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View Full Version : Which was the worst performance by Federer in a slam final-Wimby 08, AO 09 or USO 09?


GasquetGOAT
09-15-2009, 05:18 AM
Not taking anything away from the brilliant performance by Del Potro who fully deserves the USO title by beating both No.2 and No.1 convincingly. (Wonder how Andy Murray must feel now?)

Which was the worst performance by Federer in a slam final-Wimby 08, AO 09 or USO 09? USO 09 and AO 09 were very similar in many ways. Hampered by the low first serve percentage, had many chances in a couple of sets to close out the match early and of course the complete collapse in final set losing it 2-6 in both occasions.

And no, we are not comparing any French Open finals in this thread. Out of the three: Wimby 08, AO 09 or USO 09, which one?

Cup8489
09-15-2009, 05:19 AM
I would think the FO 2008 was his worst..

he played well in Wimbledon, but didn't take the giant opportunity he had at 3-4 30-40 nadal serving, he could have won the match.

Australia he just fell apart, but had a bad serving day, same situation here, bad serving.

Both men in those finals had to earn their win, though.

I don't know if i like you saying those three were his worst..

Bud
09-15-2009, 05:22 AM
I would think the FO 2008 was his worst..

he played well in Wimbledon, but didn't take the giant opportunity he had at 3-4 30-40 nadal serving, he could have won the match.

Australia he just fell apart, but had a bad serving day, same situation here, bad serving.

Both men in those finals had to earn their win, though.

I don't know if i like you saying those three were his worst..

Agreed. Nadal made him look like a schoolboy out there :oops:

bhallic24
09-15-2009, 05:22 AM
I would think the FO 2008 was his worst..

he played well in Wimbledon, but didn't take the giant opportunity he had at 3-4 30-40 nadal serving, he could have won the match.

Australia he just fell apart, but had a bad serving day, same situation here, bad serving.

Both men in those finals had to earn their win, though.

I don't know if i like you saying those three were his worst..

i love your darth federer goat icon there. nice touch with the wilson k factor racket too. lol.

GasquetGOAT
09-15-2009, 05:23 AM
I would think the FO 2008 was his worst..

he played well in Wimbledon, but didn't take the giant opportunity he had at 3-4 30-40 nadal serving, he could have won the match.

Australia he just fell apart, but had a bad serving day, same situation here, bad serving.

Both men in those finals had to earn their win, though.

I don't know if i like you saying those three were his worst..

I don't consider those French finals with Nadal because he was the underdog as always so those loses were expected. Though in these 3 non-French finals he was expected to win and he had many chances to win.

roddickfan1000
09-15-2009, 05:24 AM
If federer loses its because he played crap. According to federer fans.

GasquetGOAT
09-15-2009, 05:25 AM
Agreed. Nadal made him look like a schoolboy out there :oops:

Can we not go there? I could say Del Potro made Nadal look like a schoolboy in the USO semis.

Like I said I don't consider those French finals because he was the underdog but in these 3 non-French finals he was expected to win and he had many chances to win.

roddickfan1000
09-15-2009, 05:26 AM
true, fed should have won in SS yesterday

GasquetGOAT
09-15-2009, 05:26 AM
If federer loses its because he played crap. According to federer fans.

No one said he played crap.

This is a relative question, which was the worst performance out of the three, relatively.

JankovicFan
09-15-2009, 06:07 AM
Wimby '08 was great. He could have won that by a coin toss. Nadal's luck was better. AO 09 and USO 09 were very similar, because Fed's game "went away" in the later sets.

Cesc Fabregas
09-15-2009, 06:09 AM
Yestaday. In Wimbledon and Australia, he ran into the great Nadal.

Turning Pro
09-15-2009, 06:27 AM
Wimby '08 was great. He could have won that by a coin toss. Nadal's luck was better. AO 09 and USO 09 were very similar, because Fed's game "went away" in the later sets.

Or he could have gone out in straights barring the rain delay (Wimby 08).

mandy01
09-15-2009, 06:29 AM
Wimbledon 08 first two sets .It is the worst tennis he's ever played on grass.Nadal was playing great but at the beginning he too seemed nervous..majority of Roger's UFEs came in those first two sets.
AO 09..cannot forget those 7 UFEs in a row..dreadful.

