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nytennisaddict
11-16-2009, 04:58 AM
Each rep has to be from a dead hang (arms must lock out), palms facing out (eg. mainly because it's a precursor to other exercises like muscle ups), with no kipping (eg. kicking your feet to temporarily unweight your body).

Me: my ultimate goal is 5 one arm reps with my non-dominant arm (left). I'm currently at 10 pullups from a dead hang (vs. 25 where i keep my arms slightly bent at the bottom)

yemenmocha
11-16-2009, 07:53 AM
There's no option for ZERO.

Bud
11-16-2009, 08:05 AM
Each rep has to be from a dead hang (arms must lock out), palms facing out (eg. mainly because it's a precursor to other exercises like muscle ups), with no kipping (eg. kicking your feet to temporarily unweight your body).

Me: my ultimate goal is 5 one arm reps with my non-dominant arm (left). I'm currently at 10 pullups from a dead hang (vs. 25 where i keep my arms slightly bent at the bottom)

I know you didn't create this thread to brag :-|

P.S. You're awesome :)

r2473
11-16-2009, 09:07 AM
I think is is funny that pull-ups (unlike any other exercise) is a contest to see how many you can do.

If we were talking about the bench press, would you be bragging that you can rep the empty bar 50 times? Of course not. Instead, after you reach a desired number of reps, you would add weight to the bar. So why on earth don't people take the same approach to pull ups? Why is doing 20 pull-ups somehow better than doing 7 with a 60 lb. dumbbell strapped to your body?

I just don't get it.

raiden031
11-16-2009, 09:10 AM
I think is is funny that pull-ups (unlike any other exercise) is a contest to see how many you can do.

If we were talking about the bench press, would you be bragging that you can rep the empty bar 50 times? Of course not. Instead, after you reach a desired number of reps, you would add weight to the bar. So why on earth don't people take the same approach to pull ups? Why is doing 20 pull-ups somehow better than doing 7 with a 60 lb. dumbbell strapped to your body?

I just don't get it.

And to add, if you can do more than 12 pull ups in a row, you are wasting your time doing them at all!

yemenmocha
11-16-2009, 09:28 AM
And to add, if you can do more than 12 pull ups in a row, you are wasting your time doing them at all!

Should be boasting about how much weight they're using on the lat pulldowns machine.

Number of pullups is a lame criterion, especially since it favors the frail/scrawny body types. Make them pull down the same weight that someone else can on a lat pulldown cybex machine.

spacediver
11-16-2009, 01:13 PM
I can do 4 or 5 chinups (neutral grip with hands close together) with 80 pounds around my dipping belt. Not sure how many bodyweight chinups I could do. I weigh about 160 pounds.

maverick66
11-16-2009, 02:56 PM
Number of pullups is a lame criterion, especially since it favors the frail/scrawny body types. Make them pull down the same weight that someone else can on a lat pulldown cybex machine.

Who ever told you this is very wrong. Most bodybuilders do them and they are massive. i have seen skinny little tennis players fail at them time and again because they lack the strength to do them. Also if it is the case that lighter people can do them easier why is it that most women struggle to do them even though they are lighter than most men?

And to add, if you can do more than 12 pull ups in a row, you are wasting your time doing them at all!

never heard that. From what i have read pull ups are the best back exercise out there. I have not heard any trainers say not to do pull ups if you can do a big amount of them.

raiden031
11-16-2009, 04:46 PM
never heard that. From what i have read pull ups are the best back exercise out there. I have not heard any trainers say not to do pull ups if you can do a big amount of them.

Probably because most people can't do that many. I'm going by the rule of thumb that I've heard from numerous sources which is if you can do more than 12 repetitions of any weight training exercise, then it is too easy and you are wasting your time. So with pull-ups, that would mean in order to get anything from them you need to strap weights to your body.

