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View Full Version : is roddick the best GRASSCOURT player ever to not win wimbledon


manny pacquiao P4P king
05-19-2009, 09:02 AM
he's won 4 queens club titles, and has beaten wimbledon champions such as agassi and hewitt. has beaten quite a few wimbledon semi finalists like grosjean and ancic.

At the moment - only federer and nadal have a better record than roddick in the last few years (i rate roddick ahead of hewitt on grass - hewitt never had play fed in a wimby final). i consider federer and nadal the best players ever. aside from nadal who has actually beaten fed on the grass - roddick is the only man to have pushed federer far at wimbledon, and who knows, if the rain didn't come then roddick might have won.

i think roddick would have won at least 1 wimbledon in the 90's or 90's grass. im not questioning nadal or hewits win at wimbledon (bcuz it was deserved) but roddick would have also been at a bigger advantage to win wimbledon if the grass was faster. wimbledon is obviously quite fast though.

plz plz plz plz plz dont say that murray is a better GC player than roddick simply because he beat roddick in 06. a one time win on grass isn't evidence for being better than someone on that particular surface

mzzmuaa
05-19-2009, 09:04 AM
murray and djokovic will have no problem neutralizing his serve and attempt at a power game.
they are better GC players and neither of them have won wimbledon.

RoddickAce
05-19-2009, 09:07 AM
murray and djokovic will have no problem neutralizing his serve and attempt at a power game.
they are better GC players and neither of them have won wimbledon.

Back in 2003 and 2004, I think Roddick was a better grass court player than current Murray or Djokovic. Roddick right now doesn't play the same way he did back then.

Rabbit
05-19-2009, 09:09 AM
Actually I think Ken Rosewall was the best grasscourt player to never win Wimbledon with an honorable mention to Ilie Nastase.

tudwell
05-19-2009, 09:44 AM
Rosewall, Wilander, Lendl... definitely not Roddick.

Staiger
05-19-2009, 09:50 AM
Tim Henman -he should have won at least once. It was perfect for S&V .

manny pacquiao P4P king
05-19-2009, 09:54 AM
Tim Henman -he should have won at least once. It was perfect for S&V .

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO you are kiddin me right?????????????????


he got to 4 semi finals..........roddick got to 2 finals a semi and a QF. actually, henman probably was an overachiever on grass, and actually in the context of his whole career

snark
05-19-2009, 09:55 AM
Rosewall, Wilander, Lendl... definitely not Roddick.


Yeah, I would say Lendl. He came so close so many times.

Lsmkenpo
05-19-2009, 09:59 AM
I think so, and still think his best chance at another grandslam is at Wimbledon, he is a better all court player now than ever before.

Cyan
05-19-2009, 10:03 AM
Fed is horrible matchup for him. You cant win Wimby if you cant beat Fed!

380pistol
05-19-2009, 10:33 AM
Hell no!!!!!!!! Not even close. Pancho Gonzales, Ken Rosewall... damn, even Ivan Lendl and Mats Wilander I'd have ahead of him. Is this a serious question??

Well thenagain most assume if not for the pro/open era split both Gonazles and Rosewall would have Wimbledon titles. But that still leaves him behind Lendl and Wilander.

jamesblakefan#1
05-19-2009, 10:38 AM
I think that Roddick's grasscourt resume is vastly overrated. Yeah he made it to two finals, but he never really beat a good, top level player en route to those two finals. And yeah he has the big serve, but that has been broken down over the past few years in his losses. For a guy with a serve as big as his, it just shows how weak his all around game is that he hasn't been able to win Wimbledon. And yes he made it to two finals, but you could argue he got good draws. I think Hewitt would have taken him out, had he been in Roddick's side of the draw. 4 Queens titles is impressive, but he's never beaten a top 10 player at Wimbledon.

http://www.atpworldtour.com/tennis/5/en/players/playerprofiles/playeractivity.asp?query=Singles&year=0&player=R485&selTournament=540&prevtrnnum=0

gj011
05-19-2009, 10:40 AM
is roddick the best GRASSCOURT player ever to not win wimbledon