Cesc Fabregas
09-15-2009, 06:31 AM
Wimbledon 08 first two sets .It is the worst tennis he's ever played on grass.Nadal was playing great but at the beginning he too seemed nervous..majority of Roger's UFEs came in those first two sets.
AO 09..cannot forget those 7 UFEs in a row..dreadful.

I disagree. I think Federer played very well in both matches (apart from the 5th set in Australia) but Nadal was too good.

dh003i
09-15-2009, 06:36 AM
If federer loses its because he played crap. According to federer fans.

He didn't play like crap in any of those finals. He played very good, but not great at Wimbledon '08. He played good at the AO and USO finals in '09. In all cases, his serve is ultimately what cost him the match, especially the AO and USO.

I don't see why it is so hard for some people here to concede that Federer isn't going to lose when he's playing his best (except vs. Nadal on clay), and that when he has lost in those finals, he wasn't playing his best. He as 15 GS, at least 1 on every surface. It is obvious he is the best player overall, and the best on every surface except clay.

I'm sorry, but at the AO, Wimbledon, or USO, if Federer plays his best tennis (or near there), he isn't going to lose. The most recent examples of Federer's best would be AO '07, FO '09, Wimbledon '07 and to a lesser extent '09, and USO '08. (I'm talking about in the finals mainly).

JankovicFan
09-15-2009, 06:40 AM
Or he could have gone out in straights barring the rain delay (Wimby 08).Part of being great is overcoming a slow start.

TheNatural
09-15-2009, 06:42 AM
I think Wimbledon 09, but Roddick choked it away regardless . If Roddick didn't choke that tie break then he would have won in 4. And Roddick is no Del Potro, Roddick has nothing on his return game or baseline game compared to Delpo.

roddickfan1000
09-15-2009, 07:10 AM
I think Wimbledon 09, but Roddick choked it away regardless . If Roddick didn't choke that tie break then he would have won in 4. And Roddick is no Del Potro, Roddick has nothing on his return game or baseline game compared to Delpo.

Actually, the roddick of 03/04 could hurt you from the baseline. He has more power than delpo - he chooses not to use it.

Cyan
09-15-2009, 08:04 AM
Fo 2008...........................

zhassan
09-15-2009, 08:15 AM
French Open 2008

Turning Pro
09-15-2009, 08:31 AM
He didn't play like crap in any of those finals. He played very good, but not great at Wimbledon '08. He played good at the AO and USO finals in '09. In all cases, his serve is ultimately what cost him the match, especially the AO and USO.

I don't see why it is so hard for some people here to concede that Federer isn't going to lose when he's playing his best (except vs. Nadal on clay), and that when he has lost in those finals, he wasn't playing his best. He as 15 GS, at least 1 on every surface. It is obvious he is the best player overall, and the best on every surface except clay.

I'm sorry, but at the AO, Wimbledon, or USO, if Federer plays his best tennis (or near there), he isn't going to lose. The most recent examples of Federer's best would be AO '07, FO '09, Wimbledon '07 and to a lesser extent '09, and USO '08. (I'm talking about in the finals mainly).

If. IF. IF.IF. If the rain delay wasn't there in the Wimby final, Fed would have been out in straights, Nadal had match points in the 4th regardless. IF nadal hadn't played THE LONGEST MENS SINGLES MATCH in AO HISTORY, he'd have played his best and demolished Fed, Fed certainly wouldn't have taken it to 5 had he been in Nadal's poisition. And Del Potro Could have closed it out in 4 had he not let that break slip straight away 4-3 in the 3rd.

IF, BUTS. Federer was lucky he took them all to 5 in the first place.

The-Champ
09-15-2009, 08:50 AM
Actually, the roddick of 03/04 could hurt you from the baseline. He has more power than delpo - he chooses not to use it.


the huge difference between the two is the bh and return.

roddickfan1000
09-15-2009, 09:07 AM
the huge difference between the two is the bh and return.

roddick had the better serve and forehand - by far.

Benhur
09-15-2009, 09:12 AM
I don't see why it is so hard for some people here to concede that Federer isn't going to lose when he's playing his best (except vs. Nadal on clay), and that when he has lost in those finals, he wasn't playing his best.

