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View Full Version : Strength of Schedule in ATP points


NotAtTheNet
06-23-2009, 12:36 PM
Should the ATP adopt a strength of schedule type calculation in their ATP points? Jesse Levine for example should get more points than just passing the 1st round for his improbably victory over safin... I think this would level the playing field a bit for up and comers.

akv89
06-23-2009, 12:45 PM
I recall that one of the posters on this board last year applied to tennis the ELO ranking system used for Chess tournaments, where the ranking points that a person gains or loses in the match depends on the opponent's ranking. I haven't seen any posts from that poster recently, but that might be something similar to what you are talking about.

Max G.
06-23-2009, 03:28 PM
WTA used to do that, I believe - bonus points based on the rankings of the people you beat.

I've got no opinion on it, not sure it would change all that much.

tacou
06-23-2009, 04:00 PM
I think there should be some sort of bonus, not necessarily points but maybe a protected entry for the tournament next year.

however, safin is only the 14th seed, 20-something in the world and soon to be in the 70s, so I'm not sure that would warrant anything too special.

jamesblakefan#1
06-23-2009, 05:01 PM
I agree w/ this. For instance, making the semis through a cakewalk draw (i.e Schuettler last yr, though he beat Blake), shouldn't be the same amt as Safin's run, where he beat Djokovic. Bonus points, say +100 for top 5 win, +50 for top 6-10 win, something like that

kanamit
06-23-2009, 05:31 PM
The suggestion kind of doesnt make sense. Tournaments are already weighted in terms of difficulty with the MS 1000, 500, 250. If you play more tournaments, especially tournaments at the highest 1000 level where top players are required to participate, you have the benefit of possibly earning more points. So I don't see how what we have right now isn't taking difficulty into consideration already.

kanamit
06-23-2009, 05:33 PM
I agree w/ this. For instance, making the semis through a cakewalk draw (i.e Schuettler last yr, though he beat Blake), shouldn't be the same amt as Safin's run, where he beat Djokovic. Bonus points, say +100 for top 5 win, +50 for top 6-10 win, something like that

But who determines a cakewalk draw? Basing it only on rakings could be unfair, because players often play well above their rankings depending on whether they are in form and the surface. Remember how Federer's draw at the FO was supposedly a cakewalk according to some posters. Then each "cakewalk" player proceeded to play out of their minds with the exception of Martin, Mathieu, and Monfils.

jamesblakefan#1
06-23-2009, 05:40 PM
Well, I'm a proponent of surface specific seedings, but that's a whole other issue.

This would mean a win over Nadal on clay would earn more than a win over Nadal on HC. It's probably too complicated to be realisically and fairly implemented, but it would be cool to have something like this.

tacou
06-23-2009, 05:58 PM
it could only be done based on rankings, and someone like Federer obviously wouldn't be able to benefit from it.

vive le beau jeu !
06-24-2009, 12:09 AM
I agree w/ this. For instance, making the semis through a cakewalk draw (i.e Schuettler last yr, though he beat Blake), shouldn't be the same amt as Safin's run, where he beat Djokovic. Bonus points, say +100 for top 5 win, +50 for top 6-10 win, something like that
there were bonus points before... they stopped awarding it when they created the race, i think (until 1999... or maybe only until 1998 ?).
it was a relatively good idea, despire some inconvenients (for instance, sometimes you could not defend all your points even if you defended successfully your title, bonus was debatable in case of early retirement, etc.)

Andres
06-24-2009, 04:20 AM
it could only be done based on rankings, and someone like Federer obviously wouldn't be able to benefit from it.
Why would he?
What has more merit? A guy like Roko Karanusic ranked #110 beating a high seed like Andy Murray or Federer or Nadal, or Nadal/Fed/Murray beating #128 Mannarino?

I agree, a bonus would make the tour more competitive, would make an upset even more important, and higher ranked players would BOTHER beating lesser ranked players in order to prevent their rankings.

joeri888
06-24-2009, 04:28 AM
Draw's even out over the course of a season. of course it's a little different for Levine, but if he's better than his ranking he should win challengers as well. This way you'll already always end up with the ranking you deserve, so no problem. if it ain't broken, don't fix it

AAAA
06-24-2009, 04:54 AM
So everybody who doesn't get drawn top players has reduced 'earning' potential, no chance to win the same points in a given round as someone drawn to play a big name. That isn't fair either. Used over all seven rounds we officially start grading (asterisk'ing) slams wins. The public and the players will really like that.

More reward for betting the better more medalled star is flawed aswell. Stich has an easier time beating the Biggger star, Sampras, than he did against the lesser Agassi, yet he'd earn more points for the easier task.

Imagine the TW talk, fanboyZ complaining their idol's draw isn't TOUGH enough.