No. Not even close.

manny pacquiao P4P king
05-19-2009, 10:41 AM
I think that Roddick's grasscourt resume is vastly overrated. Yeah he made it to two finals, but he never really beat a good, top level player en route to those two finals. And yeah he has the big serve, but that has been broken down over the past few years in his losses. For a guy with a serve as big as his, it just shows how weak his all around game is that he hasn't been able to win Wimbledon. And yes he made it to two finals, but you could argue he got good draws. I think Hewitt would have taken him out, had he been in Roddick's side of the draw. 4 Queens titles is impressive, but he's never beaten a top 10 player at Wimbledon.

http://www.atpworldtour.com/tennis/5/en/players/playerprofiles/playeractivity.asp?query=Singles&year=0&player=R485&selTournament=540&prevtrnnum=0


um roddick beat hewitt on grass............

jamesblakefan#1
05-19-2009, 10:51 AM
^^^true, he did beat Hewitt in Queen's. I still think Hewitt would have beaten Roddick at Wimbledon, on the slower grass. Hewitt owned Roddick at his peak, besides that one match. It was 6-1 Hewitt, but Roddick's won the last 3 meetings.

aphex
05-19-2009, 10:55 AM
if you are talking 90s grass...definitely---

he would at least have 3-4 wimbys---hell, even krajicek got one...talk about a weak era dominated by the serve...

karlovic would've got a couple back then...

jamesblakefan#1
05-19-2009, 11:39 AM
But Roddick never played on 90s grass, so we don't know.

stormholloway
05-19-2009, 11:40 AM
Patrick Rafter.

aphex
05-19-2009, 11:42 AM
But Roddick never played on 90s grass, so we don't know.

no, but we can infer...
he has a better serve, forehand and backhand than sampras
his net game is weaker but if he played in a S&V era it would be better (edit: than it is now)

jamesblakefan#1
05-19-2009, 11:49 AM
no, but we can infer...
he has a better serve, forehand and backhand than sampras
his net game is weaker but if he played in a S&V era it would be better (edit: than it is now)

Serve? No, what planet are you on?
FH? At Roddick's peak, maybe, but not today with Roddick's loopy topspin FH.
BH? Neither one was really good, but I think Sampras's superior net game is enough to end the argument. And S&V era? With Agassi & Courier around winning slams, I don't think it was really an era, at least not during the 90s.

35ft6
05-19-2009, 11:54 AM
Roddick is very effective on grass but not sure if I would necessarily call him a great grasscourt player. This may sound counterintuitive but likewise I don't consider Chang a great clay courter despite him having won a French Open. Maybe I'll have to revise my definition at some point, because the grass has really changed in terms of playing characteristics, but guys like Mac, Sampras, Becker, and Fed are who I consider greats on grass.

jamesblakefan#1
05-19-2009, 12:00 PM
^^^Agreed.

Rabbit
05-19-2009, 12:24 PM
Patrick Rafter.

Dang....I had thought of Rafter and was going to post....

Foiled again...

smart_player
05-19-2009, 01:06 PM
Dang....I had thought of Rafter and was going to post....

Foiled again...

yeah rafter i would for sure agree

egn
05-19-2009, 01:24 PM
Open era I always think Wilander
Pre Open era Rosewell and Pancho but those are for reasons like not being able to play wimby.

Open era though Wilander won 2 grass court slams and beat McEnroe on fast grass at Australia which some sources feel was at points faster than wimbledon. He had some mental block in England though. He had convincing victories over top players in his two Australian Open runs on grass..it is kind of sad.

Though Rafter is my close second as he lost to the man on fire twice..Sampras and than Goran.

egn
05-19-2009, 01:28 PM
murray and djokovic will have no problem neutralizing his serve and attempt at a power game.
they are better GC players and neither of them have won wimbledon.

oh god..mind you roddick is 28 not 23 anymore and they are 22..gosh and doesn't djokovic get his *** handed to him by roddick as of late?

