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zammouka
07-17-2009, 10:21 PM
My old high school coach keeps stressing me to put my younger brothers in USTA, and have them compete in tournaments. My brothers do want to progress thier game, and maybe get a scholarship( Lower D1, D2). I would much rather have them do drills and train, than do tournaments. Is USTA that important or is it a waste of money? Money is the big issue here. I have three younger brothers that could compete at tournament levels. One is a 15 year old 4.0, the next is a 13 year old 3.5, and finally an 11 year old 2.5-3.0. Would USTA tournaments take them to the next level?

tennismom42
07-17-2009, 11:10 PM
My old high school coach keeps stressing me to put my younger brothers in USTA, and have them compete in tournaments. My brothers do want to progress thier game, and maybe get a scholarship( Lower D1, D2). I would much rather have them do drills and train, than do tournaments. Is USTA that important or is it a waste of money? Money is the big issue here. I have three younger brothers that could compete at tournament levels. One is a 15 year old 4.0, the next is a 13 year old 3.5, and finally an 11 year old 2.5-3.0. Would USTA tournaments take them to the next level?

My sakes! I hope your parents are still involved. But kudos to you for taking charge of the tennis careers of 3 brothers. I have 5 boys, only 2 are interested in tennis.

I have yet to figure out how to do the college/tennis thing w/o USTA. I am sorry to say that it would be quite difficult, but not impossible.

It sounds like $$ will be quite limited. Think of it this way, college coaches (recruiters) need to do their jobs well so that they are employed year after year. In order to pick good recruits, they must have tools to compare one kid to another. Thus, USTA & TRN.

Let's be clear on a few things. Athletic scholarships only pay a portion of the amounts owed at college, maybe 50 - 75% of the total. (I've only heard of 2 full-ride scholarships in many years.) So the rest of the costs must be covered with academic scholarships, grants, jobs & other scholarships.

Unfortunately too many kids & parents fall for the "D1 or bust" dream. I know my son & I fell for it. It's not what it seems. I suggest you use the TRN website & research all the different types of divisions. There are many reasonable goals on the list.

Also, I do know of several young men who went to or are going to college DESPITE their USTA & TRN rankings. So it CAN happen. They were special circumstances. They did have USTA match histories so the coaches could make some comparisons.

To keep costs down, consider in-state colleges or neighbor-state colleges that offer reciprocal in-state agreements. These could also be called, "out-of-state tuition waivers." Some states just have one rate.

USERNAME
07-17-2009, 11:36 PM
Hard to get scholarships without a national ranking, especially in d1. Tournys r very good 4 one huge reason, point play experience UNDER PRESSURE. I kno college coaches (im a competing jr) and they all want players with lots of on court time against a variety of quality players. Tournys r the best and sometimes only way to get this.

SoCal10s
07-17-2009, 11:46 PM
if tennis was just who hits the best ball ,then life would be so easy.. tennis is all about competing and knowing ways to record those "Wins" over who ever is on the other side of the net... you can't prove yourself to any D1 or D2 coach unless you have a history.. there's no thing as a walk on talent anymore.. do yourself a favor and get into the USTA and start competing.. start proving yourself ASAP before it's too late...

NoSkillzAndy
07-18-2009, 08:06 AM
Playing in competitive matches is an important part of tennis. It won't necessarily make someone better at hitting the tennis ball, but it does make people better at playing tennis, at learning how to win matches. There's no better way to do this than through tournaments, in my opinion. It's like a trial by fire. You really have to be on your game to go deep in a tournament, winning match after match against progressively tougher opponents. It's a test of skill, endurance, and mental fortitude.

That being said, the other posters are right. College recruiters don't want to look at untested, unproven players. If playing D1 or D2 college tennis is a real goal, then I'd suggest getting into the tournament scene NOW -- and yes, that means USTA. There is a long way to go before "recognition" status and it's better to have time on your side. You have to start with ZAT's (Zone Advancement Tournaments) and earn enough points to qualify for Championship level. Then earn enough points to qualify for Super Champs. That's when you can finally work on a sectional ranking and eventually a national ranking.

It is alot of work and quite a large investment in time and money. Try to get started early so you can at least give yourselves a chance at making it as far as possible along the path to being recognized as a potential recruit. And try not to get discouraged by the sheer enormity of it all. Treat each tournament as a learning experience, a test of how far you've come and what you need to work on, and lastly a chance to showcase your talent through results. Not every junior is going to end up with a national ranking, but that's not a reason to have the "D1 or bust" mentality that the other poster mentioned. Just get your feet wet by playing some tournaments and see where it leads you. If nothing else, they are at least a great trial by fire.

