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View Full Version : Top 5 serves in todays game


Cesc Fabregas
10-20-2009, 09:01 AM
1.Karlovic
2.Roddick
3.Isner
4.Ljubicic
5.? Not sure


Whats your lists?

pame
10-20-2009, 09:04 AM
The guy who out-aced Roddick at WMB 2009 comes before Roddick :)

wyutani
10-20-2009, 09:04 AM
roddick, federer, nadal, davydenko and me.

akv89
10-20-2009, 09:06 AM
1st Serve:

1. Karlovic
2. Roddick
3. Isner
4. Muller
5. Querrey

2nd Serve:

1. Isner
2. Roddick
3. Karlovic
4. Federer
5. Ljubicic

wyutani
10-20-2009, 09:09 AM
when you say top, does it mean best serve or best topspin serve? pls be specific.

P_Agony
10-20-2009, 09:10 AM
1. Federer
2. Karlovic
3. Roddick
4. Isner
5. Ljubicic

Cesc Fabregas
10-20-2009, 09:12 AM
That left handed Australian Guccione must be there abouts, maybe he would be 5th on my list.

Danstevens
10-20-2009, 09:16 AM
I guess I'd go for something along the lines Cesc went down. IMO Federer has an underrated first serve among some just because it isn't huge like the people who generally have good serves. I don't know if I would call Fed's serve top 5 though.

I think my list would be;
Karlovic
Roddick
Isner
Ljubicic
Querrey

P_Agony
10-20-2009, 09:18 AM
I guess I'd go for something along those lines. IMO Federer has an underrated first serve among some just because it isn't huge like the people who generally have good serves. I don't know if I would call Fed's serve top 5 though.

One thing's for sure, Fed leads the tour with 2nd serve points won.

Cup8489
10-20-2009, 09:20 AM
One thing's for sure, Fed leads the tour with 2nd serve points won.

not to mention respectable rankings in first serve points won and aces :)

competition
10-20-2009, 09:26 AM
Roddick
Fed
Karlovic
Isner
Delpo

Cesc Fabregas
10-20-2009, 09:27 AM
One thing's for sure, Fed leads the tour with 2nd serve points won.

TBF Roddick wins only 2% less on his second serve with a much inferior ground game.

jamesblakefan#1
10-20-2009, 09:36 AM
1. Federer
2. Karlovic
3. Roddick
4. Isner
5. Ljubicic

You honestly think Fed has the best serve in the game?

1. Isner
2. Karlovic
3. Roddick
4. Federer
5. Tsonga

TheMagicianOfPrecision
10-20-2009, 09:37 AM
1.Karlovic
2.Roddick
3.Isner
4.Ljubicic
5.? Not sure


Whats your lists?


There is a comeback-kid named Joachim pim pim Johansson playing this week in Stockholm, you might wanna check him out, then make your list again.

P_Agony
10-20-2009, 09:37 AM
You honestly think Fed has the best serve in the game?

1. Isner
2. Karlovic
3. Roddick
4. Federer
5. Tsonga

I honestly do, yes. I know it's not a popular opinion, but it's my true one.

P_Agony
10-20-2009, 09:38 AM
TBF Roddick wins only 2% less on his second serve with a much inferior ground game.

With Roddick's improvment and Federer's huge decline in the ground game, the gap isn't that large.

IvanAndreevich
10-20-2009, 10:03 AM
Federer doesn't have a top 5 serve. He's mentally tough, so he comes up with big ones on big occasions. I cannot believe how many times this has been discussed over and over again.

Cesc Fabregas
10-20-2009, 10:05 AM
Federer doesn't have a top 5 serve. He's mentally tough, so he comes up with big ones on big occasions. I cannot believe how many times this has been discussed over and over again.

I agree, thats why he isn't in the top 5 in my OP. :neutral:

Breaker
10-20-2009, 10:06 AM
1. Karlovic
2. Roddick
3. Isner
4. Guccione
5. Ljubicic
6. J. Johannson
7. Tsonga
8. Querrey
9. Federer
10. Soderling

IvanAndreevich
10-20-2009, 10:10 AM
1. Karlovic
2. Roddick
3. Isner
4. Guccione
5. Ljubicic
6. J. Johannson
7. Tsonga
8. Querrey
9. Federer
10. Soderling

Great post. Very sensible choices.

