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View Full Version : Best thing for Nadal is if Federer wins today


King of Aces
05-17-2009, 07:45 AM
Nadal is getting a bit too comfortable.

Rafa needs to fight harder......he has to realize that he is human.

Blinkism
05-17-2009, 07:52 AM
Less pressure on him, too...

Beastforearm
05-17-2009, 07:54 AM
Nadal is getting a bit too comfortable.

Rafa needs to fight harder......he has to realize that he is human.

...:):D:twisted:

raiden031
05-17-2009, 07:55 AM
The only problem with this theory is that both Federer and Djoker know that they can beat Nadal in his current form.

King of Aces
05-17-2009, 08:15 AM
The only problem with this theory is that both Federer and Djoker know that they can beat Nadal in his current form.

Federer has destroyed Rafa on clay before in a best of three.

Rafa is undefeated in a best of five.

charliefedererer
05-17-2009, 08:22 AM
Best thing for Nadal is if Federer wins today
Nadal is getting a bit too comfortable.

Rafa needs to fight harder......he has to realize that he is human.

Yeah.
It was definitely the best thing for Nadal that Federer won today.
The problem is that it was besterer for Federer that he won today.
Hopefully, this will blossum into a real rivalry with more close finals. That is, more like the Evert - Navritalova rivalry than the Sampras - Agassi rivalry.

matchmaker
05-17-2009, 08:25 AM
Well, think we can draw a few conclusions from this clay court season:

- Rafa isn't dominating as he used to. Testimonies of that we find in the matches against Djokovic, who took him at three occasions to the brink of defeat, showing that he has the key to neutralize Nadal. Murray also managed to give him a good test, and today the loss against Federer shows Nadal is not infallible.
- Nadal is making more UE's than normal, only seems to wake up on the really big points.

BUT:
- Is this really relevant?
- Djoker has always given him tight matches
- Fed defeated him in Hamburg two years ago
- He was defeated by Ferrero in Rome last year.
- Nadal still emerged as the champion of RG.

WHY?
- RG is best of five, with one day between each match.
- No one can sustain the level necessary to beat Nadal over 5 sets on clay.
- Djokovic cannot hang in there physically.
- Roger's attacking game is hit or miss and very error prone, not sustainable to win three sets
- Murray still lags behind on clay, although he can be very dangerous on certain days.

WHAT TO EXPECT FOR RG?
- Nadal will win, either with a just enough level, either convincingly just like last year, when he did not a perfect preparation campaign either
- I think this year might be the last of Nadal's utter clay dominance.
- Physically and mentally he is getting tired and finds it more difficult to get focused
- I would not be surprised to see Djokovic, if he works on his physique, win RG in 2010.

Blinkism
05-17-2009, 09:15 AM
I agree with matchmaker.

This win shouldn't change the landscape of clay tennis going into the French Open.

In fact, this is Nadal's best year on clay (only edging out 2007's results because Nadal won 2 extra matches in Davis Cup).

No worries.

Dutch-Guy
05-17-2009, 09:20 AM
The only problem with this theory is that both Federer and Djoker know that they can beat Nadal in his current form.

Yes they can.But i remind you that Rafa played 4 tourneys back to back, which may have effected him too.Nole has more chance to beat Rafa than Fed.

urban
05-17-2009, 09:38 AM
Nobody can hold his top form for 6-7 consecutive weeks. I think, Nadal was never happy with the schedule and conditions of Madrid, but because it was in his own country, he felt the duty to play here. In the whole tournament he played a bit uneasy, while at Rome he played brilliantly on occasion (like in the Soederling match).That Nadal now has a letdown in form, is quite normal and for him good. His goal is top form at RG. The titanic match with Djoko took something out of him, no doubt. Nobody can recover from a 4 hour match within 18 hours. Hopefully he has no worrying injury at his knee. On the surface at RG he will be fine, if he is healthy.

BounceHitBounceHit
05-17-2009, 09:42 AM
Federer has destroyed Rafa on clay before in a best of three.

Rafa is undefeated in a best of five.

