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cesarmo03
10-19-2009, 08:39 PM
Hi, greetings from Venezuela. Can anybody give me some tips to stop doing foot faults, im a leftie so my habit is when i toss the ball i tend to move my right foot and that makes me step the line, that is not a big deal cuz i play with some friend and we pay attention to that mistake look, but i want to better on my serve doing things correctly.

Vermillion
10-19-2009, 08:42 PM
stand further back from the baseline and you'll be safe.

Get to a place where you'll be right up against the line as you go through the motion.

SystemicAnomaly
10-19-2009, 08:48 PM
You could drive a railroad spike thru your right foot so that is cannot move. For a less painful solution, superglue your shoe behind the the baseline. Unfortunately this will make it difficult to move to make the next shot (or the next serve).

Seriously, is a wild ball toss causing the right foot movement? Do you jump on your serve? Come back with answers to those 2 questions & I'll see if I've got some real answers for your problem.

cesarmo03
10-19-2009, 08:48 PM
a coach here told me to do that, but i really want to serve not that far in the court.

SystemicAnomaly
10-19-2009, 08:51 PM
^ I assume you are talking about the suggestion of standing further back. How about the questions that I asked in my post above?

wyutani
10-19-2009, 09:00 PM
put a towel infront of ur feet.

cesarmo03
10-19-2009, 09:05 PM
You could drive a railroad spike thru your right foot so that is cannot move. For a less painful solution, superglue your shoe behind the the baseline. Unfortunately this will make it difficult to move to make the next shot (or the next serve).

Seriously, is a wild ball toss causing the right foot movement? Do you jump on your serve? Come back with answers to those 2 questions & I'll see if I've got some real answers for your problem.

what u do mean " a wild ball toss"

yeah almost everytime i jump.

cesarmo03
10-19-2009, 09:06 PM
put a towel infront of ur feet.

that is a really good advice how exactly i do this?

Do i put the towel in the baseline, so when i step on it i know that im foot faulting or what else??

naylor
10-19-2009, 09:17 PM
Put a spare racket (or a small plank of wood of similar thickness) along the baseline before your right foot, but make sure that it's long enough to also reach in front of your left foot. If you footfault because your right foot steps on the line, you'll stand on or kick the racket / wood forward.

But sometimes people footfault with their back foot - as it comes besides the front foot, it actually gets in front of it and steps on the line before the server actually jumps in the air for the serve. That's why the racket / plank needs to be long enough to cover this kind of footfault.

The overall idea is that, in your serve action your rear foot will come up next to your leading foot, with both staying behind the racket / plank, and then as part of the throwing of the rackethead at the ball you'll also explode upwards and over the obstacle and into the court without touching it.

Un cordial saludo desde Nueva Zelanda.

naylor
10-19-2009, 09:33 PM
what u do mean " a wild ball toss" - yeah almost everytime i jump.

What he means is you toss the ball too far forward / inside the court, so you step inside the court to get closer to the tossed ball so you can hit it as you jump for your serve.

Broadly speaking, if you put your racket perpendicular to the baseline with the head pointing at the net, your toss for a normal flat serve should land level with the rackethead (or the top of the frame at most), unless you're very athletic and the jump in your service action takes you a long way inside the court. Bear in mind that the distance from baseline to the toss landing place is the distance you travel only in the first half of your jump (from tossing to hitting the ball when you're up in the air) - as you're jumping forward, you'll travel further in the court to your landing point. So, if your action includes a good jump, then you can toss further inside the court. But if your jump is not that far inwards, then if you toss the ball too far in, you'll have to step in before you take off for the jump - footfault!

cesarmo03
10-19-2009, 10:04 PM
Naylor thanks so much for taking some time to read and also giving some tips, no i dont have a wild toss, sometimes i even make that move from my right foot and the ball gets behind me. I been practicing my toss and now is much better but still have the same problem with the foot fault.

LeeD
10-20-2009, 09:28 AM
I always tell people who footfault..."keep some weight on the FRONT foot, your right, and don't lift up the forefoot...keep the whole foot flat on the ground.
That little movement doesn't help your serve speed much, and often gives you INCONSISTENT direction on your serves. A solid, planted front foot is better for consistency, even thos PeteSampras and a few other's tend to lift the forefoot on their service motions. Don't copy them.

cesarmo03
10-20-2009, 09:33 AM
i have a pair of ankles weights it is a good idea to use it, but only to practice serve so i dont move my feet?.

