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View Full Version : Federer losing motivation at Masters just as Sampras did after Wimbledon 2000


JennyS
04-01-2010, 06:36 AM
Here's how Sampras did in Masters events after he broke the all time Grand Slam record at Wimbledon in 2000:

2000:
Canada: lost in QF to 9 Safin
Cincinnati: lost in r16 to 16 Henman (made it to the US Open final a few weeks later)
skipped both fall Masters events


2001:
Indian Wells: lost in final to 4 Agassi
Miami: lost in R32 to 119 Roddick
Monte Carlo: did not play
Rome: lost in R64 to 54 Levy
Hamburg: lost in R64 to 50 Calatrava
Canada: Did not play
Cincinnati: lost in R32 to 38 Alberto Martin (made US Open final a few weeks later)

2002:
Indian Wells: lost in SF to 1 Hewitt
Miami: lost in R32 to 62 Gonzalez
Monte Carlo: did not play
Rome: lost in R64 to 45 Felix Mantilla
Hamburg: lost in R64 to 39 Mirnyi
Canada: lost in R16 to 3 Haas
Cincinnati: lost in R32 to 70 Arthurs (won US Open a few weeks later)

So Sampras made a Grand total of one Masters hardcourt final, yet made it to three US Open finals in that period of time. So loss of form at Masters events is normal at this stage in a career.

At this point, I won't be shocked to see Federer's ranking start to slip, but he'll be a favorite at every single Slam.

samprasvsfederer123
04-01-2010, 06:54 AM
in masters, but federer still has what it takes to win 6 times what sampras did win after wimby 2000, and thats 1 federer by the age of sampras won 14 will problabably have like 21

sampras sucked to a bigger extent in the masters and wasnt agassi still winning masters at this age, lendl too?

Rhino
04-01-2010, 12:27 PM
I don't think Federer has lost motivation. He still looked very motivated against Berdych and Baghdatis, with his "come ons" etc, it's just that the margin for error is less during best of three.
Keep in mind, whenever Federer is trailing two sets to one in a major, that would've meant elimination in a Masters. For example vs Haas at the French.

rk_sports
04-01-2010, 05:25 PM
I don't think Federer has lost motivation. He still looked very motivated against Berdych and Baghdatis, with his "come ons" etc, it's just that the margin for error is less during best of three.
Keep in mind, whenever Federer is trailing two sets to one in a major, that would've meant elimination in a Masters. For example vs Haas at the French.

Good point... but it does look like he is not as 'focused' in non-GS events .. my 2 cents

moist
04-01-2010, 05:56 PM
I also think other players have an easier time playing loose at smaller events. Beating Roger at a slam is a much bigger deal, and not many players have that champion's mental toughness for the big stage.

davey25
04-01-2010, 06:09 PM
I think the Sampras comparision is a good way. He became much less urgent and hungry in Masters events starting in 98 but in slams he still was the guy to beat.

davey25
04-01-2010, 06:11 PM
I don't think Federer has lost motivation. He still looked very motivated against Berdych and Baghdatis, with his "come ons" etc, it's just that the margin for error is less during best of three.
Keep in mind, whenever Federer is trailing two sets to one in a major, that would've meant elimination in a Masters. For example vs Haas at the French.

I watched those matches and he didnt look motivated at all to me. Serena also does "come ons" when she plays Brisbane for example but I dont sense she is that hungry there all the same.

Your point about the majors format is good, but there is no saying Federer would lose 2 of the first 3 sets in all of those matches if he went in knowing they were best of 3 vs best of 5. He never should have lost the 1st set to Haas at the French for example, and if it were best of 3 probably would have focused harder on the 1st set tiebreak, or pushed harder to break considering he didnt lose a service point all set until the few unforced errors on his serve points in the tiebreak.

dwhiteside
04-01-2010, 06:22 PM
Frankly, it's only April. It's too soon to tell. Federer is not Sampras and Sampras is not Federer. There was no one like Federer and so who's to say Federer will obey past trends. We'll just have to wait and see. It's a possibility, but it's obviously far too soon to tell. Federer lost plenty of Master's when he was younger and in his prime as well (2004-2006 or so, although one might argue he's still in his prime today based on his continuing GS results).

davey25
04-01-2010, 06:26 PM
Frankly, it's only April. It's too soon to tell.

You call it soon to tell but Federer has won only 2 Masters since August of 2007. In Masters since then he has lost to a series of mediocre opponents, not just a few. So I wouldnt say it is too soon to tell. It is already quite evident.

dwhiteside
04-01-2010, 06:39 PM
His losses at the Masters events to lower ranked players are fact. Whether or not they're because he doesn't have motivation or doesn't try at Masters is opinion.

JennyS
04-01-2010, 07:54 PM
Well regardless of his lesser form in Masters than Slams, only three players have more match wins in Masters events than Fed since 2008:

Nadal: 74 (possibly 76 after Miami)
Djokovic: 60
Murray: 50
Federer 49

abraxas21
04-01-2010, 09:43 PM
Fed's decline in the MS started long before he broke Sampras' record... Furthermore, I don't think he's lost his motivation. Against Tomas he look really motivated at least.

Rhino
04-01-2010, 09:45 PM
Just in '08 and '09, here are four examples of matches in majors that Federer would have lost, had it have been best of three:

vs Haas, Roland Garros 2009, Federer trailed 6-7(4), 5-7

vs Del Potro Roland Garros 2009, Federer trailed 3-6, 7-6(2), 2-6

vs Berdych, Australian Open 2009, Federer trailed 4-6, 6-7(4)

vs Tipsarevic Australian Open 2008, Federer trailed 6-7 (5-7), 7-6 (7-1), 5-7