LeeD
11-16-2009, 04:50 PM
Yeah, you're right. There's no place in this world for light weights and lots of repetition.
Only thing that matters is high weight and a few reps.

J011yroger
11-16-2009, 04:50 PM
Pull: Check.

Up: Needs improvement.

I don't know what is more embarrassing, doing 6 pullups, or having to wait a minute only to do 4 more.

J

maverick66
11-16-2009, 05:49 PM
So with pull-ups, that would mean in order to get anything from them you need to strap weights to your body.

I agree to start straping on weight but you can also mess with your grip and get a different exercise. To not do them would be a bad idea. There is no better way to improve back strength.

Djokovicfan4life
11-16-2009, 05:59 PM
Pull: Check.

Up: Needs improvement.


J

This about sums it up for me.

stormholloway
11-16-2009, 06:23 PM
Is it good for the shoulder to do each rep from a dead hang? I think you're supposed to maintain contraction between reps.

Knightmace
11-17-2009, 12:03 AM
so what about push ups if you do more than 12 your wasting your time?

Jay_The_Nomad
11-17-2009, 03:35 AM
so what about push ups if you do more than 12 your wasting your time?

Nah. More than 200 at one go is excessive because not only are you wasting your time, you run the risk of wearing out your elbows due to a drop in form. (unless you're so conscientious and you maintain proper form).

AAAA
11-17-2009, 08:15 AM
Is it good for the shoulder to do each rep from a dead hang? I think you're supposed to maintain contraction between reps.

The problem with learning about correct exercise form is that there is so much conflicting advice both in print and the net. From one site I found this

Pull-up & Chin-up Technique. Start each rep from a dead hang with straight elbows. Clear the bar with your chin on every rep.
...
...
Chest Up. Don’t let your shoulders go forward: it’s unhealthy for your shoulders. Lead with your chest up & keep your shoulders back.

raiden031
11-17-2009, 08:23 AM
Nah. More than 200 at one go is excessive because not only are you wasting your time, you run the risk of wearing out your elbows due to a drop in form. (unless you're so conscientious and you maintain proper form).

Is it not a waste of time to do 50 repetitions of bench press with a bar with no weights on it?

nytennisaddict
11-17-2009, 08:29 AM
I know you didn't create this thread to brag :-|

P.S. You're awesome :)
I'd be bragging if i could reach my ultimate goal... doing 10 (my current) is hardly something to brag about.

nytennisaddict
11-17-2009, 08:31 AM
I think is is funny that pull-ups (unlike any other exercise) is a contest to see how many you can do.

If we were talking about the bench press, would you be bragging that you can rep the empty bar 50 times? Of course not. Instead, after you reach a desired number of reps, you would add weight to the bar. So why on earth don't people take the same approach to pull ups? Why is doing 20 pull-ups somehow better than doing 7 with a 60 lb. dumbbell strapped to your body?

I just don't get it.
I agree with you... doing 7 weighted pullup is *much* better than doing 20 (unweighted) pullups. I tried to indicate that by listing the option [1-5 weighted] as a harder progression (eg. harder than [11+ (unweighted)])

nytennisaddict
11-17-2009, 08:33 AM
And to add, if you can do more than 12 pull ups in a row, you are wasting your time doing them at all!
Agreed! In general, I think if the goal is to get stronger, doing any resistance exercise beyond 10-12 will provide minimal (zero?) gains vs. increasing the load/intensity for fewer reps.

nytennisaddict
11-17-2009, 08:41 AM
Should be boasting about how much weight they're using on the lat pulldowns machine.

