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View Full Version : Is Alex Clayton a pusher?


Trickster
01-03-2010, 09:01 AM
Just watching this match against Bassam Beidas.

Looks like Clayton is seriously junking him...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6b5tndrWgWI


Maybe this is not how he normally play but still...

autumn_leaf
01-03-2010, 09:44 AM
i don't know how you get that Clayton is a pusher from that video. he's going from corner to corner when he has the chance to. i see him trying for down the line winners.

only shots i see that would be considered pushing when he was wrong footed, this is mostly to his backhand side which to me is obvious his weaker side.

also he might seem like a pusher to you because Beidas played a lot more aggressively in video shown.

ClarkC
01-03-2010, 11:07 AM
No, he does not look like a pusher. Of course, the word pusher is greatly misused on these boards by people who have no idea what it means, so I am not sure what you think it means.

psYcon
01-03-2010, 11:11 AM
do you even know what a pusher is? someone who just taps the ball (pushes it onto the opponent's court). Please get your terminology right before opening threads.

Larrysümmers
01-03-2010, 11:18 AM
I dont agree that he is a pusher. However, I would like someone to apply duct tape to Beidas' mouth :-p

DownTheLine
01-03-2010, 11:19 AM
Not even close. It was very windy that day and like Leaf said he was going from corner to corner. Look at his videos from Stanford vs UCLA.

DownTheLine
01-03-2010, 11:20 AM
Larry I would like to do the same I've watched that video 50 times and that always makes me mad.

NolemurraY
01-03-2010, 11:23 AM
Please tell me Clayton won this match, Beidas started to get on my nerves towards the end!!!

DownTheLine
01-03-2010, 11:28 AM
Please tell me Clayton won this match, Beidas started to get on my nerves towards the end!!!

He won 4-6 6-4 1-0

NolemurraY
01-03-2010, 11:32 AM
Thats good to hear :D I can sleep happily now. I mean saying cmon is ok on big points, but saying it after every point you win gets annoying, I hope Clayton did a massive CMONNN after winning the 2cnd set and then the match ;P

TennisNinja
01-03-2010, 11:47 AM
Even in college they don't play a full third set?

And no, he's not a pusher.

Larrysümmers
01-03-2010, 11:48 AM
The noise in general, yeah a little bit of sound ok. But these loud, and RUDE grunts really urinates me off. Its that reason why I watch WTA on mute.

Evry1hateslefties
01-03-2010, 11:55 AM
The noise in general, yeah a little bit of sound ok. But these loud, and RUDE grunts really urinates me off. Its that reason why I watch WTA on mute.

lol i do the same

Trickster
01-03-2010, 12:05 PM
I think really when we're talking in terms of professionals/college players a bit of relativity has to be applied. Yer of course he's not going to play like Joe Bloggs at the park playing wif-waf tennis.

What I'm trying to say is he's playing very defensive, which is the professional equivalent of pushing.

I'm talking like Michael Chang/Bjorn Borg/Muster - all could be described as pushers/defensive players

I really don't see Alex going for many shots here.

DownTheLine
01-03-2010, 12:13 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6MM5NK4e-A&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4DCMrC35mo&feature=related

If you call that a pusher I'll gladly be one.

woodrow1029
01-03-2010, 02:01 PM
I can't believe that Fedace hasn't gotten on this thread yet!

stanfordtennis alum
01-03-2010, 02:27 PM
he is no way shape or form a pusher.. he may be a counterpuncher but far from a pusher

stanfordtennis alum
01-03-2010, 02:28 PM
I can't believe that Fedace hasn't gotten on this thread yet!

i know!! fedace will be the happiest man alive when he sees this thread

Larrysümmers
01-03-2010, 02:39 PM
i know!! fedace will be the happiest man alive when he sees this thread

haha finally no hate for fedface, I thought I was the only one that enjoys his posts

Fedace
01-03-2010, 02:51 PM
he is no way shape or form a pusher.. he may be a counterpuncher but far from a pusher

You know he isn't a pusher nor is he a counterpuncher. You did say you hit with him right ? He is a aggressive baseliner with a big 1st serve. He plays like Lendl in someways. He sets up points with big forehands into either corner. and Alex gets in trouble when he plays guys that gets his serve back often and neutralizes his big forehand.

DownTheLine
01-03-2010, 03:03 PM
Speak of the devil. lol jk

If people figured out that they can just hit to his backhand they would win alot more points against him...

blaby
01-03-2010, 03:13 PM
how does fedace know so much about clayton?? :-P

DownTheLine
01-03-2010, 03:17 PM
how does fedace know so much about clayton?? :-P

His grandparents live in the city I live in. :)

His dad might even too.

Trickster
01-03-2010, 03:23 PM
In this video he seems to be playing a lot more aggresively

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4DCMrC35mo&feature=related

But only when he's trading blows on his forehand. His backhand gets very pushy if you skip to the middle of the video.

DownTheLine
01-03-2010, 03:32 PM
In this video he seems to be playing a lot more aggresively

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4DCMrC35mo&feature=related

But only when he's trading blows on his forehand. His backhand gets very pushy if you skip to the middle of the video.

The only ball I saw he was pushing on that whole video was the very last point Klahn served before the camera focused in on Alex and that shot was a mishit. All the serve returns I think your talking about he's not pushing. Klahns serve is going 110-120 m.p.h I would like to see you get a racquet on the ball.

autumn_leaf
01-03-2010, 03:48 PM
In this video he seems to be playing a lot more aggresively

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4DCMrC35mo&feature=related

But only when he's trading blows on his forehand. His backhand gets very pushy if you skip to the middle of the video.

are we watching the same video? his backhand was a lot better in this video than the one in the OP. landed them in the backcourt several times, went for the corners when he could and even got a cross court passing shot.

only times when his bh was weak was during serve returns and that's nothing to be ashamed of, you block serves back most of the time, a person needs to be extremely good at reading a serve if they want to really do anything with it.

Larrysümmers
01-03-2010, 04:02 PM
besides he can't be a pusher, because pushers dont excell past the 3.5 level :p

Trickster
01-03-2010, 04:29 PM
The only ball I saw he was pushing on that whole video was the very last point Klahn served before the camera focused in on Alex and that shot was a mishit. All the serve returns I think your talking about he's not pushing. Klahns serve is going 110-120 m.p.h I would like to see you get a racquet on the ball.

I regularly come up against guys serving at this pace - not really part of the discussion here though.

Have you not seen the loop on that backhand during the middle of that video. And I don't mean on the return of serve, we're talking during the point.

That is sheer grinding imho.

This is not a personal criticism on Alex, but his style is pretty defensive.

Trickster
01-03-2010, 04:33 PM
Watch that video against Kahn at 2.00 minutes onwards. Classic example


He takes that 2nd serve about 3 foot behind the baseline, and loops it back.

Then hits a 3/4 backhand straight down the middle.

The one that takes the biscuit is the penultimate backhand, which is looped about 10 feet above the net.

forthegame
01-03-2010, 04:40 PM
Man, that Beidas dude.... thinks he's a pro..

autumn_leaf
01-03-2010, 04:49 PM
The one that takes the biscuit is the penultimate backhand, which is looped about 10 feet above the net.

you mean the one that was taken about shoulder high?? that's just a hard ball to hit for most one handers.

he does seem defensive on the serve return, but i disagree with being defensive for his entire game. it just seems like he's more comfortable with a baseline game.

forthegame
01-03-2010, 04:51 PM
With such a vibrant collegiate system, why doesn't the US produce more successful ATP/WTA players?

DownTheLine
01-03-2010, 04:56 PM
Alex is not a defensive player. He won the USO junior doubles championship. You can't be that good of doubles player and be a defensive player.

Fedace
01-03-2010, 04:57 PM
With such a vibrant collegiate system, why doesn't the US produce more successful ATP/WTA players?

because if they were talented enough to be top 20 pro, then they would have turned pro at 18 years of age and skipped the college program all together...

West Coast Ace
01-03-2010, 05:59 PM
I dont agree that he is a pusher. However, I would like someone to apply duct tape to Beidas' mouth :-pPretty much sums up my thoughts.

