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View Full Version : Strong NADAL is Back!!!


hondas2k
12-04-2009, 09:59 AM
man he was just best at clay court. In, Davis Cup he was so strong. just like same old NADAL. King of Clay!!!

Too bad for Czech...

matchmaker
12-04-2009, 10:07 AM
I knew that he'd find motivation to play for his country.

I think his problems over the past few months have been of various natures: physical and mental. I hope we get to see him back in his usual shape next year.

E36BMWM3
12-04-2009, 10:12 AM
Best he's played since Spring time earlier this year... A synopsis of what we'll see in 2010. VAMOS RAFA!!!!

TMF
12-04-2009, 10:12 AM
He defeated Berdych easily. Now he is so strong?

If he loses to a better player than Berdych, then all of the sudden hes so weak?

jazzyfunkybluesy
12-04-2009, 10:16 AM
Uh oh he has beaten Berdych. Then he will definitely complete a grand slam in 2010. Don't even quibble its absolute fact written in stone.

SuperDuy
12-04-2009, 10:19 AM
Ok, im stupid... Whats VAMOS RAFA mean?

CMM
12-04-2009, 10:19 AM
He defeated Berdych easily. Now he is so strong?

If he loses to a better player than Berdych, then all of the sudden hes so weak?

It's not about the result. The important thing is that he actually played very good.

VAMOS!
http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/8162/rafac.jpg

markwillplay
12-04-2009, 10:24 AM
naaaaa, I said all along that he would always be a huge threat on clay and especially in 3 out of 5. On hardcourt 2/3 sets..it's over. He will be tough in any tournament that is 3/5 because he has such a commitment to fitness and mental strength, but for the most part, I think he is done on all but clay. We will see at the Australian Open I guess where he has won before.

Anaconda
12-04-2009, 10:46 AM
man he was just best at clay court. In, Davis Cup he was so strong. just like same old NADAL. King of Clay!!!

Too bad for Czech...

Congratulations to your boy Rafa, he just managed to beat a wahsed-up, inconsistent no hoper on his worst surface.

Mustard
12-04-2009, 11:02 AM
Of course strong Nadal is back. It's clay. That win over Berdych takes his clay-court win-loss record to 140-4 since the start of 2005 Monte Carlo Masters.

All-rounder
12-04-2009, 11:06 AM
Great for him I wouldn't say he's back but he definatley played a good match on home surface

Michael Bluth
12-04-2009, 11:09 AM
I've heard this before. After Berdych in the Cincinatti QF, Gonzalez in the US Open QF, Tsonga in the Paris QF.

Nadal beats an inconsistent, mentally weak fool, and people think he's back. Then once he goes up against the top dogs of the sport he gets smoked.

Chadwixx
12-04-2009, 11:10 AM
Berdych is like the worst player in the history of the sport to break the top 10. The next big win will be his first

drakulie
12-04-2009, 11:10 AM
It's not about the result. The important thing is that he actually played very good.

VAMOS!
http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/8162/rafac.jpg

No wonder he is not playing well. Where is his raquet??

namelessone
12-04-2009, 11:17 AM
LOL at the OP. How the hell is Rafa back? Did you watch that first set? Sure,he played better after but the birdman flew away mentally after that. Nadal is playing mediocre CC tennis right now but as someone else said,mediocre Nadal on CC is way better than mediocre Nadal on HC.

He is still tentative on the BH and he misses with his FH still. One thing I did notice is that the clay helps his movement because he is still slow to take off but he can slide here and it helps him somewhat. Nadal has still a long ways to go game and confidence-wise. Did you see his celebrations today? Meant a lot to him,I guess,not because of this win necessarily but because he actually played something in the 2nd and third sets,he tried to take control and he did it. He will have to play A LOT better if he wants to win masters and GS's on clay. This will not cut it.

TMF
12-04-2009, 11:22 AM
You cannot just judge on one match and conclude that Rafa is completely back in form. Especially against a player that is no threat on clay.

Last year Roger crushed some of the average players on hard court. Did he finally became the same great, consistent player he once was? No. He was still struggling to play consistently, his forehand was erratic, became an UFEs machine, and thus continue flaming out against the players he use to dominated. It took times for him to get back on track. For Nadal, he needs to do more than just win one match to convince everyone that hes back again. Maybe win the slam first for start. As of now, hes still a player whos struggling to compete with the top ten players.

jazzyfunkybluesy
12-04-2009, 11:24 AM
Berdych is a Fed fanboy.

srinrajesh
12-04-2009, 11:25 AM
test will come agaisnt top 10 players ..lets c if his level improves VS stepanek no.12

TMF
12-04-2009, 11:30 AM
Of course strong Nadal is back. It's clay. That win over Berdych takes his clay-court win-loss record to 140-4 since the start of 2005 Monte Carlo Masters.

Was Roger back when he beat the same Berdych last year in Beijing??? How well did he play the next match?

BTW, Berdych is a much better hardcourt player than clay BTW.

Mustard
12-04-2009, 11:39 AM
Was Roger back when he beat the same Berdych last year in Beijing??? How well did he play the next match?

He won the US Open soon after.

BTW, Berdych is a much better hardcourt player than clay BTW.

I know. If that first rubber had been on hardcourt, Berdych would have been much more likely to win.

TheMagicianOfPrecision
12-04-2009, 11:41 AM
I understand that the Nadal-fans are gonna be happy with just about anything these days- But a win on clay vs Berdych, with 1 set finishing 7-5?? Come on ! :):)

Vyse
12-04-2009, 11:42 AM
the nadal-stepanek match will tell us more and i think rafa will dominate again

Blinkism
12-04-2009, 11:42 AM
I understand that the Nadal-fans are gonna be happy with just about anything these days- But a win on clay vs Berdych, with 1 set finishing 7-5?? Come on ! :):)

I thought it was a good win.

I don't agree with the OP that Nadal is back, fully.

He's on the right path.

A bagel over Berdych is better than no bagel, right?

TheMagicianOfPrecision
12-04-2009, 11:48 AM
I thought it was a good win.

I don't agree with the OP that Nadal is back, fully.

He's on the right path.

