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Grover Sparkman
06-02-2009, 09:40 AM
My best friend's fiance wants to join our 2.5 mixed-doubles team. We're in our mid-20's. She went through the NTRP ratings process, and listed that she played two years of tennis in her freshman and sophomore year of high school. She was given a 3.0 rating despite not playing in over 10 years. I've played with her before, and she's definitely a 2.5 skill-wise.

She's going to appeal her rating, but I'm wondering if it's a lost cause. I don't think the appeal will be processed in time to join this league, but there's another mixed doubles league later in the summer that I'm probably going to join. Does she have a good chance of winning her appeal, or will they see that she played two years of competitive tennis in high school over 10 years ago and say that she is too good for 2.5?

herrburgess
06-02-2009, 09:45 AM
My best friend's fiance wants to join our 2.5 mixed-doubles team. We're in our mid-20's. She went through the NTRP ratings process, and listed that she played two years of tennis in her freshman and sophomore year of high school. She was given a 3.0 rating despite not playing in over 10 years. I've played with her before, and she's definitely a 2.5 skill-wise.

She's going to appeal her rating, but I'm wondering if it's a lost cause. I don't think the appeal will be processed in time to join this league, but there's another mixed doubles league later in the summer that I'm probably going to join. Does she have a good chance of winning her appeal, or will they see that she played two years of competitive tennis in high school over 10 years ago and say that she is too good for 2.5?

I'm nearly 100% certain it's a cost cause. If you ever played high school tennis you cannot self-rate lower than 3.0.

herrburgess
06-02-2009, 09:46 AM
sorry, "lost" cause

kylebarendrick
06-02-2009, 10:01 AM
One issue with 2.5 is that people who work at tennis will quickly advance beyond the 2.5 level. Speaking generically, someone who played in high school but took a decade off afterwards may be a 2.5 now, but would likely be 3.0/3.5 soon after they start playing regularly again.

innoVAShaun
06-02-2009, 10:04 AM
You can try going through local and district area coordinators. If they grant it, you're in luck. If not, I'd take the 3 years off USTA and re-rate and say no tennis experience to the questionaire.

There's always combo leagues. you guys would be able to play mixed 5.5 together.

vandre
06-02-2009, 10:16 AM
My best friend's fiance wants to join our 2.5 mixed-doubles team. We're in our mid-20's. She went through the NTRP ratings process, and listed that she played two years of tennis in her freshman and sophomore year of high school. She was given a 3.0 rating despite not playing in over 10 years. I've played with her before, and she's definitely a 2.5 skill-wise.

She's going to appeal her rating, but I'm wondering if it's a lost cause. I don't think the appeal will be processed in time to join this league, but there's another mixed doubles league later in the summer that I'm probably going to join. Does she have a good chance of winning her appeal, or will they see that she played two years of competitive tennis in high school over 10 years ago and say that she is too good for 2.5?


this is definately not a lost cause.

because i played d3 tennis in college and didn't pick up a racquet for 10+ years, the comp automatically rated me as a 4.0 and wouldn't let me register for a 3.5 men's league. i got a teaching pro and the league coord. in on it and had the appeal successfully pushed through in about a week. tell her she needs to get the pros who've seen her play involved.

Kostas
06-02-2009, 10:19 AM
I don't see how anyone who played two years of high school could ever be a 2.5 again.

A 2.5 player is really, really bad. It would take a catostrophic event for this to happen imo.

kylebarendrick
06-02-2009, 10:26 AM
You can try going through local and district area coordinators. If they grant it, you're in luck. If not, I'd take the 3 years off USTA and re-rate and say no tennis experience to the questionaire.

FWIW lying on the questionaire would give opponents a sure win if they file a grievance.

OrangePower
06-02-2009, 10:46 AM
this is definately not a lost cause.

because i played d3 tennis in college and didn't pick up a racquet for 10+ years, the comp automatically rated me as a 4.0 and wouldn't let me register for a 3.5 men's league. i got a teaching pro and the league coord. in on it and had the appeal successfully pushed through in about a week. tell her she needs to get the pros who've seen her play involved.

And how did you do that first season at 3.5?

Just curious since I was in a very similar position... but decided to self rate as 4.0 anyway despite some pressure from a friend who was captaining a 3.5 team and wanted to recruit me. And I'm glad I did... I went 5-7 that first season; not exactly dominating but still respectable. And I think enjoyed it far more than if I had played 3.5.

innoVAShaun
06-02-2009, 10:59 AM
FWIW lying on the questionaire would give opponents a sure win if they file a grievance.

If they're already in the system, yes.

If I was on a high school tennis team my last 2 years in school, on a team that went 0-11, individual record of 1-10 in doubles 2-9 in singles. I am no 3.0.

^^^Thats exactly what we wrote to our area coordinators.

Zero tennis experience it is.


Example of being in the system:
My boy that played tennis on a national level as a junior and has a few national tournaments under his belt, tried to self rate with "no experience," got rated 5.5.

