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DoubleWindsor
08-30-2009, 09:08 PM
We must unite!

Come here to complain/discuss the ludicrous hours or nights on call, the sleepless nights spent studying or trying not to fall asleep in the ICU. The grueling days of studying for step 1 or the nightmare that is obamacare.

Tell us a little about yourself. Where are you in the long process of becoming a doctor and what's your specialty (or what you think you would like to do). Why did you choose medicine and what do you think about the future of medicine?

VivalaVida
08-30-2009, 09:37 PM
I dont think I fit in with you guys yet. I am really a long way from there. I am just starting college, and going into the pre med major. You are like my idol :D. I really wanna be a doctor because my dad is one, I enjoy science classes the most, and I really like watching House M.D. :lol:

mlktennis
08-31-2009, 10:12 AM
We must unite!

Come here to complain/discuss the ludicrous hours or nights on call, the sleepless nights spent studying or trying not to fall asleep in the ICU. The grueling days of studying for step 1 or the nightmare that is obamacare.

Tell us a little about yourself. Where are you in the long process of becoming a doctor and what's your specialty (or what you think you would like to do). Why did you choose medicine and what do you think about the future of medicine?

tell us about yourself first.

hyogen
08-31-2009, 10:19 AM
Fedace went to med school right?

aphex
08-31-2009, 11:02 AM
Fedace went to med school right?

of course, there's dr.fedace...

ollinger
08-31-2009, 04:44 PM
I'm afraid med school and residency are the relatively easy and care-free years. One has relatively little ultimate responsibility during those years, and I look back on them fondly. Being in practice is when you really have responsibility for other people's lives, and that's a special kind of stress.

DoubleWindsor
08-31-2009, 05:33 PM
I dont think I fit in with you guys yet. I am really a long way from there. I am just starting college, and going into the pre med major. You are like my idol :D. I really wanna be a doctor because my dad is one, I enjoy science classes the most, and I really like watching House M.D. :lol:

Its great that you feel so passionate about what you want to do, but from my experience and readings, those are terrible reasons to choose medicine, and so is enjoying house (although its great!), medicine is nothing like in the shows.

About me, Im a new MS-2, going to a med school in florida. Because I haven't started clinicals yet (next year!) I'm not sure what I want to do. I have a few ideas; rads, derm, int. med-gastro, but those are all very competitive and very dependent on how well I continue to do (and what connections I make).

super_forehand
08-31-2009, 06:10 PM
I'm afraid med school and residency are the relatively easy and care-free years. One has relatively little ultimate responsibility during those years, and I look back on them fondly. Being in practice is when you really have responsibility for other people's lives, and that's a special kind of stress.

I dont know what med school you went to but where I went it was nothing like that.

Puddy
08-31-2009, 09:30 PM
Fedace? Oh Fedace, where are you?

max
09-01-2009, 06:58 AM
I'm afraid med school and residency are the relatively easy and care-free years. One has relatively little ultimate responsibility during those years, and I look back on them fondly. Being in practice is when you really have responsibility for other people's lives, and that's a special kind of stress.

ollie: can you describe this stress more? Just curious.

Fedace
09-01-2009, 07:06 AM
Fedace went to med school right?

Lets stop spreading rumors. I Never said whether I did or I didn't. But i do understand exactly what the OP is talking about.. My family is full of Physicians and also I will Quote the good Dr. Dean Edell,,,,,,," Medical School and residency is like going thru the Marine Core Boot Camp 10 X over and over " It is that tough....:-?

Fedace
09-01-2009, 07:08 AM
Lets get ONE thing straight right now. I NEVER said i was a doctor or i wasn't a doctor, and i will not confirm that in a talk Forum... That is just NOT going to happen........

DoubleWindsor
09-01-2009, 07:08 AM
I'm afraid med school and residency are the relatively easy and care-free years. One has relatively little ultimate responsibility during those years, and I look back on them fondly. Being in practice is when you really have responsibility for other people's lives, and that's a special kind of stress.

Your crazy to say med school is "easy and care-free." That makes me question you whether or not you actually went. I'd call it emotionally and physically draining, unrewarding, and very very care-full years.

I don't doubt your statement about life in practice, but to make a bold statement about med school and residency like that is a slap in the face to us students who consider it hard as hell.

aphex
09-01-2009, 07:09 AM
Lets stop spreading rumors. I Never said whether I did or I didn't. But i do understand exactly what the OP is talking about.. My family is full of Physicians and also I will Quote the good Dr. Dean Edell,,,,,,," Medical School and residency is like going thru the Marine Core Boot Camp 10 X over and over " It is that tough....:-?

please stop trying to impress us with all your fancy standford spellings...

Fedace
09-01-2009, 07:11 AM
I'm afraid med school and residency are the relatively easy and care-free years. One has relatively little ultimate responsibility during those years, and I look back on them fondly. Being in practice is when you really have responsibility for other people's lives, and that's a special kind of stress.

Ollinger i know what you are getting at, but the STress for the medical students and residents are Tremendous. It is the lack of sleep and overwhelming amount of material you have to digest in order to pass the exams in med school and get thru the internships and residencies as well. I think it really helps if you have Photographic Memory but Not all the people are blessed with such Gifts.......:-?

