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View Full Version : i guess us old timers are the only ones on here?????


jimanuel12
01-21-2010, 12:56 PM
i told my niece recently that when i started playing tennis we used wood rackets, she looked at me like i had two heads??

reallly??? she said.
i said yes, and they were heavy rackets with a small head and small sweet spot.
these kids now a days, they don't know good they have it but the new rackets are more likely to cause arm problems being too light and too head heavy.
so, i caution the young people to be aware of that.

but what do i know??

i still don't know who adam lambert and lady gaga is?????

ronalditop
01-22-2010, 07:42 AM
i told my niece recently that when i started playing tennis we used wood rackets, she looked at me like i had two heads??

reallly??? she said.
i said yes, and they were heavy rackets with a small head and small sweet spot.
these kids now a days, they don't know good they have it but the new rackets are more likely to cause arm problems being too light and too head heavy.
so, i caution the young people to be aware of that.

but what do i know??

i still don't know who adam lambert and lady gaga is?????

I envy you.

Superman1272
01-22-2010, 09:24 AM
How old do I have to be to be in the old timers club?

Tennis Man
01-22-2010, 10:34 AM
How old do I have to be to be in the old timers club?

It's a good question. My guess is over 50 at least. I missed the whole wooded racquet era. So I wouldn't call myself an old-timer. 80's is my thing, the start of modern racquet era :)

jimanuel12
01-22-2010, 10:52 AM
It's a good question. My guess is over 50 at least. I missed the whole wooded racquet era. So I wouldn't call myself an old-timer. 80's is my thing, the start of modern racquet era :)

i started with the old woodies, but then went to the wislon T-2000 and T-3000.
went back to the woodies, then a long lay off.
went to a wilson and then to the over size modern rackets.
made the terrible mistake of going to a wilson hyper hammer last year and still healing from the tennis elbow.
now i bought a kennex 5G and a couple of fischer m pro 105 for the arm.
will try them out as soon as i heal up.
been playing tennis since high school and college and this is only the second time i have had TE.

the dreaded wilson hyper hammer - the racket build for TE.
i should sue them!!!

Tennis Man
01-22-2010, 11:25 AM
i started with the old woodies, but then went to the wislon T-2000 and T-3000.
went back to the woodies, then a long lay off.
went to a wilson and then to the over size modern rackets.
made the terrible mistake of going to a wilson hyper hammer last year and still healing from the tennis elbow.
now i bought a kennex 5G and a couple of fischer m pro 105 for the arm.
will try them out as soon as i heal up.
been playing tennis since high school and college and this is only the second time i have had TE.

the dreaded wilson hyper hammer - the racket build for TE.
i should sue them!!!

I don't know what tennis elbow is. I always played with heavy good-quality frames like Pro Staff 85. Now you make me wonder if someone had TE from such frames. Maybe from constanly mishitting them :)

Virginia
01-22-2010, 11:39 AM
I don't know what tennis elbow is. I always played with heavy good-quality frames like Pro Staff 85. Now you make me wonder if someone had TE from such frames. Maybe from constanly mishitting them :)
It's not weight that gives you TE. In fact, it's likely to be the opposite.

coachrick
01-22-2010, 10:40 PM
If you read my other posts(like the one I just left in the Former Pro Player dept. re: Roy Emerson), you can be certain that I qualify for the 'double nickel' club...plenty old if you ask me. I came along just in time for the 'boom' of the 70s. Plenty of wood sticks but since I worked in a tennis specialty shop, I got to try out just about everything! We also had to figure out how to string them!

I'm a little amused when posters refer to the POG(Prince Original Graphite) in 90 or mid. NO...the Prince ORIGINAL Graphite was only oversize...stayed that way for a few years.

I'm also amused when threads discussing 'classic' rackets go ALL THE WAY BACK to the late 90s or even more recent models. These young whippersnappers don't know 'classic'. Why, I'll show them 'classic' by golly!!! :) j/k and all that, y'all!

CollegeBound
01-23-2010, 01:22 AM
I'm a little amused when posters refer to the POG(Prince Original Graphite) in 90 or mid. NO...the Prince ORIGINAL Graphite was only oversize...stayed that way for a few years.


I wouldn't laugh because it's the ORIGINAL Prince Graphite that only came in oversize. The 'POG' (Prince Original Graphite), which is just a nickname, came in 90/93 and 107/110.

pshulam
01-23-2010, 07:07 AM
but the new rackets are more likely to cause arm problems being too light and too head heavy.
Not entirely true .. There are many modern racquets that are head light, not real light (12 oz range), and semi-soft (RA ~60 - 63).

pshulam
01-23-2010, 07:11 AM
How old do I have to be to be in the old timers club?
Age itself does not cut it. One has to start playing early, i.e., 60s, 70s.

pshulam
01-23-2010, 07:18 AM
It's not weight that gives you TE. In fact, it's likely to be the opposite.