A bagel over Berdych is better than no bagel, right?

Its a good win- And im sure he is happy about it- it was the OP`s headline though that made me think its very exagurated...:shock: I mean, i watched Berdych on clay in Bastad the past 3 years and he looks like Bambi on ice.

TMF
12-04-2009, 11:51 AM
He won the US Open soon after.



Yeah, but you can’t expect Rafa is going to win the next GS. Also, Roger still struggles after USO.

Rafa will need to win more matches consistently to have a better picture.

namelessone
12-04-2009, 11:53 AM
I thought it was a good win.

I don't agree with the OP that Nadal is back, fully.

He's on the right path.

A bagel over Berdych is better than no bagel, right?

What did you think about his BH? Rafa seems to have some physical issues on the right side,why isn't he putting his weight into this shot like before? And today he had a chance,because the surface was slow,giving him more time to set up the shot. It's this that worries me the most. If he is not solid off both sides,he will have a tough time on all surfaces.

MuseFan
12-04-2009, 11:56 AM
Rafa is BACK baby! Now the rest of the tour will quake in fear again.

mzzmuaa
12-04-2009, 12:08 PM
I thought it was a good win.

I don't agree with the OP that Nadal is back, fully.

He's on the right path.

A bagel over Berdych is better than no bagel, right?

You're right about being back on the right track.
He talked in interviews about needing his confidence back, and this is a great step.

Omega_7000
12-04-2009, 12:09 PM
Berdych is just in awe of Nadal. He practically accepted defeat before even stepping onto the court for crying out loud!

snowpuppy
12-04-2009, 12:27 PM
Nadal is pumped because I was more of a pay back for his defeat in one of the Madrid masters back when it was an indoor hardcourt event. Berdych was mocking Nadal and testing the crowd that year so I think this was more a personal affair.

CMM
12-04-2009, 12:35 PM
Nadal is pumped because I was more of a pay back for his defeat in one of the Madrid masters back when it was an indoor hardcourt event. Berdych was mocking Nadal and testing the crowd that year so I think this was more a personal affair.
No, he beat him many times since then.
Berdych said that they are friends and if Rafa wouldn't have been injured, they would have played doubles together in Bangkok.

volleynets
12-04-2009, 12:37 PM
man he was just best at clay court. In, Davis Cup he was so strong. just like same old NADAL. King of Clay!!!

Too bad for Czech...

This is an example of exactly what Nadal said himself:
As soon as he loses people say he is weak and tired etc. AS soon as he wins people say look how strong Nadal is.

Basically Nadal knows there is a bandwagon.

Telepatic
12-04-2009, 12:42 PM
I haven't watch this match but I hope Nadal is playing good, at least on clay.

Blinkism
12-04-2009, 12:50 PM
Its a good win- And im sure he is happy about it- it was the OP`s headline though that made me think its very exagurated...:shock: I mean, i watched Berdych on clay in Bastad the past 3 years and he looks like Bambi on ice.

Well, Berdych did win Munich on clay this year against guys like Chardy, Hewitt, and Youzhny, so he's not a complete tool on clay. Not to mention his DC performances this year being good.

I think it was a good win for Nadal. At the very least, he won't be as nervous stepping out onto the clay courts next year with Switzerland in their Davis Cup tie, if he plays.

What did you think about his BH? Rafa seems to have some physical issues on the right side,why isn't he putting his weight into this shot like before? And today he had a chance,because the surface was slow,giving him more time to set up the shot. It's this that worries me the most. If he is not solid off both sides,he will have a tough time on all surfaces.

I thought that his groundies today were excellent in the 2nd and 3rd sets and he was actually *GASP* aggressive off his backhand. He even moved well to the backhand, which I don't think anyone expected. Then again, it's clay, so he's probably more comfortable putting the pressure on his knees.

I think it was a positive win, overall- including the struggle of the first set. An easy match across all 3 sets wouldn't have given Rafa much to think about after the match. But now, he can be confident that he kicked *** but also look at what he has to improve on from the 1st set.

You're right about being back on the right track.
He talked in interviews about needing his confidence back, and this is a great step.

Hopefully, this Davis Cup weekend will be just what he needs for his confidence.

Vamos Rafa!

The_Question
12-04-2009, 12:53 PM
Seriously, these Nadal fanboys makes me laugh. Hell, I almost spit out my orange juice on my monitor laughing hard when I saw this thread title

TheMagicianOfPrecision
12-04-2009, 01:04 PM
Well, Berdych did win Munich on clay this year against guys like Chardy, Hewitt, and Youzhny, so he's not a complete tool on clay. Not to mention his DC performances this year being good.

I think it was a good win for Nadal. At the very least, he won't be as nervous stepping out onto the clay courts next year with Switzerland in their Davis Cup tie, if he plays

Never said it wasnt a good win- Every win is a good win. But dont jump to conclusions, beating Berdych on clay is as if Team Canada beats France in Ice-hockey, even first period- Then mental check out for different reasons from the underdogs.

Am I the only one who thinks Nadal is in need of rebuilding his game on faster surfaces than playing on clay? The other players are rebuilding their games right now.

RafaNike
12-04-2009, 01:09 PM
This will help rafa's confidence. it's back to the top from here.

E36BMWM3
12-04-2009, 01:10 PM
He defeated Berdych easily. Now he is so strong?

If he loses to a better player than Berdych, then all of the sudden hes so weak?

Leave the forum for being so ignorant.

E36BMWM3
12-04-2009, 01:12 PM
Congratulations to your boy Rafa, he just managed to beat a wahsed-up, inconsistent no hoper on his worst surface.

You too leave this thread for being ignorant

E36BMWM3
12-04-2009, 01:14 PM
I've heard this before. After Berdych in the Cincinatti QF, Gonzalez in the US Open QF, Tsonga in the Paris QF.

Nadal beats an inconsistent, mentally weak fool, and people think he's back. Then once he goes up against the top dogs of the sport he gets smoked.

Thir one I'll say this to... Leave the thread for being ignorant.

To clarify for all you haters and idiots, this doesn't mean Nadal is BACK... it simply means that it was an important match win for him that will help his confidence and outlook on 2010.

