll of a point with his backhand. On defence he can use the slice all day, and then when he gets on even footing, dictates play with the 2 hand

Volley - federer. Nadal volleys well for when he comes to net, but he really never has to make any tough volleys at net. Federer has great feel and touch

Movement - Nadal.

Hard Court - Nadal. federer has a mental block

Clay court - see last post

Grass Court - toss up. Federer moves so well on grass and is almost impossible to break. But Nadal owns Federer and is also a grass maestro

Physical Condition - Nadal. See AO 2009 for proof

veroniquem
03-26-2009, 11:56 AM
do you also think nadals 1st serve is better than roddicks non flat first serve? just curious because both cause the opponents to receive at head height alot.
No, Roddick's first serve is insane. I would still choose Nadal's serve though (for myself) because it's more reliable and it's easier for Nadal to keep it consistent even during a long match. The problem with Roddick's is that although his first serve is unbelievable, he gets tired doing it and there's often a point in the set or the match when it deserts him and then he's in trouble.

jackson vile
03-26-2009, 12:03 PM
Roger has better serve, much more agressive!

Ripster
03-26-2009, 12:04 PM
So you gave forehand, serve and volleys to Nadal? The forehand is debatable; I'd still take Federer's. But in NO WAY does Nadal have a better serve or volleys. Not a chance.

deltox
03-26-2009, 12:05 PM
No, Roddick's first serve is insane. I would still choose Nadal's serve though (for myself) because it's more reliable and it's easier for Nadal to keep it consistent even during a long match. The problem with Roddick's is that although his first serve is unbelievable, he gets tired doing it and there's often a point in the set or the match when it deserts him and then he's in trouble.

im in favor of him mixing up his first serve from flat and 145 mph to top spin kicking head height and 105 mph. it really keeps the opponents off guard.
im truely impressed with the work ethic and work done with his new coach this year.. come on hes out of prime age and still working HARD to improve. some credit is due.

Roddick will most likely go down in history as the best server the game has had in its history, Unless someone else can step up for as many years with more dominance.

veroniquem
03-26-2009, 12:07 PM
No. Nadal is the best EVER! END OF THREAD!
http://www.im-net.hu/images/wallpaper_images/rafael_nadal1024.jpg
Your picture demonstrates that he's the best looking ever (thanks for the reminder)! As for tennis, we'll see, you seem to consider that it's a totally preposterous proposition but if he keeps up his current winning pace it's a possibility, absolutely not a certainty, of course not, but a possibility sure.

thejoe
03-26-2009, 12:09 PM
I disagree about the backhand: the onehanded backhand is too vulnerable, 2 handed more efficient (that's why 1 handed is slowly disappearing).
I disagree about grass, if they played 10 matches on grass NOW, Nadal would win practically all of them, Nadal almost won W 2008 in straights even though Fed was playing the best grass court tennis of his life (according to his fans themselves, first time he won Halle without dropping a set, didn't lose a set either in W before the final). For physical condition Nadal is a beast, sure he's had problems with his feet and knees but they haven't stopped him from playing much so far and in 5 setters noone has better conditioning than Nadal. His 5 set record (only 3 lost careerwise, only one after the age of 18, 0 on clay) is mindboggling. Federer (who has lost a lot of 5 set matches in his career) doesn't even come close.

Yes, he played amazing tennis, and then didn't turn up to the final for two sets.

bolo
03-26-2009, 12:09 PM
Serve??? Are you kidding me?
Roger has one of the best serves in the game.
Nadal has a clown serve. His ground game is at a point where if he actually had a non-clown serve he would be pretty much unbeatable on all surfaces.

I remember when they surveyed players in early 2008 on tennis.com or something and asked them would had the best serve, forehand, backhand, etc. For forehand, lots of players picked Nadal and nobody picked

the other way around, most picked federer, except for murray who picked nadal. I think federer also might have picked nadal becaue he probably didn't want to pick himself.

coyfish
03-26-2009, 12:17 PM
As far as movement goes, Nadal is amazing no doubt but he plays so far back like monfils. He ends up running / having to hit harder from so far back.

Even if fed is in a defensive position, he hugs the baseline and takes riskier shots taking it much earlier than nadal does.

I think fed's variety is one of a kind. He changes pace and picks his winners. Even though hes been losing more often, its still a winners / error battle for him. Seems like hes always in control.

Nadal on the other hand has one of a kind consistancy and the ability to grind. He plays very 1 dimensionally and always hits the same way with the occasional lazy slice.

These players are so different its hard to really say what one does better than the other. I think most agree however that Fed's 1st serve is more a weapon than Nadals.

Tennis_Bum
03-26-2009, 12:25 PM
I agree that Nadal's serve is greatly underrated. Look at his most recent matches, he gets a lot of free points because opponents do a bad job of returning his serve (and that includes Fed also). He may not serve lots of aces but a- he does have the capability to pull the aces when in trouble, b- his serve placement is excellent and troubles other players a lot.
If you're comparing Nadal to current Fed, there's no contest, that's why Nadal is ahead by more than 4000 points. Federer used to have a lethal serve but not anymore. I would say prime Fed's forehand is very close in quality to Nadal' s forehand, I've always preferred Nadal's backhand and for movement prime Fed's advantage was smoothness and rarely getting off balance while Nadal's assets are speed and reflexes.

You don't know what you are writing. You write a bunch of craps. If Nadal wipe his ***** you would think that is charming or cute. You probably think that his butt wiping routine is cute. So what else Nadal does that doesn't look great in your eyes?

abmk
03-26-2009, 12:57 PM
I disagree about grass, if they played 10 matches on grass NOW, Nadal would win practically all of them, Nadal almost won W 2008 in straights even though Fed was playing the best grass court tennis of his life (according to his fans themselves, first time he won Halle without dropping a set, didn't lose a set either in W before the final).

That's a load of crap . Fed played better in every other Wimbledon final since 2003 ( except for 2004 ) than he played in 2008 ...He was off for the majority of the first 2 sets .... and your statement that nadal would win 10 on 10 on grass is laughable . Maybe on a video game/computer game, not in real life. Sorry to say, but your bias is as evident as nadal_freak's is !

KerryJ
03-26-2009, 01:03 PM
Volleys - people say that Federer is better volleys, but what about the last game of Wimbledon? You see Nadal hit amazing passing shots against Federer all the time, but rarely the other way around.



I didn't read the thread so if someone else said this my bad


The reason Federer doesn't pass Nadal, and why he always seems to be missing volleys is because he comes to the net more than Nadal. And I almost said Federer has a greater will to win generally speaking but then I remembered something my friend told me.