There are many factors attributed to tennis elbow:

improper hitting techniques
stiffness of the racquet
string stiffness
high string tension
weak tendon

I am sure there are more ..

coachrick
01-23-2010, 07:40 AM
There are many factors attributed to tennis elbow:

improper hitting techniques
stiffness of the racquet
string stiffness
high string tension
weak tendon

I am sure there are more ..

One of the most common causes is overuse. Rod Laver had a severe case of TE in the 70s. At one tournament at Sea Pines, he tried a forearm strap popular at the time. It took TWO of them strapped end to end to go around his left forearm! Not so sure the human arm was designed to hit tennis balls 4, 6, 8 hours a day.

Virginia
01-23-2010, 09:52 AM
There are many factors attributed to tennis elbow:

improper hitting techniques
stiffness of the racquet
string stiffness
high string tension
weak tendon

I am sure there are more ..
What I meant was that just the fact of using a heavy racquet would not give a player TE. The stress on the arm is more likely to come with a light racquet, as there is more impact to absorb.

You are right about the other factors though - they all play a part.

pshulam
01-23-2010, 10:02 AM
One of the most common causes is overuse. Rod Laver had a severe case of TE in the 70s. At one tournament at Sea Pines, he tried a forearm strap popular at the time. It took TWO of them strapped end to end to go around his left forearm! Not so sure the human arm was designed to hit tennis balls 4, 6, 8 hours a day.

Most likely that our arms are not meant for that. I wonder how people who work with their hands all day are holding up. Occupations such as painters and carpenters may be at risk of developing tennis elbow.

pshulam
01-23-2010, 10:13 AM
What I meant was that just the fact of using a heavy racquet would not give a player TE. The stress on the arm is more likely to come with a light racquet, as there is more impact to absorb.


Agreed - a heavier racquet is more effective in dampening vibration. Proper distribution in weight may prevent shock.

CollegeBound
01-23-2010, 03:05 PM
One of the most common causes is overuse. Rod Laver had a severe case of TE in the 70s. At one tournament at Sea Pines, he tried a forearm strap popular at the time. It took TWO of them strapped end to end to go around his left forearm! Not so sure the human arm was designed to hit tennis balls 4, 6, 8 hours a day.

My wife is a physio and she is adamant that one of the most common causes today is people using grip sizes which are too small for them. It's fine for players who are playing constantly and keep their strokes well grooved (although they're not immune to injury) but, for the average person who plays only once a week, it can be a recipe for disaster. They go from not playing at all to turning their wrist and forearm on every shot as though they're playing ping pong, not tennis. That ends up causing problems ranging from tennis elbow to carpal tunnel.

Tennis Man
01-23-2010, 04:51 PM
It's not weight that gives you TE. In fact, it's likely to be the opposite.

Well, that's exactly what I meant by saying that I never had TE from playing with heavy frames and still wonder if anyone does. I do has a shoulder pain once in a while though. :)

coachrick
01-23-2010, 06:19 PM
[QUOTE=CollegeBound;4315058]My wife is a physio and she is adamant that one of the most common causes today is people using grip sizes which are too small for them.

Agreed on that one...unless the player has a 'feathery' grip and doesn't clamp down on the handle. If anyone has a doubt, just look at the extensor attachment at your elbow when you clamp down on a very small grip vs a larger one. When those muscles and tendons work so hard just to hold the grip, they can't absorb as much as when they are more relaxed. YMMV of course.

On the other hand, the old days of stretching leather grips onto handles and stringing 15-20 rackets a day made for some pretty good cases of TE. Hitting fluffed up or damp tennis balls didn't help, either. Did anyone mention Tretorn pressureless? Now, I AM showing my age! :)

CollegeBound
01-25-2010, 09:50 AM
[QUOTE=CollegeBound;4315058]My wife is a physio and she is adamant that one of the most common causes today is people using grip sizes which are too small for them.

Agreed on that one...unless the player has a 'feathery' grip and doesn't clamp down on the handle. If anyone has a doubt, just look at the extensor attachment at your elbow when you clamp down on a very small grip vs a larger one. When those muscles and tendons work so hard just to hold the grip, they can't absorb as much as when they are more relaxed. YMMV of course.

Did anyone mention Tretorn pressureless? Now, I AM showing my age! :)

Feathery grip or firm grip, it doesn't matter. The problem isn't caused by how tightly you grip the racquet (that's something else altogether) but because the small grips (combined with the light weight racquets) allow and encourage people to use a lot more wrist and forearm in their shot. Even players who are well-trained and hitting on a regular basis can have injuries but people who only hit once or twice a week are far more likely to do damage. My wife is of the opinion that if those people increased the frequency of their tennis we'd actually be seeing more injuries. Having a few days break between hits allows the tendons to relax. The less time they have to relax the quicker the path to injury.