TMF
12-04-2009, 01:57 PM
Leave the forum for being so ignorant.

Why? I’m speaking the truth. When Rafa played well, it’s all about how good is over the field. All of the sudden he loses, it isn’t about the other player was better, but something wrong with him. Go figure.

When he lost to Roger in Madrid, he’s too tired.
When he was cruising at the FO, he’s invincible. But when he lost to Soderling, he’s tired, injured, burn out, etc….

Now, he just beat a mediocre player on clay, he became a invincible again.

You gotta love these *******s.

ReturnWinner
12-04-2009, 03:53 PM
Lets not overract, He beat Berdych on clay in Spain.

flyinghippos101
12-04-2009, 04:05 PM
Nadal played at a mediocre level, not at his AO level. But Nadal's mediocre of clay is still enough to win sets and matches. Still hurrah for Nadal's first bagel in awhile. Hope to see a recovery for 2010

P_Agony
12-04-2009, 04:07 PM
Good win for Nadal (and from what I hear great performence too!). I just hope the injury excuses are gone.

MuseFan
12-04-2009, 04:11 PM
One win on his beloved Spanish clay and ya'll nominating Rafa "is back" and going to kick *** in Australia. Very funny.

Bud
12-04-2009, 04:15 PM
Good win for Nadal (and from what I hear great performence too!). I just hope the injury excuses are gone.

The last time he was injured was at the USO with an abdominal tear. He's been playing with no confidence, lately. Get with the program :wink:

bolo
12-04-2009, 04:19 PM
Great 2nd and 3rd sets. Most importantly they had some shots of his left arm in the beginning......HUGE, MASSIVE I tell you.

TMF
12-04-2009, 04:25 PM
Great 2nd and 3rd sets. Most importantly they had some shots of his left arm in the beginning......HUGE, MASSIVE I tell you.

Was it more HUGE, MASSIVE than Soderling at the FO?

P_Agony
12-04-2009, 04:27 PM
The last time he was injured was at the USO with an abdominal tear. He's been playing with no confidence, lately. Get with the program :wink:

Quite happy for him actually. He's had some tough losses, and it's not easy when you are one of the top two players in the sport and everyone expects you to win. I hope he builds some confidence for the AO so we could have a great quality torney like in this year.

I miss tennis matches :-(

AM95
12-04-2009, 05:25 PM
OMG THATS SUCH A BIG ACCOMPLISHMENT! BEATING BERDYCH!!! 20th IN THE WORLD!!! ON CLAY!!!! HIS WORST SURFACE!! He will definitely p0wn Federer and win the calender slam (just like everyone thought he would this year.

Omega_7000
12-04-2009, 05:25 PM
Does Berdych have knee problems? Maybe he is exhausted??

veroniquem
12-04-2009, 05:27 PM
Of course strong Nadal is back. It's clay. That win over Berdych takes his clay-court win-loss record to 140-4 since the start of 2005 Monte Carlo Masters.
140-4?
That is one insane stat, isn't it? :)

veroniquem
12-04-2009, 05:30 PM
I thought it was a good win.

I don't agree with the OP that Nadal is back, fully.

He's on the right path.

A bagel over Berdych is better than no bagel, right?
Yeah he's on the right track. I think he will start 2010 well. He'll be ready for AO!

Bud
12-04-2009, 05:31 PM
140-4?
That is one insane stat, isn't it? :)

It's why he's the undisputed King of Klay :shock:

97% winning percentage on clay since 2005 (almost 5 years - in 2010).

Blinkism
12-04-2009, 05:34 PM
Yeah he's on the right track. I think he will start 2010 well. He'll be ready for AO!

I am hoping Spain loses their doubles rubber
ONLY so Rafa can have another competitive match under his belt before heading to the off-season.

veroniquem
12-04-2009, 05:50 PM
Was Roger back when he beat the same Berdych last year in Beijing??? How well did he play the next match?

BTW, Berdych is a much better hardcourt player than clay BTW.



Oh yeah. That's why the 1 title he won this year was on clay? :roll:
Lol at Fed fans coming here to disparage Berdych as if the guy was # 49 in the world (oops sorry, that was Benneteau...). Berdych is #20. He's not a tool by any means and IMO he played a very solid match. He didn't collapse after the first set. It's Nadal who raised his level and started hitting the lines.
And for a weak, incompetent player, Berdych sure was close to oust Fed at AO 2008.

veroniquem
12-04-2009, 05:52 PM
I am hoping Spain loses their doubles rubber
ONLY so Rafa can have another competitive match under his belt before heading to the off-season.
I'm hoping for the same. But I still think Nadal needs a break: rest, conditioning, practice. He's gonna put the month off to good use and surprise everybody when he comes back (that's my feeling!)

TennisFan3
12-04-2009, 05:54 PM
140-4?
That is one insane stat, isn't it? :)

Yes and even more impressive is the fact that there are only 2 players who've beaten Nadal "twice" on clay : Federer and Gaudio. And Gaudio is not even a present player!

veroniquem
12-04-2009, 06:02 PM
And another stat just for fun. The lowest ranked player Nadal lost to in 2009 was Soderling at RG who was then ranked 25.
He's the only player this year who never lost to players ranked lower than 40.
Cheers to that!

coloskier
12-04-2009, 06:04 PM
It's amazing how he could play on HC and look like he couldn't beat his way through a wet paper bag and then two weeks later he gets on clay and looks unbeatable. Let's face it. He is a clay court specialist who occasionally can do well on HC's, but they better not be fast HC's. There are now too many players that can beat him on HC's (3 for sure that we know of).

veroniquem
12-04-2009, 06:05 PM
Yes and even more impressive is the fact that there are only 2 players who've beaten Nadal "twice" on clay : Federer and Gaudio. And Gaudio is not even a present player!
Correct! Federer is the only current player and the only player since Monte-Carlo 2005 (1st clay master for Rafa, he was eighteen) who managed to beat Rafa twice on clay!