Fedace
09-01-2009, 07:15 AM
please stop trying to impress us with all your fancy standford spellings...

People say marine CORE, and the Marien CORE boot camps are like going the Hell and back. Just imagine doing that 10X over. but it is a different kind of stress though. More of a mental stress than the Physical as in the Marine CORE boot camp.....:)

rommil
09-01-2009, 07:41 AM
I wonder where is our resident patellar tendonitician Dr Nadal_Freak went to.

super_forehand
09-01-2009, 08:13 AM
People say marine CORE, and the Marien CORE boot camps are like going the Hell and back. Just imagine doing that 10X over. but it is a different kind of stress though. More of a mental stress than the Physical as in the Marine CORE boot camp.....:)

I have several buddies in the marines, the stress is bery much mental as it is physical.

Also in medical school it is mental and physical. That lack of sleep gets to you. Maybe not in a few days, or even weeks, but I bet your health is down a few points by the end of a semester. Mine sure was.

aphex
09-01-2009, 08:23 AM
People say marine CORE, and the Marien CORE boot camps are like going the Hell and back. Just imagine doing that 10X over. but it is a different kind of stress though. More of a mental stress than the Physical as in the Marine CORE boot camp.....:)

how come they don't teach these things at standford?


"Pronunciation" refers to the way a word or a language is spoken, or the manner in which someone utters a word.


Spelling is the writing of a word or words with the necessary letters and diacritics present in an accepted standard order.

Sentinel
09-01-2009, 08:33 AM
I wonder where is our resident patellar tendonitician Dr Nadal_Freak went to.
He signed up as backhand_winner and got banned immediately.

iirc, Fedace is the only reliable and respected doctor on board.

rommil
09-01-2009, 08:39 AM
He signed up as backhand_winner and got banned immediately.

iirc, Fedace is the only reliable and respected doctor on board.

Maybe he will come back as backside_scratcher in his next foray.

woodrow1029
09-01-2009, 08:42 AM
People say marine CORE, and the Marien CORE boot camps are like going the Hell and back. Just imagine doing that 10X over. but it is a different kind of stress though. More of a mental stress than the Physical as in the Marine CORE boot camp.....:)
Dr. Feddie, somebuddy wit a Standford education wud not tipe like that, even if they was rushd typing on a talk Forum.

Fedace
09-01-2009, 08:45 AM
Dr. Feddie, somebuddy wit a Standford education wud not tipe like that, even if they was rushd typing on a talk Forum.

Yea just make sure you don't goof any calls during the Stanford matches coming season...

woodrow1029
09-01-2009, 08:46 AM
Yea just make sure you don't goof any calls during the Stanford matches coming season...
I will try extra hard not to goof up knowing that you will be watching from the Eye in the Taube Sky..

goober
09-01-2009, 08:53 AM
Lets stop spreading rumors. I Never said whether I did or I didn't. But i do understand exactly what the OP is talking about.. My family is full of Physicians and also I will Quote the good Dr. Dean Edell,,,,,,," Medical School and residency is like going thru the Marine Core Boot Camp 10 X over and over " It is that tough....:-?


These are not rumors. You said twice you went to med school. Unfortunately the threads got deleted. The first time somebody asked if there are any med students on this forum. You responded "I am one. Hurry up ask me a question I have to go play tennis" The second time you directly responded to me that you the med school you went to is none of my buisness. Even when you were directly quoted you simply ignored the posts.

Fedace
09-01-2009, 08:58 AM
These are not rumors. You said twice you went to med school. Unfortunately the threads got deleted. The first time somebody asked if there are any med students on this forum. You responded "I am one. Hurry up ask me a question I have to go play tennis" The second time you directly responded to me that you the med school you went to is none of my buisness. Even when you were directly quoted you simply ignored the posts.

NEVER EVER said in this forum i went MED school. and i will NEVER ever confirm whether i did or I didn't........so keep letting your imagination run Wild.......that is the way i like it...:evil::)

ollinger
09-01-2009, 09:16 AM
I graduated from Albert Einstein College of Medicine, NYC. My point was that med school and residency are times during which someone else is always supervising and ultimately signing off on your work, with possible exception of some clinic outpatients that are generally fairly routine. I didn't find those years all that stressful, perhaps because I enjoyed what I was doing and one is still considered to be learning their craft during those years, not so stressful unless you have problems handling the amount of work (I never really did). In practice life is very different. A colleague of mine sighed to me last week "I'm tired of being in charge of other people's lives," a stressful way of life one really doesn't have until being out in practice.