Apparently, at some point during the third set against Murray, Federer hits a shot that is called out (I think it was a serve). Murray is saying it was in and then Federer says "I don't care, I want to go home". My friend was at Indian Wells courtside and I believe it happened. He looked unmotivated throughout the Verdasco match as well

Cup8489
03-26-2009, 01:19 PM
No, Roddick's first serve is insane. I would still choose Nadal's serve though (for myself) because it's more reliable and it's easier for Nadal to keep it consistent even during a long match. The problem with Roddick's is that although his first serve is unbelievable, he gets tired doing it and there's often a point in the set or the match when it deserts him and then he's in trouble.

you would choose nadal's serve over roddicks?

WHAT?

roddick hits both his serves, first and second, with more pace/spin than nadal does, and while nadal usually has a higher first serve percentage, roddick has more free points..

i saw how someone also mentioned that nadal is more fit than federer. perhaps, but i've never seen federer ''run out of gas'' in a match against nadal. he doesn't ever look exhausted or worn out, but he usually looks like he's given up mentally. even in the wimbledon final it wasn't fatigue but mental surrender that caused him to lose. nadal was chiseling away at his serve and he didn't put anymore effort into the match after he was broken (that being said, he still pushed to deuce, the furthest in 5 nadal service games before losing)

in fact last year at australia was the only time i've seen him really lose out of fatigue.

veroniquem
03-26-2009, 01:22 PM
im in favor of him mixing up his first serve from flat and 145 mph to top spin kicking head height and 105 mph. it really keeps the opponents off guard.
im truely impressed with the work ethic and work done with his new coach this year.. come on hes out of prime age and still working HARD to improve. some credit is due.

Roddick will most likely go down in history as the best server the game has had in its history, Unless someone else can step up for as many years with more dominance.
I agree, Roddick is not a quitter and is still working hard on his game. I was impressed by his level in IW.

fastdunn
03-26-2009, 01:31 PM
i think federer's serve recently is being hampered by his back problem. although it's minor back problem, i think it's subtely affecting his serving. well i guess it's part of aging...

edberg505
03-26-2009, 01:43 PM
I disagree about the backhand: the onehanded backhand is too vulnerable, 2 handed more efficient (that's why 1 handed is slowly disappearing).
I disagree about grass, if they played 10 matches on grass NOW, Nadal would win practically all of them, Nadal almost won W 2008 in straights even though Fed was playing the best grass court tennis of his life (according to his fans themselves, first time he won Halle without dropping a set, didn't lose a set either in W before the final). For physical condition Nadal is a beast, sure he's had problems with his feet and knees but they haven't stopped him from playing much so far and in 5 setters noone has better conditioning than Nadal. His 5 set record (only 3 lost careerwise, only one after the age of 18, 0 on clay) is mindboggling. Federer (who has lost a lot of 5 set matches in his career) doesn't even come close.

What the hell? Where do you come up with this stuff? So you are saying we should just pencil in Nadal for a Wimbledon win as well? I'm gonna let you in on a little secret. The reason you don't see a lot of people with 1 handers has absolutely nothing to do with it not being as efficient as a 2 hander. If anything it's easier to teach a 2 hander to small kids and some of them become so dependent on it and are so in love with winning that they are reluctant to make the switch. Whenever I see a young child hitting a 1 hander, I'm quite impressed.

Tennis_Bum
03-26-2009, 01:49 PM
What the hell? Where do you come up with this stuff? So you are saying we should just pencil in Nadal for a Wimbledon win as well? I'm gonna let you in on a little secret. The reason you don't see a lot of people with 1 handers has absolutely nothing to do with it not being as efficient as a 2 hander. If anything it's easier to teach a 2 hander to small kids and some of them become so dependent on it and are so in love with winning that they are reluctant to make the switch. Whenever I see a young child hitting a 1 hander, I'm quite impressed.

She's so in love with Nadal that everything he does is so great. And now she claims to be the expert on tennis too. One-hander is inefficient, blah, blah, blah.

What a nit-wit. If you are so sure Nadal would win then go damn ahead and bet the house in Vegas. Put your money where your mouth is. Nadal is playing great tennis now, but in sports, there is nothing such as a guarantee win. A lot of things can happen. Fed is not playing good tennis now but that doesn't mean Fed is finished! You are too stupid to know the difference.

deltox
03-26-2009, 01:56 PM
No, Roddick's first serve is insane. I would still choose Nadal's serve though (for myself) because it's more reliable and it's easier for Nadal to keep it consistent even during a long match. The problem with Roddick's is that although his first serve is unbelievable, he gets tired doing it and there's often a point in the set or the match when it deserts him and then he's in trouble.

first serve % numbers for the first part of 2009

notice nadal is awesome on the second serve but doesnt exist in first serve top 10. nadals first serve is not as reliable as many think.. its his second that is gonna jump outta the stadium and is always in a good spot and in play.

http://sports.optimum.net/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=cablevision&page=tennis-m/stat/atp-matchfacts.htm

shockingly verdasco has the highest first serve % on tour this year.

veroniquem
03-26-2009, 01:57 PM
What the hell? Where do you come up with this stuff? So you are saying we should just pencil in Nadal for a Wimbledon win as well? I'm gonna let you in on a little secret. The reason you don't see a lot of people with 1 handers has absolutely nothing to do with it not being as efficient as a 2 hander. If anything it's easier to teach a 2 hander to small kids and some of them become so dependent on it and are so in love with winning that they are reluctant to make the switch. Whenever I see a young child hitting a 1 hander, I'm quite impressed.
Maybe but it's harder to break down a 2 handed. Federer has a lot of trouble on his backhand now vs both Nadal and Murray. Which players who have a 1 handed do you find very competitive? Gasquet? It seems to me in the future mostly everyone will have a 2 handed.

pound cat
03-26-2009, 01:59 PM
Federer wins the crying in public after losing the final v. Nadal award (Wimbledon 08)

Nadal wins the discrete crying in the locker room award after losing the final v. Federer award. (Wimbledon 07) award.

Tie for post match emotion.

veroniquem
03-26-2009, 01:59 PM
first serve % numbers for the first part of 2009

notice nadal is awesome on the second serve but doesnt exist in first serve top 10. nadals first serve is not as reliable as many think.. its his second that is gonna jump outta the stadium and is always in a good spot and in play.

http://sports.optimum.net/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=cablevision&page=tennis-m/stat/atp-matchfacts.htm

shockingly verdasco has the highest first serve % on tour this year.
1st serve percentage doesn't mean best quality or best placed serve. Actually it could even mean somebody taking less risk on the first serve.

Nadal_Freak
03-26-2009, 02:00 PM
Nadal's got a pretty good serve but saying it is better then Federer's is ridiculous. Fed is also a better first serve returner. After that, Nadal has about everything over Federer.

veroniquem
03-26-2009, 02:01 PM
Federer wins the crying in public after losing the final v. Nadal award (Wimbledon 08)

Nadal wins the discrete crying in the locker room award after losing the final v. Federer award. (Wimbledon 07) award.