LeeD
10-20-2009, 09:40 AM
I don't think ankle weights is a good idea...you can hurt yourself.
Some players say a bent leg doesn't get lifted. Try a slight bend in your front leg at first, to keep the entire front foot on the court.
You can move your backfoot forwards in a pinpoint serve, so your momentum is moving forwards, not any other direction.
I've seen some top Open players weight their BACK foot during the prep to the service motion, so they only rock forwards, keeping the front foot on the ground.
Weight on back foot, then start the toss, while the body moves forward.

eagle
10-20-2009, 09:45 AM
I'm puzzled why you are at a loss for a fix to a simple problem.

Just step back. Determine how far into the court you step forward when you serve before striking the ball, then adjust your starting position accordingly. Get a vid of your serve and foot positioning if need be.

You are not changing your stance or your swing. You are merely moving back.

If you say that moving back causes you to double fault, then you have to improve your placement.

r,
eagle

LeeD
10-20-2009, 09:49 AM
The reason I don't think stepping back is good.
Say you step 11" back on your serves. In a tight match, you needing a fast first serve, wouldn't you want to improve your serve? So you step 10" behind the baseline. Result, foot fault.
Even if you STAY 11" back of your baseline, you KNOW a good first serve needs forwards momentum, so you step forwards TOO FAR resulting in footfault during an important fault.
Why reinforce bad habits? Just break them into good form.
Hit a few serves with weight on the BACK foot to start the motion, front leg slightly bent.

eagle
10-20-2009, 02:35 PM
^^ He can certainly do that.

He has a number of options. The simplest however is to simply step back. Again, he won't have to change his motion or anything else with his serve. No need to learn a new serve motion or technique. He keeps his current serve. He only needs to move back. That's it.

Now, whether he just steps back or learns a new serve is up to him. He can get away with foot faults playing against friends but once he competes in leagues, he'll lose critical points or games from such a glaring bad habit.

r,
eagle

volusiano
10-20-2009, 03:38 PM
I'd say if the OP just plays for fun, then stepping back may be an acceptable fix, or not do anything at all if nobody ever calls him out.

But if he plays in competition, he should be serious enough about fixing the foot fault once and for all because even stepping back is not the most optimal fix.

naylor
10-20-2009, 06:23 PM
I'm puzzled why you are at a loss for a fix to a simple problem. Just step back...

I agree with those who think this is not the best solution. In my club there are some well-known footfaulters - literally, their entire leading foot is inside the court when they start the toss. And we do have a couple of guys that start two feet behind the service line, precisely so that when they step forward they still stay behind the line.

The common denominator to all their serves is that because of the step-forward, when they initiate the toss their chest is pointing at the direction they will be serving at, i.e. they lose all of the action/power that the upper body and shoulder rotation provides to the serve, and they can only serve flat or slice. More importantly, none of them can do a decent topspin or kick second serve, because their mody motion and momentum is all in one direction, towards the service target. Even the best player of them all - who on strokes and playing ability easily ranks at the equivalent of NTRP 5.0 here - has an unreliable second serve (relatively speaking, he's prone to double faulting when things get tight, unless he takes off a lot of heat).

Moral of the story - cure the doublefault by learning to keep your leading foot behind the line, whilst still ensuring you maintain the correct shoulder turn at the toss so you can apply the correct upper body actions for the various serves you try.

Falloutjr
10-20-2009, 07:27 PM
Breaking the rules 101: Don't get caught.

SystemicAnomaly
10-21-2009, 01:35 AM
that is a really good advice how exactly i do this?

Do i put the towel in the baseline, so when i step on it i know that im foot faulting or what else??

This is one of the exact ideas that I had in mind when I asked about your toss and if you jumped on the serve. The towel can serve 2 functions. Fold or roll up a small or medium towel and lay it on the baseline right in front of your forward foot. Some players will use a towel in this manner as something to jump over when practicing the serve.

You can also use it for feedback to let you know if your front foot moves forward. Practice your service motion with a towel but without a ball numerous times before trying it for real. Repetition is the key. By doing it without an actual ball toss, you can focus on your front foot rather than worrying about hitting a ball toss. Try to make your serve simulation as real as possible (w/o a ball toss). You might need to repeat this dozens or even hundreds of times for this to becomes a new habit.

You can also practice your serve without the jump. Stand a ball can or three in right front of your forward foot. You should not knock over the can(s) until after you make contact with the ball.

cesarmo03
10-21-2009, 04:49 AM
Thanks so much guys, there are a lot of complex solutions and also simple ones, i will try your ideas.

And well in terms of the other posts that just say stand further from the baseline that is a good tip, but i like to hear different ideas of how i can stop doing foot faults.

SA: thanks for your explanation.