IvanAndreevich
10-20-2009, 10:13 AM
I honestly do, yes. I know it's not a popular opinion, but it's my true one.

Dude.. Federer with Karlovic serve = 4 Grand Slams in a row. Nadal would rarely break him on clay (once or twice a season). This is the guy who served 50 aces on RG clay against Hewitt. + 15 mph + more angles + higher percentage than Federer.

Cesc Fabregas
10-20-2009, 10:32 AM
1. Karlovic
2. Roddick
3. Isner
4. Guccione
5. Ljubicic
6. J. Johannson
7. Tsonga
8. Querrey
9. Federer
10. Soderling

Great list Breaker.

BounceHitBounceHit
10-20-2009, 10:53 AM
You honestly think Fed has the best serve in the game?

Yes I do. :) BHBH

BounceHitBounceHit
10-20-2009, 10:54 AM
You honestly think Fed has the best serve in the game?

If by 'best' we mean the serve most effective in winning tennis matches. ;) BHBH

P_Agony
10-20-2009, 10:59 AM
Dude.. Federer with Karlovic serve = 4 Grand Slams in a row. Nadal would rarely break him on clay (once or twice a season). This is the guy who served 50 aces on RG clay against Hewitt. + 15 mph + more angles + higher percentage than Federer.

I don't know about you, but in the past two years Federer was living and breathing off of his serve.

P_Agony
10-20-2009, 11:01 AM
If by 'best' we mean the serve most effective in winning tennis matches. ;) BHBH

Exactly, Fed's serve is so effective it's insane. He doesn't have the biggest serve (hardly) but his placement and variety plus his great clutch serving and huge disguise make it effective against anyone.

jamesblakefan#1
10-20-2009, 11:16 AM
I don't know about you, but in the past two years Federer was living and breathing off of his serve.

I don't agree with that. He's won plenty of matches where he's served like crap - Cincy vs Djokovic, for example. He didn't serve above 60% vs Hewitt, Murray, or Djokovic in Cincy, yet still won the title handily.

akv89
10-20-2009, 11:23 AM
I don't know about you, but in the past two years Federer was living and breathing off of his serve.

Guys like Karlovic, Isner, Roddick, Querrey etc have been doing that since they started their careers. Federer still has weapons other than his serve that bail him out of matches.

Telepatic
10-20-2009, 11:29 AM
1.Federer (Nothing against Karlovic but I think Fed uses more brain then Karlovic imo)
2.Karlovic
3.Roddick
4/5.Ljubicic
5/4.Tsonga

tennisdad65
10-20-2009, 12:22 PM
1) Karlovic
2) Isner
3) Guccione
4) Roddick
5) Querrey

Agassifan
10-20-2009, 12:31 PM
1.Karlovic
2.Roddick
3.Isner
4.Ljubicic
5.? Not sure


Whats your lists?

LOL @ Isner and Ljubicic before Roger. LOL LOL LOL

T1000
10-20-2009, 12:33 PM
1. karlovic
2. isner
3. roddick
4. querrey
5. johanson
6. ljubicic
7. tsonga
8. guccione
9. soderling
10. federer

Cesc Fabregas
10-20-2009, 12:34 PM
LOL @ Isner and Ljubicic before Roger. LOL LOL LOL

Both of them have better 1st and 2nd serves than Roger.

Agassifan
10-20-2009, 12:37 PM
Both of them have better 1st and 2nd serves than Roger.

define "better"

rocket
10-20-2009, 12:40 PM
If by 'best' we mean the serve most effective in winning tennis matches. ;) BHBH

1. Karlovic: 0 slam
2. Roddick: 1 slam
3. Isner: 0 slam
4. Guccione:0 slam
5. Ljubicic: 0 slam

Pure coincidence?

jamesblakefan#1
10-20-2009, 12:41 PM
define "better"

Both are tougher to return than Roger's serve.

rocket
10-20-2009, 12:44 PM
Both are tougher to return than Roger's serve.

