The Pushers are killing me

[C_Smith]

i can take a 4.5 player to three sets, but i can't beat the 3.0 kids who slice it back. Its driving me crazy! I hit a good topspin forehand, and they slice it back, i hit that back, another slice, slice slice slice. he keeps the ball so low i can't topspin it, and short bouncing around the service line. Net game is the worst part of my game, so taking the net isn't highly effective. My high school coach is a moron, and all he says to me is "you lose because of unforced errors". I could "dink" the ball back and have twenty point rallies, but consistancy is this type of players game, i can't beat them at their best attribute. HELP ME!

[jon166]

Net game is the worst part of my game, so taking the net isn't highly effective.

The net game will destroy all of those "pushers." So why not improve that? Once you improve that, things will fall in to place. Don't sit back and try to improve the shots you are profecient at.

You said it your self, if your net game is the weakest, improve on that. I'm not in any position to tell you how to improve, but go ask your coach or refer to the threads of volleying. You can pick up great tipes from many people.

[Ken]

Your coach actually might be right. The pushers are trying to FORCE you to create errors, and practically live off the extra aggressive shots you have to take.

DON'T dink it back, stick with your strokes. But aim crosscourt maybe three times, and then down the line. While keeping the same pace, don't go for outright winners every shot. If the pusher produces a short ball, put it away.

On a low ball, if you're good at it, SLICE IT BACK. Take them out of their comfort zone on balls, do a drop shot if you can. Most of the time, these pushers will be bad at the net themselves. If you can, blast a ball STRAIGHT at their face. It's enjoyable for you, and it destroys their confidence and will to get to the net. Which makes your drop shots all the more effective.

[TwistServe]

I find it hard to beleive. If you can beat a real "4.5" player, then you can take out short balls in any direction... Pushers will always end up throwing a short ball, and no pusher can push back a short ball if you PUT IT AWAY!

Also, if you're beating 4.5 players, then you must be 4.5 yourself. According to the definition of 4.5, you should be able to putaway floaters/slices with your net game.

[Ken]

As TwistServe said, ALL players tend to overrate their game. After the first time reading through the USTA'S NTRP guide a while ago, I believed I was at LEAST a 4.5. After asking an experienced pro, it turns out I was only between 3.0 and 3.5. That's a big difference.

On my school's varsity team, I'm lucky enough to see a lot of variation. Most of the players are firm 4.5s. Most of these players can keep all their strokes deep, have some to plenty of pace, and can all play percentage tennis. Every single one of them can move up to the net and produce consistent volleys, and will put away any floaters/short balls.

We also have one 5.0s (nationally ranked, been playing since they were four), and a 5.5. Both of these players are EXTREMELY good, and the 5.5 is fully sponsored by Yonex right now. He's a freshman. He's not even 15 yet, but he's playing in the 18 and under category. His two losses this year are to an awesome S+Ver, and this guy named Jason Jung, who's 15th in the 16 and unders nationally.

While I got off topic, I mean to say that EVERY single .5 is a huge difference on the court. You may be much lower than you think. I'm barely over a 3.5 myself, as of now.

You seem maybe a 3.5. I can tell you for sure you won't move up until you're able to consistently beat pushers as consistently as they can push the ball back. They're a good exercise.

[nViATi]

i can take a 4.5 player to three sets, but i can't beat the 3.0 kids who slice it back. Its driving me crazy! I hit a good topspin forehand, and they slice it back, i hit that back, another slice, slice slice slice. he keeps the ball so low i can't topspin it, and short bouncing around the service line. Net game is the worst part of my game, so taking the net isn't highly effective. My high school coach is a moron, and all he says to me is "you lose because of unforced errors". I could "dink" the ball back and have twenty point rallies, but consistancy is this type of players game, i can't beat them at their best attribute. HELP ME!
your coach is not a moron. YOU are the moron. he is 100% correct. just slow down your stroke a bit and be more consistent. practice hitting deeper and with a bit less pace

[Marius_Hancu]

search
http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/search.php?
keyword: pusher
Search Titles Only
lots of good threads, READ.