Cindysphinx
06-02-2009, 11:19 AM
If you lie on the questionnaire about your past, you had better be sure that *no one* will ever recognize you. My understanding that lying about verifiable facts to get a lower rating is a nice way to get suspended for a good long time. Rumor has it that a lady who played for Baylor self-rated at 3.0 (and allegedly registered on TennisLink with an unusual spelling of her name). She was busted when someone recognized her.

Regarding OP's question, I wouldn't have this person self-rate at 2.5. I started as a 2.5. People at that level have *no* strokes at all. Zero. Someone who played in high school will have form that resembles actual strokes and will stick out like a sore thumb.

I do not know if the computer is calibrated to DQ people at 2.5 more than at other levels, but I think it may be. I have seen many DQ's at the 2.5 level and one double-bump. So your friend would be taking a big risk.

Lastly, she can appeal if she wants. I filed such an appeal for a lady who wanted to be on our 3.5 team. She had played at Maryland but had taken a lot of time off and was candid that her fitness and weight weren't what they once were. I played with her myself, and I knew she was not 4.0. I personally wrote to the USTA person in charge of appeals, and the appeal was denied. Last I heard, she played combo as a 4.0 and did not do well at all. Trouble is, combo doesn't count for ratings, so she is still a self-rated 4.0 and may be trapped there indefinitely, as no 4.0 team will take her because she can't play at a 4.0 level.

Jim A
06-02-2009, 11:29 AM
I'd be shocked if the local section granted this appeal since if she had any sort of tennis play at all during those 2 years, she'll be back in the groove quicker than later

I would also think that the core of you @ 2.5 would be 3.0 soon enough as its typically a quick bump

innoVAShaun
06-02-2009, 01:36 PM
If USTA Googles you and finds out you played competitive tennis, your stuck with your rating.

raiden031
06-02-2009, 01:42 PM
Why would someone in their 20s and with 2 years of HS tennis want to rate at 2.5? That seems like a big waste of time.

Cindysphinx
06-02-2009, 01:44 PM
I'd guess to be able to play 6.0 mixed with a guy who is 3.5, especially if her skills and his skills don't add up to 7.0.

cak
06-02-2009, 01:45 PM
I played tennis in a not particularly competitive high school, not at the top of my team, only one year of varsity, and that year I played at last doubles. Then I gave up tennis for 20 years. Registered as a 2.5 per my pro's suggestion. Went undefeated. I shouldn't have been a 2.5. If she's out hitting balls once a week between now and August she will be a 3.0.

raiden031
06-02-2009, 01:49 PM
I'd guess to be able to play 6.0 mixed with a guy who is 3.5, especially if her skills and his skills don't add up to 7.0.

The OP said 2.5 mixed, which I think is probably more accurately 5.0 mixed.

zebano
06-03-2009, 06:39 AM
I was under the impression that right now appeals down .5 levels were being automatically granted... Maybe I heard wrong or it only applies to people who have been bumped recently but my buddy successfully appealed down from 4.0 to 3.5. That said, 2.5 is pretty bad I doubt with any high school experience this is where he is after playing twice.

raiden031
06-03-2009, 06:47 AM
I was under the impression that right now appeals down .5 levels were being automatically granted... Maybe I heard wrong or it only applies to people who have been bumped recently but my buddy successfully appealed down from 4.0 to 3.5. That said, 2.5 is pretty bad I doubt with any high school experience this is where he is after playing twice.

The appeal is only granted automatically if you are appealing a year-end rating in which you are within 0.05 of the boundary (0.10 of boundary if senior). Appealing a rating that was given as a result of the self-rating questionaire is not automatic.

Cindysphinx
06-03-2009, 08:04 AM
The OP said 2.5 mixed, which I think is probably more accurately 5.0 mixed.

Does 5.0 mixed even exist? I've never heard of anything lower than 6.0 mixed.

Raiden.Kaminari
06-04-2009, 02:22 PM
If USTA Googles you and finds out you played competitive tennis, your stuck with your rating.

You don't even have to google. As Cindysphinx mentioned, if anyone recognizes you were on a high school team, a self-rating grievance will be upheld. Captains can be suspended as well as the player.

2.5 is normally reserved for players with little or no experience. If you self-rate 3.0 and are bumped down to 2.5, then you are a legitimate 2.5 player.

However, rating at 2.5 just to win, that's just simply cheating. The NTRP was created so that players of equal level could play with each other and be competitive. That's what tennis is supposed to be. Competitive, regardless of winning or losing.

Jim A
06-05-2009, 12:07 PM
The NTRP was also created with a range of 1.0 to 7.0, however the USTA and most of its players seem to believe there are 3.0/3.5/4.0 with lesser 4.5./5.0 options

I don't even know if we have a 2.5 option in my district, I would say that 2.5 league shouldn't be out there. Have some 2.5 events and tournaments, with a quick bump for those doing well