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View Full Version : Would YOU Call a Foot Fault?


ttbrowne
09-14-2009, 04:57 AM
I don't believe anyone has posted this question.

drakulie
09-14-2009, 05:04 AM
Yes, and anyone who doesn't play by the rules needs to find a sport where they are allowed to make up the rules as they go along.

jonnythan
09-14-2009, 05:05 AM
At that point in the match, I don't call it unless it's egregious.

wmoore
09-14-2009, 05:05 AM
why does it matter WHO commits the foot fault? Wondering why you phrased the question that way - or does it really not matter?

BHud
09-14-2009, 05:08 AM
At that point in the match, I don't call it unless it's egregious.

Exactly...replay is highly inconclusive...what a way to lose a key point. Of course, they way she lost the match is a different story all together...

Henry Kaspar
09-14-2009, 05:09 AM
There was no foot fault, or at the very least it was a very shady situation. Hence, of course I would not call foot fault.

Gorecki
09-14-2009, 05:16 AM
^^^ - it's clear as water and without a shade of doubt! she foot faulted: Period!



on topic: yes... for those who dont want to follow the rules of a certain sport, there is always "CALVIN BALL"

ClubHoUno
09-14-2009, 05:25 AM
I can safely say, that all who votes NO in this poll can adn will not be considered true tennis players.

They should take up wrestling or just go hit balls on the wall, because they surely DO NOT belong on any tennnis court any where in the world.

I see a LOT of amateur players at my club constantly footfaulting themselves during matches, but no one is there to tell them about it.
A footfault is a god dam# footfault, wheter it's Federe, Serena or a nobody who makes the footfault.

latinking
09-14-2009, 05:27 AM
Tennis is different from any other sports. Doesn't matter if its Fed, Nadal or just a beginner. If the ball is out, its out!! If your foot is over the line, its a foot fault. Other sports like football or boxing or basketball, ( whatever ) its up to the ref to decide to call fouls or not. Tennis isn't like that. Its a lines game!! Its either in or out, over the line or not. Its really that simple!! End of story.

mrw
09-14-2009, 05:28 AM
I am a tournament player and ALWAYS call foot faults when I see them. Why would I treat some fat assed diva any different?

Lambsscroll
09-14-2009, 05:33 AM
Lines people aren't asked to take in outside circumstances before making a call.

jonnythan
09-14-2009, 05:34 AM
^^^ - it's clear as water and without a shade of doubt! she foot faulted: Period!

I'd like to see your evidence, because the only angles I've seen have been inconclusive at best.

TennisNinja
09-14-2009, 05:35 AM
Tennis is different from any other sports. Doesn't matter if its Fed, Nadal or just a beginner. If the ball is out, its out!! If your foot is over the line, its a foot fault. Other sports like football or boxing or basketball, ( whatever ) its up to the ref to decide to call fouls or not. Tennis isn't like that. Its a lines game!! Its either in or out, over the line or not. Its really that simple!! End of story.

Great point. The rules stay thesame regardless and yes, I wouldve called it.

Gorecki
09-14-2009, 05:37 AM
I'd like to see your evidence, because the only angles I've seen have been inconclusive at best.

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm24/lambfreack/Serena.jpg

Inconclusive my big fat derriere...

btw: this is a screen shot of the movie... you could have done it yourself!

PatrickB
09-14-2009, 05:39 AM
I'd like to see your evidence, because the only angles I've seen have been inconclusive at best.

We have great evidence that you seem to want to ignore - the linesperson sitting on the line saw a foot fault.

To be sitting on a line, a linesperson has to have proven 20/20 corrected vision. In addition, that linesperson has, if I understand correctly, been in several other matches where hawkeye was available, which means that *every* close call she's made in past matches on such courts have been used to evaluate her judgement prior to putting her on that court.

jonnythan
09-14-2009, 05:41 AM
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm24/lambfreack/Serena.jpg

Inconclusive my big fat derriere...

btw: this is a screen shot of the movie... you could have done it yourself!