Yeah, Federer sucks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whhlKaa1Jcc

jamesblakefan#1
10-20-2009, 12:47 PM
Yeah, Federer sucks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whhlKaa1Jcc

It's ok if Fed's not the best in everything, ok? The world's not gonna end precious *******. :lol:

No one is saying Fed's serve sucks, it's just not as hard to return as those other guy's serves.

SuperDuy
10-20-2009, 12:53 PM
Dude.. Federer with Karlovic serve = 4 Grand Slams in a row. Nadal would rarely break him on clay (once or twice a season). This is the guy who served 50 aces on RG clay against Hewitt. + 15 mph + more angles + higher percentage than Federer.

+ 8 inches of height.

P_Agony
10-20-2009, 01:06 PM
I don't agree with that. He's won plenty of matches where he's served like crap - Cincy vs Djokovic, for example. He didn't serve above 60% vs Hewitt, Murray, or Djokovic in Cincy, yet still won the title handily.

He didn't serve like crap in this match. Yes his 1st serve % was low but it was there when he needed it plus his 2nd serve was ultra effective, and Djoko is a good returner.

P_Agony
10-20-2009, 01:15 PM
It's ok if Fed's not the best in everything, ok? The world's not gonna end precious *******. :lol:

No one is saying Fed's serve sucks, it's just not as hard to return as those other guy's serves.

Oh I hardly think Federer is the best at everything. Heck, I'm not even sure is FH is the best in the world today. However, I truly do think his serve is the best one (not the hardest to return, but overall more effective). Like I said, my opinion isn't very popular, so let's agree to disagree James :)

Joseph L. Barrow
10-20-2009, 01:36 PM
I'll go with:
1. Karlovic
2. Roddick
3. Isner
4. Querrey
5. Tsonga
Honorable mention to Federer and Ljubicic

TheMagicianOfPrecision
10-20-2009, 01:39 PM
Karlovic
Isner
Roddick
Pim Pim Johansson
...might be Federer

egn
10-20-2009, 02:32 PM
1. Karlovic
2. Roddick
3. Isner
4. Guccione
5. Ljubicic
6. J. Johannson
7. Tsonga
8. Querrey
9. Federer
10. Soderling

I like that list similar to mine. Same 10 anmes and the top 3 is exactly the same the rest is a bit re-arranged but all and all those are the top 10 guys.

akv89
10-20-2009, 02:41 PM
1. Karlovic
2. Roddick
3. Isner
4. Guccione
5. Ljubicic
6. J. Johannson
7. Tsonga
8. Querrey
9. Federer
10. Soderling

Good list, although I think Querrey deserves to be higher up for having one of the best 1st serves in the game. I would also have Gilles Muller somewhere in there instead of Soderling.

I have yet to see Johansson back in action. Is his serve as good now as it was before?

IvanAndreevich
10-20-2009, 03:03 PM
He didn't serve like crap in this match. Yes his 1st serve % was low but it was there when he needed it plus his 2nd serve was ultra effective, and Djoko is a good returner.

Yes he did serve like crap in the semis against Djokovic. Compare it to 2008 against the same guy in the same place. Federer was getting NO aces on break points basically. The year before he served 25 aces against Djokovic in the same court.

And to support that he served like crap in the semis, he served like crap in the finals. Which is why he lost it, similarly to AO 2009.

lambielspins
10-20-2009, 03:27 PM
1. Karlovic

-----huge gap------

2. Roddick
3. Federer
4. Isner
5. Querrey

SerbWhoLovesDelPo
10-20-2009, 03:34 PM
1 Karlo
2 Isner/Roddick
3 Guccione
4 Johansson
5 Fed/Tsonga/Soderling/Ljubicic

PS. I have a question for those who say Federer's serve is the best:

Would Federer lose a match in which he served 78 aces?

P_Agony
10-20-2009, 03:52 PM
Yes he did serve like crap in the semis against Djokovic. Compare it to 2008 against the same guy in the same place. Federer was getting NO aces on break points basically. The year before he served 25 aces against Djokovic in the same court.

And to support that he served like crap in the semis, he served like crap in the finals. Which is why he lost it, similarly to AO 2009.

I was replying to James about Cincy, not the USO. In Cincy I thought Fed's serve was really effective despite being low on %.

