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Antonio Puente
05-13-2009, 12:11 AM
Who is the better player?

lambielspins
05-13-2009, 12:12 AM
Hard courts- right now Murray. Career achievements Djokovic
Clay- right now Djokovic. Career achievements Djokovic
Grass- right now Djokovic. Career achievments Djokovic
Overall- Djokovic

FlamEnemY
05-13-2009, 12:19 AM
Djokovic. Murray has the edge on HC now, but like lambielspins said, Djokovic is currently better on the other surfaces.

fluffy Beaver
05-13-2009, 12:26 AM
Didn't Djokovic lose 2nd round in Wimby last year while Murray made the quarters?

FlamEnemY
05-13-2009, 12:31 AM
This is correct. However, he gave Nadal a hell of a match in Queens final 2008 and made the semis of Wimbledon in 2007.

iamgoat
05-13-2009, 01:27 AM
Novak easily.
1 slam > 0 slams.

sh@de
05-13-2009, 02:01 AM
Djoker. Everything about him is better than Murray... :p jk jk. But I think Djoker is better on clay and grass, and they're quite close on hardcourts... so Djoker overall.

Cenc
05-13-2009, 02:38 AM
đoković definitely

Dutch-Guy
05-13-2009, 02:43 AM
Djokovic >>>>Murray.

BorisBeckerFan
05-13-2009, 02:49 AM
Obviously Djokovic. This question could be a lot more interesting at the end of this year or next.

maximo
05-13-2009, 05:18 AM
Murray wiped the floor with djokovic in Miami and Cincy.

The rankings show who is better.

Gen
05-13-2009, 05:31 AM
This year Murray is better so far. Djokovic had a very bad start. Now he is gradually coming to good shape. Have to wait till post-Wimbledon tourneys. Murray looks more fit. Djokovic may have problems, if he has to play 5-setters. On clay Djokovic is far above Murray, but I don't think he's better on grass. Murray lost in the quarterfinals only because he played vs future champ.

sh@de
05-13-2009, 05:36 AM
Djoker on clay >>>>> Murray. And Djoker on hard I would say is now close to Murray (he has his confidence back). Djoker on grass still looks better than Murray. That is why Djoker > Murray. And from the poll results, that's what most people think.

batz
05-13-2009, 06:51 AM
It says a lot about Murray's improvement over the last 12 months that this is even a reasonable question.

There's not doubt that Novak has achieved more than Murray to date - that slam win goes a long way. On those grounds then Novak is the better player.

That said, Murray has won their last 3 matches without dropping a set and is currently ranked higher. I also believe that Murray is fitter than Novak at this time.

I guess it all depends on the definition of 'better'.

Cyan
05-13-2009, 11:56 AM
Djokovic................

Cesc Fabregas
05-13-2009, 11:58 AM
Djokovic is the better all surface player so Djokovic.

West Coast Ace
05-13-2009, 12:01 PM
Djokovic is the better all surface player so Djokovic.I'd agree - now.

But if the question were re-phrased to say "Who will be considered the better player at the end of their career" I would probably say Murray. But not by much - very tight.

fedtastic
05-13-2009, 12:04 PM
Djokovic. Although Murray is improving he still has a long way to go on clay. As mentioned before Murray has to win a slam at least to be compared with Djoko's achievments.

seffina
05-13-2009, 12:06 PM
This year Murray is better so far. Djokovic had a very bad start. Now he is gradually coming to good shape. Have to wait till post-Wimbledon tourneys. Murray looks more fit. Djokovic may have problems, if he has to play 5-setters. On clay Djokovic is far above Murray, but I don't think he's better on grass. Murray lost in the quarterfinals only because he played vs future champ.
Djokovic is second behind Nadal in the ATP Race this year. In the last 52 weeks, Murray was better. In 2009, so far, Djokovic has been better. Overall, Djokovic has achieved more than Murray. One more Masters series, a YEC (or the new WTF), and a slam. Plus he has made the semis of all four grand slams. Obviously Djokovic.

All-rounder
05-13-2009, 12:06 PM
Murray wiped the floor with djokovic in Miami and Cincy.