TourTenor
09-01-2009, 09:21 AM
People say marine CORE, and the Marien CORE boot camps are like going the Hell and back. Just imagine doing that 10X over. but it is a different kind of stress though. More of a mental stress than the Physical as in the Marine CORE boot camp.....:)
Ah, Dr. Fedace ... you did claim to be a doctor in the 'MTF forum', to go along with your "Standford med school" claims in the old "WHAT'S WRONG WITH THE STANFORD MEN'S TENNIS?" thread that was deleted in this forum. Have you received your tuition refund yet? Perhaps a reminder note is in order; "Two Hoom It MAY Consern at Standford Medikal Skool, Eye did naut get watt I thought I wood from my Standford eduKation. Pleeze send full refund. Yoars, Dr. Fedace." (Best of luck and you're very welcome.)

goober
09-01-2009, 09:35 AM
I graduated from Albert Einstein College of Medicine, NYC. My point was that med school and residency are times during which someone else is always supervising and ultimately signing off on your work, with possible exception of some clinic outpatients that are generally fairly routine. I didn't find those years all that stressful, perhaps because I enjoyed what I was doing and one is still considered to be learning their craft during those years, not so stressful unless you have problems handling the amount of work (I never really did). In practice life is very different. A colleague of mine sighed to me last week "I'm tired of being in charge of other people's lives," a stressful way of life one really doesn't have until being out in practice.

I agree that your level of responsibility increases 100 fold post residency, but I would guess that if you polled your classmates, a very small percentage would characterize their med school and residency years as carefree and easy. The type of residency aslo would greatly influence this perception (i.e general surgery vs derm.).

Are you in a primary care field?

aphex
09-01-2009, 09:38 AM
Ah, Dr. Fedace ... you did claim to be a doctor in the 'MTF forum', to go along with your "Standford med school" claims in the old "WHAT'S WRONG WITH THE STANFORD MEN'S TENNIS?" thread that was deleted in this forum. Have you received your tuition refund yet? Perhaps a reminder note is in order; "Two Hoom It MAY Consern at Standford Medikal Skool, Eye did naut get watt I thought I wood from my Standford eduKation. Pleeze send full refund. Yoars, Dr. Fedace." (Best of luck and you're very welcome.)

damn you! i spilled my drink:):):)

woodrow1029
09-01-2009, 09:44 AM
Ah, Dr. Fedace ... you did claim to be a doctor in the 'MTF forum', to go along with your "Standford med school" claims in the old "WHAT'S WRONG WITH THE STANFORD MEN'S TENNIS?" thread that was deleted in this forum. Have you received your tuition refund yet? Perhaps a reminder note is in order; "Two Hoom It MAY Consern at Standford Medikal Skool, Eye did naut get watt I thought I wood from my Standford eduKation. Pleeze send full refund. Yoars, Dr. Fedace." (Best of luck and you're very welcome.)
That's funny right there, I don't care who you are that's funny!!

-Larry The Cable Guy.

Joeyg
09-01-2009, 09:52 AM
Marine CORE???? The hits just keep on coming!! By the way, Dr. Fedace. You most certainly claimed to have gone to med school on more than one occasion, as others have pointed out.

Personally, I skipped grad school and joined the Peace Core instead.

goober
09-01-2009, 10:13 AM
Marine CORE???? The hits just keep on coming!! By the way, Dr. Fedace. You most certainly claimed to have gone to med school on more than one occasion, as others have pointed out.

Personally, I skipped grad school and joined the Peace Core instead.

What? You haven't heard of the marine core bootcamp? It's harder than the marine corps boot camp because you only workout on your core. Once you get through that you have insane abs I tell you!

Joeyg
09-01-2009, 10:19 AM
Ahh, to be back posting with my buddies, Goober and Tour Tenor. Just like the good, old days!

TT, absolutely classic post about the refund. I was thinking about something similar, but the last time I did something like that, it earned me a one week vacation from the boards.

As for the good doctor's claims....

aphex
09-01-2009, 10:38 AM
goober,

is the quote in your signature verbatim?


surely not...
this is too much--even for the good doctor...

Joeyg
09-01-2009, 10:41 AM
Aphex,

I can assure you. It is a direct quote. You can't make this stuff up. Too bad you didn't see his posts about liking hot, smelly blondes. Or perhaps, his preference for wearing women's undies.

goober
09-01-2009, 10:44 AM
goober,

is the quote in your signature verbatim?


surely not...
this is too much--even for the good doctor...

cut and paste baby! No need to edit.

Oh your quote is pretty funny too. Hmm who should I believe rational posting Ollinger or the "Standford" grad Feddie? Tough choice...

aphex
09-01-2009, 10:47 AM
Aphex,

I can assure you. It is a direct quote. You can't make this stuff up.

lolz...for some reason it's not very hard to believe...



aaah you guys in the doctor's ignore list...i feel like i've missed out on so much...:cry:

aphex
09-01-2009, 10:49 AM
sorry, i meant "ignore list"

Joeyg
09-01-2009, 10:58 AM
The original "What is wrong with Standford Men's Tennis" was approximately 2000 posts long. It was eventually deleted (much to my dismay) because it seemed Dr Fedace took exception to people calling him on his BS and "baiting" him into responding (even though we were on his "ignore" list).

That being said, the hilarity continues on an almost daily basis in other threads.

max
09-01-2009, 12:21 PM
I graduated from Albert Einstein College of Medicine, NYC. My point was that med school and residency are times during which someone else is always supervising and ultimately signing off on your work, with possible exception of some clinic outpatients that are generally fairly routine. I didn't find those years all that stressful, perhaps because I enjoyed what I was doing and one is still considered to be learning their craft during those years, not so stressful unless you have problems handling the amount of work (I never really did). In practice life is very different. A colleague of mine sighed to me last week "I'm tired of being in charge of other people's lives," a stressful way of life one really doesn't have until being out in practice.