Tie for post match emotion.
The award would have to go to Federer after AO for best crying in public.

deltox
03-26-2009, 02:01 PM
1st serve percentage doesn't mean best quality or best placed serve. Actually it could even mean somebody taking less risk on the first serve.

roddick doesnt have the best quality first serve? maybe its because im a roddick fan but i was under the assumption roddicks first serve was one of the most lethal on the tour ever.

edberg505
03-26-2009, 02:25 PM
Maybe but it's harder to break down a 2 handed. Federer has a lot of trouble on his backhand now vs both Nadal and Murray. Which players who have a 1 handed do you find very competitive? Gasquet? It seems to me in the future mostly everyone will have a 2 handed.

There are several players with good one handed backhands. You have only named two people that are able to exploit Federer's back hand and that's because the hit with a lot of topspin to get it up high making it difficult to deal with.

How many people can you name that hit a one-hander? LOL, that statement is sort of ridiculous. It's kinda like saying, how many people do you know with a 2 handed forehand that you find very competitive. A very high percentage of the tour hits with 2 hands so of course there are going to be more higher ranked people with a two-handed backhand. Gasquet's backhand is outstanding it's the rest of his game that's the problem not his backhand.

pound cat
03-26-2009, 02:51 PM
The award would have to go to Federer after AO for best crying in public.


You're right. It will be an award never to be won by anyone else.

Oh gosh, I can just imagine him emoting at his child's birth.

veroniquem
03-26-2009, 03:20 PM
roddick doesnt have the best quality first serve? maybe its because im a roddick fan but i was under the assumption roddicks first serve was one of the most lethal on the tour ever.
I was talking in general there not about Roddick in particular. I've already said before that I did find Roddick's serve insane.

veroniquem
03-26-2009, 03:22 PM
There are several players with good one handed backhands. You have only named two people that are able to exploit Federer's back hand and that's because the hit with a lot of topspin to get it up high making it difficult to deal with.

How many people can you name that hit a one-hander? LOL, that statement is sort of ridiculous. It's kinda like saying, how many people do you know with a 2 handed forehand that you find very competitive. A very high percentage of the tour hits with 2 hands so of course there are going to be more higher ranked people with a two-handed backhand. Gasquet's backhand is outstanding it's the rest of his game that's the problem not his backhand.
I still prefer the 2 handed. Is that allowed or should I be fined for it?

deltox
03-26-2009, 03:24 PM
I was talking in general there not about Roddick in particular. I've already said before that I did find Roddick's serve insane.

that is why i was so confused with the topic. but you said youd take nadal 1st serve over roddicks cause it was more consistant?

edberg505
03-26-2009, 03:38 PM
I still prefer the 2 handed. Is that allowed or should I be fined for it?

LOL, where did that come from suddenly? I was never disputing if it was okay for you to prefer a 2 hander to a 1 hander. Prefer all you want, but I think it's a bit presumptuous to say that a 1 hander is better than a 2 hander or vice versa.

Lotto
03-26-2009, 03:56 PM
Serve - Federer
Forehand - Federer but Nadal's is more consistent. Still based on overall, Federer's is better. Probably the best forehand of all time and up there as one of the greatest shots of all time.
Backhand - Yeah, no point even mentioning the bh because it goes to Rafa.
Volleys - hmmm, it's a tough one. I honestly dont know.
Movement - Nadal
Mental Strength- Nadal


So yes, there are things Federer is better at then Nadal but Rafa is just so damn consistent and Federer has lost his self-belief, thus the old Fed of ours has disappeared. ALOT of people on this board underestimate the power of the mind, and especially the power of the mind in sport. Self-Belief and Confidence are the building blocks of tennis. And at that level Mental Toughness is probably THE most important thing. That's why Rafa owns Roger and is owning the tour at the moment too. While, when Federer was dominating he felt untouchable because he had so much self-belief.

TheTruth
03-26-2009, 05:44 PM
Serve - Federer
Forehand - Federer but Nadal's is more consistent. Still based on overall, Federer's is better. Probably the best forehand of all time and up there as one of the greatest shots of all time.
Backhand - Yeah, no point even mentioning the bh because it goes to Rafa.
Volleys - hmmm, it's a tough one. I honestly dont know.
Movement - Nadal
Mental Strength- Nadal


So yes, there are things Federer is better at then Nadal but Rafa is just so damn consistent and Federer has lost his self-belief, thus the old Fed of ours has disappeared. ALOT of people on this board underestimate the power of the mind, and especially the power of the mind in sport. Self-Belief and Confidence are the building blocks of tennis. And at that level Mental Toughness is probably THE most important thing. That's why Rafa owns Roger and is owning the tour at the moment too. While, when Federer was dominating he felt untouchable because he had so much self-belief.


This is a good post. The mental aspect is probably the most important.

lilycolefan
03-26-2009, 05:54 PM
I wonder how someone can be a threat for #1 if he does everything worse than the current #1, lol.

Serve - people always talk about Federer's serve, but I would rather have Nadal's. Federer has the speed but Nadal's serve has the accuracy and spin to find the other guy's backhand every time. Look at break point conversions in all of their matches and what percentage of their games they hold serve, and it is incredibly obvious that Nadal serves better.
Forehand - Nadal has so much better placement and controls his forehand so much better on the run
Backhand - Not even up for debate
Volleys - people say that Federer is better volleys, but what about the last game of Wimbledon? You see Nadal hit amazing passing shots against Federer all the time, but rarely the other way around.
Movement - Nadal is faster and gets into position much more easily, that is why he is able to put so much on every shot
Mental - Once again, not even up for debate
Hard courts - see most recent GS final and most recent Master Series 1000 tournament
Grass courts - see most recent Wimbledon final, plus Nadal faced a much tougher field in his grass warm-up the week before Wimbledon
Clay courts - this one is just total domination, Nadal goes down 1-5 or 4-0 on purpose just to practise his mental toughness. It worked so well, not only did he win the matches where he was down 1-5, the mental toughness practice let him win Wimbledon and the Australian Open too
Other surfaces - neither player has done anything important on other surfaces in the past year

Any takers? Federer might've had a better forehand and serve and volleys in his prime, but that time is long gone.

You can somehow ******** argue everything but Nadal does not have better volleys than Federer, that s laughable. Don't forget slice. I prefer Federer's forehand over Nadal's but right now Federer is making so many errors off it. Also Federer at his peak on grass and hardcourt>>>Nadal now.

Joseph L. Barrow
03-26-2009, 08:23 PM
Actually, looking at their statistics, it is clear Federer is the better server. He's tied for #5 in the percentage of service games won category, compared with Nadal's 11, and as Nadal admittedly clearly does most other things better than Federer, this is a clear indication that the serve stroke is making the difference in these games.

