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View Full Version : Definitive position on Rafa withdrawing and the draw


batz
06-18-2009, 03:09 PM
http://www.itftennis.com/shared/medialibrary/pdf/original/IO_38630_original.PDF

Page 31 refers in your PDF browser refers, page 24 in the document.

If Rafa withdraws after draw is made but before Monday's OOP is issued then Juan Martin Del Potro gets the number 1 spot in the draw. After the OOP and it's a LL.

rhubarb
06-18-2009, 03:19 PM
Interesting! It appears that some of my previous posts were slightly erroneous, as they've modified the rule to include a special procedure for the withdrawl of a top 4 seed; sorry about that. (Admittedly I last read it a couple of years ago.)

So this is the relevant bit:

Any vacancy created by the withdrawal of a seed prior to the
release of the Order of Play for the first day of Main Draw shall
be filled as follows:
- If the withdrawal is among seeds 1 to 4, the 5th seed is
moved into then open position, the 5th position shall be filled
by the 17th seed, and the 17th position shall be filled by the
next highest ranked player eligible to be seeded.
- If the withdrawal is among seeds 5 to 16, the 17th seed is
moved into the open position and the 17th position shall be
filled by the next highest ranked player eligible to be
seeded.
- If the withdrawal is among seeds 17 to 32 it shall be filled
by the next highest ranked player eligible to be seeded.
The position vacated by that next highest ranked player shall
then be filled by the next player on the original entry list if prior
to the commencement of the Qualifying competition or by the
eligible Lucky Loser if after the commencement of the
Qualifying competition.

Any vacancy created by the withdrawal of a seed which occurs
after the release of the Order of Play for the first day of the
Main Draw shall be filled by eligible Lucky Losers.

batz
06-18-2009, 03:22 PM
Interesting! It appears that some of my previous posts were slightly erroneous, as they've modified the rule to include a special procedure for the withdrawl of a top 4 seed; sorry about that. (Admittedly I last read it a couple of years ago.)

So this is the relevant bit:

No need for apologies mate - was an honest mistake.

malakas
06-18-2009, 03:31 PM
thanx very much batz for this info!:)
And rhubarb too good job,you're very knowledgable poster!:D
I think this rule makes more sense and will lead to much more balanced draws.

ChanceEncounter
06-18-2009, 03:36 PM
Hmm, so the beneficiary of this could be Del Potro?

Is it a coincidence that Del Potro is a big Federer fan?

Conspiracy theorists, go!

gj011
06-18-2009, 03:57 PM
Thanks for the info.
Not fair to the #2, #3 and #4 seeds, but that is life.

batz
06-18-2009, 04:03 PM
Thanks for the info.
Not fair to the #2, #3 and #4 seeds, but that is life.


I agree that it might've been nice to allow some pragmatism, but those are the rules; everyone just has to get on with it.

dh003i
06-18-2009, 04:48 PM
Does it really matter? There isn't a significant difference between #1 and #2 seedings.

RoddickAce
06-18-2009, 05:06 PM
Does it really matter? There isn't a significant difference between #1 and #2 seedings.

But there is a difference between #2 and #3. If everyone moved up one spot, then Murray will be guarenteed not to meet Fed until the finals.

JennyS
06-18-2009, 05:22 PM
But there is a difference between #2 and #3. If everyone moved up one spot, then Murray will be guarenteed not to meet Fed until the finals.

The crap will hit the fan in the UK if Murray winds up in Roger's half. I have a feeling he will:P

veroniquem
06-18-2009, 05:25 PM
The crap will hit the fan in the UK if Murray winds up in Roger's half. I have a feeling he will:P
Why? I actually feel that it would be easier (relatively of course) for Murray to beat Fed in the semi than in the final.

JennyS
06-18-2009, 05:31 PM
Why? I actually feel that it would be easier (relatively of course) for Murray to beat Fed in the semi than in the final.

True. Then again, they'd probably prefer him to play Del Potro or Djokovic in the semis since neither player has ever been to a Wimbledon final.

And I know Murray has a great record against Roger, but as many have pointed out, beating Roger in a best of 5 match is a different animal.

veroniquem
06-18-2009, 05:48 PM
True. Then again, they'd probably prefer him to play Del Potro or Djokovic in the semis since neither player has ever been to a Wimbledon final.

And I know Murray has a great record against Roger, but as many have pointed out, beating Roger in a best of 5 match is a different animal.
Murray got a practice session in USO 2008. I'm sure he will do better the second time! On hard at least, I still have my doubts about Murray and grass but the Queen's win is encouraging...