That is inconclusive. It's a horrible angle.

I'm not a Serena fan. I don't give a crap whether she won or lost. But claiming that this image is somehow proof of a foot fault is, frankly, silly.

jonnythan
09-14-2009, 05:42 AM
We have great evidence that you seem to want to ignore - the linesperson sitting on the line saw a foot fault.

To be sitting on a line, a linesperson has to have proven 20/20 corrected vision. In addition, that linesperson has, if I understand correctly, been in several other matches where hawkeye was available, which means that *every* close call she's made in past matches on such courts have been used to evaluate her judgement prior to putting her on that court.

Oh, so they're incapable of mistakes!

Why even use Hawkeye if they never mess up, then? ;)

Gorecki
09-14-2009, 05:44 AM
That is inconclusive. It's a horrible angle.

I'm not a Serena fan. I don't give a crap whether she won or lost. But claiming that this image is somehow proof of a foot fault is, frankly, silly.

even if you discount the Paralax error given by the angle, she is well inside the baseline... silly is looking at that and make such claim.

ps: in case you are as ignorant as your posts regarding this subject make you look, paralax is:

http://encyclopedia.farlex.com/Paralax

joe sch
09-14-2009, 05:45 AM
That was a historic call which was very unexpected.
The linesperson did her job and it was a very surprising call at that point of the match.

Im sure there was much history that led up to that call including bad treatment and intimidation. Often times, very unexpected and surprising events are based on a history of unknown events which help to explain a surprising event. It turned out to be an obvious case of assault. Sometimes events do turn out fair in the end.

jonnythan
09-14-2009, 05:46 AM
even if you discount the Paralx error given by the angle, she is well inside the baseline... silly is looking at that and make such claim.

ps: in case you are as ignorant as your posts regarding this subject make you look, paralax is:

http://encyclopedia.farlex.com/Paralax

Wow, so I claim that one poor image of a possible foot fault is inconclusive and suddenly I'm ignorant and stupid!

That's about par for the course for TW, though, unfortunately.

Look, the image is not conclusive. Period.

jelle v
09-14-2009, 05:53 AM
In the Serena-Clijsters case, I would only call it if it was on the first serve, I wouldn't call it on the second service, knowing that my call would result in a double fault, which would lead to 2 matchpoints in such a high profile match so far in the tournament.

People can talk all they want about slippery slopes with this reasoning and argue that a rule is a rule. But truth is, Clijsters wouldn't care if Serena's toe would have touched the line. And actually no one would have known about it if it wasan't called, because if there was any footfault, it was minimal at best. Have you actually ever seen a professional tennismatch where the receiver starts complaining to the umpire that the server made a footfault of half a centimeter?

Before I hear the argument that this reasoning would implie that line judges give balls in on important points when the ball is only a little out.. A ball being in or out is the essence of the tennisgame, so ofcourse that will always be a yes or no call without any room for negotiation. In the case of a minimal footfault (at best) it is at the discretion of the linesjudge and the linesjudge should take all circumstances into consideration. In the case of Serena, the call shouldn't have been made imo.

And NO, I'm am not saying that had Serena stepped over the line with her entire foot on that serve (or something like that), that the call should not be made.

BTW: I'm not defending Serena's behavior at all. She was way out of line and the point penalty was the least she deserved. You don't go telling linesjudges that you will shove a ball down their throat.

Gorecki
09-14-2009, 05:54 AM
Wow, so I claim that one poor image of a possible foot fault is inconclusive and suddenly I'm ignorant and stupid!

That's about par for the course for TW, though, unfortunately.

Look, the image is not conclusive. Period.

i never used the word stupid. and for the record i dont think you are either. your position on this subject on the other hand is seemengly ignorant!

the image is more than enough for me based on my experience!

guess we have to agree to disagree!

carlos djackal
09-14-2009, 05:54 AM
Yes I would, rules should be upheld from the first point of the match up to the last.........regardless if it is in the match point or not, it is the responsibility of every player to watch out for footfault simply because it is a violation...........