I guess to the OP and others, if one isn't trying to rip the cover off the ball on every shot he's a pusher. You guys must have attention deficit disorder if you go for winners on every shot. Both guys had decent games and appeared to know how to come to net and put balls away. Mr White was on the defensive more - didn't have a huge serve and as others said was blocking his returns back - probably needs to work on that part of his game.

chrisplchs
01-03-2010, 07:13 PM
Very aggressive baseline who does not really try to set up points but rather hit winners left and right and is very good at doing so.

Clayton can hit winners at will

Tennisman912
01-03-2010, 07:55 PM
Give us a break. I find it pretty comical anyone would consider Alex a pusher, or at least anyone who knows anything about tennis at least (or plays). Anyone who regularly plays against those who serve in the 110-120 mph range (as you state) and returns them with the nonchalance you imply, is a player who would know better than to ever suggest this line of reasoning.

Translation. You have never seen a 110-120 mph serve in your life and are vastly overestimating you and your peer's tennis game. Because only someone will little tennis knowledge would suggest he is a pusher based on this video (or any other I have seen of him).

He hit the short ball back up the middle (with solid pace I might add) expecting the guy to guess one way or the other. A good play the majority of the time.

Sometimes this board is entertaining though. Good tennis all.

TM

forthegame
01-04-2010, 04:43 AM
because if they were talented enough to be top 20 pro, then they would have turned pro at 18 years of age and skipped the college program all together...

Ah! Thanks.

Trickster
01-04-2010, 09:18 AM
Give us a break. I find it pretty comical anyone would consider Alex a pusher, or at least anyone who knows anything about tennis at least (or plays). Anyone who regularly plays against those who serve in the 110-120 mph range (as you state) and returns them with the nonchalance you imply, is a player who would know better than to ever suggest this line of reasoning.

Translation. You have never seen a 110-120 mph serve in your life and are vastly overestimating you and your peer's tennis game. Because only someone will little tennis knowledge would suggest he is a pusher based on this video (or any other I have seen of him).

He hit the short ball back up the middle (with solid pace I might add) expecting the guy to guess one way or the other. A good play the majority of the time.

Sometimes this board is entertaining though. Good tennis all.

TM



I'm not talking about service return..I'm talking about in the middle of the point.

I play people who are good as Clayton on a regular basis, the league I play in is equivalent to Div 1, so I feel qualified to comment. I think people on here are looking at Clayton as if he's playing down at your local club. Of course he's not going to look like a pusher there

For the record, I think he's a good player. My observations weren't negative in anyway.

TourTenor
01-04-2010, 09:49 AM
C'mon Fedace, this is your man, remember, ATP top 50 and all that ... I'm disappointed, you just haven't been the same since you started self-medicating!:wink:

TonLars
01-04-2010, 09:55 AM
Alex is one of the most aggressive players ive ever played; its straight up unbelievable to me that someone could actually say he is a pusher, plays defensive or counter-punches. He just has a solid one-handed backhand but thats both far from uncommon for every level of player including the pros, as well as again a solid deep shot that he isnt ripping like his forehand but is hit deep and moves it around. He has got one of the biggest forehands around, and that includes some of the best pros. Does he need to kill every ball? That would just be nonsense. Is Federer a pusher? Theres not really a huge difference in the way players of this level hit the ball compared with top pros other than that they obviously do it better. Really when anyone plays Alex you have to get to his backhand or there will be nothing you can do and lose if he is playing decent. His forehand, and big serve, are so good that my entire game plan centered around relentlessly going to his backhand during rallies and serve targets and I still lost in a close 3 set match.

If he ever improves his consistency and a couple little other things he honestly has the potential to be a REALLY good player, like top 100 or better. He has got huge power on the forehand and serve.

Edit: Also just wanted to comment how the video of his match with Beidas, both players are playing very aggressive on the forehand and theres some big baseline play being made here.

DownTheLine
01-04-2010, 01:30 PM
I'm not talking about service return..I'm talking about in the middle of the point.

I play people who are good as Clayton on a regular basis, the league I play in is equivalent to Div 1, so I feel qualified to comment. I think people on here are looking at Clayton as if he's playing down at your local club. Of course he's not going to look like a pusher there

For the record, I think he's a good player. My observations weren't negative in anyway.

I have just gone from having some respect for your posts to none. You don't play people anywhere near to Claytons level. There's a HUGE difference in Stanfords #1 player and a normal D1 player. Through out the whole US Alex is probably in the top 20 if not higher.(Counting the pros) Your "D1 league" is probably full of 4.0-4.5s.

This is Tonlars(Posted in this thread) playing http://vimeo.com/3231428 4 months before him and Clayton played at that tournament he's talking about. Tony is an INSANELY AWESOME player and Clayton still beat him. I'm not taking anything away from Tony, but Alex is that good.

vandre
01-04-2010, 02:07 PM
Thats good to hear :D I can sleep happily now. I mean saying cmon is ok on big points, but saying it after every point you win gets annoying, I hope Clayton did a massive CMONNN after winning the 2cnd set and then the match ;P

yup, the other dude definately had ana ivanovic syndrome!

to comment on the original question, i wonder if clayton altered his game because of the wind. i could here it blowing through the camera mic from time to time and thought there might have been enough wind for clayton to go for more spin.

Brock
01-04-2010, 02:26 PM
Just watching this match against Bassam Beidas.

Looks like Clayton is seriously junking him...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6b5tndrWgWI


Maybe this is not how he normally play but still...


Not at all...

I think that people are misusing the term "pusher". A "Pusher" is someone who constantly hits moonballs and slices, and drop shots- THEIR GOAL IS TO WIN THE POINT ONLY BY MAKING THEM HIT STUPID ERRORS AND FRUSTRATE THE PLAYER.


Now, in this video, Clayton isn't really going all out- but at the same time he isn't "pushing"- this is a strategy which I think of as "grinding"- it's not pushing, not at all, but Clayton is just staying in the rally and making his opponent hit the tough shots- he isn't lobbing the ball, just hitting ball for ball with the guy, conserving his energy while staying in the point. IMO Clayton although he lost the first set, wasn't too worried or intimitated by the guy (I mean, with all the "come-on"s, who would be?) and he realized he could win without "hitting out" on the ball.

Trickster
01-04-2010, 03:15 PM
So if I modify my statement to say that he's *grinding* quite a lot of points out? Would that be a more appropriate statement>?

Trickster
01-04-2010, 03:25 PM
Edited....

DownTheLine
01-04-2010, 03:28 PM
I can name various different players who I have played against - some are ranked 700-1500 in the world. Where is Clayton in the world now?

I'm not saying I'd get anywhere near Clayton ( of course that's ridiculous) but I have faced such opponents, obviously not winning, but equally not getting trounced.

I'm sure you get my jist..I'll get a video up sometime.
Highest rank was 798. Somewhere in the high 700's.

Trickster
01-04-2010, 03:34 PM
Just to clarify he looks an unbelievably talented guy...Just that video against Beidas - he isn't exactly taking control.

Who do you play for TonyLars??

bad_call
01-04-2010, 03:40 PM
Alex is one of the most aggressive players ive ever played; its straight up unbelievable to me that someone could actually say he is a pusher, plays defensive or counter-punches. He just has a solid one-handed backhand but thats both far from uncommon for every level of player including the pros, as well as again a solid deep shot that he isnt ripping like his forehand but is hit deep and moves it around. He has got one of the biggest forehands around, and that includes some of the best pros. Does he need to kill every ball? That would just be nonsense. Is Federer a pusher? Theres not really a huge difference in the way players of this level hit the ball compared with top pros other than that they obviously do it better. Really when anyone plays Alex you have to get to his backhand or there will be nothing you can do and lose if he is playing decent. His forehand, and big serve, are so good that my entire game plan centered around relentlessly going to his backhand during rallies and serve targets and I still lost in a close 3 set match.

If he ever improves his consistency and a couple little other things he honestly has the potential to be a REALLY good player, like top 100 or better. He has got huge power on the forehand and serve.

Edit: Also just wanted to comment how the video of his match with Beidas, both players are playing very aggressive on the forehand and theres some big baseline play being made here.

you tell them Tony...they are clueless.