An interesting comment from that fellow: a good part of me believes I would have the right temperament to have been a judge.

flyinghippos101
09-01-2009, 12:34 PM
Sheesh, guys like Fedace are getting into Med school now? Now, I'm definately changing my career choice.

Fee
09-01-2009, 12:35 PM
Lets stop spreading rumors. I Never said whether I did or I didn't. But i do understand exactly what the OP is talking about.. My family is full of Physicians and also I will Quote the good Dr. Dean Edell,,,,,,," Medical School and residency is like going thru the Marine Core Boot Camp 10 X over and over " It is that tough....:-?

Finally, confirmation of what I have suspected for so long, Feddie has adopted his older brother's persona on this forum (right down to the Stanford credentials).


This is too long for a signature, but everyone should read Dr. Feddie vs Ollinger from another thread: http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showpost.php?p=3754150&postcount=12996

Joeyg
09-01-2009, 01:33 PM
Sorry that I missed that thread. "Dr. Fedace" is a goofball that should be banned from the boards for giving out potentially dangerous medical advice. Especially, when you consider that he is not qualified to be giving it in the first place.

I know that I tease and rib him about his wackiness, but this was an instance where he proves to be a know-it-all m e n a c e.

super_forehand
09-01-2009, 01:44 PM
I graduated from Albert Einstein College of Medicine, NYC. My point was that med school and residency are times during which someone else is always supervising and ultimately signing off on your work, with possible exception of some clinic outpatients that are generally fairly routine. I didn't find those years all that stressful, perhaps because I enjoyed what I was doing and one is still considered to be learning their craft during those years, not so stressful unless you have problems handling the amount of work (I never really did). In practice life is very different. A colleague of mine sighed to me last week "I'm tired of being in charge of other people's lives," a stressful way of life one really doesn't have until being out in practice.

I can roll with that, but unless you are naive about the line of work you're getting into, having other peoples lives in you hand (and losing them at times) is about as certain as gravity for a doctor.

I completely changed careers after med school. My reason however is I just didn't like everything about it. *****y colleagues, people that dont want to be there, the liability insurance and state of current healthcare system, being in a building all day long, standing for 6 hours doing nothing but little movements with your hand. It started driving me crazy. It started in a cadaver lab i took as an undergrad. Man, it takes a really boring person to be a surgeon, I need more, even though learning and getting through med school wasnt easy, when you get a specialty and thats all you do for the rest of your life, man, that sucks.

I am so glad I got out of it while in time to start my new career. ufff

coyfish
09-01-2009, 02:20 PM
I can roll with that, but unless you are naive about the line of work you're getting into, having other peoples lives in you hand (and losing them at times) is about as certain as gravity for a doctor.

I completely changed careers after med school. My reason however is I just didn't like everything about it. *****y colleagues, people that dont want to be there, the liability insurance and state of current healthcare system, being in a building all day long, standing for 6 hours doing nothing but little movements with your hand. It started driving me crazy. It started in a cadaver lab i took as an undergrad. Man, it takes a really boring person to be a surgeon, I need more, even though learning and getting through med school wasnt easy, when you get a specialty and thats all you do for the rest of your life, man, that sucks.

I am so glad I got out of it while in time to start my new career. ufff


Sounds to me like you just didn't do your homework. Im not one to judge but there are many fields with very different applications. Standing for 6 hours performing a surgery is a rarity unless your ultra specialized for that type of work.

Anyway im a senior college student right now and I was accepted to FSU med school and FIU. I really wan't to go to baylor or UF. So . . . im going for round 3 on the MCAT. First score i got was a 23 (barely studied) followed by a 30. Shooting for a 32-34 on this next one. Hope I get lucky :). So much stress relief now that im in though. Im taking Kaplan and I pity the fools studying in there !!!

Trying to enjoy my time before med school starts. I heard the 1st years are just a lot of bookwork.

DoubleWindsor
09-01-2009, 02:36 PM
congrats on getting into fsu, they are a very florida only oriented school who really encourages all they're docs to become family docs and stay in rural florida, so it wasn't really for me.

super_forehand
09-01-2009, 02:46 PM
Sounds to me like you just didn't do your homework. Im not one to judge but there are many fields with very different applications. Standing for 6 hours performing a surgery is a rarity unless your ultra specialized for that type of work.

Anyway im a senior college student right now and I was accepted to FSU med school and FIU. I really wan't to go to baylor or UF. So . . . im going for round 3 on the MCAT. First score i got was a 23 (barely studied) followed by a 30. Shooting for a 32-34 on this next one. Hope I get lucky :). So much stress relief now that im in though. Im taking Kaplan and I pity the fools studying in there !!!

Trying to enjoy my time before med school starts. I heard the 1st years are just a lot of bookwork.

