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SLD76
05-23-2010, 11:26 AM
Is it a trick of the television, or do they seem to playing quick so far?

joeri888
05-23-2010, 11:27 AM
Is it a trick of the television, or do they seem to playing quick so far?

It's hot, and last year they were quicker too.

I'm hoping for a hot two weeks, with no watering of the courts. I like the sliding and the point construction, but serve should be a shot worth having and camping in the first row isn't what I like, so I like Madrid type of courts, but not the 'old' RG ones.

drakulie
05-23-2010, 11:27 AM
they look slow

Mortifier
05-23-2010, 11:56 AM
The centercourt seems much slower than the second biggest one. Don't know their names though. Just what it looked like to me, but it can have something to do with cameraangles, lenses and the distance aswell.

West Coast Ace
05-23-2010, 11:59 AM
Cahill said the balls are 'of a higher compression' and thus it's playing fast. And it usually is fast when it's warm - it is today and Tues - cool weather on the way:

http://weather.cnn.com/weather/forecast.jsp?locCode=FRXX0076&zipCode=433858208652

drakulie
05-23-2010, 01:01 PM
the balls look slow too.

Gorecki
05-23-2010, 01:09 PM
ball boys look very fast...

Puredrivetennis
05-23-2010, 01:10 PM
playing super fast with the weather-- courts look very dry and dusty.. will slow down with rain and temp drop

Al Czervik
05-23-2010, 01:13 PM
There is a camp which says hot and dry bakes the clay and allows the ball to kick up higher.

drakulie
05-23-2010, 01:15 PM
ball boys look very fast...

yes. good observation. also, the commercial breaks are faster this year than last year.

bolo
05-23-2010, 01:30 PM
Seems fair, not too fast not too slow. Reminds me of the 08 final speed.

Gorecki
05-23-2010, 01:33 PM
yes. good observation. also, the commercial breaks are faster this year than last year.

people at the stands are taking their seats a lot faster, and the ingestion of croissants seems on pair with last year speed wise!

P_Agony
05-23-2010, 01:37 PM
I hope it's fast enough to give other players some chances at going far and maybe winning the thing.

drakulie
05-23-2010, 01:50 PM
people at the stands are taking their seats a lot faster, and the ingestion of croissants seems on pair with last year speed wise!


yes. Agree. I wonder if the stringers are slower or faster?? anyone have any inside information??

Halba
05-23-2010, 01:54 PM
I hope it's fast enough to give other players some chances at going far and maybe winning the thing.

i think cool weather will spoil it later. anyhow it is certainly quicker than previous years. maybe 2008 speed.

Pwned
05-23-2010, 01:55 PM
yes. Agree. I wonder if the stringers are slower or faster?? anyone have any inside information??

They're using crank stringing machines so they are a bit slower unfortunately...

Puredrivetennis
05-23-2010, 05:16 PM
Whats weather outlook for paris? I bet itll cool off and slow up the courts... Thats when we'll see some reallll crazy matches

vortex1
05-23-2010, 05:22 PM
Whats weather outlook for paris? I bet itll cool off and slow up the courts... Thats when we'll see some reallll crazy matches

Rain is predicted starting from wednesday, followed by cool, cloudy weather. (down to ~18C from current 25-26C)

Bryan Swartz
05-23-2010, 06:18 PM
The effect of clay on serving is greatly overestimated in the minds of both. There's never been a surface on which a big serve wasn't effective. It literally only takes off a couple mph(i.e., serving 126 at RG is as effective as 124 on a fast court).

Puredrivetennis
05-23-2010, 08:31 PM
should make for more interesting tennis.

slicefox
05-23-2010, 08:37 PM
should make for more interesting tennis.

should give pushers free rides into 2nd week

Puredrivetennis
05-23-2010, 08:41 PM
a W is a W

jamesblakefan#1
05-23-2010, 08:44 PM
PARIS (AP)—At nearly 6 feet, 5 inches, the big-serving Marin Cilic poses more of a threat on grass and hard courts. But the 10th-seeded Croat is finding the current conditions at Roland Garros may suit his game.

Cilic beat Ricardo Mello of Brazil 6-1, 3-6, 6-3, 6-1 in the first round of the French Open on Sunday.

“It was pretty hot and the ball was bouncing,” Cilic said. “And I think it was pretty similar to last year. Compared to these other tournaments on clay, I think here (it) is a bit faster as the balls are pretty quick.”

http://sports.yahoo.com/tennis/news?slug=ap-frenchopen-notebook

http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/b1/fullj.efb8ca9fa043acf9449341185d17a9f4/efb8ca9fa043acf9449341185d17a9f4-getty-tennis-fra-open-roland-garros.jpg

dmt
05-23-2010, 08:51 PM
i think there is going to be rain soon.

nadal era
05-23-2010, 09:20 PM
this is definitely to make nadal lose.
how amazing is that, they had to change an entire tournament to make one player lose.
does this show the greatness of nadal?

the courts are faster than wimbledon and the aussie open.
no question about it.

Puredrivetennis
05-23-2010, 09:22 PM
this is definitely to make nadal lose.
how amazing is that, they had to change an entire tournament to make one player lose.
does this show the greatness of nadal?

the courts are faster than wimbledon and the aussie open.
no question about it.

get out. :lol:

aprilfool
05-23-2010, 09:53 PM
Hope you all enjoy the French.

Lotto
05-23-2010, 10:48 PM
this is definitely to make nadal lose.
how amazing is that, they had to change an entire tournament to make one player lose.
does this show the greatness of nadal?

the courts are faster than wimbledon and the aussie open.
no question about it.


Well look what they're doing at Wimbledon to Federer but that's not affecting him eventhough it should be benefitting Nadal :D

Gorecki
05-23-2010, 11:27 PM
yes. Agree. I wonder if the stringers are slower or faster?? anyone have any inside information??

Slower i was told... i suspect its part of the French agenda!

Gen
05-24-2010, 02:38 AM
Well look what they're doing at Wimbledon to Federer but that's not affecting him eventhough it should be benefitting Nadal :D

They have been doing nothing to Federer in Wimbledon. The grass was replaced in 2001, and Federer started winning it in 2003. He won all his Wimbleys playing on the "new" grass.

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 02:43 AM
PARIS (AP)—At nearly 6 feet, 5 inches, the big-serving Marin Cilic poses more of a threat on grass and hard courts. But the 10th-seeded Croat is finding the current conditions at Roland Garros may suit his game.

Cilic beat Ricardo Mello of Brazil 6-1, 3-6, 6-3, 6-1 in the first round of the French Open on Sunday.

“It was pretty hot and the ball was bouncing,” Cilic said. “And I think it was pretty similar to last year. Compared to these other tournaments on clay, I think here (it) is a bit faster as the balls are pretty quick.”

http://sports.yahoo.com/tennis/news?slug=ap-frenchopen-notebook

http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/b1/fullj.efb8ca9fa043acf9449341185d17a9f4/efb8ca9fa043acf9449341185d17a9f4-getty-tennis-fra-open-roland-garros.jpg

SO now we got it from a player. it´s even quicker than Madrid.Frenchtards are crazy to get Nadal to lose. NExt year, ice courts and 1 gram balls. FO open to become the quickest tourney on the tour. keep it up haters

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 02:48 AM
SO now we got it from a player. it´s even quicker than Madrid.Frenchtards are crazy to get Nadal to lose. NExt year, ice courts and 1 gram balls. FO open to become the quickest tourney on the tour. keep it up haters

not only that.. i heard that players will serve from a stool... darn french frogs...

they just cant stop hating on Poor Nadal... but nothing will stop us... "GO NADS"....

vortex1
05-24-2010, 02:50 AM
The weather is going to cool down drastically within the next few days. The courts will slow.

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 02:56 AM
even if you are a federer fan, i´m sure you will agree on this statement i found somewhere: "The courts playing like they are IMO completely take away the character of what makes clay court tennis, clay court tennis. It's basically like a hard court on clay now. I see enough hard court tennis throughout the year, and now since most clay court tournaments play pretty quick now, there is little variety with the courts, they all play pretty similar, all year around. Not impressive."

Halba
05-24-2010, 03:17 AM
SO now we got it from a player. it´s even quicker than Madrid.Frenchtards are crazy to get Nadal to lose. NExt year, ice courts and 1 gram balls. FO open to become the quickest tourney on the tour. keep it up haters

its as fast as an indoor court. soderking blew 46 winners only 14 errors yesterday. federer is icing it on centre 17 winner only 4 error, 77% first serve

its actually faster than AO and W. AO is the slowest court. W - the grass looks deadish so its slow.

the ball is flying in roland garros. i wouldn't back nadal

zagor
05-24-2010, 03:27 AM
even if you are a federer fan, i´m sure you will agree on this statement i found somewhere: "The courts playing like they are IMO completely take away the character of what makes clay court tennis, clay court tennis. It's basically like a hard court on clay now. I see enough hard court tennis throughout the year, and now since most clay court tournaments play pretty quick now, there is little variety with the courts, they all play pretty similar, all year around. Not impressive."

Even if you're a Nadal fan I'm sure you will agree on this statement:

Bring back the carpet as a surface and change Wimbledon and USO back to their 90s speeds.

If Wimbledon being won 99% from baseline for the last 6 years doesn't take away the character of what makes grass tennis grass tennis then I don't know what does.

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 03:32 AM
Even if you're a Nadal fan I'm sure you will agree on this statement:

Bring back the carpet as a surface and change Wimbledon and USO back to their 90s speeds.

If Wimbledon being won 99% from baseline for the last 6 years doesn't take away the character of what makes grass tennis grass tennis then I don't know what does.

you are just Hating on our Beloved Martir.... hater hater hater...


:)

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 03:35 AM
Even if you're a Nadal fan I'm sure you will agree on this statement:

Bring back the carpet as a surface and change Wimbledon and USO back to their 90s speeds.

If Wimbledon being won 99% from baseline for the last 6 years doesn't take away the character of what makes grass tennis grass tennis then I don't know what does.

Do you really enjoy watching people such as sampras or ivanisevic blasting aces for 2 hours rather than The stuff that Djoko, Nadal or Federer offer? Watch Indian wells or Australian open highlights, and you´ll see the best points ever. I´m sure you won´t find any sampras vs ivanisevic super points. I´m sick of the "bring back the carpet crap". We want rallies, crazy shots and stamina, players fighting hard and emotion. No more ace festivals please.

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 03:41 AM
Do you really enjoy watching people such as sampras or ivanisevic blasting aces for 2 hours rather than The stuff that Djoko, Nadal or Federer offer?

YES.


Watch Indian wells or Australian open highlights, and you´ll see the best points ever. I´m sure you won´t find any sampras vs ivanisevic super points. I´m sick of the "bring back the carpet crap". We want rallies, crazy shots and stamina, players fighting hard and emotion. No more ace festivals please.

YOU want.. not WE...

zagor
05-24-2010, 03:52 AM
you are just Hating on our Beloved Martir.... hater hater hater...


:)

Yeah I should just go back into my cave after trolling Jesus Raf like that.

Do you really enjoy watching people such as sampras or ivanisevic blasting aces for 2 hours rather than The stuff that Djoko, Nadal or Federer offer? Watch Indian wells or Australian open highlights, and you´ll see the best points ever. I´m sure you won´t find any sampras vs ivanisevic super points..

Goran is my favourite player of all time after Fed so yes i did enjoy watching his game.Oh and watching Nadal hit 99% shots to Fed's BH for 5 hours is loads of fun.

I´m sick of the "bring back the carpet crap".

Good for you.

We want rallies, crazy shots and stamina, players fighting hard and emotion. No more ace festivals please.

Who's we exactly?

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 04:04 AM
Yeah I should just go back into my cave after trolling Jesus Raf like that.



Goran is my favourite player of all time after Fed so yes i did enjoy watching his game.Oh and watching Nadal hit 99% shots to Fed's BH for 5 hours is loads of fun.



Good for you.



Who's we exactly?


alright, i guess that´s a matter of taste. Anyway, i don´t think the tv ratings support your theory. People love watching federer, nadal and djoko.The majority of tennis fans go to youtube and watch federer-hewitt rally, verdasco-nadal rally or federer-nadal 08 WB final, you will agree, right? Nobody gives a damn about karlovic or isner. That´s more like olympic shooting, not enjoyble tennis. Maybe for you it is, but not for the average tennis fan i know

zagor
05-24-2010, 04:10 AM
alright, i guess that´s a matter of taste. Anyway, i don´t think the tv ratings support your theory. People love watching federer, nadal and djoko.The majority of tennis fans go to youtube and watch federer-hewitt rally, verdasco-nadal rally or federer-nadal 08 WB final, you will agree, right? Nobody gives a damn about karlovic or isner. That´s more like olympic shooting, not enjoyble tennis. Maybe for you it is, but not for the average tennis fan i know

Yes it is a matter of taste,however where did I mention I like Karlovic and Isner?

Pocky
05-24-2010, 04:20 AM
They're using crank stringing machines so they are a bit slower unfortunately...

i saw them using tecnifibre electronic stringing machines

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 04:26 AM
i saw them using tecnifibre electronic stringing machines

those french... using tecnifibre... jeeezzz. they just cant stop hating on Nadal!

Pocky
05-24-2010, 05:09 AM
do you think they will use babolat stringers from next year onwards since babolat will be sponsoring the balls?

drakulie
05-24-2010, 05:13 AM
Looks like the water hose pressure has been sped up this year:

http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/b1/fullj.efb8ca9fa043acf9449341185d17a9f4/efb8ca9fa043acf9449341185d17a9f4-getty-tennis-fra-open-roland-garros.jpg

joeri888
05-24-2010, 05:31 AM
Cut the watering. I dislike the unity of surfaces, but when it comes to the second sunday of the French Open, it can't be too quick for me. I despise most of the Federer-Nadal matches on clay, because it's just about making the other player play below his level, especially for Nadal.

I don't agree slower is better either. Guys like Isner and Karlovic should stand a chance, but of course not necessarily on clay. Clay can be really slow, but than the grasscourts at Wimbledon should be speeding up again too.