[montx]

If I have over stated my 3.0-3.5 approximation, then I must be about a 1-2.0. But my coach thinks I am a 4.0. But I lose to slicers and dicer's a lot as well, so I think I am not as hot as a 4.0....I still think 3.0-3.5 is fair. I got some power, I got some consistency, always working on my technique, strategy and tactics.

I recently played a guy who can dink, and he can go aggressive. My definition of an all rounder. That is my goal to play like him and to keep those power shots on reserve.

[Mies]

Well, I used to get in trouble against decent pushers whereas I played a much better game against people who'd also play with some pace themselves. For me, this was due to my extremely western forehand. I couldn't handle the slice balls on the forehand side and my stroke was very sensitive to little mishits. With such an extreme grip, they would either sink into the net or hit the back fence. I.o.w., against pushers, I didn't have the proper technique and as a result: my consistency suffered.

During this winter, I took up some lessens with a former ATP pro who immediately advised me to switch to a semi-western forehand. I did that, switched from a tweener to a Volkl tour 10 MP Gen II and now I smoke the pushers that used to give me a hard time. The key to this being that I can now consistently put away balls that sit-up between the serve and baselines and when you play a pusher, sooner or later he will hit a ball that sits-up.

The moral of the story being: I improved because I worked on my technique which improved my consistency considerably.

Most pushers don't have any real weapons themselves other than their consistency. A pusher never really wins from you, it's you losing to the pusher, if you understand what I'm saying :) ......

Regards,
Maurice

[Camilio Pascual]

If you can beat a real "4.5" player, then you can take out short balls in any direction...
Also, if you're beating 4.5 players, then you must be 4.5 yourself.

He didn't say he could BEAT 4.5 players, he said he can TAKE a 4.5 TO three sets.
I must be better than him, I can take a pro to three sets. LOL

[kevhen]

Are you taking a pro to 3 sets in a Grand Slam match? I think I could do that too if I could get a wildcard.

[Xevoius]

I had the very same problem.

The trick to beating these guys is taking the net. Force them to try and pass you. Do not over commit or they will go for the lob. Try coming in only to just about the service line and since they do not hit big, you should have plenty of time to take another step or two towards the net to get your volley. Since they do not see you as being close to the net, they will probably not go for the lob.

I had to play an amazing pusher in my last tournament that was totally fit and could run everything down. The only thing that got him were sharp angled volleys.

I am normally a baseliner but had to switch to another playstyle to win the match.

[Kaptain Karl]

C - This is a much better way to find a solution than your whiney thread in Rants & Raves. (Didn't get much sympathy over there, did you?)

Do the Search Marius recommends. There are LOTS of good tips for beating pushers.

Once you've mastered "The Pusher" you'll REALLY love the game. Keep working at it. Let us know how it's going in a few months.

Ken - I'd trade my whole team of HS boys to coach a team like yours. Here (Colorado) most HS boys range between 4.0 and 3.0. "Doooh!!!"

- KK

[anirut]

C - Just keep your head when things don't come your way. Think of your very basic strokes and mechanics and play them consistently. Don't rush.

Sorry, your coach is right. He was saying things like that to let you think.

Your opponents keep the balls so low that your can't top-spin? Try something else, then. Treat the shots as they deserve. Send your shots to where they should go at that moment. Topspin is not everything in tennis.

So, think of the basic grips and the basic strokes old school tennis. Drive the ball. Don't bash it.