The rankings show who is better.
On hardcourts Murray hasn't beaten any top 4 player on any surface outside of hardcourts. But when you consider their recent meetings Murray has one them convincingly and the rankings pretty much show it

NickC
05-13-2009, 12:23 PM
I reckon the guy with the slam win and another slam final to his name is a bit better than the guy whose best achievement in a slam is a straight-sets defeat.

CocaCola
05-13-2009, 01:31 PM
Djokovic is better...

Clydey2times
05-13-2009, 01:48 PM
Murray has mopped the floor with Djokovic in their last 3 meetings, is now higher ranked, yet this poll is so lopsided? What a joke.

Here's a thought. Try and remember what happened beyond the last month. Talk about fickle. Djokovic is a better clay courter, Murray is clearly a better HC player right now. Grass is hard to say. Need to reserve judgement. You can't judge who the best player is right now based on a slam win over a year ago.

danb
05-13-2009, 01:58 PM
Hard courts- right now Murray. Career achievements Djokovic
Clay- right now Djokovic. Career achievements Djokovic
Grass- right now Djokovic. Career achievments Djokovic
Overall- Djokovic

I buy this.

jimbo333
05-13-2009, 03:49 PM
Murray is obviously the better player at the moment, hence his move to being ranked 3rd in the world!

I'm guessing people are not voting for him because either they just don't like him as he annoys so many people (that's why I like him), or people think the ATP rankings are wrong!

Murray will finish the year ranked 3 in the world and will be higher than Djokovic:)

tennis-hero
05-13-2009, 04:16 PM
Jokes no doubt

much MUCH MUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCCCCCCCCCCH BETTER

by a country mile

give Andy (boring) Murray credit

for such a weak game, he's mentally there to challenge the top

doesn't deserve a slam though

i find his style of play annoying

I hated Henman but at least he S&V'd and had the heart

Murray just annoys me

Antonio Puente
05-13-2009, 06:40 PM
I'm guessing people are not voting for him because either they just don't like him as he annoys so many people

And Djokovic is a fan favorite?

TenS_Ace
05-13-2009, 07:07 PM
Murray is the best of the two when you use the term atheleticism and "got game"...I've lost all respect for "da-joker" spelled WIMP!

jimbo333
05-14-2009, 02:24 AM
Murray has mopped the floor with Djokovic in their last 3 meetings, is now higher ranked, yet this poll is so lopsided? What a joke.

Here's a thought. Try and remember what happened beyond the last month. Talk about fickle. Djokovic is a better clay courter, Murray is clearly a better HC player right now. Grass is hard to say. Need to reserve judgement. You can't judge who the best player is right now based on a slam win over a year ago.

Absolutely mate:)

Murray is constantly underrated, the poll result here is ridiculous!!!

I havn't been a big Murray fan until recently, but his mental strength at the moment is only bettered by Nadal, and if this continues Murray will be ranked 2 in the world at some point next year!!!

Clay lover
05-14-2009, 02:50 AM
Djokovic's got all the tools, but Murray is a very smart tennis player and a very good defender. In terms of achivements Djokovic gets the edge, but on overall ability I think it's a toss up.

The-Champ
05-14-2009, 12:21 PM
Murray Defends Rankings System

New world number three Andy Murray hit back at number four Novak Djokovic on Thursday after the Serb said the current rankings system was cruel. Djokovic was leapfrogged by Murray in the rankings on Monday despite landing a second title of the year in Belgrade at the weekend and reaching the last three Masters Series finals. "There always seem to be problems and now it's obviously the rankings," Murray told a news conference after beating Tommy Robredo in the third round of the Madrid Open. It's great that Novak's done well the last few weeks but the first three or four months of the year I played a lot better than him so I think the rankings reflect very well how the guys are playing. Until this week I've never heard anyone complain. I think maybe only in the last week it's become a problem for Novak." Players on the ATP tour have to defend the points they earned during the same week a year earlier, so the reigning champion at an event can only maintain his points tally, not improve it. "Playing three Masters Series finals in a row and winning a 250 event is incredible success and even then you are dropping a spot down in the rankings," Djokovic said on Wednesday. "That shows how cruel the ranking system is in this sport."