Gorecki
09-14-2009, 05:56 AM
Have you actually ever seen a professional tennismatch where the receiver starts complaining to the umpire that the server made a footfault of half a centimeter?.

could it be because the receiver is looking at the ball point of contact and hoping the line judges do their job?


genius at sight...

hankash
09-14-2009, 05:57 AM
Rules are made not to be broken. There are no clauses that indicate foot faults should not get called in tight games. In a game where every millimeter counts, that foot fault could be the difference between an ace and a fault.

Fedfan1234
09-14-2009, 05:58 AM
It looks to me like she hits the line, but I agree the angle is horrible. Where are all the nice line camera's when we need them?
At best the call is doubtfull, so why not give the benefit of the doubt to the woman that made the call and clearly had the best view. Don't forget the only thing she had to look at were the feet of Williams, it is really difficult to get this call wrong.

jelle v
09-14-2009, 06:00 AM
could it be because the receiver is looking at the ball point of contact and hoping the line judges do their job?

genius at sight...

So I take it you agree with the rest of my post :)

Furthermore, I think you are the genius at sight.. or maybe I actually am some sort of genius because I have noticed on several occassions that my opponent made footfaults.

You think Clijsters wouldn't notice if Serena stepped over the line entirely, because Clijsters is looking at the ball? :lol:

Gorecki
09-14-2009, 06:07 AM
So I take it you agree with the rest of my post :)

Furthermore, I think you are the genius at sight.. or maybe I actually am some sort of genius because I have noticed on several occassions that my opponent made footfaults.

You think Clijsters wouldn't notice if Serena stepped over the line entirely, because Clijsters is looking at the ball? :lol:

well.. then you are indeed one...

if you can look at two points in the same moment during a tennis match than i can land one foot in Calais and the other one i Dover and wash stuff in the channel...

darthpwner
09-14-2009, 06:08 AM
Yea if I was a linesman on the server's side. If I was a player, I wouldn't be able to see that clearly from the other side of the court, so no in that case.

jelle v
09-14-2009, 06:14 AM
well.. then you are indeed one...

if you can look at two points in the same moment during a tennis match than i can land one foot in Calais and the other one i Dover and wash stuff in the channel...

Your reasoning is flawed.. you don't have to look at two points at the same time..

Gorecki
09-14-2009, 06:17 AM
Your reasoning is flawed.. you don't have to look at two points at the same time..

right.. so when you receive serve i gather that you look at your opponents feet and trust your spiderman abilities to guess the trajectory of the ball...

right...

Send my regards to Cat woman...

forehand_dude
09-14-2009, 06:19 AM
I am a tournament player and ALWAYS call foot faults when I see them. Why would I treat some fat assed diva any different?

You mean you call foot faults on your opponent? How can you even tell if they foot fault from the other side of the net? Unless they are like six inches inside the line, I don't see how you can call that.

jonnythan
09-14-2009, 06:20 AM
right.. so when you receive serve i gather that you look at your opponents feet and trust your spiderman abilities to guess the trajectory of the ball...

right...

Send my regards to Cat woman...

I guess I am Spider-man, because I do glance at the feet once they set up and start their ball toss.

jelle v
09-14-2009, 06:21 AM
right.. so when you receive serve i gather that you look at your opponents feet and trust your spiderman abilities to guess the trajectory of the ball...

right...

Send my regards to Cat woman...

Do you actually play tennis? :confused:

Furthermore, if you have to focus at one point to see something, I feel sorry for you :(

jonnythan
09-14-2009, 06:21 AM
You mean you call foot faults on your opponent? How can you even tell if they foot fault from the other side of the net? Unless they are like six inches inside the line, I don't see how you can call that.

They're not that far away. It's tough to impossible if it's close but a lot of people have their foot an inch or more on the line, making it very obvious. I've called a foot fault on an opponent in a doubles match when I wasn't the one receiving.