Totai
05-24-2010, 06:06 AM
Looks like the water hose pressure has been sped up this year:

http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/b1/fullj.efb8ca9fa043acf9449341185d17a9f4/efb8ca9fa043acf9449341185d17a9f4-getty-tennis-fra-open-roland-garros.jpg

Thats a good observation, however, I regret to inform you that the water pressure was actually slowed down this year to match the speed of stringing. It only looks faster due to the camera angle.

drakulie
05-24-2010, 07:09 AM
^^^Ahh, very true.

Does anyone have a different angle of the courts being watered down???

ksbh
05-24-2010, 07:16 AM
Nadal/Federer over Sampras/Ivanisevic any time! And I say this despite being a huge admirer of both those former greats.

How many incredible matches have the current World's top 2 given us? More than I could have predicted when their rivalry started. Hopefully it'll be another incredible final between them come second Sunday of the FO!

Do you really enjoy watching people such as sampras or ivanisevic blasting aces for 2 hours rather than The stuff that Djoko, Nadal or Federer offer?

Omega_7000
05-24-2010, 07:32 AM
Wow you guys have some amazing eyes if you can figure out the speed of these courts just by looking at your television sets...

drakulie
05-24-2010, 07:35 AM
The lines to get into the courts have been sped up this year as well:

http://parisparfait.typepad.com/paris_parfait/images/pict0094.jpg

sureshs
05-24-2010, 07:43 AM
Is it a trick of the television, or do they seem to playing quick so far?

Isner was asked this by Bill Macatee (Tennis Channel) and he said they were to his liking (meaning they facilitated his fast serves) and only a little slower than hard courts. So, yes, it has been confirmed that they are playing fast.

vandre
05-24-2010, 07:45 AM
^^^Ahh, very true.

Does anyone have a different angle of the courts being watered down???

no, but if you gimme some time, i may be able to get a satellite view of the courts being watered.

vandre
05-24-2010, 07:46 AM
Slower i was told... i suspect its part of the French agenda!

someone should tell them the germans are invading. see if that speeds them up! :twisted:

CMM
05-24-2010, 07:49 AM
Frenchtards are crazy to get Nadal to lose.

He'll play his first match on Suzanne Lenglen. That's ridiculous. Roddick will play on Philippe Chatrier. :mad:

jamesblakefan#1
05-24-2010, 08:24 AM
even if you are a federer fan, i´m sure you will agree on this statement i found somewhere: "The courts playing like they are IMO completely take away the character of what makes clay court tennis, clay court tennis. It's basically like a hard court on clay now. I see enough hard court tennis throughout the year, and now since most clay court tournaments play pretty quick now, there is little variety with the courts, they all play pretty similar, all year around. Not impressive."

The heat is making the courts play quicker, just like HC and grass play faster when it's hot, same w/ clay. There is no grand conspiracy to keep Nadal from the FO title.

drakulie
05-24-2010, 08:31 AM
The ball boys at the French this year have been training to be much faster this year, in order to suit the growing demands of the "faster theme".

http://www.paris-photos.org/photos/roland-garros-tennis-balls-boys.jpg

TMF
05-24-2010, 08:38 AM
I hope the court will play as fast as last year b/c more players can play better. Too slow only benefit clay court specialists, which there’s only a few out there.

TMF
05-24-2010, 08:43 AM
even if you are a federer fan, i´m sure you will agree on this statement i found somewhere: "The courts playing like they are IMO completely take away the character of what makes clay court tennis, clay court tennis. It's basically like a hard court on clay now. I see enough hard court tennis throughout the year, and now since most clay court tournaments play pretty quick now, there is little variety with the courts, they all play pretty similar, all year around. Not impressive."

You are say this is a disadvantage for cc specialists including rafa? I didn’t hear any complaint about rafa fans when they slow down SW19 and plus the new grass permits the ball bounce higher.

Deal with it...you can’t have everything your way.

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 08:53 AM
http://blogs.reuters.com/sport/files/2009/06/rtr24bew3umpires.jpg

the umpires and judges are checking marks at lightning fast speed...

drakulie
05-24-2010, 08:57 AM
^^LOL. I noticed that too.

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 09:21 AM
The heat is making the courts play quicker, just like HC and grass play faster when it's hot, same w/ clay. There is no grand conspiracy to keep Nadal from the FO title.

it´s been discussed before. You´re right that the heat has something to do, but, regardless the heat, all the pros are stating that the balls and the courts are quicker. 3-4 years ago it was even hotter and nobody said that the courts were playing like HC (Isner has said something along those lines). So, yes, there´a conspiracy or at leat some hating involved. Plus, they have just sent Nadal to Lenglen court for tomorrow.

jamesblakefan#1
05-24-2010, 09:45 AM
3-4 years ago it was even hotter and nobody said that the courts were playing like HC

Well that's because Nadal was winning and all the Nadal fans were happy, no? Now that Nadal loses at RG last year, it has to be some sort of grand conspiracy.

Tina
05-24-2010, 09:48 AM
Love to go to Paris not only for Honeymoon and Tennis one day.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 09:48 AM
I don't remember clay courts sounding like basketball courts when players would run on them...maybe I am just forgetting. But I am hearing squeaks whenever guys change direction, it sounds exactly like running on a basketball court, or on asphalt (or hard courts really).

When I've played on clay, you hear a shuffle, like you're running on dirt. That's how I remember previous years sounding as well (didn't watch much last year, its just generally too early), but today...it was definitely loud squeaks.

Blinkism
05-24-2010, 09:48 AM
I've heard the rotation of the earth's axis has been sped up, as well, by the French Open organizers (obviously, to throw Nadal off).

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 09:50 AM
Well that's because Nadal was winning and all the Nadal fans were happy, no? Now that Nadal loses at RG last year, it has to be some sort of grand conspiracy.

or maybe that´s because, as i said, the courts and balls are quicker now. Look, go on youtube and check 2007-2008 matches and 2009 matches. Compare the rallies and you will appreciate easily the differences in term of speed

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 10:06 AM
So no one else has noticed how the players sound when moving on the courts this year vs. past years?

Totai
05-24-2010, 10:34 AM
So no one else has noticed how the players sound when moving on the courts this year vs. past years?

sounded normal to me

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 10:35 AM
sounded normal to me

Well watch Gasquet vs. Murray highlights at least. Whenever they are available.

jamesblakefan#1
05-24-2010, 10:49 AM
Well watch Gasquet vs. Murray highlights at least. Whenever they are available.

I certainly didn't hear any squeaking. Sounds nothing like a hard court TBH.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 10:51 AM
I certainly didn't hear any squeaking. Sounds nothing like a hard court TBH.

Then you're not watching the match. Just go watch the match, you can't really deny reality here.

The courts were squeaking under their feet like an indoor basketball or hard court. I was listening with headphones on and it's clear as a bell. 100% and impossible to deny really.

Cyan
05-24-2010, 10:55 AM
Roland Garros is reddish hardcourts now. Ludicrous.

CMM
05-24-2010, 10:59 AM
http://twitter.com/bgtennisnation

Brad Gilbert:
guys are saying the courts are playing much quicker & balls are not fluffing up like they usually do. should give US men hope

Cyan
05-24-2010, 11:00 AM
Isner was asked this by Bill Macatee (Tennis Channel) and he said they were to his liking (meaning they facilitated his fast serves) and only a little slower than hard courts. So, yes, it has been confirmed that they are playing fast.


Cut the watering. I dislike the unity of surfaces, but when it comes to the second sunday of the French Open, it can't be too quick for me. I despise most of the Federer-Nadal matches on clay, because it's just about making the other player play below his level, especially for Nadal.

I don't agree slower is better either. Guys like Isner and Karlovic should stand a chance, but of course not necessarily on clay. Clay can be really slow, but than the grasscourts at Wimbledon should be speeding up again too.

I hope the court will play as fast as last year b/c more players can play better. Too slow only benefit clay court specialists, which there’s only a few out there.

http://twitter.com/bgtennisnation

Brad Gilbert:

guys are saying the courts are playing much quicker & balls are not fluffing up like they usually do. should give US men hope







Yeah so Fed can win the CYGS and bore us to sleep with his domination of slam tennis.. :oops:

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:01 AM
http://twitter.com/bgtennisnation

Brad Gilbert:

Also, since when is high 80's considered "heat"? It gets over 100 here and I'm ready to go. I've played in 115 heat on red clay.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 11:03 AM
Yeah so Fed can win the CYGS and bore us to sleep with his domination of slam tennis.. :oops:Uhm..ever bothered to think about the weather today?
But then you're mostly engorssed in 'desparate jinxing' ( or whatever it is that you believe in) so I'm not surprised.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:03 AM
Yeah so Fed can win the CYGS and bore us to sleep with his domination of slam tennis.. :oops:

It's obviously not about tennis anymore...it's about making one guy win. Clay historically required the best fitness, and emphasized angles and point construction. Now we are back to bashing I guess.

vandre
05-24-2010, 11:04 AM
The ball boys at the French this year have been training to be much faster this year, in order to suit the growing demands of the "faster theme".

http://www.paris-photos.org/photos/roland-garros-tennis-balls-boys.jpg

maybe someone should test them for peds???? :twisted:

mandy01
05-24-2010, 11:06 AM
It's obviously not about tennis anymore...it's about making one guy win. Clay historically required the best fitness, and emphasized angles and point construction. Now we are back to bashing I guess.where was this when Nadal won Wimbledon and AO?
Oh yes...back then the Federer fans were making excuses.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:10 AM
where was this when Nadal won Wimbledon and AO?
Oh yes...back then the Federer fans were making excuses.

Except, the FO was the same until last year (after Federer got pasted I guess), and the courts at Wimbledon have been the same for years. What, do you think they were fast when Roddick made the finals, slowed down for Nadal, then magically sped up for Roddick again? Meanwhile Venus is still cleaning up at these Wimbledons, while sucking like usual at the French? None of that makes sense. Wimbledon, Like the FO requires great athleticism, that's why Federer and Nadal have done so well there. Play on the surfaces, you'll understand why.

It's not an excuse. It's just an obvious, marked, drastic change to the French Open starting with last year. Why would they do this? It seemed like you could even see the concrete on Lenglen when Murray and Gasquet were playing (and you could certainly hear it)

jamesblakefan#1
05-24-2010, 11:14 AM
I'm sorry but this is pure bs, plain is simple. I'm watching right now and there is NO squeaking when players slide, plain and simple. The courts are playing fast, but that's because of the conditions. Rain is supposed to be coming in the next few days, the courts will slow, and I guess this magical 'conspiracy' talk will all go away when Rafa wins (as he should) in 2 weeks. Or will RG count as a HC slam for Rafa now?

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:15 AM
I'm sorry but this is pure bs, plain is simple. I'm watching right now and there is NO squeaking when players slide, plain and simple. The courts are playing fast, but that's because of the conditions. Rain is supposed to be coming in the next few days, the courts will slow, and I guess this magical 'conspiracy' talk will all go away when Rafa wins (as he should) in 2 weeks. Or will RG count as a HC slam for Rafa now?

You're wrong dude. Wait until you see some of the Murray and Gasquet match highlights. Why would I make something like this up? Look at when they change directions not sliding.

I actually don't think Nadal will win this tournament, seeing how it's playing, but we will see. If Federer and Nadal make it to the final, Federer has a great chance.

zagor
05-24-2010, 11:15 AM
Except, the FO was the same until last year (after Federer got pasted I guess), and the courts at Wimbledon have been the same for years. What, do you think they were fast when Roddick made the finals, slowed down for Nadal, then magically sped up for Roddick again? Meanwhile Venus is still cleaning up at these Wimbledons, while sucking like usual at the French? None of that makes sense. Wimbledon, Like the FO requires great athleticism, that's why Federer and Nadal have done so well there. Play on the surfaces, you'll understand why.

It's not an excuse. It's just an obvious, marked, drastic change to the French Open starting with last year. Why would they do this? It seemed like you could even see the concrete on Lenglen when Murray and Gasquet were playing (and you could certainly hear it)

Given that they made drastic changes to both Wimbledon and USO it's only fair that they do the same to FO.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 11:16 AM
Except, the FO was the same until last year (after Federer got pasted I guess), and the courts at Wimbledon have been the same for years. What, do you think they were fast when Roddick made the finals, slowed down for Nadal, then magically sped up for Roddick again? Meanwhile Venus is still cleaning up at these Wimbledons, while sucking like usual at the French? None of that makes sense. Wimbledon, Like the FO requires great athleticism, that's why Federer and Nadal have done so well there. Play on the surfaces, you'll understand why.

It's not an excuse. It's just an obvious, marked, drastic change to the French Open starting with last year. Why would they do this? It seemed like you could even see the concrete on Lenglen when Murray and Gasquet were playing (and you could certainly hear it)
Interesting.Was the court magically slower in last year's final then?
REALLY QUIT the stupid conspiracy theories now.Even IF ( and that's still an IF since you've hardly proven anything here) the courts are faster I'd say it's only fair seeing that the other courts have been slowered down.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:17 AM
Given that they made drastic changes to both Wimbledon and USO it's only fair that they do the same to FO.

Wimbledon isn't that different, and it certainly hasn't changed since Federer was winning there. It's the same blend, and it still plays fast because of the low bounce. Remember, Venus is consistently successful here and she is a fast court player. You simply can't argue these facts.

How did the USO change? I thought it was lightning fast last year.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:18 AM
Interesting.Was the court magically slower in last year's final then?
REALLY QUIT the stupid conspiracy theories now.Even IF ( and that's still an IF since you've hardly proven anything here) the courts are faster I'd say it's only fair seeing that the other courts have been slowered down.

It's not a conspiracy theory, and refrain from using the word stupid I would ask. The only thing "stupid" is not using your God given eyes and brain to watch tennis. What are you talking about in regards to last years final? Which final, Wimbledon or the French? The French was faster last year. Wimbledon was the same as usual. I think that point is fairly clear.

Which courts are "slowered" down again? Look at Brad Gilbert's twitter account by the way. He is talking about how FAST the courts are. So...it's not a conspiracy theory, just observations about the tournament.

zagor
05-24-2010, 11:19 AM
It's obviously not about tennis anymore...it's about making one guy win. Clay historically required the best fitness, and emphasized angles and point construction. Now we are back to bashing I guess.