Reuters


WOW, can't wait to see Murray give the Djoke some beatings he will never forget.

Andyk028
05-14-2009, 04:57 PM
Right now..Murray

oy vey
05-14-2009, 06:08 PM
Djokovic better all around

veroniquem
05-14-2009, 06:25 PM
They are both excellent but yes Djoko has done better in slams so far. I would give a slight advantage to Murray on hard and to Djoko on clay.

jimbo333
05-15-2009, 04:56 AM
I wouldn't argue that in the past Djokovic was a better player. But that was the past. Murray is now currently the better player for sure. Mentally and Strategically Murray is stronger, and that's what in the end wins matches at the top level!!!

If Murray continues like this, he will be number 2 in the world at some point next year:)

Antonio Puente
05-18-2009, 03:14 PM
I wouldn't argue that in the past Djokovic was a better player. But that was the past. Murray is now currently the better player for sure. Mentally and Strategically Murray is stronger, and that's what in the end wins matches at the top level!!!

You want to rethink that?

IvanAndreevich
05-18-2009, 03:19 PM
My vote goes to Djokovic, but I think it's a little bit too early to tell. Murray has been making quantum leaps.

Clydey2times
05-18-2009, 03:19 PM
You want to rethink that?

Why would he? Murray is the world number 3 and has beaten Djokovic the last 3 times that they played. Your memory doesn't seem to extend beyond the clay court season. Djokovic is the better clay courter and Murray is the better hard court player.

Seriously, people on here are so fickle. You seem to forget that Murray has routined Djokovic 3 times in the last year.

Cesc Fabregas
05-18-2009, 03:19 PM
Djoker has the more exciting game and seems to be a lighter character.

Cesc Fabregas
05-18-2009, 03:20 PM
Why would he? Murray is the world number 3 and has beaten Djokovic the last 3 times that they played. Your memory doesn't seem to extend beyond the clay court season. Djokovic is the better clay courter and Murray is the better hard court player.

Seriously, people on here are so fickle. You seem to forget that Murray has routined Djokovic 3 times in the last year.

Beating someone 7-6 7-6 isn't "routine".

Clydey2times
05-18-2009, 03:24 PM
Beating someone 7-6 7-6 isn't "routine".

The scoreline is deceiving. Djokovic was pretty much beaten and just started swinging for the fences when Murray was serving for the match. The scoreline flattered Djokovic in the Cinci final.

Cesc Fabregas
05-18-2009, 03:25 PM
The scoreline is deceiving. Djokovic was pretty much beaten and just started swinging for the fences when Murray was serving for the match. The scoreline flattered Djokovic in the Cinci final.

I'll take your word for it can't really remember the match.

Antonio Puente
05-18-2009, 03:27 PM
Seriously, people on here are so fickle. You seem to forget that Murray has routined Djokovic 3 times in the last year.

Perhaps you're the fickle one who got too high on a few Masters Series wins and the hardcourt season while currently attempting to selectively ignore the entire clay court season.

Clydey2times
05-18-2009, 03:31 PM
Perhaps you're the fickle one who got too high on a few Masters Series wins and the hardcourt season while currently attempting to selectively ignore the entire clay court season.

Uh, I'm not ignoring the clay court season. Maybe you missed the part where I said Djokovic is the better clay courter. Learn to read.

I'm not basing my opinion on the last month of tennis. It was no secret that Nole plays better on clay and was going to do better during the clay stretch. You, however, are completely ignoring everything prior to the clay, a period in which Murray was streets ahead of Djokovic.

P_Agony
05-18-2009, 03:33 PM
I think it's a bit early to say. Both players will develop their games in the future. Djokovic is clearly the superior clay courter, and I would say they're pretty close on HCs and grass.

Djokovic, however, has something that Murray doesn't - a grand slam title. That alone makes him the more successful player.

Clydey2times
05-18-2009, 03:39 PM
I think it's a bit early to say. Both players will develop their games in the future. Djokovic is clearly the superior clay courter, and I would say they're pretty close on HCs and grass.

