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Chopin
08-11-2009, 12:24 PM
Hello all,

Let me start by saying that I respect Nadal as the best competitor in tennis today, a great sport, a humble champion and by most accounts, a nice guy. He's extremely talented and a great, great champion.

That being said, I think that Nadal's domination of the sport (French Open 08-Australian Open 09) is over and I don't think it will return to the same extent. Will he win more slams? Yes. Will he be as dominant has he had been? Probably not. Will he dominate in the same way Federer did? No.

The reasons, you ask? There are two main reasons. The first, sadly, is how physical Nadal's game is. If he's having such major knee problems now, I don't think he's going to hold up in the long-run. I hope he does though. Players with much less physical games have had injury prone careers.

But more than that, I think Soderling and, to a lesser extent, Federer showed us (and their fellow pros) in Nadal's last two losses. The answer they gave us is to flatten out their strokes a little bit more and hit through the ball. Simple strategy, often very difficult to execute. That being said, too many players made the mistake of trying to rally with Nadal from the baseline instead of playing more aggressively.

It should be a fascinating week of tennis in Montreal.

GasquetGOAT
08-11-2009, 12:32 PM
I agree his domination is over. Its a hard ask for him to repeat 2008. Even Sampras couldn't match it. 6 slams for a pair of knees, I'd say he's done well. ;)

http://i405.photobucket.com/albums/pp133/bn4769/rafa.jpg

flyinghippos101
08-11-2009, 12:39 PM
Frankly, I don't see any player really dominating like Federer in 2004-2007 from here on. After 2009, I see 3 or 4 winners for grand slams, no longer 2

TheFifthSet
08-11-2009, 12:40 PM
Federer won't keep this going forever---and when he slips, I would reasonably expect a FULL changing of the guard. Every champion goes through a period of doubt. But I think Nadal will end up with 11-12 slams.

That is, if his knees hold up.

All-rounder
08-11-2009, 12:41 PM
Federer won't keep this going forever---and when he slips, I would reasonably expect a FULL changing of the guard. Every champion goes through a period of doubt. But I think Nadal will end up with 11-12 slams.

That is, if his knees hold up.
Federer has already gone through that last year

bruce38
08-11-2009, 12:42 PM
Nadal 9 slams tops.

S H O W S T O P P E R !
08-11-2009, 12:44 PM
I agree his domination is over. Its a hard ask for him to repeat 2008. Even Sampras couldn't match it. 6 slams for a pair of knees, I'd say he's done well. ;)

http://i405.photobucket.com/albums/pp133/bn4769/rafa.jpg

What happened to that thread?

GasquetGOAT
08-11-2009, 12:48 PM
What happened to that thread?

Thread was on roids and is now serving a suspension.;)

Cesc Fabregas
08-11-2009, 01:03 PM
More slams than that clown Gasquet will ever get.

All-rounder
08-11-2009, 01:05 PM
More slams than that clown Gasquet will ever get.
So he's a clown yet he has more career titles than fleming. Where fleming is seen as a genius because he said nadal is the best player on tour

Nadalfan89
08-11-2009, 01:34 PM
Oh so players are going to flatten their strokes and start pounding the lines?

Soderling was destroyed 6-1,6-0 by Nadal a month or two before the French. Soderling played amazingly at the FO and that's why he won.

Most other player's can't play like that consistently. Federer would need to change his backhand all together if he wants to win consistently against Nadal.

The knee part is up to him. If he gets smart and stop playing every tournement in existance, he can win 5-6 more GSs imo.

Chopin
08-11-2009, 07:33 PM
Oh so players are going to flatten their strokes and start pounding the lines?

Soderling was destroyed 6-1,6-0 by Nadal a month or two before the French. Soderling played amazingly at the FO and that's why he won.

Most other player's can't play like that consistently. Federer would need to change his backhand all together if he wants to win consistently against Nadal.

The knee part is up to him. If he gets smart and stop playing every tournement in existance, he can win 5-6 more GSs imo.

Yes, players are going to flatten out their strokes, take more risks and move forward more often against Nadal. Will it always work? No. Is it a better strategy than grinding from the baseline for many players? Yes.

Federer still has a winning record against Nadal off of clay. Remember that.

I agree Nadal needs to change his schedule.

CountryHillbilly
08-11-2009, 07:37 PM
Yes, players are going to flatten out their strokes, take more risks and move forward more often against Nadal. Will it always work? No. Is it a better strategy than grinding from the baseline for many players? Yes.