Tennisman912
01-04-2010, 06:12 PM
Trickster,

I am not talking about the service return either. But that should have been obvious based on my language. Grinding, yeah right. They are both hitting the ball hard and consistently. They are FORCED off balance by a good shot, not grinding and trying to keep it in play like you and your buddies. LOL. Go video yourself and your friends (who play tennis, not watch tennis videos). I hope you notice a bit of a difference but alas, based on this thread, it is a lost cause. I usually try not to be too offensive but on occasion, stupid is, as stupid does warrants it. Please stop speaking about things you know absolutely nothing about. Thankfully, the ignore function still works quite well when reason doesn't.

You tell him Tony. I would love to see some vid of your match with him. You are quite the baller.

Good tennis all

TM

Fedace
01-04-2010, 06:16 PM
Alex is one of the most aggressive players ive ever played; its straight up unbelievable to me that someone could actually say he is a pusher, plays defensive or counter-punches. He just has a solid one-handed backhand but thats both far from uncommon for every level of player including the pros, as well as again a solid deep shot that he isnt ripping like his forehand but is hit deep and moves it around. He has got one of the biggest forehands around, and that includes some of the best pros. Does he need to kill every ball? That would just be nonsense. Is Federer a pusher? Theres not really a huge difference in the way players of this level hit the ball compared with top pros other than that they obviously do it better. Really when anyone plays Alex you have to get to his backhand or there will be nothing you can do and lose if he is playing decent. His forehand, and big serve, are so good that my entire game plan centered around relentlessly going to his backhand during rallies and serve targets and I still lost in a close 3 set match.

If he ever improves his consistency and a couple little other things he honestly has the potential to be a REALLY good player, like top 100 or better. He has got huge power on the forehand and serve.

Edit: Also just wanted to comment how the video of his match with Beidas, both players are playing very aggressive on the forehand and theres some big baseline play being made here.

Like i said, similar Playing style to Ivan Lendl, nothing more needs to be said. but Tony if you thought he was so good, how did you take him to 3 sets? and very close 3 sets at that... No offense to your playing abilities, of course. You are a fine player, yourself......

DownTheLine
01-04-2010, 06:45 PM
Fedace has someone ever called you a tool? Lol

Fedace
01-04-2010, 06:47 PM
Fedace has someone ever called you a tool? Lol

Alex Clayton is top 5 division 1 player and has competed in Junior Grand slams. ok, toni is a good player and all but does he have similar reseme ?

DownTheLine
01-04-2010, 06:55 PM
Alex Clayton is top 5 division 1 player and has competed in Junior Grand slams. ok, toni is a good player and all but does he have similar reseme ?

I'm on your side here fedace. Tony aren't you a teaching pro somewhere in the cities? Or is it lakeville?

Panic492
01-04-2010, 07:33 PM
I'm not sure who is who. But the gut in blue is an obnoxious brat. "Come on" after every point? Please.

DownTheLine
01-04-2010, 07:58 PM
Clayton is the the other guy.

TonLars
01-04-2010, 08:43 PM
Like i said, similar Playing style to Ivan Lendl, nothing more needs to be said. but Tony if you thought he was so good, how did you take him to 3 sets? and very close 3 sets at that... No offense to your playing abilities, of course. You are a fine player, yourself......

Alex Clayton is top 5 division 1 player and has competed in Junior Grand slams. ok, toni is a good player and all but does he have similar reseme ?

I'm on your side here fedace. Tony aren't you a teaching pro somewhere in the cities? Or is it lakeville?

Hate to give you a sob story, but the reason I dont have a resume' like Alex Clayton is because im a "late bloomer". I was still top 5 in the section for juniors at times, but I grew up in a farm town with nobody above a 4.5 within an hour, and no indoor courts within an hour, and Minnesota has snow on the ground half the year. I didnt have good coaching or training, started playing at 11, and simply played lots of tournaments and was able to improve with some natural ability and athleticism. Would you like to know what kind of training Alex had growing up?

Im not sure exactly what youre trying to insinuate, but clearly as you can see from the score of our match, and if you look at results from other tournaments I have played, Im pretty close with Alex although I concede he is definitely a better player than me. What a resume' shows on paper is not a full explanation of a player's ability in the present. Why would anyone even bother playing Federer otherwise?

So to answer your questions, the match was close because we were fairly even; I was up a break in the third set and in fact let it slip away. I teach tennis, but am still training very hard, which is why I have and hopefully will continue to improve each year. If I had the money, I would play the pro futures tournaments and give it a go, but since I do not, I play alot of open tournaments that have a nice cash purse.

HunterST
01-04-2010, 09:00 PM
Alex is one of the most aggressive players ive ever played; its straight up unbelievable to me that someone could actually say he is a pusher, plays defensive or counter-punches. He just has a solid one-handed backhand but thats both far from uncommon for every level of player including the pros, as well as again a solid deep shot that he isnt ripping like his forehand but is hit deep and moves it around. He has got one of the biggest forehands around, and that includes some of the best pros. Does he need to kill every ball? That would just be nonsense. Is Federer a pusher? Theres not really a huge difference in the way players of this level hit the ball compared with top pros other than that they obviously do it better. Really when anyone plays Alex you have to get to his backhand or there will be nothing you can do and lose if he is playing decent. His forehand, and big serve, are so good that my entire game plan centered around relentlessly going to his backhand during rallies and serve targets and I still lost in a close 3 set match.

If he ever improves his consistency and a couple little other things he honestly has the potential to be a REALLY good player, like top 100 or better. He has got huge power on the forehand and serve.

Edit: Also just wanted to comment how the video of his match with Beidas, both players are playing very aggressive on the forehand and theres some big baseline play being made here.


Are you a college player too or did you play him somewhere else?

SlapShot
01-04-2010, 09:04 PM
Tony - let's get working on that serve of yours, and you'll get Clayton for sure. You got any free time in the next few weeks to hammer some balls around?

DownTheLine
01-05-2010, 01:30 PM
Hate to give you a sob story, but the reason I dont have a resume' like Alex Clayton is because im a "late bloomer". I was still top 5 in the section for juniors at times, but I grew up in a farm town with nobody above a 4.5 within an hour, and no indoor courts within an hour, and Minnesota has snow on the ground half the year. I didnt have good coaching or training, started playing at 11, and simply played lots of tournaments and was able to improve with some natural ability and athleticism. Would you like to know what kind of training Alex had growing up?

Im not sure exactly what youre trying to insinuate, but clearly as you can see from the score of our match, and if you look at results from other tournaments I have played, Im pretty close with Alex although I concede he is definitely a better player than me. What a resume' shows on paper is not a full explanation of a player's ability in the present. Why would anyone even bother playing Federer otherwise?

So to answer your questions, the match was close because we were fairly even; I was up a break in the third set and in fact let it slip away. I teach tennis, but am still training very hard, which is why I have and hopefully will continue to improve each year. If I had the money, I would play the pro futures tournaments and give it a go, but since I do not, I play alot of open tournaments that have a nice cash purse.

Tony for someone that would want to be a teaching pro and play adult tournaments for extra money. Would you recommend it? Do you live comfortely?

Joeyg
01-05-2010, 03:06 PM
Let's leave Tony's love life out of this, ok?

DownTheLine
01-05-2010, 05:42 PM
Let's leave Tony's love life out of this, ok?

Hahahaha my bad. My iPod most have whiched live to love. EDITED!

matchmaker
01-05-2010, 06:19 PM
This guy is defo not a pusher!

TonLars
01-05-2010, 08:17 PM
Tony for someone that would want to be a teaching pro and play adult tournaments for extra money. Would you recommend it? Do you live comfortely?

Its a great job if you love the game. For the most part I like to try to help other people play the game; it can always be a little frustrating when you have people who dont listen, dont give effort, are rude or simply dont have any athletic ability but when all thats not in the equation it can be really fun. Sometimes I do some playing and hitting which for me is fun even though im not trying to play well but just hit nice and right to the player and give them lots of hits. Just being around the game is great for me, and when im not teaching im working out, hitting, or playing matches. Its hard to beat doing what you enjoy for a living, and theres alot worse things I could be doing even if I didnt enjoy it all that much. Alot of tennis teachers can make a pretty good living, it all depends on the situation and how much you want to be on court teaching. At this point in my life at 25 years old and eager to train, I work quite a bit of hours but I also try to play alot of tennis and workout every day so there are times when I could fill my teaching schedule up more but I dont. Im easy to please so even though I dont make a lot of money, I pay the bills, have what I need and have a little extra to save and thats all I need!

