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miyagi
04-18-2009, 09:55 AM
I am NO Murray fan at all! BUT he played great today....I didnt think his game would translate well to clay and whilst I'm not suggesting that he will win any clay titles.

But for a Hard Court specialist shall we say I thought he played very well indeed!

So what did you guys think?

matchmaker
04-18-2009, 09:58 AM
I agree.

When Murray stops pushing and is forced to go after the points he is dangerous on any surface and he showed he actually masters clay, he will be increasingly a huge contender for clay court tournaments.

batz
04-18-2009, 09:58 AM
I am NO Murray fan at all! BUT he played great today....I didnt think his game would translate well to clay and whilst I'm not suggesting that he will win any clay titles.

But for a Hard Court specialist shall we say I thought he played very well indeed!

So what did you guys think?

Firstly I think that Rafa is bluddy amazing - some of his retrieving today was inhuman.

Secondly, the tropes about Murray not being able to generate power and not being able to hit through the court are pretty much dispelled.

Murray will get better on the dirt. Rafa hadn't been taken to a breaker in this event since 2006, and when was the last time he had mp on his serve on dirt and got broken?

miyagi
04-18-2009, 10:02 AM
I didnt know what to expect really.... I expected Murray to put up a hell of a fight but at 5 - 3 in the 2nd set he came alive and played some kick *** tennis.

Yep we all know Rafa played insane (as usual) I love the way he steps up to the challenge and never crumbles!

But congrats to Murray, clay court season could be interesting - ish lol imagine if he can build on this performance?

Tennis_Maestro
04-18-2009, 10:02 AM
Thank you!

I'm glad even Nadal trolls are finally sensing Murray's potential on clay.

miyagi
04-18-2009, 10:03 AM
Thank you!

I'm glad even Nadal trolls are finally sensing Murray's potential on clay.

I'm a Nadal troll? LOL thanks for coming into my thread and insulting me....lmao! :)

All-rounder
04-18-2009, 10:04 AM
Thank you!

I'm glad even Nadal trolls are finally sensing Murray's potential on clay.
Nobody is trolling just a misunderstanding

hansolo
04-18-2009, 10:11 AM
Murray certainly played very well to the latter stages of the second set and proved that when he plays aggressively he is a threat on clay aswell.

deltox
04-18-2009, 10:19 AM
i give murray credit he played well this tourney.. cant wait to see what he does later in the year and next season

Cesc Fabregas
04-18-2009, 10:25 AM
I hold my hands up credit to Murray today.

batz
04-18-2009, 10:26 AM
I hold my hands up credit to Murray today.


And credit to you Cesc.

maximo
04-18-2009, 10:30 AM
Murray would of won a set if he starting like he did in the second

Cesc Fabregas
04-18-2009, 10:31 AM
Murray would of won if a set if he starting like he did in the second

Nadal was bossing the points at that stage he couldn't.

maximo
04-18-2009, 10:34 AM
Nadal was bossing the points at that stage he couldn't.

Murray was bossing the points in the second. Could of done the same in the first.

maximo
04-18-2009, 10:38 AM
I hold my hands up credit to Murray today.

I thought you said Murray has the worst FH in the top 10. It was certainly better than Nadal's today. :roll:

Cesc Fabregas
04-18-2009, 10:41 AM
I thought you said Murray has the worst FH in the top 10. It was certainly better than Nadal's today. :roll:

No it wasn't it was great in the last few games but not over the course of the match.

maximo
04-18-2009, 10:43 AM
No it wasn't it was great in the last few games but not over the course of the match.

In the second set it was clearly better than Nadal's.

VivalaVida
04-18-2009, 10:44 AM
No it wasn't it was great in the last few games but not over the course of the match.
If murray played with the same intensity and level as he did towards the end of the second set, nadal wouldnt have been making him run around like a "crazy chicken" as the British commentators put it.

Cyan
04-18-2009, 12:03 PM
Hopefully Murray wins a slam this year.

Cesc Fabregas
04-18-2009, 12:04 PM
Hopefully Murray wins a slam this year.

He has a good shot at the USO.

P_Agony
04-18-2009, 12:18 PM
Murray first tried to play like Nadal and had no success. The result was one of the most boring sets I've watched in my life, with some horribly long rallies with moonball after moonball. It was a pain to watch and I stopped.