There is no such thing as a player who cannot lose if playing “his best.” All that is needed for this to happen, is that the opponent play better than him. There are no exceptions to this trivial axiom, except in mythology.

Leaving the above aside, the notion of "playing your best" is normally understood as an absolute, meaning, an inherent ability that depends only on the player, not on the opponent. But this, again, is a myth.

Because how well you can play is to a large extent determined by how well your opponent lets you play. In other words, it is determined by how well your opponent is playing. If your opponent has no weapons to hurt you with, this will make it a lot easier to “play your best”. If your opponent starts hitting you off the court in rallies, you have to try something different, which normally means you have to go outside your safety zone by going for shots (including serves) you don’t need to try against a lesser opponent.

Federer played at a very high level throughout most of this tournament, including the final. He was clearly superior to Del Potro in the first set. Then it was pretty even in the next three, and then he was visibly out of moves by the end of the fifth (and slightly worn out), trying to end the points as early as possible because the alternative would be even worse. After the first set, Del Potro kept up a relentless, steady pressure with superb court coverage and shotmaking, and Federer kept up with it for three sets, but in the end he could not keep up with it.

I should also say that Unforced Errors may very well be the most subjective and therefore useless statistic in tennis. The number of “unforce errors” by a player is entirely dependent on:

1) who is counting
2) the opponent’s level of play

The fact that, as a general rule, the number of “unforced” errors tends to correlate very strongly with your opponent’s level of play, shows that the meaning of “unforced” is very, very elastic. Perhaps as elastic as the notion of “playing your best.”

MEAC_ALLAMERICAN
09-15-2009, 11:34 AM
Are we just going to roll over that Mallorcan Elephant that's in the room and brush over last year’s French Open Final?

Or was it so fast that the OP forgot to mention it? :lol:

bizarre_opinion
09-15-2009, 11:52 AM
just get over it guys, the problem with fed fans is that most of them worship him. The guy got blown off the court yesterday and he couldn't do anything about it. I hope he doesn't win any more slam's. It was good while it lasted but, the game is changing. It's all about power tennis now, these big guys who hit hard will give fed and nadal trouble. I'm just glad someone other than nadal federer has won a slam.

2ndserveace
09-15-2009, 11:56 AM
I actually thought Fed played very well for a stretch in the AO 09 final. Around the 3rd and 4th sets there were some incredibly high-quality rallies that left me amazed. He didn't play that badly in the USO final either, Del Potro just came through at the right moments. Wimby 08 was pretty bad, but still not as bad as the FO 08 final. That one tops all others.

Joseph L. Barrow
09-15-2009, 12:05 PM
Wimbledon '08 should not even be in this discussion. The '08 French Open saw what was almost certainly Federer's worst showing in a Grand Slam final, but out of those on the list, I would go with yesterday's US Open final, followed fairly closely by the Australian this January, with the '08 Wimbledon final a very distant third.

GasquetGOAT
09-15-2009, 12:13 PM
Wimbledon '08 should not even be in this discussion. The '08 French Open saw what was almost certainly Federer's worst showing in a Grand Slam final, but out of those on the list, I would go with yesterday's US Open final, followed fairly closely by the Australian this January, with the '08 Wimbledon final a very distant third.

Thank you sir. Apparently you are among the only few here that can read and understand the question.

We are not comparing any French Open finals in this thread. Get it?

Turning Pro
09-15-2009, 12:54 PM
They was all equally as good. Fed played his best and lost them all. That's just the way the racket smashes.

Nadalfan89
09-15-2009, 01:08 PM
Oh wow, *******s are funny.

He lost because he didn't play his best, and when he does play his best, he's unstoppable.

Got it.

icedevil0289
09-15-2009, 01:21 PM
None of these can be considered federer's worst performance in a slam final. Please, all these finals went to 5 sets.

like many are saying, perhaps FO 2008. He did not play well at all, but then again rafa was just a beast that day and through out the entire tournament.

I think some of you should just except that the better player won in all of these tournaments.

that being said, I would say out of all of these, wimbly 2008 was the worst. He really did not play that well during the first two sets and then kind of raised his level from then on, but still not a great display from him over all. AO 2009 was actually not bad. He played well for 4 sets, but just sort of went away the fourth, while rafa was consistent.