Its not for everyone though for sure, most of the time you wont make alot of money, its fairly physical being on court standing and feeding alot even if youre not like me running around and hitting some and doing your own training on the side, I quite often go hungry for a while and dont eat dinner until 9 or 10 at night because of no breaks, it takes patience to deal with the less than ideal students, it takes energy and on your feet thinking to communicate and lead well, observe and critique and think of what needs to be done.

Anyways enough about me, this thread hopefully has decidedly put to rest the notion that Alex Clayton isnt an aggressive baseline player with a big serve, and one of the top few college players. When he is done with college Im sure he will play alot of the pro tournaments and at minimum will get inside the top 300-400

darthpwner
01-05-2010, 08:54 PM
Dude there is no way Alex Clayton is a pusher. I saw him play live at UCLA and he ripped the felt off the ball. His serve and forehand especially are huge. I thought he had an excellent backhand in addition. I also like his service motion, how he takes that step with the left foot and starts rocking forward, back, then BOOM. Alex uses a full western on his forehand and an eastern backhand grip on his backhand so he doesnt have to change grip, just use the other face of the racket. I think you can tell when he returns serve. His grip is prepared for a backhand.

VamosRafa10
01-06-2010, 04:10 AM
He is far from a pusher. And I wish Beidas would stop roaring after every shot.

goldfish81
01-06-2010, 02:13 PM
there is no way clayton is a pusher, he has one of the biggest forehands in college.

goldfish81
01-06-2010, 02:15 PM
if you think clayton is a pusher, you are mistaken

pac10s.com

HunterST
01-06-2010, 03:34 PM
Tony for someone that would want to be a teaching pro and play adult tournaments for extra money. Would you recommend it? Do you live comfortely?



Wait, what kind of adult tournaments pay money???

DownTheLine
01-06-2010, 04:32 PM
Wait, what kind of adult tournaments pay money???
It's more of a choice from the tournament director. Alot do around here and were in the Northern section.

CollegeBound
01-06-2010, 05:20 PM
Ithis thread hopefully has decidedly put to rest the notion that Alex Clayton isnt an aggressive baseline player with a big serve, and one of the top few college players.

Mate, it was one question by one person, hardly a notion to be put to rest.

Now, if the OP had asked whether Alex's tennis had gone backwards since he started at college or if he wasn't a particularly smart player, that'd be worth debating. I'd also say that being ranked 37, as Alex is by the ITA, doesn't make you one of the top few college players.

Fedace
01-06-2010, 05:22 PM
Alex is one of the top 5 players....forget the ranking...

TonLars
01-06-2010, 05:58 PM
Mate, it was one question by one person, hardly a notion to be put to rest.

Now, if the OP had asked whether Alex's tennis had gone backwards since he started at college or if he wasn't a particularly smart player, that'd be worth debating. I'd also say that being ranked 37, as Alex is by the ITA, doesn't make you one of the top few college players.

A question that has, quite clearly, been put to rest, given all the opinions of people watching video of him playing, as well as experience of people watching him play live, or in my case I played against him. The notion is far from accurate.

Alex has been in the semi-finals of the year end national tournament two years in a row now. This is why most would say he is one of the top 5. He had a streaky and underachieving season last year which gives him his current ranking. He has a huge game and can be on and off, and if he is on is probably the #1 or 2 player in the country.

Fedace
01-06-2010, 06:03 PM
A question that has, quite clearly, been put to rest, given all the opinions of people watching video of him playing, as well as experience of people watching him play live, or in my case I played against him. The notion is far from accurate.

Alex has been in the semi-finals of the year end national tournament two years in a row now. This is why most would say he is one of the top 5. He had a streaky and underachieving season last year which gives him his current ranking. He has a huge game and can be on and off, and if he is on is probably the #1 or 2 player in the country.

I agree wholeheartedly. Alex just needs to develop patience and staying mentally tough when his opponents make him uncomfortable. Alex tend to get frustrated when his 1st serves comes back on regular basis. and you can't always knock guys down with the huge forehand. He needs to learn that sometimes you need to hit 2-3 big forehands to set up the point for the kill...

SourStraws
01-06-2010, 06:04 PM
Bottom line is...A pusher cannot be the number one player for Stanford so no he is not a pusher.

S.S.

strahan918
01-06-2010, 06:29 PM
I agree wholeheartedly. Alex just needs to develop patience and staying mentally tough when his opponents make him uncomfortable. Alex tend to get frustrated when his 1st serves comes back on regular basis. and you can't always knock guys down with the huge forehand. He needs to learn that sometimes you need to hit 2-3 big forehands to set up the point for the kill...

that's gotta be the first post i've seen where Fedace may just have questioned Clayton..

andfor
01-06-2010, 07:28 PM
Alex is one of the top 5 players....forget the ranking...

Did you forget something? Alex is one of the top 5 players IN THE WORLD....forget the ranking

TourTenor
01-07-2010, 01:36 PM
I agree wholeheartedly. Alex just needs to develop patience and staying mentally tough when his opponents make him uncomfortable. Alex tend to get frustrated when his 1st serves comes back on regular basis. and you can't always knock guys down with the huge forehand. He needs to learn that sometimes you need to hit 2-3 big forehands to set up the point for the kill...
Stanford is advertising for a coach, and Fedster, I think you are the man (boy?)! Since you know 'Coach Whit' ... the job should be yours.:wink:

DownTheLine
01-07-2010, 02:48 PM
Stanford is advertising for a coach, and Fedster, I think you are the man (boy?)! Since you know 'Coach Whit' ... the job should be yours.:wink:

The team would boycott.
Jk

goldfish81
01-08-2010, 10:36 AM
A question that has, quite clearly, been put to rest, given all the opinions of people watching video of him playing, as well as experience of people watching him play live, or in my case I played against him. The notion is far from accurate.

Alex has been in the semi-finals of the year end national tournament two years in a row now. This is why most would say he is one of the top 5. He had a streaky and underachieving season last year which gives him his current ranking. He has a huge game and can be on and off, and if he is on is probably the #1 or 2 player in the country.

tonlars did you really think he was trying his hardest?

pac10s.com

goldfish81
01-08-2010, 10:37 AM
Bottom line is...A pusher cannot be the number one player for Stanford so no he is not a pusher.

S.S.

how true!

pac10s.com

DownTheLine
01-08-2010, 12:11 PM
tonlars did you really think he was trying his hardest?

pac10s.com

They were playing for $800. The only thing is, is that Alex can't except that money. He can put it to his plane ticket and other expenses for the trip but that takes a very long time to get looked at.

TonLars
01-08-2010, 01:25 PM
tonlars did you really think he was trying his hardest?

pac10s.com

Do you really think he wasnt? Do you think he is God?

Ive played several players just as good or better and either won or had a close match. And as was stated earlier, we were playing for like $800, which he accepted in full. Most importantly... why wouldnt he try? Lol! Id be hard pressed to find even one player who has ever "not tried his best" in a tournament match, unless the player was tanking to lose and save face.

Joeyg
01-08-2010, 02:04 PM
I put Goldfish81 right up there with the doctor as to the IQ factor. A few points less and they would be under a bell jar.

SlapShot
01-08-2010, 05:00 PM
The thing that sticks out to me in that video is how many first serves were missed. Hmm....

And what's with the screaming c'mon after every point? I saw that when I watched the Gophers play Michigan this year - it's as though they are all saying "look at me" after every point. Parental attention issues, maybe? ;)

diamondgeezer
01-08-2010, 05:38 PM
I don't understand why everyone is getting at Beidas. I think it should be commended when someone is playing with their heart on their sleeve. He's playing a high ranked player, and he's showing some fight and taking it to Clayton.

What's wrong with that?

Trickster
01-08-2010, 05:55 PM
The thing that sticks out to me in that video is how many first serves were missed. Hmm....

And what's with the screaming c'mon after every point? I saw that when I watched the Gophers play Michigan this year - it's as though they are all saying "look at me" after every point. Parental attention issues, maybe? ;)

It's something learnt in juniors that sticks.