Then, however, I turned it on again and saw Murray starting to play aggressive tennis and actually taking the 2nd set to a TB, with some very nice, short, aggressive points. Kudos to Murray for showing a lot of fighting spirit at the end. Nadal was playing grat as usual of course, no need to mention that.

l_gonzalez
04-18-2009, 12:30 PM
Credit indeed, but can Murray play with the intensity he showed at the end of the 2nd set for up to 3 hours? That's the real question because that's what it'll take to beat Nadal in one of these Masters Series let alone at Roland Garros.

nevisben
04-18-2009, 12:44 PM
From 5-2 down in the second Murray turned it on a won 4 out of the next 5 games. If only he had started 1 game earlier.....

Nadal was immense as usual but good to see that Murray hit more winners than him, even including a too passive first set and a half. Hopefully he will learn from this.

Also well done to the posters who are finally giving credit to Murray.

Looking forward to he final.

miyagi
04-18-2009, 01:13 PM
Murray first tried to play like Nadal and had no success. The result was one of the most boring sets I've watched in my life, with some horribly long rallies with moonball after moonball. It was a pain to watch and I stopped.

Then, however, I turned it on again and saw Murray starting to play aggressive tennis and actually taking the 2nd set to a TB, with some very nice, short, aggressive points. Kudos to Murray for showing a lot of fighting spirit at the end. Nadal was playing grat as usual of course, no need to mention that.

Murray said he played especially high shots to give himself time to get back in position.

I dont know if Murray can keep it up for 2 sets but we will get to see shortly!

P_Agony
04-18-2009, 02:47 PM
Murray said he played especially high shots to give himself time to get back in position.

I dont know if Murray can keep it up for 2 sets but we will get to see shortly!

But when he did play those shots he wasn't succesful (plus the tennis was ultra ugly). I swear, I thought I was watching a WTA with some of the most horriblly long and boring rallies, with nothing but moonballs played by each. Murray was succesful when he started playing aggressive, going for his shots and taking chances. That's the only way to play Nadal on clay.

Safinator_1
04-18-2009, 02:59 PM
Wheres Nadals credit? :P

Magnificent!
04-18-2009, 03:02 PM
Murray is a quick learner, he knows he can compete with Nadal on clay for periods in a match atleast. I see Murray closing the gap on Nadal on clay because he is a good tactician with alot of shot options. I reckon Nadal sees Murray as his biggest threat on all surfaces, including grass because Murray has good mental strength too. I think Murray is similar to Macenroe, people don't really warm to him...but they will grow to appreciate his talent.

miyagi
04-18-2009, 03:26 PM
But when he did play those shots he wasn't succesful (plus the tennis was ultra ugly). I swear, I thought I was watching a WTA with some of the most horriblly long and boring rallies, with nothing but moonballs played by each. Murray was succesful when he started playing aggressive, going for his shots and taking chances. That's the only way to play Nadal on clay.

LOL

Can we please keep the insults to another thread!

Breaker
04-18-2009, 03:33 PM
Wheres Nadals credit? :P

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=87534&highlight=nadalgirl26

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=108023&highlight=nadalgirl26

CCNM
04-18-2009, 03:45 PM
Glad to see there's someone on tour besides Federer that's not afraid of Nadal

Serendipitous
04-18-2009, 03:50 PM
I would have LOVED to see a third set. I'm sure everyone would.


It could have never happened, though, because Murray started slowly in the tie-break and Nadal played perfectly.


But Murray proved to everyone that he has some serious mental toughness...hopefully that bodes well in the future.

Mastadon_10S
04-18-2009, 03:55 PM
Murray is a player, that it for sure. He is becoming better with time as all do, IMO he will give Nadal a run for his money in the near future on the dirt.

Serendipitous
04-18-2009, 03:56 PM
The one thing that let Murray down in this match was his forehand.


It's nowhere near as penetrating as Nadal's forehand. Except when he stepped in and attacked, all he did was loop that ball back and wait for an error.

srvnvly
04-18-2009, 04:15 PM
I would like to see them play on grass, at Wimbledon; Nadal is incredible and is the current legitimate hope for a true Grand Slam, but Murray's game could be good enough to beat Rafa on grass

slick
04-18-2009, 05:44 PM
Glad to see there's someone on tour besides Federer that's not afraid of Nadal


What? Nadal scares the crap out of Federer!