Even Karlovic has bad serving days, and Sampras had his share too. Fed's 2nd serve is so good he can still take a top player to 5 sets despite not playing well and the 1st serve being gone (USO final). Fed also leads the tour in 2nd serve points won.

akv89
10-20-2009, 04:06 PM
I was replying to James about Cincy, not the USO. In Cincy I thought Fed's serve was really effective despite being low on %.

Even Karlovic has bad serving days, and Sampras had his share too. Fed's 2nd serve is so good he can still take a top player to 5 sets despite not playing well and the 1st serve being gone (USO final). Fed also leads the tour in 2nd serve points won.

This has so much more to do with Federer's ground game than how good his 2nd serve is in comparison to guys like Karlovic or Roddick. The fact that guys like Roddick and Isner win almost as many points on their 2nd serve as Federer despite their weaker ground games should tell you something about the quality of their serves.

chair ump
10-20-2009, 04:43 PM
You guys ever heard of Wayne Arthurs?...definitely one of the greatest EVER...IMHO.

Becksx1
10-20-2009, 04:46 PM
Now that pim pim is back he has definetly got to be up there. I remember him hitting 51 aces against andre agassi in 4 sets :p

Becksx1
10-20-2009, 04:51 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uzDugi638hU&feature=related

drakulie
10-20-2009, 05:59 PM
Both are tougher to return than Roger's serve.

Once again a clueless post.


Aces- Fed is 5th on the tour in number of aces (isner- 6th,ljubicic- 7th)

First serve point won- Fed is 4th, (ljubicic 7th, isner 17th)

Second Serve Points won- Fed is 1st, (Isner 5th, ljubicic 35th)

Service Games won- Fed is 3rd (Isner 5th, ljubicic 16th)

Break points saved- Fed is 2nd (Isner 3rd, ljubicic 7th)


He beats both of them in every category, but I could definitely see your and your new clueless pal's point. :roll: You are such a troll.

IvanAndreevich
10-20-2009, 06:05 PM
Aces- Fed is 5th on the tour in number of aces (isner- 6th,ljubicic- 7th)
Wrong metric. Fed played more matches than either of those guys. They have more aces per match.

First serve point won- Fed is 4th, (ljubicic 7th, isner 17th)
Service Games won- Fed is 3rd (Isner 5th, ljubicic 16th)
Federer has better movement, and forehand. Once his top 10 (not top 5) first serve goes in, he dispatches of his opponents easier than the other guys.

Second Serve Points won- Fed is 1st, (Isner 5th, ljubicic 35th)
Federer has a good second serve, but it's not winning him those points. The rest of his game is.

Break points saved- Fed is 2nd (Isner 3rd, ljubicic 7th)
Federer is mentally tougher than both of those players, and the rest of his game is miles above theirs. Isner being 3rd pretty much guarantees he has a MUCH better serve than Federer (which he does).

He beats both of them in every category, but I could definitely see your and your new clueless pal's point. :roll: You are such a troll.
I hope you were kidding, drak

SourStraws
10-20-2009, 06:07 PM
If you cant back your serve up...Then you cant maximize it...A lot of the players listed have really good serves but are flawed in other aspects which hinder them from using their serves to its potential

S.S.

rocket
10-20-2009, 06:20 PM
Federer has a good second serve, but it's not winning him those points. The rest of his game is.

Sure Fed has better groundies than those big servers, but his 2nd serve is not as attackable as one might thing. He kicks it out wide, he goes for the T, he keeps you guessing.

As Sampras famously said: "you're only as good as your 2nd serve".

IvanAndreevich
10-20-2009, 06:29 PM
Sure Fed has better groundies than those big servers, but his 2nd serve is not as attackable as one might thing. He kicks it out wide, he goes for the T, he keeps you guessing.

As Sampras famously said: "you're only as good as your 2nd serve".

I agree that Federer's second serve is good. Out of the Top 5 players in the world, Federer has the best second serve.

Carsomyr
10-20-2009, 07:16 PM
1. Karlovic
2. Roddick
3. Isner
4. Querrey
5. Federer

A couple of years ago I probably would have put Ljubicic at 4 or 5.

JeMar
10-20-2009, 07:20 PM
One thing's for sure, Fed leads the tour with 2nd serve points won.