As for money, if you can find tournaments that all your brothers can play in at the same time, that'd definitely save on some of the expense. Another option is to try to arrange to travel with other tennis friends' families. Nothing wrong with carpooling for tournaments, and it actually creates a nice little team atmosphere on the road.

TennisCoachFLA
07-18-2009, 09:05 AM
We have lots of kids who get scholarships with no regard to USTA rankings. Most college coaches do not give much respect to USTA rankings at all. They will use tools such as Tennis Recruiting which actually weighs schedule power, etc. In many cases a top ranked USTA player is ranked 50-100 by TRN when the kids in their age group are all added together.

College coaches also have a strong network of club, high school, and tennis academy coaches who funnel the best players their way. These players have track records in interclub matches, some handpicked USTA tourneys and perhaps ITF. Also, as the link below outlines, the foreign players are eating up more and more positions every year. Some kids go to top academies for 2-3 summers and they are so tested vs top players that with no USTA ranking they get scholarships. Whats better, a kid playing tourneys where 2/3rds the players are mediocre, or a kid who competes and succeeds each summer vs the best players from all over the world? (Yeah, this takes money for summer programs or an academy scholarship)

They also use Athletic Scholarship services that produce videos and outlines for the players.

The thought that a high USTA ranking is either needed or always respected by college coaches is wrong. And it is more and more wrong with each passing year. The avenues to a scholarship are changing.

http://www.baylor.edu/Lariat/news.php?action=story&story=50115

zammouka
07-18-2009, 09:12 AM
Thanks for the advice. I was going to sign them up, but I read a thread that says that colleges dont even look at USTA, they just care about the way the kid hits the ball. They both play high school tennis. The younger is an incoming freshman. I think he will have time to make his game better.

SoCal10s
07-18-2009, 02:27 PM
Thanks for the advice. I was going to sign them up, but I read a thread that says that colleges dont even look at USTA, they just care about the way the kid hits the ball. They both play high school tennis. The younger is an incoming freshman. I think he will have time to make his game better.

TCF is dangling a carrot in front of your face...the D1,D2 coaches shop for ITF and academy tennis players.. it doesn't sound like you and your brothers fit that description.. those kids eat,think,sleep,and play tennis every moment of their life.. it's not that great of a life.. even if you get a scholarship but cannot make the grade,after a while you will be academically ineligible and be sent back home.. what kind of adult life are you going to have if you haven't train yourself to do anything else except hit a tennis ball .. maybe you can be a tennis coach at a local park somewhere like others on this blog.. there are better ways to have a great life than teaching tennis,unless that's what you love..

ClarkC
07-18-2009, 03:08 PM
We have lots of kids who get scholarships with no regard to USTA rankings. Most college coaches do not give much respect to USTA rankings at all. They will use tools such as Tennis Recruiting which actually weighs schedule power, etc. In many cases a top ranked USTA player is ranked 50-100 by TRN when the kids in their age group are all added together.


The original question was whether the younger brothers should spend the money to join the USTA and play USTA tournaments. Assuming they live in America, they will not be likely to get much of a tennisrecruiting.net ranking without joining the USTA and playing USTA tournaments, will they? Your riff on different ranking systems does not address the question.

The answer to the question, for players who reside in the USA, is YES. You should join the USTA and play some USTA tournaments. You don't have to play a tournament every weekend, but you need to start getting results against players that college coaches know about from various sources, else they have no way to measure you.

The younger brothers he described are not in an academy, are not foreign players with ITF rankings or foreign sports club experience, etc. Trying to get into NCAA Division I on the basis of high school tennis means walking on and hoping to earn a scholarship down the road somewhere.

THESEXPISTOL
07-18-2009, 03:25 PM
I think you could take them to some club tournaments first non-USTA and give them some hours of competitive tennis. Then you would see what you gonna do.
For me starting at tournaments was great. I couldn't even hit my BH 3 times in a row and went to some. The first time i played a lefty was on a tournament :)

zammouka
07-19-2009, 10:32 AM
If it helps I plan to get certified by the USPTA. I just want them to excel in high school and then maybe keep on playing. I by no means want them to turn pro, eat, sleep, and dream tennis. Tennis is huge for me and my brothers, we all just love it. I just want them to keep competing and doing something they enjoy, after high school. Thanks alot for the advice guys. I dont think I want to sign them up for tournaments. I dont want them to get burned out and starting hating the game.

ClarkC
07-19-2009, 11:26 AM
As I said, they don't have to play tourneys every weekend and burn out.

Do you think every player who plays 5 tourneys a year burns out?