Great,ridiculous conspiracy theories again,put your tin foil hat on.

If Federer and Nadal make it to the final, Federer has a great chance.

LMAO,great sense of humour.Fed has about 5-10% chance if both him and Nadal make it to the final and even that's probably generous.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 11:20 AM
Wimbledon isn't that different, and it certainly hasn't changed since Federer was winning there. It's the same blend, and it still plays fast because of the low bounce. Remember, Venus is consistently successful here and she is a fast court player. You simply can't argue these facts.

How did the USO change? I thought it was lightning fast last year.
I actually thought it was slower .See?The mind plays tricks :D

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:21 AM
Great,ridiculous conspiracy theories again,put your tin foil hat on.



LMAO,great sense of humour.Fed has about 5-10% chance if both him and Nadal make it to the final and even that's probably generous.

Well you can be negative about Federer all you want, but the match up would certainly be closer than 2008. 5-10%? Federer must not be very good by your own estimation. :rolleyes:

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:22 AM
I actually thought it was slower .See?The mind plays tricks :D

Right, that's how Del Potro was blasting 100 mph winners right by Federer (and Nadal) with his huge game.

The mind doesn't play tricks, unless you have no clue what you're looking at with regards to tennis. How often do you play, and on what surfaces just out of curiosity? It's really not rocket science to see how a tournament is playing.

zagor
05-24-2010, 11:23 AM
Wimbledon isn't that different, and it certainly hasn't changed since Federer was winning there. It's the same blend, and it still plays fast because of the low bounce. Remember, Venus is consistently successful here and she is a fast court player. You simply can't argue these facts..

Yes it really is,it's quite different from the Wimbledon of the 90s I grew up watching.

As for Venus,well I guess then since Roddick almost won Wimbledon last year and has multiple finals there he should atleast reach the SF at FO this year given how it plays lightning fast right?

How did the USO change? I thought it was lightning fast last year.

They slowed down USO twice and no it surely wasn't lightning fast since about 1999-2000.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 11:23 AM
It's not a conspiracy theory, and refrain from using the word stupid I would ask. The only thing "stupid" is not using your God given eyes and brain to watch tennis. What are you talking about in regards to last years final? Which final, Wimbledon or the French? The French was faster last year. Wimbledon was the same as usual. I think that point is fairly clear.

Hmmmm....so it's not coming up with conspiracy theories when you state that the organisers just want to make one guy win?Oh yes,but I'm the one being stupid :roll:(anyway,sorry for the word if it offended you.)
And I was talking about the FO final.LOL you thought the court was faster?
Clearly you did not see the final.

Which courts are "slowered" down again? Look at Brad Gilbert's twitter account by the way. He is talking about how FAST the courts are. So...it's not a conspiracy theory, just observations about the tournament.


Wimbledon and AO are slower.The USO COULD BE slower.

flyinghippos101
05-24-2010, 11:23 AM
Yeah so Fed can win the CYGS and bore us to sleep with his domination of slam tennis.. :oops:

Because we all know absolute domination by Nadal during the clay season is prime entertainment...

Cyan
05-24-2010, 11:24 AM
It's obviously not about tennis anymore...it's about making one guy win. Clay historically required the best fitness, and emphasized angles and point construction. Now we are back to bashing I guess.

Indeed. This is scandalous.

zagor
05-24-2010, 11:25 AM
Well you can be negative about Federer all you want, but the match up would certainly be closer than 2008. 5-10%? Federer must not be very good by your own estimation. :rolleyes:

No,negative would be saying something like Fed won't reach the SF/F which I fully expect him to do.

Saying he has very little chance against Nadal in the FO final is a realistic opinion backed up by facts.

Closer than 2008? Absolutely,I think Fed will take a set this time and make it somewhat close overall but winning? Yes,very little chance of that happening.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 11:26 AM
Right, that's how Del Potro was blasting 100 mph winners right by Federer (and Nadal) with his huge game.

The mind doesn't play tricks, unless you have no clue what you're looking at with regards to tennis. How often do you play, and on what surfaces just out of curiosity? It's really not rocket science to see how a tournament is playing.Pot calling a kettle black? Interesting :D btw-I thought Del Po was blasting off winners in Miami and Montreal as well.Your point would be?

edit-I've mostly played on clay courts.

jamesblakefan#1
05-24-2010, 11:27 AM
It's not a conspiracy theory, and refrain from using the word stupid I would ask. The only thing "stupid" is not using your God given eyes and brain to watch tennis. What are you talking about in regards to last years final? Which final, Wimbledon or the French? The French was faster last year. Wimbledon was the same as usual. I think that point is fairly clear.

Which courts are "slowered" down again? Look at Brad Gilbert's twitter account by the way. He is talking about how FAST the courts are. So...it's not a conspiracy theory, just observations about the tournament.

Saying the courts are playing fast is one thing, but you're saying it's red hardcourt now and that you actually hear squeaking shoes, which I don't think anyone else will attest to TBH.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:27 AM
Yes it really is,it's quite different from the Wimbledon of the 90s I grew up watching.

As for Venus,well I guess then since Roddick almost won Wimbledon last year and has multiple finals there he should atleast reach the SF at FO this year given how it plays lightning fast right?



They slowed down USO twice and no it surely wasn't lightning fast since about 1999-2000.

Last year they said the USO was fast. Of course Wimbledon is different from the 90's, but the grass hasn't changed since Federer was winning in 2003. It was claimed that the Sampras and Ivanisevic finals caused the change in grass, after 98 or so.

Roddick had his best result ever at the French last year right? Round of 16? Think about it. I don't expect him to do well here necessarily (because I pretty much never expect him to do well), but a decent run would not be surprising. And what did Roddick have to do with Venus? I used Venus as an example to show that Wimbledon grass isn't changing around this decade. However, Gilbert does say he thinks the courts this year will benefit the Williams sisters. So...what does that tell you?

I also never used the words "lightning fast" in regards to this FO, so please stop lying. This is called a straw man argument, and is intellectually dishonest.

zagor
05-24-2010, 11:27 AM
Indeed. This is scandalous.

Indeed it is but not as scandalous as Wimbledon and USO slowing down.

Cyan
05-24-2010, 11:28 AM
You're wrong dude. Wait until you see some of the Murray and Gasquet match highlights. Why would I make something like this up? Look at when they change directions not sliding.

I actually don't think Nadal will win this tournament, seeing how it's playing, but we will see. If Federer and Nadal make it to the final, Federer has a great chance.

Rafa won't even reach the final. :cry: This is not clay but maroon HC :shock: I have a gut feeling Nole will reach the final from Rafa's half seeing as HC is Nole's best surface..

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:28 AM
Saying the courts are playing fast is one thing, but you're saying it's red hardcourt now and that you actually hear squeaking shoes, which I don't think anyone else will attest to TBH.

I don't care what you're saying man. I'm right, and as soon as videos go up you will hear it. What are you going to say then? Their running and changes in direction were causing the ground to squeak. That's just the facts, so tough luck to anyone who doesn't want to believe it.

I never said "red hardcourt" I just said they are playing very fast for clay.

Totai
05-24-2010, 11:29 AM
Well watch Gasquet vs. Murray highlights at least. Whenever they are available.

I watched the match live.

zagor
05-24-2010, 11:30 AM
Last year they said the USO was fast. Of course Wimbledon is different from the 90's, but the grass hasn't changed since Federer was winning in 2003. It was claimed that the Sampras and Ivanisevic finals caused the change in grass, after 98 or so.

Roddick had his best result ever at the French last year right? Round of 16? Think about it. I don't expect him to do well here necessarily (because I pretty much never expect him to do well), but a decent run would not be surprising. And what did Roddick have to do with Venus? I used Venus as an example to show that Wimbledon grass isn't changing around this decade. However, Gilbert does say he thinks the courts this year will benefit the Williams sisters. So...what does that tell you?

I also never used the words "lightning fast" in regards to this FO, so please stop lying. This is called a straw man argument, and is intellectually dishonest.

You used Venus I used Roddick.Given that he was few points away from winning Wimbledon last year and has reached multiple finals there he should go deep at the FO this year as it plays fast.

Furthermore since FO plays like a red HC given that Roddick won the last big HC tourney played(Miami)he should do great at FO this year.

TMF
05-24-2010, 11:31 AM
It's obviously not about tennis anymore...it's about making one guy win. Clay historically required the best fitness, and emphasized angles and point construction. Now we are back to bashing I guess.

What are you talking about? Increase the speed of the court will invite more players to play well. Hence, harder to win. It does not make it any easier for Roger, Nadal or any other players. Okay?

flyinghippos101
05-24-2010, 11:33 AM
Of course Wimbledon is different from the 90's, but the grass hasn't changed since Federer was winning in 2003.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=soJ_FVnijAw

Totai
05-24-2010, 11:33 AM
You're wrong dude. Wait until you see some of the Murray and Gasquet match highlights. Why would I make something like this up? Look at when they change directions not sliding.

I actually don't think Nadal will win this tournament, seeing how it's playing, but we will see. If Federer and Nadal make it to the final, Federer has a great chance.

If they can slide, then they can't squeak. Its one or the other. The squeak results from high friction between the rubber of the shoes and the surface. If you are sliding, then the friction is low, therefore there is no squeaking. I think you are just crazy

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:35 AM
Ok check this out. For all the idiots that are saying I am a liar about the shoes squeaking, go here:

http://www.rolandgarros.com/en_FR/multimedia/index.html

Click on day 2 highlights part 4. It has a picture of Murray by it. Wait for the Murray match to show up. It appears Lenglen is playing different from Chatrier.

What now eh?

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:36 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=soJ_FVnijAw

That's an old, well discussed video, and of course it doesn't factor rate of spin, or how Federer hit the serve at all into account.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 11:36 AM
I don't care what you're saying man. I'm right, and as soon as videos go up you will hear it. What are you going to say then? Their running and changes in direction were causing the ground to squeak. That's just the facts, so tough luck to anyone who doesn't want to believe it.

I never said "red hardcourt" I just said they are playing very fast for clay.
I saw the whole match and I didn't think the court was playing too fast.

And like I said IF at all the change has been made it's only fair .Making a change at the start of the decade dosen't seem like a poor choice to me.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:37 AM
You used Venus I used Roddick.Given that he was few points away from winning Wimbledon last year and has reached multiple finals there he should go deep at the FO this year as it plays fast.

Furthermore since FO plays like a red HC given that Roddick won the last big HC tourney played(Miami)he should do great at FO this year.

Maybe he will (I don't think he will, but maybe). He got to the round of 16 last year, his best ever result. Probably not a coincidence.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:39 AM
Come on people, go watch that video! I want to hear the naysayers comment.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 11:42 AM
Maybe he will (I don't think he will, but maybe). He got to the round of 16 last year, his best ever result. Probably not a coincidence.Seeing that he reached the Wimbledon finals last year and won Miami this year I'm thinking working with Stefanki must have something to do with it :wink:

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:46 AM
Seeing that he reached the Wimbledon finals last year and won Miami this year I'm thinking working with Stefanki must have something to do with it :wink:

Sure. But Roddick is not a clay courter. Period. He doesn't have the kind of athleticism it takes. Out of nowhere he posts a good FO result? The guy could barely make it out of the first round normally haha.

Did you watch the video yet? Has anyone watched it?

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:48 AM
By the way, watching Chatrier it seems more typical. Lenglen looks (and sounds) quite different.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 11:50 AM
Sure. But Roddick is not a clay courter. Period. He doesn't have the kind of athleticism it takes. Out of nowhere he posts a good FO result? The guy could barely make it out of the first round normally haha.
Uhm..where did I say he was?

Did you watch the video yet? Has anyone watched it?
I watched the match.That's all I need to watch.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:51 AM
I watched the match.That's all I need to watch.

LOL! Come on, don't be scared, just go watch the video and I dare you to say it doesn't sound like they are running around on hard courts. That is such a cop out. Everybody else disappeared too it seems. I guess people prefer bias and rhetoric to reality.

The reference to Roddick not being a clay courter is a response to your "it's something to do with Stefanki." Stefanki can't change Roddick's innate physical abilities. So therefore there must be some other factor contributing to his surprising and noted success at the tournament.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 11:56 AM
LOL! Come on, don't be scared, just go watch the video and I dare you to say it doesn't like they are running around on hard courts. That is such a cop out.

The reference to Roddick not being a clay courter is a response to your "it's something to do with Stefanki." Stefanki can't change Roddick's innate physical abilities. So therefore there must be some other factor contributing to his surprising and noted success at the tournament.I thought Roddick was just clearly playing better last year with regards to RG(and I thought he had a good draw as well.).BTW-physical abilities can be worked on and improved.And anyway, I don't think I denied the conditions could've been faster.What you haven't proven to me right now is that this has been a 'deliberate change to make sure one guy wins'
As for the video-the site is taking ages to open and trust me I have no interest on watching some odd footage here and there and passing a judgement.I'd much rather watch the match.

namelessone
05-24-2010, 11:57 AM
Come on people, go watch that video! I want to hear the naysayers comment.

Very weird indeed. I played on clay most of my life with all types of shoes yet I they never squaked on the CC that I played on. And they would squek when I would stop and go on hardcourts.

This was on Lenglen,right? This qualifies as very weird just like the decision to make the nr.1 on clay and a frenchie play on lenglen instead of chatrier,putting roddick-nieminen there instead. The frenchies are either anti-nadal or they are very stupid in their scheduling decisions. The other matches tomorrow on Chatrier all star frenchies or near frenchies(justine henin). Why bump Nadal-Mina on Lenglen to favour Roddick-Nieminen? It doesn't make sense. They could have easily bumped hewitt-chardy from chatrier to lenglen if they wanted more frenchy matches there.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 11:59 AM
I thought Roddick was just clearly playing better last year with regards to RG(and I thought he had a good draw as well.).BTW-physical abilities can be worked on and improved.And anyway, I don't think I denied the conditions could've been faster.What you haven't proven to me right now is that this has been a 'deliberate change to make sure one guy wins'
As for the video-the site is taking ages to open and trust me I have no interest on watching some odd footage here and there and passing a judgement.I'd much rather watch the match.

