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View Full Version : Top Ten from 1980 onwards........


JohnThomas1
04-23-2005, 06:46 AM
Who are the top ten from 1980 forward? This has been my era of following tennis and i am interested to see what peeps think. Greats that achieved more before 1980 but were still playing serious tennis i want included with their earlier achievements considered. Borg, Connors, Evert etc.

federerhoogenbandfan
04-23-2005, 07:41 AM
Grrr, how dare you try to overshadow my thread. A hex on you a hex, a HEEEXXXX!!!!! :mrgreen:

federerhoogenbandfan
04-23-2005, 07:46 AM
Ok here are mine:

Men:

1)Bjorn Borg
2)Pete Sampras
3)Ivan Lendl
4)Andre Agassi
5)John McEnroe
6)Jimmy Conners
7)Mats Wilander
8)Roger Federer
9)Boris Becker
10)Stephan Edberg


Women:

1)Steffi Graf
2)Martina Navratilova
3)Chris Evert
4)Serena Williams
5)Martina Hingis
6)Hana Mandilikova
7)Lindsay Davenport
8)Aranxta Sanchez Vicario
9)Venus Williams
10)Henin Hardenne and Tracy Austin tied

Serena2
04-23-2005, 01:28 PM
Err hello-how can seles not be included in that list????? even with the stabbing shes top 5 and without it probably the greatest ever.

federerhoogenbandfan
04-23-2005, 01:29 PM
Sorry, slip Seles in at #3, and bump everybody down a notch, bumping Henin and Austin off the list.

Serena2
04-23-2005, 01:34 PM
Ok thanx! that sounds good to me. Maybe Henin should be included and not Mandlikova-im not sure??

federerhoogenbandfan
04-23-2005, 01:35 PM
It is hard to say. Mandilikova has 1 more slam, but she never had a dominant stretch like Henin-Hardenne did briefly. She had so much more longevity though, of course she was around longer, and she won her 4 slams playing against Evert and Nav.,
and was runner up at Wimbledon twice to Henin's once. It is a tough call.

Serena2
04-23-2005, 01:40 PM
Yea, your right. But id probably put Henin in just because of her backhand! And the 2003 US Open 1/2 against capriati was amazing how she won it. Only seen a bit of Mandlikova so im not sure.

need2paint
04-23-2005, 01:47 PM
I would put Martina ahead of Steffi. Had they been the same age I think Martina would have beaten Steffi most of the time.

AndrewD
04-23-2005, 06:05 PM
Some good picks there. Here's mine, remembering that it's from 1980 onwards and both Borg and Austin were finished by 1981. Having Mandlikova above Venus and Justine H-H is more a case of their careers not being finished yet. If, when they are, they've added to their tallies they'll pass her. Federer's low rank is similar. He's only been dominant for the last couple of years whereas the others sustained a peak for longer and, apart from Borg and Sampras, were fighting each other for each major title. If he keeps winning then he'll most likely move up to #2 or #3.

Men:

1)Pete Sampras
2)Ivan Lendl
3)John McEnroe
4)Andre Agassi
5)Mats Wilander
6)Boris Becker
7)Stephan Edberg
8)Roger Federer
9)Jimmy Connors
10)Bjorn Borg/Jim Courier

Women:

1)Steffi Graf
2)Martina Navratilova
3)Chris Evert
4)Monica Seles
5)Serena Williams
6)Martina Hingis
7)Hana Mandilikova
8)Henin Hardenne
9) Venus Williams
10) Lindsay Davenport/Aranxta Sanchez Vicario

Jet Rink
04-23-2005, 06:59 PM
1. Sampras
2. Borg
3. McEnroe
4. Connors
5. Lendl
7. Agassi
8. Wilander
9. Becker
10. Edberg

Jet

35ft6
04-24-2005, 07:20 AM
1. Sampras
2. Agassi
3. Lendl
4. McEnroe

from here on out, things get hazy:

5. Becker
6. Edberg
7. Federer
8. Courier
9. Wilander
10. Hewitt

Deuce
04-24-2005, 09:40 PM
When will you people learn the game? And how about a little respect?!

Shlomo, Shlomo, Shlomo...

Northerly
04-25-2005, 12:38 AM
Henin Hardenne wouldn't have won any Slams if she'd played when Mandlikova did!

activentures
04-25-2005, 02:47 AM
Sampras
Lendl
Borg
Agassi
McEnroe
Connors
Federer
Becker
Wilander
Edberg

activentures
04-25-2005, 02:53 AM
how about 90 onwards??