Federer still has a winning record against Nadal off of clay. Remember that.

I agree Nadal needs to change his schedule.

Sure, that's all easy to say. But Soderling was a bit lucky with his shots, he's quite tall, and Nadal wasn't exactly 100%.

But still, it's the best strategy, unless you have topspin and fitness like Rafa.

btw isn't there a permanent ban for multiple accounts?

nadalfan4life
08-11-2009, 07:43 PM
Nadal will come back and break Roger's record amount of Grand Slams or at least get close. Every big time player has struggled at some point. Nadal is one of those players who could win all four grand slams in one year he just needs to stay healthy.

Chopin
08-11-2009, 07:43 PM
Sure, that's all easy to say. But Soderling was a bit lucky with his shots, he's quite tall, and Nadal wasn't exactly 100%.

But still, it's the best strategy, unless you have topspin and fitness like Rafa.

btw isn't there a permanent ban for multiple accounts?

We'll see what happens with Nadal. He's also lost a bit of mental edge I'm sure. Look what happened with Federer when he lost his mental edge. I image that guys will go after Nadal with increased confidence now.

I'm abiding by all forum rules and policies.

theroleoftheunderdog
08-11-2009, 07:45 PM
Nadal will come back and break Roger's record amount of Grand Slams or at least get close. Every big time player has struggled at some point. Nadal is one of those players who could win all four grand slams in one year he just needs to stay healthy.

less fanaticism, more realism please

CountryHillbilly
08-11-2009, 08:03 PM
We'll see what happens with Nadal. He's also lost a bit of mental edge I'm sure. Look what happened with Federer when he lost his mental edge. I image that guys will go after Nadal with increased confidence now.

Yea, that's true. I'm interested what happens in the next few months with Rafa.

I'm abiding by all forum rules and policies.

Did Mozart and Debussy abide by the regulations? :twisted:

Anyway, it's good to see that mods have a refined sense of humor. And sorry for ruining your threads :)

Chopin
08-11-2009, 08:06 PM
Yea, that's true. I'm interested what happens in the next few months with Rafa.



Did Mozart and Debussy abide by the regulations? :twisted:

Anyway, it's good to see that mods have a refined sense of humor. And sorry for ruining your threads :)

Yeah, just let it go. Nice profile picture.

JeMar
08-11-2009, 08:08 PM
Yea, that's true. I'm interested what happens in the next few months with Rafa.



Did Mozart and Debussy abide by the regulations? :twisted:

Anyway, it's good to see that mods have a refined sense of humor. And sorry for ruining your threads :)

One of my students last year wrote a research report about Claude Debussy.

It was interesting.

CountryHillbilly
08-11-2009, 08:11 PM
One of my students last year wrote a research report about Claude Debussy.

It was interesting.

Why Debussy? Why not Franz Liszt? Tchaikovsky? Rachmaninoff?

I see you don't like Eastern European composers, you lying bigot, troll and hypocrite!! :twisted:

JeMar
08-11-2009, 08:14 PM
Why Debussy? Why not Franz Liszt? Tchaikovsky? Rachmaninoff?

I see you don't like Eastern European composers, you lying bigot, troll and hypocrite!! :twisted:

I do love the west.

That kid was a great piano player! :shock:

CountryHillbilly
08-11-2009, 08:20 PM
I do love the west.

That kid was a great piano player! :shock:

Are you a music teacher?

nadalfan4life
08-11-2009, 08:26 PM
Hey theroleoftheunderdog I garuntee you he will be in the twelve to thirteen grand slam range and he has a great shot at winning all four in one year. If he wins two every year for the next three years he is at twelve for Nadal that is easy.

JeMar
08-11-2009, 08:30 PM
Are you a music teacher?

No, I'm an English teacher, but I do play several instruments and planned to make a life out of music until I fell in love with literature.

nadalfan4life
08-11-2009, 08:33 PM
No, I'm an English teacher.

Hey I have to read Lord of the Flies this year. Is it as bad of a book as some people say.

JeMar
08-11-2009, 08:34 PM
Hey I have to read Lord of the Flies this year. Is it as bad of a book as some people say.