My "deliberate change to make one guy win" is just me being guilty of inflammatory remarks.

Thank you Nameless. It's clear as day right?

zagor
05-24-2010, 12:01 PM
I watched the video and I have to admit it does sound a bit strange in Murray-Gasquet match,I do hear squeaking(if that's the right word)almost like they're playing on HC but do not hear any of that for Monfils match.

Anyway as far as I'm concerned if the FO speed up good for them,given that Wimbledon and USO slowed down and carpet has been butchered I really don't care that much if FO speeds up.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 12:03 PM
My "deliberate change to make one guy win" is just me being guilty of inflammatory remarks.

Thank you Nameless. It's clear as day right?LOL nameless is a Nadal fan.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 12:04 PM
LOL nameless is a Nadal fan.

And Zagor? :-)

Face it, I was telling the truth. I don't make things up, that would be positively absurd.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 12:05 PM
And Zagor? :-)

Face it, I was telling the truth. I don't make things up, that would be positively absurd.Yes,that's why you chose some odd footage here and there to prove that courts are significantly faster.
And is that why you chose to tell us that Nadal somehow volleys better than Federer when he dosen't come in HALF as much as Fed does?

namelessone
05-24-2010, 12:06 PM
My "deliberate change to make one guy win" is just me being guilty of inflammatory remarks.

Thank you Nameless. It's clear as day right?

Very clear. I played most of my childhood on clay with whatever shoes I had at hand and they NEVER squeaked,no matter how the weather was like but they did so once I went to play indoor in the winter time.

I think putting Nadal on Lenglen,a faster court at least by the sound of their shoes(I think there is little top layer of clay there so maybe that's a reason why their shoes squeak) and a smaller court at that makes it pretty clear,once again,how the french feel about Rafa and how little respect they have for him. Maybe I could understand a frenchie or Fed match bumping Rafa's match from Chatrier but Roddick-Nieminen? Come on,how more obvious can it get?

It's another sign of disrespect for the four times champ. Oh well,guess I should have expected as much. Nadal should play 80% of his matches at the FO on Chatrier,I think he has at least earned that right.

jamesblakefan#1
05-24-2010, 12:07 PM
LOL! Come on, don't be scared, just go watch the video and I dare you to say it doesn't like they are running around on hard courts. That is such a cop out. Everybody else disappeared too it seems. I guess people prefer bias and rhetoric to reality.

The reference to Roddick not being a clay courter is a response to your "it's something to do with Stefanki." Stefanki can't change Roddick's innate physical abilities. So therefore there must be some other factor contributing to his surprising and noted success at the tournament.

Look even Sampras, as relatively poor as he was on clay, had a few good runs at RG. It's not impossible to think Roddick could as well. He got a good draw, took advantage of the conditions, and still went out to the first good CCer (Monfils) he played.

The conspiracy still is falling flat - I watched the video - I saw CC tennis. Either way there is no evidence that the courts have been intentionally sped up. Like I said, in a few days when conditions are expected to cool, I guess the courts will magically slow down? What incentive would RG tourney organizers have to plot to keep Nadal out of the winner's circle? Do you really think they hate Nadal THAT much they'd change the courts, just to hope he loses? And even so, Nadal's more than capable on HC, so I don't see how it's automatic he'd lose anyways. And according to some of you Nadal only lost last year b/c he was injured, now that he's healthy he should be back to dominating right? Or is it now the court's fault that Nadal lost last year?

There's a lot of logical holes in your theory. I prefer to stay with what everyone else knows - the courts are playing faster due to the conditions. I know 06-08, the first day or 2 have always been hit by rain, which slows the courts down. That didn't happen last year and hasn't happened so far this year.

As Mandy mentioned - go watch last year's final. The court magically slowed down then? Or did the rain and cool temps have something to do with it?

Up a set and leading 5-4 in a first-round win against Sweden's Robin Soderling on Monday, Nadal didn't solicit the trainer or request that the umpire check a line call. The defending French Open champ from Spain asked for clay to be added to the windswept Philippe Chatrier Court.

"It's the first time that I've been asked for more clay in 17 years working at Roland Garros," says Gaston Cloup, the French Open's head groundskeeper.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/tennis/french/2006-05-30-weather_x.htm

So apparently this conspiracy's been in order for 5 years now, but only NOW has started to take affect.

jamesblakefan#1
05-24-2010, 12:10 PM
Very weird indeed. I played on clay most of my life with all types of shoes yet I they never squaked on the CC that I played on. And they would squek when I would stop and go on hardcourts.

This was on Lenglen,right? This qualifies as very weird just like the decision to make the nr.1 on clay and a frenchie play on lenglen instead of chatrier,putting roddick-nieminen there instead. The frenchies are either anti-nadal or they are very stupid in their scheduling decisions. The other matches tomorrow on Chatrier all star frenchies or near frenchies(justine henin). Why bump Nadal-Mina on Lenglen to favour Roddick-Nieminen? It doesn't make sense. They could have easily bumped hewitt-chardy from chatrier to lenglen if they wanted more frenchy matches there.

I'll let Fee educate you...

59 posts, only 3 that got it right.

The organizers have said they will put one large marquee match on Lenglen each day. Today it was Murray v Gasquet, tomorrow it will be Nadal. They do it for the money and to keep the ticket buyers somewhat happy because they sell a seperate ticket for Lenglen. Look for W to do the same in a few weeks, they sell separate tickets for their top 3 courts.

But no...it's a grand French conspiracy out to dethrone King Rafa!

namelessone
05-24-2010, 12:10 PM
LOL nameless is a Nadal fan.

What does that have to do with anything? Your shoes shouldn't squeak on clay,if they do it mean that there is little top layer of dirt and the hardcourt underneath is exposed. I bet your shoes have squeaked in hallways or on concrete but have your shoes ever squeked in the dirt or gravel? No of course they haven't because they don't have enough grip.

This is the first time in my life when I have seen squeaking on clay on the men's side. If this wouldn't have come from the RG site I would have thought it a hoax.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 12:11 PM
Yes,that's why you chose some odd footage here and there to prove that courts are significantly faster.

Mandy, I don't like to rail on people, especially women since I know they tend to take things a bit more personally than men, but you are being ridiculous. That is the "highlight reel" directly from the office French Open website. The entire match played and sounded that way.

I play tons of tennis, and have played on every surface. Many hard courts, grass (two different kinds), red and green clay...it is quite easy for me to see how a court is playing. I am also not deaf. I can hear it when players sound like they are running around on a hard surface, as can the other people who are freely admitting it here.

I am not sure what emotional attachment you have here to your stance. Perhaps its just not wanting to be "wrong", however I can assure you that is not the issue. It is not one of us being wrong vs. being right. It is simply observing what the reality of the situation is.

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 12:13 PM
oh yes... i could hear the players feet squeaking like baby toys...

darn those french... painted the paris Masters Taraflex carpet in red and make it look like clay just to throw of Nadal...

haters haters haters...

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 12:13 PM
JBF are you denying what is clearly evident in the video I linked you too? Do you deny the squeaking of shoes, indicative of a hard and high friction surface underfoot? I just want your yes or no answer, for the record.

namelessone
05-24-2010, 12:13 PM
But no...it's a grand French conspiracy out to dethrone King Rafa!

It is a sign of disrespect. Nadal should almost always play on chatrier just like Fed should always play on centre court in WB or Ashe in USO. They are multiple times champions there,they are not some guys who can be thrown around the schedule. If anything the schedule should start with them firmly fixed on the centre courts when they play and the other guys should be moved around.

Just the way it should be IMO.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 12:15 PM
Mandy, I don't like to rail on people, especially women since I know they tend to take things a bit more personally than men, but you are being ridiculous. That is the "highlight reel" directly from the office French Open website. The entire match played and sounded that way.

Not to me.Sorry.

I play tons of tennis, and have played on every surface. Many hard courts, grass (two different kinds), red and green clay...it is quite easy for me to see how a court is playing. I am also not deaf. I can hear it when players sound like they are running around on a hard surface, as can the other people who are freely admitting it here.
Good for you if at all what you say is ture but I'm not quite sure why you're bringing this up.

I am not sure what emotional attachment you have here to your stance.
None.
Perhaps its just not wanting to be "wrong", however I can assure you that is not the issue. It is not one of us being wrong vs. being right. It is simply observing what the reality of the situation is.
The REALITY is that a footage isn't good enough to gauge how fast a court is playing overall.
response in bolded parts.

zagor
05-24-2010, 12:16 PM
What does that have to do with anything? Your shoes shouldn't squeak on clay,if they do it mean that there is little top layer of dirt and the hardcourt underneath is exposed. I bet your shoes have squeaked in hallways or on concrete but have your shoes ever squeked in the dirt or gravel? No of course they haven't because they don't have enough grip.

This is the first time in my life when I have seen squeaking on clay on the men's side. If this wouldn't have come from the RG site I would have thought it a hoax.

So if it has nothing do with it then where's your outrage for both Wimbledon and USO slowing down and for killing the carpet?

bolo
05-24-2010, 12:16 PM
That's some serious squeakage in the gasquet/murray match.

But I do agree with mandy that roddick is a slightly different player under stefanki. He's lost some weight, has more endurance and is faster around the court. He also noted in some interiview or another that he's lost some weight as well.

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 12:17 PM
It is a sign of disrespect. Nadal should almost always play on chatrier just like Fed should always play on centre court in WB or Ashe in USO. They are multiple times champions there,they are not some guys who can be thrown around the schedule. If anything the schedule should start with them firmly fixed on the centre courts when they play and the other guys should be moved around.

Just the way it should be IMO.

10 posts back it was about the speed of the courts...

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 12:17 PM
Mandy I guess there is no having a discussion with you then. You are clearly sidestepping and denying every obvious fact being presented, and are not able to make the clear connections between points here. Moving on I guess.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 12:18 PM
okay I just saw the video and T&M is plain exaggerating now.YES,it was slightly squeaky but IMO that was probably because the courts weren't sprinkled with enough clay TODAY AND also the weather which was pretty warm and dry.

namelessone
05-24-2010, 12:19 PM
So if it has nothing do with it then where's your outrage for both Wimbledon and USO slowing down and for killing the carpet?

It could be it because this is a thread where where we discuss the court speed of ROLAND GARROS,not WB or USO.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 12:19 PM
So if it has nothing do with it then where's your outrage for both Wimbledon and USO slowing down and for killing the carpet?

Killing carpet was lame (Heck I think a carpet AO would be boss). Wimbledon still plays pretty darn fast. If it wasn't, Federer and Venus wouldn't be so dominant there. It's not the ace fest of the 90's but you still get a ton of aces, and I think guys served better (in general) in the 90's to be honest.. USO seems pretty flippin fast to me. I just think what you're saying is not really correct. Seems like you're throwing up more straw mans.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 12:20 PM
okay I just saw the video and T&M is plain exaggerating now.YES,it was slightly squeaky but IMO that was probably because the courts weren't sprinkled with enough clay TODAY AND also the weather which was pretty warm and dry.

Nope, no exaggeration. It sounds like running on asphalt. Do you ever run on hard courts? Do you ever play hard tennis on a hard court? That's what it sounds like. Just stop.

TMF
05-24-2010, 12:20 PM
Very weird indeed. I played on clay most of my life with all types of shoes yet I they never squaked on the CC that I played on. And they would squek when I would stop and go on hardcourts.

This was on Lenglen,right? This qualifies as very weird just like the decision to make the nr.1 on clay and a frenchie play on lenglen instead of chatrier,putting roddick-nieminen there instead. The frenchies are either anti-nadal or they are very stupid in their scheduling decisions. The other matches tomorrow on Chatrier all star frenchies or near frenchies(justine henin). Why bump Nadal-Mina on Lenglen to favour Roddick-Nieminen? It doesn't make sense. They could have easily bumped hewitt-chardy from chatrier to lenglen if they wanted more frenchy matches there.

Let’s wait until after two weeks and see how many times rafa gets to play on center court, then you have something to say about the UNFAIRNESS. Just b/c Roddick ranked lower than Rafa, it doesn’t means that he’s trash and Rafa is god!

Just remember, Gasquet(a French man) requested to play Tuesday instead of Monday but got turned down. So no, the French are not giving any favor for any players. And even if they try want rafa lose(according to you and some rafa fans), wouldn’t they put players in his half draw that can give him problems? Notice he’s got a easy draw(and no Soderling) than Federer.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 12:21 PM
Yeah discussions about who is playing where doesn't really need to go here. We are simply discussing the composition of the courts. It's pretty clear Chatrier and Lenglen are not the same. At least it wasn't today.

namelessone
05-24-2010, 12:21 PM
10 posts back it was about the speed of the courts...

Both are very wrong. You shouldn't hear squeaking on clay regardless of how fast or slow the clay is(that means that the court is not properly taken care of as it means that the top layer is very thin since there is enough friction between the soles of your feet and the court underneath to make that sound) and the guys who have been multiple champs there should almost always get centre court.

jamesblakefan#1
05-24-2010, 12:21 PM
It is a sign of disrespect. Nadal should almost always play on chatrier just like Fed should always play on centre court in WB or Ashe in USO. They are multiple times champions there,they are not some guys who can be thrown around the schedule. If anything the schedule should start with them firmly fixed on the centre courts when they play and the other guys should be moved around.

Just the way it should be IMO.

Tourney organizers are trying to appeal to all of their consumers. Lenglen is still a show court, it is not like Court 17 or something. Honestly I don't think it's a big deal at all. Nadal's likely going to steamroll.