Put it this way I'd rather see someone like Beidas getting fired up, than someone who shows little heart and desire like Lendal when he was in tanking mode.

ttbrowne
01-08-2010, 08:18 PM
You can still be #1 at Stanford and be a pusher.

Hey, Gilbert got to the Top 10 with all his pushing.

You only have to be a little better than the guy on the other side of the net, you don't have to blow people off the court. Nadal is one of the biggest pushers around. He doesn't always play a passive game but he pushes almost every match.

BounceHitBounceHit
01-08-2010, 08:27 PM
tonlars did you really think he was trying his hardest?

pac10s.com

Having hit with Tony this spring and plenty of top DI players over the years I can tell you with certainty that if Alex was not 'trying' he would not be able to defeat Tony. :) BHBH

BounceHitBounceHit
01-08-2010, 08:30 PM
Oh, and for Heaven's sakes, Alex Clayton is NOT a "pusher". "Pushing" (in the traditional sense) does not exist at these stratospheric levels of the game. There ARE 'counterpunchers' who play a more defensive, 'grinding' style, but the 'just get it back deep and without pace' mentality simply isn't effective at the 5.5 and above levels. :) BHBH

SlapShot
01-08-2010, 09:23 PM
You can still be #1 at Stanford and be a pusher.

Hey, Gilbert got to the Top 10 with all his pushing.

You only have to be a little better than the guy on the other side of the net, you don't have to blow people off the court. Nadal is one of the biggest pushers around. He doesn't always play a passive game but he pushes almost every match.

Nadal is anything but a pusher. I guarantee that if you were on the other side of the net from him, you'd feel like you were being bombarded. He's certainly a grinder, but he's anything but a pusher.

Fedace
01-08-2010, 09:55 PM
Alex Clayton hits his forehand as hard as Federer,,,so how do you feel about it now ???

DownTheLine
01-08-2010, 10:58 PM
Fedace you can be funny sometimes.

CollegeBound
01-09-2010, 01:51 AM
A question that has, quite clearly, been put to rest, given all the opinions of people watching video of him playing, as well as experience of people watching him play live, or in my case I played against him. The notion is far from accurate.

Mate, the OP just wanted to get a reaction out of anyone silly enough to bite.

Alex has been in the semi-finals of the year end national tournament two years in a row now. This is why most would say he is one of the top 5. He had a streaky and underachieving season last year which gives him his current ranking. He has a huge game and can be on and off, and if he is on is probably the #1 or 2 player in the country.

I don't agree with that at all. Alex's problem is that he needs to be 'on' to win matches at that top level. You're apparently playing at a high level so you should know that winning when you're not in the zone or 'on' is what makes you a genuinely good player. Based on your criteria Monfils would be "probably the #1 or 2 player" in the world. What I see from Alex is a guy who misses far too many first serves, doesn't seem to have any plan apart from hitting hard and whose game seems to have regressed since the juniors. I think the lack of brain is borne out in his doubles results where he can't just hit through an opponent and where you're punished for missing the first serve.

Datacipher
01-09-2010, 03:52 AM
I don't understand why everyone is getting at Beidas. I think it should be commended when someone is playing with their heart on their sleeve. He's playing a high ranked player, and he's showing some fight and taking it to Clayton.

What's wrong with that?

Playing with your "heart" on your sleeve and showing fight, is NOT NOT NOT related to screaming like a little girl with a histrionic disorder. Fortunately, the vast majority of great tennis players...in fact, the vast majority of pro tennis players throught all history have known that. They realized that playing with heart and determination is cool, shrieking like Monica Seles AFTER you've won the point, is simply ********.

TonLars
01-09-2010, 06:11 AM
I don't agree with that at all. Alex's problem is that he needs to be 'on' to win matches at that top level. You're apparently playing at a high level so you should know that winning when you're not in the zone or 'on' is what makes you a genuinely good player. Based on your criteria Monfils would be "probably the #1 or 2 player" in the world. What I see from Alex is a guy who misses far too many first serves, doesn't seem to have any plan apart from hitting hard and whose game seems to have regressed since the juniors. I think the lack of brain is borne out in his doubles results where he can't just hit through an opponent and where you're punished for missing the first serve.

I agree with what youre saying to an extent. At a high level though you pretty much need to be on to win most of the time. Its not like he still cant win ugly when he is off either. But he has a big game like you said and that makes him very dangerous, and so when he is playing well, similar to a Monfils, he can take out anybody. Even a top ranked consistent player without those kind of big weapons would fear going against a very streaky player with big weapons that isnt even as good as Alex because if theyre on it could be tough. Alex's year-end results still show that he is one of the top few players when he is playing well. But like you said, he has some things to improve to become better, and to perform consistently against good players.

Having hit with Tony this spring and plenty of top DI players over the years I can tell you with certainty that if Alex was not 'trying' he would not be able to defeat Tony. :) BHBH

Looking forward to when you come out here again BHBH, let me know and we can hit!

goldfish81
01-09-2010, 09:09 AM
i mean clayton wins off competitiveness if you really watch him. he fights harder than the other guy. if he is not in the right frame of mind hes not going to play well. and no theres no way he was trying his hardest against tony larson....i would like to see clayton really try against him... i think it wouldnt be too close

pac10s.com

psYcon
01-09-2010, 11:27 AM
i mean clayton wins off competitiveness if you really watch him. he fights harder than the other guy. if he is not in the right frame of mind hes not going to play well. and no theres no way he was trying his hardest against tony larson....i would like to see clayton really try against him... i think it wouldnt be too close

pac10s.com

did you see them play each other? How do you know he wasn't trying his hardest. :confused:

BounceHitBounceHit
01-09-2010, 01:22 PM
i mean clayton wins off competitiveness if you really watch him. he fights harder than the other guy. if he is not in the right frame of mind hes not going to play well. and no theres no way he was trying his hardest against tony larson....i would like to see clayton really try against him... i think it wouldnt be too close

pac10s.com

I think it would be fun to watch you play TonLars first. :) BHBH

BounceHitBounceHit
01-09-2010, 01:23 PM
I agree with what youre saying to an extent. At a high level though you pretty much need to be on to win most of the time. Its not like he still cant win ugly when he is off either. But he has a big game like you said and that makes him very dangerous, and so when he is playing well, similar to a Monfils, he can take out anybody. Even a top ranked consistent player without those kind of big weapons would fear going against a very streaky player with big weapons that isnt even as good as Alex because if theyre on it could be tough. Alex's year-end results still show that he is one of the top few players when he is playing well. But like you said, he has some things to improve to become better, and to perform consistently against good players.



Looking forward to when you come out here again BHBH, let me know and we can hit!

Absolutely TonLars! Be well, BHBH

TonLars
01-09-2010, 01:59 PM
i mean clayton wins off competitiveness if you really watch him. he fights harder than the other guy. if he is not in the right frame of mind hes not going to play well. and no theres no way he was trying his hardest against tony larson....i would like to see clayton really try against him... i think it wouldnt be too close

pac10s.com

Oh dang. Youve probably seen me play before then right? Because you seem to have some sort of idea who I am, what I play like, or what my results are. Ive been caught in a lie. Im actually not any good at all, Alex felt pity for me in the final. He certainly would have beaten me 6-0 6-0 but wanted to have some rallies with me so he took it down to about 25% pace. As you can see also in this video against Beidas in the OP, Alex wasnt trying there either. He wasnt yelling or intense or into it at all, and would have beaten Beidas 6-0 6-0 had he been in the right mood. Theres no way he was trying his hardest there either evidently. He deserves some kind of humanitarian award or a Pulitzer prize for doing what he did with me in a tournament final with almost a grand on the line, fiddling around to get behind a break in the third set before "trying" at the end to win, when he could have just put some effort into it and won in 20 minutes. Considering that fact now, he sure has some balls to let the act go that far before flipping the switch! He probably could have let me get up 6-0 5-0 40-0 and still won but that would be too obvious and he might look like a "show off". What was I thinking, I was lying to myself to think someone like me could compete with him.

CollegeBound
01-09-2010, 05:36 PM
I agree with what youre saying to an extent. At a high level though you pretty much need to be on to win most of the time.

At a high level (not including juniors), you need to be in control of your game but you don't need to be zoning to win or to be so 'on' that you're hitting winners off everything. A good professional leaves himself room to lift his game if necessary. A fragile player starts out at full capacity and hopes he can hold it for the entire match. That, to me, is the way Alex plays. Just not enough margin (not talking about his shots) for error.