Number of pullups is a lame criterion, especially since it favors the frail/scrawny body types. Make them pull down the same weight that someone else can on a lat pulldown cybex machine.
I think that being able to do impressive weight (exceeding your bodyweight) on the lat pull down machine is impressive! However, since I don't go to the gym (and hate paying for one), I do all my exercises at the playground. Also, my goal is not to lift as much iron as possible.. my goal is to develop a high strength to weight ratio to be able to move and manipulate my body in highly leveraged positions (which in my opinion is more important (functionally and for injury prevention) to movement based sports (eg. tennis, rock climbing, basketball, etc...) than just being able to statically lift as much weight as possible. I still think lifting weight has tremendous benefits, I just think that focusing on balance (eg. body weight exercises) while getting stronger (resistance exercises) has more benefit to me personally

nytennisaddict
11-17-2009, 08:43 AM
Probably because most people can't do that many. I'm going by the rule of thumb that I've heard from numerous sources which is if you can do more than 12 repetitions of any weight training exercise, then it is too easy and you are wasting your time. So with pull-ups, that would mean in order to get anything from them you need to strap weights to your body.
Agreed. However, if you don't have the means (like me) to have weights strapped to your body for pullups, you can increase the load by isolating the arms (eg. working towards a 1 arm pullup - and i'm not talking about a one arm pullup where your free hand is holding the wrist of the anchored hand).

nytennisaddict
11-17-2009, 08:50 AM
so what about push ups if you do more than 12 your wasting your time?
I can do 85-90 pushups in 2 minutes... but as a general workout out to get stronger, do variations of pushups where i can't do more than 10... sample progression:
* kneeling pushups: (=~50% benchpress of body weight)
* normal pushups: (=~70% benchpress of body weight)
* pushups with feet elevated
* clapping pushups
* typewriter pushups
* 1arm pushups
* 1arm&1leg (only 2 points on the ground - opposing leg/arm) pushup

hopefully you get the idea.

T Woody
11-17-2009, 12:13 PM
Should be boasting about how much weight they're using on the lat pulldowns machine.

Number of pullups is a lame criterion, especially since it favors the frail/scrawny body types. Make them pull down the same weight that someone else can on a lat pulldown cybex machine.

Mega FAIL.

T Woody
11-17-2009, 12:17 PM
so what about push ups if you do more than 12 your wasting your time?

If you can do more than 12 pushups, just start doing freestanding handstand clapping pushups like Jim. Work up to 12 in a row.

http://www.beastskills.com/ClappingHSPU.htm

Smartbucks
11-17-2009, 01:42 PM
i can do like 7 most days in the gym . its funny though sometimes i do them so easy and other times its like sloooow. thats life i guess.

Smartbucks
11-17-2009, 01:44 PM
If you can do more than 12 pushups, just start doing freestanding handstand clapping pushups like Jim. Work up to 12 in a row.

http://www.beastskills.com/ClappingHSPU.htm

Photoshop .. LOL

nytennisaddict
11-17-2009, 01:56 PM
I can do 4 or 5 chinups (neutral grip with hands close together) with 80 pounds around my dipping belt. Not sure how many bodyweight chinups I could do. I weigh about 160 pounds.

That is very strong... I'm not quite there yet. I think I read somewhere that you need to be able to do a weighted pullup with about 75% of your bodyweight, before you can start doing 1arm pullups - you're so close!

Can you do muscleups already?

J011yroger
11-17-2009, 02:56 PM
NYT, do you ever do pushups with your feet together atop a med ball, or basketball?

They were tough as heck for me at first to stay balanced, but now I love them.

J

Dgpsx7
11-17-2009, 03:03 PM
I can do about 11 or 12 with palms facing out(mentioned by OP) and about 15 palms facing in. I am about 170 lbs with most of my weight in my legs though.

spacediver
11-17-2009, 03:10 PM
That is very strong... I'm not quite there yet. I think I read somewhere that you need to be able to do a weighted pullup with about 75% of your bodyweight, before you can start doing 1arm pullups - you're so close!

Can you do muscleups already?

I did a muscleup for fun once at the climbing gym but it felt awkward on the shoulders. Might look into it at some point in the future.