Mansewerz
03-26-2009, 08:43 PM
I disagree about the backhand: the onehanded backhand is too vulnerable, 2 handed more efficient (that's why 1 handed is slowly disappearing).
I disagree about grass, if they played 10 matches on grass NOW, Nadal would win practically all of them, Nadal almost won W 2008 in straights even though Fed was playing the best grass court tennis of his life (according to his fans themselves, first time he won Halle without dropping a set, didn't lose a set either in W before the final). For physical condition Nadal is a beast, sure he's had problems with his feet and knees but they haven't stopped him from playing much so far and in 5 setters noone has better conditioning than Nadal. His 5 set record (only 3 lost careerwise, only one after the age of 18, 0 on clay) is mindboggling. Federer (who has lost a lot of 5 set matches in his career) doesn't even come close.

The 2 hander is more baseline oriented and the one hand is more all court oriented. Hence the reason why many serve and volleyers had the one hander. Today's game is becoming more and more baseline, so the 2 hander is more common.

helloworld
03-26-2009, 08:50 PM
Nadal's got a pretty good serve but saying it is better then Federer's is ridiculous. Fed is also a better first serve returner. After that, Nadal has about everything over Federer.
This is just about right, and it came from the freakest of Nadal fans!! Nadal's serve is NOT even in the top 50. Just because he's number 1 player in the world doesn't mean he also has the best serve. Karlovic has the best serve, and he's not even in the top 20. Let's be reasonable here.

thalivest
03-26-2009, 09:47 PM
How they currently matchup:

Serve- Federer (clearly)
Return of serve- not sure
Forehand- Nadal (based on current play)
Backhand- Nadal (again based on current play)
Movement- Nadal
Mental Toughness- Nadal by a long shot
Net Play- Federer
Fitness- Nadal

fednad
03-26-2009, 10:46 PM
I wonder how someone can be a threat for #1 if he does everything worse than the current #1, lol.

Serve - people always talk about Federer's serve, but I would rather have Nadal's. Federer has the speed but Nadal's serve has the accuracy and spin to find the other guy's backhand every time. Look at break point conversions in all of their matches and what percentage of their games they hold serve, and it is incredibly obvious that Nadal serves better.
Forehand - Nadal has so much better placement and controls his forehand so much better on the run
Backhand - Not even up for debate
Volleys - people say that Federer is better volleys, but what about the last game of Wimbledon? You see Nadal hit amazing passing shots against Federer all the time, but rarely the other way around.
Movement - Nadal is faster and gets into position much more easily, that is why he is able to put so much on every shot
Mental - Once again, not even up for debate
Hard courts - see most recent GS final and most recent Master Series 1000 tournament
Grass courts - see most recent Wimbledon final, plus Nadal faced a much tougher field in his grass warm-up the week before Wimbledon
Clay courts - this one is just total domination, Nadal goes down 1-5 or 4-0 on purpose just to practise his mental toughness. It worked so well, not only did he win the matches where he was down 1-5, the mental toughness practice let him win Wimbledon and the Australian Open too
Other surfaces - neither player has done anything important on other surfaces in the past year

Any takers? Federer might've had a better forehand and serve and volleys in his prime, but that time is long gone.

Few things that Federer does better and have not been mentioned yet:
1.) Does not waste time between serve
2.) Does not stop to arrange and re-arrange water bottles during the changeover in tiebreaks (with no regards to the opponent, pace of the game and the audience)
3.) does not pick his undies with the camera facing his back.
4.) Does not yell "Come Ons and Vamos" when opponent makes unforced errors

I will add more when I have more time.
Bye for now

Tennis_Monk
03-27-2009, 03:07 AM
I wonder how someone can be a threat for #1 if he does everything worse than the current #1, lol.

Serve - people always talk about Federer's serve, but I would rather have Nadal's. Federer has the speed but Nadal's serve has the accuracy and spin to find the other guy's backhand every time. Look at break point conversions in all of their matches and what percentage of their games they hold serve, and it is incredibly obvious that Nadal serves better.
Forehand - Nadal has so much better placement and controls his forehand so much better on the run
Backhand - Not even up for debate
Volleys - people say that Federer is better volleys, but what about the last game of Wimbledon? You see Nadal hit amazing passing shots against Federer all the time, but rarely the other way around.
Movement - Nadal is faster and gets into position much more easily, that is why he is able to put so much on every shot
Mental - Once again, not even up for debate
Hard courts - see most recent GS final and most recent Master Series 1000 tournament
Grass courts - see most recent Wimbledon final, plus Nadal faced a much tougher field in his grass warm-up the week before Wimbledon
Clay courts - this one is just total domination, Nadal goes down 1-5 or 4-0 on purpose just to practise his mental toughness. It worked so well, not only did he win the matches where he was down 1-5, the mental toughness practice let him win Wimbledon and the Australian Open too
Other surfaces - neither player has done anything important on other surfaces in the past year

Any takers? Federer might've had a better forehand and serve and volleys in his prime, but that time is long gone.

Lets not confuse Fed-Nadal matchup with their skill. Nadal is a bad matchup for Federer and everyone knows that.

As far as Serve goes, there is no question. Its Roger Federer. While Nadal improved his serve a lot, he still wins by grinding out points. Roger on the other hand can win lots of points on his serve with ease.

Forehand, lets make some assumptions. If Roger was a lefty, i would take his forehand over Nadal. If Nadal was a righty, i would take Roger's forehand again.
As they stand today, i will take Nadal's because they both are so good but Nadal's lefty is an advantage when the tour has a lot of righties.

Josherer
03-27-2009, 04:19 AM
It depends... when Fed is in top form and high in confidence it all changes around...

Josherer
03-27-2009, 04:20 AM
Lets not confuse Fed-Nadal matchup with their skill. Nadal is a bad matchup for Federer and everyone knows that.

As far as Serve goes, there is no question. Its Roger Federer. While Nadal improved his serve a lot, he still wins by grinding out points. Roger on the other hand can win lots of points on his serve with ease.

Forehand, lets make some assumptions. If Roger was a lefty, i would take his forehand over Nadal. If Nadal was a righty, i would take Roger's forehand again.
As they stand today, i will take Nadal's because they both are so good but Nadal's lefty is an advantage when the tour has a lot of righties.

Good Post

(sorry double post)

vtmike
06-12-2009, 09:34 AM
I wonder how someone can be a threat for #1 if he does everything worse than the current #1, lol.


I disagree. I think Fed does a lot of things better than nadal...

hewittboy
06-12-2009, 09:37 AM
Both at their best Federer does almost everything better than Nadal. Nadal's only edges are his incredible running ability and his mental toughness. The latter the biggest edge which in many of their meetings has been more than all of Federer's edges combined.