If we're talking just about the stroke itself, Federer's not in the top 5.

Federer has one of the best hold games around, though.

JeMar
10-20-2009, 07:28 PM
Once again a clueless post.


Aces- Fed is 5th on the tour in number of aces (isner- 6th,ljubicic- 7th)

First serve point won- Fed is 4th, (ljubicic 7th, isner 17th)

Second Serve Points won- Fed is 1st, (Isner 5th, ljubicic 35th)

Service Games won- Fed is 3rd (Isner 5th, ljubicic 16th)

Break points saved- Fed is 2nd (Isner 3rd, ljubicic 7th)


He beats both of them in every category, but I could definitely see your and your new clueless pal's point. :roll: You are such a troll.

The thing is that some of the other guys on the list have created entire careers just with that one shot. Federer's serve is a tremendous complement to his ground game, but if you look at the serve by itself, there's quite a few players with a better serve, but a worse hold game.

drakulie
10-20-2009, 07:48 PM
Wrong metric. Fed played more matches than either of those guys. They have more aces per match.

Then I suppose their serves ain't that good, since it can't win them more games.


Federer has better movement, and forehand. Once his top 10 (not top 5) first serve goes in, he dispatches of his opponents easier than the other guys.

Uhhhhh :roll:


Federer has a good second serve, but it's not winning him those points. The rest of his game is.

uhhhhh :roll:


Federer is mentally tougher than both of those players, and the rest of his game is miles above theirs. Isner being 3rd pretty much guarantees he has a MUCH better serve than Federer (which he does).

Stats dont' confirm.

President
10-20-2009, 08:01 PM
Currently:

1.Karlovic
2.Isner
3.Roddick
4.Tsonga
5.Federer

Federer's serving stats are comparable to all of these guys, but that is because he has a ridiculous baseline game as well. Most of these guys rely on their serve as their bread and butter, and still have stats similar to Federer's.

ubermeyer
10-20-2009, 09:30 PM
1st Serve:

1. Karlovic
2. Roddick
3. Isner
4. Muller
5. Querrey

2nd Serve:

1. Isner
2. Roddick
3. Karlovic
4. Federer
5. Ljubicic

Muller??? no...
I'd put Querrey, Guccione, of course, Soderling and even Murray ahead of Muller...

the rest of 1st serve, and 2nd serve is about right though

ubermeyer
10-20-2009, 09:31 PM
1.Federer (Nothing against Karlovic but I think Fed uses more brain then Karlovic imo)
2.Karlovic
3.Roddick
4/5.Ljubicic
5/4.Tsonga

Karlovic may use less brain... but his 1st serve is light-years better than fed's

abmk
10-20-2009, 11:31 PM
Karlovic
Roddick
Federer
Isner
Tsonga
Guccione
Johannsson
Soderling
Querry
Ljubicic
.......

Cesc Fabregas
10-20-2009, 11:34 PM
Once again a clueless post.


[QUOTE]Aces- Fed is 5th on the tour in number of aces (isner- 6th,ljubicic- 7th)

Federer plays way more matches than those guys, so as a result he gets more aces.

First serve point won- Fed is 4th, (ljubicic 7th, isner 17th)
Who is most likely to hit a winner when the ball comes back? and who is most likely to dump it into the net? Facts are those guys have better serves but weak alround games.
Second Serve Points won- Fed is 1st, (Isner 5th, ljubicic 35th)
Nadal was in the top 5 second serve points won last year, or are you telling me he has one of the best second serves? :oops: Second serve points won is more to do with how good your allround game is.

Service Games won- Fed is 3rd (Isner 5th, ljubicic 16th)
Federer backs his serve up better than anyone and he isn't even leading this category, doesn't that tell you he has nowhere near the best serve?

Break points saved- Fed is 2nd (Isner 3rd, ljubicic 7th)
Federer is more likely to hit a winner or his defence is good enough to force an error on the breakpoints, he also mentally stronger than those guys.

He beats both of them in every category, but I could definitely see your and your new clueless pal's point. :roll: You are such a troll.

You're the clueless one.

jamesblakefan#1
10-20-2009, 11:44 PM
Once again a clueless post.