Gugafan
04-18-2009, 05:49 PM
I think its fair to say that 'Murray is suited to clay'.

Ljubicic for number1
04-18-2009, 09:57 PM
Yep great effort, hope we get to see a rematch this season as it will be very interesting to see what he took from this match.

bluetrain4
04-18-2009, 09:59 PM
Credit indeed, but can Murray play with the intensity he showed at the end of the 2nd set for up to 3 hours? That's the real question because that's what it'll take to beat Nadal in one of these Masters Series let alone at Roland Garros.

This is what I was thinking. You can look at that second set and maybe conclude that Murray is "close", that with some adjustments, he can really challenge Nadal at the French.

Or, you can see what tremendous effort and intensity it took, and realize tht if he drops that level for even a second (which he is going to do over a best of 5 match), he's right back to losing the set as he did the first set.

He's close, yet, so, so, far away.

The-Champ
04-18-2009, 10:18 PM
Hopefully Murray wins a slam this year.


nope, hopefully he wins a slam or 2 next year! this is the year when rafa wins all 4

shawn1122
04-18-2009, 10:32 PM
nope, hopefully he wins a slam or 2 next year! this is the year when rafa wins all 4

No.

Murray is by far the favourite at the US open, and I would not take Wimbledon for granted just yet.

Antonio Puente
04-18-2009, 10:40 PM
You have to admit, it is funny seeing a player get this much credit after being dusted off in straight sets(6-2 in the first). To me, it just points to how ridiculously dominant Nadal is.

Congratulations Andy - you played a hell of a match. Your prize? A straight set beating.

batz
04-19-2009, 01:48 AM
You have to admit, it is funny seeing a player get this much credit after being dusted off in straight sets(6-2 in the first). To me, it just points to how ridiculously dominant Nadal is.

Congratulations Andy - you played a hell of a match. Your prize? A straight set beating.

It's all relative though isn't it? When somebody does something that hasn't been done for three years (take Rafa to a tb @ MC) and when the last guy to do it was prime Roger, then people take notice, especially when the guy who did it has been almost universally written off as a clay court no-hoper.

Murray can now tell himself his next target is to take a set off Rafa on clay. A week ago the thought of Murray doing that would have brought howls of derision - but this morning it would seem to be a reasonable goal.

I think that in itself is due a bit of credit.

P_Agony
04-19-2009, 03:00 AM
LOL

Can we please keep the insults to another thread!

No insults really. Both played well (Nadal obviously better). It just was a pain to watch as far as entertainment goes. The tennis, especially in the 1st set, was the ugliest I've ever seen. There is a big difference between high quality tennis and beautiful tennis. Was it high quality? Sure, espeically from Nadal. Was it beautiful? Hardly (at least not until the nice last games of the 2nd set).

maximo
04-19-2009, 03:02 AM
Murray's better than Federer and Djokovic on clay.

P_Agony
04-19-2009, 03:03 AM
No.

Murray is by far the favourite at the US open, and I would not take Wimbledon for granted just yet.

How is Murray favorite to win any slam? Why would he be favorite over 2 guys that are currently running the grand slam buisness (Rafa and Fed). Everyone said Murray was favorite to win the AO (including myself I admit) and he didn't exactly even reach the semi final. Until he wins one, he is no favorite at any of them.

Cesc Fabregas
04-19-2009, 03:04 AM
Murray's better than Federer and Djokovic on clay.

No he isn't.

maximo
04-19-2009, 03:05 AM
No he isn't.

He sure is.

Cesc Fabregas
04-19-2009, 03:07 AM
He sure is.

He played well yestarday but Djoker and Fed have far better clay court resumes.

maximo
04-19-2009, 03:09 AM
He played well yestarday but Djoker and Fed have far better clay court resumes.

The past means nothing...


Fed went out 3rd round in MC, don't forget. Murray got to the SF, and almost took it to 3 sets.

Cesc Fabregas
04-19-2009, 03:11 AM
The past means nothing...


Fed went out 3rd round in MC, don't forget. Murray got to the SF, and almost took it to 3 sets.

Djokovic nearly beat Nadal at Hamburg last year so did Federer and Djokovic at RG nearly took Nadal to 4 sets.

Safinator_1
04-19-2009, 03:11 AM
The past means nothing...


Fed went out 3rd round in MC, don't forget. Murray got to the SF, and almost took it to 3 sets.