380pistol
06-12-2009, 09:47 AM
And the stupidity continues.....

SERVE -Federer, Nadal's is good, very effective and protects it beter, but Roger's is superior

RETURN -I'm inclinded to say Roger, as I'm not impressed with Nadal's as a stroke in isolation, but both are more dangerous after the put the return in play.

FOREHAND -Federer, except clay. Head to head I would take Nadal's, as in an indivudual match his will hurt Roger, more than Fed's will hurt him, but overall, Federer's is better except on clay.

BACKHAND -Nadal

VOLLEY -Federer, although his has dipped consistently through the years, and Nadal's has improved, and Fed's forehand volley is shaky, I still gotta give Roger the nod.

MOVEMENT - I don't know. Many will say Fed cuz he's more graceful, but appearance means nothing, effectiveness is what matters. Federer is more efficient, but Nadal is actually better on the move. Nadal has probably surpassed Roger laterally, but I'd give the nod to Fed moving forward.

MENTAL -Nadal

rwn
06-12-2009, 09:50 AM
federer is better in winning grand slams :)

Mansewerz
06-12-2009, 09:52 AM
I think, in terms of movement, Nadal wins the speed and reflexes but Roger wins fluidity, balance, and footwork.

By the way, what exactly is agility?

380pistol
06-12-2009, 09:57 AM
I think, in terms of movement, Nadal wins the speed and reflexes but Roger wins fluidity, balance, and footwork.

By the way, what exactly is agility?

I would say agility is how well one can move from one shot/position to another. What they can do, and the quality of what they can do when they get there. From balance, reach to recovery. Also start and stop. Blake is great going in one direction (as is Safin), but to stp and go the other way, or a different direction aren't areas where they excel.

DoubleDeuce
06-12-2009, 10:02 AM
lol? Bad joke dude

TennezSport
06-12-2009, 10:39 AM
Both at their best Federer does almost everything better than Nadal. Nadal's only edges are his incredible running ability and his mental toughness. The latter the biggest edge which in many of their meetings has been more than all of Federer's edges combined.

We have a winner, absolutely correct and even Uncle Tony thinks so :shock:

Cheers, TennezSport :cool:

joeri888
06-12-2009, 10:45 AM
This thread is absolutely ridiculous. Federer's touch, Slice backhand, Serve, and tactical ability are all better IMO. Nadal's backhand, probably forehand(at least ATM), movement and mental game are better.

Swissv2
06-12-2009, 10:56 AM
way to generalize the "who's better" debate, with FANTASTIC "facts and statistics" to boot.

Let me join in:

SERVE -Federer got served more than Nadal at dinner last night so Federer gets the win here.
RETURN -Nadal took the return trip to his hometown earlier so Federer wins.
FOREHAND -Lets shake up the crystal ball. Federer Wins.
BACKHAND - Shaking up that crystal ball again. Nadal wins.
VOLLEY -Its a tie. Just cause.
MOVEMENT - Who's better on the dance floor? I say nadal. Nadal wins.
MENTAL -Federer cries, Nadal hasn't yet. Nadal wins.

Yet another "insightful" post.

Rhino
06-12-2009, 12:26 PM
Does Federer do anything better than Nadal?

Yeah he's better at winning Grand Slams and Tennis Masters Cups.

okdude1992
06-12-2009, 12:50 PM
serve: fed's serve is WAY ahead of nadal's. more pace, more variety, more free points
return: federer is excellent at neutralizing big servers. no contest here
forehand: nadal's forehand is better. more spin, better able to hit on the run. but in his prime this title would certainly also belong to federer. he could take it so early and the placement was uncomparable.
backhand: nadal's backhand is clearcut better than federer's in all areas except the slice
volleys: federer's volleys are more classic, but nadal has used them more effectively at wimbledon in the last two finals. edge: nadal
movement: nadal is quicker in the backcourt but fed is better moving in. i guess this makes them even?
mental toughness: this is nadal's strongest attribute imo and the reason he owns the head to head with federer

BreakPoint
06-12-2009, 12:51 PM
The ONLY thing that Nadal does better than Federer is pick his butt.

Otherwise, Federer does EVERYTHING better than Nadal, including kicking Soderling's butt. :)

T1000
06-12-2009, 12:55 PM
I wonder how someone can be a threat for #1 if he does everything worse than the current #1, lol.

Serve - people always talk about Federer's serve, but I would rather have Nadal's. Federer has the speed but Nadal's serve has the accuracy and spin to find the other guy's backhand every time. Look at break point conversions in all of their matches and what percentage of their games they hold serve, and it is incredibly obvious that Nadal serves better.
Forehand - Nadal has so much better placement and controls his forehand so much better on the run
Backhand - Not even up for debate
Volleys - people say that Federer is better volleys, but what about the last game of Wimbledon? You see Nadal hit amazing passing shots against Federer all the time, but rarely the other way around.
Movement - Nadal is faster and gets into position much more easily, that is why he is able to put so much on every shot
Mental - Once again, not even up for debate
Hard courts - see most recent GS final and most recent Master Series 1000 tournament
Grass courts - see most recent Wimbledon final, plus Nadal faced a much tougher field in his grass warm-up the week before Wimbledon
Clay courts - this one is just total domination, Nadal goes down 1-5 or 4-0 on purpose just to practise his mental toughness. It worked so well, not only did he win the matches where he was down 1-5, the mental toughness practice let him win Wimbledon and the Australian Open too
Other surfaces - neither player has done anything important on other surfaces in the past year

Any takers? Federer might've had a better forehand and serve and volleys in his prime, but that time is long gone.

serve: federer's > nadal's every time
forehand: i would personally take federer's in his prime. that thing was deadly and could be a winner at any time
backhand: nadal's definetly, i think its his stronger stroke cuz it doesnt break down as easily on defense
volleys: federer's everytime
movement: federer's cuz i won't die of knee tendinitis
mental: nadal, he rarley folds
hard: federer everytime
clay: nadal everytime
grass: federer everytime
other surfaces: federer, but carpet is gone

theZig
06-12-2009, 01:00 PM
fed knows how to not injure himself better than nadal.

NickC
06-12-2009, 01:03 PM
Hard courts - see most recent GS final and most recent Master Series 1000 tournament

See the amount of slams (3 Aussie, 5 USO) and Masters Finals (YEC, 2) won on hardcourts by Federer and compare them to the 1 (AO2009) by Nadal. You can say all you want, but I think results generally speak for themselves, but that's just me. Maybe you trolls think otherwise.

Grass courts - see most recent Wimbledon final, plus Nadal faced a much tougher field in his grass warm-up the week before Wimbledon

Again, compare the results. 5 Wimbledon titles in comparison to 1. Results have a funny way of pointing out the obvious, eh?

