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christos_liaskos
10-15-2009, 07:24 AM
Anyway feel like doing the math for me, as in what Rafa or Roger have to do for either to secure te year end no1.... cos I cant be bothered to work it out :D

akv89
10-15-2009, 09:39 AM
01 Roger Federer (SUI) 9855 (--) (--)
02 Rafael Nadal (ESP) 8335 (--) (180) R3 Shanghai
03 Novak Djokovic (SRB) 6150 (150) (10) R3 Shanghai
04 Andy Murray (GBR) 6040 (250) (--)
05 Juan Martin Del Potro (ARG) 5815 (70) (10)
06 Andy Roddick (USA) 4410 (90) (00)
07 Fernando Verdasco (ESP) 3070 (150) (40)
08 Fernando Gonzalez (CHI) 2780 (90) (00) R3 Shanghai
---------------------------------------------------
09 Robin Soderling (SWE) 2740 (115) (20) R3 Shanghai
10 Jo-Wilfried Tsonga (FRA) 2695 (250) (00) R3 Shanghai
---------------------------------------------------
11 Nikolay Davydenko (RUS) 2540 (250) (90) R3 Shanghai

This is from MTF

These are the point tallies through last week. If Nadal wins Shanghai, he'll be at 9335, roughly 500 points behind Federer. Federer will probably get 500 points if he plays Basel, giving him a 1000 point lead heading into Paris. And there are 2500 points available at most through Paris and WTF/TMC.

Blinkism
10-15-2009, 09:42 AM
^^ Those are race points, right?

GasquetGOAT
10-15-2009, 09:54 AM
01 Roger Federer (SUI) 9855 (--) (--)
02 Rafael Nadal (ESP) 8335 (--) (180) R3 Shanghai
03 Novak Djokovic (SRB) 6150 (150) (10) R3 Shanghai
04 Andy Murray (GBR) 6040 (250) (--)
05 Juan Martin Del Potro (ARG) 5815 (70) (10)
06 Andy Roddick (USA) 4410 (90) (00)
07 Fernando Verdasco (ESP) 3070 (150) (40)
08 Fernando Gonzalez (CHI) 2780 (90) (00) R3 Shanghai
---------------------------------------------------
09 Robin Soderling (SWE) 2740 (115) (20) R3 Shanghai
10 Jo-Wilfried Tsonga (FRA) 2695 (250) (00) R3 Shanghai
---------------------------------------------------
11 Nikolay Davydenko (RUS) 2540 (250) (90) R3 Shanghai

This is from MTF

These are the point tallies through last week. If Nadal wins Shanghai, he'll be at 9335, roughly 500 points behind Federer. Federer will probably get 500 points if he plays Basel, giving him a 1000 point lead heading into Paris. And there are 2500 points available at most through Paris and WTF/TMC.

Incorrect, the 8335 of Nadal already includes the 3rd round pts from Shanghai, so he will get less than 9335 if he wins SH (but would be over 9000 for sure).

GasquetGOAT
10-15-2009, 09:58 AM
Nadal is not scheduled to play any other tournies apart from Paris and London so the maximum he could gain (after shanghai) is 2500 pts.

Federer will be playing Basel (500), Paris (1000) and London (1500), so thats 3000 pts to gain.

Blinkism
10-15-2009, 10:18 AM
Incorrect, the 8335 of Nadal already includes the 3rd round pts from Shanghai, so he will get less than 9335 if he wins SH (but would be over 9000 for sure).

How is that possible?

He has 8,945 going into Shanghai, so you subtract the 450 points that he's defending from Madrid last year - you get 8495 points going into Shanghai.

Nadal's made the QF's now so that's 180 points on top of that means that

Nadal has 8675 points ATM with 820 points left in Shanghai to gain + 1000 (Paris) + 1500 (YEC) = 3320 points to gain

Federer has 9855 points with 3000 points to gain

If Federer skips Basel or Paris then it's going to get a lot tighter

Ledigs
10-15-2009, 10:53 AM
Who is defending points here?

GasquetGOAT
10-15-2009, 11:11 AM
How is that possible?



We are talking race points here. Nadal has 8335 pts as of Shanghai 3rd round. (yes I know hes into quarters but that list was updated yesterday)

Who is defending points here?

exactly.

srinrajesh
10-15-2009, 11:41 AM
How is that possible?

He has 8,945 going into Shanghai, so you subtract the 450 points that he's defending from Madrid last year - you get 8495 points going into Shanghai.