[donnyz89]

I have the same problem with these pushers, though he didnt slice. and if he is actually slicing his way to a win, then they must be pretty good slices. but how is he winning? are u making the errors or is he hitting winners and force errors off you?

a couple tips. you cross court over the lower part of the net with top spin to his weaker side whether its forehand or backhand. keep doing it, i know u think u have to hit spetacular winners just because it seem like you are the better player but dont. these pushers are dangerous if u dont take them seriously. dont think u can win the point with a hard shot, at your level i doubt u can do that.

and hit some droppers, or dont go for much and just give him a short ball, and if he is just a slice and dicer, his shot wont be that intimidating and if u really aare as good as u say u are then get him to the net and see how good he is there.

another thing, hit BEHIND the player. meaning, dont always hit from left to right, because most pushers like to run down balls and at your level, its not that hard to run them down. also ANTICIPATE those short balls. KNOW they are coming and run up and finish the point. keep them deep, especially. not shot topspin shots that land on the service line, if anything push it deep to the corner. and go to the net, cover down the line and if they are good enough to hit a slice cross court passing winner, then he deserve that point. but DONT give him point, let him earn his points.

hope this helps.

[Ken]

Karl - LOL, thanks. Just watching the varsity team helps me, since I can look at/study all kinds of styles of play, shot combinations, strokes, etc. Just having a 5.0 or above sort of influences the whole team.

In Southern California though, it's kind of scary. There are just so many people that have talent AND experience. I've even seen Maria Sharapova in courts barely 10 minutes away from where I live, because Lansdorp is based around here. I tried, but it's pretty much impossible to get time with him. :D The Jack Kramer club (guess who made it) is even closer, and all the clubs in the area all have Sampras autographs since he played here, too.

...it's insane. ALL the schools have really good players. I've never played tennis anywhere else though, so I don't really know how good other areas are. You're welcome to come to SoCal if you want, LOL.


Um...as for the original poster, although I said it before, everyone's points are good. I'll sum it up, so it's easier:

The "pushers" are destroying your rhythm. If you can't dictate the pace yourself, I'd hold off on aiming for winners every point. Hit it to their weaker side, it doesn't necessarily have to be a great shot. Do what donny does, hit topspin to that side if you can. It'll produce weaker returns that you can put away.

If they're trying to destroy your game, destroy theirs. Hit drop shots. Hit varied balls. If you can't get into a rhythm, don't let them either. And I can guarantee you that most of the time doing this will get you back into yours as well.

[FiveO]

IMO the one commonality in all pushers is that they provide the opponent the opportunity to cut their own throat. The don't even provide the weapon, just the opportunity. Over and over. They really expose limitations in their opponent's games. Whether it be a lack of consistency, the inability transition from mid-court or point end at the net, it will get exposed.

Read the threads Marius suggested searching. They're good.

Two quick thoughts: One of the more error producing situations at the level you describe is trying to drastically up the mph's off your opponent's apparent duck. Put the 80 mph ego builders on hold, and try to maneuver the "pusher" completely out of position with 3/4 paced drives. Don't overhit.

Second: speed up to slow down. Players struggling w/ "pushers" get into the bad habit of slowing down their footwork, prep and set-up to the pace of their opponent's shots. Getting there "just in time". Players end up loping or worse, loafing to the ball. "Just in time" ain't good enough. It limits YOUR options and will usually result in letting your contact points drop below net height, further limiting YOUR options. Work harder on your footwork, prep and set-ups, emphasizing making earlier contact above net height, to improve accuracy and to allow you to dictate w/ those 3/4 paced balls. Move faster to give yourself more time to execute. It will also serve to keep your motivation up and maintain that level of relaxed excitement you want in order to perform at your best.

Good luck.

WHEN you beat and then dominate this type player THEN you will be a better player than him/her.

[C_Smith]

Hey guys thanks for all the help. I didn't mean to say i was a 4.5 player at all, i probably a 3.5 at best, i just wanted to try and show that i play much better when i play people who top spin, hit faster shots etc.

i got a match tommorrow, and since pushers seem to be the only kind of player at the Number 3 spots, im sure ill get to try out all your suggestions.

Thanks Alot!