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View Full Version : Can you tie off against a cross


kenshireen
11-05-2009, 05:40 AM
Once in a while I find that there is more room for a tie-off on a cross.. is this ok.

Second question.. when you pull to tie the knot I usually wrap the string around my finger and pull instead of using my starting clamp to grip.. Is this OK

Thanks,
Ken

kkm
11-05-2009, 06:55 AM
imho, yes, and probably yes

SOY78
11-05-2009, 06:58 AM
My Volkl DNX 10 mid grommets that are in a Volkl C10 Pro Tour racquet require me to use the cross as a tie off.

Rabbit
11-05-2009, 07:04 AM
You should always tie off on a cross if it's available.

Richie Rich
11-05-2009, 07:56 AM
My Volkl DNX 10 mid grommets that are in a Volkl C10 Pro Tour racquet require me to use the cross as a tie off.

same with the mg prestige mp

kkm
11-05-2009, 08:52 AM
You should always tie off on a cross if it's available.

I like and have adopted this practice.

Irvin
11-05-2009, 12:48 PM
I always tie off a cross string is I am going one piece but it makes no difference if you tie off on a cross or a main. Some stringers do not like to tie off a poly on a multi string though and that is not a bad idea. If tie off a cross string because I can get the clamp closer to the frame with the clamp and the cross hole is usually closer to the tie off hole. Both reduce the distance between the clamp and the knot. The closer the clamp is to the knot the less draw back you will have on the tied off string.

Using your finger, pliers, starting clamp, or your teeth is OK to hold the string while you are tying it off as long as you don't damage the string (or your teeth.) I like to use a starting clamp because I can rock it one or two times and get most if not all the tension out of the string between the knot and the clamp. I am sure you could do it with your fingers too, but if you string many rackets in a day your fingers may get sore.

Irvin

Bud
11-05-2009, 12:56 PM
Once in a while I find that there is more room for a tie-off on a cross.. is this ok.

Second question.. when you pull to tie the knot I usually wrap the string around my finger and pull instead of using my starting clamp to grip.. Is this OK

Thanks,
Ken

Tie-off wherever you can find space in a grommet hole :)

Lindsay
11-05-2009, 03:58 PM
Tie off wherever you find space? Really? How about plan ahead, open a grommet if needed, and tie-off where you'll lose the least tension? Tie-off on a cross.

Bud
11-05-2009, 05:04 PM
Tie off wherever you find space? Really? How about plan ahead, open a grommet if needed, and tie-off where you'll lose the least tension? Tie-off on a cross.

Yes, really :-?

Reading you post, I think of this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpX2Cx86hg8

Please explain how tying off on a main causes a loss of tension :roll:

Irvin
11-05-2009, 05:51 PM
Tie off wherever you find space? Really? How about plan ahead, open a grommet if needed, and tie-off where you'll lose the least tension? Tie-off on a cross.

I have to say that I always use a tie off hole to tie off instead of opening up a grommet hole that is not meant for tie offs. Most of the time that means I have to tie off on a main string and not a cross string. I would say 99% of the time if you are stringing one piece the grommet that you will lose the least amount of tension is on a main string not a cross. When I string one piece I tie off the top and bottom cross strings but they are using tied on a main.

Irvin

Lindsay
11-05-2009, 08:06 PM
Easy answer - go find a picture of federer, nadal, djokovic, anybody top 20s frames. If they were done at a tourney with reputable stringers, they're tied off on crosses. If it's good enough for them, shouldn't we want the same thing?

Lindsay
11-05-2009, 08:08 PM
And to bud, I Just thought it were a litle careless to say "tie off anywhere". You should put a little more thought into it to stay consistent
and to Irvin, the best place to tie off is the closest place to where you finish. 90% of the time the cross above is your best option.

Bud
11-06-2009, 01:57 AM
And to bud, I Just thought it were a litle careless to say "tie off anywhere". You should put a little more thought into it to stay consistent
and to Irvin, the best place to tie off is the closest place to where you finish. 90% of the time the cross above is your best option.

Regardless of whether you tie off on a main or a cross, it makes no difference in the tension.

You can tie off where it's most practical and/or convenient.

Irvin
11-06-2009, 02:21 AM
...to Irvin, the best place to tie off is the closest place to where you finish. 90% of the time the cross above is your best option.

If I were just finishing up my mains doing one piece and wanted to tie off, which cross would that be 90% of the time? Seems to me that 100% of the time there would not be a cross.

Irvin

jim e
11-06-2009, 03:15 AM
Tie-off wherever you can find space in a grommet hole :)

Lindsay is correct, to tie off wherever is a careless statement to say! Whatever happened to keeping things consistant as possible?
I normally use the manuf. specific tie offs whenever possible,but the closer you tie the knot to the machines clamp holding the string, the less tension loss there will be, as the distance of string between the clamp and the knot is basically not tensioned even if a good cinched up knot is done.
But to say to tie off wherever, if that wherever is a # of grommet holes away, there can be some loss. This should not even be a debatable issue.