Decide whatever you want, but don't base the decision on a misunderstanding of USTA tourneys. You seem to have a fear of USTA tourneys that is not based on knowing the USTA scene from up close, but from viewing it fearfully from afar.

stanfordtennis alum
07-19-2009, 12:28 PM
it is and is not, all depends on what you are trying to achieve and what your goals are

zammouka
07-19-2009, 02:38 PM
I asked my brothers if they wanted me to sign them up and they said they would rather train, and do a couple indoor tournaments in the winter, b/c chicago is freezing in the winter. I just dont want to make them do something they dont want to.

MethodTennis
07-20-2009, 06:37 AM
the 15y.o and 13 might be worth signing up mabay when the 11 yo is 13 he could sign up too

WARPWOODIE
07-20-2009, 01:48 PM
Is USTA that important or is it a waste of money? Money is the big issue here. I have three younger brothers that could compete at tournament levels. One is a 15 year old 4.0, the next is a 13 year old 3.5, and finally an 11 year old 2.5-3.0. Would USTA tournaments take them to the next level?

If money is an issue, look up the USTA grants. If your family qualifies, I believe they will subsidize tournament entrance fees/coaching/equipment.

norcal22
07-26-2009, 01:08 AM
If you resist USTA tournaments, there will be a pretty slim chance of college tennis. Not to say it cant happen, but it is just MUCH harder for a college to recruit someone who has no history.

Possible scenarios: wildcard into Kalamazoo (or another high profile tourney) and end up winning it, certain college coach knows the player very well, connections from parents or coach... just my take. Not many colleges would want to take chances on a "no namer" when there are so many kids competing for the same spot

10isplayer
07-26-2009, 07:59 AM
they wouldn't get a wildcard into kalamazoo or any high profile tournament if they have never played USTA and they just have played high school tennis

norcal22
07-26-2009, 10:42 AM
they wouldn't get a wildcard into kalamazoo or any high profile tournament if they have never played USTA and they just have played high school tennis
Actually thats not entirely true, the player could be known to be very good in the area or something, or have some sort of connection with somebody running the tournament

10isplayer
07-27-2009, 08:33 PM
No because the only way a player would become widely known in the area is by playing local USTA tournaments. I have never heard of (and has probably never happened) a big supernational event giving a wildcard to a kid that has never played in the USTA.

norcal22
07-30-2009, 06:07 PM
No because the only way a player would become widely known in the area is by playing local USTA tournaments. I have never heard of (and has probably never happened) a big supernational event giving a wildcard to a kid that has never played in the USTA.
The laws of physics allow it, so its possible. Never said it was likely.

DownTheLine
07-30-2009, 06:14 PM
If you want to get scholarships to lower D1 or higher D2 schools USTA tournaments and rankings is the fastest way to get there.

Plus, why can't they train through out the week and do tournaments on the weekends?

10isplayer
07-30-2009, 06:30 PM
The laws of physics allow it, so its possible. Never said it was likely.

That is the dumbest thing i've ever heard.

ClarkC
07-31-2009, 07:07 AM
The laws of physics allow it, so its possible. Never said it was likely.

The USTA could give me a wild card to the US Open this year. But we don't need to have a thread to discuss the possibility of that, do we?

norcal22
08-01-2009, 12:14 AM
The USTA could give me a wild card to the US Open this year. But we don't need to have a thread to discuss the possibility of that, do we?
Youre right, we dont. But you idiots just cant seem to let the hypothetical go.

ClarkC
08-01-2009, 10:36 AM
Youre right, we dont. But you idiots just cant seem to let the hypothetical go.

That's because this is an advice thread. Someone started the thread looking for advice. Hypotheticals that have no relationship to reality don't help provide advice.

Someone with your intellectual capacity is is no position to call anyone an idiot.

norcal22
08-01-2009, 07:06 PM
That's because this is an advice thread. Someone started the thread looking for advice. Hypotheticals that have no relationship to reality don't help provide advice.

Someone with your intellectual capacity is is no position to call anyone an idiot.
Actually, the hypothetical can help in giving advice because it shows just how hard getting a wildcard for a major national is.

You have no way of knowing my intellectual capacity, because you have only seen what i have posted on this forum.

fruitytennis1
08-04-2009, 05:14 AM
Cough..Cough.. Your off topic now.
You should sign up for USTA first and try it out. You will enjoy the tournaments. If you dont I dont think playing tennis is for you. Training isnt tennis, playing matches is tennis.

norcal22
08-10-2009, 11:56 PM
Cough..Cough.. Your off topic now.
You should sign up for USTA first and try it out. You will enjoy the tournaments. If you dont I dont think playing tennis is for you. Training isnt tennis, playing matches is tennis.
Actually, both are very important parts of tennis

riponeverything
08-16-2009, 09:53 AM
if you choose not to play USTA tournaments you will almost get nowhere in tennis. it doesnt mattter how good you are. the best of the best play USTA. Colleges recruit based of these events and these rankings. if you have no record how can you expect to be looked at?