Saludos.

eagle
10-21-2009, 05:30 AM
Hola cesar,

Do you have a vid of you serving with a view of your foot faults for us to see?

That would also help narrow down potential suggestions for you.

r,
eagle

charliefedererer
10-21-2009, 08:02 AM
Watch this video from "The Serve Doctor" at the Bolletieri camp.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ixx-MCC7D88&feature=related

Notice how this 14 year old girl raises and lowers her toe on her front foot and ends up pushing off with her back heel raised off the court.

How can she be doing so much foot shifting and not foot fault?

The answer is that she maintains her balance with her body weight over both legs throughot the serve.

If you are shifting your center of gravity too far forward or back this will make you take a small step to maintain your balance.

The most common problem is not pushing your front hip forward as you go into the trophy position. Instead, by just rocking with your frame erect as you tilt back you put yourself momentarily in an unbalanced state. Then as you come forward you have to take a small step forward with your front foot across the line to regain your balance just before striking the ball.
Try doing what's in this video: http://www.fuzzyyellowballs.com/video-tennis-lessons/serve/advanced-serve-technique/leading-with-your-hip-when-serving/

So maintaining your balance throughout the serve will keep gravity pushing you down so you can't take that step and foot fault.

It may feel like you are serving up a mountain, but that's actually a good thing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlPVdppfYGs&feature=related

I hope this helps.

cesarmo03
10-21-2009, 09:33 AM
Hola cesar,

Do you have a vid of you serving with a view of your foot faults for us to see?

That would also help narrow down potential suggestions for you.

r,
eagle

hi eagle, no i dont have right now a vid of me serving but, i will put some videos of me playing so everyone can give me some tips.

cesarmo03
10-21-2009, 09:34 AM
Watch this video from "The Serve Doctor" at the Bolletieri camp.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ixx-MCC7D88&feature=related

Notice how this 14 year old girl raises and lowers her toe on her front foot and ends up pushing off with her back heel raised off the court.

How can she be doing so much foot shifting and not foot fault?

The answer is that she maintains her balance with her body weight over both legs throughot the serve.

If you are shifting your center of gravity too far forward or back this will make you take a small step to maintain your balance.

The most common problem is not pushing your front hip forward as you go into the trophy position. Instead, by just rocking with your frame erect as you tilt back you put yourself momentarily in an unbalanced state. Then as you come forward you have to take a small step forward with your front foot across the line to regain your balance just before striking the ball.
Try doing what's in this video: http://www.fuzzyyellowballs.com/video-tennis-lessons/serve/advanced-serve-technique/leading-with-your-hip-when-serving/

So maintaining your balance throughout the serve will keep gravity pushing you down so you can't take that step and foot fault.

It may feel like you are serving up a mountain, but that's actually a good thing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlPVdppfYGs&feature=related

I hope this helps.

Awesome!! thanks for your time dude. Awesome vid.

naylor
10-21-2009, 02:24 PM
Watch this video from "The Serve Doctor" at the Bolletieri camp...

Terrific stuff, this, many thanks. One thing I would add - based on the "up the mountain" clip - is that the knee bend was very noticeable in the last server, so his whole body / weight was being loaded down onto the calves, and the "firing" of the serve started from the calves as they sprang upwards. To be able to do so, the body has to be balanced, on the feet. And if you're balanced, and with that much load on them (ready to spring up into the serve) it's actually very difficult to unweigh a foot to step into the court and footfault.

maddogz32
10-21-2009, 06:39 PM
dont get so close to the line

ubermeyer
10-21-2009, 07:10 PM
Are you joking?

Stand farther back. Have you not considered this?

cesarmo03
10-21-2009, 09:25 PM
Are you joking?

Stand farther back. Have you not considered this?

thanks dude. :) your are a big help on this thread, but if u want to be a more productive try to post something like charliefederer did.

Saludos.

naylor
10-21-2009, 10:22 PM
Are you joking? Stand farther back. Have you not considered this?

dont get so close to the line

... somos tejanos, y hablamos muy despacio, porque el cerebro nos funciona incluso mas despacio todavia... como se puede observar por la calidad de nuestras dos contribuciones...

SystemicAnomaly
10-21-2009, 10:52 PM
muy divertido! do you think that the good ol' boys from tejas will figure it out?






.

naylor
10-22-2009, 01:07 AM
Muy divertido! Do you think that the good ol' boys from Tejas will figure it out?