Actually, Fed handed Rafa a bagel in the 5th set of the 2007 Hamburg Final. :) BHBH

bizarre_opinion
05-17-2009, 09:43 AM
another joke thread.

matchmaker
05-17-2009, 10:07 AM
Actually, Fed handed Rafa a bagel in the 5th set of the 2007 Hamburg Final. :) BHBH

I am sorry BHBH, but the result of that match was 6-2, 2-6, 6-0, it was a three-setter. Please check your facts before making such statements.

Dutch-Guy
05-17-2009, 10:20 AM
Actually, Fed handed Rafa a bagel in the 5th set of the 2007 Hamburg Final. :) BHBH

Hamburg 07 was a 3 setter:6-2,2-6,0-6.

Gorecki
05-17-2009, 11:06 AM
the best thing for this forum is if *******s shut the hell up and *******s do not get pretensious with this fluke...

alienhamster
05-17-2009, 11:18 AM
Well, think we can draw a few conclusions from this clay court season:

- Rafa isn't dominating as he used to. Testimonies of that we find in the matches against Djokovic, who took him at three occasions to the brink of defeat, showing that he has the key to neutralize Nadal. Murray also managed to give him a good test, and today the loss against Federer shows Nadal is not infallible.
- Nadal is making more UE's than normal, only seems to wake up on the really big points.

BUT:
- Is this really relevant?
- Djoker has always given him tight matches
- Fed defeated him in Hamburg two years ago
- He was defeated by Ferrero in Rome last year.
- Nadal still emerged as the champion of RG.

WHY?
- RG is best of five, with one day between each match.
- No one can sustain the level necessary to beat Nadal over 5 sets on clay.
- Djokovic cannot hang in there physically.
- Roger's attacking game is hit or miss and very error prone, not sustainable to win three sets
- Murray still lags behind on clay, although he can be very dangerous on certain days.

WHAT TO EXPECT FOR RG?
- Nadal will win, either with a just enough level, either convincingly just like last year, when he did not a perfect preparation campaign either
- I think this year might be the last of Nadal's utter clay dominance.
- Physically and mentally he is getting tired and finds it more difficult to get focused
- I would not be surprised to see Djokovic, if he works on his physique, win RG in 2010.

Great analysis! Well-reasoned, too. Wish we could see a trend in more posts like this in this sub-forum, rather than 1000s of flames.

I think on average Fed can't sustain the error-free play he needs to beat Nadal in 3 of 5 sets. But he seemed to find a possible hole today--i.e., DTL shots to Nadal's backhand after opening up to his forehand side on the preceding shot. Fed's inside-in FHs, DTL BHs, and drop shots to that side worked perfectly. Granted, Nadal seemed a bit off on his groundstrokes and wasn't moving as well as normal.

I think the main thing Fed did was stop trying to rally backhand to backhand with Nadal with topspin BHs. That's a recipe for disaster for him.

King of Aces
05-17-2009, 11:47 AM
I am sorry BHBH, but the result of that match was 6-2, 2-6, 6-0, it was a three-setter. Please check your facts before making such statements.

and when it came to the FO Federer I think bageled Nadal in the first set but ended up losing in the best of five.

Its one thing to sustain that level of play for a best of three but to do that for a best of five is an entirely different situation.

King of Aces
05-17-2009, 11:50 AM
Well, think we can draw a few conclusions from this clay court season:

- Rafa isn't dominating as he used to. Testimonies of that we find in the matches against Djokovic, who took him at three occasions to the brink of defeat, showing that he has the key to neutralize Nadal. Murray also managed to give him a good test, and today the loss against Federer shows Nadal is not infallible.
- Nadal is making more UE's than normal, only seems to wake up on the really big points.

BUT:
- Is this really relevant?
- Djoker has always given him tight matches
- Fed defeated him in Hamburg two years ago
- He was defeated by Ferrero in Rome last year.
- Nadal still emerged as the champion of RG.

WHY?
- RG is best of five, with one day between each match.
- No one can sustain the level necessary to beat Nadal over 5 sets on clay.
- Djokovic cannot hang in there physically.
- Roger's attacking game is hit or miss and very error prone, not sustainable to win three sets
- Murray still lags behind on clay, although he can be very dangerous on certain days.