Leublu tennis
05-19-2009, 02:12 PM
Ever?? I was hoping that this was a poll so I could just safely say "no".

Jchurch
05-19-2009, 02:14 PM
Back in 2003 and 2004, I think Roddick was a better grass court player than current Murray or Djokovic. Roddick right now doesn't play the same way he did back then.

Agreed. His forehand now just looks like it must hurt. That forehand in the 2004 Wimbledon final was amazing.

tintin
05-19-2009, 03:01 PM
hell to the NO!

Gorecki
05-19-2009, 03:29 PM
lets forget Rafter, Rosewall, Wilander, Lendl, Tanner...

and pretend tennis was invented by early 2000's

petetheileet
05-19-2009, 03:55 PM
Id say rafter...

he was a chance at winning both of his finals

Madhoshi22
05-19-2009, 03:56 PM
I wouldn't even consider a real GC player...
He used brute force in 04/05, no real thought to his play. Don't get me wrong, he had an enormous serve, but that seemed to be the only thing he showed a slight idea of knowing how to use on grass. Other than that, his volleys are sub-par at best, groundies are average, I definitely wouldn't consider him the best GC player not to win Wimby.

JeMar
05-19-2009, 04:38 PM
No. Not even close.

I'm with gj011 on this one.

RoddickAce
05-19-2009, 04:42 PM
I'm sure Ivanisevic is glad he managed to avoid being nominated in this thread. Had he not won Wimbledon at the last moments of his career, I would seriously consider him the best grasscourt player never to win Wimbledon.

GameSampras
05-19-2009, 04:49 PM
Roddick the best? Hell I thought Rafter looked better on grass than Roddick. Roddick a "great" grass courter? Great Grass court players would have at least one Wimbeldon to their resume

S H O W S T O P P E R !
05-19-2009, 05:14 PM
I think he got robbed. If the grass wasn't slowed at Wimbeldon, Roddick's service at it's prime could have won him one, maybe even 2 Wimby's.

Roddick the best? Hell I thought Rafter looked better on grass than Roddick. Roddick a "great" grass courter? Great Grass court players would have at least one Wimbeldon to their resume

Federer never won RG, does that mean he sucks on clay?

GameSampras
05-19-2009, 05:29 PM
I think he got robbed. If the grass wasn't slowed at Wimbeldon, Roddick's service at it's prime could have won him one, maybe even 2 Wimby's.



Federer never won RG, does that mean he sucks on clay?


No he doesnt suck but I certainly dont think Fed is "great" on clay by any means regardless of his RG final slam appearances. But lets look at his road to get to the finals every year. Its Pretty lame. . Certainly not among the best clay courters ever. Fed is definitely a good solid dirtballer though. You could name 15 better clay court players in history over Fed IMO

jamesblakefan#1
05-19-2009, 05:30 PM
I think he got robbed. If the grass wasn't slowed at Wimbeldon, Roddick's service at it's prime could have won him one, maybe even 2 Wimby's.

He got robbed? Great players adapt to all surfaces, all speeds, and don't just win because of one weapon. Great players adapt. (Ex. Nadal, Federer) Roddick has played on the slower grass for the past 5-6 yrs, he should have adapted a more all around game to win a Wimbledon, instead of relying so much on his serve. That is why he has never won Wimbledon. He is not an all around great player.

manny pacquiao P4P king
05-19-2009, 10:20 PM
He got robbed? Great players adapt to all surfaces, all speeds, and don't just win because of one weapon. Great players adapt. (Ex. Nadal, Federer) Roddick has played on the slower grass for the past 5-6 yrs, he should have adapted a more all around game to win a Wimbledon, instead of relying so much on his serve. That is why he has never won Wimbledon. He is not an all around great player.

you shouldn't have to be a great all around player to win wimbledon - well, you do now as its green clay

jamesblakefan#1
05-19-2009, 10:25 PM
So you're admitting that Roddick's a one trick pony?

helloworld
05-19-2009, 10:25 PM
if you are talking 90s grass...definitely---

he would at least have 3-4 wimbys---hell, even krajicek got one...talk about a weak era dominated by the serve...

karlovic would've got a couple back then...