I don't think roger's performance this year was bad at all. Yes his serve wasn't all that great and he made a few more errors, but over all it was fine. Dpot was just serving well, blasting those fhs, he just simply outplayed federer.

it would be really nice if fed fans could give credit to his opponents when they beat fed.

icedevil0289
09-15-2009, 01:23 PM
just get over it guys, the problem with fed fans is that most of them worship him. The guy got blown off the court yesterday and he couldn't do anything about it. I hope he doesn't win any more slam's. It was good while it lasted but, the game is changing. It's all about power tennis now, these big guys who hit hard will give fed and nadal trouble. I'm just glad someone other than nadal federer has won a slam.

why must you generalize? *******s worship him and can think he can do wrong, fed fans on the other hand are capable of being objective and rational. No need to group all the fans together.

maddogz32
09-15-2009, 01:24 PM
us open 09, he had so many unforced, and his first serve was not working for him

flyinghippos101
09-15-2009, 01:51 PM
Fo 2008...........................

French Open 2008

No, Nadal was just a beast at the 2008 FO. Let's just say

2008 French Open was to Nadal as Australian Open 2007 is to Federer

Nadal&Nike10
09-15-2009, 02:07 PM
who ever says Wimbledon is stupid one of the greatest matches ever

icedevil0289
09-15-2009, 02:08 PM
who ever says Wimbledon is stupid one of the greatest matches ever

just because someone has an opinion that differs from yours, does not make them stupid.

FredMurray
09-15-2009, 02:22 PM
Us Open 09

I think he served at around 45 % in the first & second set....


just because someone has an opinion that differs from yours, does not make them stupid.

True his performance in the first two sets in that wimbledon final are comparable to the other 2 finals(ao&uso 09),but dont you agree that in the other sets he performed at a far higher level than at the two other finals ?

icedevil0289
09-15-2009, 02:40 PM
Us Open 09

I think he served at around 45 % in the first & second set....




True his performance in the first two sets in that wimbledon final are comparable to the other 2 finals(ao&uso 09),but dont you agree that in the other sets he performed at a far higher level than at the two other finals ?

yeah I mentioned that, I think. I agree he raised his level and played really well sets 3, 4, 5.

I do think he played over all better at AO, except for the last set.

navratilovafan
09-15-2009, 04:12 PM
U.S Open 2009 by far.

(K)evin
09-15-2009, 05:28 PM
I think French 08 and also the US 09 and the US 09 because he a mentally strong player against anyone and sometimes even nadal just lost it because of the call on the serve del po hit I think del po should have gotten a second serve instead of a first

Tony48
09-15-2009, 05:51 PM
French Open 2008....by a country mile.

Why is Wimbledon 2008 even listed as a choice? There was nothing bad about that performance.

IvanAndreevich
09-15-2009, 06:34 PM
I thought very hard, and I have to say that it was this USO 2009 final. Very similar to AO 2009 in terms of the serve. I am afraid Fed's back is injured again. Otherwise, I can see no explanation for the horrendous serving in BOTH Djokovic + DP matches.

He was up 2 sets to 1 and had a sitter to have 5-1 in the second - basically be 2 sets to 0. In AO he was never in such a commanding position.

I think he blew it. Full credit to Del Potro for coming back, though.

Gut Feeling
09-15-2009, 06:36 PM
I thought he played awesome in all three.....I think he was just beaten

Turning Pro
09-15-2009, 09:06 PM
Yeah FFS, if fed had come back from 2 sets down and won that wimby final or any of these final, they'd be saying it was his best win, great wins etc.

Talker
09-15-2009, 09:16 PM
UO '09.

Many areas seemed to be off, and mentally the wrong mindset, almost like he was just going thru the motions.

federerfanatic
09-15-2009, 10:19 PM
Hard to say. I think Wimbledon 2008 was easily the best of the 3. Not sure between the other two which was better or worse, clearly he was far from his best tennis in both though.

flying24
09-15-2009, 10:24 PM
The U.S Open final was funny since Federer played fairly poor tennis for his standards and still would have won in straight sets if he didnt choke away so many chances in the 2nd set. Given that he blew that one to a greater degree than any of the others (though he arguably blew them all to some degree) in that without alot of 2nd set choking he could have won in 3 sets even with very subpar form for his standards, I would say the U.S Open final easily.