WHAT TO EXPECT FOR RG?
- Nadal will win, either with a just enough level, either convincingly just like last year, when he did not a perfect preparation campaign either
- I think this year might be the last of Nadal's utter clay dominance.
- Physically and mentally he is getting tired and finds it more difficult to get focused
- I would not be surprised to see Djokovic, if he works on his physique, win RG in 2010.

Djkovic gives up too often. In the Nadal match he was breathing heavy in the third st tiebreaker. No way can he last five sets against Nadal.

zagor
05-17-2009, 11:53 AM
Well, think we can draw a few conclusions from this clay court season:

- Rafa isn't dominating as he used to. Testimonies of that we find in the matches against Djokovic, who took him at three occasions to the brink of defeat, showing that he has the key to neutralize Nadal. Murray also managed to give him a good test, and today the loss against Federer shows Nadal is not infallible.
- Nadal is making more UE's than normal, only seems to wake up on the really big points.

BUT:
- Is this really relevant?
- Djoker has always given him tight matches
- Fed defeated him in Hamburg two years ago
- He was defeated by Ferrero in Rome last year.
- Nadal still emerged as the champion of RG.

WHY?
- RG is best of five, with one day between each match.
- No one can sustain the level necessary to beat Nadal over 5 sets on clay.
- Djokovic cannot hang in there physically.
- Roger's attacking game is hit or miss and very error prone, not sustainable to win three sets
- Murray still lags behind on clay, although he can be very dangerous on certain days.

WHAT TO EXPECT FOR RG?
- Nadal will win, either with a just enough level, either convincingly just like last year, when he did not a perfect preparation campaign either
- I think this year might be the last of Nadal's utter clay dominance.
- Physically and mentally he is getting tired and finds it more difficult to get focused
- I would not be surprised to see Djokovic, if he works on his physique, win RG in 2010.

Interesting analysis,I mostly agree but I don't see Djokovic dethroning Nadal at the FO next year.In 2011 maybe but I think Nadal has this year's and next year's FO in the bag.You said it yourself,both Novak and Fed pushed Nadal at Hamburg(which is same as Madrid this year)in the past years and he still won FO.

Last year both Fed and Djokovic had chances against Nadal and pushed him hard in Hamburg yet Nadal still raced to the FO title losing very few games on the way.I don't see that changing much this year and next,maybe after that.

OddJack
05-17-2009, 12:00 PM
How different is the clay at Madrid vs FO? Madrid is faster isnt it

dh003i
05-17-2009, 12:08 PM
Interesting analysis,I mostly agree but I don't see Djokovic dethroning Nadal at the FO next year.In 2011 maybe but I think Nadal has this year's and next year's FO in the bag.You said it yourself,both Novak and Fed pushed Nadal at Hamburg(which is same as Madrid this year)in the past years and he still won FO.

Last year both Fed and Djokovic had chances against Nadal and pushed him hard in Hamburg yet Nadal still raced to the FO title losing very few games on the way.I don't see that changing much this year and next,maybe after that.

For sure Nadal's the favorite, but winning a match never hurts, and losing a match never helps unless a player needs a wakeup call.

matchmaker
05-17-2009, 03:05 PM
and when it came to the FO Federer I think bageled Nadal in the first set but ended up losing in the best of five.

Its one thing to sustain that level of play for a best of three but to do that for a best of five is an entirely different situation.

FWIW, Fed has never bageled Nadal in a FO final, nor been able to take him to five sets. He had his best shot at winning in 2006, when he won the first set 6-1, but lost the second with the same score and ended up losing in four.

In 2007, he also got a set off Nadal, the second, with 6-4, but still lost in four sets.

We all know what happened in 2008.

King of Aces
05-17-2009, 03:30 PM
FWIW, Fed has never bageled Nadal in a FO final, nor been able to take him to five sets. He had his best shot at winning in 2006, when he won the first set 6-1, but lost the second with the same score and ended up losing in four.

In 2007, he also got a set off Nadal, the second, with 6-4, but still lost in four sets.

We all know what happened in 2008.

6-1...sorry.

I never meant that Roger took Rafa to five sets but rather that they played the best of five.