Bud
11-06-2009, 03:27 AM
Lindsay is correct, to tie off wherever is a careless statement to say! Whatever happened to keeping things consistant as possible?
I normally use the manuf. specific tie offs whenever possible,but the closer you tie the knot to the machines clamp holding the string, the less tension loss there will be, as the distance of string between the clamp and the knot is basically not tensioned even if a good cinched up knot is done.
But to say to tie off wherever, if that wherever is a # of grommet holes away, there can be some loss. This should not even be a debatable issue.

I was hoping others (i.e. you and Lindsay) would figure out that you do use the manufacturer's recommendation wherever/whenever possible. When not possible, it's OK to use another grommet hole to tie off... regardless if it's a cross or main.

It's pretty darn obvious (to most stringers) that you should use the closest grommet hole possible to the last cross.

origmarm
11-06-2009, 03:29 AM
One piece I often tie off on a cross. Two piece of course I don't by and large.

uk_skippy
11-06-2009, 04:05 AM
....to Irvin, the best place to tie off is the closest place to where you finish. 90% of the time the cross above is your best option.

If I were just finishing up my mains doing one piece and wanted to tie off, which cross would that be 90% of the time? Seems to me that 100% of the time there would not be a cross.

I suspect that Lindsay is referring to tie-off mains & not crosses. On a 2-piece job I doubt that anyone would tie-off on a cross as you'd have to use 2 strarting clamps to hold the mains until you'd finished the crosses.

Now if you're stringing 1 piece that can be a bit different. If I do a ATW pattern on a standard wilson 16 x 18 then my short side mains would also do the top 2 crosses and this would allow me to tie-off on the 2nd from top cross. Even on something like a Volkl where the mains finish at the top and I run the short-side main across the top cross, I could still hold that string in a starting clamp until I'd strung several more crosses and then tie-off the main on the 2nd from top cross.

I was hoping others (i.e. you and Lindsay) would figure out that you do use the manufacturer's recommendation wherever/whenever possible. When not possible, it's OK to use another grommet hole to tie off... regardless if it's a cross or main.

It's pretty darn obvious (to most stringers) that you should use the closest grommet hole possible to the last cross.

I agree that the first pattern any string should use is the manufacturer's pattern. You can't go wrong with their design (most times!). Once you're happy deciding that you'd rather use a different position for the tie-off, for whatever reason, then that's up to you.

Regards

Paul

kkm
11-06-2009, 08:10 AM
On a 2-piece job I doubt that anyone would tie-off on a cross as you'd have to use 2 strarting clamps to hold the mains until you'd finished the crosses.

I do this :oops:

Irvin
11-06-2009, 08:37 AM
...Now if you're stringing 1 piece that can be a bit different. If I do a ATW pattern on a standard wilson 16 x 18 then my short side mains would also do the top 2 crosses and this would allow me to tie-off on the 2nd from top cross. Even on something like a Volkl where the mains finish at the top and I run the short-side main across the top cross, I could still hold that string in a starting clamp until I'd strung several more crosses and then tie-off the main on the 2nd from top cross...

How do you string a Wilson 16 x 18 racket ATW?

Irvin

uk_skippy
11-06-2009, 09:30 AM
How do you string a Wilson 16 x 18 racket ATW?

Irvin

Take the 6.1 95 16 x 18

string short side to 7th main, then string to 2nd from top cross, then top cross. This will let you tie-off the short side on the 2nd from top cross if you want to. String long side to 8th main and this will end up at the btm, string 2nd from bottom cross the back up missing main on short side, then continue crosses from 3rd from top cross downwards. Last cross string will be bottom missing cross.

Regards

Paul

Irvin
11-06-2009, 01:21 PM
Take the 6.1 95 16 x 18

string short side to 7th main, then string to 2nd from top cross, then top cross. This will let you tie-off the short side on the 2nd from top cross if you want to. String long side to 8th main and this will end up at the btm, string 2nd from bottom cross the back up missing main on short side, then continue crosses from 3rd from top cross downwards. Last cross string will be bottom missing cross.

Regards

Paul

I am sure that would work but I would rather just run the top cross and tie off at the normal 5H tie off hole. Your want you would have to open up the grommet hole to get two strings in it and it does not get you any closer to a tie off hole.

Irvin

uk_skippy
11-06-2009, 01:38 PM
I am sure that would work but I would rather just run the top cross and tie off at the normal 5H tie off hole. Your want you would have to open up the grommet hole to get two strings in it and it does not get you any closer to a tie off hole.

Irvin

I prefer to use the 2 cross string method, but I don't tend to tie-off the crosses on the 2nd from top cross when stringing ATW. I will do it though on hybrids.

I will run just the one across the top when stringing Volkl's 1 piece, or Babolat Pure Drive's ATW.

Regards

Paul

DownTheLine
11-06-2009, 01:47 PM
I use to do this when I put sensation or a softer cross in.