Of course if the French Open final of 2008 was an option that one takes the cake. Given that this was possible clay court GOAT Nadal playing the greatest clay court tournament of his whole career, Federer had zero shot of winning that final even if he played his best but he played awful in that final and that whole tournament nonetheless.

TheFifthSet
09-15-2009, 10:27 PM
Yeah FFS, if fed had come back from 2 sets down and won that wimby final or any of these final, they'd be saying it was his best win, great wins etc.

Are you a psychologist? That's one excellent psychological profile there.

About 2100 days have passed since Hewitt last beat Federer. :shock::shock::shock::shock:

flying24
09-15-2009, 10:35 PM
Are you a psychologist? That's one excellent psychological profile there.

About 2100 days have passed since Hewitt last beat Federer. :shock::shock::shock::shock:

According to Turning Pro that will be because Hewitt played bad everytime and Federer played his best everytime. After all according to Turning Troll every match Federer plays he plays his best tennis and every match he plays his opponents plays their worst or chokes. Funny how that mistakingly is giving a huge compliment to Roger (not that Turning Troll has the brain capacity to compute this). How great must the guy be to always play his very best and never choke (according to Turning Troll) and apparently every other guy in the game is always choking or playing badly when they play Federer. He must be really special to pull that off in such direct contrast to everyone else.

As for Hewitt, poor Hewitt is just unlucky to not have 15 slams like Federer with his monstrous game and spellbinding talent, ROTFL!

ceberus
09-15-2009, 10:45 PM
They weren't his worst performance. I don't understand why whenever he loses people saying they are bad days for Federer. Oh comon, he has been outplayed on every single one of those matches, he played to his best, but the other guy played better. Is it so hard to understand?

UsualSuspect
09-15-2009, 10:56 PM
Yesterday by far. Del Potro played good but Federer let him inside the match for sure. If Federer had started getting all cute with his shots he could have easily put away the second set, but NOOO, Federer was like " I am gonna throw little droppers in the middle of the court and charge the net" :roll:

roysid
09-15-2009, 11:09 PM
It has to be USO' 2009. Here's why

Wimbledon 2008: Except for 2nd set, he played his best there. 1st set was warm up. Service-forehand both worked fine. So many amazing winners.
Someone mentioned breakpoint at 3-4. That point Nadal hit a first serve at body. On the return he went for a inside out forehand winner which federer could only touch. Nadal smashed the ball away.
Why he lost because Nadal played amazing that day.

AO 2009: He lost against Nadal, not Del Potro. He was always behind in sets there.
In the same tournament he smacked DelPo 6-3 6-0 6-0. Sure DelPo has improved, but not so much.

USO 2009: match under control, he lost it.

Rob_C
09-15-2009, 11:17 PM
French Open 2008....by a country mile.

Why is Wimbledon 2008 even listed as a choice? There was nothing bad about that performance.

1/12 on break pts is bad.

When you come back from 2 sets down, and have your opponent, who doesnt have a particularly strong 2nd serve, 15-40, middle of the 5th set, and you dump two 2nd serve return in a row in the bottom of the net, thats bad.

Turning Pro
09-16-2009, 04:27 AM
According to Turning Pro that will be because Hewitt played bad everytime and Federer played his best everytime. After all according to Turning Troll every match Federer plays he plays his best tennis and every match he plays his opponents plays their worst or chokes. Funny how that mistakingly is giving a huge compliment to Roger (not that Turning Troll has the brain capacity to compute this). How great must the guy be to always play his very best and never choke (according to Turning Troll) and apparently every other guy in the game is always choking or playing badly when they play Federer. He must be really special to pull that off in such direct contrast to everyone else.

As for Hewitt, poor Hewitt is just unlucky to not have 15 slams like Federer with his monstrous game and spellbinding talent, ROTFL!

Of course Federer never plays his best tennis. He NEVER plays his best tennis, right? That's why he has 15 gs titles. Although when someone who isn't afraid of federer or isn't as bad of a player play him, Federer can't compete. Coming of Age Del Potro (not FO 09 choke artist, lack of fitness bottler) fitness/Pre-prime Nadal-Prime Nadal are the only real competition in an otherwise pretty lacklustre era. Djokovic just isn't consistent enough and Murray is way overhyped and continuing to disappoint. Fact is, Roddick the biggest pigeon of federer CHOKED 4 CONSECUTIVE SET POINTS at Wimby 09 for a 2 set to love lead away. What a joke. Fed would be lucky to have even 6-8 slams in the 80/90's.