Ok here is my problem with this:

What are you talking about I didnt do my homework? I've already gone through the whole thing and passed with an above 80th percentile GPA in the country. You haven't even started and you're passing along your opinon, thats stretching a little bit beyond your experience level don't you think? But don't worry, kids your age do that, I dont mind.

Anyways, big number 2: it is not a rarety to be stading at the same spot for a couple of hours for a lot of physicians. And nowadays, if you want to be any good at your specialty, you will be so specialized you are going to be doing pretty much the same thing over and over again. After a couple years (probably just in residency), you've pretty much seen 95% of what you're going to see your whole career.

And by the way, don't give me the ER doctor crap, they just make sure you live, you go to a specialist to deal with all the different injuries. Stabilizing gets pretty old after a while.

Once I would tell you to revise your goals, make sure you know what you're going into, and tell you that you have no clue what it really is like. HOWEVER, I am really against that now that I've grown to realize you can't know what you're getting into in any profession until you actually start doing it. So if this is your dream, follow it, pray to God you'll be happy with it, but do realize that it might not be exactly what you thought it was. I would start by dropping the pre-conceived notion that because there are many fields and a wide range, your job is going to reflect that. Well, its the opposite, because there are so many fields and a wide range, like I've said before, if you're going to get any sort of name for what you do, its going to be (in your mind I suppose) ultra-specialized.

I willa dmit though, that coming from a family of doctors I really should have know better before I went through the whole thing.

Anyways, on a more lighter note, isn't it the best feeling in the world when you're already accepted and you put all that work into it and it feels like it finally paid off? And you see everyone else struggling to get there and you know your spot is there!

coyfish
09-01-2009, 04:36 PM
Ok here is my problem with this:

What are you talking about I didnt do my homework? I've already gone through the whole thing and passed with an above 80th percentile GPA in the country. You haven't even started and you're passing along your opinon, thats stretching a little bit beyond your experience level don't you think? But don't worry, kids your age do that, I dont mind.

Anyways, big number 2: it is not a rarety to be stading at the same spot for a couple of hours for a lot of physicians. And nowadays, if you want to be any good at your specialty, you will be so specialized you are going to be doing pretty much the same thing over and over again. After a couple years (probably just in residency), you've pretty much seen 95% of what you're going to see your whole career.

And by the way, don't give me the ER doctor crap, they just make sure you live, you go to a specialist to deal with all the different injuries. Stabilizing gets pretty old after a while.

Once I would tell you to revise your goals, make sure you know what you're going into, and tell you that you have no clue what it really is like. HOWEVER, I am really against that now that I've grown to realize you can't know what you're getting into in any profession until you actually start doing it. So if this is your dream, follow it, pray to God you'll be happy with it, but do realize that it might not be exactly what you thought it was. I would start by dropping the pre-conceived notion that because there are many fields and a wide range, your job is going to reflect that. Well, its the opposite, because there are so many fields and a wide range, like I've said before, if you're going to get any sort of name for what you do, its going to be (in your mind I suppose) ultra-specialized.

I willa dmit though, that coming from a family of doctors I really should have know better before I went through the whole thing.

Anyways, on a more lighter note, isn't it the best feeling in the world when you're already accepted and you put all that work into it and it feels like it finally paid off? And you see everyone else struggling to get there and you know your spot is there!


Well you sort of admit you should have known better . . . that was my point. Thats why you shadow doctors, volunteer, gain exposure , etc. before jumping into 10+ years of hardcore study. You never know EXACTLY what things are going to be like but you can learn what the various fields have to offer. Your description regarding 5+ hour procedures isn't very accurate. Not many specialties do that. My intention wasn't trying to take a shot at you. I just didn't agree with your seemingly one dimension view of medicine (not saying thats your view . . . just how it came across in your post).

As for your response . . . A little presumptious don't you agree?? Just FYI both my parents are VERY accomplished speacialized physicians. Not to mention 2 grandparents and 2 harvard graduate med school uncles. I have grown up surrounded by medicine. I know what life is like for them and many other docs. I don't know everything but I know what to expect. I do admire you getting through med school and saying . . . screw it lol. That takes some balls.

Standing in place for 2 hours is very different from what you said earlier ( 6 hour procedures). Of course some docs do procedures that take forever but thats not nearly a majority. I agree you can never really know EXACTLY what something is going to be like until you try it for yourself but you can get an idea so you are not suprised by anything.


And yes walking in the Kaplan center is such a pleasure now:) When I was studying I was always in a trance. It was like I was blazed out of my mind and depressed at the same time. Now that I think of it I should have taken aderol. It probably would have helped.

But really med school isn't TOO hard to get into. The hardest part imo is the MCAT. If you have a 3.2+ GPA with a 29+ MCAT and decent extra curriculars you will probably get in somewhere. No ivy league of course but in med school nonetheless.

coyfish
09-01-2009, 04:39 PM
congrats on getting into fsu, they are a very florida only oriented school who really encourages all they're docs to become family docs and stay in rural florida, so it wasn't really for me.

Thanks :). I actually transfered from FSU after my 1st 2 years at college. Didn't like it very much. Hope I don't have to go there. I would prob go to FIU over FSU. What you say is correct about the family oriented aspect.

