low ball to forehand

[badboy]

Hi,

Just need some advise here. I have been playing someone who got very good backhand slice which he likes to place it to my forehand. Given, it is deep and low to the ground, the best shot I can make is a topspin forehand down the line which is a low percentage and difficult when I was in a rush.

I know this has been asked for million times, but anyone got a suggestion to resolve this tactic? :-?

[Rickson]

Skip that topspin and slice it back with your forehand. Make sure you have an open face and watch that dropshot just kill your opponent inside. One clown was victimized by his own dropshot attempt 3 times when I sliced it back to him. You'd figure he'd stop using dropshots on me.

[badboy]

It was a deep ball, like an approach shot.

[Rickson]

You can't slice back a deep ball? I do it all the time on low balls that are deep.

[Grizvok]

I've always felt the best option against a good slice was to hit a safer shot with a lot of topspin, which probably means a heavy forehand crosscourt over the low part of the net. It really depends on whether the opponents slice sits up at all, but since you are playing against somebody good it's going to be difficult to be aggressive off of the slice but you can atleast get some extra depth.

[Ballinbob]

I never hit topspin against a slice unless he's approaching the net. Always slice a slice. Always. Just slice that sucker back cross court to his forehand and resume play.

I slice 99.9% of my backhands because my backhand sucks, and people always try to rip winners of a slice. It just wont work. Usually a good slice will neutralize the point (can be used as an offensive weapon, but usually...). Don't try to do too much with it, just give him a taste of his own medicine

[Rickson]

I like to hit the forehand slice inside out. It gives a wicked bounce when you do that which it won't do if you go cc with it.

[Ballinbob]

I like to hit the forehand slice inside out. It gives a wicked bounce when you do that which it won't do if you go cc with it.

Lol I've never done that before. If I get a slice to that side I'll just hit a BH slice. Never thought of running around it to hitting a forehand slice.

You make things too hard on yourself Rickson :)

But if you say so....lol

[Djokovicfan4life]

I don't think you should always slice a slice. If I was playing someone like that I'd pretty much hit nothing but slice approaches and have a blast putting away those easy slices at net.

I think the most important thing for handling the slice is footwork. Don't get lazy when moving to the slice and make sure you get down by bending your knees. You want to get low while staying on balance.

Once your footwork and legwork improve, your timing will get better and you'll find that topspin and slice shots are much easier. Don't even bother with flat shots off a slice. They should only be used when you take the ball above the height of the net.

Matt

[ramseszerg]

Why can't you hit it topspin and cross-court? Practice doing that. That's what the pros do. Ergo it's the best way.

[Rickson]

Bob, why would you run around when the shot is coming to your fh anyway? Maybe it's a tiny inside out or at times, a dtl fh, but there's never a need to run around a slice directed to your fh. Perhaps dtl would paint you a better picture.

[Grizvok]

Why can't you hit it topspin and cross-court? Practice doing that. That's what the pros do. Ergo it's the best way.

I agree. The way a Nadal or Federer (especially Nadal) runs around their backhand to take a slice on their forehand and hit an aggressive but safe shot. Controlling the slice off of the forehand is super easy, just hit with as much top spin as you can manage since the approaching slice will neutralize some topspin.

[coyfish]

Seems to me like you just need to practice hitting slices. Its really not hard at all. Im a 4.5 and by no means an expert but I find the most common mistake is that people dont bend their knees enough and end up hitting down on slices or with an open face. The ball is coming slower so make sure you bend your knees and prepare properly.

[Ballinbob]

I don't think you should always slice a slice. If I was playing someone like that I'd pretty much hit nothing but slice approaches and have a blast putting away those easy slices at net.

I think the most important thing for handling the slice is footwork. Don't get lazy when moving to the slice and make sure you get down by bending your knees. You want to get low while staying on balance.

Once your footwork and legwork improve, your timing will get better and you'll find that topspin and slice shots are much easier. Don't even bother with flat shots off a slice. They should only be used when you take the ball above the height of the net.

Matt

It all depends on how aggressive that slice is really. And I said earlier that I will hit a topspin shot if I see they are coming in to the net. That's a no brainer. The general rule that really works for me though is to slice a slice.

There are always going to be circumstances where you need to drive the backhand (opponent coming to net), but usually I think this is a good rule to go by.

But agreed on the footwork part, and agreed that a flat shot is a no-no if your hitting a slice. I guess if you have an eastern grip it could work out though? Those guys like those low balls dont they?


Bob, why would you run around when the shot is coming to your fh anyway? Maybe it's a tiny inside out or at times, a dtl fh, but there's never a need to run around a slice directed to your fh. Perhaps dtl would paint you a better picture.

