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View Full Version : possible usta grievance, what will happen


blakesq
12-05-2009, 06:49 PM
HI All,

I had an unfortunate incident recently after a USTA match. This is what happened, during the match, someone's cell phone went off, we kept on playing, the match on the next court (with the oppossing captain), kept on playing too.

We lost the match on our court, and the other team won 2 of the 3 matches.
The matches on all three courts appeared friendly at all times.

AFter the match, we were inside the club, eating snacks, drinking beers and soda. After about 15 minutes or so, the opposing captain came up to me and said that my phone was ringing during the match. I told her no, i had put it on vibrate. She said she was sure it was ringing, because she was looking right at my bag. There were 4 tennis bags all in close proximity to each other on our side of the divider net. I told her again, she was wrong, because my phone was on vibrate, and that maybe someone on her team had the phone that was going off. She then said she wanted to look at my phone, and I told her no, she couldnt look at the phone. Then she called the captain of my team over to complain that I wouldn't let her see my phone. AT the point I said "F.U. Idiot", and walked off.

Supposedly she is going to file a grievance. Any idea on what will happen?

Casey10s
12-05-2009, 07:33 PM
Most likely, they will ban you from league play for 2 years. I seen it happen around here.

Seriously, nothing. The match was played in good faith and the captain was being a b ****. She can't prove it was yours that was ringing. If it was a problem, she should have brought it up at that point in time that the phone was ringing. All she will look like is a fool.

blakesq
12-05-2009, 07:43 PM
DANG CASEY! Your first line had me SCARED! :shock: Thanks for the input.


Most likely, they will ban you from league play for 2 years. I seen it happen around here.

Seriously, nothing. The match was played in good faith and the captain was being a b ****. She can't prove it was yours that was ringing. If it was a problem, she should have brought it up at that point in time that the phone was ringing. All she will look like is a fool.

Geezer Guy
12-05-2009, 08:03 PM
Why didn't you let the captain see your phone? Seems like that would have solved everything right there.

JavierLW
12-05-2009, 08:59 PM
Why didn't you let the captain see your phone? Seems like that would have solved everything right there.

Probably because she was being a b**** and it was really none of her business at that point. And it's rude of her to engage in this sort of whining after the match is over, and insist that the OP is lying....

Need I go on?

(that said though the OP losing his cool and swearing at her is probably not appropriate)

There really is nothing to solve, match is over.

When people act like this with me, I just walk away and if they want to provide their own little immature show, they can do it on their own!

Geezer Guy
12-05-2009, 09:49 PM
Yeah, but just denying it, then blowing up and storming away doesn't get anywhere. She stands there feeling "right".

To calmly say No, that wasn't my phone. You can call it right now - it's still on vibrate. Or, show her the call history to prove she was wrong.

If it's me and I know I'm right I'll go to great lenghts to prove I'm right. I wouldn't let her off the hook that easy.

blakesq
12-05-2009, 10:04 PM
you guys are right, I didn't handle it right. If i had it to do over again, I would have simply told her my phone was in vibrate, and walk away from her. but what do you think will probably happen if she files a grievance with the USTA?


Yeah, but just denying it, then blowing up and storming away doesn't get anywhere. She stands there feeling "right".

To calmly say No, that wasn't my phone. You can call it right now - it's still on vibrate. Or, show her the call history to prove she was wrong.

If it's me and I know I'm right I'll go to great lenghts to prove I'm right. I wouldn't let her off the hook that easy.

!<-_->!
12-05-2009, 11:03 PM
Just based on speculation as I'm not familiar at all with USTA regulations.. but I don't believe USTA has any jurisdiction over something that has taken place after matches. Yes, someone's phone went off during the matches, but this confrontation occurred afterward. Matches over should = responsibility of those involved and not USTA. However, this is just my interpretation of things.

chalkflewup
12-06-2009, 03:23 AM
Just based on speculation as I'm not familiar at all with USTA regulations.. but I don't believe USTA has any jurisdiction over something that has taken place after matches. Yes, someone's phone went off during the matches, but this confrontation occurred afterward. Matches over should = responsibility of those involved and not USTA. However, this is just my interpretation of things.

You can't change the past, however; you may want to take the high road and track her down and apologize if you feel that you didn't handle the situation properly. I believe USTA does have jurisdiction even though the match is over. If a grievance is filed, you will have an opportunity to respond. I would recommend that you purchase the Friend at Court book off the USTA website. I think it's $6 or $8 - well worth it in my opinion.

Good luck in making amends.

raiden031
12-06-2009, 04:16 AM
Yeah, but just denying it, then blowing up and storming away doesn't get anywhere. She stands there feeling "right".

To calmly say No, that wasn't my phone. You can call it right now - it's still on vibrate. Or, show her the call history to prove she was wrong.

If it's me and I know I'm right I'll go to great lenghts to prove I'm right. I wouldn't let her off the hook that easy.

Once the match is over, the captain has no business to whine about a ringing cell phone. Therefore the OP has every right to refuse to answer to her about it. If it was mid-match, then it would be more necessary for the OP to prove it wasn't their phone.