JennyS
06-18-2009, 06:00 PM
Murray got a practice session in USO 2008. I'm sure he will do better the second time! On hard at least, I still have my doubts about Murray and grass but the Queen's win is encouraging...

And Murray is going to be under so much pressure. It's going to be worse than Henmania! All of those fans camped out on Murray Mountain screaming "COME ON ANDY" and going crazy over every point. Can't wait:)

egn
06-18-2009, 06:08 PM
That is good to know, makes things even more interesting as now Murray might want to not be on Fed's side and get the super cakewalk to the finals and than beat Fed there instead of risking chance at losing to him in the semis.

christo
06-18-2009, 06:49 PM
Ha , Ha , Ha, all you Murray lovers are going to be crying in your Guiness. It's a joke, you think Rog is gonna let a punk like Murray set the tone at Wimbledon? Murray has to get there first, let alone win it. The field at these grass court warm ups has been pathetic and that's being gracious. At this point Haas could be in the final so don't give me any **** about Murray

batz
06-19-2009, 02:38 AM
Ha , Ha , Ha, all you Murray lovers are going to be crying in your Guiness. It's a joke, you think Rog is gonna let a punk like Murray set the tone at Wimbledon? Murray has to get there first, let alone win it. The field at these grass court warm ups has been pathetic and that's being gracious. At this point Haas could be in the final so don't give me any **** about Murray

Maybe - if he gets drawn in Roger's half and doesn't choke this time ;)

gj011
06-19-2009, 11:27 AM
This thread deserves a bump now.

So if this is correct, Del Potro (#5 seed) is taking Nadal's spot in the draw, Blake i(#17 seed) s taking Del Potro's spot, I think Kiefer (highest ranked unseeded player) is taking Blake's spot as a seed, and LL (not sure who) is taking Kiefer's spot.

forehand_dude
06-19-2009, 11:37 AM
Huge break for Blake. He should coast into the final 16 now.

bumfluff
06-19-2009, 11:44 AM
What I want to know now is how this will affect the order of play. I am going on the Friday of the first week and I had assumed I would be watching Nadal. But now I guess I will either see Murray or Federer as they are in opposite halfs of the draw, it depends on which one is playing Monday, Wednesday, Friday.

Arafel
06-19-2009, 12:02 PM
That's stupid; either fill it with a LL or redo the draw. How do they justify moving up the 17 seed to the 5 position? DelPotro hasn't done squat on grass; move him to no 1?

If Roddick had been the no 5 seed, (as he should have been I think, based on prior results on grass vs Del Potro), then this might have made sense. Then you'd have Roddick, Murray, Djokovic, and Federer as the top four seeds.

tacou
06-20-2009, 03:48 PM
why doesn't #9 take #5 spot?

vive le beau jeu !
06-21-2009, 07:21 AM
Interesting! It appears that some of my previous posts were slightly erroneous, as they've modified the rule to include a special procedure for the withdrawl of a top 4 seed; sorry about that. (Admittedly I last read it a couple of years ago.)

So this is the relevant bit:
Any vacancy created by the withdrawal of a seed prior to the
release of the Order of Play for the first day of Main Draw shall
be filled as follows:
- If the withdrawal is among seeds 1 to 4, the 5th seed is
moved into then open position, the 5th position shall be filled
by the 17th seed, and the 17th position shall be filled by the
next highest ranked player eligible to be seeded.- If the withdrawal is among seeds 5 to 16, the 17th seed is
moved into the open position and the 17th position shall be
filled by the next highest ranked player eligible to be
seeded.
- If the withdrawal is among seeds 17 to 32 it shall be filled
by the next highest ranked player eligible to be seeded.
The position vacated by that next highest ranked player shall
then be filled by the next player on the original entry list if prior
to the commencement of the Qualifying competition or by the
eligible Lucky Loser if after the commencement of the
Qualifying competition.

Any vacancy created by the withdrawal of a seed which occurs
after the release of the Order of Play for the first day of the
Main Draw shall be filled by eligible Lucky Losers.
why doesn't #9 take #5 spot?
i'm wondering the same... that doesn't sound very logical. http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/images/icons/icon13.gif
they rearrange the top4 spots, the top16, the top32... but not the top8 ?! :?
is there any justification for that ?

tacou
06-23-2009, 05:57 PM
if anyone has any clue that'd be cool