Federer plays way more matches than those guys, so as a result he gets more aces.

Who is most likely to hit a winner when the ball comes back? and who is most likely to dump it into the net? Facts are those guys have better serves but weak alround games.

Nadal was in the top 5 second serve points won last year, or are you telling me he has one of the best second serves? :oops: Second serve points won is more to do with how good your allround game is.

Federer backs his serve up better than anyone and he isn't even leading this category, doesn't that tell you he has nowhere near the best serve?

Federer is more likely to hit a winner or his defence is good enough to force an error on the breakpoints, he also mentally stronger than those guys.

You're the clueless one.

Well said sir.

Andres
10-21-2009, 05:40 AM
You guys ever heard of Wayne Arthurs?...definitely one of the greatest EVER...IMHO.
Ever heard of the word 'today' ? :)

helloworld
10-21-2009, 05:59 AM
1.Karlovic
2.Isner
3.Pim-Pim
4.Roddick
5.Federer on a good day

drakulie
10-21-2009, 06:50 AM
Federer plays way more matches than those guys, so as a result he gets more aces.

If they had better serves, they'd be winning more matches.


Who is most likely to hit a winner when the ball comes back? and who is most likely to dump it into the net?

If they had better serves, they'd be getting easier returns, and as a result, would have more winners.


Nadal was in the top 5 second serve points won last year, or are you telling me he has one of the best second serves?

Yes.

:oops: Second serve points won is more to do with how good your allround game is.

Your only as good as your second serve. Remember this, for when you decide to start actually playing tennis.


The rest of your post is garbage (not the the first part wasn't), troll.

Blinkism
10-21-2009, 07:02 AM
Anyone rating Federer #1 or #2 is overrating him on serve, but he definitely belongs in people's Top 5 lists.

Ljubicic is no longer a Top 5 server, IMO.

And, obviously, Roddick is a perennial top 5 server.

I know he is FAR, FAR, FAR away from the Top 5 list of server, but Nico Almagro deserves a mini-shoutout for serving quite well at Wimbledon. Him and Verdasco (too bad about all those DF's).

Are people really including Johansson back on their lists? The dude's played like 2 or 3 comeback matches, he's hardly back to the top of men's tennis in serves...

Although he was a beast in his day :)

Cesc Fabregas
10-21-2009, 08:34 AM
If they had better serves, they'd be winning more matches.




If they had better serves, they'd be getting easier returns, and as a result, would have more winners.




Yes.



Your only as good as your second serve. Remember this, for when you decide to start actually playing tennis.


The rest of your post is garbage (not the the first part wasn't), troll.



The fact that you think Nadal has one of the best second serves in the world indicates that your really don't have a clue what your talking about. I recomend this for you. You can thank me later.


http://img.infibeam.com/img/443066cb/874/0/9780764550874.jpg

drakulie
10-21-2009, 09:01 AM
The fact that you think Nadal has one of the best second serves in the world indicates that your really don't have a clue what your talking about. I recomend this for you. You can thank me later.




Let me know when the guys you are referencing to had better numbers than the years referred.

LolzWhat?
10-21-2009, 09:19 AM
1. O. Rochus
2. C. Rochus
3. Phau
4. Seppi
5. Robredo.

dropshot winner
10-21-2009, 09:25 AM
1. O. Rochus
2. C. Rochus
3. Phau
4. Seppi
5. Robredo.

You forgot Nieminen, his 2nd serve makes Sampras green with envy.

big bang
10-21-2009, 02:43 PM
many players serve harder and with more spin than Fed, but fedīs serve is so difficult to read, you simply cant see where its going before the ball leaves his raquet. It might not look as impressive as many other of the big servers, but he has the abillity to disguise it better..

big bang
10-21-2009, 02:45 PM
1. O. Rochus
2. C. Rochus
3. Phau
4. Seppi
5. Robredo.

great list you got there, but had chang still been playing I would give him #1 spot:) Santoro could be a contender as well..

grafselesfan
10-21-2009, 03:17 PM
great list you got there, but had chang still been playing I would give him #1 spot:) Santoro could be a contender as well..

Dont forget Gilles Simon, what a killer serve that guy has, lol.