Is this the most pathetic post ever or what? Do you think Roddick will have a chance against Pete Sampras in the 90s? He can't even beat Federer. How the hell is he going to beat prime Sampras at Wimbledon? :confused::confused:

380pistol
05-19-2009, 10:45 PM
Roddick the best? Hell I thought Rafter looked better on grass than Roddick. Roddick a "great" grass courter? Great Grass court players would have at least one Wimbeldon to their resume

Uh huh... yeah. Rafter > Roddick on grass. People talking about if it wasn't for Fed, well in the 90's Roddick sees Agassi and doesn't see the final.

380pistol
05-19-2009, 10:47 PM
no, but we can infer...
he has a better serve, forehand and backhand than sampras
his net game is weaker but if he played in a S&V era it would be better (edit: than it is now)

Roddick's serve, forehand and backhand superioer to Sampras'?? On what planet?? Mars??? What are you on???

Leave Tina alone!!!!!!!!!!!!!

joeri888
05-19-2009, 10:48 PM
if you are talking 90s grass...definitely---

he would at least have 3-4 wimbys---hell, even krajicek got one...talk about a weak era dominated by the serve...

karlovic would've got a couple back then...

Krajicek was a great player. He was one of the good serve and volleyers of his time, and his forehand was good as well. There's nothing wrong with serve& volley. Besides, the guy beat Pete Sampras on his way to win it as well, which is not just 'some guy' on grass

manny pacquiao P4P king
05-20-2009, 07:54 AM
Uh huh... yeah. Rafter > Roddick on grass. People talking about if it wasn't for Fed, well in the 90's Roddick sees Agassi and doesn't see the final.

roddick's only win against AA came on grass

MethodTennis
05-20-2009, 09:02 AM
out of players still playing on the atp at their peak he is the best not to win it but if djock and murray keep improvin his 03/04 ability will be no where near as good as theres and lendl never won wimbeldon

Grampy
05-20-2009, 09:05 AM
Lendl > Roddick by far.

MethodTennis
05-20-2009, 09:08 AM
Lendl > Roddick by far.

ye roddick would get his BACKSIDE kicked off of lendl

380pistol
05-20-2009, 10:35 AM
roddick's only win against AA came on grass

And your point wuld be....??? You mean 7-6 in the 3rd (an 8-6 tie break) vs 33 yr old Agassi. Is Roddick going to beat Agassi at his peak at SW19?? I mean name the the 20 players Roddick has beaten at Wimbledon.

devila
05-21-2009, 12:10 AM
I think that Roddick's grasscourt resume is vastly overrated. Yeah he made it to two finals, but he never really beat a good, top level player en route to those two finals. And yeah he has the big serve, but that has been broken down over the past few years in his losses. For a guy with a serve as big as his, it just shows how weak his all around game is that he hasn't been able to win Wimbledon. And yes he made it to two finals, but you could argue he got good draws. I think Hewitt would have taken him out, had he been in Roddick's side of the draw. 4 Queens titles is impressive, but he's never beaten a top 10 player at Wimbledon.Your precious Blake thanked him. He needed a fat Roddick who struggled on every surface, to move and serve precisely against every opponent, not just Federer. You conveniently left out Federer's easy Halle draws and crap draws on hardcourts and clay. Hewitt, Clement, Stepanek and Ferrero embarrassed Federer and Nadal too. Soderling and Rochus choked badly against Fed on grass courts, as Roddick did. Since 2006, Roddick cancelled matches with severe injuries and bulimic symptoms.

Joseph L. Barrow
05-21-2009, 09:55 AM
No, not "the" best, but he's in the top 10, maybe top five.