Djokovic, however, has something that Murray doesn't - a grand slam title. That alone makes him the more successful player.

He's more successful, but that doesn't mean he's better. Thomas Johansson has a grand slam title, too, but I wouldn't say he's better than a lot of players who don't have one.

I also don't think they are particularly close on hard. Murray has been by far the better player on hard in the last year, while Djokovic has been by far the better clay courter. What I would say is that the difference between them on clay is bigger than it is on hard.

Antonio Puente
05-18-2009, 03:40 PM
You, however, are completely ignoring everything prior to the clay, a period in which Murray was streets ahead of Djokovic.

Well, when does this period of comparison begin and end for you? Djokovic has been much better on clay and just won a slam last year while Murray has yet to win one. So, if you're going with recent history, it's Djokovic, and if you're going with their entire histories, it's Djokovic. But yes, I suppose if you have selectively chosen last fall as your reference point for comparison and end in March, you could go with Murray.

Clydey2times
05-18-2009, 03:46 PM
Well, when does this period of comparison begin and end for you? Djokovic has been much better on clay and just won a slam last year while Murray has yet to win one. So, if you're going with recent history, it's Djokovic, and if you're going with their entire histories, it's Djokovic. But yes, I suppose if you have selectively chosen last fall as your reference point for comparison and end in March, you could go with Murray.

I haven't selectively chosen anything. I'm talking about the last 12 months, which is what the ATP also judges on. The irony is that you want to judge over the last 16 months so that we can include Nole's GS title. You're the one choosing selectively.

I'm saying that Murray has been the better hardcourt player and Nole has been the better clay court player. You can't grasp such a basic concept, though. You have the memory span of a goldfish. You think because Djokovic had a better clay court season that he is now the better player. What about the hard court season? Should we just ignore that because it's inconvenient for your point of view?

Murray has clearly shown that he is now a better hard court player. You can't just gloss over that fact because Djokovic has been better on the clay. You can't just ignore Murray's routine win over Nole in Miami.

P_Agony
05-18-2009, 03:48 PM
He's more successful, but that doesn't mean he's better. Thomas Johansson has a grand slam title, too, but I wouldn't say he's better than a lot of players who don't have one.

I also don't think they are particularly close on hard. Murray has been by far the better player on hard in the last year, while Djokovic has been by far the better clay courter. What I would say is that the difference between them on clay is bigger than it is on hard.

Aren't they close on hard? Sure, Djoko lost the last 3 matches to Murray on HCs, but those matches happenned when Djokovic wasn't exactly playing his AO 2008 tennis.

Djokovic also has HC Masters Series titles to back up his GS - Indian Wells and Canada (not to mention a TMC title in his pocket). I agree Murray had a better HC season since the end of 2008 (with winning Cincy, Madrid, and Miam, USO final), but I wouldn't say yet that he's the overall better HC player. That would be unfair to Djokovic.

On clay, Djoko has reached multiple finals, and won a Masters, where Murray has never gotten close to anything like that.

On grass, none of them has proved to be anything special (I hope it changes this year, I want some variety at Wimbly), so I'd say they're about equal (Djoko with the edge though with reaching Wimbly semis once, and Queens final).

Trust me, I like Murray way more than I do Djokovic (heck, I like almost any player more than I like Djokovic), but credit where credit is due - I think Djokovic has proved to be the better player. As far as talent goes, I think both of them are very talented (Djoko's game more appealing to the eye though I think).

jimbo333
05-18-2009, 03:49 PM
You want to rethink that?

........No

Clydey2times
05-18-2009, 03:53 PM
Aren't they close on hard? Sure, Djoko lost the last 3 matches to Murray on HCs, but those matches happenned when Djokovic wasn't exactly playing his AO 2008 tennis.

Djokovic also has HC Masters Series titles to back up his GS - Indian Wells and Canada (not to mention a TMC title in his pocket). I agree Murray had a better HC season since the end of 2008 (with winning Cincy, Madrid, and Miam, USO final), but I wouldn't say yet that he's the overall better HC player. That would be unfair to Djokovic.

On clay, Djoko has reached multiple finals, and won a Masters, where Murray has never gotten close to anything like that.

