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magmasilk
05-11-2009, 07:56 PM
USTA doubles match:

Volley bounces near the line. The opponent closer to the line calls it out while at the same time the slightly farther opponent calls it good. Do you take the point or let them sort out who had the better view? What if you thought it was out, but you aren't sure and it isn't really your call anyways.

BobFL
05-11-2009, 08:30 PM
If it is not my call and/or I amnot sure -> I just shut up.
I would let them talk and make a decision as a team.

OrangePower
05-11-2009, 09:06 PM
USTA doubles match:

Volley bounces near the line. The opponent closer to the line calls it out while at the same time the slightly farther opponent calls it good. Do you take the point or let them sort out who had the better view? What if you thought it was out, but you aren't sure and it isn't really your call anyways.

If I'm in this situation and I'm reasonable sure it's out, then I call it out and concede the point. But if I didn't see it well enough to form an opinion, then I claim the point since they are not sure that it was out (and therefore it should be considered in).

Cindysphinx
05-12-2009, 03:47 AM
If I am the team that hit the shot, I wait, but walk toward the net while they discuss it. If they say, "We decided it was out," I would reply with "She signaled it good, so she can't change her mind."

The only excuse I will accept from the player who signaled it good is, "Whoops! I got my hand signals confused."

Cindy -- who frequently gets her hand signals confused and signals out when she means good

larry10s
05-12-2009, 03:51 AM
could someone say what the rule book says in this circumstance please? thanks

Topaz
05-12-2009, 04:46 AM
If there is disagreement, the ball is assumed good.

Whenever there is disagreement in line calls between two doubles partners, the point goes in favor of the opponents (the ones who hit the ball). If it isn't clearly out, then it is assumed good.

JavierLW
05-12-2009, 05:16 AM
If there is disagreement, the ball is assumed good.

Whenever there is disagreement in line calls between two doubles partners, the point goes in favor of the opponents (the ones who hit the ball). If it isn't clearly out, then it is assumed good.

Also I think as soon as someone says it's good, it's good, right?

I dont think they can change their call at that point no matter how much they sit and talk to convince themselves it is out. Even if it's singles that would demonstrate some measure of doubt.

(although if it was clearly out you could still call your own shot out)

That happened to me the other day. I called a serve out that I saw miss the center line, and my partner said "no, it's in". I wasnt going to sit there and argue with him, so I just said "well, it's in now...".

blakesq
05-12-2009, 07:45 AM
No brainer. If opponents disagree, the point is yours.

USTA doubles match:

Volley bounces near the line. The opponent closer to the line calls it out while at the same time the slightly farther opponent calls it good. Do you take the point or let them sort out who had the better view? What if you thought it was out, but you aren't sure and it isn't really your call anyways.

woodrow1029
05-12-2009, 07:52 AM
could someone say what the rule book says in this circumstance please? thanks
Here's what the Friend at Court says in the Code:

14. Partners’ disagreement on calls. If one partner calls the ball out and the
other partner sees the ball good, they shall call it good. It is more important to give
your opponents the benefit of the doubt than to avoid possibly hurting your
partner’s feelings. The tactful way to achieve the desired result is to tell your partner
quietly of the mistake and then let your partner concede the point. If a call is changed
from out to good, the principles of Code 12 apply.

OrangePower
05-12-2009, 08:52 AM
Here's what the Friend at Court says in the Code:

14. Partners’ disagreement on calls. If one partner calls the ball out and the
other partner sees the ball good, they shall call it good. It is more important to give
your opponents the benefit of the doubt than to avoid possibly hurting your
partner’s feelings. The tactful way to achieve the desired result is to tell your partner
quietly of the mistake and then let your partner concede the point. If a call is changed
from out to good, the principles of Code 12 apply.


Yes, but... referring to the OP:

The rule immediately preceding this says:


13. Player calls own shots out. With the exception of the first serve, a player should call against himself or herself any ball the player clearly sees out regardless of whether requested to do so by the opponent. The prime objective in making calls is accuracy. All players should cooperate to attain this objective.



Of course people will argue about what "clearly sees out" means. My standard is that if I reasonably believe my shot to be out, I will call it out. I think this captures the spirit of the code.

woodrow1029
05-12-2009, 09:18 AM
Yes, but... referring to the OP:

The rule immediately preceding this says:


13. Player calls own shots out. With the exception of the first serve, a player should call against himself or herself any ball the player clearly sees out regardless of whether requested to do so by the opponent. The prime objective in making calls is accuracy. All players should cooperate to attain this objective.



Of course people will argue about what "clearly sees out" means. My standard is that if I reasonably believe my shot to be out, I will call it out. I think this captures the spirit of the code.
The OP says he thought it was out, but really wasn't sure. There are a lot of times that you hit a ball and think it's going out and it doesn't, or close balls on the baseline, that look out across the net, but the person on that side calls it in. Code 13 says that you call out against yourself if you clearly see it out. If doubles players disagree, then the benefit of the doubt is given to the opponent. If you don't see it clearly out from your side, then Code 14 is the one in question.

BobFL
05-12-2009, 09:41 AM
If I'm in this situation and I'm reasonable sure it's out, then I call it out and concede the point. But if I didn't see it well enough to form an opinion, then I claim the point since they are not sure that it was out (and therefore it should be considered in).

How can you be "reasonable sure"? That is not possible. You are either 100% sure or you have the case that we all know as reasonable doubt.
Furthermore, how do you define "to see well enough"?

OrangePower
05-12-2009, 10:06 AM
How can you be "reasonable sure"? That is not possible. You are either 100% sure or you have the case that we all know as reasonable doubt.
Furthermore, how do you define "to see well enough"?

Well, because you can never be 100% sure. Sorry, but there it is. There is always some doubt. Your eyes could be deceiving you. Your brain could be deceiving you. (See earlier posts from a poster about how we perceive things.) How can you be 100% sure that is not the case? Professional linespeople make mistakes... are you less fallable than they are? If not, they there is always some degree of uncertainty.

So I use my best judgement, and my senses of reason and fair play.

sphinx780
05-12-2009, 10:25 AM
Unless I'm reasonably sure it was out, I would take the point. If both opponents have a better view of the spot than I do, I give the benefit of the doubt to them. If they cannot agree, then they are unsure...the ball is then in.