Might take some time... funcionan despacio...

charliefedererer
10-22-2009, 08:16 AM
Terrific stuff, this, many thanks. One thing I would add - based on the "up the mountain" clip - is that the knee bend was very noticeable in the last server, so his whole body / weight was being loaded down onto the calves, and the "firing" of the serve started from the calves as they sprang upwards. To be able to do so, the body has to be balanced, on the feet. And if you're balanced, and with that much load on them (ready to spring up into the serve) it's actually very difficult to unweigh a foot to step into the court and footfault.

You spell it out exactly right.

And I would just emphasize to push off equally with BOTH legs.
It is very easy to fall into the trap of pushing off mainly with just the back leg, as if you are rearing back to get even more momentum into the serve. I started doing that by mistake a couple of summers ago and it took me awhile to figure out why my back leg was getting so sore.

charliefedererer
10-22-2009, 08:30 AM
Are you joking?

Stand farther back. Have you not considered this?

Glad to be of help.

But don't be too tough on ubermmeyer. His suggestion does work, and it is the standard recommendation. But it doesn't get to problem in the technique responsible for the foot fault. I gave a pretty complicated solution, but I hope it doesn't just help with your foot faults, but gives you a better serve using the whole kinetic chain. http://www.popularmechanics.com/outdoors/sports/4221210.html?page=5
http://www.popularmechanics.co.za/images/features/1079/image1.jpg

Bungalo Bill
10-22-2009, 08:45 AM
Hi, greetings from Venezuela. Can anybody give me some tips to stop doing foot faults, im a leftie so my habit is when i toss the ball i tend to move my right foot and that makes me step the line, that is not a big deal cuz i play with some friend and we pay attention to that mistake look, but i want to better on my serve doing things correctly.

You are hitting like a pitcher. Unfortunately, you have three choices:

1. Stand further back to allow your front foot to step forward.

2. Learn to keep your front foot planted and bring the back foot forward.

3. Learn the platform stance where you rise over both feet and go up for your serve.

Which would you prefer?

Geezer Guy
10-22-2009, 01:35 PM
What I did is to determine the ideal placement of my feet when I finish the serve. Then, I simply start my serve with my feet in that position. You can still rock forward and backward to get some body momentum - just don't move your feet. As you toss the ball and push upward into your serving motion, push up without moving your feet.

It will feel awkward at first, but after some practice it will feel natural.

film1
10-22-2009, 02:59 PM
You put a 2x4 on the base line and don't touch it when working on your serve.

SystemicAnomaly
10-22-2009, 03:07 PM
You put a 2x4 on the base line and don't touch it when working on your serve.

Or how about a bed of nails or molten lave right on the baseline? :twisted:

Geezer Guy
10-23-2009, 07:11 AM
Or how about a bed of nails or molten lave right on the baseline? :twisted:

Wouldn't that screw up your pre-serve dribble?

Bungalo Bill
10-23-2009, 07:43 AM
You put a 2x4 on the base line and don't touch it when working on your serve.

That is good also, or an old racquet, towel, or even your tennis bag.

eagle
10-23-2009, 08:26 AM
Or how about a bed of nails or molten lave right on the baseline? :twisted:

Just let me know and I'll ship some lava. :)

How about a vicious pit bull or an MMA fighter?

r,
eagle

callen3615
10-25-2009, 04:05 PM
Back up .

SystemicAnomaly
10-25-2009, 11:22 PM
Back up .

This has already been mentioned quite a few times in this thread. While it is the simplest solution, it isn't necessarily the best solution.

Bungalo Bill
10-26-2009, 07:02 AM
This has already been mentioned quite a few times in this thread. While it is the simplest solution, it isn't necessarily the best solution.

That is very true SA. It is at most a bandaid.

callen3615
10-26-2009, 08:18 AM
This has already been mentioned quite a few times in this thread. While it is the simplest solution, it isn't necessarily the best solution.

I know im just being a dick. :twisted:

troytennisbum
10-26-2009, 11:21 AM
Breaking the rules 101: Don't get caught.

Yeah, thats what every guy who doesn't have the ability to serve correctly says.
I see that a lot at the parks.

SystemicAnomaly
10-26-2009, 11:57 AM
I know im just being a d!ck. :twisted:

Are you good at it? Guess ya gotta go with yer strengths.

ubermeyer
10-26-2009, 04:07 PM
... somos tejanos, y hablamos muy despacio, porque el cerebro nos funciona incluso mas despacio todavia... como se puede observar por la calidad de nuestras dos contribuciones...

Don't speak in Spanish and expect me not to understand. You should pick a more obscure language. :)

And, actually I think it is a good suggestion.

SystemicAnomaly
10-26-2009, 04:57 PM
Don't speak in Spanish and expect me not to understand. You should pick a more obscure language. :) .

How about ig-pay atin-lay?