CyBorg
05-21-2009, 10:01 AM
Rafter, Lendl, Tanner come to mind as good ones as well. Mecir and Henman were good too, but never made the final at Wimbledon.

Ignoring obvious ones like Rosewall of course.

Nadal_Freak
05-21-2009, 10:02 AM
Roddick took advantage of a weak field in Queen's. He's not that great on grass. I actually think Roddick is better on hardcourts.

tonyg11
05-21-2009, 10:03 AM
Rafter for sure

West Coast Ace
05-21-2009, 10:28 AM
Guessing the OP is real young. As many have mentioned there are a number of guys who Roddick couldn't carry their 'grass court jock strap'. Roddick's serve has been figured out by a lot of players - he's not blowing people off fast courts like he did early in his career. The Queens wins are tainted because a lot of the top players aren't there.

jamesblakefan#1
05-21-2009, 11:24 AM
Your precious Blake thanked him. He needed a fat Roddick who struggled on every surface, to move and serve precisely against every opponent, not just Federer. You conveniently left out Federer's easy Halle draws and crap draws on hardcourts and clay. Hewitt, Clement, Stepanek and Ferrero embarrassed Federer and Nadal too. Soderling and Rochus choked badly against Fed on grass courts, as Roddick did. Since 2006, Roddick cancelled matches with severe injuries and bulimic symptoms.

You make no sense. That is all.

viduka0101
05-21-2009, 11:31 AM
Your precious Blake thanked him. He needed a fat Roddick who struggled on every surface, to move and serve precisely against every opponent, not just Federer. You conveniently left out Federer's easy Halle draws and crap draws on hardcourts and clay. Hewitt, Clement, Stepanek and Ferrero embarrassed Federer and Nadal too. Soderling and Rochus choked badly against Fed on grass courts, as Roddick did. Since 2006, Roddick cancelled matches with severe injuries and bulimic symptoms.

I'm sorry,what?:confused:

Cfidave
05-21-2009, 02:51 PM
Roddick has a huge serve, that's it. Tell me what else this guy has that makes him such a great grass court player? You going to call him a great grass court player based on one stroke? He is, and always will be a one trick pony. Roddick is not near the same talent as a Sampras, Federer, Jmac, Rafter, and other true grass court greats.

wihamilton
05-21-2009, 03:09 PM
Patrick Rafter.

I agree 10 char

thejoe
05-21-2009, 04:10 PM
Henman or Rafter.

devila
05-21-2009, 10:09 PM
Agreed.

Also, I think Hewitt has won 4 Queens titles.

But atleast he won Wimbledon once..
His cakewalk draws were almost as easy as Federer's Halle and Wimbledon draws.
How do you blow people off the court when your matches last 2-5 hours?
Without his physical strength, Federer wouldn't be a top 10 player. Look what happened to Blake.
His fan requires endless education to find a clue about Roddick. Huh, what, duhhh.:oops:

jamesblakefan#1
05-21-2009, 10:23 PM
What a cheapshot. Don't bring others down just because Roddick is finally being called out for being an overrated grass courter. You talk about one thing and then go onto a completely different topic, that's why no one understands you. The point is, I proved that your guy Roddick's overrated on grass, without even bringing up the beatdown my guy Blake put on him a few yrs ago in Queens.

devila
05-21-2009, 11:10 PM
Federer was crying over the Olympics.
Roddick must worry about Blake not winning again for the Davis Cup team. He sure learned how to massively tank Olympic, DC grass ties and Slam matches from his gentlemanly hero Blake.

manny pacquiao P4P king
05-22-2009, 01:03 AM
What a cheapshot. Don't bring others down just because Roddick is finally being called out for being an overrated grass courter. You talk about one thing and then go onto a completely different topic, that's why no one understands you. The point is, I proved that your guy Roddick's overrated on grass, without even bringing up the beatdown my guy Blake put on him a few yrs ago in Queens.

blake beat roddick when blake was at his best and roddick at his worst

roddick - blake H2H 6-2