On grass, none of them has proved to be anything special (I hope it changes this year, I want some variety at Wimbly), so I'd say they're about equal (Djoko with the edge though with reaching Wimbly semis once, and Queens final).

Trust me, I like Murray way more than I do Djokovic (heck, I like almost any player more than I like Djokovic), but credit where credit is due - I think Djokovic has proved to be the better player. As far as talent goes, I think both of them are very talented (Djoko's game more appealing to the eye though I think).

Well, I'm talking about recent form. In other words, Murray has been much better in the last 12 months on hard, while Djokovic has been miles better on clay. Hell, I think Djokovic has even lost more than twice as many matches this year compared to Murray. Rather than asking who the better player is, it's much easier to judge by their recent form on each surface, since their respective ability on each surface varies.

jimbo333
05-18-2009, 03:55 PM
I haven't selectively chosen anything. I'm talking about the last 12 months, which is what the ATP also judges on. The irony is that you want to judge over the last 16 months so that we can include Nole's GS title. You're the one choosing selectively.

I'm saying that Murray has been the better hardcourt player and Nole has been the better clay court player. You can't grasp such a basic concept, though. You have the memory span of a goldfish. You think because Djokovic had a better clay court season that he is now the better player. What about the hard court season? Should we just ignore that because it's inconvenient for your point of view?

Murray has clearly shown that he is now a better hard court player. You can't just gloss over that fact because Djokovic has been better on the clay. You can't just ignore Murray's routine win over Nole in Miami.

Again, I agree with you:)

The voting on this poll is ridiculous. I've honestly never been a huge Murray fan, but at the moment he is definitely better overall than Djokovic, the ATP agree. Because Federer just beat Nadal is he now better than Nadal, of course not!!!

You can't judge a player just on one match or one or two tournaments or one surface surely:)

Guamanian G
05-18-2009, 03:57 PM
If they meet in RG then Djoko will crush him!
I like the Djokster better all around

adlis
05-18-2009, 03:59 PM
If they meet in RG then Djoko will crush him!
I like the Djokster better all around


MURRAY
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_G9qMaFrDlus/SR5fj9MNqiI/AAAAAAAAAlA/aFsbgz0vT8c/s400/andy-murray.jpg
http://www.abc.net.au/reslib/200904/r357011_1643406.jpg



VS





NOLE
http://i43.tinypic.com/33nb30y.jpg
http://i39.tinypic.com/s12geh.jpg

Antonio Puente
05-18-2009, 04:20 PM
I haven't selectively chosen anything. I'm talking about the last 12 months, which is what the ATP also judges on. The irony is that you want to judge over the last 16 months so that we can include Nole's GS title. You're the one choosing selectively.

Right, and after Murray goes out early in Paris, Djokovic might be back to #3. So, at that point, I assume you will agree that Djokovic is clearly the better player since you're basing your entire opinion on the rankings system.

I'm saying that Murray has been the better hardcourt player and Nole has been the better clay court player. You can't grasp such a basic concept, though. You have the memory span of a goldfish. You think because Djokovic had a better clay court season that he is now the better player. What about the hard court season? Should we just ignore that because it's inconvenient for your point of view?

Wow, you turn into a spoiled baby just like Murray the second anything goes wrong or someone disagrees with you.

Murray has clearly shown that he is now a better hard court player. .

One guy has a slam while one guy subsequently wins a few Masters Series events. The guy with the slam is better until the slamless wonder proves otherwise when it truly matters.

Clydey2times
05-18-2009, 04:26 PM
Right, and after Murray goes out early in Paris, Djokovic might be back to #3. So, at that point, I assume you will agree that Djokovic is clearly the better player since you're basing your entire opinion on the rankings system.



Wow, you turn into a spoiled baby just like Murray the second anything goes wrong or someone disagrees with you.



One guy has a slam while one guy subsequently wins a few Masters Series events. The guy with the slam is better until the slamless wonder proves otherwise when it truly matters.

Like I said, Thomas Johansson also has a slam. I don't consider him a better hardcourt player than Murray, at his peak or on current form.