Flyingpanda
06-12-2009, 01:05 PM
A few things:

1. Bad troll .... is bad.
2. 14 > 6. Results speak for themselves.
3. Federer does not wear pink and yellow.

Badger
06-12-2009, 02:10 PM
What the hell are you on about? Get real. Nadal- better passing shots and serve, don,t think so.

FlamEnemY
06-12-2009, 02:13 PM
His skill in English and Deutsch is obviously better...




Who am I kidding. Nadal owns him there too.

rommil
06-12-2009, 02:14 PM
Federer has better knees than Kneeadal.

zagor
06-12-2009, 02:19 PM
His skill in English and Deutsch is obviously better...




Who am I kidding. Nadal owns him there too.

Of course he does,it's just that in their interviews Fed gets asked the easiest possible questions in those languages so it "appears" that he's more fluent at them than Nadal.On the other hand Nadal is forced to answer the hardest possible questions interviewers come up with in order to make him look bad.

It's another conspiracy against Nadal like with the draws and schedule.

FlamEnemY
06-12-2009, 02:21 PM
I am glad we all get the idea.





:D

BounceHitBounceHit
06-12-2009, 02:35 PM
Does Federer do anything better than Nadal? How about win Grand Slam Titles?? ;) BHBH

Guamanian G
06-12-2009, 02:49 PM
Hahaha good one!!
This thread drives me crazy! 8)

0.2RatedPlayer
06-12-2009, 02:51 PM
Federer has better hair than Nadal

FlamEnemY
06-12-2009, 02:51 PM
Babies.



10 char.

BreakPoint
06-12-2009, 02:54 PM
Federer has better hair than Nadal
Federer also wears better looking polo shirts than Nadal. :)

Seriously? Hot pink? :oops:

clayman2000
06-12-2009, 02:55 PM
Federer constantly gets his towel so he never looks tired, or sweaty.... Nadal never uses the towel thus always looks like he has been in the ring for 14 and a half rounds

BreakPoint
06-12-2009, 02:57 PM
Federer constantly gets his towel so he never looks tired, or sweaty.... Nadal never uses the towel thus always looks like he has been in the ring for 14 and a half rounds
Nice to know that you've never seen Nadal play a tennis match. :-?

herosol
06-12-2009, 03:02 PM
ridiculous.

you compare someone's achievements at age 23 to the achievements of another guy at age 28.

you fail on so many levels.

oh yeah you know what fed is better at?

winning more slams.
but slams never mattered, just the opinions of ******s like yourself.

Dream_On
06-12-2009, 03:04 PM
Play on clay :D

AJK1
06-12-2009, 03:04 PM
Winning the US Open

AJK1
06-12-2009, 03:11 PM
Fed also keeps injury free better than Nads, that's why he will win way more majors than Nadal. His game and style of play has much more longevity.

P_Agony
06-12-2009, 03:26 PM
Serve:
Accuracy: Federer
Consistency: Federer
Variety: Federer
Power: Federer
Free points off of serve: Federer
2nd serve: Federer
Overall: Federer

Forehand:
Accuracy: Federer
Consistency: Nadal
Variety: Federer
Power: Tie
Forehand on the run: Nadal
Overall: Federer

Top Spin backhand:
Accuracy: Tie
Consistency: Nadal
Power: Nadal
Variety: Federer
Backhand on the run: Nadal
Backhand passing shots: Federer
Overall: Nadal

Backhand slice:
Accuracy: Federer
Consistency: Federer
Power: Federer
Variety: Federer
Drop shots: Federer
Overall: Federer

Volleys:
Accuracy: Tie
Consistency: Federer
Variety: Federer
Sitters: Nadal
Half Volleys: Federer
Drop Volleys: Federer
Overall: Federer

Overhead:
From inside the court: Nadal
From the back of the court: Federer
Consistency: Nadal
Overall: Nadal

Movement:
Speed: Nadal
Footwork: Federer
Overall: Nadal

Mental Strength:
Defending BPs on your serve: Tie
Converting BPs on opponent serve: Nadal
Better TB player: Federer in slams, Nadal in non-slams
Overall: Nadal

Fitness:
Both players are very fit, I say tie.

Special shots:
Nadal: Forehand on the run (banana), Backhand crosscourt.
Federer: Backhand flicks, the smash-lob-thingy.

Better Player:
I would say Nadal is the better player against Federer, while Federer is the overall better player.

Jchurch
06-12-2009, 03:35 PM
Federer constantly gets his towel so he never looks tired, or sweaty.... Nadal never uses the towel thus always looks like he has been in the ring for 14 and a half rounds

Yea. Nadal never uses the towel :rolleyes:

dugger5688
06-12-2009, 04:57 PM
I agree that Nadal's serve is greatly underrated. Look at his most recent matches, he gets a lot of free points because opponents do a bad job of returning his serve (and that includes Fed also). He may not serve lots of aces but a- he does have the capability to pull the aces when in trouble, b- his serve placement is excellent and troubles other players a lot.
If you're comparing Nadal to current Fed, there's no contest, that's why Nadal is ahead by more than 4000 points. Federer used to have a lethal serve but not anymore. I would say prime Fed's forehand is very close in quality to Nadal' s forehand, I've always preferred Nadal's backhand and for movement prime Fed's advantage was smoothness and rarely getting off balance while Nadal's assets are speed and reflexes.

You should probably check the results as of late before you go throwing around words like "current".

malakas
06-12-2009, 08:14 PM
I wonder how someone can be a threat for #1 if he does everything worse than the current #1, lol.

Serve - people always talk about Federer's serve, but I would rather have Nadal's. Federer has the speed but Nadal's serve has the accuracy and spin to find the other guy's backhand every time. Look at break point conversions in all of their matches and what percentage of their games they hold serve, and it is incredibly obvious that Nadal serves better.
Forehand - Nadal has so much better placement and controls his forehand so much better on the run
Backhand - Not even up for debate
Volleys - people say that Federer is better volleys, but what about the last game of Wimbledon? You see Nadal hit amazing passing shots against Federer all the time, but rarely the other way around.
Movement - Nadal is faster and gets into position much more easily, that is why he is able to put so much on every shot
Mental - Once again, not even up for debate
Hard courts - see most recent GS final and most recent Master Series 1000 tournament
Grass courts - see most recent Wimbledon final, plus Nadal faced a much tougher field in his grass warm-up the week before Wimbledon
Clay courts - this one is just total domination, Nadal goes down 1-5 or 4-0 on purpose just to practise his mental toughness. It worked so well, not only did he win the matches where he was down 1-5, the mental toughness practice let him win Wimbledon and the Australian Open too
Other surfaces - neither player has done anything important on other surfaces in the past year

Any takers? Federer might've had a better forehand and serve and volleys in his prime, but that time is long gone.

the answer to you from longsocks:
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa86/calzelunghe_2007/doom.gif

tennisplaya
06-12-2009, 08:16 PM
He serves MUCH better and keeps him self injury free MUCH better. That's about it.