Also last year at Wimbledon, the WS got put on outer courts while more attractive players like Kirilenko, Wozniacki, and Cirstea got Centre Court. Tourney organizers do things like this. Ultimately it has no impact on the outcome of the match (or at least it shouldn't for the true professionals).

fedfan08
05-24-2010, 12:23 PM
OK lets be honest. When the speed of RG courts come up the real question is how will it help/hurt Nadal or Federer. Faster court isn't going to help Federer against Nadal (if the balls are kicking up that only hurts him as Nadal directs most of his balls to Fed's BH). A faster court has a small chance of hurting Nadal were he to come up against a big server/hitter like Soderling on a hot dry sunny day. But there really isn't anyone like that on his side of the draw.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 12:24 PM
Nope, no exaggeration. It sounds like running on asphalt. Do you ever run on hard courts? Do you ever play hard tennis on a hard court? That's what it sounds like. Just stop.Hardly.On HC the squeaking is likely to be much more than this particular video.
And again I'm not entirely sure why this was even presented as an evidence to prove the courts are somehow FASTER overall.

namelessone
05-24-2010, 12:24 PM
Let’s wait until after two weeks and see how many times rafa gets to play on center court, then you have something to say about the UNFAIRNESS. Just b/c Roddick ranked lower than Rafa, it doesn’t means that he’s trash and Rafa is god!

Just remember, Gasquet(a French man) requested to play Tuesday instead of Monday but got turned down. So no, the French are not giving any favor for any players. And even if they try want rafa lose(according to you and some rafa fans), wouldn’t they put players in his half draw that can give him problems? Notice he’s got a easy draw(and no Soderling) than Federer.

Are you suggesting that they fix the draws?

Roddick is not trash,that's your take on my words but he is close to a nobody on clay and yet he gets centre court with another ho-hum player like nieminen while Nadal(4 times champ) and a promising young french player get lenglen. Hell what do I know,maybe the frenchies are starting to like roddick:)

ksbh
05-24-2010, 12:25 PM
I feel sorry for you. With the way the courts are playing, Federer beating Nadal on the Paris clay must be a real possibility, that's got to hurt!

Hurry, stock up on the Kleenex now!

Yeah so Fed can win the CYGS and bore us to sleep with his domination of slam tennis.. :oops:

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 12:25 PM
Hardly.On HC the squeaking is likely to be much more than this particular video.
And again I'm not entirely sure why this was even presented as an evidence to prove the courts are somehow FASTER overall.

Do you really not know why that would be a contributing factor to speed? Do you know the effect that clay has on a ball on impact?

fedfan08
05-24-2010, 12:25 PM
I'll let Fee educate you...



But no...it's a grand French conspiracy out to dethrone King Rafa!Makes sense now. Roddick certainly wouldn't sell tickets. haha

jamesblakefan#1
05-24-2010, 12:26 PM
okay I just saw the video and T&M is plain exaggerating now.YES,it was slightly squeaky but IMO that was probably because the courts weren't sprinkled with enough clay TODAY AND also the weather which was pretty warm and dry.

Yes there was squeaking but not at all noticeable when watching on TV and nothing comparable to that of a HC IMO. If you're trying to make the argument that squeaking = RG HC, I'm still not buying in. The conditions are faster, but it's a big leap of faith to say it's playing exactly like HC. And there's still no proof that it's a blatant attempt by tourney organizers to get rid of Nadal. That part of your theory still falls flat.

T&M, what are your thoughts on what I posted in #129?

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 12:27 PM
Ok check this out. For all the idiots that are saying I am a liar about the shoes squeaking, go here:

http://www.rolandgarros.com/en_FR/multimedia/index.html

Click on day 2 highlights part 4. It has a picture of Murray by it. Wait for the Murray match to show up. It appears Lenglen is playing different from Chatrier.

What now eh?

Man, you are right. i haven´t noticed it. what the hell is this? i would understand quicker balls, but this squeaking thing is too much. They changed the surface dramatically from 2008 to 2009 and then this year even more. Next year it will be a hard clay with no slicing. I can´t believe they are doing it in such a noticeable way, not trying to disguise it. A bit quicker is fine, but no way the Grand slam on a surface, clay in this case, should play way faster than the other tourneys on the same surface (madrid is altitude so its different). That´s outrageous.

zagor
05-24-2010, 12:27 PM
Killing carpet was lame (Heck I think a carpet AO would be boss). Wimbledon still plays pretty darn fast. If it wasn't, Federer and Venus wouldn't be so dominant there. It's not the ace fest of the 90's but you still get a ton of aces, and I think guys served better (in general) in the 90's to be honest.

It's still grass but it's still quite different than it was in the 90s as even pros like Roddick,Safin,Henman said as well,it's slower and has a much higher and "correct" bounce,on old grass the ball would just die.As for Fed he's pretty much dominant everywhere except when he's playing Nadal so using him as an example doesn't add up.

USO seems pretty flippin fast to me. I just think what you're saying is not really correct. Seems like you're throwing up more straw mans.

Yeas,my all arguments are straw mans.I'll try to find an article discussing the changes made at USO.

As for what USO seems to you,well FO still seemed pretty flipping slow to me last year.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 12:28 PM
Do you really not know why that would be a contributing factor to speed? Do you know the effect that clay has on a ball on impact?uhm...I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here.:-?
I already said the courts could be faster.And you're right looking back Lenglen was slightly 'squeaky'.
The onus is on you to prove that this is a deliberate /premeditated attempt.

fedfan08
05-24-2010, 12:30 PM
If Nadal wins RG in two weeks Nadal fans will say it just shows how great he is that he can win on fast and slow clay. If someone takes him out then they can blame it on the organizers for supposedly speeding up the surface to favor Federer or whoever and punish Nadal.

namelessone
05-24-2010, 12:31 PM
Tourney organizers are trying to appeal to all of their consumers. Lenglen is still a show court, it is not like Court 17 or something. Honestly I don't think it's a big deal at all. Nadal's likely going to steamroll.

Also last year at Wimbledon, the WS got put on outer courts while more attractive players like Kirilenko, Wozniacki, and Cirstea got Centre Court. Tourney organizers do things like this. Ultimately it has no impact on the outcome of the match (or at least it shouldn't for the true professionals).

For me it does not have much to do with the outcome of the match. I doubt Rafa will have much trouble on whatever court with Mina. It's the gesture that counts. It is a plain diss,they are going to put mediocre CC'ers like roddick,nieminen and hewitt on centre court but Nadal has no room there. Come on.

Oh and please don't compare with the joke that is WTA. The only thing that sells their tour is sex and it has been this way for a couple of years now. The whole WTA is composed of 90% mega chokers at the top and a couple of proven champs who could probably take a year off and still come back to win slams. Can you imagine that on the men's side? The guys marketing the WTA are actually pretty smart. They realized that they can't really sell they product if the focus on the tennis(which is really lacking,no variety,players become nr.1 with no slams,nr.2 and 3 lose to nr.50 regularly and so on) so they focused on the sexual side,trying to attract all types of viewers. Most times I see a WTA player they are usually posing for a calendar instead of posing with a trophy.

I hope we don't see the days when the men are scheduled on certain courts due to their sex appeal.

zagor
05-24-2010, 12:31 PM
It could be it because this is a thread where where we discuss the court speed of ROLAND GARROS,not WB or USO.

Yes it is but when the subject of slowing down of Wimbledon was brought up it was supposedly good for the game to get more rallies and avoid boring servefests,*******s making excuses etc. and now when FO does the same it's a great conspiracy to dethrone Rafa,you seriously don't see the double standards?

mandy01
05-24-2010, 12:32 PM
I feel sorry for you. With the way the courts are playing, Federer beating Nadal on the Paris clay must be a real possibility, that's got to hurt!

Hurry, stock up on the Kleenex now!
It would he HILARIOUS if that actually ended up happening(it won't but still)
I'd be interested in seeing the look on Cyan's face :lol:

TMF
05-24-2010, 12:33 PM
Are you suggesting that they fix the draws?

Roddick is not trash,that's your take on my words but he is close to a nobody on clay and yet he gets centre court with another ho-hum player like nieminen while Nadal(4 times champ) and a promising young french player get lenglen. Hell what do I know,maybe the frenchies are starting to like roddick:)

No I'm not. I'm echoing from some of you guys sound like the French wants Rafa to lose.

There's nothing wrong with them liking Roddick. Perhaps they rather see Nieminen over Mina. Who knows. Stop getting on their case just b/c Rafa is not on PC.

Just wait a few more days. If Roddick gets PC again and Nadal is on Lenglen, then you have something to say.

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 12:34 PM
OK lets be honest. When the speed of RG courts come up the real question is how will it help/hurt Nadal or Federer. Faster court isn't going to help Federer against Nadal (if the balls are kicking up that only hurts him as Nadal directs most of his balls to Fed's BH). A faster court has a small chance of hurting Nadal were he to come up against a big server/hitter like Soderling on a hot dry sunny day. But there really isn't anyone like that on his side of the draw.

yes, but federer gets much more free points from his serve than Nadal. Plus, federer lately is playing very offensively against Nadal on clay, not engaging in long rallies. Hence, tha faster the better for Federer.

ksbh
05-24-2010, 12:34 PM
LOL! I'd be interested as well! :)

It would he HILARIOUS if that actually ended up happening(it won't but still)
I'd be interested in seeing the look on Cyan's face :lol:

jamesblakefan#1
05-24-2010, 12:35 PM
For me it does not have much to do with the outcome of the match. I doubt Rafa will have much trouble on whatever court with Mina. It's the gesture that counts. It is a plain diss,they are going to put mediocre CC'ers like roddick,nieminen and hewitt on centre court but Nadal has no room there. Come on.

Oh and please don't compare with the joke that is WTA. The only thing that sells their tour is sex and it has been this way for a couple of years now. The whole WTA is composed of 90% mega chokers at the top and a couple of proven champs who could probably take a year off and still come back to win slams. Can you imagine that on the men's side? The guys marketing the WTA are actually pretty smart. They realized that they can't really sell they product if the focus on the tennis(which is really lacking,no variety,players become nr.1 with no slams,nr.2 and 3 lose to nr.50 regularly and so on) so they focused on the sexual side,trying to attract all types of viewers. Most times I see a WTA player they are usually posing for a calendar instead of posing with a trophy.

I hope we don't see the days when the men are scheduled on certain courts due to their sex appeal.

1. Wimbledon is ITF, not WTA. Still no excuse for putting unproven players like Wozzi and Kirilenko on CC over proven champs. So I guess it's ok for the WS to get shafted over to outer courts but w/ Nadal it's a grand injustice. :rolleyes:

2. As someone else mentioned, the French put the marquee match of today, Gaquet-Murray, over on Lenglen, so all bets are off. Fee's point is correct. They do it for ticket sales and give people on all show courts something good to watch, nothing more nothing less. If one of Fed's matches is on Lenglen I expect a lot of you to be changing your tune. BTW as someone else mentioned, Fed did play vs Querrey on Lenglen a few yrs ago.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/tennis/7420050.stm

mandy01
05-24-2010, 12:37 PM
If Nadal wins RG in two weeks Nadal fans will say it just shows how great he is that he can win on fast and slow clay. If someone takes him out then they can blame it on the organizers for supposedly speeding up the surface to favor Federer or whoever and punish Nadal.
LOL this is pretty much it.This is why we have one footage in the tournament to illustrate that the courts are faster overall,that they play like HC etc.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 12:37 PM
Yes there was squeaking but not at all noticeable when watching on TV and nothing comparable to that of a HC IMO. If you're trying to make the argument that squeaking = RG HC, I'm still not buying in. The conditions are faster, but it's a big leap of faith to say it's playing exactly like HC. And there's still no proof that it's a blatant attempt by tourney organizers to get rid of Nadal. That part of your theory still falls flat.

T&M, what are your thoughts on what I posted in #129?

Well for me the squeaking was so loud, that it made me take notice. I wasn't listening for it. It was more like a "What the heck is this?" moment.

It's definitely not playing like a fast hard court. Lenglen appears to be playing like a really, really fast clay court. Very fast for clay. Still a higher bounce than hard courts in general though. The Chatrier footage looked "normal" to me for a clay court. Quite different from Lenglen.

I don't think tourney organizers are blatantly trying to eliminate Nadal. I would hope not. I can't believe they would be that stupid. But who knows? You even said yourself how the Williams got pretty dissed at Wimbledon last year. Why do you think that is? Certainly some players are less well liked, whether it's deserved or not. I'll tell you one thing. As a fan of tennis, if I had centre court seats and got Kirilenko over Serena I'd be ****ed. REALLY ****ed.

Your thoughts in 129 are good I think. I do think the French obviously like Federer more than Nadal, and that's ok. What I don't like are people who refuse to open their ears and eyes as to how things are playing. That's ALL the discussion is about. I make a comment about how the court is playing, and immediately I get jumped on saying I am wrong, or lying etc. What would be the purpose of that? That kind of thing is easily verifiable (unlike "I know this girl with a laptop"), so what is the point in making it up? Yes, faster conditions favor Federer more than Nadal. BIG DEAL. If Nadal is a great tennis player (which he is) he should be able to deal with it. My comment about it being to make one man win was simply me making a halfway serious and foolish comment. Nothing more.

And from the looks of it, as stated before, Chatrier is looking like pretty standard clay court affair. At least, based on the Monfils match. Lenglen, today, was a different matter.

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 12:37 PM
It would he HILARIOUS if that actually ended up happening(it won't but still)
I'd be interested in seeing the look on Cyan's face :lol:

well, the frenchies are doing everything that they can possibly do to make that happen. It seems like a *******´s dream or a ******* being able to change the conditions. He would say: remove all the clay (there is proof, as the courts are squeaky) and pick the lightest and fastest balls available. Crazy this is happening.

TMF
05-24-2010, 12:42 PM
yes, but federer gets much more free points from his serve than Nadal. Plus, federer lately is playing very offensively against Nadal on clay, not engaging in long rallies. Hence, tha faster the better for Federer.

Make that better for almost EVERYONE. This isn't just about the only 2 players, but the 128 players. Whatever the surface is fast or slow, Roger and Rafa has to deal with the same situation. i.e. Faster surface will just make harder for them to beat player like Roddick or Isner than on slower one. Simple as that.

zagor
05-24-2010, 12:42 PM
Here,TennisAndMusic since you basically accused me of talking BS about USO slowing down here's the article:

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/tennis/2006-07-16-surface-tension_x.htm

I don't make up things either.They slowed down USO twice,in 2001 and 2003.It's still one of the fastest courts around today and the fastest slam but that's because overall surfaces have been just slowed down tremendously not because USO still plays very fast(it's kinda medium-fast now).

jamesblakefan#1
05-24-2010, 12:42 PM
Well for me the squeaking was so loud, that it made me take notice. I wasn't listening for it. It was more like a "What the heck is this?" moment.