Weighted chins and dips are two of my staple upper body lifts. Weighted dips feel like upper body squats.

nytennisaddict
11-17-2009, 06:54 PM
NYT, do you ever do pushups with your feet together atop a med ball, or basketball?

They were tough as heck for me at first to stay balanced, but now I love them.

J

I definitely used to do those, and got great benefit from them... adding the balancing factor to any exercise really forces you to recruit a wider range of muscles...

I have progressed to doing these now:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIY2sXIbmWA&feature=PlayList&p=0E1E8C0902C8302F&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=20

for about 4 reps

spacediver
11-17-2009, 07:25 PM
I just tried that one legged one armed pushup, and it feels very difficult. You have to recruit a whole range of stabilizers throughout your whole body to remain balanced.

These days I'm working on one legged squats on a wobble board. Out of all the exercises I do in the gym I find this one the most difficult (not in terms of recruiting maximal fiber activation, but in terms of focus)

stanfordtennis alum
11-17-2009, 07:34 PM
about 15 or so..

TnTBigman
11-18-2009, 07:03 AM
It depends on what your body weight is. I weight 248lbs and I can do 3 cleanly. I've maxed out on the pull down machine at 300lbs, ~5 reps.

J011yroger
11-18-2009, 04:03 PM
I definitely used to do those, and got great benefit from them... adding the balancing factor to any exercise really forces you to recruit a wider range of muscles...

I have progressed to doing these now:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIY2sXIbmWA&feature=PlayList&p=0E1E8C0902C8302F&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=20

for about 4 reps

Oh...I am a long way away from that. Looks pretty sick though. I will have to try it and see how far I get before my face hits the mat.

J

nytennisaddict
11-18-2009, 07:22 PM
Oh...I am a long way away from that. Looks pretty sick though. I will have to try it and see how far I get before my face hits the mat.

J
It's not about where you are, it's about where you're going... isn't that why we share all this knowledge about fitness, tennis tips, etc... :)

Besides, I'd trade my ability to those, for your serve :P

10ACE
11-19-2009, 08:27 PM
well this guy can do 644 in 60 minutes! http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/12/09/NBGJDG1ELV1.DTL

Then again the record for pullups in 1 minute is 31. So no need to do much more I guess

onehandbh
11-20-2009, 12:08 AM
That is very strong... I'm not quite there yet. I think I read somewhere that you need to be able to do a weighted pullup with about 75% of your bodyweight, before you can start doing 1arm pullups - you're so close!

Can you do muscleups already?

75% of bodyweight?!?
Wow. I'd have to add like 125lbs! Crazy.
I'll have to give that up as one of my weird lifetime
goals.

Try this variation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3mdkGxSFFhE

spacediver
11-20-2009, 09:10 AM
:shock::shock::shock:

nytennisaddict
11-20-2009, 11:30 AM
well this guy can do 644 in 60 minutes! http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/12/09/NBGJDG1ELV1.DTL

Then again the record for pullups in 1 minute is 31. So no need to do much more I guess
wow! that is impressive.

nytennisaddict
11-20-2009, 11:31 AM
75% of bodyweight?!?
Wow. I'd have to add like 125lbs! Crazy.
I'll have to give that up as one of my weird lifetime
goals.

Try this variation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3mdkGxSFFhE
I need to build up do just doing a flag pole (which is on my "todo" list) :)

J011yroger
11-20-2009, 03:01 PM
Nothing like seeing someone actually in shape to make you feel pitiful and weak.

As I was headed over to do my miserable amount of pullups, I see that the bar is already occupied.

By a dude, who is in his late 30's. He is holding the neutral grip pegs, his back is parallel to the floor, at a perfect L with his arms, and his legs are pointed straight at the ceiling at a perfect L with his torso. And he is doing pullups. . . lots of them. . . at will.

I don't know what the hell it is called, and I have never seen anyone do it before, but I know full well that if I ever attempted to try it, I would have to call 911 about 10 minutes beforehand to give the ambulance a head start.