I taught it one year and it can be awesome for students if their teacher does it the right way. The book itself is a little slow, but it gets much better once the two tribes are established.

hankash
08-11-2009, 08:35 PM
I hope Nadal comes back to full strength again. Who doesn't enjoy watching a Federer-Nadal match? I was hoping to watch it in the 2007 Rogers cup finals, but got a Federer-Djokovic match instead (which was a great match with long rallies and few errors). It's a great rivalry and it would be a shame if it ended because Nadal had a bad knee.

nadalfan4life
08-11-2009, 08:37 PM
Thanks JeMar.

nadalfan4life
08-11-2009, 08:38 PM
It's a great rivalry and it would be a shame if it ended because Nadal had a bad knee.

Yeah you are right.

NamRanger
08-11-2009, 08:39 PM
I hope Nadal comes back to full strength again. Who doesn't enjoy watching a Federer-Nadal match? I was hoping to watch it in the 2007 Rogers cup finals, but got a Federer-Djokovic match instead (which was a great match with long rallies and few errors). It's a great rivalry and it would be a shame if it ended because Nadal had a bad knee.



I don't because it consists of this :


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gxc0bmd4WWg

JeMar
08-11-2009, 08:42 PM
Thanks JeMar.

Before we started reading it, I set up a scenario in which the kids were in charge of creating a stable society in the classroom, mirroring what happens in the book. Their grade basically depended on how efficiently they worked and what their constitution looked like. I only observed and didn't help them at all.

They were ready to kill each other after three days; it took one whole extra day just to debrief them and make them not hate each other anymore. It was pretty intense.

I haven't taught it since because I'm still working out the kinks in that activity.

JeMar
08-11-2009, 08:44 PM
I don't because it consists of this :


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gxc0bmd4WWg

Nadal is such a strategic genius!

GameSampras
08-11-2009, 08:44 PM
I doubt Nadal will dominate again.. I dont see Nadal being any more dominant than he was last year and the beginning of this year.. As he gets older, he will only get more injured, and become even streakier. You wont see high consistent dominance from the guy. But you may see him pick up slams or master every now and then. His body obviously cant hold up the grind of the tour for an entire year.


If he cant manage it at 23, how can he manage it in his mid to late 20s? HE CANT

nadalfan4life
08-11-2009, 08:45 PM
Haha. I have had some situations like that with class projects, but most of the times it is the students and not the projects.

FedFan_2009
08-11-2009, 08:45 PM
Hello all,

Let me start by saying that I respect Nadal as the best competitor in tennis today, a great sport, a humble champion and by most accounts, a nice guy. He's extremely talented and a great, great champion.

That being said, I think that Nadal's domination of the sport (French Open 08-Australian Open 09) is over and I don't think it will return to the same extent. Will he win more slams? Yes. Will he be as dominant has he had been? Probably not. Will he dominate in the same way Federer did? No.

The reasons, you ask? There are two main reasons. The first, sadly, is how physical Nadal's game is. If he's having such major knee problems now, I don't think he's going to hold up in the long-run. I hope he does though. Players with much less physical games have had injury prone careers.

But more than that, I think Soderling and, to a lesser extent, Federer showed us (and their fellow pros) in Nadal's last two losses. The answer they gave us is to flatten out their strokes a little bit more and hit through the ball. Simple strategy, often very difficult to execute. That being said, too many players made the mistake of trying to rally with Nadal from the baseline instead of playing more aggressively.

It should be a fascinating week of tennis in Montreal.

Actually didn't his domination extend through early May winning Rome? Also he captured 3 Masters AFTER winning Australia while remaining #1 through that stretch.

rafan
08-11-2009, 08:55 PM
They once thought no man would go to the moon or climb Everest or sail around the world single handed. I hate this word "cant". Its not unusual for Nadal to come out of the doubles early. He is being sensible and not showing off too early

namelessone
08-11-2009, 09:05 PM
You need to look at the big picture people.Nadal spent 48 weeks at nr.1 while being a contemporary to Federer.That's almost a full year.And he could have hold on to the nr.1 spot for at least another 6 months if not more if his knees didn't break down.It's not like his descent was slow.The guys lost 3000 something points in a few weeks and knees played a big part in that,at least in the wimby withdrawal if not in the RG exit too.

Also how did Nadal dominate? Nadal has been nr.1 for 48 weeks.In my book,in order to dominate the tour you have to win lots of titles(slams and masters) and stay AT LEAST 2 years or so at nr.1.
But his arrival at nr.1 and the fact that the managed to stay there quite a while in the age of Federer is a big achievement,considering that Fed's competitors couldn't even get a freaking Slam off of him(exception being Safin and Djokovic in AO),let alone take his number 1 position.Nadal got all his GS titles by beating Federer along the way and even managed to snatch the nr.1 for the swiss.If it were not for this guy fed would have 18 slams or so and would have spent 5 years and counting as the nr.1

Nadalfan89
08-11-2009, 09:18 PM
Nadal is such a strategic genius!