Lakers4Life
12-06-2009, 05:05 AM
To the OP: Unless you had a very annoying ringtone, that could be proof it was your phone. Even if had it on Vibrate, after the match you could have switched it back to normal. Had you still had it on Vibrate, you could have asked one of your team mates to call your cell to see if it was you. At the same point, you could have asked them to verify it was not their phone they heard. Had it been me I would have made them eat thier words.

Cindysphinx
12-06-2009, 07:21 AM
What?

The match was over. There was nothing to be gained by figuring out whose phone it was. As I understand it, the penalty for having your phone go off during a point is you play a let. If it happens again it is loss of point.

After the match, people are under no obligation to show their phone or prove their phone wasn't the culprit. There is *no way* I would show that pinhead my phone just because she asked.

Blake, too bad you didn't have this picture in your bag; you could have showed *that* to her instead:

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=60548&stc=1&d=1248698884

JLyon
12-06-2009, 08:16 AM
There is no grounds for grievance becuase the match was well over by your account at least 15 minutes. The only thing the captain can do is complain to the tennis facility, but USTA should have no jurisdiction in this matter since it did not occur on the court and the matches were played in good faith.

tennismom42
12-06-2009, 08:37 AM
There is no grounds for grievance becuase the match was well over by your account at least 15 minutes. The only thing the captain can do is complain to the tennis facility, but USTA should have no jurisdiction in this matter since it did not occur on the court and the matches were played in good faith.

agreed, if your participation in the tournament/leage was over (singles & doubles) then the USTA has no jurisdiction over you.

I've seen this rule in the Friend at Court rule book.

blakesq
12-06-2009, 09:23 AM
Tennismom, I looked for that rule in Friends of Court and cannot find it, can you give me the rule, thanks!


agreed, if your participation in the tournament/leage was over (singles & doubles) then the USTA has no jurisdiction over you.

I've seen this rule in the Friend at Court rule book.

raiden031
12-06-2009, 10:36 AM
Tennismom, I looked for that rule in Friends of Court and cannot find it, can you give me the rule, thanks!

Even though most would agree the opposing captain was in the wrong about the cell phone, you were also in the wrong by talking to her the way you did. I wouldn't be surprised if the facility banned you, even if USTA has no jurisdiction. I can't say it wouldn't be somewhat deserved.

amarone
12-06-2009, 03:56 PM
Grievance committee member here.

What is she going to raise a grievance about - the cell phone or saying F.U. idiot?

If the cell phone, then nothing will/should happen. The match was played in good faith and there is no evidence it was your cell phone. The most I could see happening is a statement that there is no evidence as to it being your cell phone but everyone is reminded that cell phones should be switched off (if that is in your rules - USTA Atlanta has such a statement in its rules).

If she raises a grievance because of the "F.U. idiot", then the most likely outcome from our grievance committee is that you would be warned that it is against the general rule requiring good sportsmanship and if you did it again, you may have some sort of penalty/sanction against you.

Cindysphinx
12-06-2009, 04:27 PM
If she raises a grievance because of the "F.U. idiot", then the most likely outcome from our grievance committee is that you would be warned that it is against the general rule requiring good sportsmanship and if you did it again, you may have some sort of penalty/sanction against you.

Just curious . . .

When does the jurisdiction of the grievance committe end?

What if OP had cursed at this lady later in the parking lot? The next day at Starbucks? A month later when both were spectators at Districts? A year later when both had box seats to the Australian Open?

Around here, my guess would be that cursing someone in the facility lounge would be something to be handled by the facility. If the facility had a posted rule about coarse language and a USTA member violates it, the facility can ask that the league ban that person from the premises. In that case, the league will do so but will continue to schedule the team's matches there and the person couldn't play in those matches.

Oldracquet27
12-06-2009, 04:32 PM
At the level most of us are playing, ( i am sure that probably happened in a league not higher than 3.5!), some complaints from players or captains are just soooo ridiculous. If that would have happened to me i had been very upset too with that lady. What are you talking about god woman? even after the match?

I think that at our level we should complaint about more obvious faults. A phone is something that does not disrupt my game unless it has a HUGE sound, which i don't think so if it was inside the bag. If some players just put the same input and energy in practicing than they put in stupid complaints they maybe could go out someday out of the 3.5 pool!.

amarone
12-06-2009, 05:26 PM
Just curious . . .

When does the jurisdiction of the grievance committe end?

What if OP had cursed at this lady later in the parking lot? The next day at Starbucks? A month later when both were spectators at Districts? A year later when both had box seats to the Australian Open?
There is nothing in the rules, and we (the grievance committee) have never discussed it, but my personal view is that it covers the period clearly associated with the match. So that would mean after arrival and before the match begins; during the match; after the match while still present at the location (including in the parking lot while leaving). And nothing later than that.

blakesq
12-06-2009, 06:02 PM
OP here. Thanks Amarone. This whole incident, my feeling bad after cussing at the women, and worrying, all could have been avoided, if i just walked away, or said "I am done talking about this".