I would LOVE to go to Baylor. I don't think my parents would like forking over that cash though lol. In state tuition ftw :).

super_forehand
09-01-2009, 05:25 PM
Well you sort of admit you should have known better . . . that was my point. Thats why you shadow doctors, volunteer, gain exposure , etc. before jumping into 10+ years of hardcore study. You never know EXACTLY what things are going to be like but you can learn what the various fields have to offer. Your description regarding 5+ hour procedures isn't very accurate. Not many specialties do that. My intention wasn't trying to take a shot at you. I just didn't agree with your seemingly one dimension view of medicine (not saying thats your view . . . just how it came across in your post).

As for your response . . . A little presumptious don't you agree?? Just FYI both my parents are VERY accomplished speacialized physicians. Not to mention 2 grandparents and 2 harvard graduate med school uncles. I have grown up surrounded by medicine. I know what life is like for them and many other docs. I don't know everything but I know what to expect. I do admire you getting through med school and saying . . . screw it lol. That takes some balls.

Standing in place for 2 hours is very different from what you said earlier ( 6 hour procedures). Of course some docs do procedures that take forever but thats not nearly a majority. I agree you can never really know EXACTLY what something is going to be like until you try it for yourself but you can get an idea so you are not suprised by anything.


And yes walking in the Kaplan center is such a pleasure now:) When I was studying I was always in a trance. It was like I was blazed out of my mind and depressed at the same time. Now that I think of it I should have taken aderol. It probably would have helped.

But really med school isn't TOO hard to get into. The hardest part imo is the MCAT. If you have a 3.2+ GPA with a 29+ MCAT and decent extra curriculars you will probably get in somewhere. No ivy league of course but in med school nonetheless.

Ok that's fair. I wasn't saying every specialty has 6 hour procedures, I just picked a number. Even 1 hour standing in place is too much for me. I couldn't stand it.

Just to clarify one thing I think you didn't understand about my point, I don't have a 1D view of medicine. Medicine in general is very broad, you're right. However, the individual doctors do usually have a 1D career in terms of what they do. As do most white collar work, it's the nature of having a required skill set that is hard to obtain and in demand. You can't have a superdoctor that can be really good at aortic coarctation and renal stenosis. Generally, you will have vascular surgeons (who are already specialized into vascular surgery) that are good at either or, it's rare to find a doctor that has made a name for himself doing all sorts of different procedures (except in plastic surgery of course, but then again plastic surgery is about as monitored as a white T-shirt contest).

Anyways, I'm sure you'll do fine. Being indoors all day, having to deal with the crap (and you know what it is) that surrounds medicine nowadays just doesn't sound like the kind of life I want to have.

In case you were wondering, I am applying to the Air Force at the end of the year for a pilot slot, which is what I've really always wanted to do. So it didn't really take balls, it just took re-evaluating where I wanted to be in 10 years (which now would seem like: DEAD, lol, but its not as risky as you would think).

Anyways, keep me posted on how your MCAT goes and if you end up getting in where you want. You sound like you have a level head on your shoulders, thats a rare commodity these days.

coyfish
09-01-2009, 05:49 PM
Wow you and I are similar. Ever since I was a little kid I wanted to be a fighter pilot. I must have seen Top Gun (cheesy favorite movie i know) like 300 times. Thats what I really want to do. I can settle for medicine though. VERY difficult to become a fighter pilot and even generic air force pilots. Best of luck to you my friend.

Im probably going to take the MCAT in december but ill keep you posted :).

Sentinel
09-01-2009, 07:50 PM
Sheesh, guys like Fedace are getting into Med school now? Now, I'm definately changing my career choice.
The good doctor did mention the other day that he was staring at his diploma on the wall in front of him.

Puddy
09-01-2009, 09:39 PM
The original "What is wrong with Standford Men's Tennis" was approximately 2000 posts long. It was eventually deleted (much to my dismay) because it seemed Dr Fedace took exception to people calling him on his BS and "baiting" him into responding (even though we were on his "ignore" list).

That being said, the hilarity continues on an almost daily basis in other threads.

I'd love to sit next to you...

super_forehand
09-01-2009, 09:53 PM
Wow you and I are similar. Ever since I was a little kid I wanted to be a fighter pilot. I must have seen Top Gun (cheesy favorite movie i know) like 300 times. Thats what I really want to do. I can settle for medicine though. VERY difficult to become a fighter pilot and even generic air force pilots. Best of luck to you my friend.

Im probably going to take the MCAT in december but ill keep you posted :).

You know it's funny, there is a huge correlation between medicine and piloting. One of the guys I know was an F-16 pilot, got out and went through med school and now hes a flight surgeon and has a reserve F-16 slot, pretty cool eh?

I know a handful of other stories like that one. Knew a guy that got into med school and embry riddle, went to embry riddle and now earns 15K a year as a regional pilot (he will grow, but it's still a tough choice).

Am not surprised at all you were considering that as well. Also know a guy that went the med school route, he is a loaded radiologist, has his own plane.

Anyhow, must sleep, instrument rating test end of the week, do post.