Outbeyond
12-04-2009, 06:08 PM
I understand that the Nadal-fans are gonna be happy with just about anything these days- But a win on clay vs Berdych, with 1 set finishing 7-5?? Come on ! :):)

Missed the rubbers today, and am scrolling through the comments for a quick review. But yours here made me laugh out loud!

You need to be extra NICE to us Nadal fans, now, TMOP, because we were worried sick about our man, seeking group hugs...

veroniquem
12-04-2009, 06:13 PM
It's amazing how he could play on HC and look like he couldn't beat his way through a wet paper bag and then two weeks later he gets on clay and looks unbeatable. Let's face it. He is a clay court specialist who occasionally can do well on HC's, but they better not be fast HC's. There are now too many players that can beat him on HC's (3 for sure that we know of).
He actually played the first set tentatively (in the same vein as WTF) but after he won it, he found his rhythm (and the lines!) and hit more aggressively.
It's always been true that other players could beat him on hard but Rafa's strength is that you cannot rule him out anyway. If he sticks around he will find a way to get a big one: 5 masters, 1 gold, 1 slam. I have no doubt he'll get more. Davydenko is gonna get old. Delpo and Djoko are great but they will never have Fed-like consistency. So I'm not worried about Rafa, he'll be fine.

flyinghippos101
12-04-2009, 06:16 PM
Missed the rubbers today, but am scrolling through the comments for a quick review. But yours here made me laugh out loud!

You need to be extra NICE to us Nadal fans, now, TMOP, because we were worried sick about our man, seeking group hugs...

(Group hugged) on behalf of the caring Fed Fan community :D

TMF
12-04-2009, 06:17 PM
You people make it sound like Nadal just won a GS. Winning one match in DC...big deal. A player cannot just don't turn on and off anytime he wants to. Getting back in full forces is slow process, many months to complete. That's what it took Roger when he was down. Who do you think Rafa is, God? He may even need more time than Agassi to get back in shape, let alone Federer. Geez.

Outbeyond
12-04-2009, 06:20 PM
(Group hugged) on behalf of the caring Fed Fan community :D

THANK you, flyinghippos. That made me feel very good, indeed - particularly coming from a kindly Fed fan!!

Outbeyond
12-04-2009, 06:22 PM
You people make it sound like Nadal just won a GS. Winning one match in DC...big deal. A player cannot just don't turn on and off anytime he wants to. Getting back in full forces is slow process, many months to complete. That's what it took Roger when he was down. Who do you think Rafa is, God? He may even need more time than Agassi to get back in shape, let alone Federer. Geez.

As for you, TMF, stop raining on our parade!!!!!!!!!!! :)

flyinghippos101
12-04-2009, 06:24 PM
You people make it sound like Nadal just won a GS. Winning one match in DC...big deal. A player cannot just don't turn on and off anytime he wants to. Getting back in full forces is slow process, many months to complete. That's what it took Roger when he was down. Who do you think Rafa is, God? He may even need more time than Agassi to get back in shape, let alone Federer. Geez.

Well look at it in their prespective. Tehy're happy, they excited, but only because this is the first in awhile Nadal's actualy played decently in a match. And considering how Nadal went setless in one of the biggest tournaments of the year, don't exactly blame em man.

veroniquem
12-04-2009, 06:30 PM
You people make it sound like Nadal just won a GS. Winning one match in DC...big deal. A player cannot just don't turn on and off anytime he wants to. Getting back in full forces is slow process, many months to complete. That's what it took Roger when he was down. Who do you think Rafa is, God? He may even need more time than Agassi to get back in shape, let alone Federer. Geez.
What's your problem? He played a great match after losing 4 in a row and we're happy. If you can't handle it, stay away man. Rafa served very well today and painted the lines. Straight set win, bagel, he was more confident that I've seen him in months and yeah I think it's reason enough to celebrate.

Mustard
12-04-2009, 06:40 PM
Yes and even more impressive is the fact that there are only 2 players who've beaten Nadal "twice" on clay : Federer and Gaudio. And Gaudio is not even a present player!

Gaudio actually beat Nadal three times on clay, but that was when Nadal was much lower ranked. Nadal was ranked 87 at the 2003 Hamburg Masters while Gaudio was ranked 29. At 2004 Bastad, Nadal was ranked 60 while recently crowned French Open champion Gaudio was ranked 11. And at 2005 Buenos Aires, Nadal was ranked 48 while Gaudio was ranked 8.

When Gaudio beat Nadal on clay, Gaudio was always the higher ranked player and it was before Nadal became the king of clay.

Blinkism
12-04-2009, 06:52 PM
Here are some comments Nadal and Berdych made post-match.

Nadal:
"I was a bit nervous at the start," said Nadal. "I played shorter than I normally do on clay.
"The first set was the key, and afterwards everything changed. I found more depth. I made fewer mistakes and I think Tomas was more tired than me.

'From the second set I could move much better on the baseline, I knew I could stay in control easily from that point.'

"Personally, I think he lost his way because I was playing better from the end of the first set. With the public behind me, I was confident and I started to play the tennis I normally play on clay."
"After that first set I just started to play much better, I was able to control the points a lot better and I wasn't making so many mistakes."

I was very nervous in the first set but I opened up a little bit and in the second set I was at a good level, Nadal told Television Espanola. Im very happy.

Berdych:
'I had a couple of chances in the first set, which I should have taken. If I had, the match would have been completely different.'

"You have to congratulate Rafa. The way in which he played those last two sets was simply incredible.
"It's tough to lose 13 games on the trot. I tried to find some answers to come into the net a little more but nothing really worked."

crackbillionair
12-04-2009, 08:09 PM
You guys are funny. A couple years back, a TERRIBLY POOR clay courter by the name of Andy Roddick whipped Berdy on clay in Davis Cup, in the Czech.

Nadal did not win a SET last week, yall. He hasn't been able to get a set off Djoker or Davydenko at all, in a long time.

He hasn't won a tournament...in ages. 1 match against Berdy? Not gonna learn much from that. Spain has @ least 2-3 guys other than Nadal who would have moved a 6'6 guy like that all around and beat him easily.