And that's the key. We're talking about current form. And if Djokovic goes back to number 3, yes he will have proved himself to be the better overall player on current form. However, Murray will still be better on hard on current form.

Quite why you expect Djokovic to go back to number 3 at the French, I do not know. Murray extended his lead in Madrid and is only defending a 3rd round at the French. Djokovic's best chance is at Wimbledon.

egn
05-18-2009, 04:32 PM
Hardcourts they are about equal Murray has been winning as of late but I feel that will change..

Clay this is a no brainer DJokovic easily.

Grass at the moment I give slight edge to Djokvic but neither have been overly impressive on the surface or consistent we will see this year though.

Indoor Toss up.

Overall Djokovic is consistent on more surfaces I mean realistically think about the year when it comes to who can go deep in every tournament that is of note this year who has been talked about more DJokovic or Murray? The answer Djokovic. We have gone through the early hardcourts and clay season and there has not been a tournament where people have said oh Djokovic completely has no chance. There have all ready been easily 3 where people have said Murray has no chance...the clay masters.

Clydey2times
05-18-2009, 04:36 PM
Hardcourts they are about equal Murray has been winning as of late but I feel that will change..

Clay this is a no brainer DJokovic easily.

Grass at the moment I give slight edge to Djokvic but neither have been overly impressive on the surface or consistent we will see this year though.

Indoor Toss up.

Overall Djokovic is consistent on more surfaces I mean realistically think about the year when it comes to who can go deep in every tournament that is of note this year who has been talked about more DJokovic or Murray? The answer Djokovic. We have gone through the early hardcourts and clay season and there has not been a tournament where people have said oh Djokovic completely has no chance. There have all ready been easily 3 where people have said Murray has no chance...the clay masters.

You really aren't painting an accurate picture of their recent hard court abilities. Murray has been clearly superior in the last 12 months on hard.

jimbo333
05-18-2009, 04:46 PM
I have to say this again, because it really does make me laugh:)

A lot of people out there (actually the majority bizarrely) just seem to "think" that Djokovic is better than Murray? If you look at the results over the last year (suely a fair amount of time), he simply isn't!!!

Murray is the better player, at the moment, FACT:)

jimbo333
06-14-2009, 05:14 PM
Do all the people that voted for Djokovic in this poll, still think he is better than Murray?

CountryHillbilly
06-14-2009, 05:21 PM
Murray was good at the same time that Djokovic was bad (late 08 - early 09).

Murray is a little better, since most surfaces are hardcourt.
We'll see who is better on grass in a few weeks.....

jimbo333
06-14-2009, 05:25 PM
Well we've just had a week of grass, and Murray is better so far by quite a long way:)

flying24
06-14-2009, 05:28 PM
Djokovic is without a doubt the superior clay courter right now, despite his dissapointing French. Djokovic is the 3rd best clay courter in the World the last 2 years behind Federer and Nadal. Murray even this year is maybe not even a top 6 clay courter.

However on all other surfaces Murray is right now the better player I feel.

CountryHillbilly
06-14-2009, 05:30 PM
There is one VERY significant detail:

Murray has improved a LOT since last year when he was getting straight-setted by Djoko without much fuss. Better mentality, muscles, fitness,...

Djokovic still doesn't seem to be going anywhere, and that's very annoying for many of his fans. It's doubtful whether he can or wants to improve his game.

flying24
06-14-2009, 05:31 PM
There is one VERY significant detail:

Murray has improved a LOT since last year when he was getting straight-setted by Djoko without much fuss. Better mentality, muscles, fitness,...

Djokovic still doesn't seem to be going anywhere, and that's very annoying for many of his fans. It's doubtful whether he can or wants to improve his game.

I like Djokovic so I hope he can get back on track. What do you think he needs to do?

jimbo333
06-14-2009, 05:31 PM
Djokovic is without a doubt the superior clay courter right now, despite his dissapointing French. Djokovic is the 3rd best clay courter in the World the last 2 years behind Federer and Nadal. Murray even this year is maybe not even a top 6 clay courter.

However on all other surfaces Murray is right now the better player I feel.

Absolutely, a great summary:)

I really don't see how anyone can disagree with this!!!