Sampras
Agassi
Becker
Federer
Edberg
Courier
Hewitt
Rafter
Guga
Kafelnikov/Safin


I'm now cowering in a corner waiting for the bullets to strike!!

35ft6
04-25-2005, 03:55 AM
How about 25,000 BC on? Because scientists found the remains of a cave man, wonderfully preserved in ice, and he's holding a some type of racket. Strung with natural gut. And judging by the looks of him, he could have been the best ever. I mean, if old timers are better than modern players, and this caveman is older than anybody, then that means this uni-browed brute is the best player in history. Hurry for Grok.

The Pusher Terminator
04-25-2005, 08:42 AM
1-10...John Mcenroe

1-10 ...Monica Seles

Jack the Hack
04-26-2005, 10:37 AM
I just posted a list in the "Lendl vs. McEnroe" thread, but I modify it for the extended range of time. Here is my top ten:

1. Pete Sampras (Played in 18 Grand Slam finals, won a record 14! Never made it past the semi at the French, but dominated everywhere else.)

2. Bjorn Borg (Played in 16 Grand Slam finals, won 11. He ruled the French Open and Wimbledon back to back several times, which is one of the most amazing accomplishments ever... never to be duplicated.)

3. Ivan Lendl (Played in 19 Grand Slam finals, won 8. He was a finalist in all Slams, and could win on any surface. He changed the way pros looked at fitness, and set the pattern for power baseliners.)

4. Jimmy Conners (Played in 15 Grand Slam finals, won 8. He is only one of three players to win a Slam on all three surfaces - grass, clay, and hard court. Won more overall tournaments - 109!!! - and matches - 1,222!!! - than any player in history.)

5. Andre Agassi (Played in 14 Grand Slam finals, won 8. One of only three players to win a Slam on all three surfaces, and one of only 5 to win all 4 of the Slams. It could be argued as to whether he or Connors should be #4, and Andre could yet win another Slam to bump himself up.)

6. Mats Wilander (Played in 11 Grand Slam finals, won 7. Along with Conners and Andre Agassi, he is one of only three players to win a Slam on all three surfaces. Note, the '83 and '84 Australians were on grass... and he also won a Wimbledon doubles title with Joakim Nystrom in '86. He could play on fast courts or rule on clay.)

7. John McEnroe (Played in 11 Grand Slam finals, won 7. Tremendous artistry with the game, along with fiery outgoing personality made him a star, but he never recovered after his 12 month absence in '86 - other competitors passed him by with increased fitness, power, and desire.)

8. Stefan Edberg (Played in 11 Grand Slam finals, won 6. Was a finalist at all of the Slams, and could be argued as better than McEnroe. However, he won 1 less Slam in the same amount of finals, so he gets bumped to #8.)

9. Jim Courier (Played in 7 Grand Slam finals, won 4. He played in the final of all the Slams, dominating for a brief time before Sampras took off.)

10. Roger Federer (Played in 4 Grand Slam finals - so far - and won all 4.)

If he keeps it up, Federer will seriously challenge Lendl, Borg, and Sampras as the best overall player, post-1980 (or ever...) but he has a long way to go. Also, the likes of Safin, Ferrero, Roddick, or Nadel could easily break into the historical top 10 within the next few years.

As far as women, I won't go into the same detail, but I think the top 5 goes something like:

1. Steffi Graf
2. Martina Navratilova
3. Chris Evert
4. Monica Seles
5. Serena Williams

I wish that Seles hadn't gotten stabbed as I would have loved to see if she could have gotten past Chris, Martina, and Steffi. She was dominating and on her way like Federer is with Sampras... but that crime robbed her of any chance to be best ever.

Jack the Hack
04-26-2005, 10:48 AM
Ooops!

My apologies to Becker fans!

Boris Becker should be in there at #9 instead of Courier. Boris played in 9 Grand Slam finals and won 5. The interesting thing is that as talented as Boris was, he never won a clay tournament on the pro tour... several finals, but no wins!

Anyway, that moves Courier down to #10, in a tie with Federer. However, as I mentioned, I think it is just a matter of time before Federer moves up and another talented youngster breaks through for 4+ career Slams. (Safin, Roddick, Ferrero, Nadel... or maybe a huge comeback by Guga or Moya?)

Jack the Hack
04-26-2005, 10:52 AM
Or Hewitt hanging on and sneaking out another 2 or 3 Slams...

Kevin Patrick
04-26-2005, 11:21 AM
Becker made 10 GS finals, winning 6.

Jack the Hack
04-26-2005, 11:40 AM
Kevin, you are right!