A secondary problem she's seeing a lot of is 'carpel tunnel' injuries. Now that one is very much related to how tight you grip your racquet.


Doesn't show your age at all. Tretorn still make pressureless tennis balls and were recently sponsoring the Challenger tour.

vwfye
01-25-2010, 10:42 AM
i actually have my players use the biggest grip they can stand. it allows for a relaxed grip that in turn allows twitch muscles to... well... twitch.

jimanuel12
01-25-2010, 10:57 AM
i actually have my players use the biggest grip they can stand. it allows for a relaxed grip that in turn allows twitch muscles to... well... twitch.

according to guts and glory tennis, the major casues of TE are:

grip size too small
heavy head - light weight rackets - anything under 11 oz
stiffness rating above 65
string tension too tight

all of these factors add to the TE injury and yes, i agree that grip size too small cannot help.
i used a wilson hyper hammer with a smaller grip size than i was used to using and i developed THE worst case of TE i have ever had, still not healed 100% and it has been 7 months.

the new powerful rackets are fun to hit with but they caused me all kinds of TE problems. i wish i had never seen the wilson hyper hammer.

coachrick
01-25-2010, 11:59 AM
[QUOTE=coachrick;4316058]

Doesn't show your age at all. Tretorn still make pressureless tennis balls and were recently sponsoring the Challenger tour.

Yeah, but we were actually crazy enough to USE them! (and their Slazenger counterparts)...back in the old days.

jimanuel12
01-25-2010, 12:53 PM
If you read my other posts(like the one I just left in the Former Pro Player dept. re: Roy Emerson), you can be certain that I qualify for the 'double nickel' club...plenty old if you ask me. I came along just in time for the 'boom' of the 70s. Plenty of wood sticks but since I worked in a tennis specialty shop, I got to try out just about everything! We also had to figure out how to string them!

I'm a little amused when posters refer to the POG(Prince Original Graphite) in 90 or mid. NO...the Prince ORIGINAL Graphite was only oversize...stayed that way for a few years.

I'm also amused when threads discussing 'classic' rackets go ALL THE WAY BACK to the late 90s or even more recent models. These young whippersnappers don't know 'classic'. Why, I'll show them 'classic' by golly!!! :) j/k and all that, y'all!

A BIG AMEN TO THAT!!!!
i thought a classic was the old woodies????

PBODY99
01-25-2010, 04:22 PM
Four Tretorns every two weeks was what my meger funds could stand in the 1960's. Despite having a slight frmae with small joints, I never had tennis elbow, even using the Hyper Hammers in various large head sizes, for this I thank my college coach Nelson Phillips.
That siad, I have moved towards a slightly headlight balance in my super stiff Prince Speedport Golds, so they swing like my last Wilson Cliff Richey Ultra (Med 4 5/8) in my hands.

SVP
01-25-2010, 05:34 PM
[QUOTE=CollegeBound;4324045]

Yeah, but we were actually crazy enough to USE them! (and their Slazenger counterparts)...back in the old days.

Hitting tretorns fooled me into thinking I was a good tennis player.

Did you ever use the old tennis ball pumper contraption? You could re-use your tennis balls for months by constantly pumping them up, and they'd still maintain their bounce, even when they were worn down to the size of a handball. Ever drink water out of the old metal tennis ball cans during water breaks on the tennis court? Ah, the good ol' days!

coachrick
01-25-2010, 07:11 PM
That siad, I have moved towards a slightly headlight balance in my super stiff Prince Speedport Golds, so they swing like my last Wilson Cliff Richey Ultra (Med 4 5/8) in my hands.

I can't tell you how many times I thought to start a post with 'you want heavy? I'll show you a Cliff Richey Ultra that'll make your arm sweat just looking at it!' What a beast of a racket. We had a couple of customers who liked it because you could scrape it on the court more times before it would wear down!

coachrick
01-25-2010, 07:22 PM
[QUOTE=coachrick;4324573]

Hitting tretorns fooled me into thinking I was a good tennis player.

Did you ever use the old tennis ball pumper contraption? You could re-use your tennis balls for months by constantly pumping them up, and they'd still maintain their bounce, even when they were worn down to the size of a handball. Ever drink water out of the old metal tennis ball cans during water breaks on the tennis court? Ah, the good ol' days!

Ha! Never used but SOLD a ton of the Ball Savers. Remember the Slazenger box of four from Sears...with a little carrying handle on the box! Remember when Borg got in all sorts of trouble with Bancroft/Tretorn because he refused to play a tournament using the Tretorn Pressureless ball.