TennisFan3
12-04-2009, 08:47 PM
It seems that a lot of people here think Nadal plays awfully. How dare he loose 7 games to Berdych. He should have won by a triple bagel at the very least. Maybe then posters here would think that this match is a step in the right direction.

Mick
12-04-2009, 09:00 PM
of course nadal looked stronger, he's not playing the world's top players :)

crackbillionair
12-04-2009, 10:06 PM
It seems that a lot of people here think Nadal plays awfully. How dare he loose 7 games to Berdych. He should have won by a triple bagel at the very least. Maybe then posters here would think that this match is a step in the right direction.


He's 1-4 in his last 5 matches. Since that's slightly better than 0 and 5, he must be going in the right direction. Right?

jamesblakefan#1
12-04-2009, 10:46 PM
A win for Nadal on clay is nothing by now. Shouldn't be celebration over one good match. It hasn't gotten that bad for Nadal, has it? I should be the one making threads if my favorite player has a good match, since it happens so rarely nowadays. :lol:

No but seriously, it was a good win, an OK win. But do Nadal fans really want to have some great comeback party for Nadal after one win? Then if Nadal wins the AO or even the FO next year we'll hear how it's such a great comeback from his career nearly being over? :rolleyes:

You guys act like Nadal's washed up or something. He's had a tough few months, but still been having consistent results and beating the guys he's supposed to beat, even if ugly sometimes. A win vs Berdych on clay is nothing to Nadal.

And like others have mentioned, it's easier to look good when you're playing lesser level opposition on your favorite surface, not as easy playing the best in the world on your least favorite surface. Though I still maintain that the YEC wasn't indicative of what to expect from Nadal in 10, Nadal fans shouldn't be having victory parades just b/c of one good match vs Berdych on clay. Nadal also beat Berdych on HC in Cincy aka the Real Slam; we saw how that helped him at the USO. At this point Berdych is no longer good enough to give Nadal trouble. Take little to nothing from this result as it relates to next season for Nadal.

vernonbc
12-05-2009, 12:35 AM
Why do so many people give Nadal crap for winning a match on clay while having difficulty on an indoor hardcourt. Every single player has an advantage depending on what type of court they play on. Davydenko rightly got lots of praise for winning last week on hard court. If the tournament had been held on clay instead and Davydenko hadn't won a match, would there be mega headlines about him bring washed up and such a horrible tennis player? No, of course not. Different players have different strengths. Nadal's is on clay. Good for him. I hope he goes on another 81 match winning streak.

TMF
12-05-2009, 10:15 AM
What's your problem? He played a great match after losing 4 in a row and we're happy. If you can't handle it, stay away man. Rafa served very well today and painted the lines. Straight set win, bagel, he was more confident that I've seen him in months and yeah I think it's reason enough to celebrate.


Federer fans didn't celebrate just b/c he played one good match in 2008, b/c it's doesn't prove that he's fully recovered. The only parade we had was when he won the BIG one, and that was the 2008 USO. But for you and all Nadal fans who even think Rafa is back in full strength just b/c he had one good match can lead to more disappointment. I would advise you to wait until he wins a big one. Having a PARADE just b/c he won a match is pretty silly.

TMF
12-05-2009, 10:20 AM
Well look at it in their prespective. Tehy're happy, they excited, but only because this is the first in awhile Nadal's actualy played decently in a match. And considering how Nadal went setless in one of the biggest tournaments of the year, don't exactly blame em man.

Yeah, but having a parade just b/c he won a match? That's an overkill.

If Rafa wins the next GS, his fans is going to declare it as a national holiday!!!

Outbeyond
12-05-2009, 10:28 AM
Yeah, but having a parade just b/c he won a match? That's an overkill.

If Rafa wins the next GS, his fans is going to declare it as a national holiday!!!

LOL

That would be UN-BEE-LEEVE-A-BAHL!!!

TMF
12-05-2009, 10:35 AM
Oh yeah. That's why the 1 title he won this year was on clay? :roll:
Lol at Fed fans coming here to disparage Berdych as if the guy was # 49 in the world (oops sorry, that was Benneteau...). Berdych is #20. He's not a tool by any means and IMO he played a very solid match. He didn't collapse after the first set. It's Nadal who raised his level and started hitting the lines.
And for a weak, incompetent player, Berdych sure was close to oust Fed at AO 2008.

The clay title that Berdych won was by beating against players ranked no higher than 40. Impressive!
Other than that, he was a no show on any clay tourneys. Not to say he had a stellar performance on hc, but he was better than on clay.

Whether if you praise or disparage Berdych, it doesn't matter b/c Rafa is SUPPOSE to beat him on clay. My point is it's naive to believe Rafa is back just b/c he played a good match. It doesn't automatically erase everything he lost mulitple times to the top ten players this year. Understood?

GOATPARERA
12-05-2009, 10:35 AM
I don't think the result of this match was relevant, it was a definite win going in. The relevance here is Nadal's forehand, it looked better in that 2nd and 3rd set than it's looked for quite some time:D

If he hits the forehand like that in the Australian Open it will take a lot to beat him. Also his serve, it was a threat, both 1st and 2nd serve, nothing soft about it now:D

Whereas in the 1st set it all looked like crap, so this one match has transformed him completely:D:D

TMF
12-05-2009, 10:46 AM
I don't think the result of this match was relevant, it was a definite win going in. The relevance here is Nadal's forehand, it looked better in that 2nd and 3rd set than it's looked for quite some time:D

If he hits the forehand like that in the Australian Open it will take a lot to beat him. Also his serve, it was a threat, both 1st and 2nd serve, nothing soft about it now:D

Whereas in the 1st set it all looked like crap, so this one match has transformed him completely:D:D

Using his stats against Berdych as a reference to say how good his 1st and 2nd serve is poor. How good of a returner Berdych is? He ranked 25th on 1st serve return and 26th on 2nd serve return.

But when he faces the top ten players, his serve doesn't look impressive. And the only excuse is he's struggle due to injured, tired, burn-out, out of shape, etc....Go figure.

Blinkism
12-05-2009, 10:54 AM
Using his stats against Berdych as a reference to say how good his 1st and 2nd serve is poor. How good of a returner Berdych is? He ranked 25th on 1st serve return and 26th on 2nd serve return.