It's definitely not playing like a fast hard court. Lenglen appears to be playing like a really, really fast clay court. Very fast for clay. Still a higher bounce than hard courts in general though. The Chatrier footage looked "normal" to me for a clay court. Quite different from Lenglen.

I don't think tourney organizers are blatantly trying to eliminate Nadal. I would hope not. I can't believe they would be that stupid. But who knows? You even said yourself how the Williams got pretty dissed at Wimbledon last year. Why do you think that is? Certainly some players are less well liked, whether it's deserved or not. I'll tell you one thing. As a fan of tennis, if I had centre court seats and got Kirilenko over Serena I'd be ****ed. REALLY ****ed.

Your thoughts in 129 are good I think. I do think the French obviously like Federer more than Nadal, and that's ok. What I don't like are people who refuse to open their ears and eyes as to how things are playing. That's ALL the discussion is about. I make a comment about how the court is playing, and immediately I get jumped on saying I am wrong, or lying etc. What would be the purpose of that? That kind of thing is easily verifiable (unlike "I know this girl with a laptop"), so what is the point in making it up? Yes, faster conditions favor Federer more than Nadal. BIG DEAL. If Nadal is a great tennis player (which he is) he should be able to deal with it. My comment about it being to make one man win was simply me making a halfway serious and foolish comment. Nothing more.

And from the looks of it, as stated before, Chatrier is looking like pretty standard clay court affair. At least, based on the Monfils match. Lenglen, today, was a different matter.

Fair enough. Like I said, I didn't notice the squeaking watching on TV. Definitely as much as on HC for example.

And I think we both agree that it's faster, but like I said, it's supposedly going to cool in the next few days and possibly rain, so I think after that courts will slow some.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 12:42 PM
Well for me the squeaking was so loud, that it made me take notice. I wasn't listening for it. It was more like a "What the heck is this?" moment.

It's definitely not playing like a fast hard court. Lenglen appears to be playing like a really, really fast clay court. Very fast for clay. Still a higher bounce than hard courts in general though. The Chatrier footage looked "normal" to me for a clay court. Quite different from Lenglen.

.I would say it was OK.I didn't think it way too fast but yes,the squeaky sounds were weird and they could've been a result of various factors.

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 12:44 PM
well, the frenchies are doing everything that they can possibly do to make that happen. It seems like a *******´s dream or a ******* being able to change the conditions. He would say: remove all the clay (there is proof, as the courts are squeaky) and pick the lightest and fastest balls available. Crazy this is happening.

http://vox2.cdn.amiestreet.com/album-art/Coo-Coo-by-Vax_LBgndRht6twx_full.jpg

fedfan08
05-24-2010, 12:44 PM
yes, but federer gets much more free points from his serve than Nadal. Plus, federer lately is playing very offensively against Nadal on clay, not engaging in long rallies. Hence, tha faster the better for Federer.Didn't help him in Madrid a week ago.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 12:46 PM
Here,TennisAndMusic since you basically accused me of talking BS about USO slowing down here's the article:

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/tennis/2006-07-16-surface-tension_x.htm

I don't make up things either.They slowed down USO twice,in 2001 and 2003.It's still one of the fastest courts around today and the fastest slam but that's because overall surfaces have been just slowed down tremendously not because USO still plays very fast(it's kinda medium-fast now).

Last change was in 2003? I thought you meant it was changed recently. I remember hearing or reading that it was sped up for 2009? Could be totally wrong on that too though.

At the very least, at least we can all agree strange noises were being heard on Lenglen today. :p That, and the fact that it was playing fast for clay were my only observations.

zagor
05-24-2010, 12:46 PM
It would he HILARIOUS if that actually ended up happening(it won't but still)
I'd be interested in seeing the look on Cyan's face :lol:

I think she'd be very surprised actually,I don't for a second believe that she really means all this Fed will win Calendar slam nonsense she posts.

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 12:46 PM
Make that better for almost EVERYONE. This isn't just about the only 2 players, but the 128 players. Whatever the surface is fast or slow, Roger and Rafa has to deal with the same situation. i.e. Faster surface will just make harder for them to beat player like Roddick or Isner than on slower one. Simple as that.

yes, but nobody cares about Roddick or isner here, since they are not gonna win the FO, no matter how quick. They could go a bit farther, that´s all.The only thing that matter is how the courts are affecting the top players, the players who actually have a chance (those are fed, nadal, delpo (not playing), djokovic and maybe some other one)

fedfan08
05-24-2010, 12:47 PM
LOL this is pretty much it.This is why we have one footage in the tournament to illustrate that the courts are faster overall,that they play like HC etc.Seriously unless someone has concrete proof that the French Tennis Federation intentionally decided to change the court composition to speed it up this is all BS. Obviously weather plays a huge part in how the courts play and if it's hot and sunny the courts will play faster than if it's cool and cloudy/rainy. Just like at Wimbledon, the courts play different the 2nd week as the baseline is all worn down to basically dirt.

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 12:48 PM
Didn't help him in Madrid a week ago.

what? this discussion does not make any sense. Federer lost, but the faster conditions did help him.It doesn´t have to do that he lost. Im sure had they played in montecarlo for instance and Nadal would have won much more easily.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 12:48 PM
well, the frenchies are doing everything that they can possibly do to make that happen. It seems like a *******´s dream or a ******* being able to change the conditions. He would say: remove all the clay (there is proof, as the courts are squeaky) and pick the lightest and fastest balls available. Crazy this is happening.Are we sure the balls are lighter?I for one didn't hear any of the comms say that.Not this year anyway.

namelessone
05-24-2010, 12:48 PM
1. Wimbledon is ITF, not WTA. Still no excuse for putting unproven players like Wozzi and Kirilenko on CC over proven champs. So I guess it's ok for the WS to get shafted over to outer courts but w/ Nadal it's a grand injustice. :rolleyes:

2. As someone else mentioned, the French put the marquee match of today, Gaquet-Murray, over on Lenglen, so all bets are off. Fee's point is correct. They do it for ticket sales and give people on all show courts something good to watch, nothing more nothing less. If one of Fed's matches is on Lenglen I expect a lot of you to be changing your tune. BTW as someone else mentioned, Fed did play vs Querrey on Lenglen a few yrs ago.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/tennis/7420050.stm

1. ITF or WTA,they are still using the female players as sex symbols as they have realized that most of them cannot attract people with their tennis. Not so for the male players. I don't wanna see the day when haas gets centre court cause he is the best looking male player out there(at least my gf thinks so:) )

2.Why not put Federer on court 7, Rafa on court 17, Djoker on court 5,that will certainly sell tickets,right?

You have to find a balance between your business and disrespecting players.

Federer played all of his matches on centre court last year despite being nr.2 player in the world at the time and nr.2 CC'er at the time. Why didn't they put him on langlen at the time?

sdont
05-24-2010, 12:48 PM
So let's do a little summary:

The French organizers want Rafa to lose and Federer to win. In order to do that, they changed the surface of the Suzanne Lenglen to a HC, but not the Philippe Chatrier. And they scheduled Rafa to play on the Suzanne Lenglen from now on.

Maybe they're planning to put the final on the SL too if he makes it this far? Or maybe they changed the PC to red grass to give Fed a even more unfair advantage? (which would explain the PC non-squeaking surface)

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 12:49 PM
at first i thought i was watching a badmington match, with so much squeaking... or a puppy playing with his toy...

you know... so much squeaking i can tell straight out that the courts are faster... just because of the sound! not because i looked at the match and it looked like any other clay match!
those cheese eating frogs... haters... haters... the french "Le Mafiahhhh" gathering efforts with the Swiss mob...

zagor
05-24-2010, 12:50 PM
Last change was in 2003? I thought you meant it was changed recently. I remember hearing or reading that it was sped up for 2009? Could be totally wrong on that too though.

At the very least, at least we can all agree strange noises were being heard on Lenglen today. :p That, and the fact that it was playing fast for clay were my only observations.

Yes,with that I can agree.

I overall wish the surfaces stayed completely the same as they were in the 90s,the variety of surfaces is one of the things that made tennis appeal to me as a sport,now that's almost completely gone.They're ruining(or already ruined) the game with homogenziation IMO.

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 12:51 PM
at first i thought i was watching a badmington match, with so much squeaking... or a puppy playing with his toy...

you know... so much squeaking i can tell straight out that the courts are faster... just because of the sound! not because i looked at the match and it looked like any other clay match!
those cheese eating frogs... haters... haters... the french "Le Mafiahhhh" gathering efforts with the Swiss mob...

haha, that´s actually funny, but if you´re clever enough, which I´m sure you´re, you´ll understand that a normal clay court doesn´t squeak. So yes, because of the sound you can say that there´s no much clay over the layer below. I´m sure you´ve heard at school about the meaning of friction and that stuff

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 12:53 PM
haha, that´s actually funny, but if you´re clever enough, which I´m sure you´re, you´ll understand that a normal clay court doesn´t squeak. So yes, because of the sound you can say that there´s no much clay over the layer below. I´m sure you´ve heard at school about the meaning of friction and that stuff

LOL...yeah. Pretty funny. Some people don't get it, but that's ok. I wonder if this kind of play will persist over the course of the tournament? If it's an "error" all they have to do is put more clay on. I have never in my life played on a clay court that sounded like that.

sdont
05-24-2010, 12:54 PM
French organizers are even more dumb than I thought: they scheduled Gasquet against Murray on HC, what were they thinking?

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 12:56 PM
haha, that´s actually funny, but if you´re clever enough, which I´m sure you´re, you´ll understand that a normal clay court doesn´t squeak. So yes, because of the sound you can say that there´s no much clay over the layer below. I´m sure you´ve heard at school about the meaning of friction and that stuff

i never went to school... the msc diploma in my bedroom i got it from a pack of Doritos and the phd thesis in my computer i downloaded it. thought it was a porn magazine...

fundrazer
05-24-2010, 12:56 PM
Even if the courts are playing faster that should change in the next couple days. Commentators during Gasquet match were saying rain was expected soon, should slow the courts down.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 12:56 PM
Yes,with that I can agree.

I overall wish the surfaces stayed completely the same as they were in the 90s,the variety of surfaces is one of the things that made tennis appeal to me as a sport,now that's almost completely gone.They're ruining(or already ruined) the game with homogenziation IMO.

It all kinda goes with the strings and (then as a result) more powerful racquets though. You just can't have fast surfaces and entertaining play it seems. Maybe some people love ace fests, and one two punch style points...

I personally love the spin capabilities and rallies of the current era, but miss the variety and (IMO) tougher competition of pretty much all tennis seen before the year 2000.

namelessone
05-24-2010, 12:58 PM
LOL...yeah. Pretty funny. Some people don't get it, but that's ok. I wonder if this kind of play will persist over the course of the tournament? If it's an "error" all they have to do is put more clay on. I have never in my life played on a clay court that sounded like that.

They should take some cues from MC,that's how a clay court should play. Or at least Rome,even though Rome is faster. Madrid is just a abberation,you can hardly call that clay.

Anyway,it would be real funny to see Rafa tomorrow on clay and hear squeaking again. I would LOL. Is it that hard to pack some more clay in(and maybe water the courts a bit from time to time)?

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 12:58 PM
French organizers are even more dumb than I thought: they scheduled Gasquet against Murray on HC, what were they thinking?

they don´t give a damn about gasquet .They know he can´t win with that pathetic stamina of his. They were actually thinking about Nadal´s match ,remember they prefer Nadal losing over french victories.

muzza123
05-24-2010, 01:00 PM
French organizers are even more dumb than I thought: they scheduled Gasquet against Murray on HC, what were they thinking?

cos the organisers feel gasman has brought shame upon their people with his miami nightclub antics. thus they refused to give him an extra day's rest AND forced him to play on a HC against the World No. 4 in the 1st rd :)

But seriously, cheers for the vid TennisandMusic. That is seriously wierd and definitely the first time I have heard trainers squeaking on a clay court.

First talk of faster surface, then faster balls. Now squeaking clay courts! Oh the controversy!

mandy01
05-24-2010, 01:01 PM
LOL...yeah. Pretty funny. Some people don't get it, but that's ok. I wonder if this kind of play will persist over the course of the tournament? If it's an "error" all they have to do is put more clay on. I have never in my life played on a clay court that sounded like that.


Yes,it does seem like Lenglen wasn't sprinkled with enough clay today.But it seems the discussion has changed it's course somehow since the original discussion was about the overall speed so I wasn't quite sure why you posted the footage.
But yes,I didn't hear squeaking on my TV.. Didn't notice it .

jamesblakefan#1
05-24-2010, 01:01 PM
They should take some cues from MC,that's how a clay court should play. Or at least Rome,even though Rome is faster. Madrid is just a abberation,you can hardly call that clay.

Yeah the fact that that's how you think clay should play has NOTHING to do with the fact Rafa's won it 6 years in a row, now does it?

Is it that hard to pack some more clay in(and maybe water the courts a bit from time to time)?

Yes...the courts should be watered. Oh wait....

http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/b1/fullj.efb8ca9fa043acf9449341185d17a9f4/efb8ca9fa043acf9449341185d17a9f4-getty-tennis-fra-open-roland-garros.jpg

Leonidas
05-24-2010, 01:01 PM
i never went to school... the msc diploma in my bedroom i got it from a pack of Doritos and the phd thesis in my computer i downloaded it. thought it was a porn magazine...

Great. now that I know that, no wonder that 99% of your statements are silly. They´re funny though. keep it up

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 01:07 PM
Great. now that I know that, no wonder that 99% of your statements are silly. They´re funny though. keep it up

Silly is my midlle name... Dr. Mike Not Buying Silly Clay Conspiracy Theory

Conspiracy is my Mother's maiden name...

i found some more evidence that courts in RG are faster!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jNQMJynCMw

BallzofSkill
05-24-2010, 01:13 PM
lol. Nad fans are so paranoid.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 01:19 PM
Great. now that I know that, no wonder that 99% of your statements are silly. They´re funny though. keep it up

Doesn't really matter. I work with MIT PhD's, including a Nobel Prize Winner in Chemistry. They are a mix of the laziest AND craziest people I've ever met.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 01:23 PM
Mandy I guess there is no having a discussion with you then. You are clearly sidestepping and denying every obvious fact being presented, and are not able to make the clear connections between points here. Moving on I guess.
Okay I just saw this.
First-What facts did you present in regards to the original premise of the argument?