TheTruth
06-12-2009, 08:53 PM
No...........................!

vtmike
06-12-2009, 08:56 PM
the answer to you from longsocks:
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa86/calzelunghe_2007/doom.gif

Hahahahaha :lol:

sh@de
06-12-2009, 09:16 PM
Wow, epic picture that ^

bluetrain4
06-12-2009, 09:23 PM
He wins US Opens better than Nadal.

フェデラー
06-12-2009, 09:38 PM
Did anyone watch the Madrid Final? Nadal got his **** jacked by Federer. Federer out powered him in every way.

BullDogTennis
06-12-2009, 09:43 PM
Did anyone watch the Madrid Final? Nadal got his **** jacked by Federer. Federer out powered him in every way.

did anyone watch the french final? nadal just didnt even show up...i wonder where he was?

weallwegot
06-12-2009, 09:48 PM
I'd want Nadal's knees.

vndesu
06-12-2009, 09:51 PM
How they currently matchup:
Fitness- Nadal

you cant really say fitness bc of his knees.

TennisFan481
06-12-2009, 09:53 PM
Federer and Nadal have completely different types of ground strokes. Nadal is a defensive player who has improved at playing offense, and Federer is an offensive player who has also always been exceptional at playing defense.

When you look at it that way, Federer is CLEARLY the better tennis talent.

Nadal's forehands and backhands are more consistent than Federer's...the man doesn't make errors...but he also isn't real big on hitting winners. He plays defense and tries to force errors with his excessive topspin.

Compare that with Roger, who generally "hits winners for a living." Federer had WAY more pace on his groundstrokes in his prime than Nadal (he's lost quite a bit on both wings since his 2004-2006 *** kicking period, but when he's on these days, he's still a good deal ahead of Nadal in terms of how hard he hits the ball). Both his forehand and his backhand were excellent attacking weapons...and both could ALSO be used for defense. The difference in defensive effectiveness is simply that Federer, while he can do what Nadal does almost as well as Nadal, doesn't go into a match with the same mindset. He wants to construct points, he doesn't want to be the human equivalent of a brick wall and just wait for his opponent to make a mistake.

So what you have is a lot more unforced errors and people talking about Nadal's "big forehand" (the big moonball) and "better backhand." They're not better, they just stay in the court more consistently because that's the style of player Nadal is, i.e. not a big risk taker.

So I break it down like this:

2004-2006 Federer vs. Nadal:

Serve Power (Pace): Federer
Serve Speed: Federer
Serve Placement/variety: Federer

Forehand Volley: Federer (Nadal's horrid dropshots should be enough to tell you he doesn't have good feel)

Backhand Volley: Federer

Forehand Power (Pace): Federer
Forehand Speed: Federer
Forehand Consistency: Nadal
Forehand Variety: Federer
Forehand Placement/accuracy: Federer
Forehand Spin: Nadal

Backhand Power (Pace): Federer
Backhand Speed: Federer
Backhand Consistency: Nadal
Backhand Variety: Federer
Backhand Slice: Federer
Backhand Placement/accuracy: Even
Backhand Spin: Nadal

Movement (pure getting to ball speed/defense): Nadal
Movement (fluidity): Federer

Return Serve Forehand: Federer
Return Serve Backhand: Federer

Fitness/Stamina: Federer

Mental Toughness: I'm calling it even. In a match against each other, of course Nadal has a mental edge--he's gained all that confidence against Federer by beating him up on clay.



As far as current Federer vs. Nadal...it's a crapshoot. Depends on whether or not Roger shows up for the match, so it's too tough to really call any of these categories with any sort of consistency.

Oh, and let's talk about drop shots more. Has anyone noticed that Nadal can not hit a good dropshot to save his life? That helped get him killed versus Soderling. They were landing at the end of the freaking service box every time. Conversely, Federer's land close to the net every time. Federer just has much better racket control than Nadal.

Nadal has poor technique on all his shots and in his movement, which is why he's so banged up all the time. The key to hitting explosive shots is to have a relaxed arm. Nadal just muscles the ball in and strains his body in doing so. He doesn't hit explosive ground strokes...though he has improved on flattening out his forehand on hardcourts, it remains a work in progress. Perhaps all that work has detracted from his form on clay, who knows.

And his lack of offensive firepower makes him susceptible to certain types of players (such as Soderling) who hit extremely hard and flat and are willing to take it to him. Nadal lost that match because he couldn't come up with much offensively once Soderling showed he wasn't bothered by the wicked topspin.

Cenc
06-12-2009, 10:19 PM
what fed does better than nadal? lots of things, for the beginning as far as i heard he is a better driver :p
seriously
serves are not comparable
even volleys
i prefer feds forehand especially on fast surfaces, nadals is a bomb on clay
his slice is better (feds) as well
but i guess this guy just wanted to start fire because this topic is useless

nfor304
06-12-2009, 11:17 PM
Federer and Nadal have completely different types of ground strokes. Nadal is a defensive player who has improved at playing offense, and Federer is an offensive player who has also always been exceptional at playing defense.

When you look at it that way, Federer is CLEARLY the better tennis talent.

Nadal's forehands and backhands are more consistent than Federer's...the man doesn't make errors...but he also isn't real big on hitting winners. He plays defense and tries to force errors with his excessive topspin.

Compare that with Roger, who generally "hits winners for a living." Federer had WAY more pace on his groundstrokes in his prime than Nadal (he's lost quite a bit on both wings since his 2004-2006 *** kicking period, but when he's on these days, he's still a good deal ahead of Nadal in terms of how hard he hits the ball). Both his forehand and his backhand were excellent attacking weapons...and both could ALSO be used for defense. The difference in defensive effectiveness is simply that Federer, while he can do what Nadal does almost as well as Nadal, doesn't go into a match with the same mindset. He wants to construct points, he doesn't want to be the human equivalent of a brick wall and just wait for his opponent to make a mistake.

So what you have is a lot more unforced errors and people talking about Nadal's "big forehand" (the big moonball) and "better backhand." They're not better, they just stay in the court more consistently because that's the style of player Nadal is, i.e. not a big risk taker.

So I break it down like this:

2004-2006 Federer vs. Nadal:

Serve Power (Pace): Federer
Serve Speed: Federer
Serve Placement/variety: Federer

Forehand Volley: Federer (Nadal's horrid dropshots should be enough to tell you he doesn't have good feel)

Backhand Volley: Federer

Forehand Power (Pace): Federer
Forehand Speed: Federer
Forehand Consistency: Nadal
Forehand Variety: Federer
Forehand Placement/accuracy: Federer
Forehand Spin: Nadal

Backhand Power (Pace): Federer
Backhand Speed: Federer
Backhand Consistency: Nadal
Backhand Variety: Federer
Backhand Slice: Federer
Backhand Placement/accuracy: Even
Backhand Spin: Nadal

Movement (pure getting to ball speed/defense): Nadal
Movement (fluidity): Federer

Return Serve Forehand: Federer
Return Serve Backhand: Federer

Fitness/Stamina: Federer

Mental Toughness: I'm calling it even. In a match against each other, of course Nadal has a mental edge--he's gained all that confidence against Federer by beating him up on clay.