But when he faces the top ten players, his serve doesn't look impressive. And the only excuse is he's struggle due to injured, tired, burn-out, out of shape, etc....Go figure.

Did you even watch the match?

The point isn't THAT Nadal won, it's HOW Nadal won that people are happy about.

namelessone
12-05-2009, 10:54 AM
I've said it before and I will say it again: Nadal's REAL TEST will come in the clay and grass season,because that's where he excels. When Nadal was pretty healthy in 08'(and presumably on roids right?:) ),how many top10 players did he beat in the second part of the season? What is his usual record at the TMC? What is the best player he has beaten at USO(it's monfils if I am not mistaken and it was this year)? Nadal is not a guy who excels in the second part of the season,for various reasons,becaue his body can't hold up anymore,because he is tired,because fast HC and his game don't really mix and so on. For God's sake,Nadal got only to one HC GS final in 5 years at the top,it's not HC that determines how rafa is doing,it is clay and grass.

Nadal started losing steam this year on clay(and injuries made it worse) and missed the grass season. If Nadal can defeat top10 players on these surfaces and stay healthy,he will win RG or Wimbledon again and then we can say he is out of this slump. If he can't do it,for whatever reasons,he will retire in a few seasons time. Personally,I feel he can do it again,at least on clay,but he needs to amp his game,especially on the BH side.

GOATPARERA
12-05-2009, 11:09 AM
Yeah no stats or scores are relevant when measuring Nadal's level. All you had to do was watch the match and you see how much deeper and penetratingly he's hitting the forehand now CLOSE TO THE LINES, and how much bite his serve has now. Only area he didn't perform well was a lot of unforced errors on the backhand, but his form in all other areas made the backhand unimportant. Backhand is really a bonus shot for Nadal; he can beat anyone in the world with forehand alone when in form:D:D

Chadwixx
12-05-2009, 11:09 AM
You know times are bad for nadal when he gets this excited over a berdych win on clay.

Berdych isnt a threat on his best surface, much less his worse.

GOATPARERA
12-05-2009, 11:13 AM
Nadal saved his career with the win over Berdych. He proved to himself that his skills are still there. If he didn't play on clay before the Australian Open he may never have regained confidence until next year's clay season :D:D

fleabitten
12-05-2009, 11:17 AM
No wonder he is not playing well. Where is his raquet??
LOL! Good one. This would also make a great picture for a Caption This.

TMF
12-05-2009, 11:20 AM
Did you even watch the match?

The point isn't THAT Nadal won, it's HOW Nadal won that people are happy about.

No, but the problem is you cannot conclude that Nadal is back in full strength b/c:

-it's only one match
-it's only against one player(and not the top ten)
-Rafa's best surface
-Berdych worst surface
-not a suprise Rafa won

My issue is not about his fans are happy, but having a parade is overkill and of course believing that he's back is pretty silly.

CMM
12-06-2009, 07:11 AM
:mrgreen:
http://img686.imageshack.us/img686/6679/rafa1.jpg
http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/6922/rafa2c.jpg

matchmaker
12-06-2009, 07:49 AM
Well, the matches won are what could be expected from Nadal, but the 13 games streak against Berdych gives some hope to see Nadal back at his best next season, which could only be in the best interest of the neutral tennis fan. I guess he will never win the USO, but on anything between the AO and Wimbledon he has his chances.

GOATPARERA
12-06-2009, 08:29 AM
He could get lucky at a US Open in future and not have to play the premier hardcourter, ala Federer at RG :D

Keep making the semis (which he can do easily judging by this year's US) and anything can happen :D

edmondsm
12-06-2009, 08:55 AM
It's good that he won. If he had lost on slow clay, to Thomas Berdych, in Spain, that would have spelled real problems for Nadal. The test will be how his body and game are holding up after the winter/spring hardcourts. Let's not get out of control here with this one success. Andy Roddick beat Thomas Berdych on clay in Davis Cup when Berdych was better then he is now. It's not like landing on the moon.

GOATPARERA
12-06-2009, 09:59 AM
Nadal says he's ready now to start training for the Aust Open. I think he was 100% physically in WTF London, but mentally he had no confidence, until he regained it at Davis Cup, his forehand is a weapon once more :D :D

TMF
12-09-2009, 12:23 PM
Nadal saved his career with the win over Berdych. He proved to himself that his skills are still there. If he didn't play on clay before the Australian Open he may never have regained confidence until next year's clay season :D:D

He saved his career just b/c of one match against a weak clay court player, whos not suppose to beat rafa anyway? I suppose it also mean his career would be over had lost that match. LOL. You are funny.

You can dream all you want...because hes not going to play only 1 match in 2010, but somewhere 70 matches. And its not going to be the same Berdych, but against the top ten who owned him in the last 8 months!

nCode2010
12-09-2009, 12:26 PM
Great for Rafa. Maybe this will lead to confidence for Doha.

djokovicgonzalez2010
12-09-2009, 01:53 PM
I've heard this before. After Berdych in the Cincinatti QF, Gonzalez in the US Open QF, Tsonga in the Paris QF.

Nadal beats an inconsistent, mentally weak fool, and people think he's back. Then once he goes up against the top dogs of the sport he gets smoked.

I hate Nadal but I'll admit he played well against him. Gonzalez is by no means weak and has the highest % of bps saved of the top 32. He's just really bad in tiebreaks then gave up. And Berdych collapsed. And, honestly. Berdych?! When was the last time he beat a Top 10 player?! If anyone watched Rafa vs. Hajek he was playing pathetically but still won cuz Hajeks not even a singles player... Nadal is 0-9 vs. Top 8 since beating Djokovic (4 at time) 3-6 7-6 7-6.

TMF
12-09-2009, 01:59 PM
Great for Rafa. Maybe this will lead to confidence for Doha.

What did he say about how he feel BEFORE the WTF? And what did he say AFTER the tournament?

And Doha is play on hard court. Dont compared DC(clay) to Doha.

Blinkism
12-09-2009, 02:08 PM
What did he say about how he feel BEFORE the WTF? And what did he say AFTER the tournament?