I missed the '96 Australian where he beat Michael Chang when I was putting my list together. A couple minutes after I posted the original list, I realized I made a huge omission in leaving off Becker and was scarmbling to get him added on before someone slammed my mistake!!!

However, I wouldn't put him above Edberg at #8, who made one more final... and was a finalist at all of the Slams.

spirit
04-26-2005, 12:33 PM
Pete Sampras
John McEnroe (remember to add in his GOAT doubles play)
Bjorn Borg
Ivan Lendl
Jimmy connors
Stefan Edberg
Mats Wilander
Andre Agassi
Boris Becker
Jim Courier
Roger Federer (he will definitely move up unless a catastrophe happens)

As for women, I have more trouble rating them, but I see no reason to differ from Jack the Hacks best 5 list:

Stefi Graf
Martina Navritolova
Chris Evert
Monica Seles
Serena Williams (if she got some good coaching and concentrated on her tennis she could move up)

federerhoogenbandfan
04-26-2005, 02:25 PM
I am sorry but I laugh at the thought of putting Federer below Courier, to each their own though.

Jack the Hack
04-26-2005, 03:21 PM
If something were to happen to Federer today and he could never play again, he would have 4 Grand Slam titles to his name - an excellent career for anyone, and probably a guaranteed Hall of Fame induction. But, Courier would outrank him by having made 7 Grand Slam finals (winning 4), including making the finals of all four.

I thought I made myself perfectly clear that if Federer continues on the path of dominance he is currently on, he will end up as one of the best ever - far ahead of Courier. In fact, 5-10 years from now, Courier may not be on anyone's top 10 list of the best post-80s players... while Federer might be at the top. However, he needs to keep winning and achieve the titles to solidify himself in history.

Don't be one of those type of folks that would put Lebron James in the top 50 basketball players of all time before he ever wins a title!

(If we are making a list of the greatest pure TALENTs in the past 25 years, let's go ahead and put Safin in the top 10. But if we are talking the best players, I have to go with cold hard accomplishments... and Federer is on the path to be one of the best.)

federerhoogenbandfan
04-27-2005, 07:59 AM
Federer would be above Courier even today. They both have 4 slams, Federer has won 3 of the 4, Courier only 2, Federer won 3 in one year, a momentual feat Courier never achieved. Federer has stats like 16 straight finals won, and winning his first 4 slam finals. 3 of Courier's 4 slams were at the Aussie and French, 3 of 4 of Fed's at Wimbledon and the U.S, isnt it generally considered the latter two are slightly more prestigious, more slams often still wins out, but when there is a tie or very close to a high number one would always look at that.

If Federer retired today I would guess atleast 8 out of 10 experts would have him over Courier without problem, in fact I would bet money on it if there ever was a poll among experts of the game.

35ft6
04-27-2005, 08:21 AM
John McEnroe (remember to add in his GOAT doubles play)
I remember when you could say this and absolutely nobody would argue.

But does Todd Woodbridge deserve consideration?

Jack the Hack
04-27-2005, 09:01 AM
federerhoogenbandfan,

Very good points and I can agree with your assessment. I don't want to discount Courier's accomplishments as they are very worthy - and I don't think it is "laughable" to compare his record with Federer's at this point. However, we are splitting hairs here that aren't worth arguing over! Besides, unless something terrible happens to Federer or he becomes satisfied once he reached 7-8 Slams, he is likely to go down as one of the greatest players ever before he his done.

(By the way, I am also a big Federer fan, so I'm not trying to say he's not already great. If I was going to pay for a ticket to a match, I would much rather watch Federer than the blunt style of Courier! Federer is the first player in years where I have watched and seen him do something so unbelievable, I've jumped out of my chair shouting "Oh my G*d, did you see that!!!")

federerhoogenbandfan
04-27-2005, 11:30 AM
Sorry I was in a rush when I typed my last post. You are right I probably am disrespecting Courier's record somewhat and he does have the current edge on Roger in some areas. I just think Roger's 2004 year, and the fact Courier does not top level success spread over a number of years himself, would allow Roger to be above Courier even today. Your points in Courier's argument though are all good.

Coria
04-27-2005, 02:43 PM
From '80 on:

1) Sampras
2) Agassi
3) McEnroe
4) Borg
5) Lendl
6) Becker
7) Edberg
8) Wilander
9) Connors
10) Federer--and moving up!!

1) Graf 2) Martina 3) Evert 4) Seles 5) S. Williams 6) Hingis 7) Davenport
8) Mandlikova 9) Sanchez 10) Austin--no I would not put Venus in it