Second-What connections am I supposed to be making here?Kindly enlighten me for I do not see how one footage is enough to gauge how a surface is playing overall.Wouldn't it be wiser to wait and see before one passes the final verdict? :lol:

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 01:29 PM
Okay I just saw this.
First-What facts did you present in regards to the original premise of the argument?

Second-What connections am I supposed to be making here?Kindly enlighten me for I do not see how one footage is enough to gauge how a surface is playing overall.

mandy.. you are grasping at straws... Drakulie and i have provided more than evidence that courts are fast, plus the ball kids and the line judges are faster... even the people in the stands are booing faster. the earth started to spin faster in it's axis... the french managed to make the day shorter by 3 hours and 39 minutes, and then there is the video i posted...~

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jNQMJynCMw

this is all a great conspiracy about dethroning Nadal... no one else but him!

Nadal should be called Helios...

drakulie
05-24-2010, 01:30 PM
The red bricks being heated up too make the courts faster:

http://www.toihutchinson.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/pizza-red_brick_oven.jpg

mandy01
05-24-2010, 01:35 PM
mandy.. you are grasping at straws... Drakulie and i have provided more than evidence that courts are fast, plus the ball kids and the line judges are faster... even the people in the stands are booing faster. the earth started to spin faster in it's axis... the french managed to make the day shorter by 3 hours and 39 minutes, and then there is the video i posted...~

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jNQMJynCMw

this is all a great conspiracy about dethroning Nadal... no one else but him!

Nadal should be called Helios... LOL Gorecki.Priceless stuff today :lol:

Seriously though-I'm sorry but I'm going to need more evidence than that of one footage to conclude that FO(or Lenglen,let's say) is overall playing much faster ,like a hard court etc.
The squeaking wasn't even clear on TV.

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 01:39 PM
LOL Gorecki.Priceless stuff today :lol:

Seriously though-I'm sorry but I'm going to need more evidence than that of one footage to conclude that FO(or Lenglen,let's say) is overall playing faster .
The squeaking wasn't even clear on TV.

you are denying the truth here... please dont tell me the crowds are not boing with extreme swift...

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/45520000/jpg/_45520796_flag_getty.jpg


and not to mention that these croissants would be gliding down the throats of players like nalbandian (who is a bad matchup for federer) only to make him a step slower...

http://www.stockphotopro.com/photo-thumbs-2/A4KEGD.jpg

them frogs got lucky and nalbo withdrawn, so there is no proof for this last part...

mandy01
05-24-2010, 01:41 PM
I like chocolate croissants.

drakulie
05-24-2010, 01:42 PM
I don't hear anything unusual. But the courts do look fast:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=heYPZjLp5sE&feature=related

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 01:42 PM
Only on a forum will facts and evidence be mocked, and puerile derision celebrated.

Oh wait, real life is like that too.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 01:46 PM
Only on a forum will facts and evidence be mocked, and puerile derision celebrated.

Oh wait, real life is like that too.You are yet to give me a satisfactory response.
I already conceded that Lenglen was faster today and even admitted that it was a little squeaky.Now it's your turn to show us the evidence that the overall change is that way and that this is a deliberate/premeditated change.

TennisandMusic
05-24-2010, 01:48 PM
You are yet to give me a satisfactory response.
I already conceded that Lenglen was faster today and even admitted that it was a little squeaky.Now it's your turn to show us the evidence that the overall change is that way .

I never said the overall change was that way. I said Chatrier looked pretty normal from what I saw. The problem is I spelled things out quite clearly, and it looks like most people readily understood, but you came back with questions whose answers are self evident if you know the basics about tennis. Like, why would less clay mean the court is faster. I mean, seriously? It's not even worth talking about at this point. We should just let it go.

mandy01
05-24-2010, 01:52 PM
I never said the overall change was that way. I said Chatrier looked pretty normal from what I saw. The problem is I spelled things out quite clearly, and it looks like most people readily understood, but you came back with questions whose answers are self evident if you know the basics about tennis. Like, why would less clay mean the court is faster. I mean, seriously? It's not even worth talking about at this point. We should just let it go.REALLY?This is what I came up with?
PLEASE show me the post.
Atleast be honest here.

To the part in Red-Why was it even necessary then to point out to that one match ?

And of course we should let it go seeing that someone is having to come up with the BS like that posted in the bolded part to hang on to the argument.

Halba
05-24-2010, 02:54 PM
Seriously unless someone has concrete proof that the French Tennis Federation intentionally decided to change the court composition to speed it up this is all BS. Obviously weather plays a huge part in how the courts play and if it's hot and sunny the courts will play faster than if it's cool and cloudy/rainy. Just like at Wimbledon, the courts play different the 2nd week as the baseline is all worn down to basically dirt.

chatrier = medium-fast hard court.

wimbledon = clay court by 2nd week

Ocean Drive
05-24-2010, 03:02 PM
The conditions are pretty warm and dry meaning the court is playing quite fast, the weather is set to change though and so will the courts.

tudwell
05-24-2010, 03:15 PM
They should take some cues from MC,that's how a clay court should play. Or at least Rome,even though Rome is faster. Madrid is just a abberation,you can hardly call that clay.

We have fast and slow hard courts, so I don't see why we can't have some variety in clay. It would be boring if we had 2-3 months of Monte-Carlo. And judging by the semifinalists of Madrid (Nadal, Federer, Ferrer, and Almagro - all top-notch clay-courters), I can hardly see how it's an "aberration." Seems pretty consistent with the rest of the clay season.

tudwell
05-24-2010, 03:22 PM
yes, but federer gets much more free points from his serve than Nadal. Plus, federer lately is playing very offensively against Nadal on clay, not engaging in long rallies. Hence, tha faster the better for Federer.

Yes, I'm sure the French Open organizers were sitting on the edge of their seats watching the Madrid final this year to decide how fast to make the courts. Come on, they can't just change the speed of the courts at the snap of their fingers.

I don't know why it seems so many Nadal fans have this persecution complex. The whole world is against them, it seems. I guess it makes sense that they would be attracted to the perennial underdog Nadal (until he finally overtook Federer in 08, that is), but still. I can understand why some feel such hostility coming from the rest of the board because there are so many more Federer fans than Nadal fans, but thinking the ITF or ATP or whoever is actually rigging things against Nadal? Why? What purpose would it serve? Does he bring in that many more fans or that much more money? Why not expand the grass court season, in that case, as that's probably Federer's best surface? It's just silly.

kraggy
05-24-2010, 03:35 PM
It doesn't really matter though if the courts are fast or slow. It doesn't even matter if they are playing on a minefield. As long as the conditions are the same for everyone it is fair.

mseles1
05-24-2010, 04:24 PM
perennial underdog Nadal (until he finally overtook Federer in 08, that is)

Federer never once led his h2h match-up with Nadal. Underdog?

Puredrivetennis
05-24-2010, 05:53 PM
It doesn't really matter though if the courts are fast or slow. It doesn't even matter if they are playing on a minefield. As long as the conditions are the same for everyone it is fair.

high five.

tudwell
05-24-2010, 05:55 PM
perennial underdog Nadal (until he finally overtook Federer in 08, that is)

Federer never once led his h2h match-up with Nadal. Underdog?

You're saying Nadal was the favorite for every tournament he entered?

RalphNYC
05-24-2010, 07:20 PM
How's the traffic in Paris?

namelessone
05-24-2010, 09:32 PM
We have fast and slow hard courts, so I don't see why we can't have some variety in clay. It would be boring if we had 2-3 months of Monte-Carlo. And judging by the semifinalists of Madrid (Nadal, Federer, Ferrer, and Almagro - all top-notch clay-courters), I can hardly see how it's an "aberration." Seems pretty consistent with the rest of the clay season.

It is a weird surface and notice how I am saying this even though Rafa won. When balls are jumping head high after they hit the service line one has to wonder how they took care of this surface. Do they even know how to maintain a proper claycourt in the mobster's tourney? To be fair,this year it was better,just look at last year madrid semi,Nadal and Djokovic were routinely hitting from shoulder high even short balls. The surface was way way way too bouncy for my liking. Sure,balls should bounce higher off clay but not this much. It gets in the way of good,quality CC tennis.

namelessone
05-24-2010, 09:39 PM
Yes, I'm sure the French Open organizers were sitting on the edge of their seats watching the Madrid final this year to decide how fast to make the courts. Come on, they can't just change the speed of the courts at the snap of their fingers.

I don't know why it seems so many Nadal fans have this persecution complex. The whole world is against them, it seems. I guess it makes sense that they would be attracted to the perennial underdog Nadal (until he finally overtook Federer in 08, that is), but still. I can understand why some feel such hostility coming from the rest of the board because there are so many more Federer fans than Nadal fans, but thinking the ITF or ATP or whoever is actually rigging things against Nadal? Why? What purpose would it serve? Does he bring in that many more fans or that much more money? Why not expand the grass court season, in that case, as that's probably Federer's best surface? It's just silly.

I don't think they are rigging things to push Nadal out but when Nadal is put on Lenglen for the second year round even though he is the king of clay and there is nothing big going on in chatrier the same day one one has to wonder. And as TennisandMusic has pointed out,what kind of clay are they using in lenglen when you can hear players shoes squeaking on clay? Me thinks that they should add more top layer and water the courts a bit more. This is CLAYCOURT tennis after all.

So no conspiracy theories from me but I do think the organizers don't respect the king of clay. Rafa was put on lenglen when he was nr.1 in the world last year and now,when he comes off 3 masters titles on clay,they put him on lenglen again. Guys like Fed and Rafa should only play on centre courts IMO.

sh@de
05-24-2010, 10:02 PM
He'll play his first match on Suzanne Lenglen. That's ridiculous. Roddick will play on Philippe Chatrier. :mad:

That is really pathetic. Nadal, world number 2, four time champ, not on centre court? And in place is Roddick, some guy who's done basically zilch on clay?

I agree with you. It's completely ridiculous.

sh@de
05-24-2010, 10:41 PM
How's the traffic in Paris?

Traffic is fast!!

It doesn't really matter though if the courts are fast or slow. It doesn't even matter if they are playing on a minefield. As long as the conditions are the same for everyone it is fair.

Win! :D

mandy01
05-24-2010, 10:56 PM
I don't think they are rigging things to push Nadal out but when Nadal is put on Lenglen for the second year round even though he is the king of clay and there is nothing big going on in chatrier the same day one one has to wonder. And as TennisandMusic has pointed out,what kind of clay are they using in lenglen when you can hear players shoes squeaking on clay? Me thinks that they should add more top layer and water the courts a bit more. This is CLAYCOURT tennis after all.

So no conspiracy theories from me but I do think the organizers don't respect the king of clay. Rafa was put on lenglen when he was nr.1 in the world last year and now,when he comes off 3 masters titles on clay,they put him on lenglen again. Guys like Fed and Rafa should only play on centre courts IMO.
And why is that?
Personally I don't care what court Roger plays on as long as he wins :lol:( and he prefers Lenglen to Chatrier).

Gorecki
05-24-2010, 11:56 PM
How's the traffic in Paris?

extremely fast. like frozen mollasses.
darn frogs, doing all it takes to stop poor rafito... haters.... or in french... hrateurrss

ps. this post is puerile derision... not real life. in real life, puerility is much faster and squeaks like in you tube videos

Halba
05-25-2010, 12:04 AM
I don't think they are rigging things to push Nadal out but when Nadal is put on Lenglen for the second year round even though he is the king of clay and there is nothing big going on in chatrier the same day one one has to wonder. And as TennisandMusic has pointed out,what kind of clay are they using in lenglen when you can hear players shoes squeaking on clay? Me thinks that they should add more top layer and water the courts a bit more. This is CLAYCOURT tennis after all.

So no conspiracy theories from me but I do think the organizers don't respect the king of clay. Rafa was put on lenglen when he was nr.1 in the world last year and now,when he comes off 3 masters titles on clay,they put him on lenglen again. Guys like Fed and Rafa should only play on centre courts IMO.

joke. they have totally changed the courts and there should be an investigation. the courts were changed for 2009, after they got sick of rafa(a spaniard who likes slow to medium clay courts) winning the french. they are more pro federer who is french speaking. i watched both lenglen and chatrier and i'm convinced its super fast tennis now. you can't even tell its a claycourt. only thing is the colour of the court, and slight bounce variation.

clay my foot!

Gorecki
05-25-2010, 12:16 AM
joke. they have totally changed the courts and there should be an investigation. the courts were changed for 2009, after they got sick of rafa(a spaniard who likes slow to medium clay courts) winning the french. they are more pro federer who is french speaking. i watched both lenglen and chatrier and i'm convinced its super fast tennis now. you can't even tell its a claycourt. only thing is the colour of the court, and slight bounce variation.

clay my foot!

like i said. they picked the super fast taraflex from the old carpet masters paris and painted it red... just to hate more and more... luckily, nalbandian is injured or he would serve some bakery to poor rafito, who should only play on clay.
ze atp banditss? ze swiss mafia? le camorrah?ze crroissant? oh la la

posted from my hating fast htc diamond

mandy01
05-25-2010, 12:21 AM
like i said. they picked the super fast taraflex from the old carpet masters paris and painted it red... just to hate more and more... luckily, nalbandian is injured or he would serve some bakery to poor rafito, who should only play on clay.
ze atp banditss? ze swiss mafia? le camorrah?ze crroissant? oh la la

posted from my hating fast htc diamond
HAHAHA Gorecki you're too good :lol:

Gorecki
05-25-2010, 12:22 AM
It doesn't really matter though if the courts are fast or slow. It doesn't even matter if they are playing on a minefield. As long as the conditions are the same for everyone it is fair.

super fast win.
now, read what we talked two days ago, and read this whole thread, and tell me who is the most paranoid bunch...

namelessone
05-25-2010, 12:35 AM
Like I said no conspiracy theories for me. They could have put Rafa on carpet again Mina and he still would have won. It's the context that is bothersome to me and I have already stated why.