And Doha is play on hard court. Dont compared DC(clay) to Doha.

Dude, seriously, what's your problem? What's your beef with Nadal fans being happy that he won a few matches and hoping that he is confident for the next season?

Sometimes it feels like it's just a crime to be a Nadal fan on these threads.

...

Vamos Rafa!!

TMF
12-09-2009, 02:50 PM
Dude, seriously, what's your problem? What's your beef with Nadal fans being happy that he won a few matches and hoping that he is confident for the next season?

Sometimes it feels like it's just a crime to be a Nadal fan on these threads.

...

Vamos Rafa!!

The key word here is "happy", and Im not here to ask you guys to be "unhappy" about your boy.

This thread is about Rafa is back in form, which has no proof just b/c of one match he played on clay. Thats all Im interested in.

You can be happy all you want, I dont care, but Ill argue against people you claim Rafa is back.

...

Vamos Rafa!!

Blinkism
12-12-2009, 08:27 PM
Vamos Rafa!!

That's the spirit :)

Antonio Puente
12-12-2009, 08:54 PM
You people make it sound like Nadal just won a GS. Winning one match in DC...big deal. A player cannot just don't turn on and off anytime he wants to. Getting back in full forces is slow process, many months to complete. That's what it took Roger when he was down. Who do you think Rafa is, God? He may even need more time than Agassi to get back in shape, let alone Federer. Geez.

Fed is down. What are you watching? He's lost 4 of his last 6 matches(nearly lost every one) and is 2-4 in his last 6 vs. top 10 opponents. How long before Fed is back to full force?

TMF
12-12-2009, 09:16 PM
Fed is down. What are you watching? He's lost 4 of his last 6 matches(nearly lost every one) and is 2-4 in his last 6 vs. top 10 opponents. How long before Fed is back to full force?

While we can all agree that Roger isn't going to reach the level of dominant he once was in 2005/2006, but the way he bounce back this year with 2 GS titles plus 2 GS finals, and reclaimed the year end #1 is fair to say he's back. This year he didn't have the physical problem he had last year and it looks like he's fit and ready for the 2010.

veroniquem
12-13-2009, 01:04 AM
[QUOTE=TMF;4191938]
Yeah he bounced back and then bounced off again. No USO, no Basel, no WTF and those used to be his bread and butter + seriously, Benneteau?
As for "recovering" #1, it would be more accurate to say Nadal gave it up. He would have had 0 chance of getting it back if Nadal had been able to play Wimbledon.

DarthMaul
12-13-2009, 01:31 AM
No wonder he is not playing well. Where is his raquet??

ROFLMAO !!! :D

GOATPARERA
12-13-2009, 03:51 AM
He saved his career just b/c of one match against a weak clay court player, who’s not suppose to beat rafa anyway? I suppose it also mean his career would be over had lost that match. LOL. You are funny.

You can dream all you want...because he’s not going to play only 1 match in 2010, but somewhere 70 matches. And it’s not going to be the same Berdych, but against the top ten who owned him in the last 8 months!

Yes it does, if Nadal had not got some time on clay before the Australian Open he would not have got his game back together and his confidence. So let's assume there was no Davis Cup, would he have trained on clay before the Australian Open? Maybe. But what if he didn't, what if he only trained on hardcourts?

And even if he did train on clay, would it have brought out his confidence the way a competitive clay match does? Then he may have entered the Australian Open in a mess mentally and physically. When he plays on clay he gets confidence to attack with his forehand, you saw it in the Davis Cup, he was going for broke with his forehand into the corners unlike during the hardcourt season.

The forehand he hits with on clay is what won him the Australian Open, not the defensive abbreviated version he used at the US Open :o

Rippy
12-13-2009, 04:37 AM
[QUOTE=TMF;4191938]
Yeah he bounced back and then bounced off again. No USO, no Basel, no WTF and those used to be his bread and butter + seriously, Benneteau?
As for "recovering" #1, it would be more accurate to say Nadal gave it up. He would have had 0 chance of getting it back if Nadal had been able to play Wimbledon.

Why? Nadal was able to play the French Open but went out in the 4th round. Perhaps the same would have happened at Wimbledon if he had been able to play. :p

sihatch19
12-13-2009, 05:15 AM
Ummm....Nadal didn't win a single set in the WTF so let's be realistic. I'm a Fed fan but I'm hoping Nadal can comback strong so they can stay on top.

GOATPARERA
12-13-2009, 05:17 AM
It doesn't take much form for Nadal to at least make the semi of every slam, look at the US Open, never reached close to top form but still made the semis easily...

dlk
12-13-2009, 05:27 AM
It doesn't take much form for Nadal to at least make the semi of every slam, look at the US Open, never reached close to top form but still made the semis easily...

Precisely, he's scary. To not be hitting on all cylinders and have a nagging injury, yet make semis w/o too much hassle is impressive.

Marshredder
12-13-2009, 05:33 AM
Nadals style of play is great even when he's not 100%, as a large proportion of it is wearing the other player down and out-gunning them with his fitness.

I really do hope Nadal wins a slam or 2 this year, if he doesnt then it would be hard to see him making a comeback.

feetofclay
12-13-2009, 06:07 AM
of course nadal looked stronger, he's not playing the world's top players :)

Just to give a little perspective. Over the whole year Nadal beat top ten players a total of 14 times, a fit Federer managed 15 wins over top ten players.When it comes to top five players Federer and Nadal both had 7 wins.

TMF
12-13-2009, 01:34 PM
Yeah he bounced back and then bounced off again. No USO, no Basel, no WTF and those used to be his bread and butter + seriously, Benneteau?
As for "recovering" #1, it would be more accurate to say Nadal gave it up. He would have had 0 chance of getting it back if Nadal had been able to play Wimbledon.

Don't ask Roger to duplicate the 2005-06 b/c it's not going to happen. He can never reach that level anymore, but winning 2 GS and reach #1 again, he's back at the top. Now let see if Rafa can do it in 10 months.