Ignore my other post... It's late here and I'm doing 3 projects at once. completley misread that.

But yeah i gotcha now lol I know what you are referring too.

About time to go to bed I think wow:shock:

[Rickson]

Here's the wicked bounce form Bantlord's inside out, forehand volley.

crazy bounce (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjlClQi62Kc)

[badboy]

I like to hit the forehand slice inside out. It gives a wicked bounce when you do that which it won't do if you go cc with it.

Really like the sound of it :)

[Hot Sauce]

I've always felt the best option against a good slice was to hit a safer shot with a lot of topspin, which probably means a heavy forehand crosscourt over the low part of the net. It really depends on whether the opponents slice sits up at all, but since you are playing against somebody good it's going to be difficult to be aggressive off of the slice but you can atleast get some extra depth.

This sounds good to me. Get it back with depth and topspin so he's not going to be able to attack it.

[Djokovicfan4life]

It all depends on how aggressive that slice is really. And I said earlier that I will hit a topspin shot if I see they are coming in to the net. That's a no brainer. The general rule that really works for me though is to slice a slice.

There are always going to be circumstances where you need to drive the backhand (opponent coming to net), but usually I think this is a good rule to go by.

But agreed on the footwork part, and agreed that a flat shot is a no-no if your hitting a slice. I guess if you have an eastern grip it could work out though? Those guys like those low balls dont they?






Well, the title was "low balls to forehand", so the backhand side wasn't really my focus in the previous post. For most players the forehand slice is much more difficult because the wrist/forearm must supinate rather than pronate, a more natural movement for most when slicing.

As for the grip/flat balls thing, it applies to all grips. It's more a matter of simple physics, really. If the ball is below the net and you hit it hard with no spin, just what is there to bring it back down into the court? It's one thing if you hit puff balls, but if you hit with decent pace gravity will not be a sufficient force to bring the ball back down.

Matt

[mikeler]

I like to hit a low slice DTL to my forehand back to my opponent with half topspin/half sidespin. The sidespin really helps take the ball off the court if I hit it cross court. I'm not a huge fan of the forehand slice reply unless I'm completely stretched out or I have to dig a short ball up over the net.

[maverick66]

people who are saying slice it back what levels are you?

you hit it back crosscourt with a good amount of topspin and stay in the point. its a neutral ball so your most likely not gonna be able to rip the cover off of it. roll it back crosscourt with good depth and stay in the point.

[stormholloway]

Hi,

Just need some advise here. I have been playing someone who got very good backhand slice which he likes to place it to my forehand. Given, it is deep and low to the ground, the best shot I can make is a topspin forehand down the line which is a low percentage and difficult when I was in a rush.

I know this has been asked for million times, but anyone got a suggestion to resolve this tactic? :-?

Why is a forehand down the line the best shot? If you find it difficult and low percentage then it probably isn't. I prefer taking the ball down the line when it has some height on it because you have to go over the high part of the net. Taking a low ball down the line requires a good ball arc.

Just keep sending the ball back crosscourt. All things being even, the slice will break down before the topspin forehand. At the very least he will hit the slice long or short, in which case you can punish the short ball.

[mikeler]

people who are saying slice it back what levels are you?

you hit it back crosscourt with a good amount of topspin and stay in the point. its a neutral ball so your most likely not gonna be able to rip the cover off of it. roll it back crosscourt with good depth and stay in the point.


Agreed. This might work at the <=4.0 level, but is probably not going to be real effective higher than that unless you are some big time hacker who can hit the hell out of a slice forehand. I have seen great slice forehands before, but not very often.

[Ballinbob]

people who are saying slice it back what levels are you?

you hit it back crosscourt with a good amount of topspin and stay in the point. its a neutral ball so your most likely not gonna be able to rip the cover off of it. roll it back crosscourt with good depth and stay in the point.

I got rated a 4.0 by two coaches around 2 weeks back. Anyway though..

how is a forehand slice not a neutralizing shot? I agree 100% that a topspin ball that is deep will work, but what's wrong with a forehand slice? If your opponent is coming in to the net, then hit a topspin passing shot. But otherwise I think a forehand slice is a safe, high percentage shot that will neutralize the point for you.

Is this just an awkward shot for most people to hit then? I use it alot but usually approach after I hit it. I make my living at the net, so you baseline junkies educate me on why this is a bad shot to hit

[stormholloway]

What's wrong with a forehand slice? It's a completely defensive shot. It's never as consistent as a backhand slice. Why would you hit that shot in this scenario? It's just a forehand.

The forehand slice is probably the most inconsistent groundstroke in the game for any reasonable tennis player.