Do you fill your student's heads with leftist propoganda like my old high school?

JeMar
08-11-2009, 09:20 PM
Do you fill your student's heads with leftist propoganda like my old high school?

Yes, we recite the entire Communist Manifesto to a picture of Barack Obama every morning. I'm not too happy about wasting twelve weeks' worth of instruction every morning, but you gotta do what you gotta do.

Nadalfan89
08-11-2009, 09:26 PM
Yes, we recite the entire Communist Manifesto to a picture of Barack Obama every morning. I'm not too happy about wasting twelve weeks' worth of instruction every morning, but you gotta do what you gotta do.

Haha I wasn't being sarcastic. I've talked to a lot of teachers who said that they were pressured by administration to keep students from veering to the right by marking them harder and whatnot...

It's most likely BS but considering what's going on in universities nowadays, you never know.

~ZoSo~
08-12-2009, 08:42 AM
No, I'm an English teacher, but I do play several instruments and planned to make a life out of music until I fell in love with literature.

What instruments do you play?

Cyan
08-12-2009, 09:09 AM
You need to look at the big picture people.Nadal spent 48 weeks at nr.1 while being a contemporary to Federer.That's almost a full year.And he could have hold on to the nr.1 spot for at least another 6 months if not more if his knees didn't break down.It's not like his descent was slow.The guys lost 3000 something points in a few weeks and knees played a big part in that,at least in the wimby withdrawal if not in the RG exit too.

Also how did Nadal dominate? Nadal has been nr.1 for 48 weeks.In my book,in order to dominate the tour you have to win lots of titles(slams and masters) and stay AT LEAST 2 years or so at nr.1.
But his arrival at nr.1 and the fact that the managed to stay there quite a while in the age of Federer is a big achievement,considering that Fed's competitors couldn't even get a freaking Slam off of him(exception being Safin and Djokovic in AO),let alone take his number 1 position.Nadal got all his GS titles by beating Federer along the way and even managed to snatch the nr.1 for the swiss.If it were not for this guy fed would have 18 slams or so and would have spent 5 years and counting as the nr.1

Good post. Agreed.

maximo
08-12-2009, 09:11 AM
What instruments do you play?

Vous etes Francaise?

nadalfan4life
08-12-2009, 09:23 AM
Vous etes Francais?

Why are you speaking French. You are speaking French right.

~ZoSo~
08-12-2009, 09:34 AM
Vous etes Francaise?

Non, je suis britannique

Cyan
08-12-2009, 09:37 AM
Non, je suis britannique

And a Led Zep fan apparently. I don't think ~ZoSo~ is Veroniquem....

GameSampras
08-12-2009, 09:37 AM
A long reign of domination is not the most probable thing in the world to a player who cant finish a season healthy Im sorry. And I actually like Nadal..

TheMagicianOfPrecision
08-12-2009, 09:38 AM
A long reign of domination is not the most probable thing in the world to a player who cant finish a season healthy Im sorry. And I actually like Nadal..
Agree.
Leave it to the Big man:) Now Fed is only 44 weeks from tying Petes record at most weeks as no 1:twisted:

GameSampras
08-12-2009, 09:59 AM
Agree.
Leave it to the Big man:) Now Fed is only 44 weeks from tying Petes record at most weeks as no 1:twisted:

LOL... Well thats not guaranteed either

TheMagicianOfPrecision
08-12-2009, 10:01 AM
LOL... Well thats not guaranteed either
Of course not, but it is a record im sure he wants on his own

drakulie
08-12-2009, 10:04 AM
People forget, Nadal was #2 for nearly 4 years???, and no player behind him in the rankings was even close to him in points. Then, a full year at #1. That is nearly 5 years at the top.

This **IS** dominating. Without Fed in the picture, the guy would be #1 for a period of 5+ years.

I'm going to make a guess here, but most great players typically have 5 great years in them. Nadal has been at the top for that many years in a row.

GameSampras
08-12-2009, 10:06 AM
People forget, Nadal was #2 for nearly 4 years???, and no player behind him in the rankings was even close to him in points. Then, a full year at #1. That is nearly 5 years at the top.