TheFifthSet
09-16-2009, 06:47 AM
Of course Federer never plays his best tennis. He NEVER plays his best tennis, right? That's why he has 15 gs titles. Although when someone who isn't afraid of federer or isn't as bad of a player play him, Federer can't compete. Coming of Age Del Potro (not FO 09 choke artist, lack of fitness bottler) fitness/Pre-prime Nadal-Prime Nadal are the only real competition in an otherwise pretty lacklustre era. Djokovic just isn't consistent enough and Murray is way overhyped and continuing to disappoint. Fact is, Roddick the biggest pigeon of federer CHOKED 4 CONSECUTIVE SET POINTS at Wimby 09 for a 2 set to love lead away. What a joke. Fed would be lucky to have even 6-8 slams in the 80/90's.

Uh, no. People make a big deal out of this crap. It was ONE blotched volley. None of the other 3 points were choke jobs.

Goran had setpoints in the '98 Wimby finals in the 2nd set, after he had won the first. Threw that away. Rafter had a 5-1 lead in the 2nd set tiebreak after he had won the first, in 2000.

They choked too, I suppose?

tacou
09-16-2009, 07:07 AM
kind of irrelevant, he didn't play particularly terrible in any of them, and Wimby 08 I think he played pretty well. some fans of Federer get too used to his dominant form and don't realize that the opponent has some say over how well he can perform. his serve % was low at the US and AO, but outside of that he played pretty well, just not well enough.

French 08 is his worst slam final, clearly, and if you're removing that from the discussion then I don't really see the point.

GasquetGOAT
09-17-2009, 10:28 AM
I thought very hard, and I have to say that it was this USO 2009 final. Very similar to AO 2009 in terms of the serve. I am afraid Fed's back is injured again. Otherwise, I can see no explanation for the horrendous serving in BOTH Djokovic + DP matches.

He was up 2 sets to 1 and had a sitter to have 5-1 in the second - basically be 2 sets to 0. In AO he was never in such a commanding position.

I think he blew it. Full credit to Del Potro for coming back, though.

I agree. I think he was too overwhelmed by his own brilliance from the semifinal match and got a bit careless (cocky?) thought naDEL PWNtro would just roll over like Mpushrray like last year and paid the price in the end.

Jchurch
09-17-2009, 10:32 AM
US Open 09. He just disappeared. His serve pulled a Houdini and vanished. This time he was 100% healthy. He just didn't execute.

ArrowSmith
09-17-2009, 10:42 AM
Definitely 2009 US Open. He was gifted the 3rd set with 2 DelPo double faults, and lost the next 2 sets. He only played well for the first set and 3/4. By far worse then Aussie.

Moose Malloy
09-18-2009, 01:48 PM
1/12 on break pts is bad.

When you come back from 2 sets down, and have your opponent, who doesnt have a particularly strong 2nd serve, 15-40, middle of the 5th set, and you dump two 2nd serve return in a row in the bottom of the net, thats bad.

Don't know what match you are thinking of, but Fed only had one bp in the 5th set of the W final- & Nadal hit a good 1st serve on that point & eventually won it with an overhead smash.

Augustus
09-18-2009, 02:34 PM
IMO this year's US Open final was Federer's worst GS final,
maybe even worse than FO 08, because Nadal was just godlike that day.
At USO 09 Fed choked big time in the second set and again in the fourth,
he should have finished the job after Delpo's DF collapse. Fed's serving was atrocious throughout the match.
AO 09 actually was a great match IMO, except the fifth set. Fed was really good off the ground, but his serving was below average. He should have made the difference at the end of the third set, when he blew several BP's by playing too passively.
Wimbledon 08 wasn't a bad match by Fed, Nadal was just better. Fed almost came back from the dead, but in the end the better man won. OK, it wasn't the best match Federer ever played, but by no means as crappy as the USO final.

Just my opinion though...

abmk
09-18-2009, 07:58 PM
overall FO 2008

among these 3, USO 2009 F easily