Nadal's made the QF's now so that's 180 points on top of that means that

Nadal has 8675 points ATM with 820 points left in Shanghai to gain + 1000 (Paris) + 1500 (YEC) = 3320 points to gain

Federer has 9855 points with 3000 points to gain

If Federer skips Basel or Paris then it's going to get a lot tighter


well Nadal would actually have 8425 as 250 points for Paris indoors is included in ranking points ... with 3320 points possibly
Federer has 9855 with 3000 points possibly

So unless Roger has a very bad end to the season and Nadal has a very good one Federer is almost assured of No.1 year end ranking

tudwell
10-15-2009, 11:44 AM
So my dream of Federer and Nadal playing in the WTF final for the world number one ranking might come true after.

Blinkism
10-15-2009, 11:45 AM
We are talking race points here. Nadal has 8335 pts as of Shanghai 3rd round. (yes I know hes into quarters but that list was updated yesterday)



exactly.

My mistake.. the race points are so rarely discussed.

well Nadal would actually have 8425 as 250 points for Paris indoors is included in ranking points ... with 3320 points possibly
Federer has 9855 with 3000 points possibly

So unless Roger has a very bad end to the season and Nadal has a very good one Federer is almost assured of No.1 year end ranking

Not the most unlikely of scenarios, but it does look like Roger is probably keeping that #1 ranking.

If he drops Basel and/or Paris, though - it could be a showdown at the YEC for #1

Kind of like how Guga had to win YEC to become #1 at the end of 2000

flyinghippos101
10-15-2009, 11:49 AM
No "Over 9000" references?

Max G.
10-15-2009, 12:02 PM
No "Over 9000" references?

Incorrect, the 8335 of Nadal already includes the 3rd round pts from Shanghai, so he will get less than 9335 if he wins SH (but would be over 9000 for sure).

It's more likely than you think.

aphex
10-15-2009, 12:20 PM
No "Over 9000" references?

http://piratesoft.org/images/9000/over9000-4.jpg

christos_liaskos
10-15-2009, 12:40 PM
So my dream of Federer and Nadal playing in the WTF final for the world number one ranking might come true after.

I hope so, I'm going to the semis and final

Cosmic Charlie
10-15-2009, 10:12 PM
Doesn't Nadal stand to gain additional race points in the Davis Cup Final? Which implies the #1 could be decided after the Year End Masters!

Just doesn't sit well with what I'm used to. The Masters Cup on a few ocasions offered a climactic platform with a load of possibilities/permutations given the RR format.

vive le beau jeu !
10-16-2009, 02:06 AM
Doesn't Nadal stand to gain additional race points in the Davis Cup Final? Which implies the #1 could be decided after the Year End Masters!

Just doesn't sit well with what I'm used to. The Masters Cup on a few ocasions offered a climactic platform with a load of possibilities/permutations given the RR format.
one of the reasons why i don't like this idea of awarding davis cup points... and it can be even worse if we had to wait for points from the davis cup final of the previous year to drop off, to know the year-end #1 ! :?
http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?p=2090885&highlight=davis+cup+final+able#post2090885

but as regards nadal, how many points could he earn if we consider the (extremely unpleasant, i know) hypothesis where he wins two live single rubbers in the final ?
c) Players who miss a round of ties (i.e not among the four nominated players at the draw) will be awarded points based on the immediately preceding round.(For example, a player who doesn’t play the first round but plays the second round will earn 40 points for each singles match won in that second round).
from: http://www.daviscup.com/ranking/atp.asp

so... if i understand that point of the rules well, as he didn't play since the 1st round against serbia, he would get 65 points (according to the table) for any live single win in the final, and his davis cup points total would be:
40*2 (1st round) +65*2 (final) = 210 points

then... this can count as a "ATP World Tour 500 category" result.
in his "ATP World Tour 500 category" list of results, he already has:
1000 (monte-carlo)
500 (barcelona)
300 (rotterdam)
180 (pekin)
as only his 4 best "ATP World Tour 500 category" (http://www.atpworldtour.com/Rankings/Rankings-FAQ.aspx) results can be count, it means that pekin points would be replaced by davis cup points... and he would gain a maximum of 210-180 = 30 points (in the worse case, or "best case" from his own selfish perspective).

but maybe i missed something ?

anyway, hopefully he will lose all of his upcoming matches so that we don't have to bother with all these maths ! ;)

christos_liaskos
10-16-2009, 07:47 AM
^^^ Rafa did play against Serbia, he beat Djokovic on clay. He didn't play in the last round did he against Israel because of his stomach strain?

Dont know if he missed anything else, cant remember who else Spain played

vive le beau jeu !
10-16-2009, 10:49 AM
^^^ Rafa did play against Serbia, he beat Djokovic on clay. He didn't play in the last round did he against Israel because of his stomach strain?

Dont know if he missed anything else, cant remember who else Spain played
yes sorry i wasn't clear maybe... i took into account that he played the 1st round against serbia, but he was absent (honeymoon with drakulie) for the QF against germany and the SF against israel.

stanfordtennis alum
10-16-2009, 11:10 AM
think rog is gonna get finish at 1