J

r2473
11-20-2009, 03:13 PM
Nothing like seeing someone actually in shape to make you feel pitiful and weak.

As I was headed over to do my miserable amount of pullups, I see that the bar is already occupied.

By a dude, who is in his late 30's. He is holding the neutral grip pegs, his back is parallel to the floor, at a perfect L with his arms, and his legs are pointed straight at the ceiling at a perfect L with his torso. And he is doing pullups. . . lots of them. . . at will.

I don't know what the hell it is called, and I have never seen anyone do it before, but I know full well that if I ever attempted to try it, I would have to call 911 about 10 minutes beforehand to give the ambulance a head start.

J

You should have yelled "hey dick. hurry the phuk up. it's a public gym you know"

Then proceeded to do one pull-up (cheating) and move on to your next exercise :)

nytennisaddict
11-20-2009, 03:26 PM
Nothing like seeing someone actually in shape to make you feel pitiful and weak.

Well, there are different facets of being "in shape" :) but the point of this thread was to help motivate me (and others) see what's possible, and what i can strive for :) so far more than 50% (20+) folks can do more pull ups than me - motivating to me anyway!



As I was headed over to do my miserable amount of pullups, I see that the bar is already occupied.

By a dude, who is in his late 30's. He is holding the neutral grip pegs, his back is parallel to the floor, at a perfect L with his arms, and his legs are pointed straight at the ceiling at a perfect L with his torso. And he is doing pullups. . . lots of them. . . at will.

I don't know what the hell it is called, and I have never seen anyone do it before, but I know full well that if I ever attempted to try it, I would have to call 911 about 10 minutes beforehand to give the ambulance a head start.

J
Essentially they are pullups (it's similar to doing a "bent over row" with bodyweight)... it supposed to a) target the inner mid back (vs. lats) more and b) works your core (keeping the back parallel to the ground is a challenge to the lower back and abs)... i do them on my typical back day - you should be able to do about as many pullups as you normally can do... now the real challenge (which i'm working toward) is doing a completely straight front lever pullup (legs and back are parallel to the floor)

if anyone's interested, here's the article that got me to switch from doing free weights to doing bodyweight for all my resistance training:
http://www.dragondoor.com/articler/mode3/229

J011yroger
11-20-2009, 03:39 PM
I do inverted rows, where you put the bar in the squat rack, put your feet up on a swiss ball, and pull yourself up.

So I would guess that this is just the next progression of that.

J

onehandbh
11-23-2009, 05:19 PM
I need to build up do just doing a flag pole (which is on my "todo" list) :)

I've never attempted the flag thing b/c I know there's no way
I'd even come close. I'll bet some top rock climbers might be
able to do it. Some of them have vice grips for hands/fingers.

onehandbh
11-23-2009, 05:24 PM
I do inverted rows, where you put the bar in the squat rack, put your feet up on a swiss ball, and pull yourself up.

So I would guess that this is just the next progression of that.

J

I think I sometimes do a variation of this. I hang by the parallel
grip chinup bar and then raise my legs up (w/knees bent)
until my back is parallel to the ground and then "row up"
until my knee hits the bar. Kind of hard for me. Can only do
like 6-8. Trying to do 1 finger pullups (1 finger each hand)
but can only do 2 finger (each hand) ones right now.

Speaking of body weight exercises, in my yoga class there's
this one move where u go from pushup position to the frog
position (balancing with knees on elbows where you balance
on just your hands). Anyone try it? Surprisingly it takes a
lot of core strength but not a lot of actual strength. First time
I tried it I overshot as I lunged forward and face planted.

J011yroger
11-23-2009, 07:20 PM
^^^ Me and the faceplant are good friends, we go way back.

Fortunately I am really stubborn and keep going back for more no matter how dismally I fail at something.

J

SiM0N
11-24-2009, 05:25 AM
Currently I can do 14. I want to be able to do 20 or more..