Joeyg
09-02-2009, 12:49 PM
Thank you, Puddy. I always like to hear someone that appreciates sarcasm.

By the way, I tawt I taw a puddy tat.

sureshs
09-02-2009, 01:18 PM
What do the following make annually these days after insurance costs, costs of operating their own office if applicable, etc but before taxes:

A general physician

A specialist

A surgeon

Just give me 3 numbers. No need to say that it depends or ranges widely, etc. Just 3 numbers.

coyfish
09-02-2009, 01:42 PM
Thats like asking what "a soccer player makes" some make 50K in the MLS and some make 20+ mil . . .
Joe Shmo gen prac: 150K

The other 2 vary too much to have any relavant meaning.

super_forehand
09-02-2009, 02:00 PM
What do the following make annually these days after insurance costs, costs of operating their own office if applicable, etc but before taxes:

A general physician

A specialist

A surgeon

Just give me 3 numbers. No need to say that it depends or ranges widely, etc. Just 3 numbers.

Well then its very hard to answer your question, because it does. Its like asking what does an artist make these days, one that does sculptures, one that does paintings, one that does music. Can you see the problem with your that?

We can probably go here:

http://lmgtfy.com/

and find an average, which is pretty much gonna mean nothing.

Another factor is how long they have been practicing. Take a look here:

http://www.allied-physicians.com/salary_surveys/physician-salaries.htm

Since I am interested as well and have the capacity to go out and hunt for info myself, here is some calculation (third source is here: http://www.mymedicalcareer.com.au/options/medical-indemnity/how-much-does-it-really-cost.php)



LETS BEGIN:

A general physician

Mean income ~ 150K
Tax (-28%) ~ 108K
Insurance ~ 8K
Net income = 100K, thats 8K a month.

A specialist

Most make abuot 300K, so lets take a Neonatal Specialist:

Mean income ~ 300K
Taxes (-33%) ~ 200K
Insurance ~ 10K
Net income = 190K, thats 16K a month.


A surgeon

Here is where the big money is, right? NOT

Lets take the grandaddy of em all, the neurosurgeon.

Mean income ~ 500K
Taxes (-35%) ~ 325K
Insurance ~ 50K
Net income = 275K, thats 23K a month


Summing it up, family doctor brings in about 100K, specialists about 200K, surgeons about 250-300K (net).

That is nothing, my friend. Any half *** executive with 15 some years on the job makes more then that. Doctors dont make crap anymore. It sucks for the amount of cash you put in, the commitment, how hard it is, etc. I really dont understand the middle cash PUSH for kids to become doctor/lawyers. I really really hate that, and I would probably be embarassed to be a doctor nowadays, its just ridiculous and out of control.

LuckyR
09-02-2009, 04:11 PM
We must unite!

Come here to complain/discuss the ludicrous hours or nights on call, the sleepless nights spent studying or trying not to fall asleep in the ICU. The grueling days of studying for step 1 or the nightmare that is obamacare.

Tell us a little about yourself. Where are you in the long process of becoming a doctor and what's your specialty (or what you think you would like to do). Why did you choose medicine and what do you think about the future of medicine?

You came to the wrong person. Med School and Residency nowadays (since the restriction in work hours) is too lax, people come out less well trained and with less of an appreciation of complex cases since they are out the door in 12-24 hours and seldom get to follow complex parts of cases from begining to end. Guaranteed days off cuts into procedure experience time and I personally would be reluctant to have any but the most routine surgical case done by a doc fresh out of residency (without a more senior doc around) currently. Of course folks were green fresh out of residency before the restriction in work hours, but it is bordering on dangerous nowadays.

It is the perfect storm of lack of experience: cutting training hours, expanding the types of cases to master and a decrease in the total number of major cases available to be done.

Rant over.

coyfish
09-02-2009, 04:59 PM
^^^^^^ lol
Here is my rant. Become a doctor and in 10 years come back here and type that bs again.

Doctors are becoming more and more specialized as super forehand mentioned. That means docs can focus on their fortes.

Amazing doctors and terrible doctors have and will always be produced. The system isn't perfect. There are some TERRIBLE older doctors out there and some brilliant ones in todays generation.

Do you even know how many years of study it takes to be a specialized doctor ??

Healthcare is not a bread and butter issue which is why Obama is having such a hard time with it. Many factors must work together to create a good healthcare system.

Do you have any support for your claim or is it just some random thought you came up with after you saw a work hour restriction.

DoubleWindsor
09-02-2009, 06:58 PM
You came to the wrong person. Med School and Residency nowadays (since the restriction in work hours) is too lax, people come out less well trained and with less of an appreciation of complex cases since they are out the door in 12-24 hours and seldom get to follow complex parts of cases from begining to end. Guaranteed days off cuts into procedure experience time and I personally would be reluctant to have any but the most routine surgical case done by a doc fresh out of residency (without a more senior doc around) currently. Of course folks were green fresh out of residency before the restriction in work hours, but it is bordering on dangerous nowadays.

It is the perfect storm of lack of experience: cutting training hours, expanding the types of cases to master and a decrease in the total number of major cases available to be done.