This **IS** dominating. Without Fed in the picture, the guy would be #1 for a period of 5+ years.

I'm going to make a guess here, but most great players typically have 5 great years in them. Nadal has been at the top for that many years in a row.



Thats not dominating.. And Rafa's lack of HC slam success all of those years, is NOT dominating either. Dominating is being on top for an extended period of time.Not being Number 2 in the world and for most of that time, way far behind Roger in the point race. Only managing slams at the French Open is domination on clay.. Not domination all around

drakulie
08-12-2009, 10:21 AM
Thats not dominating.. And Rafa's lack of HC slam success all of those years, is NOT dominating either.

So, according to your logic, Sampras **NEVER** dominated, since he had absolutely no success on clay. I will remind you, Nadal won slams on clay, grass, and hard during the stretch I referred to.

The rest of your post is filth, and not worth responding to.

nadalfan4life
08-12-2009, 10:23 AM
So, according to your logic, Sampras **NEVER** dominated, since he had absolutely no success on clay. I will remind you, Nadal won slams on clay, grass, and hard during the stretch I referred to.

The rest of your post is filth, and not worth responding to.
Yes, but he is not done yet. He still has plenty fuel left in his tank. Every great athlete has injuries even Sampras had his problem. Nadal is just having his injuries early he will come back to number one.

theroleoftheunderdog
08-12-2009, 10:26 AM
Yes, but he is not done yet. He still has plenty fuel left in his tank. Every great athlete has injuries even Sampras had his problem. Nadal is just having his injuries early he will come back to number one.

exactly. who else has had injuries this early in their career?

TheMagicianOfPrecision
08-12-2009, 10:28 AM
He still has plenty fuel left in his tank.
Are we talking about Rafael...Nadal? Hes got some fuel left, not plenty.

nadalfan4life
08-12-2009, 10:30 AM
exactly. who else has had injuries this early in their career?

How did you get in this?

nadalfan4life
08-12-2009, 10:31 AM
Are we talking about Rafael...Nadal? Hes got some fuel left, not plenty.

I think he can win six more grand slams. I consider that plenty of fuel.

theroleoftheunderdog
08-12-2009, 10:32 AM
How did you get in this?

i mean it as a bad sign

nadalfan4life
08-12-2009, 10:35 AM
i mean it as a bad sign

What??? You lost me.

aphex
08-12-2009, 10:36 AM
So, according to your logic, Sampras **NEVER** dominated, since he had absolutely no success on clay. I will remind you, Nadal won slams on clay, grass, and hard during the stretch I referred to.

The rest of your post is filth, and not worth responding to.

shooting fish in a barrel...

TheMagicianOfPrecision
08-12-2009, 10:39 AM
I think he can win six more grand slams. I consider that plenty of fuel.
Thats insane!!! 3 more tops!

All-rounder
08-12-2009, 10:44 AM
Thats insane!!! 3 more tops!
I say if healthy 4-6 nadal proved the critics wrong many times

GameSampras
08-12-2009, 10:45 AM
shooting fish in a barrel...

Sampras never dominated on clay.. But does have some clay court titles to his resume and deep runs at the french. Fed has never DOMINATED on clay either just so you know.

Problem is the harcourt season takes up for most of the season and two slams are played on it. Im not necessarily saying Nadal hasnt dominated in some aspects, but only managing one year so far on top of the game and many years of being behind Roger due to his inability to win HC slams during that time , Nadal hasnt exactly dominated either.


When Nadal has some longevity as Number 1 and the best overrall in the world than we will talk domination. So far he hasnt proven it.. He cant stay healthy

nadalfan4life
08-12-2009, 10:45 AM
Three more tops. Are you sure. I think he can win the USO this year and for the next three years win the FO. I think he can pick up two more at other Grand Slams like AO or Wimbledon.

drakulie
08-12-2009, 10:50 AM
Sampras never dominated on clay.. But does have some clay court titles to his resume and deep runs at the french.

and Nadal has a bunch of hard court titles. Your point is???

Like you already said thru your own logic>>> Sampras never dominated.

Fed has never DOMINATED on clay either just so you know.

compared to, Sampras' resume, one would think he (Fed) invented the clay game.

drakulie
08-12-2009, 10:51 AM
Three more tops. Are you sure. I think he can win the USO this year and for the next three years win the FO. I think he can pick up two more at other Grand Slams like AO or Wimbledon.

you need to wake up from fantasy land.