Grievance committee member here.

What is she going to raise a grievance about - the cell phone or saying F.U. idiot?

If the cell phone, then nothing will/should happen. The match was played in good faith and there is no evidence it was your cell phone. The most I could see happening is a statement that there is no evidence as to it being your cell phone but everyone is reminded that cell phones should be switched off (if that is in your rules - USTA Atlanta has such a statement in its rules).

If she raises a grievance because of the "F.U. idiot", then the most likely outcome from our grievance committee is that you would be warned that it is against the general rule requiring good sportsmanship and if you did it again, you may have some sort of penalty/sanction against you.

jefferson
12-06-2009, 06:41 PM
She basically called you out in front of everyone, and then if that wasn't bad enough she called you a liar. If we lived in the wild west you would have shot her!

You could have just proved her wrong, but I understand it was the principle. You tried to handle the right way, but she would not let it go. Push push push. It is as much her fault, but since you over react, you become the bad guy. I would probably just apologize.

If it was you and another guy, we would not be having this discussion. Might be some bad blood but no silly threats of running to the USTA.

USTA should have nothing to say or do about this.

Lakers4Life
12-06-2009, 09:34 PM
Grievance committee member here.

If she raises a grievance because of the "F.U. idiot", then the most likely outcome from our grievance committee is that you would be warned that it is against the general rule requiring good sportsmanship and if you did it again, you may have some sort of penalty/sanction against you.

Shouldn't it go both ways? A grievance to both the Opposing Team Captain and the OP for bad sportsmanship? After all it was the Other Captain who provoked the confrontation in the first place. If anyone got in your face and accused you for something without proper provocation, everyone first reaction is to not back down, but push back.

Depending on who else heard the altercations, the OP could have said "Forget U, Idiot!", "Frak U, Idiot", Etc. Then it would be one person's against another. I think it's just a case of poor sportsmanship on the part of the Other Team Captain, and a normal reaction of the OP, though she could have been more Civil (smarter) about it.

amarone
12-07-2009, 04:03 AM
Shouldn't it go both ways? A grievance to both the Opposing Team Captain and the OP for bad sportsmanship? After all it was the Other Captain who provoked the confrontation in the first place. If anyone got in your face and accused you for something without proper provocation, everyone first reaction is to not back down, but push back.

Depending on who else heard the altercations, the OP could have said "Forget U, Idiot!", "Frak U, Idiot", Etc. Then it would be one person's against another. I think it's just a case of poor sportsmanship on the part of the Other Team Captain, and a normal reaction of the OP, though she could have been more Civil (smarter) about it.
The only thing the opposing captain seems to have done is say (incorrectly) that the OP's phone was ringing. I don't see that as being bad sportsmanship. However, if the OP thought there was bad sportsmanship, it would be up to him to raise a grievance. Actually, in both cases it would have to be the captain that raised the grievance, not the individual.

jefferson
12-07-2009, 06:46 AM
The only thing the opposing captain seems to have done is say (incorrectly) that the OP's phone was ringing. I don't see that as being bad sportsmanship. However, if the OP thought there was bad sportsmanship, it would be up to him to raise a grievance. Actually, in both cases it would have to be the captain that raised the grievance, not the individual.

She asked a question, did not like the answer, and then continued to pester the guy. I don't think that there was any bad sportsmanship on EITHER part. There was no sport being played at this point!

dr.freestyler
12-13-2009, 09:40 PM
i am gonna go out on a limb and say this is a almost always a women's tennis type of arguement. guys.....would have gone to blows mid conversation, and at the end....no grievences, just blood and atisfaction.

beernutz
12-14-2009, 12:32 AM
HI All,

I had an unfortunate incident recently after a USTA match. This is what happened, during the match, someone's cell phone went off, we kept on playing, the match on the next court (with the oppossing captain), kept on playing too.

We lost the match on our court, and the other team won 2 of the 3 matches.
The matches on all three courts appeared friendly at all times.

AFter the match, we were inside the club, eating snacks, drinking beers and soda. After about 15 minutes or so, the opposing captain came up to me and said that my phone was ringing during the match. I told her no, i had put it on vibrate. She said she was sure it was ringing, because she was looking right at my bag. There were 4 tennis bags all in close proximity to each other on our side of the divider net. I told her again, she was wrong, because my phone was on vibrate, and that maybe someone on her team had the phone that was going off. She then said she wanted to look at my phone, and I told her no, she couldnt look at the phone. Then she called the captain of my team over to complain that I wouldn't let her see my phone. AT the point I said "F.U. Idiot", and walked off.

Supposedly she is going to file a grievance. Any idea on what will happen?

I would have taken my phone out of my pocket and said, "Here, get a good look." Then put it back in my pocket. Seriously what is she, some kind of auditory forensics specialist?

Instead of F.U. though you might consider something like, "Take a hike, sister. It will be a cold day in hell before I let you put your sweaty, man-hands on my phone." I used to get mad at idiots like this, but now I just laugh at them. To their face.