TonLars
01-09-2010, 05:53 PM
At a high level (not including juniors), you need to be in control of your game but you don't need to be zoning to win or to be so 'on' that you're hitting winners off everything. A good professional leaves himself room to lift his game if necessary. A fragile player starts out at full capacity and hopes he can hold it for the entire match. That, to me, is the way Alex plays. Just not enough margin (not talking about his shots) for error.

Totally agree with you that Alex needs to improve his patience and consistency. But he is a very dangerous player. If he is playing well he will beat anybody, and only a handful of college players can say that. If he is a little off, he will make errors and have some streaky results at this point in time, yet still it takes a top player to beat him. He has the kind of tools and weapons that he can take to the tour level if he does improve those things. He has probably the biggest serve and forehand weapon combination in college tennis. Hopefully he can improve his margin for error on a consistent basis, like you said, and we'll see what he can do.

ClarkC
01-09-2010, 06:24 PM
and no theres no way he was trying his hardest against tony larson....i would like to see clayton really try against him... i think it wouldnt be too close

pac10s.com

In order to make a statement like that without being a complete idiot, you need to be very familiar with both players. How exactly did you get so familiar with Tony Larson's game? Have you watched him from courtside so that you can see the actual pace? Have you seen him play other players that you know really well?

Fedace
01-09-2010, 06:36 PM
Alex does have some consistancy issues. When he is on, he can flat out blow you away even at the top NCAA division 1 level but when he is off, he will let guys back into the match and give them hope...

HunterST
01-09-2010, 07:36 PM
Tonlars, why don't you play some futures tournaments? If you can hang with Alex Clayton I would imagine you'd do fairly well in futures. I know you don't have the money to play them full time but you could probably get an ATP rank which would be pretty cool.

bieker
01-09-2010, 08:20 PM
First of all a pusher is someone who pushes the ball. He was clearly swinging with form. And, to me, it sounds like you are imposing that being a pusher is bad. Everyone is entitled to their own style of play. And if you can't beat someone who doesn't impose any offensive threat, then I don't know what to say to you.

goldfish81
01-09-2010, 09:11 PM
In order to make a statement like that without being a complete idiot, you need to be very familiar with both players. How exactly did you get so familiar with Tony Larson's game? Have you watched him from courtside so that you can see the actual pace? Have you seen him play other players that you know really well?

i played on the team with alex clayton for 2 years at stanford...im not saying anything against tonlars but knowing clayton it just must seem that for him to go that close with him is just a bit strange. if tonlars had other results that proved himself to be a player of that caliber i would say it would not be as shocking...

goldfish81
01-09-2010, 09:12 PM
In order to make a statement like that without being a complete idiot, you need to be very familiar with both players. How exactly did you get so familiar with Tony Larson's game? Have you watched him from courtside so that you can see the actual pace? Have you seen him play other players that you know really well?


i played on the team with alex clayton for 2 years at stanford...im not saying anything against tonlars but knowing clayton it just must seem that for him to go that close with him is just a bit strange. if tonlars had other results that proved himself to be a player of that caliber i would say it would not be as shocking...

pac10s.com

Joeyg
01-10-2010, 06:47 AM
Then, Goldfish, you must also be close, personal friends with Fedace.

Personally, I think you are both full of it.

DownTheLine
01-10-2010, 06:50 AM
i played on the team with alex clayton for 2 years at stanford...im not saying anything against tonlars but knowing clayton it just must seem that for him to go that close with him is just a bit strange. if tonlars had other results that proved himself to be a player of that caliber i would say it would not be as shocking...

pac10s.com

I'm also in the top 10 for the ATP rankings.

Fedace
01-10-2010, 07:38 AM
Totally agree with you that Alex needs to improve his patience and consistency. But he is a very dangerous player. If he is playing well he will beat anybody, and only a handful of college players can say that. If he is a little off, he will make errors and have some streaky results at this point in time, yet still it takes a top player to beat him. He has the kind of tools and weapons that he can take to the tour level if he does improve those things. He has probably the biggest serve and forehand weapon combination in college tennis. Hopefully he can improve his margin for error on a consistent basis, like you said, and we'll see what he can do.

Not sure if you were able to get his serve back, but it seems to me that if you can get his 1st serve back consistantly, he starts to lose his patience much more quickly. and Alex does play a High risk game, he gets away with it just cause he is so talented but he is dangerously getting close to James Blake territory....:)

Fedace
01-10-2010, 07:40 AM
I'm also in the top 10 for the ATP rankings.

Is that you,, Andy ??:):)

Cesc Fabregas
01-10-2010, 08:02 AM
Alex does have some consistancy issues. When he is on, he can flat out blow you away even at the top NCAA division 1 level but when he is off, he will let guys back into the match and give them hope...

Why hasn't Clayton made it in the pros yet? You said he would be a top 50 atp player. :-?

andfor
01-10-2010, 09:29 AM
i played on the team with alex clayton for 2 years at stanford...im not saying anything against tonlars but knowing clayton it just must seem that for him to go that close with him is just a bit strange. if tonlars had other results that proved himself to be a player of that caliber i would say it would not be as shocking...

Is that you Bruch?

DownTheLine
01-10-2010, 09:52 AM
Why hasn't Clayton made it in the pros yet? You said he would be a top 50 atp player. :-?
He's 19.

10 char

Fee
01-10-2010, 01:03 PM
i played on the team with alex clayton for 2 years at stanford...im not saying anything against tonlars but knowing clayton it just must seem that for him to go that close with him is just a bit strange. if tonlars had other results that proved himself to be a player of that caliber i would say it would not be as shocking...


Did you graduate from Stanford or did you leave without a degree?

goldfish81
01-10-2010, 01:32 PM
Did you graduate from Stanford or did you leave without a degree?

i graduated from stanford last year. i dont really think clayton is a pusher either, i can tell all of you ive many forehands and serves breezed by me..

pac10s.com

ttbrowne
01-10-2010, 02:08 PM
Nadal is anything but a pusher. I guarantee that if you were on the other side of the net from him, you'd feel like you were being bombarded. He's certainly a grinder, but he's anything but a pusher.

A grinder. What's a grinder? A glorified pusher.

SlapShot
01-10-2010, 05:42 PM
A grinder. What's a grinder? A glorified pusher.

Not in the least. A grinder is a grinder. A pusher is a hack. There's no two ways about that.

Nadal is able to go on offense with the right ball, and does so as well as almost anyone on the tour.

aphex
01-11-2010, 01:11 AM
Then, Goldfish, you must also be close, personal friends with Fedace.

Personally, I think you are both full of it.

at last you realized that life without the good doctor is not worth living...

welcome back!

aphex
01-11-2010, 01:16 AM
i graduated from stanford last year. i dont really think clayton is a pusher either, i can tell all of you ive many forehands and serves breezed by me..

pac10s.com

do you remember a kid stalking the tennis team and harassing coach wHiT?

Ultra2HolyGrail
01-11-2010, 05:57 AM
i mean clayton wins off competitiveness if you really watch him. he fights harder than the other guy. if he is not in the right frame of mind hes not going to play well. and no theres no way he was trying his hardest against tony larson....i would like to see clayton really try against him... i think it wouldnt be too close

pac10s.com


This is absurd. The fact is tony larson took a set off him and it was a very close match. What else can you pac10.com-stanford ***** say besides he wasent trying? The FACT is clayton almost lost to some guy who teaches in minnesota, who mostly just plays open tournaments, who only competed at a d2 school, and does not have nowhere near the training of his opponent. If i was clayton i would not even want to be associated with people like you. If tonlars can compete with him, what do you think the top players from all over the world would do to him? No offense to tony.

Trickster
01-11-2010, 07:36 AM
I think some of us are over-estimating Clayton's ability and under-estimating Tony's ability.

I think it's easy to see why Tony took a set off Alex Clayton. Tony's obviously a good player.

And anyhow, how is clayton going to fare at top flight level if he doesn't 'try' in some matches

Joeyg
01-11-2010, 08:28 AM
Hi Aphex,

Just guessing that I just needed a little time off. It was very frustrating having so many posts deleted just because I mentioned a certain "Standford" grad.