Im not convinced, especially if we are judging purely based on 1 clay tournament

maximo
04-19-2009, 03:13 AM
The 'presumably' second best claycourter out in a 3rd round of a tournament. dont be silly now.

Safinator_1
04-19-2009, 03:22 AM
I will wait till the Clay season is actually 'over' before i judge who is played better than who

P_Agony
04-19-2009, 03:24 AM
The 'presumably' second best claycourter out in a 3rd round of a tournament. dont be silly now.

Federer is not the 2nd best clayer currently - I'll agree to that. But don't be fooled. Prime Federer is a better clay courter than both Djokovic and Murray.

maximo
04-19-2009, 03:26 AM
Federer is not the 2nd best clayer currently - I'll agree to that. But don't be fooled. Prime Federer is a better clay courter than both Djokovic and Murray.

Prime Federer is better than both, but Prime Federer is long gone...

Safinator_1
04-19-2009, 03:27 AM
Agreed he will be missed.....only by Fed fans

Ljubicic for number1
04-19-2009, 03:44 AM
Murray's better than Federer and Djokovic on clay.

That is a ridiculous comment based on 1 tournament. I acknowledge he played some great tennis at the end of the 2nd and made me a believer that he will be a threat on clay this season. He could even be playing better than Novak by the end of the clay season. But to declare him better than Novak after 1 tournament is a joke. Remember only Rafa has stopped Novak at roland garros the last 3 years.

Josherer
04-19-2009, 03:47 AM
When Murray was moonballing in the 1st he got snapped.

But in the second at 5-2 when he started going for shots (and Nadal started to drop the ball short) he did wayyyy better.

maximo
04-19-2009, 03:47 AM
That is a ridiculous comment based on 1 tournament. I acknowledge he played some great tennis at the end of the 2nd and made me a believer that he will be a threat on clay this season. He could even be playing better than Novak by the end of the clay season. But to declare him better than Novak after 1 tournament is a joke. Remember only Rafa has stopped Novak at roland garros the last 3 years.

Not just one tournament, but all the last meetings on HC (where he got rinsed), and yes you may say that was on hard, but Murray clearly showed he can compete with the best player on clay. So my point stands.

Ljubicic for number1
04-19-2009, 03:51 AM
he competed for a few games, I hope he can carry on with it but dont get carried away.

P_Agony
04-19-2009, 04:00 AM
Prime Federer is better than both, but Prime Federer is long gone...

He's gone yes. But sometimes he returns to say hello, like in US Opens. Maybe he will this year too.

maximo
04-19-2009, 04:02 AM
He's gone yes. But sometimes he returns to say hello, like in US Opens. Maybe he will this year too.

The chances of that happening again is like 100-1.

Safinator_1
04-19-2009, 04:03 AM
The chances of that happening again is like 100-1.

They must be feeling pretty lucky then

batz
04-19-2009, 04:04 AM
Maximo - seriously mate, from one Murray fan to another, don't get too carried away. Andy made some good progress this week on clay, let's just enjoy it.

Ljubicic for number1
04-19-2009, 04:09 AM
Maximo - seriously mate, from one Murray fan to another, don't get too carried away. Andy made some good progress this week on clay, let's just enjoy it.

Some common sense for you right there Maximo.

Cesc Fabregas
04-19-2009, 04:09 AM
The chances of that happening again is like 100-1.

Thats just ridicolous Federer will atleast be third favourite for the USO.

maximo
04-19-2009, 04:10 AM
Thats just ridicolous Federer will atleast be third favourite for the USO.

In the form he's in, no way.

Cesc Fabregas
04-19-2009, 04:11 AM
In the form he's in, no way.

Its not out if the realms of possiblity that he might win Wimbledon.

maximo
04-19-2009, 04:13 AM
Some common sense for you right there Maximo.

Murray's better than Djokovic, deal with it.

Cesc Fabregas
04-19-2009, 04:15 AM
Murray's better than Djokovic, deal with it.

You mean the same Djokovic that is in the Monte Carlo final?

maximo
04-19-2009, 04:17 AM
You mean the same Djokovic that is in the Monte Carlo final?

He's been playing the exact same he did Miami, yes, the same djokovic that is in the MC final.

He had to beat Wawrinka in 3 sets.

Murray beat Davydenko in straights, and we all know he's better than stan.