[Ballinbob]

I disagree... I think a forehand slice is just as easy to do as a backhand slice. It's the exact same mechanics. And no it definitley is not a defensive shot. A slice in general is a neutralizing shot. You don't see people attacking Federer's slice too much (if at all). That's because its hard to really attack a slice.

A forehand slice is not defensive and can be just as effective as a backhand slice. I mean I agree a topspin shot is a good choice in this situation also but if you just want to neutralize the point I don't see why you wouldn't slice it hard cross court. Verry safe shot too..

[Rickson]

A fh slice is just as easy, if not easier to execute, than a bh slice. Holloway's just not used to it.

[Ballinbob]

lol I wonder if i've ever disagreed with you rickson

But yeah I mean its the same grip, same motion, same technique, same everything. It can be just as useful/good as a BH slice

[Rickson]

I think you have about that girl. I'm just messin with you. I know you stopped texting her.

[Ballinbob]

ohh yeah that was awhile ago. Nothing new really w/ the girls. I decided to take CC's advice and stop posting stuff about it and just wait. And eventually something will happen. I hope at least lol

[Rickson]

Make yourself a ton of $$$ before you're 30 and they'll throw themselves at you.

[Ballinbob]

Haha well for now I'm just focusing on making it to a DII school when I'm 18 and just keeping my GPA at a 3.5+. But thanks for the tip I'll keep that in mind for later I guess lol

just saw the vid you posted w/ the underhand slice drop shot thing. That is amazing! He does it really casually too

[Rickson]

And did you notice that bantlord went inside out? That wicked bounce wouldn't have happened on a cc, fh slice volley.

[mikeler]

If the forehand slice works for you guys than great. It don't hit a forehand slice very often, so it is not the best game plan for me.

[Grizvok]

Do what you want, but you sure as hell don't see many pros ever using a forehand slice and in this specific situation the loopy topspin ball is going to neutralize their slice just as much as a slice reply.

Not to mention, the average players directional control is going to be much more efficient on a topspin forehand then some slice. You must also factor in the ability to close into the net at the last second, since slices give the opponent more time he may be able to sneak in quickly. I can't even begin to count the number of times I've been able to get to the net while my opponent is setting up for his next shot expecting me to stay on the baseline. He then has to make a split second decision that may wind up producing errors.

[maverick66]

your either an old man or a bad player if you slice it back. old men slice it back because they cant get down to hit it anymore. and bad players tend to bo lazy with there feet and dont move to the ball.

[Frank Silbermann]

It's kind of an odd discussion to me, because when I started playing almost everyone (even pros) sliced almost every backhand. Many players (even pros) could _only_ slice their backhand. Nobody fretted, "Oh my God! what if he hits it to my forehand???" That was what you _wanted_ him to do.

Of course, it's going to take more exertion to return a slice if your grip leans towards western. In Paul Metzler' 1967 classic, _Advanced Tennis_ he wrote that if you're playing an opponent who uses the western style, keep the ball low and hang in there because he might poop out before the second set is over no matter how fiery he is in the first set. He noted that the western style is a very tiring way to play. (Especially with 14oz wood rackets and no tie-breakers, I imagine.)

So if you play someone with a good slice, get in shape and get down low.

[mikeler]

Do what you want, but you sure as hell don't see many pros ever using a forehand slice and in this specific situation the loopy topspin ball is going to neutralize their slice just as much as a slice reply.

Not to mention, the average players directional control is going to be much more efficient on a topspin forehand then some slice. You must also factor in the ability to close into the net at the last second, since slices give the opponent more time he may be able to sneak in quickly. I can't even begin to count the number of times I've been able to get to the net while my opponent is setting up for his next shot expecting me to stay on the baseline. He then has to make a split second decision that may wind up producing errors.


I play almost exclusively on clay against 5.0s and most of my opponents pass very well. My best forays to the net usually happen on a routine ground stroke that pulls my opponent off the court. If I see their racket head go up then I know the slice is coming and I'll move forward to get into net.

[LeeD]

I'm an old man AND a poor player, so tend to forehand slice when I'm pulled out to the alley after a long run....
Anywhere near the court (the one I can cover :)), I like to slightly mishit a heavy topspin forehand off the low ankle high ball with a super high followtru.
That wierd spinning, really high groundie (or low lob), is super effective against a slicer if he stays back. If he charges the net, then a solid passing shot hit sorta flatter than normal is the call, except the sharp angle topped crosscourt pass.
Remember, you gotta practice hitting passing shots off ankle to shin high balls, as good players approach with low, backspun shots usually DTL, and you gotta know how to react against them.
And if they chip and charge crosscourt, you gotta know where their backhand overhead is, and react accordingly.