By the way, where are you in Greece? I was born in Malta and have been to Greece several times. My last name in Maltese actually means "from the Greek".

Fee
01-11-2010, 11:56 AM
Hi Aphex,

Just guessing that I just needed a little time off. It was very frustrating having so many posts deleted just because I mentioned a certain "Standford" grad.

By the way, where are you in Greece? I was born in Malta and have been to Greece several times. My last name in Maltese actually means "from the Greek".


Hey Joey. Happy New Year. :)

Tennisman912
01-11-2010, 12:21 PM
Goldfish18,

To suggest Alex is not trying at the top of the D1 tennis and being successful just proves you have no idea what you are talking about. If you are not trying, your peers and players of TonLars caliber would wipe you off the court. You cannot “coast” at that level and be successful. It takes too much effort and if you are not putting it in, you will get throttled. If you could, you would be far superior to others in college and leave to go play in the pros. Player’s of this caliber didn’t get there by coasting. They are hyper competitive and want to crush the spirit of an opponent as soon as possible and when up, make sure they don’t get a sense they could come back.

Alex, like any player, isn’t perfect and has a few weaknesses as described above, especially if not firing on all cylinders that day (and no offense to Alex as he is a GREAT, GREAT player). But what players do when not firing on all cylinders is grind out a win, not coast. I would bet that any college or open player would be respectful of his ability if he were on as has been stated before. But if he isn’t, he isn’t coasting and “hoping for the best.” He is going to do what he can to win, like any good player. Grinding is a relative term as it might not look like grinding to anyone who doesn’t see and understand what he or she is seeing at that very high level of play.

As a supposed former Stanford player, you would understand this as a matter of course and not suggest he is coasting when he has a close match. I bet he works pretty hard in practice and off the court. But your words have spoken volumes. It doesn't bode well for your credibility.

Good tennis all

TM

sureshs
01-11-2010, 12:33 PM
i played on the team with alex clayton for 2 years at stanford...im not saying anything against tonlars but knowing clayton it just must seem that for him to go that close with him is just a bit strange. if tonlars had other results that proved himself to be a player of that caliber i would say it would not be as shocking...

Were you Fedace's classmate?

Joeyg
01-11-2010, 01:11 PM
Hey Fee! Happy New Year to you too! Are you working in San Jose this year? I took last year off, but am back this year for sure.

Fee
01-11-2010, 01:19 PM
Hey Fee! Happy New Year to you too! Are you working in San Jose this year? I took last year off, but am back this year for sure.

Alas, I have moved completely out of Nor Cal so my days there are over. Not sure what events I will visit this year, if any. Too much going on. :(

Hey Joey, since you are familiar with Stanford, can you tell me when they stopped requiring English Comp as a graduation requirement?

Joeyg
01-11-2010, 01:39 PM
Hi Fee,

Sorry to hear about your move. I looked forward to seeing you this year and having a bit of fun at the good doctor's expense.

As for the requirements for graduation at Stanford, well, I guess they are a bit different than those at "Standford". Hope all goes well for you and yours in the coming year.

Take care,

joeyg

BounceHitBounceHit
01-11-2010, 04:17 PM
I think some of us are over-estimating Clayton's ability and under-estimating Tony's ability.

I think it's easy to see why Tony took a set off Alex Clayton. Tony's obviously a good player.

And anyhow, how is clayton going to fare at top flight level if he doesn't 'try' in some matches

Absolutely. I've hit with plenty of top flight DI guys over the years. Tony is as good as any of them. He's just chosen (for reasons he has articulated here many times over) not to pursue tennis as a career. BHBH

Fedace
01-11-2010, 04:59 PM
From watching Alex Clayton practicing,,,sure doesn't look like a pusher to me.......LOL

http://www.gostanford.com/livestats/tennis/StanfordTennis.html

SuperDuy
01-11-2010, 05:39 PM
What court fedace?

Fedace
01-11-2010, 07:26 PM
What court fedace?

court #1. but they are done now. Today, everyone was hitting big,,,noone pushing the ball today.....:)

DownTheLine
01-11-2010, 08:19 PM
Fedace is that stream daily? Or what is it? I'm on my iPod so it doesn't show much.

aphex
01-12-2010, 12:58 AM
Hi Aphex,

Just guessing that I just needed a little time off. It was very frustrating having so many posts deleted just because I mentioned a certain "Standford" grad.

By the way, where are you in Greece? I was born in Malta and have been to Greece several times. My last name in Maltese actually means "from the Greek".

ha, nice! i'm in athens-dead centre..kolonaki area...
where have u been to (in greece)?

Joeyg
01-12-2010, 11:29 AM
All over Greece. Been to Athens and all of the surrounding area, Mykonos, Crete, Rhodes. Loved Mykonos, but that was when I was 19 back in the 70's. Very cool place back then.

Fedace
01-12-2010, 04:32 PM
Fedace is that stream daily? Or what is it? I'm on my iPod so it doesn't show much.

They practice daily this week since they need a good showing this weekend at Sherwood cup....

goldfish81
01-12-2010, 11:09 PM
the draw for the sherwood is up...

www.pac10s.com

DownTheLine
01-13-2010, 05:59 PM
the draw for the sherwood is up...

www.pac10s.com

Post the link?

Fedace
01-14-2010, 03:01 AM
Post the link?

My pick to win -- Alex Clayton.

SirSweetSpot
01-14-2010, 08:49 AM
Clayton does have a nice service motion, it reminds me of Aaron Krickstein from BITD.

DownTheLine
01-14-2010, 01:36 PM
My pick to win -- Alex Clayton.

Maybe. Bradely Klahn has a good shot.

darthpwner
01-14-2010, 03:46 PM
Alex is my favorite college player and I tried to model my game after him. Does my serve kind of look like his? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_fGrD90azYs

DownTheLine
01-14-2010, 04:00 PM
Alex is my favorite college player and I tried to model my game after him. Does my serve kind of look like his? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_fGrD90azYs

Movement- Yes

Power/Speed- No

I might change mine to it...?

Fedace
01-15-2010, 09:10 AM
http://www.pac10s.com/sherwood.pdf

Beginning of GREAT dynasty for Stanford tennis....

DownTheLine
01-15-2010, 01:45 PM
Brad draws Abid in the QF Lefty vs Lefty Stanford vs UCLA Prestige vs Prestige.

I pick Bradely!

db379
01-15-2010, 01:57 PM
Klahn is a great player and he seems to be improving all the time. He had a grear season last year, and he has a real chance to do well in the cup. I'll pick him to win it!

Too bad Clayton has a bad draw...Johnson in the 3rd round is no good news.

Fedace
01-15-2010, 10:09 PM
Klahn is a great player and he seems to be improving all the time. He had a grear season last year, and he has a real chance to do well in the cup. I'll pick him to win it!

Too bad Clayton has a bad draw...Johnson in the 3rd round is no good news.

LOL,,,,Johnson is the True pusher compared to Clayton.....:)

db379
01-16-2010, 12:11 PM
I don't think Alex is a pusher either; great player, strong serve, aggressive game.

Have they played the 1st round of the Sherwood cup already?

strahan918
01-16-2010, 12:26 PM
LOL,,,,Johnson is the True pusher compared to Clayton.....:)

LOL you gotta be kidding me

Ultra2HolyGrail
01-16-2010, 12:35 PM
Alex Clayton hits his forehand as hard as Federer,,,so how do you feel about it now ???


I feel you lost all credibility.

fruitytennis1
01-16-2010, 02:05 PM
Yes hes your usual rec pusher...He only serves 100+ Though he must be a pusher since he doesnt go for a winner every shot right?

db379
01-17-2010, 11:14 AM
brad klahn is in the final ofthe sherwood cup after defeating robert farah! Well done brad.

DownTheLine
01-17-2010, 11:31 AM
brad klahn is in the final ofthe sherwood cup after defeating robert farah! Well done brad.

In my opinion Bradely is better then Alex.

strahan918
01-17-2010, 03:48 PM
In my opinion Bradely is better then Alex.

i think bradley has a more powerful backhand, n while bradley has a great forehand, clayton's is just a monster, n claytons serving and volleys seem to trump claytons. bradley is freakishly fast though

DownTheLine
01-17-2010, 04:10 PM
Yea. Bradely has been playing very good lately. Not so much for Clayton.