Bud
09-14-2009, 06:21 AM
I don't believe anyone has posted this question.

It's not a matter of calling it... it's making damned sure that you call it correctly... especially at such a critical point in a match.

jelle v
09-14-2009, 06:25 AM
You mean you call foot faults on your opponent? How can you even tell if they foot fault from the other side of the net? Unless they are like six inches inside the line, I don't see how you can call that.

If player steps his foot on or over the line you can easily see that from the baseline as a receiver. In doubles it is even more obvious for the netplayer.

Ofcourse you can't tell from the baseline if someone is making a very small footfault, but that is the entire point I'm making here.. no one (except maybe some footfault fundamentalists) actually gives a ***** if the server makes a footfault of 3 millimeters.

Bjorn99
09-14-2009, 06:26 AM
ON a second serve at 6-5. Not unless I was getting paid by the people betting on the match.

C'mon this stinks of a betting scandal to me. That was just a rude call.

And another thing that stinks, is that WE cannot get a look from the side of the CALL.

Doesn't that seem strange in this world of photo coverage from every angle?

That picture is about as clear as the Zapruder. No way you can say yay or nay to that photo? Betting scandal, bet on it.

Gorecki
09-14-2009, 06:26 AM
Do you actually play tennis? :confused:

no of course not... in fact i am expecting you teach me bacause you are so special and have superhuman abilities you must be a top pro...

Furthermore, if you have to focus at one point to see something, I feel sorry for you :(

you see... you should not compare special humans like you to us mortals!




ps:man.. how i would love to take you to a court!

jelle v
09-14-2009, 06:34 AM
ps:man.. how i would love to take you to a court!

No you wouldn't man.. I suck so much, I can barely get the ball over the net 3 times in a row.. It wouldn't even be funny for you beating me..

But seriously, you make a sarcastic post, you can expect a sarcastic post back. I'll stop the sarcasm here and will just agree to disagree about being able to see a footfault being made.

And seriously, I'm not that good of a tennis player. from what I've read, my rating would be something like 4 - 4.5 or so. But it doesn't matter, almost nobody here plays professional level, yet we all have our "educated" opinion and for many discussions we actually don't have to be professional tennis players.

jonnythan
09-14-2009, 06:37 AM
That picture is about as clear as the Zapruder.

Hah. Well put.

Enigma_87
09-14-2009, 06:41 AM
Of course, no matter the score, no matter who plays. Rules are rules and should be observed.

No one should bend the rules just to make the match "more exciting" for the crowd.

Gorecki
09-14-2009, 06:56 AM
No you wouldn't man.. I suck so much, I can barely get the ball over the net 3 times in a row.. It wouldn't even be funny for you beating me..

But seriously, you make a sarcastic post, you can expect a sarcastic post back. I'll stop the sarcasm here and will just agree to disagree about being able to see a footfault being made.

And seriously, I'm not that good of a tennis player. from what I've read, my rating would be something like 4 - 4.5 or so. But it doesn't matter, almost nobody here plays professional level, yet we all have our "educated" opinion and for many discussions we actually don't have to be professional tennis players.

fair enough...

coloskier
09-14-2009, 07:17 AM
Yes, and anyone who doesn't play by the rules needs to find a sport where they are allowed to make up the rules as they go along.

Yes, like the NBA. :)

Henry Kaspar
09-14-2009, 07:17 AM
Of course, no matter the score, no matter who plays. Rules are rules and should be observed.


In this case there should have been no call as there was no foot fault.

The truth of the matter is though that the naked eye can rarely identify a foot fault with any certainty.

Enigma_87
09-14-2009, 07:25 AM
In this case there should have been no call as there was no foot fault.

how do you know that? Any video/pic evidence?

The linesman (or woman) had the best angle, closest to the situation, and still she made the wrong choice? How so?


The truth of the matter is though that the naked eye can rarely identify a foot fault with any certainty.