I gave the salesman for the plastic ball cans the contact info at Dunlop/Hartwell, GA ball factory. Easiest sale he ever made. In Atlanta, it took about two weeks before everyone knew that balls still sold in the metal cans were the 'OLD' balls!

We would sneak in an old bald pressureless ball from time to time during fun matches. Sounded like you were hitting with metal strings! Especially fun on damp courts! Ah, memories!

retrowagen
01-25-2010, 08:46 PM
Those pressureless balls had their place. Great to keep in a ball machine. Also great for damp weather practice. Also great for growing mildew in the ball machine after damp weather practice!

vwfye
01-25-2010, 09:20 PM
I didn't know the Borg were in the 60s! I thought they were from Star Trek Next Generation?



I am joking! I remember drinking out of metal cans. I still do it with plastic even though people tell me it can kill me.

jimanuel12
01-26-2010, 05:40 AM
[QUOTE=coachrick;4324573]

Hitting tretorns fooled me into thinking I was a good tennis player.

Did you ever use the old tennis ball pumper contraption? You could re-use your tennis balls for months by constantly pumping them up, and they'd still maintain their bounce, even when they were worn down to the size of a handball. Ever drink water out of the old metal tennis ball cans during water breaks on the tennis court? Ah, the good ol' days!

yes, it was good water, yeah???
anyway, i found some old metal can tennis balls at a yard sale, never been opened - got 3 cans for $1.00 - what a deal!!!!

SVP
01-26-2010, 02:23 PM
[QUOTE=SVP;4325847]

yes, it was good water, yeah???
anyway, i found some old metal can tennis balls at a yard sale, never been opened - got 3 cans for $1.00 - what a deal!!!!

I'm wondering, why would the cans never have been opened?

Secondarily, what would they smell like if you opened them now?

Let's start an old fogeys thread- memories of what it was like to play in the old days. We have the technology to go back that far. Start from the 70s, go back to the 60s, even the 50s if there's anyone around from that time. Maybe even the 40s, you never know. Who wants to talk about the "nuthugger" shorts from the 70s?

jimanuel12
01-27-2010, 06:42 AM
[QUOTE=jimanuel12;4329519]

I'm wondering, why would the cans never have been opened?

Secondarily, what would they smell like if you opened them now?

Let's start an old fogeys thread- memories of what it was like to play in the old days. We have the technology to go back that far. Start from the 70s, go back to the 60s, even the 50s if there's anyone around from that time. Maybe even the 40s, you never know. Who wants to talk about the "nuthugger" shorts from the 70s?

i remember when i first tried to play, i was in high school, had never hit a tennis ball.
my girlfriend, sandy, got me to play. we only had one court in our town at the time, back in the late 60's. no one played tennis, the court was always open.
we had the old woodie rackets, the canvas tennies shoes and the little white shorts, man i was cool!!!!
sandy had the long hair tied back in a ponytail.

when i got to college, we used to play until we could not move, play for hours and hours, but i was young back then.
i was in college when the T2000 came out but could not afford one at that time.
finally bought one later when i got out of school and got a job then moved up to the T3000, man what a racket, such power but it really sucked, the sweet spot was too small.
man, those were the days!!!
even played on a clay court in Georgia one time.

khw72004
01-27-2010, 09:48 AM
I wouldn't consider myself an old timer.

Don't Let It Bounce
01-27-2010, 05:05 PM
...so they swing like my last Wilson Cliff Richey Ultra (Med 4 5/8) in my hands.I'm such an old-timer I remember the only British pop star to ever get a racquet named after him. :lol:

But not as fondly as I remember knees that didn't hurt no matter how long I played.

retrowagen
01-27-2010, 05:47 PM
I'm such an old-timer I remember the only British pop star to ever get a racquet named after him. :lol:

But not as fondly as I remember knees that didn't hurt no matter how long I played.

Cliff Richey? Pop star?? You mean Cliff Richard, right? LOL (maybe you ARE old!)

Don't Let It Bounce
01-28-2010, 02:59 PM
Cliff Richey? Pop star?? You mean Cliff Richard, right? LOL (maybe you ARE old!)Heh. In truth, Cliff Richard was a little before my time. He only sticks in my memory well enough to make a (weak) joke about him because he did a post-prime duet with Olivia Neutron-Bomb*, on whom I had a wicked junior high crush!

* Prettier than a Wilson Advantage, and that there's high praise, boys.

Yaz
02-08-2010, 11:43 AM
[QUOTE=coachrick;4324573]

Ever drink water out of the old metal tennis ball cans during water breaks on the tennis court? Ah, the good ol' days!

Hilarious - hate to admit that I did this too...nothing like metallic tasting water with a little ball fuzz mixed in!