Fedace
01-17-2010, 07:46 PM
Does this look like Pusher to you ?? he is annilating Lukacs with power...

http://www.youtube.com/user/Maximagq#p/u/14/Edx_u-uvJP8

socaltennnis
01-17-2010, 10:37 PM
I found some pac-10 twitter accounts from the teams. They were posting the sherwood cup results all of this past weekend.

http://twitter.com/uclatennis

http://twitter.com/stanfordtennis

db379
01-18-2010, 05:51 AM
Brad won the singles! Great effort. He may be #1 for Stanford this season... My guess is that Brad will move up the rankings pretty quickly this year. Do you guys know how the rankings are done?

Fedace
01-18-2010, 06:35 AM
Brad won the singles! Great effort. He may be #1 for Stanford this season... My guess is that Brad will move up the rankings pretty quickly this year. Do you guys know how the rankings are done?

you can watch Brad make a short work of this over-rated Farah from USC in the finals. Brad owns Farah at this point. STill Brad isn't as good as Clayton at this point of the careers. Brad just matches up better against Farah,, thats all. Beaten Farah 3 times in a row.

http://www.youtube.com/user/Maximagq#p/u/7/oa6AiDnYDlA

equinox
01-18-2010, 07:20 AM
I saw alex sky a dozen defensive lobs on the w/e, what a pusher! :p

Fedace
01-18-2010, 08:01 AM
I saw alex sky a dozen defensive lobs on the w/e, what a pusher! :p

that is not pushing,, Federer does the same thing and Alex is actually hitting better defensive lobs than Federer. Did you see his opponent ? He missed every overhead,,,,what a Incredible Spin on that defensive lob. WOW>.:shock:

db379
01-18-2010, 09:32 AM
you can watch Brad make a short work of this over-rated Farah from USC in the finals. Brad owns Farah at this point. STill Brad isn't as good as Clayton at this point of the careers. Brad just matches up better against Farah,, thats all. Beaten Farah 3 times in a row.

http://www.youtube.com/user/Maximagq#p/u/7/oa6AiDnYDlA

I saw these, thanks. Great vids! My concern with Alex is that he's very talented but he doesn't seem to have improved much over the last year. In contrast, Brad played well as Stanford #2, and he seem to have really exploded this year, winning 2 fairly big tournaments this season already (one in October and one now). This is going to be an interesting season, let's hope the cardinals will win the pack 10 this year and do well in the NCAA.

DownTheLine
01-18-2010, 10:08 AM
Is there any videos of Alex from that tournament? If I were Alex I'd be worried.

db379
01-18-2010, 10:23 AM
Is there any videos of Alex from that tournament? If I were Alex I'd be worried.

yes, I don't have the link but search you tube for clayton vs lukacs. It's only 1 set which alex won 6-0, so it's not very exciting tennis.

Fedace
01-18-2010, 11:53 AM
Is there any videos of Alex from that tournament? If I were Alex I'd be worried.

Here is the link. Alex is tearing him up.

http://www.youtube.com/user/Maximagq#p/u/30/Edx_u-uvJP8

Fedace
01-18-2010, 11:54 AM
I saw these, thanks. Great vids! My concern with Alex is that he's very talented but he doesn't seem to have improved much over the last year. In contrast, Brad played well as Stanford #2, and he seem to have really exploded this year, winning 2 fairly big tournaments this season already (one in October and one now). This is going to be an interesting season, let's hope the cardinals will win the pack 10 this year and do well in the NCAA.

Alex will win the NCAA so that should be a pretty good year. Brad is doing well against the top guys, due to the fact that he is lefty. but he doesn't match up well with Alex. Alex beats him most of the time..:)

MC10S
01-18-2010, 12:02 PM
here is a classic farce.

ELITE D1 Pusher.

Doesn't sound right?

That's because it isn't true. There is NO SUCH THING.

You will NEVER see a "pusher" at the top of D1.

Junker, maybe, Backboard guy, maybe.

MC10s,
Contributor
D3tennis.com

Fedace
01-18-2010, 12:12 PM
You know, i have been watching this video of Klahn vs Farah and i can't help it but think Klahn is starting to look like Nadal......Skinny Nadal that is....

http://www.youtube.com/user/Maximagq#p/u/21/gVIURG3ijk0

DownTheLine
01-18-2010, 02:46 PM
Alex will win the NCAA so that should be a pretty good year. Brad is doing well against the top guys, due to the fact that he is lefty. but he doesn't match up well with Alex. Alex beats him most of the time..:)
Alex is leading 6-5 head to head.

equinox
01-18-2010, 04:52 PM
Yeh alex has really stagnated lately. I remember reading about his tennis exploits years ago, thinking he'll go pro like reynolds, ram, delic, etc and with hardwork easily match there success.

Now i'm not so sure he'll amount to much more than a pencil pusher working a 9-10 job in an office.

He really hasn't progressed his game.

DownTheLine
01-18-2010, 05:50 PM
Yeh alex has really stagnated lately. I remember reading about his tennis exploits years ago, thinking he'll go pro like reynolds, ram, delic, etc and with hardwork easily match there success.

Now i'm not so sure he'll amount to much more than a pencil pusher working a 9-10 job in an office.

He really hasn't progressed his game.
He could be changing something drastic in his game that will improve later.

Fedace
01-23-2010, 06:45 PM
You can watch Alex Destroying Sac State right now.. better than Aussie open.

http://www.gostanford.com/livestats/tennis/StanfordTennis.html

ClarkC
01-23-2010, 08:31 PM
You can watch Alex Destroying Sac State right now.. better than Aussie open.

http://www.gostanford.com/livestats/tennis/StanfordTennis.html

Clayton split sets at #2 singles against Sacramento State. This does not seem to agree with the prediction that he will double bagel Dennis Nevolo of Illinois at #1 singles.

Fedace
01-24-2010, 05:22 AM
Clayton split sets at #2 singles against Sacramento State. This does not seem to agree with the prediction that he will double bagel Dennis Nevolo of Illinois at #1 singles.

Well, except now it looks like Klahn will play Nevolo, Not Clayton...:)

DownTheLine
01-24-2010, 11:49 AM
Is Clayton #2 now?

goldfish81
01-24-2010, 02:34 PM
Is Clayton #2 now?


i would imagine so

pac10s.com

Bashi
02-08-2010, 09:25 AM
i wish i could "push" like that

old coach
02-11-2010, 06:28 AM
here is a classic farce.

ELITE D1 Pusher.

Doesn't sound right?

That's because it isn't true. There is NO SUCH THING.

You will NEVER see a "pusher" at the top of D1.

Junker, maybe, Backboard guy, maybe.

MC10s,
Contributor
D3tennis.com

I agree with you 100%

subban
04-07-2010, 07:36 AM
he does'nt look like a pusher, they both look like hard hitting baseliners. Anyone notice at this level both players seem to not like hitting very short balls cause they both play with very western grips and stand far back on the baseline.

miniRafa386
04-07-2010, 09:05 PM
Just watching this match against Bassam Beidas.

Looks like Clayton is seriously junking him...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6b5tndrWgWI


Maybe this is not how he normally play but still...

i think that it should be known that players at this level DO NOT PUSH. there is NO way that anyone could make it to this level of tennis and push. maybe they throw in a few high loopers or a low paced ball deep, however they do it to disrupt the rhythm of the point or to neutralize the point. anyone who does think that players at this level are pushers are either 1) dont know s*** about tennis or 2) on LSD

Fedace
04-08-2010, 03:24 AM
100 mph forehand....yea,,,he is a pusher...allright.

Six.One.Tour.90FAN
04-08-2010, 04:25 AM
THat guy from Pepperdine is one loud guy. I mean, CMON LETS GO!!!!!!!!!!
after every single point is ridiculous.....

90

dunno
04-16-2010, 10:00 PM
lol pusher...yeah right. nadal's a pusher too.

KSJ1979
04-23-2010, 04:34 PM
Alex has nice variety.....he is not a hard, flat groundstroke machine....

djokovicgonzalez2010
04-23-2010, 04:38 PM
Offensive baseliners are NOT pushers. Is Nikolay Davydenko a pusher???