Really? You can't see if someone is stepping over a line from 5 feet away? DOn't be ridiculous.

Henry Kaspar
09-14-2009, 07:28 AM
how do you know that? Any video/pic evidence?

Of course there is video evidence. The lineswoman got it wrong.

katarddx
09-14-2009, 07:37 AM
At that point in the match, I don't call it unless it's egregious.

soooo.... at what point of the match would you call it? pick and chose?

katarddx
09-14-2009, 07:39 AM
Of course there is video evidence. The lineswoman got it wrong. but you are the only one who had seen it????

ClubHoUno
09-14-2009, 07:39 AM
In the Serena-Clijsters case, I would only call it if it was on the first serve, I wouldn't call it on the second service, knowing that my call would result in a double fault, which would lead to 2 matchpoints in such a high profile match so far in the tournament.

People can talk all they want about slippery slopes with this reasoning and argue that a rule is a rule. But truth is, Clijsters wouldn't care if Serena's toe would have touched the line. And actually no one would have known about it if it wasan't called, because if there was any footfault, it was minimal at best. Have you actually ever seen a professional tennismatch where the receiver starts complaining to the umpire that the server made a footfault of half a centimeter?

Before I hear the argument that this reasoning would implie that line judges give balls in on important points when the ball is only a little out.. A ball being in or out is the essence of the tennisgame, so ofcourse that will always be a yes or no call without any room for negotiation. In the case of a minimal footfault (at best) it is at the discretion of the linesjudge and the linesjudge should take all circumstances into consideration. In the case of Serena, the call shouldn't have been made imo.

And NO, I'm am not saying that had Serena stepped over the line with her entire foot on that serve (or something like that), that the call should not be made.

BTW: I'm not defending Serena's behavior at all. She was way out of line and the point penalty was the least she deserved. You don't go telling linesjudges that you will shove a ball down their throat.

Rules are rules. You sound like you don't follow them 100%, as as such you are a cheater and not worthy of playing the game of tennis. You should stick to WWE wretlemania, it's right down your alley....... Sooooo sad to read a post like this one.......

jelle v
09-14-2009, 07:44 AM
Rules are rules. You sound like you don't follow them 100%, as as such you are a cheater and not worthy of playing the game of tennis. You should stick to WWE wretlemania, it's right down your alley....... Sooooo sad to read a post like this one.......

Seriously? How can you tell if I do or do not follow the tennisrules.. You make a great leap from the phrase "It sounds like" to the phrase "as such you are a cheater". So sad to read a post that attacks the poster personally instead of posting a decent argument.

I for one stand 10 centimeters behind the baseline to ensure I don't make a footfault..

rascaypica
09-14-2009, 07:52 AM
Yes, and anyone who doesn't play by the rules needs to find a sport where they are allowed to make up the rules as they go along.

THis time I am with drakulie. How many aces are made by 2 inches???

Enigma_87
09-14-2009, 08:15 AM
Of course there is video evidence. The lineswoman got it wrong.

care to show us a link?

rocket
09-14-2009, 08:21 AM
Before I hear the argument that this reasoning would implie that line judges give balls in on important points when the ball is only a little out.. A ball being in or out is the essence of the tennisgame, so ofcourse that will always be a yes or no call without any room for negotiation. In the case of a minimal footfault (at best) it is at the discretion of the linesjudge and the linesjudge should take all circumstances into consideration. In the case of Serena, the call shouldn't have been made imo.

You do realize the linesperson is not supposed to exercise ANY discretion, don't you? When a linesperson sees a fault, he/she should call it. It's up to the umpire to let it stand or overrule.

Score-keeping is the job of the umpire on the tennis court, not the linesperson's. Whether the call is made at a crucial moment or not is completely irrelevant.

This is the US Open, not some local tournament.

rocket
09-14-2009, 08:23 AM
I for one stand 10 centimeters behind the baseline to ensure I don't make a footfault..

Yes, because a foot fault makes you lose a serve, whether it's 1/2cm or the entire foot.