As far as current Federer vs. Nadal...it's a crapshoot. Depends on whether or not Roger shows up for the match, so it's too tough to really call any of these categories with any sort of consistency.

Oh, and let's talk about drop shots more. Has anyone noticed that Nadal can not hit a good dropshot to save his life? That helped get him killed versus Soderling. They were landing at the end of the freaking service box every time. Conversely, Federer's land close to the net every time. Federer just has much better racket control than Nadal.

Nadal has poor technique on all his shots and in his movement, which is why he's so banged up all the time. The key to hitting explosive shots is to have a relaxed arm. Nadal just muscles the ball in and strains his body in doing so. He doesn't hit explosive ground strokes...though he has improved on flattening out his forehand on hardcourts, it remains a work in progress. Perhaps all that work has detracted from his form on clay, who knows.

And his lack of offensive firepower makes him susceptible to certain types of players (such as Soderling) who hit extremely hard and flat and are willing to take it to him. Nadal lost that match because he couldn't come up with much offensively once Soderling showed he wasn't bothered by the wicked topspin.


Whats happening with you? First you come on here and bash Federer like he's the worst human being on the planet... and then as soon as he wins the French you start posting stuff like this, which you have obviously put a lot more thought and effort into.

Your toying with my emotions!

tahiti
06-12-2009, 11:17 PM
Fed's serve is better.

lawrence
06-13-2009, 01:06 AM
lets see, what does fed to better than nadal

oh i have it: beating soderling

lewl

rommil
06-13-2009, 02:43 AM
Did anyone watch the Madrid Final? Nadal got his **** jacked by Federer. Federer out powered him in every way.

How did you get your name to appear like that? Niiiiiice.....

montx
06-13-2009, 02:47 AM
To the poster Etepras, I honestly think Federer's mental game is above and beyond other players in tennis, I think you overlooked the part that makes him #1, in my opinion.

120mphBodyServe
06-13-2009, 03:05 AM
Roger.. He speak very good english, no? :-D

BHud
06-15-2009, 11:30 AM
Yes...win majors...

joeri888
06-15-2009, 11:33 AM
This was a ridiculous thread in the first place. Fed probably just had his *** handed to him and suddenly Rafa was the better server..

CountryHillbilly
06-15-2009, 11:35 AM
Yes .... one-handed backhand

The-Champ
06-15-2009, 06:53 PM
The ONLY thing that Nadal does better than Federer is pick his butt.

Otherwise, Federer does EVERYTHING better than Nadal, including kicking Soderling's butt. :)


Don't forget, Federer is better at crying as well :)

investorofmercy
06-15-2009, 07:20 PM
Uhhhh...Win Slams!

Roger 2 of the last 3, Nadal 1 of 3
Roger 4 of last 8, Nadal 3 of 8
Roger 7 of last 12, Nadal 4 of 12
Roger 10 of last 16, Nadal 5 of last 16
Roger 12 of last 20, Nadal 6 of last 20

and after winning Wimbledon and the US Open, it will be a wash.

AprilFool
06-15-2009, 07:20 PM
Yes. He makes it to at least the semi-final of every Grand Slam he plays in.

BreakPoint
06-15-2009, 07:39 PM
Don't forget, Federer is better at crying as well :)
Yes, he is. So that's just one more thing that Federer does better than Nadal. Like I said, other than pick his butt, Federer does EVERYTHING else better than Nadal. :)

The-Champ
06-15-2009, 07:43 PM
Yes, he is. So that's just one more thing that Federer does better than Nadal. Like I said, other than pick his butt, Federer does EVERYTHING else better than Nadal. :)


That's because Fed has the zipper on his backside. That would hurt his fingers. Otherwise he would be better than Nadal at that as well.

cknobman
06-16-2009, 06:46 AM
I

Serve - people always talk about Federer's serve, but I would rather have Nadal's.


Stopped reading after this comment. Poster loses all credibility and thread is now deemed an opinionated troll.

zagor
06-16-2009, 06:52 AM
Don't forget, Federer is better at crying as well :)

Fed is GOAT crier,no doubt :).

malakas
06-16-2009, 07:05 AM
Federer chooses better Nike outfits than Nadal.

sh@de
06-16-2009, 07:43 AM
Federer chooses better Nike outfits than Nadal.

Maybe it's the other way round... maybe it's Nike chooses better outfits for Federer than Nadal... :p Ever considered that?

TheTruth
06-16-2009, 07:45 AM
Throw water bottles and he does a pretty mean racket smash.

Docalex007
06-16-2009, 07:56 AM
Throw water bottles and he does a pretty mean racket smash.

But Fed's inferior to Nadal's annoying grunting noises.

vtmike
06-16-2009, 07:58 AM
Throw water bottles and he does a pretty mean racket smash.

OTOH Nadal is better at wasting time between points & making opponents wait forever...

shazbot
06-16-2009, 08:01 AM
It's hard to say who has a better forehand, it's not a clear cut, Nadal/Federer have a better forehand.

Who is more consistent on the forehand wing? Well probably Nadal, because he does not try to dictate points as much, and is content on getting it back in play.

Who has a more lethal forehand? Probably Federer, because he can hit with more pace, and plays an aggressive style of tennis.

I don't have the stats, but I'm sure Federer's winners are a lot more then Nadal's winners on the forehand side, overall.

And Federer's unforced errors on the forehand side are probably a lot more then Nadal's on the forehand side overall.

High risk, high reward, that's why Federer has 14 grand slams.

Being consistant, and breaking down players, that's why Nadal has 6 grand slams.

Sentinel
06-16-2009, 08:11 AM
Did anyone watch the Madrid Final?

NO ! What happened ???

did anyone watch the french final?

Nope, missed it ... tell us what all happened ? Did Nadal match Borgs record ?

zagor
06-16-2009, 08:22 AM
the answer to you from longsocks:
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa86/calzelunghe_2007/doom.gif

LMAO,can't believe I missed this,pure gold :).

Old,DOOM & GlOOM,no mental strength... just too good.


Clay courts - this one is just total domination, Nadal goes down 1-5 or 4-0 on purpose just to practise his mental toughness.

Did Nadal over-practise his mental toughness against Soderling? Went down 6-1 on purpose in the 4th set tiebreak to practice his mental strength and try to save 5 MPs?