[stormholloway]

A fh slice is just as easy, if not easier to execute, than a bh slice. Holloway's just not used to it.

Why are you telling me what I'm used to? It's not easier to execute consistently by any stretch. Maybe you just have some trouble hitting the backhand slice.

lol I wonder if i've ever disagreed with you rickson

But yeah I mean its the same grip, same motion, same technique, same everything. It can be just as useful/good as a BH slice

Ridiculous. Why then is the backhand slice hit so much more often? Pros don't use the forehand slice unless they're completely out of position. Pros use the backhand slice all the time for a variety of reasons.

And the same technique? Same motion? Are you serious? You might as well say the forehand and backhand are the same motions. Where is the follow-through on a forehand slice? It's a chop motion. The backhand slice has a fluid and full follow-through.

Why do you think it's referred to as a "squash shot"? People are referencing a completely different sport altogether. In tennis' heyday, on grass, a lot of players would come under a low ball on the forehand side but I would hardly call it a slice even though it had backspin.

I think low level tennis players shouldn't use their own on-court experiences as justification for certain methods, including me. Watch the pros and count backhand vs. forehand slices.

[nytennisaddict]

Just adding my $0.02

The low ball to the forehand of a (semi)western grip player, is a fantastic tactic to challenge his/her footwork (getting to the ball, staying low, etc...).

I'll often use this tactic myself particularly if fed a ball short and waist high to my backhand side, when I'm playing someone with a western grip (aiming ideally at the opp fh side T).

The key is that I only attempt this shot selectively (with other options like driving with 2 hands etc...) when I'm in position to hit an aggressive shot. So if your opp has a consistent/regular shot s/he can hit low to your fh, and it bothers you... you really need to ask, "what shot did i give him/her to allow them to do that?"

When I play master slicer and dicers (ala Santoro), I'll tend to hit much higher and loopier topspin balls than usual (just as it's really tough to get under a well hit low sliced ball with a (semi) western grip, it's usually tough to slice a high bouncing topspin ball, in such a way that it stays low)... with this strategy it becomes a game of "who can execute their strategy better?"... but keep in mind the person that slices low to elicit a higher loopier ball that s/he can run around hit their fh with...

That said, if I execute the above strat, and still get the low awkward slicing ball to my fh that I'm scrambling for (or can't get under because I'm late, tired, etc...), I'll usually just hit a slice fh (or even lob) to neutralize, and hope to reset the point.

[Ballinbob]

A slice forehand is a fluid motion... Your not ment to chop at it at all. Yes topspin is a good choice in this situation I'm not saying it's not, but I think mixing in some slice forehands off these balls wouldn't be a bad thing.

And pro's don't slice off their forehand much because for the vast majority of pros their forehand is their better shot/weapon. They can really hurt their opponent with their forehand, so they hit their topspin FH every chance they get it. Also, most pros can't do as much damage off the backhand side as they can the forehand side, and it is usually the weaker stroke (by weak, I mean not as good as their forehand). That is why you don't see many slice forehands.

And no need to call me a low leveled player. I think all of us on these boards have worked hard to get to where we are, so keep your opinion on who's a high leveled player/low leveled player to yourself. I don't see the reason for the personal attack just because I'm advocating the forehand slice. I realize that a topspin shot is a good shot in this situation also, but I don't think this would be a bad idea to try

[maverick66]

im gonna disagree with you bob. storm already pointed out that its not a natural motion to slice a forehand. on top of that your hitting a defensive shot that sucks. slicing forehands is a bad idea. you can dictate so much better with a forehand. on top of that if he hits it well to your forehand side and you slice most likely your popping it up and now on defense. if you get there and hit it with a topspin forehand you can stay in the point and not be scrambling on defense.

and on that if your slicing forehands and looking to become a better player stop slicing right now. its a defensive shot. like i said its for old guys that can no longer move. if you want to become a good player which i think you do your gonna have to get to that ball get low and hit it cross court. slicing forehands is lazy and not your best option.

[Rickson]

A fh slice dtl makes a great approach shot because in most cases, it's to your opponent's bh and the sometimes wicked bounce can force your opponent to miss his bh altogether or give you a weak reply.

[Ballinbob]

I dont slice every forehand, I mix it up. And it doesn't really matter for me because I spend very little time at the baseline. But yes it can make an excellent approach shot, you just have to use it at the right times. You can dictacte play more with a topspin forehand, I agree 100%. But I still think it is a good neutralizing shot and if used as an approach it can be an offensive shot.

This issue is debatble and really depends on the player. I dont think we're going to arrive at one answer..