But I do find it funny how almost everyone ignored TennisandMusic's squeaky shoes argument. Everyone just made fun of him or diverted the discussion to something else(like making fun of some conspiracy theory nadal fans).Shoes shouldn't squeak on a clay,there isn't enough grip unless you are playing on a hard surface or something. I played most of my life on clay(and not particularly good claycourts at that:oops:) which did not have much maintenance done to them,with different types of shoes and I NEVER heard squeaking,not from me or from my opponent. However,that was most certainly the case indoors on HC in winter time.

People will do anything to ignore arguments that go against their point.

mandy01
05-25-2010, 12:41 AM
Like I said no conspiracy theories for me. They could have put Rafa on carpet again Mina and he still would have won. It's the context that is bothersome to me and I have already stated why.

But I do find it funny how almost everyone ignored TennisandMusic's squeaky shoes argument. Everyone just made fun of him or diverted the discussion to something else(like making fun of some conspiracy theory nadal fans).Shoes shouldn't squeak on a clay,there isn't enough grip unless you are playing on a hard surface or something. I played most of my life on clay(and not particularly good claycourts at that:oops:) which did not have much maintenance done to them,with different types of shoes and I NEVER heard squeaking,not from me or from my opponent. However,that was most certainly the case indoors on HC in winter time.

People will do anything to ignore arguments that go against their point.
Well first of all it was T&M who came up with the conspiracy theory which started the argument.The whole argument was initially based on the overall change in clay- speed and whether or not the change was deliberate for which T&M got no evidence and instead put up one video that was hardly enough to support the orginal purpose of the argument.

Of course as it turns out T&M was basically trolling when he came up with the conspiracy theory and of course it was HE who changed the course of discussion

sdont
05-25-2010, 12:42 AM
People will do anything to ignore arguments that go against their point.

You know about that, don't you? ;)

Leonidas
05-25-2010, 01:31 AM
HAHAHA Gorecki you're too good :lol:

this is the world: praising stupid coments and ignoring smart reasoning. keep it up
Myself im gonna find some smart fans who can discuss about facts somewhere else. This forum is 99% clowns.

zagor
05-25-2010, 01:35 AM
LOL,Gorecki's posts in this thread are a work of art.

joeri888
05-25-2010, 01:38 AM
@ Gorecki: _O_, I LoL'd like 5 times.

People make such big things out of little problems like surface and court scheduling.

Lifted
05-25-2010, 03:52 AM
Only on a forum will facts and evidence be mocked, and puerile derision celebrated.

Oh wait, real life is like that too.

Woe is me. The lamentations of a man alone in his fight to bring a type of honest justice to the world of Talk Tennis. Armed with a video, this man seeks to educate his fellow posters, to plant the ever growing seed of truth in their brains...nay, in their hearts; for in the fertile soil of one's heart truth can take root more deeply than in the capricious mind and, dare I say, instill in a human being the burning desire to do right...to do right when one sees the maliciousness of untruth rear its ugly head. Can our hero steel himself? Can he beat back the hydra-headed phantom of untruth with the knowledge of what is right? Can one man, one daring man with the ever-present danger of tainting his own, purest of souls with the intellectual dishonesty of his fellow forum-goers, turn away from his fears and fight the good fight for the good of mankind?

Yes. The answer is yes. Unequivocally...undoubtedly...yes. With one video of one match, he has proven that there exists a malicious intent in the hearts of the French: the intent to handicap the King of Clay, the Toro de Toros, Rafael Nadal. What loathsome, dishonest tripe is this? Whence came this treachery? Whence came this skulduggery? Do not tell our hero it emanates from the Earth. Do not tell our hero it changes with the so-called temperature or conditions. Fool. You fool. He knows this is a malicious plot on the part of Untruth, that rabid denier of honesty and virtue. Our hero begs you to look deeply into his own eyes, to avert yours from the crusted, red-eyed stare of Untruth, and to take from him what he took from El Gran Matador: a sense of calmness and truth, which ultimately emanates from the very fabric of his own pure heart, where truth, the kind from which radiates an honest, pure light, took root originally, and find its home indefinitely.

Look to our hero, but do not tell him the squeaks are not indicators of dishonesty, for he will smash your deceit-bearing face with his intellectual hammer, which was forged long ago with tempered Truth and fired Knowledge. He has worked with PhDs blast you! Heed his words. Why can you people not see what lies before you in plain sight? The squeaks are all that he needs to prove his point, nothing more, nothing less.

sdont
05-25-2010, 03:58 AM
Woe is me. The lamentations of a man alone in his fight to bring a type of honest justice to the world of Talk Tennis. Armed with a video, this man seeks to educate his fellow posters, to plant the ever growing seed of truth in their brains...nay, in their hearts; for in the fertile soil of one's heart truth can take root more deeply than in the capricious mind and, dare I say, instill in a human being the burning desire to do right...to do right when one sees the maliciousness of untruth rear its ugly head. Can our hero steel himself? Can he beat back the hydra-headed phantom of untruth with the knowledge of what is right? Can one man, one daring man with the ever-present danger of tainting his own, purest of souls with the intellectual dishonesty of his fellow forum-goers, turn away from his fears and fight the good fight for the good of mankind?

Yes. The answer is yes. Unequivocally...undoubtedly...yes. With one video of one match, he has proven that there exists a malicious intent in the hearts of the French: the intent to handicap the King of Clay, the Toro de Toros, Rafael Nadal. What loathsome, dishonest tripe is this? Whence came this treachery? Whence came this skulduggery? Do not tell our hero it emanates from the Earth. Do not tell our hero it changes with the so-called temperature or conditions. Fool. You fool. He knows this is a malicious plot on the part of Untruth, that rabid denier of honesty and virtue. Our hero begs you to look deeply into his own eyes, to avert yours from the crusted, red-eyed stare of Untruth, and to take from him what he took from El Gran Matador: a sense of calmness and truth, which ultimately emanates from the very fabric of his own pure heart, where truth, the kind from which radiates an honest, pure light, took root originally, and find its home indefinitely.

Look to our hero, but do not tell him the squeaks are not indicators of dishonesty, for he will smash your deceit-bearing face with his intellectual hammer, which was forged long ago with tempered Truth and fired Knowledge. He has worked with PhDs blast you! Heed his words. Why can you people not see what lies before you in plain sight? The squeaks are all that he needs to prove his point, nothing more, nothing less.

Lol. Good one, and well written!

Gorecki
05-25-2010, 04:07 AM
Woe is me. The lamentations of a man alone in his fight to bring a type of honest justice to the world of Talk Tennis. Armed with a video, this man seeks to educate his fellow posters, to plant the ever growing seed of truth in their brains...nay, in their hearts; for in the fertile soil of one's heart truth can take root more deeply than in the capricious mind and, dare I say, instill in a human being the burning desire to do right...to do right when one sees the maliciousness of untruth rear its ugly head. Can our hero steel himself? Can he beat back the hydra-headed phantom of untruth with the knowledge of what is right? Can one man, one daring man with the ever-present danger of tainting his own, purest of souls with the intellectual dishonesty of his fellow forum-goers, turn away from his fears and fight the good fight for the good of mankind?

Yes. The answer is yes. Unequivocally...undoubtedly...yes. With one video of one match, he has proven that there exists a malicious intent in the hearts of the French: the intent to handicap the King of Clay, the Toro de Toros, Rafael Nadal. What loathsome, dishonest tripe is this? Whence came this treachery? Whence came this skulduggery? Do not tell our hero it emanates from the Earth. Do not tell our hero it changes with the so-called temperature or conditions. Fool. You fool. He knows this is a malicious plot on the part of Untruth, that rabid denier of honesty and virtue. Our hero begs you to look deeply into his own eyes, to avert yours from the crusted, red-eyed stare of Untruth, and to take from him what he took from El Gran Matador: a sense of calmness and truth, which ultimately emanates from the very fabric of his own pure heart, where truth, the kind from which radiates an honest, pure light, took root originally, and find its home indefinitely.

Look to our hero, but do not tell him the squeaks are not indicators of dishonesty, for he will smash your deceit-bearing face with his intellectual hammer, which was forged long ago with tempered Truth and fired Knowledge. He has worked with PhDs blast you! Heed his words. Why can you people not see what lies before you in plain sight? The squeaks are all that he needs to prove his point, nothing more, nothing less.

this post is squeak free, as tested by independet swiss labs......

swiss i said...

ksbh
05-25-2010, 04:19 AM
Lifted ... Brilliant! That post would have made William Wordsworth proud!

Anyways, I watched a few points from the Roddick-Nieminen match. While the court does look marginally faster, it's nothing like a hard court. It does not even look like a fast clay court! Some folks are going way overboard.

In any case, I did notice that the balls are jumping up high ... if Nadal meets Federer in the final, the Spaniard's going to have a field day!

vortex1
05-25-2010, 04:27 AM
Roddick is struggling with a mug, so courts can't be THAT fast.

drakulie
05-25-2010, 04:50 AM
The surface was way way way too bouncy for my liking. Sure,balls should bounce higher off clay but not this much. It gets in the way of good,quality CC tennis.


Hahahahamuahahahahalolololoomauahahahahaha.

To "your liking",,,,,,,,,"balls should bounce higher on clay, but not this much"?????

LMAO. Do you even play tennis?? Sersiously???

Let me explain something to you, on clay, the balls bounces higher than on hard or grass. Add to that the amount of spin these guys hit with, and you have even higher bounces.

sh@de
05-25-2010, 04:53 AM
Hahahahamuahahahahalolololoomauahahahahaha.

To "your liking",,,,,,,,,"balls should bounce higher on clay, but not this much"?????

LMAO. Do you even play tennis?? Sersiously???

Let me explain something to you, on clay, the balls bounces higher than on hard or grass. Add to that the amount of spin these guys hit with, and you have even higher bounces.

Well said :)

namelessone
05-25-2010, 05:07 AM
Hahahahamuahahahahalolololoomauahahahahaha.

To "your liking",,,,,,,,,"balls should bounce higher on clay, but not this much"?????

LMAO. Do you even play tennis?? Sersiously???

Let me explain something to you, on clay, the balls bounces higher than on hard or grass. Add to that the amount of spin these guys hit with, and you have even higher bounces.

This year's court was better but not by much. Nadal and Djoker are both tall guys and they were hitting from shoulder level many times balls that came from around the service line. And mind you they were camping out at the baseline. Watch the highlights again. Many of their shots look restrained,cramped even because of this way too bouncy court. This did not happen to them in Rome or in MC,not even RG. Of course a clay court is supposed to bounce the ball higher then grass or HC but in Madrid it was too much IMO,it got in the way of quality play,especially in 09'. At one point Rafa and Nole looked like they were trying to moonball one another :)

Blade0324
05-25-2010, 06:40 AM
I love nothing better than high bouncing clay courts. That is what makes clay so great IMO.

drakulie
05-25-2010, 06:52 AM
Nadal and Djoker are both tall guys and they were hitting from shoulder level many times balls that came from around the service line.

It's called topspin.

10ACE
05-25-2010, 06:53 AM
This year's court was better but not by much. Nadal and Djoker are both tall guys and they were hitting from shoulder level many times balls that came from around the service line. And mind you they were camping out at the baseline. Watch the highlights again. Many of their shots look restrained,cramped even because of this way too bouncy court. This did not happen to them in Rome or in MC,not even RG. Of course a clay court is supposed to bounce the ball higher then grass or HC but in Madrid it was too much IMO,it got in the way of quality play,especially in 09'. At one point Rafa and Nole looked like they were trying to moonball one another :)

The bounce this year is fantastic- I think it has to do with the higher temps- more dry there too this year humidity wise. \

Side note Nadal Tall- I do believe he is 5'10'' more then his listed height of 6'1''- seeing him he's not that tall-

ChanceEncounter
05-25-2010, 11:34 AM
Killing carpet was lame (Heck I think a carpet AO would be boss). Wimbledon still plays pretty darn fast. If it wasn't, Federer and Venus wouldn't be so dominant there. It's not the ace fest of the 90's but you still get a ton of aces, and I think guys served better (in general) in the 90's to be honest.. USO seems pretty flippin fast to me. I just think what you're saying is not really correct. Seems like you're throwing up more straw mans.

Yes, because your opinion is the be all for this discussion. For the quotes that this year's FO plays fast, I can find a similar number of quotes that the grass of Wimbledon has slowed down. Of course, you don't care about that because slower conditions at AO and Wimbledon helps out Nadal. :rolleyes:

You do realize that the courts are kicking up more than ever, which benefit Nadal and his topspin, right? Oh noes, it's a huge conspiracy to make sure that Nadal wins the French!!!111

Selective arguments are bad.

shanked_it
05-25-2010, 01:14 PM
Don't you guys just hate it when your playing at Roland Garros, and then the ball just bounces high like a *********** ?

Lotto
05-25-2010, 02:45 PM
They have been doing nothing to Federer in Wimbledon. The grass was replaced in 2001, and Federer started winning it in 2003. He won all his Wimbleys playing on the "new" grass.


It's still getting slower though and the ball is starting to bounce higher.....see Jason Goodall's review during 08 wimbledon final.

Thomas Crown
05-25-2010, 07:09 PM
The effect of clay on serving is greatly overestimated in the minds of both. There's never been a surface on which a big serve wasn't effective. It literally only takes off a couple mph(i.e., serving 126 at RG is as effective as 124 on a fast court).

shhhhhhhhhhh don't say that here! don't you know that posters on this board adjust their string tension by the half pound depending on the humidex?

bolo
05-25-2010, 07:29 PM
verdasco on lenglen:

http://www.rolandgarros.com/en_FR/news/interviews/2010-05-25/201005251274792038603.html

"fast", "not too much clay", just like tennismusic observed.

But it looked like they put some clay on it for the nadal match maybe, didn't look as thin as in the highlights.