No rafa didn't give in. He played hard and got beat fair and square by Soderling. He can't even beat Wawrinka and Hewitt on grass during exo, so it's more plausible Rafa wouldn't make the 2nd week at SW19.

edmondsm
12-13-2009, 04:14 PM
Precisely, he's scary. To not be hitting on all cylinders and have a nagging injury, yet make semis w/o too much hassle is impressive.

He's going to have to do better then make the semis of the AO in order to not lose further ground on Federer. He'll lose well over 1000 points if he loses in the semis. If he loses earlier then that watch out for players behind him to close in on him in the rankings. He's got 1000 points to defend at Indian Wells too. He'll have to start off the year in form. He usually has in the past, we'll see if he can do it again.

RelentlessAttack
12-13-2009, 04:17 PM
He's going to have to do better then make the semis of the AO in order to not lose further ground on Federer. He'll lose well over 1000 points if he loses in the semis. If he loses earlier then that watch out for players behind him to close in on him in the rankings. He's got 1000 points to defend at Indian Wells too. He'll have to start off the year in form. He usually has in the past, we'll see if he can do it again.

I don't think he'll defend either one, even being his fan. I'm pretty sure he'll drop out of the number 2 spot for a bit, it's going to take more than the 3 weeks of training to recover his peak form I think. IMO he'll hit his stride in Monte Carlo, and he'll be able to recover a lot of points at RG and Wimbledon

P_Agony
12-13-2009, 04:29 PM
[QUOTE=veroniquem;4191938]
Yeah he bounced back and then bounced off again. No USO, no Basel, no WTF and those used to be his bread and butter + seriously, Benneteau?
As for "recovering" #1, it would be more accurate to say Nadal gave it up. He would have had 0 chance of getting it back if Nadal had been able to play Wimbledon.

Why, because it's such a given Nadal would have won Wimbly again?

Seriously, you're bashing Roger for losing the last few matches and you seem to forget that Nadal lost just about every match he had against a top 10 player since Madrid (Tsonga the exception).

Federer is at the point of his career in which he can't win it all. I think he did well at the TMC, beating Verdasco and Murray, and having close matches with DP and the eventual champ, Davy. Federer was ranked #1 in his RR group, and he did reach both the USO final, and the Basel final, nearly won both. And yet according to you those are bad results.

And it's also crystal clear that you didn't watch Fed vs. Benneteau - Fed didn't play badly at this match as Benneteau was just too good that day. But I can't expect much from you other than the usual "let's bash Fed regardless of common sense" mode.

edmondsm
12-13-2009, 04:47 PM
I don't think he'll defend either one, even being his fan. I'm pretty sure he'll drop out of the number 2 spot for a bit, it's going to take more than the 3 weeks of training to recover his peak form I think. IMO he'll hit his stride in Monte Carlo, and he'll be able to recover a lot of points at RG and Wimbledon

At the same time, I have trouble seeing Roger defend both his FO or Wimbledon titles, even one of them. Nadal should not worry himself with defending all of his masters series points on the clay courts. He should make sure that he is healthy entering the FO, and then by proxy Wimbledon. His ranking is of little consiquence going into either of those tournaments as he can beat anyone he faces at either of them so if he were to get more rest at the expense of dropping to #3 in the rankings he would benefit greatly IMO. He has won enough Masters Series titles and he needs to concentrate on the trophies that will really contribute to his legacy.

Fedace
12-13-2009, 04:50 PM
Nadal better bulk up again before next year. He is not very good without his muscles. Lets just hope he didn't have help getting it.

GOATPARERA
12-13-2009, 11:52 PM
At the same time, I have trouble seeing Roger defend both his FO or Wimbledon titles, even one of them. Nadal should not worry himself with defending all of his masters series points on the clay courts. He should make sure that he is healthy entering the FO, and then by proxy Wimbledon. His ranking is of little consiquence going into either of those tournaments as he can beat anyone he faces at either of them so if he were to get more rest at the expense of dropping to #3 in the rankings he would benefit greatly IMO. He has won enough Masters Series titles and he needs to concentrate on the trophies that will really contribute to his legacy.

No doubt about it, and I hope he realises this too. That Djokovic match last year (the longest 3 set match) is an example of how messed up Nadal's prioritizing is. He's got to change the way he thinks somehow...

dlk
12-14-2009, 04:11 AM
He's going to have to do better then make the semis of the AO in order to not lose further ground on Federer. He'll lose well over 1000 points if he loses in the semis. If he loses earlier then that watch out for players behind him to close in on him in the rankings. He's got 1000 points to defend at Indian Wells too. He'll have to start off the year in form. He usually has in the past, we'll see if he can do it again.

I agree. He needs to play well to hold onto points, but I believe he needs to play well afgter Wimby to regain some points, because he's going to lose ground the first half of the season.

RelentlessAttack
12-14-2009, 08:22 AM
At the same time, I have trouble seeing Roger defend both his FO or Wimbledon titles, even one of them. Nadal should not worry himself with defending all of his masters series points on the clay courts. He should make sure that he is healthy entering the FO, and then by proxy Wimbledon. His ranking is of little consiquence going into either of those tournaments as he can beat anyone he faces at either of them so if he were to get more rest at the expense of dropping to #3 in the rankings he would benefit greatly IMO. He has won enough Masters Series titles and he needs to concentrate on the trophies that will really contribute to his legacy.

I agree completely.

coloskier
12-14-2009, 02:47 PM
How many weeks has it been between Nadal's zero sets debacle at WTF and his Davis Cup win on clay against a guy who never does well on clay and is ranked below the top 10? It's all about the surface and the competition and has nothing to due with strength.

GOATPARERA
12-14-2009, 04:49 PM
It's definitely not strength, it's all about confidence. If he went for clean winners at the WTF (the way he did in the tiebreak set vs Davey at WTF) the way he did in the Davis Cup then he'd have done better. Clay encourages him to go for broke on his forehand more. So the key is for him to believe in himself enough to go for his forehand at the Australian Open. Fortunately he has good memories of Australia so he will look to duplicate the attacking tennis of yesteryear, just as he looked to duplicate the claycourt tennis of yesteryear when he played Davis Cup.....whereas the US summer events don't hold the same memories and he reverts into scared tennis at times...