Rant over.

You are EXTREMELY misinformed and have some audacity to talk about something which you know NOTHING about.

You my friend, are an idiot.

btw the restriction is 80 hours weekly, whew, thank god for that huge break. thats probably 80x more than you work a week.

super_forehand
09-02-2009, 07:08 PM
You are EXTREMELY misinformed and have some audacity to talk about something which you know NOTHING about.

You my friend, are an idiot.

btw the restriction is 80 hours weekly, whew, thank god for that huge break. thats probably 80x more than you work a week.

Audacity lol, who are you, grandpa?

DoubleWindsor
09-02-2009, 07:28 PM
I'm a man with a vocabulary

Quite unlike yourself

sureshs
09-03-2009, 08:35 AM
Well then its very hard to answer your question, because it does. Its like asking what does an artist make these days, one that does sculptures, one that does paintings, one that does music. Can you see the problem with your that?

We can probably go here:

http://lmgtfy.com/

and find an average, which is pretty much gonna mean nothing.

Another factor is how long they have been practicing. Take a look here:

http://www.allied-physicians.com/salary_surveys/physician-salaries.htm

Since I am interested as well and have the capacity to go out and hunt for info myself, here is some calculation (third source is here: http://www.mymedicalcareer.com.au/options/medical-indemnity/how-much-does-it-really-cost.php)



LETS BEGIN:

A general physician

Mean income ~ 150K
Tax (-28%) ~ 108K
Insurance ~ 8K
Net income = 100K, thats 8K a month.

A specialist

Most make abuot 300K, so lets take a Neonatal Specialist:

Mean income ~ 300K
Taxes (-33%) ~ 200K
Insurance ~ 10K
Net income = 190K, thats 16K a month.


A surgeon

Here is where the big money is, right? NOT

Lets take the grandaddy of em all, the neurosurgeon.

Mean income ~ 500K
Taxes (-35%) ~ 325K
Insurance ~ 50K
Net income = 275K, thats 23K a month


Summing it up, family doctor brings in about 100K, specialists about 200K, surgeons about 250-300K (net).

That is nothing, my friend. Any half *** executive with 15 some years on the job makes more then that. Doctors dont make crap anymore. It sucks for the amount of cash you put in, the commitment, how hard it is, etc. I really dont understand the middle cash PUSH for kids to become doctor/lawyers. I really really hate that, and I would probably be embarassed to be a doctor nowadays, its just ridiculous and out of control.

I would rephrase them as:

142K

290K

450K

before taxes, the way salaries are normally presented.

142 is reachable by people in several professions at mid-level with certain experience (10 to 15 years say). Those people will never reach the second mark of 290 though.

Very few people become executives, and executives in small outfits have position only, not much money.

Also keep in mind that doctors will keep their jobs thru any recession most of the time, while the numbers for other professions can go up and down. If they become unemployed, it is 0, or later they may find a job which paid much less.

We must restore the idea of medical profession as a service, not some field where it is extraordinarily difficult to get in, but pays off big later.

sureshs
09-03-2009, 08:37 AM
Guys, leave FewAce alone. He is a cool guy.

goober
09-03-2009, 09:27 AM
You are EXTREMELY misinformed and have some audacity to talk about something which you know NOTHING about.

You my friend, are an idiot.

btw the restriction is 80 hours weekly, whew, thank god for that huge break. thats probably 80x more than you work a week.

You do realize the LuckyR is a practicing physician not a some noob student? You should be careful whom you call idiot. I don't agree with everything he says about the residency hour restrictions, but he 100x more knowledgeable about what he is talking about than you.

sureshs
09-03-2009, 09:49 AM
One day doctors will be obsolete. The patient will step into a booth where he will be scanned completely. Then he will present his problems to a natural language processing system, which will then consult an artificial intelligence system to find the medical details. Then nanoprobes will inject medicines into his body and that would be the end.

In fact, gene therapy will fix all hereditary problems right after birth, so medical visits will be minimum.

super_forehand
09-03-2009, 09:53 AM
One day doctors will be obsolete. The patient will step into a booth where he will be scanned completely. Then he will present his problems to a natural language processing system, which will then consult an artificial intelligence system to find the medical details. Then nanoprobes will inject medicines into his body and that would be the end.

In fact, gene therapy will fix all hereditary problems right after birth, so medical visits will be minimum.

What happens when you fall off your flying cycle?

LuckyR
09-03-2009, 10:10 AM
You are EXTREMELY misinformed and have some audacity to talk about something which you know NOTHING about.

You my friend, are an idiot.

btw the restriction is 80 hours weekly, whew, thank god for that huge break. thats probably 80x more than you work a week.


Idiot, eh? I truly know what I am talking about having lived through it personally. Yeah, 80 hours is a pittance, we used to take call every third routinely (which can be as high as 102 hours a week, BTW). But were on every other night call during vacations, which would be as high as 116 hours a week.

So, yeah, comparitively it is a huge break (if losing out on clinical experience could be called a "break").

You are the uninformed one since you only have observed one system, I have observed both before and after the change (and have observed the surgical skills of residents, whom I teach professionally, in both eras).