P_Agony
04-19-2009, 04:26 AM
In the form he's in, no way.

Federer is the favorite to win the US Open. He's the defending champion, you know. He also tends to find his game in the US Open (it happnned both in 2007 and 2008).

P_Agony
04-19-2009, 04:30 AM
He's been playing the exact same he did Miami, yes, the same djokovic that is in the MC final.

He had to beat Wawrinka in 3 sets.

Murray beat Davydenko in straights, and we all know he's better than stan.

No credit for Wawrinka huh? Davydenko is a better clayer IMO than both Djokovic and Murray. He's a mental headcase however. Wawrinka has made tons of errors in the Djokovic match, but he also played some really great points too. Djokovic defended some state of the art shots by Wawrinka, shots that on faster surfaces would probably have been clear winners. In fact, Djokovic has surprised me with his play, so give him some credit. I still don't think he's anywhere as good as clayer as they say (I think he's much better on HCs) but yesterday he played some fantastic tennis and if he plays like that in the final he just might have a chance.

IMO the Djokovic/Wawrinka match was tons more enjoyable than the Nadal/Murray match (and I like Murray and I'm anything but a Djokovic fan for saying that).

Ljubicic for number1
04-19-2009, 04:31 AM
He's been playing the exact same he did Miami, yes, the same djokovic that is in the MC final.

He had to beat Wawrinka in 3 sets.

Murray beat Davydenko in straights, and we all know he's better than stan.


Andytard has spoken

Ljubicic for number1
04-19-2009, 04:33 AM
Federer is the favorite to win the US Open. He's the defending champion, you know. He also tends to find his game in the US Open (it happnned both in 2007 and 2008).

I bet you won't find a book maker that has Fed as firm favorite at the time though.

batz
04-19-2009, 04:37 AM
I bet you won't find a book maker that has Fed as firm favorite at the time though.

http://www.oddschecker.com/tennis/mens-us-open/win-market

This link gives odds for the USO across a dozen or so bookies. Roger is (quite rightly IMHO) currently 2nd favourite for the USO.

maximo
04-19-2009, 04:43 AM
Andytard has spoken

********* is in denial. :roll:

Ljubicic for number1
04-19-2009, 04:46 AM
I did say at the time of the tournament though, I think his favoritism will be taking a dive by then.

batz
04-19-2009, 04:51 AM
I did say at the time of the tournament though, I think his favoritism will be taking a dive by then.


That could happen - I agree.

Ljubicic for number1
04-19-2009, 04:56 AM
Time to go and watch Rafa dominate unfortunately.

miyagi
04-19-2009, 04:59 AM
Murray's better than Djokovic, deal with it.

Based on what? Yesterdays performance? LOL...

Djoko has consistantly out performed Murray. He has been to RG semis, he has taken a set off Nadal he has won Rome and he has NOW reached MC Final.

You are getting carried away!

maximo
04-19-2009, 06:01 AM
Based on what? Yesterdays performance? LOL...

Djoko has consistantly out performed Murray. He has been to RG semis, he has taken a set off Nadal he has won Rome and he has NOW reached MC Final.

You are getting carried away!

Djokovic has not consistantly out performed Murray, its the opposite way round. Murray is better than Djokovic based on the last 3 times they have met, Murray rinsed Djokovic on each of those occasions.

Ljubicic for number1
04-19-2009, 06:06 AM
Based on what? Yesterdays performance? LOL...

Djoko has consistantly out performed Murray. He has been to RG semis, he has taken a set off Nadal he has won Rome and he has NOW reached MC Final.

You are getting carried away!

No point trying to reason with the kid just let him have himself on.

P_Agony
04-19-2009, 06:12 AM
Djokovic has not consistantly out performed Murray, its the opposite way round. Murray is better than Djokovic based on the last 3 times they have met, Murray rinsed Djokovic on each of those occasions.

On HCs, Murray's better. On grass, maybe. On clay, hardly.

maximo
04-19-2009, 08:22 AM
No point trying to reason with the kid just let him have himself on.

The kid?

Who do you think you are? Moron.

oscar_2424
04-19-2009, 08:26 AM
u guys crack me up :)

miyagi
04-19-2009, 08:41 AM
No point trying to reason with the kid just let him have himself on.

Yeah true! Djoko played great today.

When you think about it Nadal has a very healthy H2H against all of the top 4 too that is a little scarey!!